Guild Wars 2

I am going to Repost the first sentence out of my last post just so you can read it.

“I am not talking about a Greatsword Frenzy build. I am talking about any thing other than that. "

Now repost your:

“Glass cannon is not meant to node defend.”

I urge you to read the post before waving it off.

TheGuy.3568:

Dude your mixing up builds.

So far you named P/D S/D D/P and P/P no thieve can run all those and those traits in the same build. the build you mention does not exist the initative cost would be astronomical and simply put you cant have 4 weapon sets at the same time.

That is one build. It is the build I use on my thief. So you can say, “No thief runs with that” and “That isn’t possible” but I am here to tell you, it is quite simple to set up that exact build and that is only with D/P that doesn’t include the secondary weapon.

Small Edit: Also note in the original post I said “Smart Thieves run with this”. I have no clue as to why you would not put in points to trait for Hard to Catch. That alone would stop your “chain stun”. Also, a lot of thieves run with Shadowstep (which would also stop your chain stun) + Shadow Refuge.

Big Edit: I honestly can’t sit here and see that post against mine saying it can’t happen. It is painfully obvious that it can. I mentioned 1 trait/2 utilities/2 weapons skill. How is that not possible? Let me recap it for you since you are having trouble reading it in the larger paragraph. Since you link links so much I added in the link to wiki.

Shadow Step: Utility skill http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shadowstep
Shadow Refuge: Utility skill: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shadow_Refuge
Hard to Catch: Trait: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Hard_to_Catch
Heart Seeker Strike: Dagger 2: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Heartseeker
Black Powder: Pistol 5: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Black_Powder

Now lets recap….. If you get Hard to Catch you will have access to…
Fleet of Foot: Adept http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Fleet_Shadow
Pain Response: Master http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Pain_Response

Now if you trait up the Shadow Arts line you get….
Last Refuge: Minor: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Last_Refuge
Meld with Shadows: Minor: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Meld_with_Shadows
Shadows Embrace: Major: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shadow%27s_Embrace
Infusion of Shadow: Major: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Infusion_of_Shadow

So longer stealth, 2 initiative on stealth, remove condition while stealth, move 50% faster while in stealth, two 1200 range shadow steps that break stun, aoe stealth for 10 seconds, stealth for 4 seconds on Pistol 5 + Dagger 3, regen for 10 seconds and remove bleeding/poison/burning if hit below 75% health.

So yes, it is quite possible.

Interpret Interrupt.3824:

This is why I should screen shot… last time I checked, Caed, Sataar, hman, davinci were not bad players. But continue to think wars are weak that is fine. For the glass build only weakness is condi specifically slows. Give us anything else for the amount of burst we can do in 20/30/0/0/20 and it will be to stronk

I am not talking about a Greatsword Frenzy build. I am talking about any thing other than that. We have almost 0 builds outside of Greatsword Frenzy that will work in tPvP and even the Greatsword build isn’t good for tPvP when you consider other options available to you in terms of the other classes.

Even if we do trait into Tactics and Defense we get none of the actually good defensive boons in the game. We get a lack luster regen affect that isn’t work the points invested. Don’t even try to say that the Tactics minor traits are worth the investment… they are jokes. The only major trait that is of actual use is the Reflect projectiles. Healing shouts? A elementalist can dodge roll and heal for more and remove a condition. I don’t think it takes them 20 seconds at the minimum to get their dodge back; in fact, it is on a 10 second cool down.

You can say get “Last Stand” but that is a completely useless trait because you are still controlled on the first CC and stuck until it is over or you are forced to use a stun breaker to get out. What good is that?

It is a joke compared to any other type of sustain play class. They get vigor, regen, protection, swiftness and any other boon they want for the majority of the fight.

Warriors were named the “on demand” stability class yet it takes us a trait and 2 utility skills to match a elite of a Ranger (not to mention he gets swiftness and fury and might with it as well). How does that make sense?

Also, if you want to say that a Warrior dps is better than a thief dps….. that is no where near true. Thief’s don’t need to be babysat so they can go into a fight for 3 seconds to try and do some damage. Not to mention that the Thief burst is actually burst… 100 Blades is only slight burst if you add frenzy to it. It is more than easy to use a stun breaker in 1 and 3/4 seconds (3 and 1/2 seconds without frenzy.. useless). The Thief’s burst can take as low as 0.5 seconds (Mug+Backstab if they know what they are doing) and up to 1 second (Mug+CnD+Backstab), also don’t forget they poison and weaken you at the same time. Which is much more important in PvP than a single bleed stack.

Needless to say, in any 1vX situations the Warrior will just lie down and die if the other people are semi competent. So you can kiss trying to defend a point goodbye.

The best bet for a Warrior is to travel with at least one other person (even then you will just get focused because at max you might have 4 defensive option at a time on a longer cool down than Mesmer/Thief/Ranger bursts. All the while, your burst combo takes longer to cool down than the Mesmers/Thiefs/Rangers evades and “Oh poo” buttons) if not two people.

Sure, Warrior might be a decent class and solid against people who understand nothing about other classes, but you run into someone who actually knows how to play… it is night and day between which class is built better.

If you want to refuse then I will offer a open ear and eye to see and hear what you have to say. Show me a video of a Warrior defending a point against a competent PvPer in tPvP(paids) with any build. Not some video that is 45 seconds long with a fail Thief burst over and over again. Show me a video with a actual player trying to dislodge the Warrior from the point. That will have a influence, because as it stands right now the traits/utilities of other classes far superior and it is very easy to see.

jwburks.9735:

I don’t hate RNG. That’s been around since Final Fantasy games were invented. It’s the diminishing returns that I am hating on.

But were the ultimate weapons RNG? Hmm…..
I do believe in most Final Fantasy’s there were stoic events that you had to complete or do something ridiculous hard to get the item. Using “everyone’s favorite” Final Fantasy 7, to get Clouds Ultimate Weapon you had to actually chase the " Ultimate Weapon" (the big dangerous dragon thing at the end of the game) around the world until you finally killed it to get Cloud’s sword as a drop. Note: Not a chance at the drop, but you get the sword as a drop for sure.

Interpret Interrupt.3824:

Miko.5726:

Vanthian.9267:

Interpret Interrupt.3824:

Soon warrior will be OP. My day will come… mwuah hah haa

Here is to hoping we become viable!

Warrior and viable? How ? In which role? Sorry, but i havn´t got a clue. Thief, Ele, Mesmer, Ranger have a better mechanic, there´s nothing to be done about that.

One can allways dream!

This warrior has beaten the likes of the OP running a dual war comp. Sorry you are just doing it wrong then because we are very much viable, just slightly at condi disadvantage.

A slight disadvantage? We have a non existent sustain mechanic compared to Mesmers/Thiefs/Rangers/Guardians. We have one burst heal and 2 very bad regen heals. We have limited access to vigor on a offhand weapon that is… subpar to say the least for a PvP set up. You will either give up your defensive side or offensive side to be able to have vigor up 50% of the time. The base line defense and health of the Warrior do not make up for the minimal boons we have as the developers thought it would.

Also, while you claim it is a skill issues for me I could claim the same and say it was obviously a horrible team you were playing against if you won with a duel Warrior set up.

Anet’s double backing on their promises has already put me boarder line ready to stop playing. If they demand that I pay to play a game with obvious unbalanced professions that warps PvP… I would walk….

Guild Wars 1 has a horrible, ABSOLUTE HORRIBLE, reputation for elitism. I figure Guild Wars 2 will be the same in a couple of more months once all the Ascended gear is here. Even more so, once the new expansion hits.

I will add this: I have already been invited by a guild that asked me to PAY them a weekly fee and to at least gain a certain amount of glory a week. It is already here and it is here to stay. Now, I will say it is no where near as bad as Guild Wars 1…. yet.

I believe it is mainly due to how different the classes are in general. Not in how they play but their power in PvP. There are obvious power houses for PvP in this game and most people who complain (again MOST) are playing that class and fail at it.

The other side of things in sPvP is the sheer amount of people in one map. It gets to me sometimes. Having 16 people on a map the size of Kyhlo is just… ugh. I could easily be defending a point from two people then get swamped by four behind me. It is very annoying, more so over when it is a thief who then proclaims that you need to learn to play and is a master thief who knows all.

Interpret Interrupt.3824:

Soon warrior will be OP. My day will come… mwuah hah haa

Here is to hoping we become viable!

Yes, lets give the class that can already out run anyone under the sun, stealth and walk away from a mob, and anything else a super weapon. While you are at it why not make that skill 5 auto down people? Also, increase the range to 2000. This is a sniper one shot build after all. Also, this is not overpowered, it is a learn to play issue. People need to stop whining and learn to dodge.

Ruufio.1496:

Will this thread even count since I’m playing a Necromancer?

I just had a 13 minute fight with a Mesmer on my Necromancer which eventually ended up with me dying because my health slowly dwindled over time until I couldn’t do anything about it. Meanwhile, the Mesmer had pretty much every boon beyond the kittening sun up at all times.

He did catch me with crappy utilities up though because I was traveling. Necromancer everybody! You have to use Signet or Spectral Walk in WvW no matter what woohoo!

I even tried to get out of the fight 2 different times because it was taking kittening forever. Both times I used Spectral Walk-jupe trick where you run far and then recall. It confused him for like 3 seconds until he turned around and caught up with swiftness.

Any time I got him below 50% health a whole bunch of “Block block block” came up.

Oh yeah and any time I would try to disengage and I turned around, he would just stand there casting auto-attack with ~4 other clones. So fair. Throughout the entire fight there was at least 3 clones at almost all times because destroying was useless since he would just create more 0.5 seconds later.

Every other class in the game is fun to fight except the Mesmer.
Before I fought the Mesmer I had a 1v1 with a Guardian which lasted 5 minutes. It was a fun fight and I actually did the /bow emote because he was good.

What did I say to the Mesmer? I told him to play a class that takes kittening skill. I don’t think opponents can hear you though.

TL;DR
Mesmer is the worst class to fight against and the most overpowered.
And Necromancer needs some kitten buffs already.

You are completely right. They are over powered at the moment and everyone knows it. More so over, the people who play the class.

Sure it might take some skill to do what that person did, but it is super easy to keep up 3 clones forever (even if you shatter them every 15 seconds).

It is no mystery why so many people play them. it is a skill cover. You can be bad and still do decent with a Mesmer. If you are good, you can do great. If you are great, well then you are basically unbeatable unless you get ganked (and even then you have a high chance of survival.

I highly doubt they will nerf the Mesmer because it is the poster child of this game. It needs to be nerfed, but all the Mesmers here will laugh and cry “L 2 P noobzer LOL so badz”. When in reality they fear the nerf because for once they might actually have to try to play the game like the other classes.

Edit: How was he infracted for that post?

Renny.6571:

Legendary capes!

+1

I would love to see capes added as black slot items. Although, I am sure if they are added it will only be for those who can craft four legendaries and mystic forge them for a 1/100 chance to get one.

alcopaul.2156:

I see many people hating on RNG.

BUT..

Life is based on RNG. Your conception was RNG. Out of 375 million sperm cells, one only get to fuse with one eggcell and formed you.

1/375000000. that’s still worse than the mystic forge.

The main reason why I hate the amount of RNG in this game is because I was promised Skill Based Progression. Where is my Skill while throwing yellow swords into a forge in the middle of the city I bought off the trading post while farming a country side for gold in the attempt to get a “Pre-Legendary” item. That, when first mentioned, was suppose to mean I have done everything in the game and had accomplished something most will not, when in reality, actually just like in life, you can win with money.

I just feel they went with horrible RNG to push people towards buying Gems to turn into gold. Which at the current rates is laughable.

Ragnarox.9601:

skill is when you kill full toughnes vit geared guardian or WARRIOR who knows to play his proffesion. .

Excuse me while I laugh. I must be the best Thief/Ele/Mesmer in the world. I have never lost to a Warrior. Warriors are non-threats and it is amusing that people act like they can actually be viable in PvP other than gibing people in the back while they were fighting someone else.

Braxxus.2904:

Remember warrior is the “baseline” which means apparently that it’s supposed to be the class with downs syndrome compared to the other classes when comparing similar abilities.

They have achieved this marvelously then. The only way the Warrior wins a fight in PvP 1v1 or 2v1 is if one of the people slip up. Sad state of affairs…

If the thief has a secondary hand pistol on anyone of his weapons sets there is no reason he should lose (if he is decent) to a Warrior. The “Black Powder” skill is completely broken against melee classes. Not only does it blind us, but even if we get distance he can just leap through it and stealth. It is a very solid defensive move.

The best bet for a Warrior to even have a chance at beating a Dagger/Pistol thief is to do your best to alternate between normal attacks and stuns/dazes in between the blinds to force him to blow his cool-downs all the while saving “Bulls Charge + Frenzy” for when he has nothing left.

Realize though, he has “Shadow Step” skill, stun breaker 1200 range 50 second cool-down, “Hard to Catch” trait, shadow steps away and gets swiftness for 10seconds at 1200 range when stunned/dazed/knocked down/etc 60 second cool-down, more than likely “Hide in Shadows” heal + stealth, also while in stealth heals a condition every 3 seconds/regen health/regen initiative/move 50% faster all while stealthed. He could use Pistol 5 “Black Powder” + Dagger 2 “Heartseeker Strike” to gain stealth. He more than likely also has “Shadow Refuge” a very long stealth that will basically take him to full health from 1 health point (if he has the above set up).

Also note, if he has his elite up “Thieves Guild” your best bet is to take a shield with the trait “Missile Deflection” Trait V. It can almost one shot the pistol thief with his unload, while also knocking down the Dagger thief instead of him knocking you down.

You will die 9/10 times to Dagger/Pistol thiefs solely because their class is much better suited for PvP in general.

Please note: Trying to instant gib a thief will not work if he is traited properly. You must waste his stun breakers first.

Braxxus.2904:

That would still leave HB as an option over auto attack, it just wouldn’t be a lol13k frenzy burst in 1 second, it’d be a lol6.5k frenzy burst in .5 seconds. Kind of like pistol whip and blurred frenzy, only instead of evasion/stun we’d have mobility with it. Fair tradeoff imo.

Hundred Blades is a 3 and 1/2 second channel which means with frenzy it is 1 and 3/4 second channel.

So it is not a 1 second 13k burst with frenzy, but a 1 and 3/4 seconds (very close to 2 second) burst.

Also, you fail to realize the ulitliy the other classes have with their skills. The Mesmers’s “Blurred Frenzy” can not only be used as a burst coupled with shatters but it can also be used defensively to have a secondary Distortion to evade counter burst. (Highly valuable in PvP).

People use Greatsword for the damage + mobility and the one built in evade. Going Axe/Mace you trade your two mobility skills + evade for a ranged knock down. Some argue that Guild Wars 2 is built around mobility, hence why a lot of Warriors use Greatsword over Axe/Mace.

For PvE I would say it honestly doesn’t matter what you take. I run with Greatsword now, but I used Axe/Shield first. I can say my damage went up in dungeons because now I can count on a evade from Whirlwind Attack and not solely rely on my dodges which means I can stay in Melee range longer to stack more vulnerability with auto attacks hitting at around 2.1k a critical.

jportell.2197:

And how many classes have access to a full two second stun? I hear shield bash is good but I wouldn’t know for sure since I am not a warrior player. But that is why you need timing and not keyboard face rolling.

First off… not needing to know the other profession to beat them shows that the class is kind of broken.

Secondly, Shield Bash has a 1 second stun with 300 range. So either that Mesmer is already in melee range (almost) or he won’t even be stunned long enough to get 1/3 of “100” Blades off. The damage from “100 Blades” is not instant like the Mesmer burst. Even if we stack our “Frenzy” with this it still takes 1 and 3/4 seconds to do a full “100 Blades” while the Mesmer combo is 1/2 second to being with.

It is fine by me to leave, but I still agree with you Blakey. A-net will not touch the Mesmer because it is its baby. What would be the point of the custom class if people couldn’t face roll with it?

jportell.2197:

I’m sorry but Blurred Frenzy=/=100B or is it better on the damage aspect. The only good thing about BF is that it has some good defense too it. Yet 100B can do 8k base damage and much MUCH more depending on the warriors build BF might do 5k depending on the mesmers build. So the only real saving grace on why any Mesmer would go melee is blurred frenzy. Other than that we are toast in melee range.

Do tell how you can actually get someone to stand in a full “100 blades” without some sort of 2 second stun? Blurred Frenzy can not only be used for offensive purpose but I would argue that it is mostly used for defensive reasons.

showatt.9413:

lol this topic is full of warrior hypocrisy.
1) Warrior needs more option than 100bs? Sorry but if all warrior weapon/ trait are buffed to have the same effectiveness as 100b, it’d be the most overpowered class ever graced a MMO.

2) You have 1 skill combo that allow you to haste/stun/instant kill pretty much every class in existence from the raw damage alone, not to mention that it BLEEDS. Granted it is an easy to counter skill when 1 vs 1, most matches aren’t about 1 vs 1. Catching a player with his stun break off and 100b is equal to instant win.

3) Face the truth warriors, you want more option not because 100b isn’t effective, but because you got bored of blasting people using the same cookie cutter build as every other warriors.

4) Which is perfectly understandable.
But when someone propose a buff to every other weapon traits and a nerf to 100b , everyone loses their mind. Hilarious. All warriors want a buff to their other traits, because they’re so tired of 100b, yet all warriors are not willing to part with 100b because it’s so….. weak? lol.

How cute

1) Yes, because to be viable in PvP you need more options so that the other team doesn’t know exactly what you have before you even use a skill. Also, our damage on the other weapons is not the problem (maybe for mace) but it is the gap closers not functioning well/properly.

2) That combo is far from being able to kill any class that has a stun breaker up (which every class has multiple ones). Not to mention, it is easily dodge able set up “Bull Charge” . Bulls Charge gets the most obvious animation award.

3) Incorrect. Because most Warriors are not even allowed on higher end tPvP and all we can do is unpaid tPvP and sPvP. All the while hoping to run into someone who doesn’t understand their class.

4) We need buff to are traits in certain lines because they are jokes. Useless traits need to go and decent ones that can actually give us some staying power would be nice.

jportell.2197:

Yes this is a thread about mesmers. And people simply dismissing skills that other classes have that can counter mesmers because the mesmers presented it. It doesn’t need to be a thread about another class for us to use an example of that class.

I didn’t dismiss the skill, I simply showed you that the Mesmer class has better skills on shorter cool-downs. All the while, obtaining the same amount of “burst” needed to kill someone with a horrible build that could never happen on another class.

jportell.2197:

Vanthian.9267:

jokitten390:

Vanthian.9267:

jokitten390:

I’m happy that you used this one as example, cuz he’s combo is bad…^^ Using CoF as opener is completely senseless… Normally you use Diversion since it stacks vulnerability to target. Afaik anet said they want to balance more for the top players and you almost see no mesmer using pistol… Ehm and showing a Mesmer killing heavy golem to show they’re burst seems like a troll… ever seen bs thief on heavy golem?….

Now please reread what you just said. It is a bad combo. It was still able to deal a huge amount of damage. Now think of people who have better builds…. yeah. There is a reason I linked that, because it is a good showcase on how bad people with mesmers can still do good.

On a golem the cof fail doesnt matter because diversion stacks vuln only on rupt, have you ever seen a golem using skills? and you may watch on his skillbar, he got everything on cd… +he uses one stun, wanna see ppl get kittened by one stun, even 100b wars do better on golems xD

Exactly the point. That is the Warrior build on a Mesmer. Only Mesmers have multiple different routes to make it so much better than the Warrior builds. It takes the majority of the Warriors skills to achieve the minimal Mesmer build. While the Max Warrior is still more vulnerable than the Min Mesmer.

And that one skill that you just pointed out is on a whopping long six second cooldown outdamages ANY other class in the game and it doesn’t matter what you say other wise. A 100b Warrior can easily catch someone with a stun break on cooldown and guarantee an instant win.

That win is conditional to someone not having a stun break up while the warrior has a 2 second stun or higher up. Which on the “traditional” Greatsword—Axe/shield Build you have one of on a 40 second cool-down. Most other classes have stun breakers on shorter cool-downs. Mesmers: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/List_of_mesmer_skills
Down at the bottom are their utilities.

While the other classes do not need such a heavy set up. This thread is about Mesmers not Warriors. If you want to make it about Warriors make a thread about it.

jokitten390:

yep, when you try to use only wep set and when you dont need to use your illus for some defense. i mean not even 2k armor and 18k hp is such a strong defense you can spam your MW 24/7… this is getting ridiculous. Not to forget that 50% of xour illus die in the aoe… Im not saying Mesmer is not solid, but to say “PLS NERF, DMG IS OP LOLOLOL” based on a heavy golem kill, srsly?

You are completely missing the point.

Blakey.5670:

Yeah but after blowing out the adrenaline, what’s there to 100 b about?

Hitting air after the Mesmer uses Phase retreat so he doesn’t waste his cool-downs.

jokitten390:

Vanthian.9267:

jokitten390:

I’m happy that you used this one as example, cuz he’s combo is bad…^^ Using CoF as opener is completely senseless… Normally you use Diversion since it stacks vulnerability to target. Afaik anet said they want to balance more for the top players and you almost see no mesmer using pistol… Ehm and showing a Mesmer killing heavy golem to show they’re burst seems like a troll… ever seen bs thief on heavy golem?….

Now please reread what you just said. It is a bad combo. It was still able to deal a huge amount of damage. Now think of people who have better builds…. yeah. There is a reason I linked that, because it is a good showcase on how bad people with mesmers can still do good.

On a golem the cof fail doesnt matter because diversion stacks vuln only on rupt, have you ever seen a golem using skills? and you may watch on his skillbar, he got everything on cd… +he uses one stun, wanna see ppl get kittened by one stun, even 100b wars do better on golems xD

Exactly the point. That is the Warrior build on a Mesmer. Only Mesmers have multiple different routes to make it so much better than the Warrior builds. It takes the majority of the Warriors skills to achieve the minimal Mesmer build. While the Max Warrior is still more vulnerable than the Min Mesmer.

Blakey.5670:

jokitten390:

Vanthian.9267:

jokitten390:

I’m happy that you used this one as example, cuz he’s combo is bad…^^ Using CoF as opener is completely senseless… Normally you use Diversion since it stacks vulnerability to target. Afaik anet said they want to balance more for the top players and you almost see no mesmer using pistol… Ehm and showing a Mesmer killing heavy golem to show they’re burst seems like a troll… ever seen bs thief on heavy golem?….

Now please reread what you just said. It is a bad combo. It was still able to deal a huge amount of damage. Now think of people who have better builds…. yeah. There is a reason I linked that, because it is a good showcase on how bad people with mesmers can still do good.

On a golem the cof fail doesnt matter because diversion stacks vuln only on rupt, have you ever seen a golem using skills? and you may watch on his skillbar, he got everything on cd… +he uses one stun, wanna see ppl get kittened by one stun, even 100b wars do better on golems xD

Correct me if i’m wrong, but beside the shatter, doesn’t he have a 8 second cooldown when he’s done his combo? How is that comparable to 100 b?

The Warrior Greatsword 2 skill “100 Blades” while traited is a 6 second cool-down rooted skill that channels over 3 and 1/2 seconds.

The Mesmer Sword 2 Skill “Blurred Frenzy” while traited is a 8 second cool-down rooted skill with distortion attached over 1/2 second.

The majority of his damage is coming from the Shatter.

jportell.2197:

Vanthian.9267:

jportell.2197:

Still does a stun. And I also remember something about how mesmers can no longer summon clones on blinds/dodges/blocks/invulns… Hmmmmm. Also the video of the guy you posted that is a High burst build but still takes some time to repeat and IDK why he didn’t use diversion on the golem because when timed right and using a sword Diversion can inflict more vulnerability. His health is also really low for a PvP Mesmer so chances are he would still go down super fast. This game is all about who gets the drop on who no matter what class it is.

Actually without Adrenaline you can’t use the skill… so no “it does not do a stun”.

Yes but in the C/D time you can still build back up to at least 1 level of adrenaline.

For a 1 second stun if you are in range. Which the argument about this is, the recharge on phase retreat is 8 seconds. So even if you could close the gap and gain adrenaline in that time they could just phase retreat out every time. (Warriors do not have that many gap closers that are reliable nor can we gain adrenaline on that level)

jportell.2197:

Still does a stun. And I also remember something about how mesmers can no longer summon clones on blinds/dodges/blocks/invulns… Hmmmmm. Also the video of the guy you posted that is a High burst build but still takes some time to repeat and IDK why he didn’t use diversion on the golem because when timed right and using a sword Diversion can inflict more vulnerability. His health is also really low for a PvP Mesmer so chances are he would still go down super fast. This game is all about who gets the drop on who no matter what class it is.

Actually without Adrenaline you can’t use the skill… so no “it does not do a stun”.

Edit: Also would like to mention: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Magic_Bullet
While traited: Recharges in 20 seconds while useable at 1200 range.

Unlike: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Skull_Crack
Need full bar of Adrenaline for 2 second stun and need to be within 130 range.

jokitten390:

I’m happy that you used this one as example, cuz he’s combo is bad…^^ Using CoF as opener is completely senseless… Normally you use Diversion since it stacks vulnerability to target. Afaik anet said they want to balance more for the top players and you almost see no mesmer using pistol… Ehm and showing a Mesmer killing heavy golem to show they’re burst seems like a troll… ever seen bs thief on heavy golem?….

Now please reread what you just said. It is a bad combo. It was still able to deal a huge amount of damage. Now think of people who have better builds…. yeah. There is a reason I linked that, because it is a good showcase on how bad people with mesmers can still do good.

jportell.2197:

LOL yay for showing a shattered strength bug video that is almost 2 months old. This reminds me of the argument I had about the whole Phase Retreat needing to be on a 30sec cooldown because warriors couldn’t stun us as fast. Then I found a skill that was on a 10sec cooldown that warriors could use to stun. But since no one runs a mace something HAD TO BE DONE TO MESMERS so we could match the builds that everyone wants to run.

Edit: How many mesmers miss the shazaam your dead build. :P

That Warrior skill is also tied to the Adrenaline and is almost completely useless without a full bar of said adrenaline. Also note, you have to be in range for that skill and not be blinded.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=HJf8TT8S718#t=1105s

Filmed not even a month ago and on the full 80 heavy Golem.

Edit: If you watch till the end you will hear him also state: If the Target lives (doubtful if they don’t block/dodge/or something) then it will also have 10 stacks of confusion.

Not mentioned in this thread but I thought I would share.

I have also noticed that when I steal on my thief I can just “store” the stolen item until I find a time I wish to use it (http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Throw_Gunk). All the mean while, the cool-down on steal will reset while I hold my item. I don’t know if this is a glitch or something just affecting my thief, but I have used this many times in dungeons and in PvP to either double junk or double whirling axe people.

Daishi.6027:

You can mock and jest all you like, but the only true nerf to mesmers that have happened since launch is the “no clone on dodged” feature (which was rightfully put in place). The class still stands as one of the two strongest solo class and team class for PvP unquestioned. Either the Mesmer needs to be toned down or every class needs to be brought up.

Look at the Warriors for example. They said the Warrior class is where it should be….they are a joke in PvP. No decently skilled person playing a Mesmer/Thief/Guardian/Necromancer/Ranger should lose to a Warrior. Engineers also got the short end of the stick for PvP in comparison to Thief and Mesmer.

jportell.2197:

And it is a shatter specs 1 of 2 damage mitigation abilities. “Distortion” is available to all mesmers and on a much longer cooldown.

The “Distortion” shatter is a 60 second cool-down without trating into the reduced cool-down line. It is 30 seconds shorter than endure pain and has better function. Also, as I mentioned, most shatter speced mesmer’s run with sword/pistol (that I have seen). The sword 2 ability gives Distortion as well on a 10 second cool-down untraited.

jportell.2197:

What’s the CD on endure pain? And it should block conditions as well (hopefully its a bug and not a design intent)

90 seconds.

While I believe you have a blurred frenzy state that copies Endure Pain on your sword 2 on a 10 second cool down ?

jportell.2197:

The Clone/Phantasm ai is much better. Not only are the ai’s better, but you can easily replace lost clones/phantasm. You can also use them for a variety of other skills (aka your shatters). Painfully slow attack? The Guardian “Spirit Bow” attacks every 4.5 seconds.. The duelist on the pistol is about the same…. Which one does more damage? Now, by how much more damage does it do? How many times can it attack before you have to take another action? What is the cool-down on said skills?

(The duelist does a lot more damage for each “attack”. The Guardian spirit bow can attack roughly 5 times in the summon duration while not traited and if not commanded. The cool-down on the bow is 60 seconds)

Answer those questions and you will see why the mesmer class is truly dominating at this time.

jportell.2197:

Ahhh… here in is where I think warriors heals base should be buffed. 1/5 health usually right? Make it something better or I would like to see “Mending cure’s a condition and the more adrenaline you have the greater amount you heal”. This is the same ideas as mesmers ether feast more active illusions the more we heal.

Sadly, Warriors will need more than just a minor buff to a single heal to be a actual force to reckon with. Our base armor and high health is nothing but a single second stop gap from death while our defensive utilities and options are lacking/non-present.

(Yes we have “Endure Pain” but that is a 3 second stack more conditions on me skill.)

jportell.2197:

it is getting sad because people just enjoy singling out mesmers and I pointed out that at least half classes have these abilities.

The reason for brushing it off, and why it is needed too, is because the things you stated have no where near the affect and efficiency that mesmer clones do.

The most notable are the Necromancer minions. Horrible ai… I actually feel bad for them when I see necros running around with the 4+minions because they are severely hampering themselves with extra bodies that won’t even follow/attack their target the majority of the time.

The Guardian “spirit weapons” suffer from the same bad ai that the necro minions do, but they also have another draw back. They are not prolonged summons like the mesmer clones or the necro minions. The weapons will die after being commanded if not traited. The weapons will de-summon after 20 seconds anyway with a 30/45/60 second cool-down if not traited.

Just looking at these two professions and their summons versus the clones/phantasm of a mesmer…. it is painfully obvious to most who comes out on top.

You can complain that the clones/phantasm are the mesmer’s “signature” as a class, but that signature has so many positives to it with no negatives to go with it. While all the other classes have little positives with serious negatives with the “minions/summons”.

jportell.2197:

But if they do something to our clone on dodge skill then engi’s no longer get bombs on dodge, and thieves no longer get caltrops on dodge. Its ridiculous. Just because one class has some novelty too it and requires a different fighting style it needs nerfed into the ground to please you kitten. And if they say that they are going to change something on mesmers in pvp only! Great I don’t give a flying kitten at that point. But anything other wise I will object to.

Because the caltrops only give a very small window for cripple/bleed and the bomb only does horribly low damage, all the mean while, the mesmer clone gives them either:
1) Shatter Fodder
2) Meat Shield for Projectiles
3) INTANGIBLE STATE SHATTER OPTION

Who else can create something on a dodge roll that makes them untouchable for 3 seconds? Right, only Mesmers.

Lets not forget to mention that he could actually pop a vigor boon and dodge multiple times for more clones to do all of the above.

Meanwhile, the Warrior deals 200 damage at the end of his dodge roll! Ouch.

Edit: Why not give thief’s their novelty on their dodge rolls? Stealth for 3 seconds on dodge roll. Doesn’t seem op at all.

Rhysati.4932:

Vanthian.9267:

Njordfinn.4921:

warrior has imo the biggest burst damage in the game
either you have the wrong gear or wrong traits or wrong weapons

False. My Warrior with all exotic Berserker gear and ascended (back and rings) does less burst damage than my full exotic Berserker thief.
Hundred Blades: 25k crit (all the way through if not then is it usually 19-21k) over 3seconds.
Mug+CnD+Backstab:4k+5k+12k= 21k less than 1 second ( I don’t think I have had a run where my thief doesn’t crit).

As you can see the thief has better “burst”. Burst meaning damage in a short amount of time. 21k in less than a second or 25k in 3 seconds. This is why in tPvP you always see thieves instead of warriors.

However, my Warrior has better dps than my thief. Due to my auto attacks on warrior going at 2kish a hit where as my thief runs at around 1kish a hit.

You forgot to consider that Warrior’s Hundred Blades hits more than one target.

Even if I were to hit all three targets it might equal out over 3 seconds. In one second of damage I would take 21k over 8,333 damage to 3 targets. In PvP 8k ish damage round robin is pale compared to downing a person in a second. Many a classes can hit for 8k damage in one second and not self root themselves.

Also, the claim still stands and is still correct. Burst, meaning damage up front not after 3 seconds, from a thief is more reliable and can be more defensive than a Warrior.

Stefanos.1673:

Vanthian.9267:

Just because someone tries to accomplish something does not mean it happens. Gearing up is a grind. Also, I can only think that the people who “grind” dungeons for skins only are the ones who have played for 700+ hours. Most people are grinding the dungeons for gear because crafting the set they want is not possible.

That’s not exactly right. If you are of the first Guild Wars’ generation, then collecting skins is something we normally do.

Yes, but this is not Guild Wars 1 this is Guild Wars 2. Gearing up is very different and dungeons are mainly used for this fact. In Guild Wars 1 it took a lot less time to get max gear. In actuality you had very little trouble getting the BEST gear in game.

In Guild Wars 2 you are forced to either grind out Money to buy the exotics, becase there is no way someone who just “plays the game” is going to have 50g + by 80. They could max the craft that their armor is in but then they would lack the trinkets. Last but not least, they could run dungeons to gear up then by the trinkets with the money form the dungeon. The last option is the most widely used.

edit: Forgot to mention this, since you brought up Guild Wars 1. The difficulty in repecing in Guild Wars 2 is astronomically higher than Guild Wars 1. All in all, I could repec my character in Guild Wars 1 in a round about 5 minutes if I new what I want. In Guild Wars 2, it would take me weeks to respec my character. Weeks of what? Grinding for new gear. End of Story.

killcannon.2576:

Were people doing dailys before? yes. Were there umpteen billion posts saying dailys were a grind before the introduction of laurels? No. But now that you can actually get something for playing exactly like you did before its a grind?

The grind mentality comes up when you have to do something to stay within the top reigns of the game. You could stay “at the top” of this game and not do dailies before. In a sense they forced the people who were not doing dailies to do them for the new and BETTER amulet.

Weather you will accept it or not, there is a small step up from exotic items to ascended items. This will make a difference in overall defense and dps. The amount of increase is not the issue; it is the increase itself that is the issue.

Lanser.8520:

Laurels, dungeons skins, etc. are not grinds. Why? Because ArenaNet is trying their hardest to make sure you don’t grind them.

Just because someone tries to accomplish something does not mean it happens. Gearing up is a grind. Also, I can only think that the people who “grind” dungeons for skins only are the ones who have played for 700+ hours. Most people are grinding the dungeons for gear because crafting the set they want is not possible.

Rym.1469:

You won’t “zerg” good guardian.

FTFY: As a Warrior you won’t “survive” against a good Guardian.

I honestly think that people who come here and say warrior is still viable in sPvP or tPvP are just fanboys unwilling to admit that Warrior is a failure of a class.

I played Warrior because it was a PvP machine in Guild Wars 1 and I thought that it would be the same in Guild Wars 2. I was wrong.

At first I thought it was learn to play issues, so I stopped playing Warrior and leveled a Elementalist and a Thief. I then took them both into sPvP and WvW.

The sheer difference in how much better the classes were designed and worked were disgusting. As a Elementalist and Thief I had very little to fear in getting trapped into a fight that I could never leave. As a Warrior I learned that once I engage a person, it is either do or die or run for a extra 20 seconds then die.

The defensive capability of the Elementalist and Thief are staggering. You don’t even really have to trait for these defenses either, but if you do trait for it…. you can truly see the joke that is the Warrior’s “Sturdy Body”.

As to the other classes, I have played some of the Mesmer (currently level 62 PvE, still trying to figure out the class and all the traits). I have played a little bit of the Guardian, Necromancer, and Engineer.

Out of all the class, I have to say that the Mesmer is by far the most impressive in terms of design and play-ability (this opinion might change at 80 but I highly doubt it). A built in intangible state…. you don’t have to trait for it… you are truly untouchable in this state. Couple that with the sword skill “Flurry” that is two skills that are innate on the Mesmer that make them completely untouchable… For no sacrifice.

I will stand by in hopes that the Warrior changes are coming, but I highly doubt we see anything soon.

I still believe they implemented legendary weapons in a horrible way. They should not have been rgn guess games nor be the richest person on the server weapons. They should have followed through with their claim on this being a skill based game and gave it to those with achievements. Such as, completing all dungeons would get you a token for the mystic forge. Then mapping the entire game would grant you the second token. Have a third and fourth for something similar then throw the tokens in the mystic forge to get a special currency that a npc will trade for legendary weapons.

This way it is a actual achievement and not “look at me, I have money”.

Because even if the player has no skill, a person with a mesmer has a very high chance to beat someone on a warrior just due to class design.

Njordfinn.4921:

warrior has imo the biggest burst damage in the game
either you have the wrong gear or wrong traits or wrong weapons

False. My Warrior with all exotic Berserker gear and ascended (back and rings) does less burst damage than my full exotic Berserker thief.
Hundred Blades: 25k crit (all the way through if not then is it usually 19-21k) over 3seconds.
Mug+CnD+Backstab:4k+5k+12k= 21k less than 1 second ( I don’t think I have had a run where my thief doesn’t crit).

As you can see the thief has better “burst”. Burst meaning damage in a short amount of time. 21k in less than a second or 25k in 3 seconds. This is why in tPvP you always see thieves instead of warriors.

However, my Warrior has better dps than my thief. Due to my auto attacks on warrior going at 2kish a hit where as my thief runs at around 1kish a hit.

rgrwng.4072:

i do not get Badges of Honor in PvE, so keep laurels out of PvP

Nope you don’t, but you get them for PvE jumping puzzle inside of the WvW zone. It is sad when the quickest way to acquire the Badges of Honor are not actually killing people and helping WvW but rather jumping up a few rocks.