I can’t remember arenanet doing a poll asking players if they like hard content or not.
A poll would automatically be ccorrupted. Beyond campaigning, the other piece is that these groups are far more vocal than the other groups.
~~~
A few points though:
1) Anet knows who does what, and how often.
2) Anet is de-emphasizing further development of this kind of content.
They want their game to be successful and to get the greatest return of improvements for their investment. The fact that they’ve decided to not focus on that stuff right now shows they know what players want to do based on their actual actions as compared to forum noise.
people don’t want what they think they want…
I would note that the hardest most challenging dungeons aren’t played much because they don’t offer good enough rewards. Thats what the gear treadmill people are talking about. If the hard challenging content isn’t significantly more rewarding than easy content, few people will do it.
I think people actually do the challenging content.
I just dont’ think people would repeat them often if it isn’t rewarding.
I doubt this is true. I think most Guild Wars 2 players have barely ever entered a dungeon and I’m pretty sure most have never done Arah.
I’m honestly curious as to what makes you think most of the players don’t frequent dungeons and that most have never even done Arah? Am I missing a dev quote somewhere or are you just making a guess?
The fact that they’re not interested in doing more dungeons is a pretty massive hint. As discussed with the Lotro guy earlier, Anet isn’t going to say ‘not enough people do this to be worth our time’ because it wil. just kitten people off (See: SAB).
The fun thing is that they look to be taking steps to change, if not reverse the viability discussion. The amount of intentionally nonstackable stuff in the new pve content is pretty overwhelming.
It makes me think “Never admit the truth to your playerbase”. Better to appear incompetent while feeding them pretty lies “We are exploring new ways to create end game content”, than to admit the truth "There is a very small but very vocal minority playing this content.
See, that’s what I’m saying. We’re so used to developers outright lying that truth is especially painful.
(edited by Windsagio.1340)
All it means is that they didn’t design dungeons correctly to begin with.
If the content was fun and engaging, people would be doing it.
I will disagree that the dungeon design itself is poor. Many dungeons are well designed. The problem is the core combat mechanics for running dungeons.
Making dungeons to be fun and engaging would require a drastic overhaul of the core combat mechanics. There are a few fundamental problems. The biggest one being that everyone essentially does the same thing(DPS, with modest support abilities). Another is that dungeons are designed so that pretty much any combination of classes and traits can succeed, so what variance there is between classes further limits your design range.
Sure, you can mitigate this by making fun gimmicks for each fight, but thats just papering over the giant cracks in the system.
Rather, they massively underestimated the players desire to optimize, and their desire to be jerks about it. If you play the dungeons with mixed groups covering multiple styes, they’re engaging fights that require some reaction. that’s not as efficient as realilzing that you can burn down almost everything in those dungeons with pure dps though, so we get all these issues.
If anything Anet blew it by underestimating players desire to maximixe rewards at the cost of evverything else.
This kind of brings us full circle though, with the complaints mainly boiling down to the rewards not being good enough.
I really don’t understand why this is even a debate. More challenging content should = higher rewards, less challenging content should = lesser rewards. It’s such a basic concept, anyone who is defending the current reward structure (which for whatever reason relies heavily on RNG for the more challenging content in the game, FoTM/Aether path/Teq/Wurm) is straight up stupid.
Why though? To make it ‘worth it’?
We’d be wrong to conflate ‘what we’re used to’ with ‘the best way to do it’.
Yes. It’s a bigger challenge, it’s just logical that the reward go accordingly.
What is even the point to create a challenge if there’s no reward to hide behind it?What is the “best way to do it” you’re talking about?
See then it’s back to the reward, the challenge can’t be worth it on its own.
on what’s best, I don’t know for sure, but challenge == rewards is a fallacy.
as it is, challenge > reward or luck > reward and if neither works out for you, there’s a lot of work >> reward.
Things like fractals are slightly out of that model, I always end up hoping they do what they did with the rings. 10,000 fractal relics = 1 skin. It would match all the others then.
I really don’t understand why this is even a debate. More challenging content should = higher rewards, less challenging content should = lesser rewards. It’s such a basic concept, anyone who is defending the current reward structure (which for whatever reason relies heavily on RNG for the more challenging content in the game, FoTM/Aether path/Teq/Wurm) is straight up stupid.
Why though? To make it ‘worth it’?
We’d be wrong to conflate ‘what we’re used to’ with ‘the best way to do it’.
Grind is repetitive content done for whatever purpose.
…
Legendary weapons are not a grind because they don’t force you to do repetitive contents to get them.
…
Making a Legendary is a time sink. Your suggestion is grind.
This is the most ridiculous double-talk I’ve ever seen. Legendary Weapons in GW2 are a grind. You’ll be hard pressed to find any forum discussion about them that doesn’t say “grind” or “farm” in it. They are slightly less grindy than they used to be, but this doesn’t change the fact that at their core they are designed to be a ridiculously large item and time sink.
Where do you think all the Lodestones come from? From playing “how you want?”
It’s pretty amusing how people redefine words to suite their purposes. This is the definition of grinding.
Some of us aren’t really all that hung up with getting the legendary yesterday. And are content to let the materials needed trickle in.
But yes, if you actively try to get a legendary as quickly as you can, it will be a grind.
I’m sure it’s been said, but that’s the other thing people talking about legendary’s are missing.
GW2 has a ton of optional/variable goals. Doing a legendary is a grind if you a) want to do it) b) feel the need to push for it quickly.
Honestly, I think the OP’s point is kind o a blackhole for Anet anyways.
People into ‘high end content’ usually follow a fairly predictable pattern.
1) Race to complete the content first (Many people skip this step)
2) Repeat the content until they’ve gotten all the rewards they want from that content.
3) Complain that there’s not enough content for them, or that it’s too easy.
(anet only alternative bit)
4) Complain that the rewards aren’t good or special enough for their achievement.
Dealing with this is a lose-lose. The group that’s into this kind of play is pretty small as a % of players, and they’re not going to be happy anyways.
I (badly) hit on this in my drunkpost last night. Guild Wars, 1 and 2, the real endgame and the really complex play were always supposed to be in pvp and wvw. That’s where the most unique rewards are (ie pvp only weapon and armor skins, although most of them are currently ‘not available at all’ weapon and armor skins), and that’s where they’ve been pushing the most rewarding prize systems lately.
To really please the ‘endgame pve!!!!’ crowd they’d have to do a bunch of things that are against their conception of the game, wouldn’t be very profitable, and are hopelessly poor design anyways.
So, what exactly do you wish to see? It would probably be helpful if players gave the Devs something more specific than ‘non-gear-treadmill end-game content’.
Raids. Dungeons. Post-80 continents. Unlockable secondary professions post-80 after questing. Unlockable skills post-80 through questing. Or we can just call it an expansion.
Aka, learnable content and vertical progression, not skillbased content and horizontal progression.
These games need to provide content for everyone, not just one play style or the other, or a toxic atmosphere arises.
I don’t want to usually make a big deal of it, but I work for a (non-mmo) developer. As far as game development decisions go, it makes sense. You get fired for creating a PR disaster, but that doesn’t mean you lied.
I’m firmly convinced that low player participation in Fractals and Aether Path has left Anet feeling that the vast majority of players have no interest in doing that content. In the GW case, it’s probably substantially less than 10%, probably less than 1% for aether. Given that, they appear to be making the right decision to not invest a lot of resources into game modes that most players don’t care about, even a little bit.
In the current state of GW2, it makes sense to drive people who want ‘skilled’ play towards pvp, and other people towards a broad range of content. Catering to a micro-minority (as showable by analytics no doubt, or they’d be acting differently) because that’s the traditional MMO model is silly at best.
That’s like building a sportscar, but it is aimed to sell to grandma’s and grandpa’s that don’t drive harder than 100km/h.
I love this guy’s comments.
It’s more like sticker-racers complaining they’re not building Lotus Evora’s for them, really.
Anet agrees, thus dungeon token rewards and pvp reward track rewards.
What about FOTM RNG? 8 months for a skin?! really?
They’re offering both paths.
Believe me I feel your pain on the Fractal rewards, but there are alternatives.
I personally think they made a mistake when they made rings for laurels possible. There’s your unique rewards (except then you’re done with it).
I call BS. You are couching this behind “I only want challenging content” when what you really want is challenging content that also provides the best rewards in the game.
Aetherpath is exactly the GW1 model. It is a challenging dungeon with rare location-specific rewards that are locked behind RNG. It is also a ghost town. “I get more loot farming somewhere else.”
You don’t want challenging content. You want challenging content with benefits.
See my post above – challenge must be met by rewards in order to make the player feel accomplished and happy doing the content.
Protip: there’s nothing wrong with good and unique rewards that aren’t RNG.
Anet agrees, thus dungeon token rewards and pvp reward track rewards.
@Mac, I don’t want to go into old news, but it matches a general trend. You saw it with teh SAB/dungeon feedback.
these players would rather be lied to than told the truth
That guy told the truth. ANet told the truth about SAB and new hard dungeons. People HATED it.
Blegh. All y’alls are haters! If every other MMO allows this and a trading post system why can’t we?
Because it’s inferior.
It’s less convenient,
It leads to scams
It leads to super annoying chat spam.
@OP welcome to UI design 101.
First lesson: Making features visible.
I am watching closely how GemStore skins will relate to these achievements, they better be VERY careful about giving free stuff for cashers.
We’re called cashers now?
I hope my full set of lovestruck skins gets an achievement and a title. Even the uninspired “Lovestruck” title would incite me to change from The Emperor.
You casher.
~~
BLC skin achievements + potential key run nerf = forum hilarity?
you know I thought the blogpost spelled out ‘spoon’ as a filter, just like how kitten is.
But they are very serious about collecting spoons, it seems.
You know, I’ve seen several spoons at karma vendors… never bought any of them (cause as a trinket, their stats sort of suck), so I just find it sort of funny.
This is one of the issues I have with this. A big part of it is a thinly veiled karma sink. Instead of adding new things in game that we can purchase for karma and be excited about, they are making us run around to heart vendors and use our existing karma on characters that have zero need for the stuff. Not innovation that I would describe as very exciting.
There are facets of this that do excite me, but I can tell a lot of this is just going to be going to karma vendors and dropping karma on items that are just going to get trashed after I unlock an achievement and that bums me out because it’s an arbitrary time and karma sink.
If they had tied this into new content in the form of new karma vendors that we had to unlock by playing new events in new or existing maps, then they would have sold me on it. In its current for this is just recycling old content.
Heart items cost like 80-400 karma usually. I really don’t think the intent is a ‘karma sink’.
The intent rather is to give players more reason to explore and go into content. It’s retention, not economy management.
Maybe more importantly, the spoon thing (and presumed similar ones) is just 1 of a number of different collection types. It’s another way to push people towards various parts of gameplay (crafting, mystic forge, JP’s for chests).
I for one like freshening old content
I hope my ‘jar of fireflies’ is part of a collection ><
Seriously though, put me on the ‘yay collection achievements!’ side. Finally a reason to do completion on some of my other characters.
…
Maybe they’ll make it possible to get the unvailable armor sets as part of these achievement rewards.
More people who just log in and expect other people to organize for them. Guess what you wanted to raid in WoW? You joined a guild and participated and people volunteered to run the raid and organize and you’d all get on a voip to coordinate. If you’re too lazy to coordinate yourself then you will follow the instructions of the people who will coordinate and do what they say or you won’t get in. Nobody is stopping you from forming your own guild and killing Triple Trouble by yourselves, only you are because you’re too lazy to learn the fight enough to coordinate with other people.
I barely care about triple trouble, but this ‘do it yourself’ stuff from people who almost assuredly are just following in is a little silly.
It’s a classic pat response, and everyone knows that it’s not only substantially more difficult and time-intensive to try to organize a guild that does that kind of thing, it also requires more than a little bit of luck to make it stick.
~~~
Again though, even though its in no way required content. If guilds are exploiting the megaserver system in order to exclude people from content, that’s a legitimate issue either on those guilds side or on Anets side.
it’s on Anet if the exclusion is actually required to complete the content, they need to rework the encounter.
It’s on the guilds if they’re forcing the servers and it’s not really required to defeat the event.
(edited by Windsagio.1340)
Map stuffing seems a bit, well ‘unintended’ if it’s actually happening.
If it’s happening and necessary, they probably blew their tuning on the event.
And what happens when he uses the attack again, and you don’t see it for all of the crap on the screen? And the third time? I’ve been in that fight with a Soldiered out Necro (with armor over 3500 and health ~30K. The move gets repeated every few seconds. Cooldowns, not so fast. There is no amount of protection that can allow you to repeatedly survive those pulls if you cannot see to avoid them in the first place.
I’m not sure about the ground circles being only for unavoidable attacks. While that may be the case, why does it have to be that way?
When ANet designed the game, they stated they wanted players to see and react to what is on screen. Then, they provided a game in which what’s on screen is a massive particle blur that many players can’t see through and some find to be a massive eyesore. Honestly, I’d prefer being able to filter out the blur so I can see the pull tell over more colors on the ground, but I’d take what I can get at this point, since ANet seems either unable or unwilling to let me control how much gunk I see.
I have not had that issue, dunno. I’m prone to reject the idea that it’s all that unescapable, it doesn’t match my experience (although I also am willing to move out of range when appropriate).
About the display, the problem is that in many cases, it won’t be visible even if there are rings. If you’re fighting him solo, there are tells to read, and anyways an 80 elite SHOULD be hard. If you’re in a big group, if he pulls you in, you know you can’t deal with another grab attack, and it’s too crowded to read his animation tell, move to max range for a bit.
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I care about this because if feels like people are treating the inability to just faceroll rargh a max level champ as a quality of life issue.
@Galen, given that the shot is a ‘conditional’ 1 hit (the condition being having at least some toughness/vitality), and it’s essentially avoidable if you run a stunbreak, I think the “worst issue!” thing is pretty far off base.
It would be a minor improvement to add the new Solid Circles to make that attack more visible, but the solid circles seem to represent unblockable attacks, which the Corrupter pull is not. An old-style ring marker would be pretty kitten impossible to see (as others in this thread have mentioned as a problem).
The tone of the complaint about the Corrupter ends up with a strong feel of ‘he pulls me in and then 1 shots me!’ While it happening is frustrating, there are multiple player skill and player decisions solutions to deal with that-
— if you break the knockdown, it’s an almost guaranteed escape (last I did it)
— if you have enough health or toughness to eat a pulse and have 50% energy, it’s a fairly safe escape.
— If you have a ton of toughness/vit you don’t even need to evade out.
The abo strikes being outside of it’s swing animation (a trait shared with Mai Trin, btw) is an issue, if a minor one. The corruptor is some actual difficulty that makes the encounter more interesting.
EDITED: I said unevadable up above, I meant unblockable
(edited by Windsagio.1340)
oop didn’t read closely enough, see Darya beat me.
1shotting pure DPSers isn’t a “QOL” change, it’s core balance. Player perceptions of balance are skewed already, let’s not make it worse by making the intended disadvantages of pure zerkers not exist.
Per the corrupter: You knew the risks when you rolled zerker.
Also, run a stun break, it’s amazing!
Nokaru, it ends up being the exact same problem. As long as some person has kick autority there are going to be more abuses.
Well, 5 laurels for what will most likely be a common dye that I already have / don’t want / can’t sell for much of anything… don’t think I’ll be buying them there.
And the chef recipes to craft a rare unidentified dye… that only has a 10% chance to actually BE a rare dye seems kind of ridiculous too.
People are probably still sitting on really big piles of unId’d from the last feature pack, since the prices seem to still be slowly going up.
Honestly though, if you’re looking for colors, most commons and uncommons are pretty cheap. Just buy ’em.
Legendary dyes are a different issue ><
I use LFG for pugs a fair deal (up to mid-20s fractals, various EXP), and I’ve yet to have a problem with any of the griefing kicks people are talking about (although I avoid the cesspit that is Arah, so that might be why).
Is there some sort of megaserver style sort on the LFG tool? I’d think not but it’s weird that I’ve never seen the complaints people are talking about.
(I have seen some ‘leader bails, dungeon lost’ problems though)
Me and my friend gonna troll the hell out of all those dungeon sellers.
Rob their dungeons and re-sell them. Dream come true.
Not the smartest post, your forum account is linked to your game account ><
All ANet needs to do is to raise the number of votes to be kicked up to 3. Should reduce trolling a fair amount.
In one of the other threads, one of the gameplay engineers said they want to do that. Problem seems to be that the script for kicking is wired wrong for that, so it’s a bigger fix than just changing a number (I presume that means they have support for ‘seconding’ but not a ‘party vote’ system in, it seems like it would be non-trivial and intrusive and trollable to copy the path-changing code)
Right, but it is Anet’s job to handle it not the individuals on either side of the farm/no farm argument. I agree that failing should never be more profitable than succeeding but it’s not my call to enforce that since it is a game design issue. In other words, when these things happen simply report or make a polite post about it and move on, no need for people to take it upon themselves to try and enforce their particular view.
My point is that Anet has 2 ways of enforcing it. If the behavior isn’t too bad, punish the people harassing people for playing the way you don’t like.
If the behavior (as in this case) IS to harmful, you make the behavior impossible.
I honestly think they want to reduce farm trains as much as possible, but they’re keeping an intentionally light hand in doing it.
as an addendum, its an interesting world where the people who get the most crap aren’t the roleplayers, they’re the train-farmers.
That’s because you have people who feel it is their responsibility to enforce their interpretation of an obscure moral code on others, or at least that is what they would have you to believe. “I’m just looking out for the best interests of x” is a common theme, as if it is their job to enforce such things. Similar to the people who get in the passing lane and go slow simply because they think they are doing a service by slowing down the speeders when that is not their job and they are just as likely to cause an accident by impeding the flow of traffic.
A good rule of thumb is that it’s tempting but not safe to assume it’s the other guy.
More likely it’s that train-farms are intrusive and sometimes disruptive to a zone.
At the least you get the Frostgorge case: Constant “Where’s the train?!” messages and yelling at people for trying to do kills out of order.
Worse, you get the CS case, where as other people say it pretty much kills other big events in the zone in addition to the chatter.
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When it’s too disruptive, players get kittened and start acting up, which of course escalates the whole conflict (see trolling accusations above).
For each case, Anet has to make a decision about which way to go on it. It’s not adversely effecting in frostgorge so they left the train in. It was really bad for new players in QD, so they killed it. It’s both unintended behavior and messing up the zone with Blix, so they’re pushing it away.
as an addendum, its an interesting world where the people who get the most crap aren’t the roleplayers, they’re the train-farmers.
I was going to type something here about loot/farming/etc, but in reality this thread was just about griefers and that conversation doesn’t belong here.
In what way? The thread was about the exploit being removed and then a bunch of people who benefited from it doing the ‘yeah well we’re the victims here, people harass us!’
About the negative effects of this.
Designers let it be more profitable to fail because we tend to not be cynical enough and it generally doesn’t occur until it’s too late that people will INTENTIONALLY fail for rewards. It’s a design mistake to fix when it becomes an issue.
It has to be fixed because it jacks up the zone it’s in and general level 80 dynamics, I don’t think it’s actually more profitable than other options, but rather, like Queensdale, it’s just easier. I mention this because I don’t think it’s being fixed to balance the economy.
The harm is that having to remove the blix exploit hurts the event chain for people who want to play it legitimately. Now if people legit fail they have to wait much longer to try again.
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And remember that’s all the change is. They’re adjusting the respawn timer so people aren’t rewarded for intentionally failing events.
you guys run on sucky servers, kitten .
I’ve never experienced any of the kind of train trolling you’re talking about. The worst I’ve seen was train people losing their mud over people daring to kill out of order.
If arena-net added easy farming options I wouldnt care.
I just personally inherently disagree with abusing event mechanics to get easy loot.
idgaf how fast you get money. I just expect events to work as intended, and for the players to respect their intended function.
Events have 4 states. in Waiting, in Action, in Success or in Failure. Two of those states have a reward attached to them. All states are part of the system and they are all as legitimate as the other.
Telling people they are exploiting because they think it’s more profitable to fail an event that to succeed it is the same as saying you’re exploiting because you think succeeding an event is more profitable than letting it fail.Failed State IS an intended function. When it is not, it vanish. Like all the events in Dry Top for example.
And as many people, including Chris and myself have pointed out, trying to succeed at an event is doing the event the way it is supposed to be done, purposely trying to fail (and raging at anyone actually trying to do it) is not. So no, the two situations you mentioned aren’t really in the same ballpark.
Wait what? Tell that to A-net when players actually tried to do champ trains in QD/FGS/etc. The game was played AS intended — yet still got nerfed. Its not the game mechanics that causes nerfs. Its the player-grievance attitude that some individuals feel self-entitled to revel in that causes it. These players BREED toxicity. And toxicity is WHY this event got nerfed, as well. Like many have said before, there were tumbleweeds rolling in Orr before this map became popularized again, post-Megaserver.
Oh c’mon, you really think Queensdale champ trains were ‘as intended’?
Those champs were meant to be challenge events for new players not freebies bags/ exp train for higher levels.
Make the game more rewarding and people will seek such farm spots less and less because they will be happy of what they are earning. If hundreds of people flock to farm such events then that should tell you something about the earning state of guild wars 2 players. I don’t think most of the people farm an event like that because they like it- It’s probably extremely boring but they get some results from all that farming that doesn’t even get close to the one gold coin you can get per dungeon run. Not everyone is TP expert and can turn the silver into gold. And don’t get me started on the Fractals….
This game was supposed to be for casuals but people that play casually and still want to have something to show are sadly mistaken. With the rate of prices going up, farming spots going down, what can a casual do other than leave and find a game that actually gives you something in return for the effort spent?
This just isn’t true. There’s a strong mindset where people will try to maximize rewards no matter what. For some people, there is no such thing as ‘enough’. This isn’t a moral judgement, but expectations are always fluid.
It’s not ‘reducing damage’ it’s ‘fixing a glaringly obvious exceptionally advantageous bug’.
Everyone knows this is unintended, it feels like a cheat. The only reason people don’t like this bug fix is because the ‘status quo’ is broken to the players advantage.
If that’s the case then the gold acquisition is already going to be a fail to achieve that goal.
If they are purely about their intended function of leading and organising then the acquisition should be relying on that rather than on gold which ultimately anyone can acquire. Remember than once upon a time 100g was a lot of money in game and every other person still had the tag, at 300g every other person is still going to have the tag because gold has no correlation to organisation or leading, if it were about that making them a very top tier guild research would make more sense (but even then that’s only more sense, not great sense)
To be honest, I think the forum crying proves it works. All the people who want the status item or who just have a bad case of pokemonitis are pretty upset because it’s an extreme expense for a mostly useless item.
It’s not ‘gold correlates to leadership ability’ but rather ‘gold is a disincentive and will keep frivolous purchases to a minimum.’
The vast majority of blue tag purchases were frivolous, I doubt anyone had any doubt of that. The colors are even less necessary than the base tag, which can still be bought at the current rate.
Another thing that occurred to me is that a game under development has like, a lot of people working on it, right? Like wasn’t the Anet team 150 people or something?
So, they get this huge team together, spend five years putting a game together, and then what? Do you think the Anet team is still 150 people?
No, I seriously doubt it. There’s a dozen. Maybe two dozen people.
All the effort goes into launching the game, but no one thinks about maintaining that level of production for the game’s life.
Why not?
Ok, maybe it doesn’t need 150 people. But with all the groundwork laid already, couldn’t they keep teams working around the clock creating new content (meaning: new maps/zones, new dungeons, new weapons and armor, new costumes, new enemies, new skills, new classes, new races).
We want a constantly expanding world – not a treadmill. Not a hamster wheel. Not a slot machine.
A.
World.
To.
Explore.That’s the ONLY thing that will keep people coming back, Anet.
Anet didn’t lay off people. They hired more people.
Then what are they doing?
They’re running a large number of teams in parallel, each working on their own mini-project.
They did a presentation on their method at GDC this year.
What you mean, “WE”, Kemosabe?
Adding a statistics based way without paying with gold to get it would also help weed out unwanted tags acquisition. Current tag owners could unlock colors through tasks..
I’d argue the high price also encourages collaberation and working together.
Really? There’s essentially no chance that this is true.
- AoE goes through doors and ceilings.
- No top-down camera view for targeting while using it, but a small sliver of screen from awkward point.
Which of course doesn’t equate to ‘no thought was given to user experience.’
A lot of thought is always given to user experience, which should be pretty obvious. Bugs (maybe technical limitations) and choices that might have balance implications (the camera you don’t like) are simply different than what you said.
I can’t say I’m originating this idea, but it bears repeating.
People are treating commander tags as prestige items, when they’re more important tools, and in fact required tools for WvW (and helpful for a few specific pve cases).
The problem is that it’s actively harmful for too many people to have active commander tags, it confuses players and causes coordination problems.
In short, the reason it’s expensive is to EXPLICITLY keep people from having them unless they really really need them for their intended function… i.e. leading and organizing zonewide content.
Edit: Which I now see is essentially what the guy above me was saying. I agree with him!
Nobody ever took a look at an arrow cart and said: “How could I improve the experience of using this cart?”
Really? There’s essentially no chance that this is true.
Heavily prorated ‘burst’ for suppressed bleeds is probably the easiest and least game changing solution.
Each bleed does 20% (or whatever) of it’s calculated remaining damage (number varies as appropriate, reduced by toughness) and is never applied.
There are some problems with this, mainly in that I’t’s increasing total damage substantially in large fights, but it’s a clean fix to thee ‘stack’ problem, and makes at least 1 heavy condi applier welcome in pve as well (since every freakin’ person seems to apply bleeds, even faceroll zerk warriors will see their damage go up a little).
Only serious flaw I see in it is that it kind of jacks up WvW (or any mass pvp), but it would handily solve pve and wouldn’t be too bad in S.