Guild Wars 2

Jugglemonkey.8741:

emkelly.2371:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

With the amount of reflects in game it would be perfectly fine since it’s tied to a 30 sec plus cd

reflects count as blocks dude. can you imagine popping that and then using unload twice. It’s fine for gubflame because you can’t spam it three times in a row. it’s not for unload because unload is spamable, grants might. So no

Reflects do count as blocks, but every bullet counts as a unique attack and would thus use one stack of the assassin signet buff, the same way they currently interact with it and venoms. So buffing assassin’s signet to make kittens unblockable would only guarantee one unload hitting, not repeated unloads like your post implies.

Even then, we’re assuming that they don’t go invuln to direct damage since the main classes you’d want to land this on (mesmer, warrior, guardian and scrapper) all have ways of doing that, or that they wouldn’t just dodge the next unload as soon as they see the signet cast.

Edit: Five hits. This censor is extremely picky haha xD

If you think reflects don’t count as blocks, i’d love tp see you try and block a killshot with your shield while using Shield mastery. And i’d lagh at you as you took full damage.

Also. there is a venom that also makes attacks unblockable. Just pointing that out.

asside from the unbalancing an entire game mode. sure.

lol you are totally talking about my very Cheesy Condi Dodger which is totally cheep. I’ve stated this on several occasions. But you know what, I can admit that. Dare devil gave the Thief the ability to literally spam evades over and over again almost without limit. It’s also a horribly designed spec, all of the elite specs are. But the Condi DD Thief does not unbalance an entire game mode. It’s annoying to fight against, sure, but any class can beat it. AOE’s, One massive Condi Burst, Daze, Traps (both ranger an DH, mesmers, Rev, all of it can take us down.

Also…I’m a warrior main. I play thief this season because I Have never played it before. Sure i had one, but i never tried to learn it. And Condi Thief was just the most effective in PVP that I’ve found.

Next, DH does counter me pretty hard…. if they’re are like three of them. If there is one, i can easily deal, i just don’t try and take them on point. if there are more. I send my Condi thief mid and wrek face because I have the team support to take them out. so no I’m not mad about DH hard countering me. I’m very logical in my analysis of any given spec.

Finally, I’ll play whatever i gosh darned please thank you very much. I have one of every class, and if i want to play a condi thief, you can eat my lotus all day. If i want to play one of my many warrior builds I’ll do that, and you can just cry about how broken warrior is then too.

Pressing one button? you mean dodnge. Sure, dodge into the traps. you’ll cacnel the initial damage. but if you cross the threshold of one of them after it’s activated you’ll take 3k damage, another one continually deals damage., yet another one traps you inside it, and any other trap. So sure, one button negates everything.

/sarcasm

Such BS excuses for a horribly designed spec. Look, you like DH. Fine. but at least have the good sense to realize when it is stupidly overpowered in spvp, which is what Anet balances for suposedly

zero does not scare me, and I was not trolling. 3k armor is still not mediocre. It’s pretty much as high as you can get it without completely sacrificing all damage output.

The saddest thing about all of this is that traps as a premise are not a bad idea. The real problem comes into how powerful the traps are. If Anet lowers the power in the traps, they make them no longer a viable option which would alienate players who use them.

I’m not really sure how Anet could fix this aside from maybe keeping their power the same, but increasing their cooldowns drastically. In this way DH would have a massive Damage burst with the Traps but would not be able to spam them nin stopped. But eben that seems like a cop out.

This is why i think the DH is a horribly designed spec. There is no way (that i can see) to make traps both viable and not overpowered at the same time. On top of that, instead of simply changing virtues to be different, all of their virtues to pretty much the same thing, but are even more powerful. That is stupid. (and that goes for all elite specs. not just DH)

If Anet wanted to make a balanced game, they should have put more thought into each Elite specialization instead of just tacking on more power to existing mechanics. but they did not. They got greedy and decided to the create the elite specializations in such a way that the only viable option is to buy HoT. Personally i did not buy HoT for the new Elite specializations. I bought it because I had finished the game and wanted a new chapter to plow through. would anyone really have complained if the elite specializations were balanced with the vanilla mechanics? no of course not, and then Anet would not be in this situation..

3k toughness is mediocre? thats like some hack level toughness. considering 3000 armor is almost equivalent to having protection constantly?

BlaqueFyre.5678:

With the amount of reflects in game it would be perfectly fine since it’s tied to a 30 sec plus cd

reflects count as blocks dude. can you imagine popping that and then using unload twice. It’s fine for gubflame because you can’t spam it three times in a row. it’s not for unload because unload is spamable, grants might. So no

HECK NO! that would just make Pistol pistol Rediculously overpowered. Screw that.

If you shield bash then immediately headbut you will often go through your opponent.

I know this has been mentioned before, but seriously…please? I’ve been good. Relatively. I have not cheated on you with any other MMOs. I bought early release, I cosp,layed as Ritlock…i even put up with Trahern stealing my personal story. so, yeah, please?

For those of you who think elementalist (or any other class) is in a good spot, just remember all of these were able to be combined.

Naw, Fresh air hits too hard, and too sudenly, and if the team has good communication the Ele is pretty safe. alsom you can make a fresh air build pretty tanky. Nothing like bunker ele, but tanky enough to take a few hits and still hit like a truck.

Zanjii.8214:

The Game Slayer.7632:

mrauls.6519:

sigh I’m so tired of people complaining about DH. This happens every time we become useful

A little too useful.

Actually guard isnt usefull in the class ranking 5 bcs like hundred of ppl say , the traps r to easy to avoid its a l2p issue

/sarcasm

Fixed that for you.

Seriously. sure Traps are easy to avoid. in WVW. In sPVP its a different story. there is no choice but to take the Trap, and even if you avoid it, you’ll just get pulled in. Did you forget that the dang spear is unblockable? yeah. You can dodge the spear, but its very hard to see coming and unless you are a DD thief running full evasion good luck with that. The trap covers the entire point (except mid on foefire.)

Man, when I did I become the thief forums Troller. I mean Trolling as in constantly glancing at this forum. I’m not normally a Thief player. But I tend to route for the under dog. Honestly, i learned DP thief first, then Pistol Pistol cheese, but none of that works. The only thing i have found works is my very OP DD build which Deals with all this meta crap in the same way I deal with people that kitten me off. Annoy the ever loving crap out of them until they go away.

For both Ranger and engi the strat shuld be the same. Whirl through them. with my DD build. i love getting the ranger one, because when i drop it in a mid fight i call out WATER! and Start whirling it to get those bolts. h\keep in mind it’s not a water feild. i just love yelling WATER! as a thief.

Engy is not as good, as it’s very small but i still whirl it to stack up to three stack of confusion.

lol. WAY to useful.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vJAQNApeTnMdAdhglhAWhAElilqATpHE7yBvj2W7sFpA0ACAA-TpgRAB1WGAg9HAA

I’ve been running a lot of thief this season, but not because warrior is ineffective. I run this when the opposing team comp does not suit my thief build.

This build pretty mush laughs at anything short of a massive condi burst, has 2500 armor, and grants might when blocking an attack. I pypically take full advantage of the extra block on mace and sheild when waiting for my next burst or berserker to build as much might as possible. The longbow burst and arcing shot fired at your feet is great fro cleaving away annoying clones from mesmer, and i can typically stand in a team fight much longer. a couple of notes

• Especially in a +1 always take target if one gets popped. even if you think that was the wrong target to take. confusing your team by changing the target or ignoring the target is a good way to get screwed.

• you have the power to get through an elementalist’s condi cleanse, break through a necro’s shroud, and keep the pressure on an engi.

• You have the stability and regen to deal with DH and you’ll find that barraling through their traps will help your team by negating the damage they would otherwise take.

• when in doubt, go full bore on your current target. You’d be surprised how many times you get a suprise kill before they can drop you.

• Whenever you start a solo queue. make it clear to your party that you need them to call and take targets. Some of them may never listen, but at least if you call and take targets you know it’s not your fault.

• Use pin down at a Targeted opponent. they may block it, or dodge it, but if they don’t your party will thank you.

• combo: Headbut, Berserker>Skull Grinder> Mace 3> Skull Grinder> sheild bash> Auto> Skull Grinder

As long as fear can interrupt, it should still work. I’ll look into it though. thanks.

Distracting strikes: “Cause 4 confusion (8s) when you interrupt a foe.”

Fear: Fear is a condition that causes an enemy to be interrupted and run directly away from the player for a short period of time. Characters suffering from fear will run away from the source of fear and have a dark green tinted skull appear over their heads. Fear counts as a control effect, meaning it can be cleared by both condition removal as well as stun breaks. Fear deals defiance bar damage at a rate of 100 per second.

checked. still works.

Needle trap has a 30 second cool down. Drops it at your feet, and yeah, its stupid that thief traps are lines instead of circled.

With trappers respite you can drop one when you use a heal skill. But the trap is cast at the end of the skill, so if you use withdraw you dodge away from your opponent, and drop the trap. So you have a choice, you can waste a skill slot on a 30 second cooldown skill that applies condis, and have an extra trap on heal.

OR

You can have lotus, save yourself a skill slot for something like Bandit’s defense, and constantly apply bleeding, torment and cripple when you dodge. Speaking of which. The bleed duration on Lotus is 10 freaking seconds, and it targets up to three opponents. so yeas its by far one of the best traits out there for a condi thief.

Thank you! You are awesome. Can i still edit it to keep it up to date?

^ this. This definitely.

you are very correct.

If nothing else. thief is very fun, but it’s not fun because of power. it’s fun because of the sense of accomplishment when you gank someone

Needle trap is hard to get people to land in. especially with withdraw. Lotus grants Ranged pressure, is a whirl finisher, applied condi’s and damage on hit, is an evade (obviously) and on top of all of that can be continually used as long as you have endurance, which as a DD Evade thief I never run out of.

(edit: also if you are playing a condi Thief and usign Deadly arts, you are doing it wrong, but if you do go that route, you can still have needle trap on heal as well as lotus.)

You say that until you have to deal with my condi thief on point, alone

Sure warrior beats out several classes on strait up power 1v1, but it’s week in team fights compared to Necromancers, Scrappers, Mesmer’s, elementalists and Revenants.

This is the same deal with thief, and comes from a lack of team support, and AOE Damage. Luckily for warriors, we have it better than thieves because we have more sustain and can stand up in a group fight. thieves are relegated to Decaping, and Single target DPS.

Sure they are mobile, quick, and great at ganking 1v1. but everything a thief can do right now, a Mesmer can make the entire party do, and a mesmer can actually hold a point if need be.

Yes, thieves are amazing 1v1, but it’s the team that makes the game. Personally i would rather have a warrior in my party than a thief. Warriors don’t get hard countetred by DH, engineer, or a properly played Mesmer.

So yeah. Thieves and warriors are in the same boat. Thieves are just worse off.

Honestly, I’m with the OP. Anet has been frantically removing any semblance of skilled play from every character class for a long time, and yet they decide thieves need a nerf like this? The thief and warrior are pretty much left in the dust as classes that still require skill to play. There was no reason to put in an 1 sec internal cooldown on stealth attacks. sure the change does not really hurt that much once you get used to it, but it’s still just a slap in the face to the thief. it’s just another reason why Thief is not part of a meta comp. Mesmer does not just do the mobility roll better, but allows the entire party to do the mobility roll better, while also having massive AOE damage, and more sustain.

i love lotus! especialy on DD

Best team comp i’ve seen:

• Meta Dragon Hunter
• Elementalist (Fresh Air)
• Scrapper
• Mesmer (Who knows how to use portal)
• Reaper

If plays right it’s the best team comp because everything has plenty of sustain while each class has massive damage output. The only squishy class is The Elementalist, but she never runs alone, all they need her for is air overload, and maybe Lightning storm

^ this.

Heck, I’d say warrior is one of the more balanced classes in the game right now, and strangely, even though i hate Elite specs as a whole, Berserker is more balanced than any other Elite spec. so as a whole warriors are in a great place. I feel bad for some other classes, because they are in a situation where they either get over buffed or over nerfed. At least as it stands, warriors are good +1s. you are never going to be in a match and think “Crap that guy brought a warrior, we’re boned.”

Read my warrior 101 for suggestions i have an entire post dedicated to helping warriors.

Vipers, Wanderers, Sinister, Carrion, Rabid, Demolishers are good pvp stats. its too bad anet does not have a stat set that is

Power Precision, toughness, Condition damage but oh well.

Funny, i get all sorts of hate in ranked for running. my condi DD. i run Trickery, Acrobatics, Dare Devil, with lotus. I normally don’t fear condi’s unless i have nothing to dodge to clear them, even then i can normally clear them with withdraw and roll for initiative. As long as i can keep fighting i can pretty much clear 1 condition every second.

wanderers in pvp has condi

Yannir.4132:

I always thought that traps should not be traited with CC. Dragon’s Maw is fine, since it’s the traps purpose to CC. But even the 1/2 s traited Daze on all of them is too much.

@emkelly You sounded like you were suggesting you don’t want to be hit by a trap at all. Is that the case? ToF is absolutely and completely avoidable even without dodging. It’s not unblockable or anything. Blocking the trap will block the daze as well. As a DD if you completely avoid the trap, why would you need to reset? I can’t see your point.

Of course not. But i can also admit that DH is a horribly designed spec. Someone above me posted that its easy to avoid DH traps. I was just explaining to them that, no, it’s not. it’s nearly impossible when they are placed on point because they cover nearly the entire point. sure you may be able to defend against the damage, but you know what? the spear in unblockable, so oven that is mute. i block, you hit me with a spear and pull me.

you do realize my example used the single trap meta as reference right?

Again. On point, how the hell do you expect anyone to take the point from a DH without going through your trap? Any trap but sure, lets use test of fate as an example. You drop it, we come to take point, we Trigger it. We try to kill From ranged, oh look you have a shield and longbow, also you can teleport to us and drop your trap. remember it’s instant cast.

so lets say I try to break the trap and dodge backwards out of it be fore it’s activation time. Oh wait, Daze, that’s right. Lets say i’m a Dare devil and dodge Through it. Okay that works, once, if i’m lucky enough that i don’t get dazed. buti still have to reset, then i still have to do it again when you lay your trap again.

People don’t hate DH because of it’s damage, or even it’s traps. they hate it because of it’s everything. A well played DH literally has an answer for anything 1v1 on point.

Okay first, triple post is annoying. Next time you feel like doing that, just edit your previous post.

Second, Power Warriors have more mobility, plenty of damage pressure, plenty of condi clears, Reflct on block, Stability, Healing over time, and two Invulnerabilities to direct damage, a block on a relatively short cool down, and Plenty of CC to level the playing field on a DH in a 1v1. On point, it’s a different story, Out sustianing a DH on point is not going to happen, even if they have lower skill level than you. unless their entire team is crap, you will fight them, until they either kill you (because you have to try and contest the point) or their team shows up.

That’s my point. Yes DH is very unbalanced in sPVP. We all kow that already, and we did not need you to put on the captain obvious cap in this case.

To answer people who actually asked useful questions…..

The reason DH seem more powerful now is because during the off season, people are learning team comps and class builds. Maybe a pvp team is practicing or whatever. what you are seeing now, is team comps that incorporate the DH far better than unranked solo queues. Not only that you may have noticed Metabattle has changed recently. What was working for you just fine in Unranked, may not work as well in ranked now simply because you are now fighting people who care about getting ranks.

Warriors CAN out sustian a guardian, but it takes o long to do that on point, that the guardian’s team will show up and turn the fight in the guardian’s favor.

Ubik.8315:

Hardly matters if they nerf traps. Idiots will still walk into them and die then rage on the forums, wheras most DH barely use any other than purification, ToF and the sometimes FoF (I quite like this for the stab and aegis spam).

I mean seriously, when one of the most outspoken “traps are OP” forum posters shows videos of him keyboard turning and clicking abilities you get an understanding of how bad some of these people who QQ about traps are.

So, To the DH on point, you have a trap on point. If i want to cap the point, you want me to NOT step into the trap right? Your trap takes up the entire point. Sure i can dodge into the trap, and make it miss. But Then you lay another trap and I have to take the hit because your fagging trap is instant cast. Then you Knock me back out of it, pull me back through it, Pop a shield which lasts longer than nearly any block in the game (or at least can last that long), then when you are finished with that you have focus block, Then a heal, then another heal, then you get to reset the entire freaking chain again, then drop another trap. The Profession is stupidly designed. Compare Dragon Hunter Traps to Ranger Traps, and there is no contest. Heck, Spike trap does not even combo with ancient seeds. (not that I’m complaining because ancient seeds is very overpowered)

The pint is that DH like most Elite specs is horribly designed. Instead of changing the class, it literally just makes the core mechanic stronger. Anet has created a situation where anything they do to improve vanilla mechanics just makes the elite mechanic more powerful. DH Specifically unbalances PVP by making taking a point from a DH a 2 player job in most cases if you want it done with any sort of speed. (note I said MOST Cases) And the balance issues only get worse with 2 DHs.

On top of that, the current state of the game (not just DHs) includes too many stuns, too many conditions, and not enough ways to deal with either, for most professions. Luckily DH’s don’t deal in massive condi’s, but it does not matter because the damage on their traps is pretty much unavoidable. Hell each and every trap is basically a minor Spike Trap but with massive damage when traited for the daze. , and Deflecting shot close range is like having point blank shot on a 10 second cooldown. and lets face it, you have to get close to kill a DH.

In conclusion. elite Specs are all Overpowered, they are all horribly designed, and DH is just Extremely unbalanced in sPVP.

yeah, i did. i was playing an Altruistic Healing build then swapped back t reproduce the bug a second time.

You may be right about that normally, but then again the subject matter of this thread lends it’s self to being bumped. At least until Anet decides to Sticky it. If you don’t like it…you should not have bothered posting here and bumping it yet again.

I was totally determined to make a video to prove my point to you. and then i tried to recreate the bug for about an hour and could not. So yes, i was totally fragging wrong. So sorry about that. I still think it’s messed up that two traps are instant cast, but they are working as intended. The only reason i can see that i may have dropped thee of them, is the auto trap when dazed. but I can admit when i’ve made a mistake. so sorry i wasted your time.

Thanks for the support.

you are not wrong about instant casts. except Traps are not instant cast. (yes two of them are.) They are 1/2 second casts. So yes, while you would be correct if they were instant casts, you are very wrong because they are NOT instant casts. the game is currently treating ALL of them except the elite and heal as instant casts though, so that is a bug. it is not a buff. and it needs to be fixed.

Go ahead. Go into HoM and kill a dummy. then stomp and pop 2*, 3, and 4 traps. you will notice they all go on cooldown, and all get dropped none of them interupting the stomp.

Pre Hot? The game was the most balanced it has ever been back then.

Since Hot, and the introduction of DH. DH has been a huge problem. it’s a horribly designed spec as far as PVP goes.

I should clearify. Pre, the updates leading up to HoT. before the nerfed Warrior into the ground by removing all semblance of sustain

(Edit: I previously posted that i found a bug with DH Traps. I was totally wrong when i tried to record the bug i could not recreate it again. So, sorry i said that. DH is still a horribly designed spec, but it’s not bugged as far as i can tell)

My condi Thief, can win all mash ups except agianst Engineer. In a match on point i cannot win agianst a DH, because Traps OP right now. (they are instant cast, you can cast your three utility traps at same time with no delay. and can be cast (all three) while stomping)

SO i was i a match playing DH, (i normally don’t play DH) and went to stomp. I accidently pressed a trap (because my c key is my trap and v key is my stomp) and i dropped the trap while stomping.

This got me curious so i did some testing. I can now drop my three utility traps all at the same time, even while stomping. this needs to be fixed.

Right now DHs have a very OP bug where they can drop all traps at the exact same time, and they can drop all traps while stomping. so this may be why you are having a hard time.

I just noticed this today, but DH can drop traps. (at least The blades) while stomping a downed enemy. i think this is a bug.

Just checked, you can also drop all your traps at exactly the same time. While you are stomping. Please fix this. it is very overpowered.