Guild Wars 2

Burnfall.9573:

fellyn.5083:

Burnfall.9573:

fellyn.5083:

Why do people care if a class can run away from you fast? If they are running away they can’t kill you which would just earn more complaints.

Do you think you deserve that kill and he should just stand there and let you have it or what?

would you let a criminal get away?

I’m confused how this analogy is supposed to work. Please explain.

It’s quite simple; It’s not about them running away from you fast or that they can’t kill you. It’s about them abusing you than getting away from it.

If the word criminal is too harsh than i’ll replace it with the word; Coward.

As the saying goes, "Coward fight to flight, Coward fight to run, I Stay To Fight "

So you do want people to just stand there and let you kill them as you please. Gotcha.

Furajir.3815:

These “end of the world” players come and go every single patch. Cracks me up. People told me after the hammer nerf, I’d suck, welp, here I am still 3 shotting people. Then they cry about an 8% decrease to HS.

It’s 300 hp over 10 seconds kids. 300 hp. If that worries you then you probably shouldn’t be playing.

Not to mention we dont even have all the notes yet. We already know that we can potentially get a damage boost in the ways of new rune sets and more sigil slots.

Quit crying. You warriors and your mood swings are giving me whiplash.

To be fair that list is not everything that is being changed. For all we know they are keeping the rest of nerfs hidden until the update on tuesday.

Rupture.7683:

If you are an Anet dev please please skip down to the end and review my suggestion; otherwise, you may quit reading before you get there. (indicated by >>>>) I have spent months crafting Ascended Celes gear. My main is a gaurd and I have found that it is the best way to balance my survivability with decent dps. Honestly, I had a lot of fun crafting my gear despite the fact that it was all time blocked. This is my biggest issue with what Anet is doing. I have acquired items that have not soaked up my gold, rather it has soaked up my gold and time. If it were a matter of replacing my set by spending a few gold I would just buy a gem card and not feel like I had been treated too underhandedly. However, Anet is nerfing items that they time blocked, thus infringing upon the months I have spent trudging through their content. They could very easily refund my gold, but can they refund my time? I think not. >>>>Why not give the qq’ers an armor set to stand against Zerk more effectively? Better yet, why not develop a new stat that certain armor sets have access to whereby they can opt to trade it for a stat they already had? Another idea would be to add a stat on to every other armor set except zerk….How about a max of 15% chance of glancing blow? You could call this new stat FAVOR. That is all I have to say at the moment regardless of the fact that Anet will probably never read this.

You could try using the enter key, too.

Like this.

I could see this if all classes have the same hp and defense, but they don’t.

That’s really as far as this conversation needs to go, I think.

coglin.1867:

fellyn.5083:

Why do people care if a class can run away from you fast?

Are you just being intentionally obtuse? I sure hope so, I would hate to think that with our 2 1/2 pages of post explaining this in detail, that you would actually be dense enough to ask in earnest.

Because no one has actually said why it needs to be changed other than “whaa whaaa big bad warrior ran away from me in a fight I deserve killlll!!!1!11 warrior cheated!!1”.

Just because you think something is unfair doesn’t mean it needs to be nerfed and 2 pages (especially when some posted more than once) is hardly representative of the entire population of the game.

Please remember you do not speak for the majority, you speak for yourself only and your opinion is not equal to fact.

But whatever, keep whining about it and eventually anet will be compelled to nerf it just like berserker gear and the game will continue to lose the feel that made it so much fun in the first 6 months of it’s life.

Burnfall.9573:

fellyn.5083:

Why do people care if a class can run away from you fast? If they are running away they can’t kill you which would just earn more complaints.

Do you think you deserve that kill and he should just stand there and let you have it or what?

would you let a criminal get away?

I’m confused how this analogy is supposed to work. Please explain.

Why do people care if a class can run away from you fast? If they are running away they can’t kill you which would just earn more complaints.

Do you think you deserve that kill and he should just stand there and let you have it or what?

Trolling? No, I think he’s 100% serious. 110% serious even.

I can’t +1 the op. That makes me sad.

Ensign.2189:

Yes, critical damage trinkets are going to take a bigger hit. A much bigger hit.

In fact, when you run the numbers based on what has been said, critical damage trinkets are going to take more or less the entire hit.

Weapons and armor aren’t going to move much at all. Trinkets are going to lose 2-3% critical damage each.

I’m curious to know how you know this? As far as I know anet hasn’t released any specifics on the change but you talk like you know what they are.

However I can’t help but notice that you don’t provide any links to some facts to back up your claim.

Not that it really matters, really.

Ignavia.7420:

Treborlavok.3504:

Ozoug.4158:

Zerker gear is used not because it has better stats than any other set. It’s used because it’s all that is needed in A-nets crappy mindless, no skill, PvE game.

Qft

Fix the mechanics, not the tools.

Enlighten me if I understood it wrong, but didn’t they say they know that this is not the complete solution to the dominance of Berserker gear in PvE and that further changes are coming down the road?
Adding an additional indirection (ferocity -> critical damage) might help to balance it out better, as there is more room for fine adjustments. Furthermore I like to play through stuff before judging it. There is still enough time for criticism afterwards.

The problem is that Anet hasn’t stated anywhere that they understand what the real problem is and they’ve demonstrated the same thing in the past multiple times.

Also the fact that they admitted it wouldn’t really change anything…why are thy making this change if they know it won’t do anything but kitten a lot of people off?

The only answer to that question is to appease complainers on the forums.

Brutal Arts.6307:

It reeks of a lazy fix riddled with incompetence for a problem that didn’t exist.

Well there was a problem and that was forum whiners thinking they were owed something for nothing.

Instead of making groups with like minded individuals they decide that the only solution to their problem was to whine on the forums that others are doing things better than they are because of the play style they chose to adapt. And then after that they decide to join pug groups.

notebene.3190:

This is probably a stupid question, but where do you go to see the discussion of the proposed changes? Under the assumption this is something they said, and not conjecture on our part?

It was talked about during yesterdays live stream.

Summary of stuff they talked about:

http://dulfy.net/2014/01/17/gw2-ready-up-skill-and-balance-developer-livestream-notes/

The Lost Witch.7601:

xarallei.4279:

Yeah, it really is. I honestly do not see how nerfing zerker is going to help support builds out.

It helps them by preparing the stage for other, more significant changes to encounters.

That’s funny. Anet even admitted during the stream yesterday that the changes wouldn’t make any difference.

If a nerf won’t make any difference in the grand scheme of things why is it needed? Oh yeah, to appease forum whiners.

Zoid.2568:

Umm no! the best way to play the game is how you want to play the game. If you want to do a lot of damage, you can. If you want to support your team, you can. If you want to be tankish, you can.

They only made zerker build lose a bit more damage to get closer to supp and tankish builds and also condition builds. Zerker was too much and condition was mostly “meh”. If there’s a build that is superior to all other types of builds, then what is the point to be tankish, support or to use condition damage. This was an update to PvE though, PvP people rarely go pure zerker, glasscannons.

The monsters need to get smarter though, so they can counter all kinds of build the players create.

I think you completely missed the point. You sort of got it there at the end but you’re still off the mark.

DPS will still be the best way to take on a boss bar none. The reasons why berserker gear is consider the best haven’t changed at all.

lordkrall.7241:

fellyn.5083:

The difference being that it takes 3s and 3 clicks to reset your traits. People have invested hundreds of gold and quite a lot of time to get their armor a certain way.

I can understand that if all you do is play video games all day having to regear isn’t all that big of a deal to you but not everyone has the time to play 10 hours a day or even 10 hours a week.

But what if the skill being changed makes me want to change build completely, including different stats? Is that really any different?

I think that’s a completely different issue. A change to a stat affects everyone. A change to a skill affects only a minority.

I’m not saying that makes it okay, though. So don’t think that I am.

lordkrall.7241:

LittleLepton.8915:

I have to agree with this. Although, I’d say that the free stat change should only be applied to ascended gears…. I don’t have ascended armors, but I think had I, I would feel extremely cheated, if the gear I made was no longer optimal for my play style.

So every update where they change a skill or trait that might make my play-style (and thus my stats) no longer optimal I should get a free stat-change?

The difference being that it takes 3s and 3 clicks to reset your traits. People have invested hundreds of gold and quite a lot of time to get their armor a certain way.

I can understand that if all you do is play video games all day having to regear isn’t all that big of a deal to you but not everyone has the time to play 10 hours a day or even 10 hours a week.

http://youtu.be/Dzpmj0PKXBk

stale.9785:

-increase armor on all mobs, increase their general damage output, and reduce the number of 1 hit kills that must be dodged. (This would be my preferred approach).

That would affect everyone who isn’t doing condition damage then. We’d have the same problem we have now only with condition gear sets.

How do I feel about GW2 right now..? I haven’t played once since the last update. That’s how I feel about GW2 right now and it feels great.

bloodletting wolf.2837:

fellyn.5083:

Nike.2631:

They’re not going to “Destroy Zerker”…

They’re going to destroy the environment in which it is the best answer to every challenge – hopefully by adding new challenges where its not the best solution.

It’ll still be the best choice some of the time.

Anet has demonstrated repeatedly that to fix problems they will take the path of the least resistance(aka the most lazy/worst path). In this case that means nerfing berserker gear.

They haven’t demonstrated once that they understand what the real problem is.

So please tell me what the real problem is other than players being lazy and being entitled to rewards for little to no effort. For the record I do have a full set of zerker.

The real problem is that the brain dead stupid AI lets people get away with stacking or wearing paper thin armor.

Game mechanics need to change to encourage people to use sets other than berserker. Nerfing berserker gear doesn’t change the reason why people use berserker to begin with. They’ll just move onto the next best set and this cycle will repeat itself again down the road.

And lazy? Really? I’d think it’s the exact opposite. It’s efficient. If a boss is going to 1 shot you no matter what kind of defenses you stack then why bother? Why not go for the gear that’s going to let you kill them as quickly as you can?

Nike.2631:

They’re not going to “Destroy Zerker”…

They’re going to destroy the environment in which it is the best answer to every challenge – hopefully by adding new challenges where its not the best solution.

It’ll still be the best choice some of the time.

Anet has demonstrated repeatedly that to fix problems they will take the path of the least resistance(aka the most lazy/worst path). In this case that means nerfing berserker gear.

They haven’t demonstrated once that they understand what the real problem is.

xXxOrcaxXx.9328:

lol. Just lol. Can you swap your stats on your warrior rabbit armor when you realise those stats are dumb?. Also, noone talks about “destroying zerkers”. They want to adjust zerker gear, so you aren’t forced to run zerker everywhere and all the time.

Adjusting berserker gear isn’t the solution to that problem. Berserker gear is merely a symptom of the problem much like a cough is a symptom of a cold.

Until they change game mechanics there is always going to be a best set of gear to use and that will be whatever provides the most dps.

FlamingFoxx.1305:

I’m sorry what… You want them to tell you every a week in advance. Some of us actually like to experience content rather than read all about it.

If they told you everything that would just ruin it. That’s like someone telling you what your christmas presents are before you open them >.>

Because they’ve given a run down of every update they’ve done for the last year? If you don’t want to read it you don’t have to, though. So I’m not sure why you’d care.

Einlanzer.1627:

Zerker needs nerfing. That is all.

Wrong. Try again.

Carighan.6758:

thefantasticg.3984:

Core AI behavior… not a simple skill loadout.

Bleh. Now, being a developer, I’m quite curious what engine this runs on and how their tooling is and how the underlying implementation is.

I suspected in the past that the reason changes seem slow and indirect in GW2 could be because it’s not their codebase. They bought the engine+toolkit. And as such as soon as they need to dig into the plumbing, things slow to a crawl because it’s hundreds of thousands of lines of code none of them wrote.

In this case, I would have thought that the AI system works by loading a list of skills, each of which can have various parameters. Then, each entity can have it’s own script what to do with those skills and abilities, or falls back. First to the type, then to the general subset (player pet, boss, other enemy, etc), then to the very basic “use longest CDs first” script.

That’s how I’d do it. But it might not be runtime efficient at all, I never had to do much of that yet besides some realtime combat-log parsing in WoW.

GW2 is using a heavily modified version of the engine that Anet made along with GW1.

That means they’ve been working with the engine for more than 10 years. GW1 came out in 2005 and it had 2 or 3 years of development time before release.

If I had a guess I’d say they know their engine inside and out and the problem with slow updates has to do with them trying to do things outside of their engines capabilities and getting it to work decently.

That is part of the reason why we have GW2 instead of the originally planned Utopia expansion for GW1.

solrik.6028:

What kind of chaos would happen if player bodies had collision?

Pros:
-Less dungeon skipping
-Smaller zergs
-Zerg is forced to use tactics
-WvW towers can be defended by blocking the enemy after wall goes down
-Less stack “exploits”

Cons:
-Troll blockers
-People can get stuck in a zerg
-Lion’s Arch bank problems
-AI (minions for example) blocks owner

These are only pros and cons I came up with and I am sure there are a lot more of them

The hitbox wouldn’t need to be as large as the players character. I.e. if a human is 1m wide, the hitbox would only be 0.5m wide. Norns would have slightly thicker hitboxes and asuras thinner.

What would this create?
Will people start running on the right side of the road?
Will people pay more attention to what others are doing around them?
Will parties find a good mix of ranged and melee players?
Will zergs develop a frontline, mid-line, backline?
Will zergs cease to run through other zergs with 30-40 people stacked tightly to eachother?
Will it cause major problems in the PvE world?
How will it affect balance?
Would asuras become the ultimate zerg infiltrators?
Would norns become the ultimate front line defenders?

You forgot the biggest con of all. FPS drops through the roof. PC clip detection was one of the reasons why mass pvp was so bad in Warhammer Online.

Instead of somewhat playable fps in a large wvw fight we’d have 1-2 fps instead.

I think people aren’t gonna be happy until warriors are a free kill in wvw or pvp again like they were most of the entire last year.

Talyn.3295:

fellyn.5083:

Robert.4197:

fellyn.5083:

Robert.4197:

Fenrir.3609:

Zevilo.9304:

Its good that they’ll nerf zerker.

Why exactly?

Because it divides the community. I run PVT guardian and ran HOW P1, ended up with all zerkers. At the end boss, everyone kept going down and 1 guy died next to an NPC, when I went to rez him, I ended up rezzing the NPC instead. This guy calls me out on it and I apologize. Then he proceeds to say that the reason we are having trouble is because I can’t do enough damage and that the NPC probably does more damage then I do. Well, the other party members didn’t like that comment and actually decided to kick him. We got another party member and finished the dungeon.

I decide to do SE path 1 and everyone decides to stack in the corner for the 3 golems, everyone goes down in a matter of a few seconds. I could tell they were zerkers. After 3 tries we finally got it. After finishing that path, went on to p3. Well, group decided to run past all the mobs right before the first boss and all the enemies got aggroed, followed and wiped everyone out 2 times. After everyone was already downed the 3rd time within a matter of seconds, I just decided to call it quits today. Next time I’m in a dungeon, I’m almost thinking about posting “No Zerkers” I mean maybe I can’t kill enemies as fast as the other people but if people are going down after 1 or 2 hits, how much faster can it be to have to start over and over and over again because the whole party wipes?

So what you’re really saying is you were grouped with bad players. Berserker gear had nothing to do with what you’re talking about.

Zerker gear had everything to do with it. I guarantee if everyone in the group had better defensive armor, they would have survived the first group of enemies. How hard is it to understand that zerker leaves no room for error and makes you die faster? I will admit if you can see, dodge, reflect, block every single attack, that’s great and if you luck out and get a good PUG, zerker probably is the way to go. The problem is too many people think they can run zerker and don’t really understand how to play and die all the time and blame everyone else for their mistake. Why is zerker a problem? It’s been said many times, it creates “elitism”.

Bad players can wear any gear.

Elitism will not go away, there will just be another type of gear. As for HOTW Run I see it this way. PVT isn’t my gear choice for PvE at all. It is selfish and brings nothing to the group. If a guardian isn’t going to run Zerker, should be Clerics at least. HOTW is one of my favorite dungeons, I run it at least once a day, and I do it as a Zerker guardian. Your group had issues, I won’t say its you. That is why they failed not because they were wearing zerker gear.

But at the end of the day this is what we have to look at. PVT/Cleric/whatever needs zerkers, zerkers don’t need them. There is part of the community that cries out and wants to see zerker stats nerfed. Be-careful what you wish for. Its been stated and re-stated that bosses are punching bags with loads of hit points and a few one shot attacks. If we nerf/remove zerker builds from the game what will happen. All runs will take longer, we run the same dungeons for coins and loot. When you find yourself doing hotw and it takes an hour to run one path because you can’t kill the mobs fast enough you will be wanting some dps in your party again. How long can you expect players to grind the same stuff when it takes that long? At least now I don’t mind it cause its done rather quickly. If Anet does nerf zerker gear, I think that might be the time for me to part ways.

The solution isn’t to nerf what works, its to fix what is broken. Control and Support need a buff, we have been saying this for a while now. Given the history of how Anet fixes things it won’t happen, they will just nerf the dps and bam, that will be it.

I think you quoted the wrong person.

Robert.4197:

fellyn.5083:

Robert.4197:

Fenrir.3609:

Zevilo.9304:

Its good that they’ll nerf zerker.

Why exactly?

Because it divides the community. I run PVT guardian and ran HOW P1, ended up with all zerkers. At the end boss, everyone kept going down and 1 guy died next to an NPC, when I went to rez him, I ended up rezzing the NPC instead. This guy calls me out on it and I apologize. Then he proceeds to say that the reason we are having trouble is because I can’t do enough damage and that the NPC probably does more damage then I do. Well, the other party members didn’t like that comment and actually decided to kick him. We got another party member and finished the dungeon.

I decide to do SE path 1 and everyone decides to stack in the corner for the 3 golems, everyone goes down in a matter of a few seconds. I could tell they were zerkers. After 3 tries we finally got it. After finishing that path, went on to p3. Well, group decided to run past all the mobs right before the first boss and all the enemies got aggroed, followed and wiped everyone out 2 times. After everyone was already downed the 3rd time within a matter of seconds, I just decided to call it quits today. Next time I’m in a dungeon, I’m almost thinking about posting “No Zerkers” I mean maybe I can’t kill enemies as fast as the other people but if people are going down after 1 or 2 hits, how much faster can it be to have to start over and over and over again because the whole party wipes?

So what you’re really saying is you were grouped with bad players. Berserker gear had nothing to do with what you’re talking about.

Zerker gear had everything to do with it. I guarantee if everyone in the group had better defensive armor, they would have survived the first group of enemies. How hard is it to understand that zerker leaves no room for error and makes you die faster? I will admit if you can see, dodge, reflect, block every single attack, that’s great and if you luck out and get a good PUG, zerker probably is the way to go. The problem is too many people think they can run zerker and don’t really understand how to play and die all the time and blame everyone else for their mistake. Why is zerker a problem? It’s been said many times, it creates “elitism”.

Bad players can wear any gear.

jihm.2315:

P1 ONLY ZERKERS NO NOOBS 6k ach
this has to die

Why? For starters the fact that they are saying you need a certain amount of ap to join because they think a lot of ap means they’re good should be a giant red flag.

You should thank them for saving you some time.

Robert.4197:

Fenrir.3609:

Zevilo.9304:

Its good that they’ll nerf zerker.

Why exactly?

Because it divides the community. I run PVT guardian and ran HOW P1, ended up with all zerkers. At the end boss, everyone kept going down and 1 guy died next to an NPC, when I went to rez him, I ended up rezzing the NPC instead. This guy calls me out on it and I apologize. Then he proceeds to say that the reason we are having trouble is because I can’t do enough damage and that the NPC probably does more damage then I do. Well, the other party members didn’t like that comment and actually decided to kick him. We got another party member and finished the dungeon.

I decide to do SE path 1 and everyone decides to stack in the corner for the 3 golems, everyone goes down in a matter of a few seconds. I could tell they were zerkers. After 3 tries we finally got it. After finishing that path, went on to p3. Well, group decided to run past all the mobs right before the first boss and all the enemies got aggroed, followed and wiped everyone out 2 times. After everyone was already downed the 3rd time within a matter of seconds, I just decided to call it quits today. Next time I’m in a dungeon, I’m almost thinking about posting “No Zerkers” I mean maybe I can’t kill enemies as fast as the other people but if people are going down after 1 or 2 hits, how much faster can it be to have to start over and over and over again because the whole party wipes?

So what you’re really saying is you were grouped with bad players. Berserker gear had nothing to do with what you’re talking about.

Fenrir.3609:

Zevilo.9304:

fellyn.5083:

Zevilo.9304:

fellyn.5083:

Zevilo.9304:

fellyn.5083:

Zevilo.9304:

Fenrir.3609:

Zevilo.9304:

Fenrir.3609:

Zevilo.9304:

Its good that they’ll nerf zerker.

Why exactly?

Zerker gear gives power, perc and crit damage, the high power and crit chance/damage make it the viable option for dps. The downside of it should be the lack of survivability but that’s not the case. There are alternatives to zerker anyway like assassins only with less power.

edit: and for the ppl with ascended gear already zerker, If you had magic find gear before then know that its possible to change gear stats to whatever you want.

You didn’t address the question. Why would a nerf on zerker be good?

You would need a total overhaul of the combat system/mechanics in order not to favour pure dmg and the ability to move/time/stack correctly over some guy stacking toughness.

A nerf to damage for the zerk set would do nothing for the game without the above. Which let’s face it, isn’t going to happen.

If you are going to move away from mobs with telegraphed massive spike damage attacks, move away from action/dodge combat and move towards a trinity system with dedicated healers et al. Then nerfing dps gear makes sense but becomes redundant anyway.

If you are just going to nerf the damage output of the glass cannon set up and err, that’s it. Then you are going to make things worse frankly.

As for “go assassins”, and? Kill stuff a bit slower? Awesome, that’s a step forward right there. That is, until people wearing PVT start moaning that those in assassins are clearing dungeons faster than them and we get another cry for nerfs.

they don’t really need to over haul the game’s combat mechanic just because they went and nerfed zerker, that would be an over reaction because the ability to move/time/stack correctly is not connected with zerker gear.

Nerfing zerker gear isn’t just so you kill stuff slower, the gear setup often provides high power and damage and high crit chance/damage which together just burns everything too fast with no downside. Bosses cant react because they’re dead after a few seconds, If anything it encourages boss design with high hp pools. A nerf would really benefit build diversity.

And they should also nerf PVT specially to deter zerging, but that’s for another day.

You’re pretty clueless. If they nerf berserker the people who stay around after that will just move onto the next highest dps set and then the next and so on. And the cycle will repeat.

The only way that doesn’t happen is like the guy said, if you rework the entire combat mechanic from the ground up to encourage the use of other gear sets.

Take away the reasons why berserker gear is good and lo and behold, berserker gear isn’t a problem anymore.

As it is right now there is no reason to stack toughness or health in PvE because bosses are going to 1 shot you no matter what you do it. And that is why people like berserker. Killing stuff faster means you don’t have to worry about getting 1 shot as much.

Berserker gear is a symptom of the problem much like a cough is a symptom of a cold. Getting rid of berserker gear isn’t going to fix the main problem.

you can try posting here, maybe they’ll hear you better.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/balance/PvE-Zerkers/page/2#post3480565

Unless you just like calling me clueless then be my guest.

I don’t know the post in which I quoted shows that you don’t understand the core issue and why people use berserker gear to begin with.

keep going.

You’re having trouble reading the rest of the posts on this page?

go on.

Go on what?

Instead of trying to refute the points I made above he just referred me to another thread. Which I find odd because he was posting in this thread too. If he didn’t want to have a discussion in this thread he perhaps shouldn’t have posted in it.

Zevilo.9304:

fellyn.5083:

Zevilo.9304:

fellyn.5083:

Zevilo.9304:

Fenrir.3609:

Zevilo.9304:

Fenrir.3609:

Zevilo.9304:

Its good that they’ll nerf zerker.

Why exactly?

Zerker gear gives power, perc and crit damage, the high power and crit chance/damage make it the viable option for dps. The downside of it should be the lack of survivability but that’s not the case. There are alternatives to zerker anyway like assassins only with less power.

edit: and for the ppl with ascended gear already zerker, If you had magic find gear before then know that its possible to change gear stats to whatever you want.

You didn’t address the question. Why would a nerf on zerker be good?

You would need a total overhaul of the combat system/mechanics in order not to favour pure dmg and the ability to move/time/stack correctly over some guy stacking toughness.

A nerf to damage for the zerk set would do nothing for the game without the above. Which let’s face it, isn’t going to happen.

If you are going to move away from mobs with telegraphed massive spike damage attacks, move away from action/dodge combat and move towards a trinity system with dedicated healers et al. Then nerfing dps gear makes sense but becomes redundant anyway.

If you are just going to nerf the damage output of the glass cannon set up and err, that’s it. Then you are going to make things worse frankly.

As for “go assassins”, and? Kill stuff a bit slower? Awesome, that’s a step forward right there. That is, until people wearing PVT start moaning that those in assassins are clearing dungeons faster than them and we get another cry for nerfs.

they don’t really need to over haul the game’s combat mechanic just because they went and nerfed zerker, that would be an over reaction because the ability to move/time/stack correctly is not connected with zerker gear.

Nerfing zerker gear isn’t just so you kill stuff slower, the gear setup often provides high power and damage and high crit chance/damage which together just burns everything too fast with no downside. Bosses cant react because they’re dead after a few seconds, If anything it encourages boss design with high hp pools. A nerf would really benefit build diversity.

And they should also nerf PVT specially to deter zerging, but that’s for another day.

You’re pretty clueless. If they nerf berserker the people who stay around after that will just move onto the next highest dps set and then the next and so on. And the cycle will repeat.

The only way that doesn’t happen is like the guy said, if you rework the entire combat mechanic from the ground up to encourage the use of other gear sets.

Take away the reasons why berserker gear is good and lo and behold, berserker gear isn’t a problem anymore.

As it is right now there is no reason to stack toughness or health in PvE because bosses are going to 1 shot you no matter what you do it. And that is why people like berserker. Killing stuff faster means you don’t have to worry about getting 1 shot as much.

Berserker gear is a symptom of the problem much like a cough is a symptom of a cold. Getting rid of berserker gear isn’t going to fix the main problem.

you can try posting here, maybe they’ll hear you better.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/balance/PvE-Zerkers/page/2#post3480565

Unless you just like calling me clueless then be my guest.

I don’t know the post in which I quoted shows that you don’t understand the core issue and why people use berserker gear to begin with.

keep going.

You’re having trouble reading the rest of the posts on this page?

Zevilo.9304:

fellyn.5083:

Zevilo.9304:

Fenrir.3609:

Zevilo.9304:

Fenrir.3609:

Zevilo.9304:

Its good that they’ll nerf zerker.

Why exactly?

Zerker gear gives power, perc and crit damage, the high power and crit chance/damage make it the viable option for dps. The downside of it should be the lack of survivability but that’s not the case. There are alternatives to zerker anyway like assassins only with less power.

edit: and for the ppl with ascended gear already zerker, If you had magic find gear before then know that its possible to change gear stats to whatever you want.

You didn’t address the question. Why would a nerf on zerker be good?

You would need a total overhaul of the combat system/mechanics in order not to favour pure dmg and the ability to move/time/stack correctly over some guy stacking toughness.

A nerf to damage for the zerk set would do nothing for the game without the above. Which let’s face it, isn’t going to happen.

If you are going to move away from mobs with telegraphed massive spike damage attacks, move away from action/dodge combat and move towards a trinity system with dedicated healers et al. Then nerfing dps gear makes sense but becomes redundant anyway.

If you are just going to nerf the damage output of the glass cannon set up and err, that’s it. Then you are going to make things worse frankly.

As for “go assassins”, and? Kill stuff a bit slower? Awesome, that’s a step forward right there. That is, until people wearing PVT start moaning that those in assassins are clearing dungeons faster than them and we get another cry for nerfs.

they don’t really need to over haul the game’s combat mechanic just because they went and nerfed zerker, that would be an over reaction because the ability to move/time/stack correctly is not connected with zerker gear.

Nerfing zerker gear isn’t just so you kill stuff slower, the gear setup often provides high power and damage and high crit chance/damage which together just burns everything too fast with no downside. Bosses cant react because they’re dead after a few seconds, If anything it encourages boss design with high hp pools. A nerf would really benefit build diversity.

And they should also nerf PVT specially to deter zerging, but that’s for another day.

You’re pretty clueless. If they nerf berserker the people who stay around after that will just move onto the next highest dps set and then the next and so on. And the cycle will repeat.

The only way that doesn’t happen is like the guy said, if you rework the entire combat mechanic from the ground up to encourage the use of other gear sets.

Take away the reasons why berserker gear is good and lo and behold, berserker gear isn’t a problem anymore.

As it is right now there is no reason to stack toughness or health in PvE because bosses are going to 1 shot you no matter what you do it. And that is why people like berserker. Killing stuff faster means you don’t have to worry about getting 1 shot as much.

Berserker gear is a symptom of the problem much like a cough is a symptom of a cold. Getting rid of berserker gear isn’t going to fix the main problem.

you can try posting here, maybe they’ll hear you better.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/balance/PvE-Zerkers/page/2#post3480565

Unless you just like calling me clueless then be my guest.

I don’t know…the post in which I quoted shows that you don’t understand the core issue and why people use berserker gear to begin with.

Primernova.5791:

fellyn.5083:

I’m going to laugh if they actually touch the stats on berserker gear. The amount of anger that will be shown on the forum that day will dwarf any of the other stupid things Anet has done in the last year and a half.

Sadly Anet has made a history of doing the worst possible thing with this game so it’s entirely possible they think it’s actually a good idea to nerf berserker gear is some way.

The stats are fine, it’s a choice just like the rest of the sets that go unused. It’s how the AI will react and how the damage will go out that will change.

Like say if a boss is drug to a corner, instant monster AoE every few seconds. Or having mobs/bosses do more unavoidable AoE faster and more often. Things that will make having the other stats important, basically.

Even with those kind of changes, the game will still be ultra shallow. Anyone that likes this all DPS (even with a potential soft trinity) meta, has never walked into Lower Guk or UBRS or any other properly balanced trinity game. They are way better, by miles.

You can’t reinvent the wheel.

I’m aware of all that and I know it’s not the stats that need to change. The post you quoted was talking about the kitten storm that is going to happen if/when they nerf berserker stats. Which is much more likely to happen than them reworking combat mechanics for every world or dungeon boss in the game.

frans.8092:

They just might change the stats. Berserker stats (power, precision and critical damage) all operate together and the bit and scraps of increased stats on ascended gear make a full berserker set quite a bit stronger (30%) then it’s exotic counterpart. They could reduce some of that power difference by decreasing some of the original stats and add some other stat to make the overall offensive difference with exotic smaller.

So? It still wouldn’t fix the problem and I gotta ask what game you’re playing if you think nerfing berserker stats would actually fix anything.

Zevilo.9304:

Fenrir.3609:

Zevilo.9304:

Fenrir.3609:

Zevilo.9304:

Its good that they’ll nerf zerker.

Why exactly?

Zerker gear gives power, perc and crit damage, the high power and crit chance/damage make it the viable option for dps. The downside of it should be the lack of survivability but that’s not the case. There are alternatives to zerker anyway like assassins only with less power.

edit: and for the ppl with ascended gear already zerker, If you had magic find gear before then know that its possible to change gear stats to whatever you want.

You didn’t address the question. Why would a nerf on zerker be good?

You would need a total overhaul of the combat system/mechanics in order not to favour pure dmg and the ability to move/time/stack correctly over some guy stacking toughness.

A nerf to damage for the zerk set would do nothing for the game without the above. Which let’s face it, isn’t going to happen.

If you are going to move away from mobs with telegraphed massive spike damage attacks, move away from action/dodge combat and move towards a trinity system with dedicated healers et al. Then nerfing dps gear makes sense but becomes redundant anyway.

If you are just going to nerf the damage output of the glass cannon set up and err, that’s it. Then you are going to make things worse frankly.

As for “go assassins”, and? Kill stuff a bit slower? Awesome, that’s a step forward right there. That is, until people wearing PVT start moaning that those in assassins are clearing dungeons faster than them and we get another cry for nerfs.

they don’t really need to over haul the game’s combat mechanic just because they went and nerfed zerker, that would be an over reaction because the ability to move/time/stack correctly is not connected with zerker gear.

Nerfing zerker gear isn’t just so you kill stuff slower, the gear setup often provides high power and damage and high crit chance/damage which together just burns everything too fast with no downside. Bosses cant react because they’re dead after a few seconds, If anything it encourages boss design with high hp pools. A nerf would really benefit build diversity.

And they should also nerf PVT specially to deter zerging, but that’s for another day.

You’re pretty clueless. If they nerf berserker the people who stay around after that will just move onto the next highest dps set and then the next and so on. And the cycle will repeat.

The only way that doesn’t happen is like the guy said, if you rework the entire combat mechanic from the ground up to encourage the use of other gear sets.

Take away the reasons why berserker gear is good and lo and behold, berserker gear isn’t a problem anymore.

As it is right now there is no reason to stack toughness or health in PvE because bosses are going to 1 shot you no matter what you do it. And that is why people like berserker. Killing stuff faster means you don’t have to worry about getting 1 shot as much.

Berserker gear is a symptom of the problem much like a cough is a symptom of a cold. Getting rid of berserker gear isn’t going to fix the main problem.

I’m going to laugh if they actually touch the stats on berserker gear. The amount of anger that will be shown on the forum that day will dwarf the reactions to any of the other stupid things Anet has done in the last year and a half.

Sadly Anet has made a history of doing the worst possible thing with this game so it’s entirely possible they think it’s actually a good idea to nerf berserker gear is some way.

Vayne.8563:

fellyn.5083:

Vayne.8563:

I can’t imagine how anyone can take a projected schedule, which was said to be not written in stone, and call that a promise.

Until someone can actually answer that…the rest of this complain seems to lack substance.

It would be different if Anet had said we’re going to have this by the end of the year, but they didn’t. All they said was they’re going to try to have this by the end of the year.

People read what they want to read.

Yeah it wasn’t a promise but if they knew there was the smallest chance something wasn’t going to get finished in time then they shouldn’t have mentioned it pure and simple.

They get peoples hopes up for much wanted and requested features only to tell us “nope lol maybe next year we’ll actually get to it”. When they are the things people have wanted since release.

Once promised, told it’s not gonna happen any time soon. Then mentioned again much later and said this could be done by the end of the year then told yet again that it’s not going to happen any time soon. Anet deserves all the flak they get as far as this stuff is concerned because all the significant things they talked about didn’t happen in 2013.

But hey, we got a lot of useless ugly back item skins, RNG boxes, and Scarlett so I guess that makes up for it.

Okay, so your suggestion is Anet doesn’t mention anything at all to anyone until they’re ready to ship..by which time it’s far too late to have feedback. The community can’t have it both ways. Either they want to be involved with the creation process, or they don’t.

If Anet waits until things are set in stone to annouce stuff, the fans get no time to react to it, and in that case they should just accept anything Anet does.

If the fans want to be involved, they need to understand creative process, iterative process and long distance scheduling of complex projects.

What Anet is saying is we didn’t make this deadline, not that it’s not going to happen. How many games have had delayed released dates, due to unforseen circumstances. Many.

Worse still, how many games (including this one in my opinion) have launched early, at least partly because of growing pressure from the playerbase.

People need to learn some patience. Stuff that comes out three months late isn’t stuff that isn’t coming.

How would these same people react if Anet rushed these things out and they didn’t work?

What, exactly, were we supposed to be giving feedback on? They didn’t give us anything to give feedback on so I don’t see it.

All they put out was their second half of 2013 blog post which contained a list of things they wanted done by the end of the year, nothing more and nothing less. No details of any sort on how the coming changes would work.

And it’s also amusing how you think anet listens to feedback unless something blows up in their faces like with cultural armor fiasco from a little while ago. And they certainly have listened to all the feedback they’ve been given on Scarlett.

They sure didn’t listen when last September (2012) when they told us they were working on the precursor scavenger hunt and they got thousands of posts talking about it and how much it was needed.

So I ask again what feedback we were supposed to be give? And don’t get me wrong I’m not saying they shouldn’t say anything. They did come through with some things on their list just not the important things most people wanted.

All I’m saying is if there was a risk something wasn’t gonna get done (and they knew there was a chance, hence the warning that nothing was concrete in the list) then they shouldn’t have mentioned it.

Vayne.8563:

I can’t imagine how anyone can take a projected schedule, which was said to be not written in stone, and call that a promise.

Until someone can actually answer that…the rest of this complain seems to lack substance.

It would be different if Anet had said we’re going to have this by the end of the year, but they didn’t. All they said was they’re going to try to have this by the end of the year.

People read what they want to read.

Yeah it wasn’t a promise but if they knew there was the smallest chance something wasn’t going to get finished in time then they shouldn’t have mentioned it pure and simple.

They get peoples hopes up for much wanted and requested features only to tell us “nope lol maybe next year we’ll actually get to it”. When they are the things people have wanted since release.

Once promised, told it’s not gonna happen any time soon. Then mentioned again much later and said this could be done by the end of the year then told yet again that it’s not going to happen any time soon. Anet deserves all the flak they get as far as this stuff is concerned because all the significant things they talked about didn’t happen in 2013.

But hey, we got a lot of useless ugly back item skins, RNG boxes, and Scarlett so I guess that makes up for it.

I haven’t read the entire thread but the secret below could be dwarves and we’ll maybe see their return to Tyria. And they disappeared shortly after killing off the Great Destroyer.

And of course at the end of Eye of the North the dwarves were all set to be going after Primordus.

Remember when Heal Sig wasn’t worth slotting? I do.

Seems like some people won’t be happy until warriors are free kills again like they were most of the entire last year.

I can think of one reason, specifically. Warriors are described as the weapon specialists. The class that can use the most weapons.

Not that anet has stuck to the class descriptions all that closely since the game was released but the fact remains that one of the warriors class mechanics is that they can use more weapons than other classes.

I do all my crafting in Ebonhawke. The crafting area is really close to the TP there.

Corpus Christi.2057:

Guess which skill is surprisingly the most amazing one… Warrior’s, of crouse.;) On the other hand, ranger’s healing spirit which heals you approx. every 10 s for around 8xx hp is a joke, imo. Its active is not strong enough to compensate for that pathetic few hundred hp/10s. Sorry to say that.:/

Only in a very specific situation in wvw. For most pve encounters and pvp it’s complete garbage.

I’d rather have a skill I can use in every part of the game instead of one I can only use in a specific part of the game. And in a specific situation in that specific part of the game, at that.

It’s like that on any UI size that is not normal. That is small or large. Pretty kitten lazy that it’s an issue that has existed for more than a year now without any fix.

Chokolata.1870:

All warrior OP complaints started when they doubled HS . Nerf it to like 300 hp/sec and be done with it

So you want them to make it worse than it was before it was buffed?

Butch.4957:

kelman.9451:

Thieves are still OPed

Saw this and just had to ask. Do you even play a thief? I main a thief and every time i fight a warrior, the only way I can survive and have a hope of killing him is to make use of all my profession mechanics with stealth and all else. Of course, this is my own personal experience and I might just be using the wrong build.

Regardless, my point that is that in my own personal opinion, warriors are extremely overpowered.

I’m confused what you’re getting at here. What do you want to kill them with if not your classes mechanics? Kind words?

How many times over the last year have we been told that “An epic event that will rock Tyria to its very core” is going to happen? Pretty much every 2 weeks I think.