Guild Wars 2

Test on engineer against the test dummies, maybe. Actually play the class for enjoyment, very well doubt it.

and Nah 24k is totally possible, just find a lone lvl 2 in WvW
take that same lvl 2 and hit him with killshot and you should get around 40k+

Kit refinement had

• Damage
• Condi Removals
• Small heal
• Snare
• Utility

I don’t see how they could possibly go more utility with KR than that unless they give us stun breakers, its just being Nerf out of hate, because if you were to say something like SE was OP, then what would Soothing Mist be ? Minor trait, OP heal and party wide, no cool-down nor ending.

what will be probably be done is; They chance grenade barrage for some extremely useless ability, toss 1 grenade into that air that will land 30s later! hitting your foe for 100 damage. and SE duration will be reduced from full to probably 3-5 seconds.

and unless they make turrets into a kit ( they do little damage but could provide utility as a whole, as well as people would start using turret traits which currently only works as visual clutter ), and still not be as strong as ele’s summons or mesmer illusions.

AoE nerf could go many ways without having to nerf actual skills, they will probably either limit the number of targets you can hit down to 3 OR the more targets you hit, the less damage you make kind of thing

MrForz.1953:

Mister Mustard.7203:

MrForz.1953:

You know, if all the turrets were part of ONE kit, I’d probably use it.

Yeah, everyone does, it’s called Supply Crate

Why isn’t there a Rocket Turret in there then.

Supply only has healing+ net + flame turrets :P ( rifle is trained ), but correct me if I’m wrong, but doesn’t everyone use supply on top of enemies for the stun rather than the turrets ? cause if you do after those 2 seconds are gone, so are your turrets lol

Keep in mind that the trait is currently broken, currently global cooldown only triggers with FT and EG which got boosted in the same update, this is probably intentional so people would create builds around these kits instead of just swamping in and out but sadly they are still not worth it yet..

Kit refinement will be Nerf again on the upcoming update and lets cross our fingers the “less damage, more utility” Anet is aiming for will actually be something good, or at least decent, specially since they are killing 100nades and Turret buff will most likely be a flop, 99% chance that they will continue to be as "useful"as they currently are..

Automated response will prevent you from getting any new condition, but it will not remove any pre-existing conditions before reaching 25%

and Cloaking device, i have never really used it but it usually triggers if i fight an engi who happens to have it, maybe it was an internal cool down or something

and don’t forget vulnerability we tend to do that alot

I’m full zerker

Auto attack usually hits for 1-,1200/ each granade
and sharpel/freeze for 1,700 – 2,000/each
bleeds still hit for around 52 per tick

Bombs special skills are if you’re low on condition damage, but skill #1 will hit for 3-5k per bomb depending on how much toughness the enemy/mob has

I sPvP quiet a bit, so i know how much people can QQ, if a turrent hits someone for 2k.. we will get even our name nerfed..

Engineers are suppose to be the control class but… at least that’s what i heard! but that was given to guardian, we have good single target CC but nothing that would control a battleground, unless they meant the 2s stun from supply create!

FT and elixir gun are too weak tho, people outside engineers would learn this and not even bother to pick up, they might even complain cause it’s annoying when your trying to loot :P

how about they just add boons to the area where it lands ? 10s protection 10s regen 10s retaliation etc

btw.. still wanting on that pm

Engineers are suppose to have a weak physical strength, if overcharged shot knock us back! imagine what kind of stuff they would add to hammer!!

skills:

1. bash your foe ( 50% chance to lose hammer )
2. Swing your hammer with tremendous force hitting everyone in front of you and sending yourself flying on a random direction!
3. Smash the ground sending a shock wave and immobilization yourself
4. Knock down your foe with a powerful swing, if you miss you get knock down instead
5. Drink Elixir Steroids: Prevents yourself from knocking yourself down for a brief period of time

hammer is an amazing idea tho! also maybe some 1-handed whips!

Only nerf would probably be decrease their hp to 5k

Other than that, as a person who’s been playing turrets. I do not understand why people keep thinking they would need to be nerfed :| they are extremely weak!

all 5 turrets combined have about the same damage than the guardians’s Sword of Justice and less CC than Hammer of Wisdom :P and those can move :P

it is impossible to make them durable and keep balance in all aspects of the game. also really, who would wanna trait on turrets for only 2 turrets ?? all they are currently good for is to blow them up for their blast finisher :P

Pre-release I was sure engineers were gadgets and turrets!! BUT.. here is THE TRUTH ABOUT THE ENGINEER…:

We’re outcast of society!! That’s why we carry our hobo packs everywhere we go. At some point in our life we joined the Army and learnt about bombs & grenades. Then we moved on to becoming plumbers with our handy toolkit at the local restaurant until that faithful night when while in the middle of fixing ourselves a snack, we stumble upon powerful potions (elixirs) and we became Magicians!!!

PS: Stimulant pack is only a redbull

Kalan.9705:

Seras.5702:

So basically everyone would bring Turret Kit. Drop all turrets, swap to other weapons, continue as usual. That’s way OP. Imagine if you could drop all 5 turrets and then still have access to your guns and 2 other utilities.

Actually it’s Underpowered. You had to spend all that cast time to place all turrets and they do so little once they’re placed, if they even manage to fire once before evaporating to any passing breeze. Multiple cast times mean you weren’t doing something else. Lost time. Let alone the pickup or cooldown times.

Turrets need to be a 1 kit. Have limited X seconds of invulnerability or be aoe immune. Hit harder. Have vastly better ai. Have their traits redone, improved and condensed to just 1 line not nearly useless traits spread across 60point investment in places with no synergy.

Invulnerability would be extremely OP on sPvP, PvE and Dungeons :|

and traits are fine tbh, but they are not worth spending into for 1 or 2 turrets which will probably get killed few seconds after being summoned, would be a complete waste.

only way to save turrets is to allow for easy access and spam-ability ( by this i mean by having more that 1 turret, so it 1 gets destroyed, it won’t have such a negative impact on player! one skill cool down would be better than an entire utility on cool down )

Other options:

Increase to damage = lots of QQ
Increase range = lots of QQ
Increase toughness to survive WvW/dungeons = lots of sPvP QQ, and god tanks on PvE

Easy access = Birth of the Turret engineer!! Turret traits would become more than just clutter on the screen, and we get a stronger identity as a class

Seras.5702:

So basically everyone would bring Turret Kit. Drop all turrets, swap to other weapons, continue as usual. That’s way OP. Imagine if you could drop all 5 turrets and then still have access to your guns and 2 other utilities.

in theory, yes, but in reality.. turrets are currently so underpowered that even with all 5 turrets out, any kit’s auto attack will out DPS them by a long shot, 3 out 5 turrets are close range and there is no way to protect them so they will constantly die.

Soon.5240:

Turrets should at least take the same level of damage that a Ranger’s frick’n Bear does.

If we could drop them up to 3000 range – coupled with great toughness – I would sacrifice damage out-put and maybe actually use them. Make them something that have to be dealt with by the enemy when we drop them in WvW. Right now they are a joke.

lol 3000 range :O! that would be amazing! sniper turrets but yea.. in WvW turret engineers are the worst! if you want range you need to bring granade kit, and Elixir S is a must. that leaves 1 utility free if you wanna bring a turret, no one is gonan trait for 1 turret which will destroyed in 2 secs and does kid damage

Ply bar on tool kit used to be a knockback as well! I miss old engineer

Phineas Poe.3018:

I question the use of an AoE pull given that it is precisely the opposite of what you want to do in sPvP. Magnet already does this for WvW, and in PvE there’s more need for a blind than a mid-range pull. Smoke Vent has saved me from getting downed a lot of times because it can be activated while stunned.

Actually it was a pull without a channel, so it could be used to pull your targets to you, while interrupting them and then you could easily blow them away, and altho i agree the blind while stun could be nice, just 1 blind won’t be enough to make a difference since its melee only and is really only useful when fighting a backstab theif ( if you can predict )

Zinwrath.2049:

First, obviously i dont think they’re where they should be or i wouldnt be asking for small buffs to them (and they are giving buffs to them)…which is my whole point of my thread, they just need to be made worth their utility slot…per turret.

Second, feel free to hit me up in game and try to take a point from me. I’ll use turrets in their weakened state and even record it for ya. if theyr’e so bad i’m sure you’ll mop the floor with me im only level 30

Perfect pm whenver you’re online!!

@Aristio.2784

We do have a class identity, just not a strong one. When you play warrior its about tank &spank, guardian protect and heal, thief all about being sneaky and mobile, Mesmer about dominating and confusing, ele master of elements… what about Engi ?

1 argument that you hear around alot as to why people don’t like 100nades, its because it doesn’t feel like you’re playing an engineer!! that’s why a lot of the community dislike this build, but…. then what what should an engineer feel like ? should we be about potions (elixirs)?? are we magicians?? or should it be about turrets, gadgets and technology?? that’s what i thought it would be like pre-release and i’m sure i’m not alone on this one.

what should an engineer look like? what is the purpose of an engineer? what do we bring to WvW/sPvp/Dungeons that no other class can ? what is our place in this game? these are some of the question people struggle with a lot!! and why we’re so misunderstood! and thats all because we lack a strong class identity

@nakoda.4213

could be a viable option to allow for mobility, have in consideration that each turrent would have different cool downs tho but yea could work

@Seezungenschleuder.8319

Turret following you :| that’s kinda creepy! we stole a necro’s minions and turn them into a robot :O!

nakoda.4213:

each turret should be a kit of its own.

5 = pack up/set up
4 = overcharge

2 – 3 ought to be extra skills, like drop bandage on a short cooldown or drop bandages on a long cool down for healing turret, or caltrops and an oil slick for net turret (small durations medium cooldowns, or whatever.

1 = attack my target.

Turrets should gain buffs from skills and elixirs like anything else.
Turrets should do enough dmg to make the opponent target the turret.
Turrets should be strong enough to survive sustained dmg for short periods.
Turrets should be able to be healed through sustained dmg for long periods.

This way we could swap between turret control and weapons/kits easily. and the turrets themselves still have their current abilities as their “auto attack”

Let’s say you have a net turret and a healing turret down, and you are fighting at the edge of their range, while your ally is in between them, you could swap to your net turret kit to spread some caltrops to slow your ally’s foe, then switch to healing turret and drop bandages for them in a matter of seconds while still engaging your own foe.

i would love this idea! would be amazing!! but considering how much love we get, this would be asking for far too much coding great idea tho!

Yea, they could simply place turrets as they are right now on a kit, the cooldowns would prevent the stronger turrets like net turret and rocket turret to be spammbable while allowing you to have short cool downs on rifle turret ( low DPS would kinda be like the auto attack ) and flame turret ( because of its short range 450 its most likely to die and/or will need to be place on different location near target during the fights)

I don’t design the game so i wouldn’t know but overcharged abilities could be taken out, or maybe traited into

edit:

oh and yes, blast finishers would naturally be removed x5 blast finishers would be kinda OP :P

yea… the balance guy really had no idea nor looked like he cared, he’s eyes only lid when talking about ele and mesmer.

btw how can you compare ride of the lighting to have 4 dodges in spirit of the watch ?

How much blinds can you apply on a 20% chance on 5s window ? every 30 seconds ?

in sPvP, they would kill you first then cap the point >.> idk what you’re talking about

the fire rate is 4s and it has a 1-3s travel time, can your net last this long ?

so you would bunker without a reliable condition remover ? and leave it up to 8% chance? also, for what i understand the 25% trait, doesn’t allow you to get new conditions under 25% but it will not remove any pre-existing conditions, so any burning/bleedings/poison will most likely still kill you

special abilities trigger on their next attack, that could be 1s 2s or 4s after you needed them.

you don’t understand that turrets like flame turret have a 450 range, thumped turret a 240 range, net turret 600.. if you want them to hit an enemy or take use of their ability, they would have to be placed relatively close to each other, so most of the time they will be hit by same AoE

and i say it, because if you had tried them, you would understand all this, turret skill description look amazing when you read them off the wiki, but once you get to use them is a different story

ps: i mention im almost rank 40 for credibility, lots of the things you mention about bunkering really don’t make sence and also, the examples you’ve given me on how to play turrets are theory at the most and haven’t been tried, if you tried the turrets right now, you would like ‘wow he’s right’, take some time and use turrets in 1 sPvP match, 1 dungeon, WvW, try them in shore and you will realize that turrets do not work as you picturing them in your mind

I did say turrets have low damage, which would make it easy to turn them into an actual kit.. and would fix the problem with their low survival because if the 1 turret gets killed it won’t have such a negative impact on your bar. this suggestion is not to add damage or godly defenses, but rather utility and to make turret engineer viable!

why does Mesmer mechanic work ? because of the spam-ability on illusions, this would follow the same concept but at the same time feel very very different because we could not infinite spawn turrets, they would not move and would be focused on utility, control and strategic game play rather than damage.

if a mob attacks your turret, it will continue until it dies, so toughness increase really would not make a difference at all, also.. why would you want to play and trait a turret build for 1 or 2 turrets? 3 at the most but you will be left with little to no condition removal, stun breakers or additional utility :S

look at your thinking: you want them to scale with toughness, we would have a turret bunker with no condition removal/stun breakers and little damage.

or a berserker/glass engi who’s turrets will scale with damage, and not be able to get to the 1k dmg rage because it would scale so poorly, why would you want to use this over any other utility that does more damage, provides more utility/control ? and if it did scale with damage over 1k.. people would cry to heavens because its AI controlled

i say tank god because i play the game, i run dungeons and know the difference on damage from general PvE and mobs in dungeons. worlds apart and you should know this too, if it can tank 1 vet in a dungeon for a few seconds, it would be able to tank up to 10 normal mobs in general PvE.. and yet would not be enough to handle a GS warrior or AoE in WvW

its not insults or slanders, i just invite you to think logically, increasing toughness or damage is not the way to fix turrets, the only way to fix them is to add utility and what more utility than to allow easy access to them without forcing you to sacrifice all utility slots ? again, no one will play turret engi to carry around 2 turrets and baby sit them cause if they get destroyed, all your left is with 2 long cool downs .. lol

thats not viable in WvW/PvE/sPvP or Dungeons

Most of the cool downs are on 30s cool down, smoke field last for 5 secs and is easily avoided by jumping away from the point

thumper turret requires target to be within 240 range making it only effective vs melee

Explosive rocket is shot at the sky and can be easily avoided by walking out its landing place

also don’t forget that turrets special abilities only trigger on their next attack and not when you command them, as a bunker who needs to stay alive, can you rely on them ?

Cleansing burst is indeed a condition removal on a 60 second cool down which removes 2 conditions ( description is currently bugged ), also if you need acess to this in order to remove immobilize to prevent a spike or high bleed/confusion stacks, you would have to use your heal, which then will be put on a 20s cool down

stun breaker? what if you get attacked by a HB warrior or back stack thief, what if the attacker is a Mesmer ( very possible ) which can stay at range away from turrets and still deal impressive damage

or if you’re facing a condition thief, ranger or necro ?

what if the player has AoE?

lol at this point i’m just laughing

if you’re talking about raw damage, confusion wins, if you’re talking about multiplier fear has the highest.. so ?

I’m about to hit rank 40 sPvP, if turrets were that good as to where you could drop them and win.. alot of people would do it, but there is currently none.. lol

we’re talking about turrets assumed we both knew the subject and i didn’t think i would have to into so much detail, by projectile i meant mainly net shot and explosive rocket.. i was wrong tho

no you haven’t really, you have fail to explain how scaling with toughness would change the fact that they are immobile, can’t defend themselves and will die no matter what. a plain increase in toughness will not make people want to play turrets ? also you did not answer my question to how much toughness/damage would they need.. if they can take hits from vets and bosses in dungeons or survive AoE in WvW, they would become tank gods in PvE .. lol anet will not do this..

never said 500-700%, i asked you for a number since you didn’t reply i placed my own, currently they do around 300-377 on sPvP dummies, if they start to scale with the players power and you go full glass cannon/berserker , would you not expect them to scale over 1k per hit? that would be the logical thinking.. would this be OP, yes.. unfortunately they cannot be scaled with the player’s power and you fail to understand this :S

usually people who don’t care about being right are more open minded :P you havent given this idea a chance because you think yours is the right one but you have no taken in consideration the impact your idea would have on every aspect of the game ( something devs do ) and have also fail to analyze or provide any ranges on what you would expect toughness/attack be increased by if based on the players own toughness and attack. there are lots of thinks you have no thought about and the fact that you keep coming back without giving a second thought just proves you care more about being right, than the future of the turrets itself lol..

Zinwrath.2049:

@google
Numbers should be whatever is balanced.

They should scale appropriatly off your gear. So if you built high defencive stats you would have tankier turrets that reflect how your outfitting your character. If you high power/condition they should do more damage reflecting how you outfitted your character.

Just like all other abilities in the game. Take life siphon for necromancer… if you build healing it heals you for more, if you build power it hits harder. Your ability is better at doing whatever YOU are building yourself to do through gear.

I want to have a rational discussion that’s why i want to ask you politely to explain something to me. bunkers are mentioned a lot when talking about turrets. so lets assume they do scale with the player’s power and toughness. bunkers normal deal low damage because of their set up, which means turrets would deal low damage as well, so as a bunker, what would be the benefits of bringing turrets instead of condi removals, stun breakers, etc ?

ps: life siphon benefits by 5% so at 1000 healing power, they would heal an extra 50hp per tick, but realistically no necromancer would spec this much healing power.

• take a look at the cool downs on special abilities…

• my mistake, fear has the highest multiplier

• At their current state, could you really win an encounter by simply dropping all the turrets?
• Turrets special ability only trigger on the next attack… which means you cannot time a knock down, knock back, immobilize properly or when you want. also projectiles are easy to dodge, avoid

• I’m stating that they are weak, but can provide utility if given easy access to them, making them more viable. also creating a new type of play style center around turrets. currently if you do this, you lose utility slots which means you would lack stun breakers, extra condi removal as well as utility itself… and all that would be left is a long cool down if they get destroyed ( which they normally are )

• would a 10% damage increase be enough? probably not, if they scale rifle turret with your attack and they starts hitting 1- 1.5k per hit. Would this be OP on sPvP, yes..

• I’m just countering your points and taking in consideration every aspect of the game lol

• I dare you to test every turret individually on shore vs normal mobs. then take as many as you can and try again. then tell me how the combination of them are overpowered ? i’ll pay you 1 gold if you can defeat a giant veteran using turrets, or 10g if you manage to kill the champion

• I just don’t think your solution would fix the problem, more toughness or no toughness turrets will most likely die and leave and empty utility bar, asides from surprise shot, other tool belt skills kinda suck.. making no difference, unlike you. i dont care about being right, i just want turrets to become “something”..

Toolbox.9375:

My HOPE is for a hefty redesign of turret functionality, that makes them into a long-setup definitely-worth-the-wait powerful point-defense tool. I’ve tossed around numerous ideas to that end; Boons from Toolkit’s autoattack, permanent and stackable power increases from the Overcharge, gradual power growth over time…

My prediction, though? The Rifle Turret’s damage boost is going to be 10% at best. The Thumper Turret’s Cripple application is going to be reduced before it goes live for whatever reason they decide. Flame Turret will get maybe 50 extra range. Net Turret might apply one stack of Vulnerability for three to five seconds. Rocket Turret will only get a boost in its Toolbelt ability, reducing the cooldown to 45 seconds. And Healing Turret, heck, I foresee that getting its Blast Finisher detonation removed to stop all the blatantly-overpowered heal combos from it.

I’m enjoying Engineer, but frankly, most developers botch up all attempts to implement turrets in their games, and Arena Net is FAR from an exception.

that’s basically what they nerf is going to be, and would it really be worth it ? would you want to play them ? prob not .. if anyone havent realized we dont get much love so this updates is preee much the only chance we get at gettin something good out turrets for a couple of months lol

@Zinwrath.2049

I got a simple question for you, how much damage do you believe each turrent should be able to make ? both berserker and condi builds ?

also, how much damage should they be able to tank ? should they be able to tank vets in dungeons? take hits for bosses? for for the 450 and 600 range, should they survive a zerg fight ?

some numbers would be nice

Zinwrath.2049:

wow. Ok. lets start again.

How are you getting more utility when your removing all the over power skills…or are you seriously thinking the turret kit should allow each turret to overcharge still???? (think about that for a moment how much CC would be poured into one utility)

Also, burning is damage…you are calculating damage, so you must include both forms of damage. Burning can be calculated by not wearing any condition gear for a base amount then you could say (dps = x before condition damage gear).
Also, you discredit burning, the turrets dont attack fast enough to make the burning damage ever last longer than the time between attacks. in short, if the turret attacks…the burning will fade before the next attack.
Also burning is the highest damage condition in the game, as well as the highest scaling condition from condition damage AND is damage that goes past toughness and ironicly the condition they apply does not last LONG enough to merit using a conditoin wipe to stop it.

Also once again, we DO have “ACCESS” to burning. But we have limited ways to build a kit around PERMA-BURNING. So your comment that just because we have a very limited way to have anything close to perma burning…that any ability or turret outside thats ability to apply burning…is ignorable.

Also, ya theyd o have that much HP, which is rather appropriate since you even in bunker gear should not have than 19-20k. Its a pet not a player. Though i do suggest they be given a portion of your toughness in my own thread to make them not quite as easy to kill..and there is a trait for 30% more mitigation.

you really haven’t used turrets have you…

Adds utility because you have the option to use different turrets at different situations, weather you need some extra damage, control or simply a distraction, more skills doesn’t mean more utility

highest condition damage and scale is actually confusion.. burning is just a condition engineers, mesmer, ele, ranger and warrior have an extremely easy to and that it only stacks on duration, not intensity ..

all turrets special ability are on a queue making it hard to co-ordinate, also projectiles are slow and easy to avoid

i was just pointing out their hp, nothing more but you do understand that more toughness means they would get target more often ? also, have you realized that if they want to add more toughness to be able to survive AoE in spvp/WvW or even dungeons, it would completely unbalance them for general PvE basically making them god tanks ? and if they don’t add enough toughness, turrets will continue to be useless after patch

I understand that you have you’re opinion of what you want turrets to be like, but what you want is turrets on steroids, like you said in your forum, 1 turret that will be good enough to replace all 5, Anet won’t give us more power, they want to give us utility.. which is what we would be getting with the idea i pointed out.

let me ask you this… how much damage do you believe each turret should make ? and also how much damage do you think they should take ? tell me, should they be able to tank vets in dungeons ? or short range turrets, should they be able to live in the middle of fights in WvW?

lol i don’t want super powerful turrents! i want utility xP

you’re entire comments leads me to believe you didnt take the time to read the entire post or even that you’ve played with turrets, the total DPS on a dummie on light armor is 615 for all turrets + burning, how is that ever OP ? if you want to have 1 turret that no matter what will get destroyed.

normal turrets have around 7k hp , thrump has 13k

and i say + burning cause it escalates with condition damage lol .. so it’s not an exact number duh

burning stacks on duration, not intensity.. as engi we have many ways to apply burning >.> whats your point

haha wanna run a fractal or dungeon ? im down! you pick

GuilguiS.2738:

Imo i think its more balanced than having many of them spread in the area because it would too strong and not fun to fight at all. Imagine being a warrior that is fighting an engie with 5 turrets spread around an area, you’ll be constantly immobilized, burned, knocked down, blown away, and shot, so you realise that you can’t just attack the engie, you have to kill his turrets first but every single one you kill knocks you back when it dies. Not fun at all. If it was only one turret you could focus it and kill it with enough effort, wich means balance.
And imagine how many targets our kitten turret AI would attack. If you only have one turret it can focus fire on your target.

Whirlwind Attack could 1 shot all turrets as once at once, as well as it takes 2-3 swings from gs, also as engineer we already have access to perma burning so it wouldn’t much of a difference and immobilize from net turret is once ever 10s.

the total DPS from all turrets is 615 + burning so it wouldn’t nessesarily be OP, it would be like fighting a Mesmer who can’t infinite spam illusions and with a lot less damage

Mister Mustard.7203:

I appreciate your effort and work into addressing turrets, but if you want this thread to go anywhere, please edit out any mention of a petition or /signing. Petitions are against forum rules and will be quickly closed, and I would hate to see that before a good discussion can be had.

Thank you very much, i did not know that

and i doubt this thread will be taken any serious now, there has been little discussion and alot of whining, oh well, can’t lose hope.

Please don’t reply unless its to an specific sentence, it makes it unnecessarily long

also, minions are mobile so you only need to cast them once and they will follow, also shorter cool downs, increase damage with power as well as many other benefits as minions can steal health with their attacks as well as remove condition from its master, you can trait them to have 50% more hp and deal 30% more damage, chance to remove boons, AoE poisons, etc

I recorded the damage of all turrets and output a total DPS for a reason, you make them sound as they are overpowered as they are, turrets are weak at the moment and allowing us to have 5 weak turrets would make up for a great skill which would not lock all our utility slots. a true turret engineer should have accss to more than 1 turret and have the option to defend them, that why opinion, may differ for yours but please make educated comments if you’re posting, i’m not trying to have an argument but rather a discussion and a viable option for us, engineers. specially since 100nades will be nerfed

i just think this will give us a stronger identity as a class, and something like this would promote turret use by a lot

GuilguiS.2738:

I’m always posting about turning turrets into a kit. And i think they should work, for balance purposes, like this: The engineer equips the kit and use the first turret, now all of the other turrets have to be placed on top of the first one. Why? Because many turrets means many targets and it would be OP. Besides its not possible for the engineer to protect and heal all five turrets separetely. Making it one single turret that the engineer “upgrades” with new functions turns it into a high reward if you can keep it alive longer, as well as a high punishment if you lose it. Making it both fun to use and fight aggainst.

since you have acess to all turrents, you could place them on different strategic locations, and if 1 gets destroyed you would get 1 skill on cool down rather than an entire utility

also the whole point wouldn’t be to body guard the turrent 24/7 because then you wouldn’t be putting in you part during the fight, unless the turret is dealing tremendous amounts of damage, this would simply be an option to allow us to play turrets without it always being on cool downs and having options, and turrents have low DPS so multitasking would be a problem, they would be more utility rather than RAW beastly damage

The no auto attack is intentional the kit would be meant to set up the space where you’re gonna fight, rather than to fight with a kit

and as for balancing, with each skill at it’s current state, i really doesn’t need any balancing as it, even with a 10% damage increase it would not need a balance since you have around the same CC as othet kits, less damage and more utility which is what anet wants.

Zinwrath.2049:

You would have to severely nerf all the turrets to the point they are worth one utility slot. The difference between this and OTHER kits is other kits are only helping you while they are replacing your weapon skills. This would continue to aid you outside of holding the kit. (medkit doesnt count, the impact is has is minor and the bandages dont last long on the ground)

Your solution creates more problems than it solves when the solution is much easier.

My thread better solves the issue. Turrets should take a utility slot and be worth a utility slot. If you see an engineer with a turret, that means he is bunkering. The rifle turret is the only turret that is not necessary to bunker with thus it has a short CD and is not tanky. Its for those who want to have an extra dps pet in dps specs.

Also, they already said how they’re buffing rifles damage so it can better serve that role, and how thumper is being given more CC so it can fullfill its role better.

Please give my idea and try and think about how your playstyle with it would be. by giving us easy all of them would balance the fact that they do little damage and die to fast, yet it doesnt take away from the fact that you can trait around turrent builds and still have 2 utility slots in Oder to defend them. A turret engineer shouldn’t be a engineer carrying 1 turret. that doesnt even sound like fun

also, think about your solution and how would that help if turrents escalated with the owners toughness ? if you as a player have to dodge an attack so you wont die, imagine what would happen to your immobile turret, no matter how much health toughness it gets, it will still be targeted first and and susceptible to all attacks, dyigng no matter what, and since you only have 1 this skill would be on cool down for the rest of the fight unless their hp/toughness go into unreal values, and personally i would hate to see 1 turrent tanking bosses or groups of vets in dungeon, and imagine and unkillable turret like this on general PvE

and as for power, the power it would need to make only 1 turret reliable would be too much and probably will not be granted, as well, if you want to trait to play a turret engineer, you would want to have more than 1 turret, at least i would

as for less damage from AoE, thats a lot of coding man

This is the simplest solution to turrets! Please take a second a read it and picture your playstyle with something like this before commenting!

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/engineer/Turret-Facts-Petition/first#post1647110

Lets Re-Live your the dream most of us had pre-release of playing a turrent engineer!! without the need of taking up our entire utility bar! and the hopeless desperation of not being able to defend your turrets cause you used all your utilities to summon them!

To players..
Please take a second to think about your personal playstyle with something like this, I’m sure most of you will re-live dream we had pre-release where we pictured ourselves fighting with turrets. keep it bumped and maybe we’ll developer attention.

so much hope, so much possibilities! so much fun!

Damage facts

• They do not share the owner’s power
• No critical hits
• No critical damage multiplier
• Special skills have to wait on a queue
• Damage is pretty much the same as described on the tool tip

Testing on the light armor target golem at the mist ( for highest possible damage )

Turret – Damage – Fire Rate —-—DPS
Rifle —-—-> 377 —--> 2 seconds =188
Thumper> 452 —--> 3 seconds =150
Flame —--> 127 —--> 3 seconds =42 + burning
Rocket —-> 943 —--> 4 seconds =235 + burning
_________________________________________
Total DPS 615+ burning

Other facts

• Low survival
• High on the priority list by mobs
• Susceptible to AoE
• Long Cool downs
• 1 Turret = 1 utility slot
• 5 utility turrets total

so knowing this, an option to balance them, instead of drastically modifying them, and going through many nerf & fail faces, why not turn them into a kit ?

Turret kit

1. Rifle turret 10s cool down
2. Flame 15s cool down
3. thumper 20s cooldown
4. Net 30s cooldown
5. Rocket 40s cooldown
6. toolbelt: Detonate all turrets( naturally remove blast finisher )

Having turrets being 1 utility slot, would make players want to use them, specially since as engineers we all dreamed at some point of using turrets, considering their low survival and combined total DPS being 615+ burning ( much less on actual mobs / players ), this would not be considered OP while allowing to open a whole lot of versatility to the game play

Facts:

• This would feel like what playing an Engineer should be like!!!
• Would give us a much needed class identity! ( turrets, he must be an engi)
• You could still trait into turrets and use the other 2 utility lots to protect/heal them!!! Welcome turret engineers!!!!!!
• New build to our class to replace 100nades
• Would be viable but not overpower on WvW, sPvP, PvE & Dungeons
• Doesn’t require additional coding or a lot of work!

Cons:

• Would take away some utility skills, BUT… Anet, as a company should understand that us ( at least most of us ) would rather have quality over quantity! 1 working skill over 5 currently under-powered, and we would rather not go through Test & Nerf Every month until you get it right. THIS is the simple fix that would make everyone happy! Allow for diversity and a new type of play style!

Also, take in consideration that 1 utility slot for engineer has a much bigger impant in our play style than any other class! so having a few less would not be such a big deal

Please, if a developer happens to read this, please take note, take it to the next balance meeting and bring it up!!! on the next update Engineers are gonna take a HUGE hit! and kit refinement update will be like playing Russian roulette! it could go really well or terrible bad! Give us this one!! let us have a stronger class identity and a new type of play style! this is what engineers need!

Chaba.5410:

More play style opinions… Oh well.

Think objectively. Your personal opinions about what is useless or not worth a slot or that versatile and fun play is achieved by having one good skill really don’t qualify as reasons to change class mechanics.

are you saying turrets are class mechanic ? also, i’ve been trying turrets unlike many people speaking in order to give accurate facts, if you take some time to read the skills, and try them out you will see where I’m coming from when i use the word useless.

the current tool-belt skills are comparable with the low end racial skills at the most with the exception of surprise shot ( net attack is not bad but.. 60s cool down kills is as a viable option )

also..

for the people talking about point holding in sPvP, please try things before you speak so you have a base… have you guys considered that a 3 second cripple will not do anything to anyone? currently the turret has a 50s cool down, and 30s for special skill which you cannot time and a radius of 240..

so for the current theory to work, you would have to kite your enemy at meele range of the turrent for it to hit, and keep him there for at least 3 second for 380-440 damage and 3 second cripple, and if you use the special ability, you will hit for a mind blowing 1k damage and 1s knock down.. assuming it had survived this long. and this only works more melee. 2/8 classes, and thief 2 shots you so that leaves warrior’s incredible AoE swing with GS..

this skill work work best to keep ranger’s pet busy at best :S

would you take this skill over tool kit which has AoE cripple/bleed on a 10s cool down, confusion, pull and block ?

Few things…

The “what won’t be happening” its based on stuff an actual dev explained on the ranger forums, and gave as reason why Anet don’t want something that’s not controlled by the player to be really tanky or do too much damage.

if you think about it.. how much toughness/hp would a turret need to withstand a couple of hits from a thief/warror on sPvP ? a shatter from mesmer or to survive mild AoE in WvW for more than a fraction of a second ? alot and now place that on PvE where mobs do less damge and attack slower..

and also, if you’ve followed anet update module, they do not change base numbers but rather increase by %, currently on mist golems, rifle turrent does 317-377 damage heavy – light armor.. a % inclease, unless its 100%+ will not change a thing about turrents

Chaba.5410:

I’ll preface this by saying that I’m not a fan of dramatic changes in class mechanics and that I typically run and enjoy most the hybrid builds that do not rely on all kits or all gadgets or all elixirs or all turrets.

Every kit has only 1 toolbelt skill. We’d lose the toolbelt skills associated with turrets by making them a kit. Nor do I believe that turning them into a kit is going to suddenly make turrets viable. Regret? I’m really not sure what that is supposed to mean. It sounds more like an opinion about a play style than an objective statement about turret viability. Turrets do need better survivability and need better targeting AI. That’ll make them more viable.

the only toolbelt worth anything is rifle turret’s, (maybe net turrent) but others just lack any purpose due to being so weak / useless

the kit idea is the best option atm, allow 5 turrets to become a kit.. once you plant a turret, you get their secondary skill and tool belt skill could simply be “detonate all turrets”.. naturally devs would remove the blast finishers but that’s okay

individually turrets are not even worth an utility slot, rifle turret is the only one people kinda use, and its because its tool belt skill goes so well with static discharge. other than that they are not really worth it

this idea is simple, and extremely easy to implement from a coding point of view, the only draw back is that we reduce the numbers of utility skills BUT I’m sure most engineers would rather quality over quantity! either have 4 close to useless skills or 1 good one that would allow for much versatile and fun play style

Great idea but it would not solve the problem of turret having extremely low damage, and also being targeted and destroyed within few seconds after being summoned.

honestly, the best idea and best fit would be as many players have stated and take the current turrets ( without any Nerf ) and gather them into a new kit, this way, players would surely consider it a viable option, and considering how unimpressive powered turrets currently are, this would not be overpowered, and would a low for a much much more versatile game play.