Guild Wars 2

Interesting concept .. I attempted one a while back but didn’t pursue it. I might take another look at it. The trick has always been in balancing survivability with it. I think retal is strong in team fights but shouldn’t be the primary use for the build. You might need to find another primary role for the build that works with the retal sharing.

The amulet of choice is not a support amulet. You’re still very glassy. Usually that’s compensated with meditations and Valor line and you don’t have both here. I’m not trying to put you down but rather inspire innovation. If you can work out survivability into the build you would have more reception.

Looking forward to the revised version

Build quick update

Build is still viable with some changes. Shield is now almost mandatory and no longer a flavouring option after adding the ageis to the shield 4. Also heals on ageis is chosen in the traits with communal defences. I will update the OP at some point but here is the updated versions :

Ascended:
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vVAQNApeWl8AhehYtQwVIQTEHLE1NA+yBI/C7XIgTgKoEA-T1BDABTcKA4TfQT7PolyPgV/BgnAwhKBJFw36tA-w

Exotic:
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vVAQNApeWl8AhehYtQwVIQTEHLEFOBqgS4GAf5Akfh9LEA-TFDDABNt/ASKVUVJ4EPBAdUxhXzf5oeQSKpWRLAAnCgfUGoiuASB8tWL-w

I believe what you seek is the Guardian Angel build explained here

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/guardian/IndigoMania-Guardian-Angel-Build

If you think staff does not have the potential to be a true damaging weapon , then you haven’t tried the wildfire build for large scale combat . it’s really scary how quickly the damage builds up from staff 1 alone .

http://en.gw2skills.net/editor/?vVAQJARWlsAhmhYtQwVIQQEHBEFeFihcwGAPwbmHiGcCB-TFyCwAQUCC4JAE4SA8SXgBzfNV+5c/Bfq/QKAImGB-w

Guardian angel build (large scale combat healer)

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/guardian/IndigoMania-Guardian-Angel-Build

you guys realize that alot of the things you’re complaining about are actually changing ?
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/guardian/Dragonhunter-Changes-for-Next-BWE/5419316
They said they can’t get them ready for THIS beta weekend but they ARE changing them for the next one.

Thought i’d share this cause i feel you guys missed out on the announcement.

ummm .. you guys realize that alot of the things you’re complaining about are actually changing ?

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/guardian/Dragonhunter-Changes-for-Next-BWE/5419316

They said they can’t get them ready for THIS beta weekend but they ARE changing them for the next one.

Thought i’d share this cause i feel you guys missed out on the announcement.

this is maximum CC we can achieve .. if you can make something like this work for you , then by all means go for it :

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vVAQNAS7OFFBxChglQggIMkIqrAQWDC

I’m a big fan of nemesis and his pragmatic approaches and analysis of things. Thank you for posting the video.

To those people who are focusing on “warrior vs necro” or “necro becoming meta” .. You’re clearly and and undoubtfully missing the whole point of the video and the problem it’s trying to address.

Ps: to whoever typed “waiting for him to solo warrior on his dps build” .. I suggest you come back to watch this after whatever you smoked wares off lol

I don’t think merging them is the right approach. It will mean that you’re locked in a specific elite to gain the aoe sharing of Virtue of Resolve. What i would recommend however, is making Battle presence have an added effect that benefits the guardian himself. As it stands it adds nothing to the guardian himself. Maybe something like :

Battle presence:
-Virture of resolve passive effect is shared with Allies
- Blocking an attack heals you.

That would make it more interesting to take as it combines personal survivability with team support. Think of it in the context of Soothing Power on eles which they get a 100% increase in their soothing mist power. That also increases both the eles own survivability as well as his team support whereas our Battle Presence does nothing for our own survivability.

Crapgame.6519:

You ever consider swapping shield with focus? Mace / Focus seem to flow better. Also you have trooper runes for condi cleansing – ever consider defender runes? Those are typically what I run anyway when in groups and playing the supporting role.

Seems like the shield is more of a modifier than an actual “use/block” weapon. I like it, just doesn’t seem to fit the supporting play style.

Shield vs Focus is a flavoring matter. It doesn’t make or break the build .. I personally went for shield for the extra heal on the bubble, protection of allies, and projectile immunity when needed. In WvW all of these are very useful. Whereas the focus, it’s personal 3 blocks max, and a random aoe regen/blind/condi clear. However the Focus does have a blast finisher so some might want that over the shield.. It’s really a flavouring thing up to the player’s taste.

As for the choice of the rune, I’d still stick to Trooper over Defender. Th reason being this would allow us to fill 1 main role (healing) and 1 secondary role (condi clearing). In wvw large scale combat is filled with conditions and as the june 23rd patch, they could stack up to 1500 stacks of each condition (barring som exceptions)… therefore it is my belief that the meta is shifting away from condition duration reduction and more towards full condi cleansing. running 3 shouts, trooper fits better here. Defender on the other hand is aimed purely for personal survivability. It adds healing power however that addition isn’t too significant because we already have high healing power. Threrefore I’d stick with Trooper runes.

If you don’t want to take on Trooper runes and want to focus purely on the healing, consider using Rune of Water or Rune of the Monk as they fit the role better.

good lord teh salt is real … it’s just like any company with their products people. One day the sell it for $100 the other day they sell for $10, maybe next year they package it as buy one get one free .. it doesn’t matter ! It’s product and they’re selling it.. you’re bought 3 fun years .. if they weren’t fun, you wouldn’t still be here whining about it.

Products go sales ALL THE TIME .. just because you bought before the sale started doesn’t give you ANY legitimacy in arguing “i got ripped off” .. this is a capitalist market.

check out this healing build for wvw and pve :

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/guardian/IndigoMania-Guardian-Angel-Build/

The more and more i duel my ele friends, the more i hate shelter + smiter’s boon. When they have shocking aura and you use shelter, the smite condition is frontloaded but the heal only procs at end of channel. Therefore, using shelter near an ele with shocking aura will interrupt your by default .. REALLY REALLY ANNOYING!

I’ve been using LoW in my power medi build laterly and having good experience with it.

Build wise, not the most optimum build for burn guard and i know as i main burn guard. Match wise, that match had plenty of bad map awareness and very offputting rotations.

Thank you for the effort though

I really liked the idea of retaliation scaling on toughness.

First some points about retaltion . Retaliation by definition punishes the enemy for hitting you with a specific amount. It could be a 100 damage or a 99999999 damage, the amount of retal damage they will recieve is the same. Further more, retaltion does NOT negate any of the damage your receive. Therefore any builds that rely on high retaliation uptime will still need to address the survivablity issue. If you build around punishing enemies that hit you, by definition you’re building to receive hits and therefore need some way of dealing with it.

I think retaliation by definition should come hand in hand with Protection since they compensate each other. Retal does the damage and protection negates some of the damage buying the retal time to do its damage.

One addition i’d like to see on retal, when I as a guardian have retal and manage to actively defend myself through blocking/blinding/evading, the retaliation damage should STILL proc on the enemy. At its current state is does not proc which makes it a a defensive/offensive style that discourages active defense in order to optimally utilize it. I could have retal the whole time but when i block/blind/evade enemy attacks (play active defense the way a guard should), my retal gets severly punished as the uptime on it just got wasted by my CORRECT play. To me that’s flawed logic and therefore needs to be addressed

Summery:
-Intrigued by retaliation damage scaling on Toughness.
- Retal damage should still PROC even when an attack is Blcoked/Blinded/Evaded to not discourge correct active play.

EDIT:
Also i’d love to see Retal damage scaling up with Damage Modifiers .. anything that give you +x% damage does NOT currently affect retal damage unfortunately.

Arken.3725:

If anything, it fits more so in Zeal if you want to go the symbol route because well…yeah.

Should Write of Persistance move to Zeal somewhere then yes.. I think there needs to be a single Symbol line but unfortunately they split all the symbol based things over 2 lines where of them is just a singular anamoly that shouldn’t be in the line.

Zeal or Honor would fit .. my concern in zeal is that there are other very good choices that it would be competing with .. However, in Honor Adept there aren’t really any good choices outside of bunkering.

Lunacy Solacio.6514:

Lord Kuru.3685:

F2P is for new players to check out the game and contribute by being playmates to pay-players, and also to get them buy the full game. So first impressions are important for the F2P version. Here what a new player sees:

• I need some help, let me ask in the chat box: “kitten account, Buy HoT!”
• Let me enter this Rata Sum portal: “kitten account, Buy HoT!”
• Let me use the mailbox: “kitten account, Buy HoT!”
• What’s that notice in the corner of the screen, oh, it says “Buy HoT!”

The chat restriction is particularly bad. This is an MMO and you can’t talk to other players? How do you make friends or respond to guild recruitments?

You expect some degree of restrictions but this is a bit too much. If new players feel like second class citizen they’re going to — technically accurate or not — pull out the dreaded letters “P2W” .. not something you want associated to your MMO.

In short, F2P new players have no money invested into the game, so they’ll quit in the beginning at the drop of a hat. The first impressions they get currently: not good.

They can talk in /say.
They can start a whisper every 30s for someone in the same map as they are.
If there wasn’t a restriction on /map, it would be full of goldseller spam…

So there is nothing preventing them from chatting with other players that are near them, and they can whisper someone that says ‘whisper me if you need help’ or whatever.

i’d like to add apoint to this .. think of it in context with the mastery system.. Mentors will exisit in the game and free accounts will be able to locate them and whisper them so the system works.

I made a post regarding the aoe nature of Permeating Wrath and how it relates to the new Dragonhunter traits. I agree it’s a heavy investment to get the aoe burning with good uptime,. However, if they make Permeating wrath make cripple application aoe too, then the merger might make it too Op ..

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/guardian/DH-Virtue-of-Justice-and-Permeating-Wrath

What i’m thinking is , Supreme justice need to have an addedd effect. As it stands, lowered the passvie trigger from kittens to 3 hits is nice but not tempting enough especially when it competes with Absolute Resolution.

On a side note, have you noticed we have a completely unselfish trait in GM that the guardian himself doesn’t benefit from ? Battle Presence doesn’t do a signle thing to help the when taking it . It’s attempting to simulate Soothing Mist on ele but it’s failing at it as the Ele gets soothing mist by default without any kind of investment. Yet we have to invest in a GM trait that doesn’t give us any benefit and prevent us from utilizing our Virtue of Resolve in order to maintain it XD .. that’s broken logic to me :P

Glacial heart fits better in the Honor adept not in Valor… It’s a symbol based, and support based .. therfore Honor line fit’s it much much better .. The valor line has no synergy with hammer whatsoever .

I love the new Free To Play approach .. I’ve tested alot of it and it’s very well thought of .. It will allow the game to become one of the top PVP games out there that are readily available while still protecting its community for grievers, botters , and spammers .. Very well done approach . I’m very much looking forward to this impact this will have on PVP and WvW

Note: as a veteren player i’m in a complete support of this system. I did get 3 awesome years for what i’ve paid for and now this will make the game more available, so the community will grow, and my experience will become even better. thank you anet.

Just one last thing, I wish there was a more detailed explanation on the limited access Free accounts have on the TP. I was looking at it but couldn’t discern a pattern as to whats available and what’s not .. This is needed so i can explain to new members in our guild what they can and cannot get on the tp. Right now we’re abit a t a loss.

I’m just a bit confused as to the free accounts access to the TP .. When i tried using a free account to buy an item, it said:

“Newly Created accounts must meet the following requirements before using this feature:

- Upgrade to Hearth of Thorns
- Newly unlocked accounts require validation. This feature will"

I am very confused as there are some items on the tp that as a free account i can still buy but they don’t follow any pattern. It’s a confusing.

so here are my questions:
- Can Free accounts use the TP to Buy/Sell items?

- Are there restrictions on what can be bought or sold ? is there a daily or weekly limit for the value traded (bought or sold)?

- Is this restriction time gated that will open up upon further use of the Free of account or is it a permenant restriction?

Thank you.

Ghotistyx.6942:

“If I had asked my customers what they wanted they would have said a faster horse.” Credited to Henry Ford.

^ this just made my night lol

Arothen.9842:

Karl… you just dont get it….do you? Revamp the bloody DH.. this is ridiculous compared to the other classes…. AT least make it worth playing! Have you even tried fighting as DH against the others in this spec? I bet the results would be terrible…

go away please.

Menzies The Heretic.3415:

There’s not a single pvp’er I know in this world that actually cares about these points.
I also think that rewarding players for every fart is not a good habit.

I don’t think it’s as much about the reward itself as it is about giving people personal gain incentive (the best incentive in mmos) to ready up with they’re ready.

Ragnar the Rock.3174:

Think about it
“Shattered AEGIS” Whenever an AEGIS you applied is broken it deals damage to & dazes the attacker.

I would be willing to pay double the price of the game if this was ever introduced in the trait XD

I agree with Thaddeus on the cool down part. Permanent AI companion are exclusively ranger and necro mechanics. What I’ve noticed is that devs tend to balance a lot of things based on the role play feel f the class and the the tics of more than the mechanics. So I’d be surprised if they adapt a permenant approach or anything close to it.

What I would recommend is having them on realistic cool downs considering how easily they die. Even in 1v1, it doesn’t take more than 10 seconds to wipe out all the spirit weapons with direct damage and conditions. Which basically means the enemy player will have about 30-kitten (when traited) window to kill the guard fully knowing the guard has absolutely 0 utilities and 0 suatain. The only sustain spirit weapon the bow, it’s healing skill is at the level of symbol heal even at a full healing spec making it more or less not as effective considering the very very long cool down.

Also the damaging weapons are both melee making them easy to cleave, cluster, and just condi bomb. Where as the necro minions have multiple ranged aspects to it and ranger also have ranged pets. This means that kiting the weapons is far easier, and killing them is also easier. I once had my weapons die to burn damage because I guardian just kited them around his purging flames to the point they stacked 15 stacks of burning on themselves.

make the cool downs in the range of 15-25 when traited … Make the spirit weapons immune to conditions or somehow able to survive for a decent amount of time. Heck I’d be all game for full immunity of damage but that might be op. Keep the disappearing of spirits as that diffrenteas them from minions but must balance cool down to compensate. 15-25s cool down when traited should do be a good balance.

Arken.3725:

x indigo x.6981:

Arken.3725:

Dulled Senses: While it’s a nice addition to have the vuln, is it possible to consider changing it to something else? With how inconsistent it is to keep someone kbed even a few times, this is hardly any vulnerability to take advantage of. Instead of vuln, grant the Guardian swiftness?

I really really like this idea .. Switching the appliction of vaulnrability on applying cripple to be gain swiftness when you apply cripple would make much much more sense when the concept of dragon hunt relies on range.

I also would still like to emphasize the importance of making the trigger of cripple on virtue of justice passive become aoe when traited into Permeating Wrath GM in virtues. .. I would even go as far as to say the swiftness gain becoming aoe as well to allies would be really nice but that might be pushing it too far.

Summery: swiftness on cripple application makes more sense than vulnrability on cripple application since ranged is the context here.

That’s….an amazing way to look at it. Cripple grants swiftness?

Edit: There were only a few things I saw which included that, hunter’s fort and heavy light.

I was thinking of that in the context of equipping both zealots aggression and dulled senses. Since you’d be applying cripple on virtue of Justice passive, that’s swiftness would be very handy in repositioning and keeping the distance from the enemy.

Edit: it is especially useful since the only knock back we have on bow is based on ring making us lack on demand cc.

Sword is really the condi weapon for single target. Since our burn application relies on maximizing hits/second , sword has the highest hits/second against single target.

I’d love to see it become more focused on condi however. Here are some ideas that could be added as traits or through weapon revamp. I’m just listening some ideas. I’m not saying they all need to be added.

- crit on sword applies bleeding
- virtue of justice passive also applies bleeding when wielding a sword
- apply confusion when blinding a foe.
- while wielding a sword, applying burning also applies (bleed or vulnerability)

What do you guys think ?

Black Box.9312:

Wasabee.5786:

I sort of see the Dragonhunter as the commander character specializing in setting up the kills for his group and swooping in where needed while providing battlefield control with traps. I try to see the traps more as a new form of symbols, to help with zoning control and kill setup, which also allows to stay at range against enemies easier, but also provide the melee Dragonhunter with new “symbols” to lock down enemies and make them vulnerable, taking on a more offensive support role.

See, but that’s kind of the issue. More area denial is the last thing this class needed. So even if they buff the hell out of traps, it still will just be more of what we already have.

Guardians have area of denial ? …

Arken.3725:

Dulled Senses: While it’s a nice addition to have the vuln, is it possible to consider changing it to something else? With how inconsistent it is to keep someone kbed even a few times, this is hardly any vulnerability to take advantage of. Instead of vuln, grant the Guardian swiftness?

I really really like this idea .. Switching the appliction of vaulnrability on applying cripple to be gain swiftness when you apply cripple would make much much more sense when the concept of dragon hunt relies on range.

I also would still like to emphasize the importance of making the trigger of cripple on virtue of justice passive become aoe when traited into Permeating Wrath GM in virtues. .. I would even go as far as to say the swiftness gain becoming aoe as well to allies would be really nice but that might be pushing it too far.

Summery: swiftness on cripple application makes more sense than vulnrability on cripple application since ranged is the context here.

Brutaly.6257:

And nerf meditations (-25%) and AH (-35) but let AH apply the heal to allies as well. This will open up for more builds where DH can play a role.
.

I COMPLETELY disagree with this approach. Meditatations are storng because they address EXACTLY the weakness of a guardian (mobility, low vitality, lack of condi clear on weapons, and general low percision)

The approach you’re suggesting to nerf good traits in order to make lesser traits have more play is very much the essence of wrong.

DH lacks self sustain through weapon skills, yet we still have low vitality, and traps don’t contribute to either condi clearing nor healing (self or allies) .. thats’ the core issue .. therefore they need to be improved to account for the areas they leave the guardian very very vulnerable . The good traits shouldn’t be nerfed for the sole reason of making bad traits comparable. Bad traits need to be fixed/balanced to be competitive with the good traits.

And on a side note, The same issues with traps exist in Spirit weapons. The reason people don’t play spirit weapons (aside from the fact they die way way too quik) is that when specced for them , the guardian loses, self heal, self condi clear and becomes very vulnerable. Same issue exists with Signets .. Hence there aren’t any prominent Signet builds or Spirit weapons builds and there won’t be prominent Traps build unless the issue of self sustain is addressed on those be it though traits, change to utilites themselves , or a complete revamp.

Again i say it .. nerfing good traits like meditations would not benefit the class in any way and will NOT add build diversity. It will only serve to hinder the class even more as the few viable ways to spec into just become worse than before.

EDIT:

I just remembered that the latest notes actually added more self sustain inthe form of condi clearing on block . This is AMAZING addition to the guard as it lowers our reliance on the utilties for sustain.

Random thought to add sustain into weapon skills, make Write of Persistance trait make Symbols Clear a condi on the guardian himself only (allies might be too op) on every pulse while he’s standing in the symbol. Basically this would simulate the eles current ridiculously op condi clearing.

Is there any chance to make Hunter Fortification make aegis you apply to allies clear a condition upon removal along side of the condi removal on block for the guardian himself?

Ghotistyx.6942:

How do you know it doesn’t work like that in testing? We have so little information on it is probably premature to start making claims like these.

I’m so confused right now as to why you thought this read was aggressive at any level. Claims??.. This was simple feedback on Dragonhunter.

Permeating Wrath as it stands:
Virtue of Justice’s passive effect no longer only burns your target, but also burns the area around your target each time it activates.

It description is very specific to say it only affects burning. Now this was never something that needed to be edited before as the passive triggers on Virtue of Justice only had burning. But now since it is getting Cripple, it begs the question whether that Cripple will be aoe like in the case of burning.

This was feedback on the latest release notes about the dragonhunter. I was hoping you’d be coming here and giving a constructive opinion over whether you think this modification is a good approach or not. Please keep the discussion productive here.

Thank you

Thank you for the responses guys

I was being whispered vulgur language . Now i’m a big boy and i understand that it’s expected in competitive games. But considering the rating on GW2 it made me wonder.

I was being told that reporting players for verbal abuse that direct vulgur insults at me would actually get ME banned for abusing the report system. Is this true ? If so , then what is Verbal Abuse and when should we report players for it ?

Genuine question here.

- It introduces a more sustained soft CC with cripples and dazes
- it provides a stronger ranged weapon option
- provides more self sustain with condi clearing on block and reciveing 10% less damage
- More damage modifiers to stack

Those i see are improvements and worth investing in. Just because the DH doesn’t fit your playstyle doesn’t make it a useless thing.

If you want to give constructive feedback to help improve things, this thread has been doing very well at fine tuning recommendations and feedback :
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/guardian/Constructive-Dragonhunter-Feedback-Ideas/

Else, this will just be regarded as another QQ thread and never taken seriously.

Just my 2 cents.

Thorwyn.8469:

x indigo x.6981:

Thorwyn.8469:

Karl McLain.5604:

Please keep in mind that (as before) these things won’t be in the next BWE, but in a future update. As always, thanks for your constructive feedback!

If you dont let us test it, how are we supposed to give you guys some feedback about it?!

They WILL allow us to test it. Just not at the upcoming BEW as implementing changes has to go through the proper channels and protocols. It’s not as simple as flipping a switch. It’s a big company that they has it’s own protocols and processing times.

Well, it is 1 1/2 weeks til the next BWE, if they did the changes already, it should be able to let us test them there.

I believe right now they’re working on the in a theoretical manner. Determining what approach to use BEFORE implementation. The theoretical part takes processing of approval.. Then comes implementation which takes time .. then come internal testing and balancing which takes time .. then comes finalizing for BWE which takes processing too …

the week and a half is actually 6 BUSINESS days or work hours .. just because it’s a week and a half away doesn’t mean they’re living and breathing development and staying at the office 24/7 . Also when they are working, they are not ONLY working on Dragonhunter. There are other things that they are working on. It follows an agenda that’s managed internally.

I am grateful they are sharing the future plans on here so we’re kept in the light. But pressing them unrealisticly to push something they’re not ready to push only shows a lack of understanding to the corporate dynamics of running large corporation like anet.

I’m not writing this to antagonize. Please understand that a business runs in a more complex and time consuming manner than a change that an individual focused on 1 task and 1 task only can do.

Thorwyn.8469:

Karl McLain.5604:

Please keep in mind that (as before) these things won’t be in the next BWE, but in a future update. As always, thanks for your constructive feedback!

If you dont let us test it, how are we supposed to give you guys some feedback about it?!

They WILL allow us to test it. Just not at the upcoming BEW as implementing changes has to go through the proper channels and protocols. It’s not as simple as flipping a switch. It’s a big company that they has it’s own protocols and processing times.

I put some builds that i’ve been running here if you’re interested:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/guardian/IndigoMania-Builds-Workshop/first#post5410099

LAG and FPS issues are hard counter to Medi guard … Playing medi guard feels more or less like playing a thief. Whereas a thief can disengage at will, a medi guard must endure as attempts to disengaging will fail 90% of the time.

Eles are very strong and the latest cele necros are even more annoying. It’s really hard to take em down on a medi guard unless you catch them off cooldowns and burst them strong.

I recommend you attempt other builds . maraurder wouldn’t be much of your friend when you have lag .. should a mesmer have lag the same you you do, he’d also end up dead no matter how op his build is.

Karl McLain.5604:

Hey all. Following up on what we talked about last week. Here’s a few more things that we’re looking at doing:

Longbow update

Deflecting Shot: The last time I posted, the note I had on this was a vague ‘damage increase’ thing, which met with fair opposition. We’ve had a little more time to look into the ability and have tweaked it a fair amount so that it can retain its primary defensive functionality and still reward you for reactive play. Here’s what we’ve got -

• Reduced missile velocity by 25% (it traveled too fast to really block much). Reduced after-cast by 300 milliseconds. Increased base damage by 13%. Destroying a projectile with this ability increases the damage it deals by 100%. Increased the blocking radius by 33%. The attack radius of this ability has not been increased.

• Symbol of Energy: Removed the burning on impact (no other symbol has an additional effect, so this felt weird). Increased damage dealt by 10%.

Virtues:

• Spear of Justice: Increased missile velocity by 100%. Reduced the casting speed from 3/4 second to 1/4 second.

• Shield of Courage: The shielding effect now occurs the moment this ability starts. Lowered after-cast by 200 milliseconds. We’re also looking into a better functionality for the shield.
  Where we’re at: Currently, you block all attacks for allies within the radius, but you don’t get any feedback for it… so we’re looking to improve that. The shield also doesn’t really benefit you, other than missile blocking (which is good, but feels like it should do more, being that you’re giving up instant casts). The current idea is to block attacks from the front (within the shield you’re projecting), but be vulnerable from the back to ensure counter-play.

• Wings of Resolve: We’re waiting to see how the current implementation plays out, being as the ability has a greatly increased healing application and has access to 3 seconds of immobilize.

Traits:
There’s been some merging and creation of new trait types for the Dragonhunter line. There are now a couple of direct defensive options, in addition to some stronger power/damage ones. The goal here was to give different clear avenues (damage, utility, virtues… with some overlap)

Adept – Piercing Light: The bleeding effect only really benefited a couple traps, where we wanted the effects of this trait to enhance each one in the same way.

• The bleeding functionality has been removed and will now daze enemies for 1 second when traps enter their ‘activating’ state.

Adept – Dulled Senses: Moved here from the Master tier! Enemies you knock back are crippled. Enemies you cripple receive Vulnerability. Reduced the vuln from 3 stacks for 5 seconds to 1 stack for 8 seconds.

Master – Hunter’s Determination: Drop a Fragments of Faith trap at your location when you’re crowd-controlled.

Master – Zealot’s Aggression: Deal extra damage to crippled enemies. Damage bonus increased from 7% to 10%. Justice’s passive effect cripples enemies (1.5s).

Grandmaster – Hunter’s Fortification: The area effect protection was bland and, while defensive, didn’t really portray the more selfish dragonhunter nature that likes to hold an advantage over their enemies. We’ve replaced this with a bit different defensive nature that’s also more synergistic with Hunter’s Determination.

• Remove conditions when blocking attacks (1 per block, ICD 1 second). Receive 10% less damage when you have no conditions on you.

Grandmaster – Heavy Light: Merged the aspect of Hunter’s Determination.

• Longbow arrows knock back enemies that are within the range threshold (10s ICD). Gain stability (1 stack, 5 seconds) when you knock an enemy back in this fashion.

Please keep in mind that (as before) these things won’t be in the next BWE, but in a future update. As always, thanks for your constructive feedback!

Cheers,
-Karl

I love the changes .. Thank you carl for updating the community. Even though it’s not going to be implemented in teh upcoming bwe, it’s still good to know the direction and work being done. Most of the community is just feeling neglected. This kind of updates is good to help people feel heard . Keep up the great work.

I have a small note regarding a couple of the new traits regarding cripple and vaulnrability on virtue of justice passive. since this is a general thread, I went ahead and seperated that discussion into another thread. Please check it out. Looking forward to hearing your feedback on it.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/guardian/DH-Virtue-of-Justice-and-Permeating-Wrath

as of the latest notes provided for DH, :

Karl McLain.5604:

Adept – Dulled Senses: Moved here from the Master tier! Enemies you knock back are crippled. Enemies you cripple receive Vulnerability. Reduced the vuln from 3 stacks for 5 seconds to 1 stack for 8 seconds.

Master – Zealot’s Aggression: Deal extra damage to crippled enemies. Damage bonus increased from 7% to 10%. Justice’s passive effect cripples enemies (1.5s).

To follow the same theme of Battle Presence sharing both the passive Virtue of Resolve effect with allies AND the Purity of Body effect (the +15% endurance regeneration) effectively turning any passive effect of virtue of resolve aoe, Shouldn’t tratiting in Permeating Wrath make ANY virtue of Justice passive effect aoe ?

This would introduce a possible build variant that revolves around maximum triggering of virtue of Justice. So when specced with:

- Permeating Wrath
- Dulled Senses
- Zealot’s aggression

An aoe trigger of Burn + Cripple + Vulnerability. .. now the numbers i see aren’t significant enough to make it overpowered ( 2s burn, 1.5s cripple, and 1 stack of vulnerability) ..

I believe Permeating Wrath should be adjusted to make any virtue of justice passive activation aoe so the effect would be consistent with how Virtue of resolve with Battle presence currently works.

Thank for the well organized and constructive effort .. I’d recommend updating the op with the alternatives discussed so the debs can see everything in one post instead of scanning through the three to find the good feedback. Just my 2 cents .

maec auto attack chain is faster than hammer auto attack chain .. also, mace symbol has a very high uptime (when traited for mace cooldown reduction and symbol duration increase) that is comparable with hammer . One thing to note though, hammer symbol lands ONLY when ALL 3 attacks hit the enemy. This is pretty much the downfall of hammer in pvp as the enemy is always moving. Mace on the other hand keeps that control over symbol application in your hand as it is an on demand symbol as oppose to the hammer where it’s really whether your enemy is getting hit or not.

For pvp i have a personal symbol dps based build that i’ve been having fun with. Not sure if it would help give you an idea or not but thought i’d share it. You can find it here:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/guardian/IndigoMania-Builds-Workshop/first#post5410099

Honestly, make whatever build you’re comfortable with and keep adjusting it and tweeking over time and you see fit. Connect with your build and develop it as you go.

here is a non meta cele build that uses Hammer Scepter/Torch. It emphasizes might stacking, has a fire field, and two blasts. Balances suvivability with dps and follows similar concepts to the cele ele builds. Check it out :

Cele Might Stacking
http://en.gw2skills.net/editor/?vVAQNAS7dlsAhyhY1QwZIQQEHzD1tAahao+AXZAk/iU8FB-TZRGwAAOCAHeAAg2fwwFBYZZAA

I’ve been putting my non-meta builds here if you’re interested:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/guardian/IndigoMania-Builds-Workshop/first#post5410099

Silv.9207:

And condition builds will always inflict more condition than what you can clean but it’s supposed to happen why they also need to deal damage…

^ pretty much this .. condi cleansing was never meant to keep up with condi application. Otherwise condi builds will never be used. It’s meant to REDUCE it not ELIMINATE it.

Dude i feel ya .. sometimes i play power medi and I STILL get hate messages that i’m playing the “noob brainless burn builds” .. i whisper back " I’m running .. power … l2p?"

I think the burn guard builds have created such a great extent of fear of burn stacks .. alot of unskilled players see stacks of burns and think you’re running burn even when you’re not. Not realizing that even power guard apply burns but it doesn’t remotely damage as much as a burn guard would. I get the same hate on my cele build but admittedly it does have a burn aspect to it.

Guardian Angel
(Front line support/healer)

Introduction:

This build is meant for large scale combat support/healer role. The more enemies we’re fighting, the stronger the potential this build will have. It focuses on condi cleansing and a combo of active bursty heals and passive heals or HoTs (Heals over Time) . It is discouraged to have multiple guardians running this in one party. Preferable use is by having 1 guardian per FRONTLINE party run this. This is not remotely effective for backline support as it relies on being tight and close for maximum support. It’s also MANDATORY to have the white wings back-piece when running this. YOU’RE AN ANGEL !

• Note * : This build was made with large scale combat in WvW context in mind. It may be useless in pve, pvp, or havoc (i honestly haven’t thought much about it outside of that context). Therefore, please keep the comments on the build restricted to the context it was built for. No point in yelling " THIS BUILD IS USELESS IN FRACTALS!" when it wasn’t meant for that in the first place. The only thing a shout like that would do is show your inability to read and comprehend context :P .. having said that, enjoy the build!

Gear:
Weapons : Mace/Shield + Staff
Armor: Nomads
Trinkets: Clerics
Weapon stats: Magi (or nomads if more toughness desired)
Runes: Trooper
Sigils: Stamina + Energy on both weapon sets

Skills:
Receive the Light
Wall of Reflection
Hold the Line
Stand your Ground
Signet of Courage
Other possible skills fitting the role (might need further changes in traits):
Purging Flames
Possible trait combo : Master of Consecrations
Merciful intervention
Possible trait combo : Smiter’s Boon trait + Monk’s Focus trait
Retreat
Possible trait combo: Communal defense + Pure of Heart + Pure of Voice.

Summery:
Condition Clearing: You’re a condi cleansing machine with the combination of Pure of Voice and Trooper runes. With 3 shouts on the bar, you should be able to pick up the whole party condi clearing granted they have a little bit of personal condi clearing. Coordinate with the party members for the rotation. If more condi cleansing is desired, swap Wall of Reflection of Purging Flames. NEVER use Virtue of Resolve as a condi clear unless it’s ABSOLUTELY LAST RESORT.

Passive Heals: You have strong HoTs (Healing over Time) skills just by being there. Virtue of Resolve + battle presence gives about 223 healing per second. Signet of Courage gives about 154 healing per second. Regenration you give heals for about 322 per second. Combining all those would give allies around you : 6990 healing every 10s. That’s equivelent of giving them another healing skill every 10s. Therefore, Always remain on tag. You’re the first person in and last person out. Your presence is what sustains the front line.

Active Heals: Besides your passive heals, you have strong active heals. Staff will have 2 healing skills : Detonate Orb of Light heals for 1710 on a 10s CD, Empower heals for 3073 on a 16s CD. On your mace, the auto attack chain heals for 739 on a 2s CD. Symbol of Faith grants regeneration and acts as a continuous source of regeneration (see passive heals calculations above). On the shield, popping Shield of Absorption heals for 1607 on a 24s CD. Recieve the Light when used right and aimed right would heal 4 allies for 8062 per ally on an 32s CD

~~ SECRET SAUCE ~~: The strongest heal on this build that goes unmatched is the heal on dodge with Selfless Daring trait in the Honor line. Each dodge would heal for 1666 and you get a dodge every 8.7s naturally. But you might be saying we will be saving the dodges for when need right? That would have been the case if we didn’t have SO MANY DODGES. With the sigil combo Stamina and Energy, you will be dodging at any time you get a dodge. Every time you see XP numbers flashing on screen showing you that you got credit for a kill, you dodge left and right. Each kill gives 2 dodges. that’s 3332 healing per kill. No internal cooldown or nothing. That’s the strongest heal in our possession. SO GO DANCING!

• NEVER *******:
  use Virtue of Resolve active unless your staring death in the face. WE WANT THE PASSIVE TO REMAIN.
  use Signet of Courage active. As strong as the active maybe, it’s very difficult to pop it at the right time. The passive is what we seek here.
  use Symbol of Faith or Symbol of Swiftness on water regroups. You shall be shunned and shamed for doing so.

Downside:
What we provide in support takes away some of our own situational survivablity. We lose Renewed Focus , Shelter. So your playstyle and positioning needs to adjust accordingly.

We don’t do ANY significant damage. As a matter of fact the only time you should be concerned with hitting the enemy is when you want to get tags that will proc sigil of Stamina. other than that, you’re mostly focused on where the tag is, your party status (condis, health.. etc) and focus on mangaing your heals accordingly.

You will receive ALOT of hate .. i mean ALOT ALOT ALOT of hate from many players. You’ll be dissed, and attakced and called a noob that doesn’t understand that gw2 doesn’t have a holy trinity… My Advice, IGNORE em. Let the numbers speak for themselves. Providing this amount of sustain on the frontline is VERY VERY STRONG. Whether its benefit outweighs the loss of DPS, that’s up to commanders and guild leaders to determine on their own relative to their own raids. NO ONE should shake you into saying healing doesn’t scale well or it’s non-effective.Numbers don’t lie

Looking forward to hearing your thoughts on the build.

Gw2skills link: (Main Build)
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vVAQNApeWl8AhehYtQwVIQTEHJEUeG/vE4GEiUcLQAOAA-T1BDABHqEkP9BAr+TT7PolyvJOFAA8EAIFw36tA-w

Variation 1: When having another guardian in party running strength in numbers:
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vVAQNApeWl8AhehYtQwVIQTEHLEV+F2vQAnAVQJcDgvcAA-T1BDABHqEkP9BAr+TT7PolyvJOFAA8EAIFw36tA-w

Variation 2: more healing focued, less condition clearing focused
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vVAQNApeWl8AhmhYtQwVIQTEHLEV+F2vQAnAVQYeDgvcAA-T1BDABHqEkP9BAr+TT7PolyvJOFAA8EAIFw36tA-w

Honestly i just wanted a place to save the various builds I fiddle with every once in a while and to share them at the same time. Not going to write full guides but I will respond to questions and comments if people are interested in any of them. Any build that has a name between paranthesis is yet to have an official name on my list

Disclaimer:
Those are non-meta builds. I put them together to answer a “what if” question that pops in my mind every now and then. Use at your own discretion.

WvW:

Guardian Angel:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/guardian/IndigoMania-Guardian-Angel-Build

Wildfire: (unoptimized yet)
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vVAQJARWlsAhmhYtQwVIQQEHBEFeFihcwGAPwbmHiGcCB-TFyCwAQUCC4JAE4SA8SXgBzfNV+5c/Bfq/QKAImGB-w

PvP:

(Burn Guard)
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vVAQNAR7flsAhyhY1QwZIwPEH+D1NcvgPwGAVQdmTiJMDB-TZhAwAeuIAw2fYcZAMHBAAPAAA

(Symbol Based DPS)
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vVAQNApdRlsAhyhY1QwbIwPEHxD1dfjhcoGANQ9i7h/bLA-TJxFABfXGIhTBAK7PAwTAAA

(Block based tank)
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vVAQRAse5dlsAhShYtQwVIQQEH1D1NA2hfAXDBRUYngT4QB-TJhAwArLDYd/hOnEAAPBAA

(Cele Might Stacking)
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vVAQNAS7dlsAhyhY1QwZIQQEHzD1tAahao+AXZAk/iU8FB-TZRGwAAOCAHeAAg2fwwFBYZZAA