Guild Wars 2

Amaimon.7823:

Why should he. Its his now. He peed on it. His scent is on it. If they want it back they better be ready to die for it. Its just a chunk of metal. Your local smith can make a 100 new crowns

Unless your local smith is a god, I doubt he’s going to be able to make a crown like the one needed for the ritual. The gods made that one as one of the gifts they gave to Doric. If Rytlock lost it in the Mists, that doesn’t bode well for ever being able to undo the Foefire.

Rytlock only made that promise to human PCs. If the PC is any other race, no such promise is requested or given.

I’m not sure when you think the topic (along with other matters related to the ritual) should have come up. Things were a bit busy between the time of Rytlock’s return and the fall of Mordremoth. After that, we’ve only seen him briefly — under circumstances not favoring a discussion of irrelevant issues — before he got hauled back to the Black Citadel.

The whole matter of the Foefire and the counter-ritual is on a back burner right now, as it should be given that we have two elder dragons, a souped-up mursaat, a baby dragon, and a power-mad Confessor demanding our attention. Is this really the time to be worrying about the crown?

baliwsirg.4396:

Quite a late reply for a thread:

I would like to suggest that we get at least one instance in LS3 to knock some sense into Braham. If Marjory goes rogue because of Lazarus, we should get a chance to knock some sense into both Kasmeer and Marjory.

People keep complaining that Braham and Marjory are being immature and insolent. The preferred solution seems to be a chance to knock them around (with second place going to the option to unfriend them forever and stalk off in a snit). And now apparently we should also have a chance to knock around anyone associated with someone we disagree with, like Kasmeer, despite the fact that Kas has done nothing to cross us in any way. Junior high drama at its finest.

Wow. When did knocking people around become a mature response? Or do people think that an immature behavior is the best response to immature behavior?

Personally, I would prefer that the Commander continue to be depicted as a mature individual who leads by providing a good example. I would prefer that the Commander show restraint when a friend acts out in a temporary display of pique. I would prefer that the Commander try to repair relationships diplomatically instead of instantly writing them off. Because these are the things that mature people do instead of screaming abuse and knocking people around whenever things don’t go exactly as they wish.

Harper.4173:

And this “effect” might be a good thing if this was a story instance but it isn’t. It’s something that’s in the game for a long time and all it’s managed to do is to make me avoid that city as much as possible.
I understand changing things “for the worse” to drive a story point but if the updates are so far between you’re not really going to achieve much.

The Consortium is also going to be in the game for a long time, and they are going to keep popping up doing things that may or may not bode well for the future. We’ve already seen them become involved with the ley energy eruptions in competition with the Priory and making semi-shady offers for the Reforged Shadowstone. It’s a long-term plot line without much clue yet where it will go, not just a quick story point. I don’t see how a continuing indication of their character is a bad thing.

It isn’t just the PS, but also LW and HoT story instances. This can cause some big problems for certain instances making them nearly impossible to complete, such as LW season 2 episode 6.

Harper.4173:

Agreed completely.
Old Lion’s arch had character and actually looked cool. The new nautical theme is a sorry attempt.

The new LA has character, too. It’s the character of the Consortium. What else would you expect from a bunch of superficial, shallow corporate pirates? Certainly not coolness! If you follow the LA tour guide around for a bit, you’ll hear a few bitter comments from her concerning the change, so it has clearly been done deliberately for a particular effect, not because the ANet designers have run out of imagination.

I’m with Tigershard. I haven’t played it in a loong time until I made a revenant recently, so I forget how it used to be. But I just assumed it was for effect, and I rather liked it. Just music, no combat noises. I didn’t have a problem with it or find it cosmetically problematic, though I can see how those who play without music would see it differently.

Codes.6870:

They bring back Prince Rurik…. Again

What’s the problem with that? We’d get to kill him again! And hopefully again, and again, and again. For an NPC that got us killed so many times in GW1, one death is NEVER enough.

(True fact: I never rolled a warrior in GW1. Until I played Turai’s story for Durmand, I had little sympathy for Rurik’s behavior. After that I was much more understanding. Funny thing is, though I liked Turai’s story most of all the Durmand missions and played it many, many times just for that beautiful final cutscene, I still never rolled a warrior. )

I don’t see that DE is any more or less of a guild than DW. The members of each have their own lives and responsibilities outside of the guild. Logan is Captain of the Seraph. Kasmeer is a noble in Jennah’s inner circle. Rytlock is a Tribune of the Blood Legion. Caithe is a Firstborn. Taimi now runs her own krewe. Etc.

Both guilds have or had their inner conflicts. DE was like spending time in junior high, but they got beyond it. DW is currently spending time there as well, but I’m certain they will get beyond it one way or another, even if not all characters make it.

DE came together to spearhead the assaults against Zhaitan and Mordremoth. DW will undoubtedly come together for Jormag and Primordus, though the guild roster is still somewhat in doubt. (Will Canach be offered membership? Will Braham reconcile? Will Rytlock be back? What of Logan and Zojja? Etc.)

Also in doubt is the amount of support DW can expect. DE failed the first time trying to take down Kralky alone. Tyria needed the Pact for Zhaitan, and the Pact plus the Summit for Mordy (who we would NOT have been able to defeat without their efforts). Elder Dragons are something that requires Tyrians (and eventually Elonians and Canthans, I suspect) to come together to defeat. I’m anxious to learn what will become of the Pact and the Summit, but I will be very disappointed if DW goes out and starts doing solo work. That would seem to completely reverse the direction in which the story has been leading ever since Zhaitan.

Ider.1276:

Not the PC, of course, but some kind of iconic norn like Jora, Eir, Asgeir Dragonrender. Now the Fang is chipped with a spell from a scroll (ok). By a person who neither created the spell, nor defeated a terrible monster to obtaine it.

But the scroll is similar or identical to the one used by Asgeir, which is apparently of jotun origin. We have no idea how Asgeir got it, but he could be as much of a “leecher” as Braham. Regardless, the upshot is that the only thing proven is that the scroll makes you deadly against teeth, but not necessarily against the possessor of those teeth, given that Asgeir was ultimately killed by Jormag. Ultimately, I don’t think it matters much whether Braham is a leecher or a true icon. Either way, he has fallen into the trap of believing a myth that was allowed to persist because it was socially useful. Until now, when it may get more norn killed than it ever saved.

ATMAvatar.5749:

That said, I now start to wonder if there isn’t also an inferiority complex component with Braham. In addition to mourning his mother’s loss – his recent time with her made him realize that she was indeed the legend people speak of. With her dead, the pressure for him to live up to that legend has only increased, especially with Norn society being what it is.

He could very well see himself as being overshadowed by the player, with taking on Jormag independently being his only chance at showing others that he’s worthy of his family’s legacy.

I don’t know about an inferiority complex. Braham has always been one to look for shortcuts. Remember how he insisted on coming along on the mission to explore Rata Novus because there might be some kind of “dragon kill switch” to be found there? That was certainly never anything Taimi even hinted about what might be found there. Now he thinks the scroll has given him his dragon kill switch.

Braham did come to realize that Eir was a legend, but he never really seemed to understand WHY she was. When we destroyed the totem in Frostgorge, he said something like “This is the first time I’ve ever seen you fight. Now I understand why you’re a legend.” But that was a major mistake on his part and he never got beyond it.

Yes, Eir had fabulous fighting skills. But her legend was far, far more than that. Her legend was her unusual (for a norn) forging of alliances, her skills at gathering intelligence and forming a plan, and at organized combat rather than the usual lynch mob of norns each following their own agenda and seeking their own glory. These are the concepts with which she was trying to transform norn society, and the concepts that Braham has just thrown out the window by yelling “I’ve cracked the tooth! Everyone follow me on a mad rush at Jormag!”

I would certainly like to know what Braham thinks are included in the “pile of responsibilities” that have been “loaded” on him since he came back. He obviously had a responsibility for arranging a memorial service, which he did. He also had a responsibility to be at that service for the sake of his mother’s friends and admirers, which he avoided. He had a responsibility for Garm that he shoved off on Rox. Overall, it looks more like he’s shirking responsibilities rather than taking them on.

It’s curious that Braham thinks Eir would not have wanted the Commander in DE, apparently because the Commander would rather look before he leaps. Does Braham not realize that Eir approved of the Pact and was glad to work with it? He acts as if Eir would have been charging around knocking out Elder Dragons one after another, with or without DE, had she lived, which is obviously not the case. If that’s what he’s trying to live up to, then he’s set the bar impossibly high. Braham has put Eir on a pedestal of his own making.

@IndogoSundown: I think you’re still reading way too much into one episode.

In what sense are we “saddled” with Braham? When we last saw him, at the end of HoT, he was acting about as normally as Braham has ever acted. He’s been a bit impulsive and volatile since the day we met him, but he was useful to the team and committed to the effort. He was pretty peeved at Mordy, which was to be expected since Mordy had killed his mother only a short time before. (The shaved head was a bit emo, but hardly rises to the level of acting like a drama king.)

So it seems to make perfect sense to look him up later and ask him to join the team in a new guild. We had no way of knowing what he had become in the interim and no good reason NOT to want him in Dragon’s Watch.

Then we get one instance at the end of one episode to show us the situation has changed, for reasons we still don’t know despite all the speculation we’ve done (well-founded and otherwise). At the end of that Braham walked away and made it clear he wants nothing to do with us. We did not follow. How does this constitute ANet “forcing” us to work with him? How do you know we will ever work with him again?

But let us suppose that the story follows your prediction, Braham redeems himself, and we reconcile with him. What is wrong with that? I just don’t understand why people are so determined to be unforgiving before we even get to the next part of the story and find out what explanations are offered for his behavior.

IndigoSundown.5419:

Can I send him home and replace him with someone whose behavior is not going to detract from the important business of saving Tyria? No, I can’t. If he is going to act like a five year old throwing a tantrum, I should be able to give him a time out.

Give him a time out from what? From Dragon’s Watch? He’s not a member at this point, since he did not agree to join. Send him home? That’s where he went to crack the fang. How do you propose to keep him there and by what right? The best you can do is to withdraw the offer and find someone else to fill the spot in DW. And how do you know that this is not exactly what will happen, given that the story is not fully told yet?

Braham voluntarily worked with the Commander and accepted his authority as team leader during efforts against Scarlet and Mordremoth. Now he has decided to go his own way. It may be a bad way that will make it more difficult for Dragon’s Watch to carry out its own plan, but that doesn’t give the Commander any continued authority over him. If he will not listen to persuasion, then the Commander’s hands are tied,

There may be a hundred others out there doing things that will ultimately detract from the business of Dragon’s Watch, including the new marshal of the Pact (whoever he/she/it/ze turns out to be), for motives that are worthy or unworthy, intelligent or brainless. So what? The Commander is not the Supreme Ruler of Tyria and can’t do a thing about it except to try to arrange some sort of voluntary coordination.

serialkicker.5274:

I’d imagine “heroes” would be a bit more mature and have some more brain cells than some random crybaby emo.

“I have known many heroes and some were such oafs that one would feed them at the back door if their deeds did not claim a place at the table.” — Star, Empress of the 20 Universes, to the hero Oscar Gordon in Robert A. Heinlein’s Glory Road.

My interest is more in science fiction than fantasy, but such examples of “heroic fantasy” as I can think of (e.g. Glory Road or Piers Anthony’s A Spell for Chameleon or even Harry Potter) usually seem to feature heroes starting out in humble circumstances, often marginalized by their societies, before discovering their true destiny. They were often used as doormats by those around them initially. That’s always seemed like a trope of the genre to me.

Granted, the protagonists of these stories themselves are not generally oafs (though Harry Potter did act out a bit when he got into his teens), but Braham is hardly the protagonist of the GW2 story. Feed him at the back door if you must.

Edit: Even King Arthur started out as a doormat nicknamed “Wart”. Is there anything that has a better claim to being “heroic fantasy” than that?

Jaken.6801:

And as there are human ghosts in Ascalon and the story points to Logan (who for some reason can still be connected to be of royal lineage, like if they made Gwen the result of an affair for example… but that’s going too far maybe).

That’s pretty speculative, especially when we already have a known descendant of Doric right there in Ebonhawke: Commander/Captain Wade Samuelsson, Duke of Ebonhawke. He, based on his line’s continued presence in Ascalon, may be the only one who can make a legitimate claim to the throne. I can’t help but feel that he was introduced into the story early on so he could be trotted out and put center stage when the time came to really deal with the Foefire.

Honestly, most of the things Caudecus distorts were pretty well documented at the time by contemporary historians (Durmand in particular). Many of those storys seem to have survived quite well and are widely known, based on conversations such as Marjory talking about pretending to be Chosen and putting on plays for her parents. What a barrel of road apples. Moral of the story: Don’t try making your own propaganda at home, kids! Hire an expert.

Hmmm. Maybe we ARE dealing with Icebrood Imitation Braham™ as I joked some time ago.

draxynnic.3719:

It’s possible “Jorasdottir” has become a family name, or that Jora has become a common name in the family and Jhavi is both a descendent of the Jora we know, and the daughter of a more recent Jora.

There’s certainly norn precedent for personal names being reused in multiple generations of a family line. Ask Olaf, Sevenfold Son of Olaf.

As for Rytlock, my revenant (norn) is a little creeped out by having voices in his head, particularly when it comes to Shiro or Mallyx. (Shiro’s “Let me out!” gives me the shivers and makes me wonder just how much control a revenant really has over the legends he is channeling.) I can well understand Rytlock being unwilling to talk about this given charr attitudes towards magic and gods. I don’t think he’s too comfortable with it himself, despite his talk about being pragmatic and calling himself “Shaman Rytlock” if that’s what it takes to solve the ghost problem. He’s got to be feeling pretty conflicted about the situation.

I do question whether Smodur has the power to directly promote or demote anyone in another legion even if assigned to his command. As I recall, my Ash Legion charr’s promotion to Centurion came through the Ash Tribune, despite my character having been assigned to work under Rytlock.

Aaron Ansari.1604:

Someone’s been drawing inspiration from real-world happenings. Still, did I spy a sneaky end to Evennia’s story in there?

I noticed that apparent reference to Evennia, too, but how much trust can we place in anything Caudecus says, given his other distortions of the history we know? Look at the other jaw-dropping fabrications in the same letter. “Revisionist” is too mild a description.

I’m not all that big on huge, time-consuming metas myself. I applaud the changes they made to mitigate the meta in most of the HoT maps. Players can now come in and do a few events, getting immediate rewards instead of having to wait for an hour or more to get a “participation” reward. You can even do this to some extent when the remaining big meta is running — VB night, Octovine, or King of the Jungle — though rewards are better, of course, for those who run the whole meta, which now takes 45 minutes or less. (I wish they could make similar changes to DS, where you can’t do anything, even map completion, unless you get into a full map with three zergs running. And you generally can’t do that unless you are present when the map resets.)

But the basic strategy in LS3 maps seems to be avoiding events for the most part in favor of farming. Some of the farming may involve champ events, particularly when the champ is needed for a daily and the pre helps complete a heart. Otherwise it’s about getting to as many nodes as you can in as short a time as you can. That’s going way to far in the anti-meta direction, IMHO.

You don’t need to have an actual map-wide, long-running meta to give events on a map more of a feeling of unity and sense of progress than we get from the LS3 maps. Many of the core maps manage to do this just fine without a HoT or Maguuma-Wastes-style meta.

Djinn.9245:

IndigoSundown.5419:

It isn’t (for me) that Braham is unrealistic. He’s an angst-ridden emo teen. I get it. What’s unrealistic is that in all of Tyria I don’t have better options for membership in a squad that is spearheading the fight against the creatures that threaten the existence of the five races. That’s not how I’d run a war.

I agree. When I first started playing and saw the members of Destiny’s Edge, those were heroes. Then “my guild” started forming and I was appalled. The team saving the world should be made up of the best of the best. Instead we had a group of misfits and children.

Through most of the original personal story, DE are all acting out some kind of Junior High drama, calling names, stomping off from active missions in fits of rage, etc. If you read the first book (Edge of Destiny) you find out that they were all more-or-less misfits. Rytlock doesn’t fit in with his warband. Logan had issues with his brother and was pining for Jennah like some lovesick kid. Eir had been exiled from Hoelbrak for her foul-up. Snaff was not highly regarded among the asura. Caithe was wandering around alone, probably because (as we found out in LS2) she had fallen out with Faolin and was not in the good graces of the Pale Tree due to the events involving Wynn.

“Misfits and children” sounds like a perfect description of DE to me, at least until they finally pulled themselves together and started acting like grownups.

ProtoGunner.4953:

Also, Braham is young, stubborn, erratic, volatile. Typical for some troubled 18-25 year olds with mother issues/complex.

And he’s got more issues than that. His father died when he was, what, seven? Kids that age often feel abandoned and resentful of a parental death at some level, even when they still have one parent caring for them. (I’ve had some personal experience with this, since my youngest sister was about that age when our father died. She was a bit of a handful as a teen and young adult, to put it mildly.) But Braham also found out at the same time that he had a living, absentee mother. A double abandonment whammy. It’s a wonder that Braham isn’t even more messed up than he is.

A well-written printed story or movie would make such things clear. I can see how it would be hard to do in a game, however, without even more expository dialog than we already have. Players tend to hate too much yak-yak, and we’ve already seen some complaints about this regarding the last episode. You have to read between the lines and put things together that were presented piecemeal over the course of years, rather than in a few pages of a book that can be read in hours or a movie that is a single two-hour experience.

Vyrulisse.1246:

Anyone else not tear down his letters? Guys? >.>

Viva Free Speech!

“Error of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it.” (Jefferson)

“When truth is left free to combat error, it may not only be safely tolerated, but will be more exposed to a decisive refutation.” (W.L. Kingsley)

I leave the posters up, too. Let the Libertarian Revolution come to Tyria!

I, too, would like to see some remembrance of Tahearne. If not by the sylvari, then at least by the Pact.

I would also like to take both the Pale Tree and Caithe to task for not warning Trahearne of the danger before he loaded up the fleet with a bunch of potential turncoats and headed out to the jungle. Keeping the secret past the point where it was bound to come out anyway was a primary factor in the disaster. Trahearne should have been warned by the time he headed out to set up Camp Resolve. He should have had a chance to come up with some plan to mitigate the danger.

There is some precedent for ignoring any trauma to the PC over being forced to kill a friend, though. Rurik, anyone?

I couldn’t agree more with these criticisms of the new maps. Player behavior on those maps is enormously different than on other maps, and much of it is pretty bad behavior driven by both the drive to harvest map currency nodes and the ridiculous difficulty of the foes.

This is especially evident in Bitterfrost, where many are running around ignoring fights and hoping someone else has attracted all the aggro so they can dash in, harvest, and run away. If that unlucky soul gets overwhelmed and dies, tough. They can just wp and run back, because trying to rez them risks getting jumped by the rapid respawns and slows you up from getting to the next node. (Even those who participate in fights that someone is struggling with will often stop to harvest first before joining in. Priorities!) This is really annoying when the aggro consists of some pack of three or more regular foes plus a tough vet, with the possibility of several other foes spawning close by and joining the fight, with players running in with a train of aggro behind them that also piles on.

I find myself doing just enough events on one of these maps to satisfy the dailies plus unlock some hearts to buy more map currency, then harvesting all I can reach, and then bailing out of the map to rinse and repeat with the other two maps. Once I’ve achieved my goals for ascended trinkets for all of my characters, I don’t expect to go back to those maps ever again unless the future story requires my return for a bit.

I, too, found it easier to bond with Tybalt than the others, but I didn’t mind Forgal and Seiran. The main problem with the Order arcs is that they were all far too short to really show a bond forming between the PC and the mentor. You whizzed from initiate to Lightbringer/Warmaster/Magister at warp speed, then two seconds later your mentor was dead. Blink once and you missed the whole arc. I really wished ANet had been able to extend that part of the story and make us care about our mentors, rather than telling us later that we did.

RoxBuryNine.4210:

I wouldn’t terminate either of them by killing them off. I’d sever ties with them and look for replacements. It’s not like either one has been very useful. Marjory has always been more concerned with her personal interests and Braham has a tendency to get hurt. They’re both odious characters.

But you can say much the same about any of the characters.

Kas? Oh, the shame of being reduced to a commoner! Oh, I’ve got to take care of Jory! And she’s been injured a time or two herself.

Taimi? She’s always been on a power trip. It’s about making her reputation and being THE authority on whatever fixation she has at the moment. Now she’s got her own krewe and is set on being the preeminent dragon researcher of all time. It’s all about her, not the team. How many times has she told the team to go do whatever but she won’t be budging from whatever she’s doing?

Rox? She’s been pretty evasive. “Haven’t seen you for a while, Rox, what have you been up to?” “Oh, stuff. You know … charr stuff. And that guy I was talking to? Um, just an old friend from my mining days. Yeah, that’s the ticket. No need for you to meet him.”

You can make any of the characters look bad without trying hard at all.

As for the Commander not being assertive, perhaps you missed the part where s/he points out that Braham’s “hard proof” is nothing of the kind. But Braham immediately changed the subject to who was or wasn’t “allowed” to kill an elder dragon. He was not prepared to listen, so what would be the point of continuing to press him? Braham was continually misconstruing or dismissing or evading everything the Commander said, and holding a rational, complex conversation covering many issues while being jumped by 50 foes every 30 seconds is a little hard to pull off even among people that respect each other. It was not a good time to be arguing about respect.

As someone else pointed out, a guild is not an army. “Commander” is pretty much a courtesy title from the Pact, which WAS an army and subject to military discipline at all times. A guild is something looser. Also, you will note, Braham has not agreed to join Dragon’s Watch, so he is not even a guild member. The Commander is no more and no less entitled to Braham’s respect than anyone else.

As much as I’ve always enjoyed Illconcieved’s lucid posts and good sense, I have to disagree that Marjory was “being a jerk” in any way. She was firm in rejecting the Commander’s demands, but the Commander was overstepping the bounds of both friendship and authority. If anything, it was the Commander who came off as the jerk in that interaction, and I disliked it for exactly that reason. It seemed very out of character to me. The whole escalating hysteria of “may be a trap” … “probably a trap” … “certainly a trap” just didn’t ring true.

It’s a little early to say that the dragons are a plot wall.

Kralkatorric was in the Crystal Desert last we knew, but that was to get Glint. Who is to say that he didn’t or won’t move further south in search of minion fodder and run into Palawa Joko, requiring us to go to Elona?

As for Bubbles, we don’t even know if that one is awake yet. But, being a deep-sea dragon, where better to expect it than near an island nation such as Cantha? Perhaps there is a connection to the salt-spray dragons who might serve Bubbles, and we may learn that Kuunavang, like Glint, is an apostate champion who will join the battle on our side.

I think there is still room for both elder dragon stories and the other continents.

Kal Spiro.9745:

Ashen.2907:

Characters, NPCs, behaving in a manner that evokes an emotional reaction from player and player character, in character, is not bad storytelling. Characters behaving in a manner that is disliked, or even unlikable, is not bad storytelling. Hated and hateable characters can be much better components of a good story than those with whom we always agree, get along with, or even love.

What is bad storytelling is characters, even the PC, not being able to, allowed to, respond appropriately to the behavior.

Sorry, but evoking the response, “Why is he acting like this, and why am I letting him act like this, this is frustrating and annoying,” is not the same thing as evoking an emotional reaction and being disliked.

The question “why is he acting like this” has certainly started some stimulating and thought-provoking discussion. Is that not good storytelling?

The question “why am I letting him act like this” likewise deserves thought and may have a perfectly good answer that simply has not yet been addressed in a story that is not yet complete. How can we know whether the storytelling is good until we have the story’s answer?

When a child throws a screaming tantrum and hurls nasty accusations, a wise parent does not descend to the child’s level and start screaming back. Nor does the wise parent try to give instruction or force a rational conversation at such a time, since the child is not ready to BE rational or accept instruction. The wise parent lets the child stomp off to their room and cool down a bit before trying to address the problem. I’m much happier with a Commander who is acting grown up instead of mirroring Braham’s rage and frustration. Aren’t you? It sure seemed like an appropriate response to me.

Sure, it might give the grownup feelings of frustration to restrain themselves in the face of such behavior. I’m sure it would make most of us feel better if the Commander had beaten Braham into jelly or shouted back some hard truths. But neither course would have done any good right then and would likely have just widened the rift, leaving Braham with a simmering resentment and feeling of self-righteousness knowing that his insults had provoked such a response.

How the situation will be resolved has yet to be revealed. When we have the whole story, we will be in a much better position to judge the quality of the storytelling.

I, too, have a little problem accepting the charr theory. The gods created a number of powerful artifacts — two swords, a crown, a couple of staves, and maybe others — and gave them to Doric, who was the ruler of all humanity on the Tyrian continent. His descendants became the ruling houses of Orr, Ascalon, and Kryta, dividing the rule and the artifacts among them.

Frankly, giving artifacts to mortals that can do things like creating the Foefire seems about as wise as giving nukes to toddlers. What were the gods thinking?! However, it seems to me that they certainly would have wanted to be sure that not just anybody could grab one and unleash its full devastating force. I think they would have been bound to Doric’s bloodline in some way, unless the gods were even dumber than they appear from giving out such artifacts in the first place.

Of course, someone will point out that Vizier Khilbron used the Scepter of Orr, which was one of those artifacts. But the royal line of a country often has many offshoots, particularly among the nobility. Look, for example, at Barradin and Adelbern, both qualified for the throne as descendants of Doric, though Barradin was more in the direct line. Or look at Salma, who was an unacknowledged illegitimate daughter of the previous king of Kryta. Khilbron, as a high-ranking Orrian noble, may well have been in line for the Orrian throne with King Reza and his family dead following the cataclysm.

Baffling someone with bullwinkle is not “taking them down a notch”. Marjory, OTOH, did put a little stick in the Commander’s wheels (quite justifiably, IMHO). But the only proper reconciliation there would be an apology to her by the Commander.

I think what Ashantara meant was that “Uncle Beemish’s magic sword” will have no relevance, not that Magdaer is irrelevant. It is far from proven that the two are one and the same.

I suspect, though, that Magdaer is going to make it’s appearance with respect to the Ascalon ghost issue rather than elder dragons. Someday I’m sure ANet will return to that plot thread.

I’m waiting for Rytlock to admit that he ignored the part of the prophecy that spoke of the “rightful king of Ascalon” since the charr obviously do not wish to acknowledge that any human ever had a right to rule Ascalon. That would certainly explain why the cleansing ritual was only partly successful. There is still one known Ascalonian descendant of Doric living, and perhaps putting the crown and either Sohothin or Magdaer in his hands would solve the charr’s problem with the ghosts.

It’s been a while since I’ve done it, but didn’t Eir recover Magdaer during the Ascalon Catacombs dungeon story and take it to a smith to have it repaired as a gift for Logan? Nothing ever came of that, as I recall, which means it may still be in the hands of some norn smith now that Eir is dead. I would guess Braham doesn’t know this story or he probably would have reclaimed it as one of his mother’s heirlooms.

If that norn smith happens to be named Beemish, then perhaps the kid’s remark is more than just a funny throwaway bit of dialog.

There are more issues than just Mordy minions. Most zones have advanced in time beyond the original 1325 AE date. Toxic Alliance groups are found here and there, particularly in Kryta maps, and the wreck of the tower is still there in Kessex. LA is rebuilt for everyone, though the early personal story takes place in the original LA. The remains of the Marionette are found in Lornar’s Pass. Fort Salma is now closed due to tendrils and Fort Concordia is in a sad state of repair because of them, while several waypoints attacked by Mordy are still out of commission. There are posters around and eruptions of ley-line energy from events just prior to the start of Season 3. Etc.

I’m not sure there are any pure 1325-AE zones left except for Orr maps and the racial capitals. Each map has its own current point in time, subject to change. It’s a compromise, but I don’t think it’s that hard to live with for either new players or old.

I don’t know if it’s quite correct to say “this game doesn’t do phased content.” If I mine a node, it goes away for me, but not for you if you haven’t mined it. I can have story-related conversations in the open world that players around me do not hear. There is some phased content on a small scale, just not on a scale that would transform an entire map.

I’m not even sure if it could be done. What would it look like when players doing, say, LS2 are fighting a vet mordrem wolf in Iron Marches that other players cannot see? I think you’d have to move all such content to instances. What about actual transformations that have occurred in the landscape? What would it look like if some players could move through an unobstructed Fort Concordia and climb the stairs in the original towers while other players were blocked? I think issues such as these are beyond anyone’s ability to handle as phased content.

suffish.4150:

I heard he is near BfF too, but I don’t know exactly what makes people say that, can anyone tell me exactly where this has been said?

When you start the episode by speaking to the elders in the Great Lodge, Elder Ulf tells you about the region to the north and the belief that Jormag has moved to be near it, corrupting any who travel there.

I enjoy the story and like looking for details I may have missed on prior characters, as well as any dialog or other small changes that are tied to the race of the PC. There are also story rewards that you can get on multiple characters. But I can’t think of any major advantage you get from running an alt through the story outside of this. So running an alt through is not necessary, though I don’t think “unnecessary” = “pointless”.

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

Djinn.9245:

Perhaps this is typical Norn behavior, but even if it is I am very dissatisfied with it. I don’t want to see my heroes go all emo and whiny even if it is normal. This is fantasy, not reality.

I agree that it was dissatisfying. The dialogue felt awkward — “all emo” is a pretty good description. I’m okay with the idea of Braham lashing out because he’s grieving and too macho to say so, but … yeah, it seemed whiny rather than Braham-y.

My bad. I did not mean to imply that Braham’s “emo” behavior was typical for norn. I was simply referring to his idea of going up against Jormag with an uncoordinated lynch mob that has no information on or analysis of Jormag’s new abilities, no chain of command, no support structure (intel, supply, med services, etc.), and no plan other than getting to the dragon and hitting it until it dies.

I fully agree that going “all emo” is not typical at all. I can’t think of any norn offhand that has done anything similar. Just the mere act of shaving his head after Eir’s death seemed a little odd. However, he was acting normally otherwise, so I chalked it up as maybe being some norn custom, maybe akin to wearing a black armband.

I am curious to know how Braham thinks he’s going to get himself and his mob through the Bitter Cold, which surely surrounds Jormag itself, or if he’s even yet realized that this is going to be a problem. Right now the Commander seems to be the only non-Svanir in the world who knows how to make an elixir to survive it. Even the kodan and the artic quaggan don’t know. I wonder what will happen when Braham realizes this, especially after he made it pretty clear he thought it was a bone-headed stunt for the Commander to trick the Svanir into giving it to him.

Both of the new maps — Bitterfrost Frontier and Ember Bay — are in areas we did not enter during GW1. We may not even get to see the old above-ground areas, such as Abaddon’s Mouth, much less the underground areas like Battledepths and the Central Transfer Chamber.

I’m pinning my hopes more on new areas, such as the hint that Caudecus might be heading for the Isles of Janthir. (Though I still can’t figure out how Rox ran into Canach to get this info when she’s been in Hoelbrak or north of there the whole time, which seems like an absurdly indirect route for someone tracking Caudecus to take.)

You might want to have a look at the “Tyrian Characterology” series of videos on Youtube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBGk0XzqwJ4). They are a pretty good introduction to each “Biconics” character and his/her history during the course of season 1. Each character profile includes relevant video clips from season 1, so you can see some of the action and interactions with other characters. These may help you immerse yourself with these characters more than text summaries on the wiki or in game.

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

As an awkward and temporary work-around, you could keep a Bank Access Express in inventory and leave the orbs in your bank — takes an extra click or two to avoid any chance of accidental use.

Yes, I had considered that, and I usually carry some of those around too. But then using an orb takes TWO gem store items, though the bank access is relatively cheap compared to the orbs. Can you say ka-ching? ANet can!

I like the suggestion for an option to remove orbs from the defeated menu.

My characters generally carry a couple of revive orbs strictly for emergency use, such as when I’m all lone in some remote corner of a map and don’t want to waypoint far away and repeat the trek to get where I’m going. I will usually, however, prefer to waypoint since the orbs are kind of expensive.

I have been having a problem, though, since the revive orb was added as an option on screen when defeated. It sometimes seems to activate without my intent when I would rather waypoint. I think it may be related to clicking on my #3 downed skill, which I tend to do while channeling the #1 skill, and the click seems to carry through to the defeated option to use an orb.

Whatever is causing it, though, needs to stop. I can’t afford to keep replacing the darned things. Even adding an “are you sure” prompt would be better than suddenly finding myself on my feet again in a situation where I will immediately go back down to defeat.

Djinn.9245:

AriaFiresong.7023:

Personally, I think it’s a bit of an insult to Eir’s legend.
Imagine Eir watching him from the mists.
“I fought two dragons, succeeded on the second, got killed going against a third, and did my best to keep my friends together the whole time in the true manner of the spirit of Wolf, and you’re charging in blindly and trying to get your friends killed? Is that how you’re honoring my legend? With divisiveness? Did Raven bless you with the wit and cleverness of a paper towel?”

Unlike what others have said, this is more what a Norn should be thinking. Reputation is everything and Braham is being stupid and dragging his own Mother’s name through the mud as well.

I wouldn’t say stupid, exactly, but behaving like a typical norn. His mother was different and was trying to move norn culture in a more enlightened direction, but Braham is too angry to see that right now or to see that his actions are actually undoing her real legacy.

Why did Destiny’s Edge come to exist in the first place? Because Eir was seeing too many brash young norn doing exactly the kind of thing Braham is doing now, but against one of Jormag’s champions rather than Jormag itself. Those brash young norn were simply being turned into icebrood and sent back to attack Hoelbrak. Eir saw that the only solution was to form alliances, gather intel, make a plan, and assault the champ as a coordinated group. After a false start with just Snaff and Zojja, she recruited Rytlock, Logan, and Caithe to bring her team up to the necessary strength, finally winning the battle.

You would think Braham knows this story, but, if he does, its lessons have clearly been lost on him. Yet this is the same Braham who once spoke to us, back in season 2, about the value in joining an Order. The same Braham who suggested that perhaps norn thinking needed to change. Now he has suddenly regressed and forgotten his own steps along the path to the enlightenment that Eir was trying to bring to the norn.

I can see a character in a story doing this, but not without some foreshadowing. Under the circumstances it seems like a very abrupt reversal to me. Yes, he was grim and burning with anger against Mordy when we met him again in Tangled Depths after Eir’s death, but there was no indication that he would go crazy with grief and switch off his brain in the interval between HoT and season 3. I think we deserve a better explanation for what triggered this change, and perhaps we’ll get it later in the season. Perhaps it’s a setup for some revelation about something that happened while Braham was off alone after setting up the memorial service. We can only hope.

Making daily attempts when there has been no game update seems kind of pointless. It would seem wiser to wait for a game update before checking to see if the bug has been fixed in that update.

Repeatedly sending bug reports for the same bug seems kind of likely to produce nothing but annoyance for the maintenance team, since the additional reports from the same person tell them nothing they did not already know — there is a bug and it hasn’t been fixed yet — but forces someone to waste his time dealing with the duplicates. There have been a number of reports lately about strange NPC behavior in parts of the original PS as well as in parts of LS2, so it would not surprise me if these bugs are all related in some way. I doubt it will be swept under the rug and forgotten.

A single report from each person affected seems like it would be more useful, since it would at least indicate the scope of the problem and help them prioritize the fix. I think we have to understand that bugs in new content are going to affect far more people than bugs in old content and will take priority.

It’s also possible that the bug is related to some change made for the new content. In that case it’s possible it will be fixed as the new content goes through the debugging process. It’s also possible that the change is essential for the new content to work and fixing it for old content without breaking the new content might be a non-trivial job.

In short, we need to have a little patience. I’m anxious to get my newest character through the story as well and hate having him stuck on this episode. But stuff happens. Find something else to do for a while.

Manasa Devi.7958:

I noticed the home instance version doesn’t produce dragonite ore. I wonder if this is intentional or an oversight, because the fist 2 season 3 nodes do give bloodstone dust and empyreal fragments, respectively.

I don’t have the petrified wood home node, but the bloodstone home node is different from the ones in Bloodstone Fen in that it gives three blood rubies every time. The ones in BF often give you none. I don’t mind not getting dragonite from the home node, since I’m getting it faster than I can feed it to the eater already and have to destroy a bunch of it every day.

It does seem strange, though, that the home node uses that thin green sickle icon instead of the red betty icon that would show up better on the map.

Harbinger.7465:

I agree, i couldn’t beleive the things he said in the most recent living story and how he was so careless towards what happened to Rox!

At least he said thank you to Rox afterward, though he couldn’t be bothered to ask if she was okay. Not a peep of appreciation, though, for the one who worked out the mechanics of the encounter, got the scroll for him, and helped him kill the bad thing once he made it vulnerable.

Chasind.3128:

Braham acts like he had more history than our character with Eir. She was estranged to him until the moment she died. I literally cannot stand him, if there was an option to hunt him down and beat the life out of him, I’d take it.

Maybe there is one. Here’s a theory:

Braham went out alone to hunt some Jormag minions to work off his anger. He was captured by Svanir and is now tied up in a cave somewhere. The Braham that Rox caught up to and we met in Bitterfrost is Icebrood Imitation Braham™, not Real Braham. He is a creation of Svanir sorcery meant to disrupt the only effective dragon-hunting team currently in operation, as well as to betray and dishearten the race that we would expect to provide the majority of the effort in any campaign against Jormag.

So, naturally, we will find out about Imitation Icebrood Braham™, trash him thoroughly, and rescue Real Braham. Not necessarily in that order.

After all, there is precedent for such a thing. Zhaitan killed a charr Pact squad leader and replaced her with a mesmer who sabotaged Pact operations, stole supplies, sent her own troops on fake missions meant to get them killed, and attempted to ruin the Commander’s reputation. Who’s to say Jormag couldn’t take a page out of Zhaitan’s playbook?

This Post Has Been Smiley Captioned for the Humor Impaired

The norn elder told us that the myth of the fang had certain value in controlling and inspiring the young and said that “Disillusion can wait.” Well, it has waited too long, and it’s angry now. It will no longer come gently, like carefully discussion the existence of Santa Claus with a child, but will be as hard as a fall off a tall cliff.

Since before the time of Olaf Olafsson, 250 years ago, norn culture has been “Armies? Norn do not need armies! We are norn!” The average norn is highly individualistic and obsessed with staking out some area of dominance and making a legend out of it, whether it be smithing (Gunnar Poundfist, Belgarth) or the biggest collection of axes around (discussion among NPCs overheard in Hoelbrak).

Norn do have group actions, but the members have to be persuaded to come by promises of good hunting, and they operate as a mob, each with their own agenda. Olaf promised to tell everyone what “wonderful prey” the destroyers were to encourage them to fight the Great Destroyer. Knut Whitebear spoke of his sons polishing their weapons when they heard about Mordy’s minions. Nothing has changed.

The very rite of passage of the society, the Great Hunt, reinforces this culture. A large number of young hunters sets out for the qualifying round with each determined to bring back the biggest and best trophy to prove their individual skill and get into the final event. The qualifying hunters go up against the final foe as a mob of individuals, each determined to be “the” winner, not to beat the foe as a group.

Eir was one of the enlightened ones. She understood the value of coordinated group action, the value of forming alliances, and the value of gathering intel and forming a plan before action. She was attempting to bring about a cultural shift in norn society by demonstrating these values through the actions of Destiny’s Edge. That, rather than her exceptional fighting ability, is her true legacy.

Braham also showed glimmers of understanding this as he worked with the team against Scarlet and during season 2. He even spoke to us about seeing the value in joining one of the Orders and suggested it was something the norn needed to think about.

Unfortunately, he seems to have forgotten his own insights and reverted to type. He’s decided to “honor” his mother’s memory and legacy by efforts that will undo all of her work. but is too blinded by grief and anger to see that he’s figuratively slapping her in the face. It seems that he will end up being the Bringer of Disillusion for the myth of Jormag’s Tooth, and he’s sprinting towards a very tall cliff indeed.

Kal Spiro.9745:

BrettM.9062:

I would never want to be part of a guild with a leader so autocratic that they thought they had the right to control every minute of my time. Guild members have their own lives and responsibilities as well as guild membership. Jory has never disobeyed a direct order in combat, but this wasn’t a battlefield situation. The fight was over, we were not on a mission in enemy territory, and she is on her own time, fully entitled to do with it as she pleases, whether or not it seems foolish or risky to anyone else.

The primary purpose of Dragon’s Watch is to work against the elder dragons. Lazarus and the White Mantle situation are currently peripheral issues, if even that. Kick Margery out of the guild because she’s off doing something not apparently related to the guild’s charter and current investigations of Primordus and Jormag? By that standard the Commander should have been thrown out of the Pact long ago, back in the Scarlet days.

What part of, this is the first time the player has ever exerted the authority Marjory herself forced on us, did you miss? Where are all the other minutes coming from? This was one time when she is making a terrible choice that is extremely dangerous, has no reasonable expectation of a worthwhile return on her time, and ultimately puts the entire team in danger should things that could easily happen actually occur.

Also, that’s not the purpose of the guild. That’s the purpose of the Pact. The purpose of the guild is to seek ways to defeat the dragons. The most important way currently being Aurene, but also includes the magic of the bloodstones and whatever crazy ideas Taimi thinks up. Lazarus is directly connected to two of those things in this specific scene since he stole the magic of a bloodstone and is suddenly invading the area Aurene is in while the defences are down.

You denied my view on the purpose of the guild while restating it in slightly different words. The purpose of the guild is not to work against the elder dragons, but to seek ways to defeat them? Huh? Seeking ways to defeat them is not working against them?

We dropped the whole thing with investigating the bloodstone and the White Mantle the second we heard that Primordus was active. If we consider Lazarus a threat to Aurene, you sure can’t tell it by any action that we’re taking. We just let him walk (float) away. That makes the issues of the bloodstone, the White Mantle, and Lazarus peripheral to what we see as the main issues at this time. We might be worried about these things, but we’ve either left them in other hands (Canach and the Shining Blade) or left them unaddressed in any way. For now, at any rate.

What part of “we were exerting authority outside of the proper sphere of that authority” did YOU miss? We had no right whatsoever to order Marjory not to investigate Lazarus under the circumstances. Advise, yes. Order, no. Again, this is not an in-combat situation or a mission moving through enemy territory. Jory is on her own time, not on any assignment from the guild. Nor is her action interfering with any project in which the guild is actively engaged, since we are doing nothing on those issues.

Lazarus made not one single threat against Aurene. He did not “invade”, he helped defend her. If this was part of some nefarious plot on his part, then it is certainly vital that somebody keep tabs on him and investigate his activities. Is there someone better qualified than Marjory the investigator to do this? And how does her doing so “put the entire team in danger”?

Furthermore, Lazarus did not “steal” the magic from the bloodstone. He was summoned there by a bunch of White Mantle nincompoops trying to resurrect him. He prevented a horrible disaster that could have affected several major cities in Tyria. (Assuming General Soulkeeper is correct in stating that the explosion could have hit LA if it had not reversed, then what are the chances that Rata Sum, the Grove, and Divinity’s Reach would have gone untouched? All three are closer to Bloodstone Fen than is LA.)

Ider.1276:

Sylvari have no reproductive organs. Without Pale Tree (which gives birth to new sylvari) they will simply extinct. It is not about growing up, it is about survival.

I wouldn’t be so certain of that. How do you know the sylvari are sexually mature? Go look at a tree and point to the reproductive organs. I think you’ll have a hard time unless the tree is blooming. They may not have human-style reproductive organs, but, despite their humanoid form, they are not humans, they are plants. We don’t know what the possibilities are for reproduction independent of the Pale Tree, given that the race is still very young. We don’t know their natural lifespan, and it seems possible that they may be both long-lived (like many plants) and very slow to reach reproductive status.

Ashen.2907:

If I have to be in charge, if I am responsible for leadership of the group, something Marjory insisted on, then I should be able to expect others to either follow or resign from the guild. Now we know that Marjory lies to us and cannot be relied on. She should be removed from the guild.

I would never want to be part of a guild with a leader so autocratic that they thought they had the right to control every minute of my time. Guild members have their own lives and responsibilities as well as guild membership. Jory has never disobeyed a direct order in combat, but this wasn’t a battlefield situation. The fight was over, we were not on a mission in enemy territory, and she is on her own time, fully entitled to do with it as she pleases, whether or not it seems foolish or risky to anyone else.

The primary purpose of Dragon’s Watch is to work against the elder dragons. Lazarus and the White Mantle situation are currently peripheral issues, if even that. Kick Margery out of the guild because she’s off doing something not apparently related to the guild’s charter and current investigations of Primordus and Jormag? By that standard the Commander should have been thrown out of the Pact long ago, back in the Scarlet days.