Guild Wars 2

alceste.8712:

Seyiwaji.4082:

This is the wrong question.
YOU NEED TO ASK:
WHY DO YOU REGRET BUYING HO?.

I have regretted buying Heart of Thorns many times. The HoT maps are very anti casual and focused on the elitist style of play. I play irregularly so I am mostly a solo player. Trying to get skill points and mastery points is like beating your head against a desk. The story being gated behind mastery acquisition grinding. My breaking point came when I had to kill the same mobs over and over again to try and get the mastery point due to their ridiculous respawn timer.

Sounds like you made it hard on yourself.
I, too, am mostly a solo player. No guild and no friends list atm as I returned from a long absence, but I still got all the HP’s and HoT maps done. Once I realized this content wasn’t soloable, I just went to LFG and joined a HP train and LFG’s for the harder mastery and achievements. Doesn’t kill you to join a train to get them all. Don’t even have to talk to them if you’re that insistent on being that solo.
You have to be in a large group of people to do any bosses or metas on even the core maps, this is really no different.

…it wasn’t nearly as bad as I was expecting it to be (I was expecting it to be a terrible experience because I made the mistake of reading these forums beforehand). I actually ended up really enjoyed it.
I quit GW2 right before HoT was released (because of HoT). I came back to the game 2 weeks ago and got the HoT expac since it finally came down to the $20 price point I always believed it was truly worth.
I went right at it, and in those 2 weeks I have almost 100% map complete on all HoT maps (not quite 100% on 2 only due to not prioritizing the poison spec and still needing the leyline gliding spec). I’m at level 38 Mastery rank, almost have my elite specialization collection complete (just need exalted mining). I’ve gotten almost all of the achievements done, the notable exceptions being ‘gold’ in those minigames, which I’ll probably never strive for. A quick mention in map chat for help on some was always answered and help provided, like a mesmer to help get an egg to that frog in Verdant Brink in under 5 secs, for example.
It really wasn’t hard as soon as I realized this isn’t solo content. I’ve blown through almost all of it in 2 weeks. I actually enjoyed most of the maps (surprising even myself) because they weren’t flat plains like every other map. I found exploring more engaging than the core maps which tended to just be run in a straight line to whatever.

(soloing hero points because nobody plays this game anymore).

I’ve seen this sentiment a lot, worded in different ways and I just pulled this one from another topic. I don’t know how people claim this. I really don’t, unless you purposely are avoiding other people. Since I was gone 2 years, my guild disbanded and my friends gone. I did everything above with no guild or friends. I’ve done the metas successfully a number of times now, got all my HP’s using LFG and getting into HP trains (excepting the poison spec ones). I use LFG to get onto populated maps even when not needing a train or meta. There’s quite often LFG’s for achievements as well.
I was worried about getting HoT content done because I had read comments like this one before starting, but there was no issue whatsoever and always found people and groups to do the content with. Map chat and chatting with the people that help and groups has made it a sociable experience as well.

Anyway, thought I’d post up a thread that was a more positive experience for someone returning to the game and getting the expac.

I left GW2 right before HoT launched, completely due to HoT. I didn’t like the direction Anet was going and did not agree with the price of what was then an unfinished expansion.
A couple days ago, after mindlessly grinding away in another MMO, I updated and logged into GW2 to see what was happening here.
I found lots to do, WvW was active (had a queue, even), and I saw that there was a second expansion coming. The price of HoT bundled with PoF was finally something I could justify spending. And after catching up on what’s been going on with GW2 the last couple years, it seemed like Anet was back on a path I could get behind again.

I don’t regret it at all thus far. Plenty to do and see and spending far more time in game than I probably should be, lol.
I also don’t regret not buying it when it was new, now that I’ve seen it. It was overpriced for what it was, IMO. I always thought it was a $20 expac when they were hyping it up and now that I’ve seen it, I see I was right and $20 is what I ended up actually paying for it

Celtic Lady.3729:

My main problem with HoT is that I don’t feel like it’s “aging” well with fewer and fewer people playing the maps. Most players have moved on and even more will move on with PoF. This has the potential for new players to buy HoT in the future but not be able to get their characters through all the content.

This isn’t an issue. As I said, I only got HoT a couple days ago and I already have Verdant Brink 100% from an HP train and part of Auric Basin (part only due to my own time limitations and had to leave the train). I’ve done the Meta for Verdant and Auric multiple times in the last couple days too (maps have actually been full so some couldn’t even join).
If people are on empty maps, it must only be because they don’t know how LFG works.

Vayne.8563:

A restaurant advertises a certain dish. For various reasons, months later, they can’t do that dish anymore. Doesn’t matter the reasons. That’s not a scam. Unless you can prove when Anet announced it they had no intention of doing it. Then it would be a scam.

This is called kitten happens. People need to learn the difference.

No, no. This is not the same thing. If a restaurant advertised a certain dish, then I ordered and paid for said dish and then they only brought me half of it and told me I could have the rest in 6 months, maybe if they don’t change their minds by then.
That would be the same thing.

Or if you went into a restaurant and ordered chicken. That’s it. Just chicken and the condition was you had to pay for it up front and they would make it however they felt like and you had to eat it, even if it was some way you didn’t like.

Point being, Anet should have prepared the exac, advertised exactly what was in it and charged for it. Not make promises and/or wishy washy statements about whats to come and expect people to pay for it and be happy with whatever they get.

Vayne.8563:

You playing less doesn’t make it a scam. It just makes it something you didn’t like.

It does when certain content was promised and was then paid for. Regardless whatever else has arrived on time, certain content was promised and advertised as being part of HoT, when any of the content that was a selling feature of said expansion is thrown away, that could be argued as a scam. People should not be asked to pay for content that isn’t fully realized or even off the drawing board that can change on a whim overnight.

I did not purchase HoT. I walked away from GW2 and Anet when they wanted money for an expansion that was filled with more promises than actual content. In checking back to see how it’s going, I do not regret my decision at all
I’ve since purchased a different MMO. Anet has tarnished their image for their next expansion already. Regardless what they do now, people will only remember the bad and cancelled content that was promised in a previously paid expansion.

Tommyknocker.6089:

it was advertised as being an MMO unlike any other one out there, which it is not anymore.

This is 1 huge part of why I left GW2. There’s little to differentiate it from every other generic MMO out there. I started playing a few months after launch and have watched it slowly transition, adopting the common generic MMO troupes.
That’s, of course, my opinion and nothing else. But its been enough for me that I don’t recommend this one to people anymore when asked about MMO’s.

Forcing people into game modes in what was labelled a “play how you want” MMO is not a good move. It damages those game modes more than they help.
If you force people into PvP who have no interest in PvP, what happens? Those people go into PvP, do the absolute minimum they have to and then go AFK. Just watch TV or tab out and press a button once in a while to ensure you’re not AFK-booted until the match ends. Thats gotta be fun for everyone, especially the people who want to actually PvP.
The same thing happens in WvW, you get the people who do not want to be there, but are forcibly so. Only playing half-hearted, not caring about it beyond the minimum they’re forced to “earn” for your PvE goals.
It’s worse for the people who do want to be in these game modes as they are forced to play with these people.

Grim West.3194:

/agree

I’ll probably never get one of the new legendaries. But I will respect anyone that does, as long as it requires real in game effort that can’t be bought.

Whenever I see one of the old legendaries I just think they pulled out the credit card. Nothing to respect there.

I have never understood this. You don’t respect someone who has a real job with disposable income, but do respect someone who will waste hours doing content they don’t enjoy in a game to grind a virtual weapon skin? Far too much emphasis is put on “earning” and “effort” in what is a game.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Is it worth noting that Metroid Prime also was more a collection of rooms strung together with doors, and not really an “open” world? It could render only one room and the doors functioned as “loading gates” to allow the Gamecube to load the next room before it opened. (And we hate gated content here, don’t we?).

Oh, I know. Metroid Prime is not something that be compared to an MMO (MP being the superior experience, IMO), let alone being on the dated Gamecube VS modern PC’s. I was merely trying to say that a very well implemented 3D mapping system was in place on said now-dated hardware, more than a decade ago. Technology isn’t whats keeping those sorts of things from being in MMO’s.

PyrateSilly.4710:

There is also the fact that technology changes and they can now allow us to do different things like gliding or having (almost) 3D maps, jumping, etc. Things that were not really doable 10 or even 5 yrs ago.

There was nothing stopping these other than choice.
For example, gliders, and subsequently flying, are just a choice to either be included or not. The choice can hinge on design, the lore, the work of actually implementing it, or any number of other reasons, but the technology itself is not a limiting factor. The MMO Perfect World, which came out in its first version roughly 10 years ago, has always had a fully implemented character flight system, with different means of flying (wings, swords and flying animals), variable speeds and auto-pilot. Not to mention other MMO’s and games that have flight systems and 3D maps. More than a decade ago, Metroid Prime had a very well executed 3D mapping system to show where you are within the 3D world. Granted that’s a specific genre, but technology has not held back that mapping system or the platforming from being utilized within an MMO (which IMO is the kind of mapping system GW2 needs in areas with multiple levels.)

Nykravis.8342:

GW2 has been doing living world updates like every month until they started major work on the expansion. Maybe they are going to release more content spread out over the months as part of the expansion? Perhaps the story line will be opening new zones and what not?

Other companies do this….it’s called DLC. Spread out, downloadable content. A lot of times this content is charged for. The difference is that most companies don’t charge $50 for an “expansion” that lacks major features that were promised to be in it that were put off until “later” and also expect this $50 to cover additional content that may or may not come later – with no indication of how much or what that content will even be. Paying for theoretical content that I may never see or even like is a waste. Finish making the content and if it is good, I will pay for it. It’s not supposed to work the other way where I pay for something and hope you make it….let alone make it good and something I like.
A lower price point for HOT would have been better and I would even have preferred a small fee for additional DLC…..like how pretty well every other game developer does it. Like how the living story became. You paid for the additional content. Yeah, it would probably cost more in the end, but that’s not the issue, at least not for me. Because at least then you’d know what you’re paying for.

Nike.2631:

A customer believes they should have been given the product for free?

Where’s my surprised face? I left it here somewhere…

Must have lost it while you were not actually reading this topic and passing judgment when wanting something for free wasn’t even the issue here or what’s being discussed.

This is the issue some of us had. I refuse to pay for what is in it. I got so much more paying for another MMO instead that will grant me years of play.
What is in the expansion is what they are charging for. I am not going to pay Anet, or anyone for that matter, for a rushed groundwork job to expand the story and add areas and the rest of the expansion content “later”. This content cannot be “counted” as part of the expansion…..when I don’t even know what I’m paying for. If it is to be “counted”, then I am essentially being asked to pay for a game that I don’t know what will be like or what will be in it or when I’m even going to get it. “Later” doesn’t cut it and I don’t pay for promises.
Get the stuff ready and have a proper expansion release worth the price you’re asking and I’ll gladly buy it. Otherwise, I’ll wait and grab it when the price drops to a reasonable one.
People can call me cheap or wanting stuff for free, I don’t care. I will gladly pay for something that I feel is worth it and will support an MMO via cashshop purchases.
As it stands to me, HoT is just glorified, over-priced DLC.

MomentOS.2831:

I agree, suddenly my feeling of accomplishment with my Reaper is suddenly removed. Everyone and their mother will be wearing the hood I worked so hard for and overcame challenges they could not apparently. The only change I had wished for was to make the elite spec when once unlocked, account wide for those like myself with multiples of the same class.

How exactly does it take away from what you “worked” for? You still earned it, did you not? Or do you actually mean the bragging rights?
If people had done it your way, it still would been “everyone and their mother” with them, just farther down the road…..so either way was going to be the same result.

Metacritic reviews mean nothing. Anyone can rally the troops and put either a ton of good or bad reviews. There’s nothing to say those reviews are genuine. There’s nothing to say they aren’t. Some fanboys will flood it with good reviews to help his favored brandname. Some haters will flood it with negative to ‘hurt’ the brandname that so offended him. Some will review good or bad before they even give something a fair play. Some will do it blind on word of mouth of others. Some will do it after in-depth playing and giving a fair chance.

These reviews literally mean nothing. I would never use metacritic as a basis for anything.

Vayne.8563:

So all the full maps we get to are hallucinations. Just about everyone in my guild of 200 bought HoT. I think you aren’t paying attention.

Your guild has to be the happiest place in the world. Everyone always loves everything Anet does and every change to the game, everyone always seems to have the exact same point of view you do, and now pretty well everyone has bought the expansion and is loving it as well and everyone is always so happy. Must be a magical place

I’ve been following the forums since release and I am so glad I didn’t pay for this expac.
Forums may be a negative outlet, but it seems to be very overwhelmingly so for HoT.
Forums are also the gateway to an MMO purchase……no way would I go near this expac with whats on the forums, even taking it all with a grain of salt it sounds so bad. There’s probably many other lurkers who haven’t purchased it yet either and after reading all this today, probably won’t. Word of mouth can be a killer.

DaikonSamurai.6714:

http://www.ign.com/articles/2015/10/23/guild-wars-2-hits-7-million-players-as-expansion-launches?utm_source=IGN%20hub%20page&utm_medium=IGN%20(front%20page)&utm_content=1&utm_campaign=Coverstory

Front page news!

Front page news of meaningless numbers. 7million accounts means nothing. How many are active? Active accounts wouldn’t be near as hard to gauge as they make it sound. How many of that new 2million were spam bots or people making alt accounts when it went f2p? How many of those 7million have actually bought the expac? Why did only a small fraction of the 7million bother to finish the map?
Anyone can throw numbers out there to make themselves look good. PvP player participation went up by 135%? Congrats….I guess. What does that mean? Percentages mean nothing when you don’t have a baseline. Were there 100 PvP players in Nov, 2014? Or were there 1million? That 135% changes quite a bit depending on the Nov,2014 value. Funny how they avoid actual numbers in some cases.

Front page news would be any MMO developer posting any actual real numbers that actually mean something.

I’m waiting for a significant price drop before I venture into HOT and to see if they even deliver on the parts of it that coming “later”.
Not worth it for me to drop that kind of money on what’s clearly rushed and unfinished content. Especially in a household where multiple people have accounts.

Ayrilana.1396:

You seem to be under the false assumption that all games that cost $60 contain the same amount of content. They don’t and the same goes for the expansions. The amount of content from all of them vary. I paid like $50 for Super Mario Bros 3 and $50 for Mario 64. One contained 90 levels while the other contained 15. Based on your reasoning, the one that I paid that contained the 15 levels was a rip off.

The flaw in your logic is that you rely solely on quantity without considering any of the other factors. I can probably make two identical pizzas but cut one to have 6 slices and the other to have 12 slices. You’d think the one with 12 slices was the better deal.

I dont understand your example here. HoT is not GW3. Its not a new game, just as Mario 3 and Mario 64 were not the same game. A more realistic example would be if you paid $50 for Mario 64, then 3 years later paid $50 again for 3 new levels, a playable Luigi and a new moveset.

The same with the pizza analogy. They are not equal. The core game would be an 18" pizza, while the expansion would be a 12", both with the same price. Only the 12" is cut into larger pieces, and therefore “looks” like more per piece.

Vayne.8563:

It’s about what I’d expect for an MMO these days

Sadly, this statement is exactly true about GW2 now. It has devolved into just another commonplace MMO with all the standard cliches, with little to differentiate itself.

It’s not worth the price they are asking. I have no interest in the new class, I dont care about Guild Halls, dont care about the new PvP modes.
All I am interested in is the Legendary crafting and the masteries, which I’m sorry, is nowhere near being worth $50. Even if I was interested in all aspects, the amount of content is still not worth the same price the original core game was (and I might add, other full core game MMO’s, so I can get a lot more for the same $50 elsewhere).
Unless they do a price drop, I’m going to continue to play around in Vanilla until a couple new MMO’s come out early 2016.

Behellagh.1468:

MrRuin.9740:

Asgaeroth.6427:

People aren’t leaving MMOs, look at the top lists on Steam. People are spreading out to the various MMOs. TERA’s Steam launch came around the same time GW2 HoT preorders started. TERA is GW2’s main competition right now, and I’m sure more than a few people used the Steam launch of TERA to talk themselves out of buying HoT and switching games. MMO playership is growing, but there is ever more and more MMOs to play so each individual game has more competition.

There is much more to point to the contrary. Big-name MMO’s shutting down, MMO’s doing server merges, MMO’s dropping fees and prices in a desperate attempt to gain and keep players, big-name MMO’s like WoW having their populations drop substantially.
When people leave one MMO and go to another and yet more others only to find them generically the same, they eventually leave the genre entirely to play or do something else more engaging, since no developer in the MMO genre has the imagination to reinvent it or do anything substantial with it.

Raids were never in their vision for their game.

• They reworked Revenant based on the player feedback from that beta weekend.
• There’s changes coming based on the player feedback from this last beta weekend.
• Traits 3.0 is partially the result of the massive pushback from Traits 2.0.
• The Wardrobe, Account Bound Dyes, changing soulbound gem shop items to account bound are all based on player feedback.
• Remove WvW maps from world complete.

You’re upset because of a lack of confirmation you are being heard, the speed that change happens and the fact that sometimes, often your feedback isn’t what’s acted upon.

So, no mounts, dueling, race change, inspection tools, 3rd party plugins, UI customization, instant waypoint unlocks, buying the expansion with gems, removing timegates, banning flipping, price regulation, or other often repeated requests that conflict with their vision of their game.

Did you mean to quote me? Because your response has nothing to do with anything I was talking about. Nor is there anything in the other persons quote inside mine where it says anything about you’re talking about here, like raids and feedback.
AFAIK the topic was aimed at the MMO genre as a whole, not attacks on Anet that need defending (though while GW2’s direction has, IMO, contributed to the stagnation of the genre, it is but a small part of the larger problems of the genre as a whole).

Asgaeroth.6427:

People aren’t leaving MMOs, look at the top lists on Steam. People are spreading out to the various MMOs. TERA’s Steam launch came around the same time GW2 HoT preorders started. TERA is GW2’s main competition right now, and I’m sure more than a few people used the Steam launch of TERA to talk themselves out of buying HoT and switching games. MMO playership is growing, but there is ever more and more MMOs to play so each individual game has more competition.

There is much more to point to the contrary. Big-name MMO’s shutting down, MMO’s doing server merges, MMO’s dropping fees and prices in a desperate attempt to gain and keep players, big-name MMO’s like WoW having their populations drop substantially.
When people leave one MMO and go to another and yet more others only to find them generically the same, they eventually leave the genre entirely to play or do something else more engaging, since no developer in the MMO genre has the imagination to reinvent it or do anything substantial with it.

MMO’s have also lent themselves to becoming mundane chores. Login, do xx daily for xx rewards, farm xx dungeon xx amount of times for xx rewards. The conditions change, but the core remains the same, whether its dungeon grinding, mob grinding, zerg grinding, event grinding.
My life has enough mundane tasks, I want to game for fun.

PC vs Console doesn’t really matter in this case. You can play an MMO on a console (not as big a selection, but you still can). Graphics, fps or whatever don’t matter in the end. Its nice if a game is pretty, but won’t make or break it. If a game or genre is fun, people will play it. Minecraft, mobile games, resurgence in the retro “8-bit” aesthetic in games such as Shovel Knight are all proof of this. Hell, the popularity of SAB in this game proves that.
MMO’s reputation precedes it with new players and keeps some from even trying the genre. Negative playerbases, having games go pay-to-win with their cashshops, the mundane “daily” chores.
I would love to see a developer actually turn the genre on its head and revitalize it.

It has seemed like the trend the last couple of years and its not hard to see why.
MMO’s as a genre are stagnant. There’s been no real innovation or changes to it.
Sure, some will argue that this or that game has changed this or that feature, but they all still follow the same stagnant paradigms.
GW2, while claimed to be an innovator, has merely taken some of the best parts of other MMOs and combined them into one. They’ve added a fresh coat of paint to some of it, but that’s all it is. The same generic MMO cliches are still at the heartThe shift from pay to play to microtransactions has affected this as well. The developers still need to make money, so they have to walk a fine line of what to put in their cashshop (GW2 I will admit has done a far better job of this than most).
MMO’s also tend to not be enticing enough on their own for daily play. This is why most have daily log-in rewards, or daily timed items/quests to instill the mindset in the player that they must login and do dailies/get daily rewards.
Their target audience probably lends to this problem, as their target is as many people as possible, so they try be everything to everyone..
I would assume MMO population numbers to stay down until someone truly innovates and reinvigorates the genre.
Personally, I’m not even interested in this tired genre enough anymore to buy the expansion for this game.

Ohoni.6057:

GOOD NEWS! They aren’t going to charge you anything for any game that you already own. Unless you already own HoT, because they are going to charge you $50 for HoT, but anything else, the GW2 core game, for example, you get absolutely free, no charge!

Thats not good news……thats a play on words to get people to buy it. Some new player now buys the game and gets the core game plus the expansion. Its a bundle. For there to be a deal, there needs to also be the option at some point for them to have been offered separately. You are buying both for the price of $50. Neither one is "free’.
Unless you’re saying that the expansion is worth a full $50, the same price as the original core game…. but only a fraction of the content.
Can’t wait for expansion #2 – Only $125 for it…but wait! You get vanilla and HOTS for free!

Greymelken.1892:

You all talk about leaving, not buying HoT, yet you are all still here. Not leaving. Each of you has the power within yourselves to determine your own reality, to welcome into it happiness or discomfort. You have chosen discomfort. You have chosen to be angry, you have chosen to feel cheated, you have chosen to lament these percived injustices.

I’m still lurking the forums looking an indication they’re going to offer the expansion separately and not charge me full price for a full game I’ve already paid them once for. I’m not personally angry, I have no personal relationship with Anet. If they choose to gouge their players and receive bad publicity when there is a literal sea of other options in the MMORPG genre, then that’s their choice. Its simply a matter of hanging around the forums to see if they change their minds before I get settled into a new game and give my money to a different company. Yeah, I’d like to keep playing their game, but if I have to pay full price for a full game, I’d rather pay full price for a full new MMO, not a partial add-on.

Riku.4821:

The loyal players already bought the $100 value like myself; not tell people to not buy the expansion pack.

Loyal players could also be outspoken against their price point because they don’t want existing players to leave or have the game receive bad publicity.
Don’t confuse your willingness to shovel out whatever you personally believe to be “value” as a means to prove loyalty.

The HOTS expansion is the end of my time on GW2 until they ever release the expansion separately.
Theyre using wordplay to gouge existing customers. Buy the expansion and get the base game free? No. That implies you can buy the 2 separate, which you cannot, making the implied “deal” moot. New players are getting a sweet deal here, but there is zero consideration for existing players.
Sorry, Anet, but I refuse to pay for the base game I already paid for once, so now I am done with GW2 until I don’t feel like I’m being gouged for content I already paid for. Some people here may pony up whatever price you demand and even defend it, but I’m not one of them. Whether you care or not, you lost a customer. Not even waiting for the expansion to hit, its uninstalled as of now.

The Sims example applies here. Yes, each expansion required the base game……but they did not charge you to buy the base game repeatedly with every expansion. You could get the expansions cheaper by themselves or get the entire bundle if you were a new player.
Its pretty sad that EA of all companies can manage a scenario like this better than Anet/NCsoft.

Dawnbreaker.6215:

My story is more coherent.

Your “story” is just proof that you’re trolling here.

I can’t believe this topic exists.
The ‘unrealistic’ things in this game far outweigh the things that are ‘realistic’. How did the blocks float in Mario Bros? More importantly, who cares? Mario was never claiming to be based in reality and neither is GW2. Why would you come to a fantasy game, filled with dragons, magic, talking cats and where imagination is the only limit and look for ‘realism’? And even appear upset, not at the fact that its an undead dragon, in a fantasy world, being taken down by talking cats and munchkins, but that it can fly? That’s where the line is drawn? LOL
Since you were keeping score, it sounds to me that with your apparant lack of imagination, you are the one losing.

Pride.1734:

but say if you only want to do WvW where ascended does matter then you are out of luck.

Ascended is not needed in WvW at all and does not matter. The scenario where the difference between winning comes down to the minuscule difference Ascended gives you is so rare to happen, its not even worth considering. People in rares/exotics can take down people in Ascended if they’re better skilled.
In anything other than an ideally matched, even playfield with 2 equally skilled opponents, Ascended will not save you or make any discernible difference in the outcome. If you’re not skilled, you’re going to die regardless.

I hate dungeons and the elite community that usually runs them in any MMO. The dungeons in this game are especially terrible design, as many have pointed out the flaws in this thread.
PvP reward tracks were one of the best things they ever added, IMO. I’m farming dungeons skins a plenty and finishing collections without ever having to step foot in one.
Now if only they’d add a fractals track (though without set skin choosing, skin rewards and final reward replaced with the same RNG chests fractals has) and I’d be set.

Ascended serves one purpose.
It brings GW2 more in line with the MMO-genre standard of needing a stat-crawl. It is intended to give an endgame gear grind and placebo effect of ‘being better’. Any other function of Ascended could have been filled without the stat boost.

The funny thing is, the boost is not significant and not worth the cost and/or time at all, unless you really need all the slots for fractals (though in this case the stats are a slight benefit to having paid for the AR slots).
Ascended is not needed in any PvE (save fractals) or any WvW. The circumstances for that tiny stat boost to matter in WvW are so minuscule, they are hardly worth considering……one on one, similar build and skill on an otherwise level playing field.

Ascended serves its function. Gear-grind stat-crawl to bring GW2 more in line with what people expect from the genre.

Zok.4956:

MrRuin.9740:

Zok.4956:

I do not share your pessimistic view.

How is it pessimistic to assume the supposedly random drop system is actually random? Or to know what its primary function is?

I meant your view of how A-Net thinks and why they did or didn’t do/change things.

MrRuin.9740:

Its not pessimistic, it’s realistic.

Thats what every pessimist says.

I think you should look up was pessimism means.
I wasn’t being negative or conveying a negative feeling about RNG, Anet or Anets intentions at all.
Quite the opposite, actually.

Halvorn.9831:

MrRuin.9740:

And truth be told, I think the system works fine as it is. It serves its purpose in multiple functions.

The point is that human beings do not like to be constantly disappointed. With the loot distribution and the random chances that we currently have, the fast majority of the player base is constantly disappointed. Personally I don’t care for the economy of this game. If I wanted to play an economics simulation, I’d have chosen to do so. I could live with either a more reliable (“fair”) loot distribution than the current RNG or with better drop rates, even if it floods some markets.

I had one precursor drop for me in the almost 3 years I play now. While it felt great at that moment, I realized that it is nothing you can rely on or aim at. That is the reason why ANet will finally install the Precursor Collections. And IMO this is a great way to do it for other commodities as well. Rather than have one huge RNG gate with a minute chance of getting the roll, the collections consist of a lot of RNG gates with a way better chance for the roll, so you can advance in steps.

Its still RNG that encourages grinding of the same content, whether its one large one or multiple small ones, it still serves the same purpose.
Though, I agree, it works in a better way. I like the way the luminescent armor unlocked via the Silverwastes, for example, with some items you purposely collect and some are RNG based. It hardly redefines anything, but does refine it into a cleaner system, where there’s still the RNG serving its function but at the same time the player feels like progress is actually being made toward something.

Zok.4956:

I do not share your pessimistic view.

How is it pessimistic to assume the supposedly random drop system is actually random? Or to know what its primary function is?

Imagine an event like the Vinewraith or Tequatl without RNG. You go once, get exactly what you want……whats the point of going again?
With RNG, one or two people get the awesome drop each time, inspiring the others on the map to keep coming back for more and trying again and again.

Its not pessimistic, it’s realistic. And truth be told, I think the system works fine as it is. It serves its purpose in multiple functions.

ZudetGambeous.9573:

why do we have a purely random system? What’s so great about purely random? Why is that the status quo? Wouldn’t a semi-random system which broke both bad and good streaks be better? everyone would get lucky sometimes but no one would be super rich from drops or super poor from lack of drops.

This is the status quo because it keeps people grinding. Its this basic reason why Anet will not divulge their RNG, why they will not give a concrete answer and why its very highly unlikely that they would bother to set up a system that favored anyone.
If it is truly a random system, it keeps people grinding the same content as they try to get xx amount of mats or a specific item. Look at the Silverwastes during the beta key drop as an example of this.
As soon as a real pattern is revealed, the grind will stop. People will know their chances or if they are being favored or neglected. If you know your account is being neglected (beyond the superstition in this topic and with actual facts), would you continue to use it? Would you recommend to friends that the account you paid for is forever kitten ed to bad drops? Would online reviews speak highly of such a system? Would this game be recommended by anyone to pay for what may be a forever crappy account? Such a system would do far more damage to the game than any good, especially if it were revealed by Anet to actually exist.

Anets generic answer is all you’re going to get and probably answers the question most fully.
“It’s working as intended”
Its working to keep people grinding, keep people guessing, because even with superstitions people still grind for those drops since they don’t know for sure whats going on. These people are active and logged in, and that translates into numbers that make the game look good.

This is why RNG exists as it does in pretty much every MMORPG. It creates the illusion of content through repetition.

Anets response is more than most developers would give. They act like they dont care, probably because they dont.
You can go to any forum of any MMO with an RNG based system and find the exact same conspiracy theories, the same anger-fueled topics, the same debunk offerings, the same people who lay down how the coding works, the same people who start the same topics as this one.
Developers will not, very understandably, give out the specific details on how their RNG system works. You can either live with it or leave it.

I’ll never understand why people will feed this much into a toilet of an RNG system and then complain about it, when obviously they could have just bought the item they want (especially with that much disposable gold within a 2-week time span.)

Rugged D Ripper.1243:

People complain because they are scared of changes, especially when their overpowered builds are going to be basically equalized with the others. What they fail to realized is that this is a opportunity to create new builds and explore a variety of new options, if things stayed the same in a game it would not be interesting to play and people need to see that.

Like when people complain about complainers?
People also complain when there is valid reason to. In this case, from the very detailed show they gave on the changes, there are many valid points to be made against this new system. The equalization of classes doesn’t even seem to be the main concern of those complaining. Its how the new system looks to severely limit the build variety, by forcing an all-or-nothing approach to trait lines while limiting the line choices to 3 (only 2 original lines, if you go with the 3rd being elite). What they’ve shown looks to limit the builds possible even moreso than what it was before. Not everyone likes to play meta, after all.

Besides the fact that ANet has asked for people to post any and all feedback on what they showed…….why wouldn’t people give their feedback? There’s been positive and negative feedback both, much of it on valid points.

Without actually being able to try it out, from whats been shown, it looks to be a lot more limiting than it currently is.
If this is to limit meta builds…..its a poor way to do it as it limits many other builds as well. Seems like they want each class limited to be in either 1 or 2 builds and are pushing people to have to play that way. May as well just have pre-defined builds to pick from when you start your class. Why bother with traits at all if you only want each class limited?
I had some hopes when they first said they were redoing the trait system that it would open up more viable builds. Seems to be doing the complete opposite.

Thanks for confirming

I’ve never taken a liking to the Sylvari in the 2 years I’ve been playing and I’m not too worried about the expansion. It would cause too much uproar if other races were excluded in any significant way.

Quick question – I made a Sylvari a while ago just to get the racial story achieves. I’m never going to play it as I’m not a fan of the Sylvari.
If I delete it now, is it safe to assume the achieves remain completed?

Brian.6435:

Look at Silverwastes these days, it’s pretty much nothing but a chest farm train 24/7. Why? Because people can make a ton of money just running around opening chests, why do the VW when this is more lucrative. Not two months ago VW was popping off once like every hour or so.

I’m not sure where you’re coming from here. I do the Vinewraith event multiple times a day, never any problem getting onto a map doing the event using LFG. Yes, there’s LFG for chest maps too, but seems to be a balance between them.

Chest maps are boring beyond belief. I already have incentive to not do this, I don’t play a game to be bored out of my mind following someone with a shovel.

I would leave and I believe a huge portion of the population would as well.
A subscription model is not the current standard and not many games can maintain one anymore, as is evidenced by the games that have been trying to, but going to a free-to-play model within a year, or less. If big names like Star Wars and Elder Scrolls can’t do it, and the juggernaut WoW showing dropping numbers , there’s not much hope for Guild Wars to do it either.

Moldur.6275:

First public HoT beta and it happens to be right on GTA V PC release day.

Anet, not sure if you did this intentionally but it just causes frustration when you could have easily chosen another day.

Anet could ask you if you intentionally did not play GTA V for the last year its been out, on 4 different platforms and waited until they had a beta to do to gripe at them. Its causing them frustration. This scenario is about as likely as the one that they did this intentionally. GTA V is a re-release of a year old game that is unrelated and does not even compete in the same genre.
Sounds like you need to manage your game time better….or loosen up about it some, if something like this is actually causing frustration.

Prototypemind.4026:

Is there any real point to them other than achievements? I don’t find them particularly enjoyable, especially if I’m on my Norn, and I’ve yet to get anything better than a few blues. Just doesn’t seem worth the frustration if you don’t get entertainment out of the puzzles themselves.

Not really. Though you can have a daily chest pretty easily if you have alts you dont really use. I know people who park alts at the end of jp’s and just leave there to login once a day to loot the chest. Also, people do this with a mesmer alt on certain jp’s (that allow a port) to provide a once a day port for friends and guild mates to the end of a jp.

Nezia.8154:

• Questing is easier with the heart system compared to old-school questing system where you have to backtrack everything.

• No Trinity! You are independent! No more having to search for healers or tankers. And as for me, I’ve always been forced to play a healer because of this, and I hated being a healer. Now I can be anything I want to be!

• Gain exp/loot/quest credit on enemy tag. Other MMO’s have the first-hit or last-hit reward system in killing mobs. It’s annoying! In GW2, just tag it and you can get rewards.

• Can only bring 10skills at a time. Unlike other mmo’s where the sky is the limit on your skillbar! No thinking required. Just fill that skillbar!

*Questing is easier, but its still the same system with a fresh coat of paint. It’ll be nice when an MMO comes out that actually changes this system.

*No trinity, but the game is lending to meta builds being required (by the playerbase) for instances, which just as bad. Yes, this can be avoided, but its still a tendency that this game has not figured out how to avoid – though they have lessened it from the trinity problems.

*Gains on tagging…..blessing and a curse. Leads to a lot of tag-and-go-afk gameplay on bosses and events. Lends itself to leeching players who lets others do the work as long as they tag it, they get the same reward for nothing. Better than in most other MMO’s, but still has its share of problems.

*Only 10 skills at a time, making no-thinking required is probably quite a ranged preference. No-thinking required isn’t something I look for in an MMO…or any game, really.

GW2 has honed and put a fresh coat of paint on many aspects of the MMO-genre and does it well, though many of their solutions are still carrying some forms of the same flaws inherent to the genre.

Fyrebrand.4859:

The thing is, whether Tequatl is “challenging” or not has little to do with any individual’s skill level. It is entirely about what time of day it is, how many people happen to pop into your map, and if you got lucky enough to get people who are semi-organized and understand the basic structure of the event. Beyond that, it really doesn’t matter how good a player you are. You either need to be in a large, organized Tequatl-killing guild, or just get lucky with map RNG. Is that “challenge”?

World bosses are, by definition, large-scale encounters. As in, the individual means nothing — the masses rule. There is some degree of coordination required, but in general you are dealing with random members of the public who cannot be depended upon to know the fight or perform efficiently. Sorry, but that is always going to be the reality. I suppose it’s a shame, in some ways, but it would be incredibly infuriating if every world boss were on this level. No one would ever see these events through successfully, except for a couple of hardcore guilds. I know there are a few people out there who are in love with that concept, but it really isn’t the reason anyone makes an MMORPG.

If you want a chance to truly shine and prove your performance as an organized, highly-skilled individual or small group, go for dungeons, fractals, some elements of WvW, or sPvP. That’s where the true skill tests lie. For large guilds, there is off-hours Tequatl or Triple Touble Wurm in the open world as guild-spawned events. Otherwise, I really don’t know why you expect to gather together large swaths of the general population and expect them to come together as highly-trained, in-synch, well-oiled killing machines.

Why should we expect that? Because it happens now, many several times a day.
The biggest counter-point to what you’re saying is the Vinewraith. It is a map-wide event that requires many people knowing what to do to successfully complete….and it is done, many several times a day. So many, that it is a farming event.
Whats the difference between Vinewraith and Tequatl/Triple Wurm? The payout.
Vinewraith, the events leading up to it, and the events after it all payout a large portion of chests, champ bags and other kinds of loot. Vinewraith takes longer, needs more coordination, and is all around a tougher boss.
The payout is all it takes to motivate people to be that well-oiled machine. Tequatl and Triple Wurm don’t pay out nearly as much, so not nearly as many go to them or bother. But if you increased the loot to be on par for what Vinewraith is giving, I would bet that all of a sudden these bosses are not so hard and get farmed.

Kedarrian.2905:

The only title i respect seeing is Dungeoneer (I didnt play GW1 so dont appreciate the titles). Dungeoneer doesn’t sound awesome compared with say ‘The Annihilator’ but it means so much more.

I agree with previous comments on Dungeon Master really not counting for much. I interpret someone wearing it as saying the feel confident about all Dungeons because if i had that title, i still wouldnt wear it if I didn’t feel so. But that’s just my outlook. Inherently, it’s not an impressive title.

How does the Dungeoneer title grant more respect than the Dungeon Master one? I may be wrong, but can’t the Dungeoneer one be had without ever even stepping foot inside a dungeon, via PvP reward tracks?