Guild Wars 2

redslion.9675:

If an enemy reaches you with greatsword, swaps weapons and uses stuns, you can be SURE he won’t be able to 100b you.

Not entirely true. If they are not in combat when they swap from GS to mace, they can swap right away. You can swap in the middle of the animation before you hit your target, stun, then swap back. Take timing but it can be done.

Garbage.

Fifteen letters.

Fenrir.5493:

COUNTERS: … if you cant use a stun break, a teleport a blind or anything that makes you invulnerable, then that is totally your fault and deserve to suffer the 100b damage, if you can manage to get rid of the stun or negate it by any of those many counters then you will have a really good amount of time to destroy the warrior completely because he has nothing, read, NOTHING to do, this build relies on other people stupidity, to land a full 100b, its their main source of damage, in the meanwhile they do nothing to you, and guess what?, in order to this build do good damage he needs to be using a berserker amulet that would hurt but if you manage to counter the stun it will die so fast that he will not have a chance to land another skull crack.

If the warrior is tanky, then the damage of the 100b will be a lot more forgiving and will not get a lot of your hp, unless you are a glass canon and then HOW IS THAT A WARRIOR PROBLEM in the first place, that is YOUR CHOICE.

I have been using this build to some extent and good players use teleports, stun breaks, chill,cripple to stay away, mesmers shatter to make themselves invulnerable or daze to interrupt, thieves spam blinds and makes you fail docens of skull cracks, elementalist use a lot of stability and of course stun breaks, necros and rangers put fear on you, i one time met a thief that put fear on me (idk how he managed to do that really), other warriors use stability or endure pain, guardians have aegis and a lot of blocks actually, the fact is that all classes have stun breaks, evasions, teleports something to make this build suffer a lot, you just need to exploit them.

Like i said, this build relys on other people mistakes, if the warrior is wining then for sure he is outplaying you and thats it, you need to learn to loose, and learn how to use better your class and abuse it.

Just to anser how that thief put fear on you, they mugged a necro and held on to it. Thieves get something specific from the class they mug. They get whirling axe from warriors.
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For the OP,

My opinion on this build, bring stun breakers, watch out for what the warrior is going to do. It should’t be difficult to deal with. As far as other classes that don’t have stability, so what, warriors don’t have stealth like the thief, blind like a necro, aoe like a ele…in other words, some classes will handle this much easier if set up correctly others may have a little harder time but I wouldn’t worry too much unless you are a really bad player. The weapon attacks are very well telegraphed for this build and you have to be totally ignorant to the game to not be able to handle this build.

Just like I tell people complaining about thieves, learn to play.

I like dailies.

You don’t have to do them.

You are not forced to log into the game to do them.

Even if you do log in to do them, they don’t typically take more than 30 minutes and all you have to do is just run around and play. Yes, you may need to work a particualr area like kryta or shiverpeaks, but you still don’t really have to go far out of your way to do them.

I like dailies in this game. They are easy to get done because I’m going to do most of that stuff anyway and since there is a list to choose from, I can typically find 5 on that list that I’m going to go and do anyway.

And why are there areas on the other side of the Sea of Sorrows tied to Maguma jungle when they are not close to maguma jungle?

I have dropped a paper thin distance and died and I had full health before I dropped that paper thin distance.

If I have Fear me or earth shaker ready, usually fear me is my go to, and I see a thief shadow refuge, I run right in there and do my thing. I like fear me the most since it puts them on a revieled after using a skill with a long cool down when they get feared out of the refuge.

I love shadow refuge.

DeadlySynz.3471:

There are a lot of things that need to be either removed or toned down in general in WvW.. in this case downed state should be removed, and stealth toned down drastically.

Other things that should be done: Stability, condition, and retaliation duration should be cut in half. Healing effects and retaliation damage should be cut in half.

Aside from that, just removing downed state alone would completely shake up the rankings in WvW.

Since we are going to just remove a bunch of stuff, we should all just be given a stick for a weapon that does only 2 points of damage, a diaper and binky for armor that only reduces damage by 1 point, .5 a point if you only have 1 of the 2, and everyone should be HP capped at 10 points.

I think you should be able to shoot downward without it being “out of range” or obstructed by that little lip. If I can see my target, it should not be obstructed. Having to jump on that little ledge is goofy and any pull can get you from there.

I think that defend should be cumulative or in some way that you defend for so long the reward for defending gets better each time.

After seeing some numbers on rank, I can agree that it would be much better if it was account.

I will never bring in a different class to WvW with it character bound. I don’t want to give them up.

Either make it account or greatly increase the WXP.

Svarty.8019:

CreativeAnarchy.6324:

Svarty.8019:

This is a part of the larger problem: thieves in general.

They require a lot of attention from Mr Peters and co.

Thieves are fine.

If by “fine” you mean “overpowered”, I agree.

No, not overpowerd at all. They are fine. I have no issues dealing with them most of the time. Rest of the time, I wasn’t paying attention and don’t have my 1v1 weapon set ready.

Svarty.8019:

This is a part of the larger problem: thieves in general.

They require a lot of attention from Mr Peters and co.

Thieves are fine.

Vuziiness.9458:

The only reason JQ couldn’t stand there own against SoR and BG last time is because they would team against us, like quite literally attack the same point at the same time, knock us out and then fight for it.

JQ hasn’t been a serious threat for some time.

Several of us on BG wanted to get you to double team SoR with us since they were more of a threat. If you got double teamed, you all did something wrong.

I would not object to the removal of the downed state.

You should also note, if it was a class with stability, invulnerability or any other immunity, you would still be dead and your skill would still not work.

Your server has had a lot of people play WvW in the past. Seems more have come out for your current match. What did you really expect when you have a high population that plays WvW?

Amir.1570:

Amazing how people are literally defending whirling axe when spamming Axe 1 is much better DPS on top of having an off-hand Mace for vulnerability stacking for quicker dungeon speed runs. I can’t tell if its stupidity or ignorance.

Seriously this skill needs help, its a counter productive skill in PvE and PvP because Axe 1 is just better DPS. It is a clear imbalance within the weapon set, there is no argument if you do the math.

It is just inexcusable that you think this skill is productive when its realistically counter productive.

I like the animation, especially with a fire field. I only use it in PvE and in PvE, who really cares? I wouldn’t mind a bit of extra damage but I’m not going to stop using it just because of that.

I don’t go to reddit. Don’t care for the site.

I need a TLDR.

That being said, I only bought them for the skin.

If you have 5 mobs, whirling axe isn’t bad and fills up adrenaline quick.

I wouldn’t mind it doing more damage though but I’m not sure what trait set you are using. I’m not seeing anything out of the 9k range and I’m doing good when I do whirl over 9k.

No.

All these ideas do is give tools to the players that want to grief by putting us over the limit.

Other areas like bay, hills, garrison are a small confined space and even with coordinated groups, players will still cause the other groups to have a debuff.

If you really want to suggest something to reduce the tendancy for players to group, you should be looking for a positive suggestion, not something like this.

I happen to like massive battles, your groups size is too small. 100 zerg limit is much better than what you are suggesting.

You don’t need to ruin the game for those of us that like large fights. You can always form up your own small army and lead on your own. People <gasp> actually do that without being forced to do that.

Most of that stuff was changed after spiked fruit and golem in a box.

You can try one to see if you can deploy it.

Sword users have a shadow step available. Looks like a teleport.

There is also a skill and a trap(I think) that also does the shadow step teleport thing.

Have to check their weapon to tell what they will be using against you, skills you won’t know. I think the skill is a medium length(30 second) cool down(not totally sure on cool down duration though.)

I think they should flap faster when running and slow when standing still.

I like landmind idea.

I don’t sympathize with groups that are not interested in placing a sentry and I don’t mind golem rushes. Been on the giving and recieveing end.

I do like the landmine idea.

I think too many are bagging on the developers when it takes time to get the data to be able to do something. Data gathering doesn’t happen overnight and sometimes it can take a year to get enough to understand where the problem(s) are. It isn’t like you can just look up code, which there is a lot of, and point to the problem.

CrazyDuck.4610:

It would make it alot less frequent if it cost a real $20 not in game currency “worth”. And low tier servers cost the same as transferring to high tier aslong as its “high” population.

I still paid cash for the gems when I transferred.

People don’t care if they are not happy with where they are at.

I don’t care if people want to transfer or not. They bought the game just like everyone else and if they are not getting out of it what they would like where they are at and changing will make them happy since they will get what they want there, why should they stay?

Do you really want people to stay on your server that are not happy to be there? Do you really want to keep people not interested in working with the rest of the server since they are not happy to be there yet can’t get off because the cost gets to be too much? Could be the server has too many PvE players and not enough WvW players. Could be the server has too many RPers or casual WvW players. Could be the guild(s) want to fight other guilds and are bored with the rotation they have now.

Preventing or raising the cost of transfers won’t solve any one’s problem unless that person or group is getting out of it what they would like.

No thanks. There already is a siege cap and it is fine as it is.

You have it backwards OP. Forcing people to stay on a server they don’t wish to be on would kill the game.

People transfer for their own reason.

Some want to be on a server with good coverage around the clock. There are only going to be a few servers that can provide such coverage because the players in the off hours are much fewer than the primitime for those servers. Spreading these people out won’t make them happy since they won’t have the same numbers to play with or fight against.

Some want to play against certain guilds. Some want to work with certain guilds.

If a player doesn’t want to be on your server, why do you think forcing them to stay or forcing them to spread out is going to be a good thing? I’d quit or start griefing the server I was stuck on if I couldn’t play where, with whom, and against whom I wanted.

I don’t care about any server I’m on. I care about the guild I’m in. I will fight for my server since that is the team that I’m on but if my guild decided to go to a different server if my current server isn’t living up to expectations, then I will go with my guild.

Nothing is stopping you from transfering to a server that is offering the competition or coverage that you seek. If you don’t want to move, that is your problem.

Nikola.3841:

Its actually childish to be offended by it, lol

Also childish to do it.

It is bad players doing it. They have an ego to stroke so they emote spam when they roll over one player with ten of theirs since they know they suck and can’t do anything else.

You can also emote spam them if you want to lower yourself to their level.

Kreten.9208:

And I do not lack imagination. All it would take is one player that does not care if they die or not, they just want to grief.

And thus proving my point. Sigh. Ok i will explain as if you were five. Storytime.

Btw, CreativeAnarchy i’m assuming that you read the entire post before answering, if not then this is not for you, please do not respond in that case.

Before we begin, someone mentioned an average guild group size of 35, ok lets go with 30 as the limit before things get confusing (ie debuff) Also, lets make it clear, my suggestion would in no way kill a zerg if it wanted to do it. But there would be a cost for zerging.

For those of you who are just joining us, my suggestion was that every-time you use an ability a check is made to see how many friendlies are in range of the ability. For every 10 people above the zerg limit you would stack 1 or 2 confusion on yourself.

The Zerg Story

We have an imaginary guild called. Small Collective Psyche [SCP], and SCP really like to zerg. And when they get their zerg going, they are unstoppable.

Now, SCP read patch notes one day, they see that running around as they usually do causes confusion, but they still want to keep 60+ people together.
What do scp do? Well grasshopper, they adapt.

SCP know that if they split the zerg up into three groups, 3 groups of 20 that stay about 900 – 1200 away from each other, now they don’t risk getting griefed or confusing themselves , yay being smart.

When they get to a gate at garrison, they make sure that they dont bunch up in front of the door to minimize accidental zerg limits. They also know that the defenders will also need to watch themselves, so that when SCP eventually get the gate down, they cant all be stacked in the lords room.

SCP did something never before seen in WvW: Tactics, movement discipline, formations. SCP cant get griefed, they are too smart for that.

The End

Also, and this is entirely aimed at CreativeAnarchy, if you see a problem with someones suggestion. Please ask them how they view that problem and ask if they have suggestions to counter that problem, instead of breking out in a sweat and getting heart palpitations because “teh griefers, you are stupid, i know best”

“Hey Kreten, how do you solve the griefing that could happen with the zerg confusion?”

Something like this.

Sigh. You just don’t live in reality. It must be nice to live in rainbow and unicorn land where no one is going to come along to grief you people. Must also be nice to have a server that doesn’t have trolls.

You are also describing organized guilds that train, not a commander with pugs that are not in team speak that can only play so often and don’t train with guilds for whatever reason they don’t.

It doesn’t matter how small any kind of debuff is, people don’t care to have a condition just because of x# of people in a area.

All your suggestion to do so will only cause more problems and give another troll tool.

Not only that, there is a lot of ebb and flow in these battles. Do you even play the game? To really think that groups will be able to maintain that small distance you suggest, well you are out of your mind. The second level in garrison is within the range you’ve suggested, most of inner garrsion would be a debuff zone.

But you also lack imagination, as proven by your post because you can’t seem to grasp the ramification of your suggestion. You can only see what you want to accomplish because you don’t care for a particular aspect of WvW.

Paulytnz.7619:

Farm keys via the lvl 10 quest if you really want/need them. 1 run can take 30-40 mins solo and a lot quicker if doing with friends. Find a guide or look on youtube they are out there.

what quest?

I don’t mind farming for the keys.

Breathing ruins WvW. I swear it does. Everyone need to just hold their breath and it will all be ok. Can’t just be one person, it has to be everyone.

Yea, I’m not buying gems for keys.

I would have bought gems with real money to purchase the skins I wanted.

Obscure One.4357:

CreativeAnarchy.6324:

LilMcGinley.3890:

I would assume, at least I think of, people wants debuffs for groups of 50, 60 or even 80… 30-35 would be the ‘average’ guild group size so this doesn’t/wouldn’t effect them unless they all want to run together in a 600 range (which is really small for 50 people)

I like those garrison fights were all servers have a full map zerg.

I like all the fights that are that big, garrison just happens to be my favorite.

I prefer the open field.

No siege. No towers. No camps. No keeps. Just us versus you and a whole lotta bags in one of our near futures. A straight up fight is the most fun you can ask for in WvW, provided the skill lag doesn’t show up to make it miserable for everyone.

Honestly, it’s just overdue for a GvG 25 vs 25 mode that contributes to the winning server’s world score…but I guess its asking to much of Guild Wars 2 to give us guild wars…clearly I’m filled with unrealistic expectations.

Usually when BG garrison has a full map zerg from all servers, it typically is swissed and lacking siege.

I like the multiple levels that garrison has. I like open field also, I just the like garrison the most.

LilMcGinley.3890:

I would assume, at least I think of, people wants debuffs for groups of 50, 60 or even 80… 30-35 would be the ‘average’ guild group size so this doesn’t/wouldn’t effect them unless they all want to run together in a 600 range (which is really small for 50 people)

I like those garrison fights were all servers have a full map zerg.

I like all the fights that are that big, garrison just happens to be my favorite.

A while back someone proposed allowing the winning group to burn the corpses to force a respawn. I like that idea the most because it would be the most interesting way and fun for the victors.

Kreten.9208:

My post, about the 1 confusion stack for every ten people over the limit of 20 in the range of the skill one uses, was the reason for this thread i guess.

I did not mean to cause panic. The chances of arenanet seeing my suggestion, deciding to implement it as is with no thought to balancing issues and thus ruining your 60+ people blob for ever, are slim to none. Rest assured, game developers have some experience in these matters and i believe there are conference rooms and powerpoint presentations involved in the process. Now do you feel better?

As to your argument about people trying to stay under the limit and being griefed by people running into their not quite zerg shows the lack of imagination. The confusion would apply to everyone, attackers and defenders alike. New tactics would be needed, spacing and formations would be required.

Large scale battles would not disappear because 50 people running around kitten to face nuking everything would get confusion.

And in my opinion, anyone that so desperately clings to a broken mechanic deserves to be debuffed.

In my thread you wrote:

Just because you don’t like something doesn’t mean you need to suggest something so stupid that it would ruin a lot of fun for the rest of u

If there is something in the game that i feel needs changing, and i have an idea of how to change it, and i think it makes sense… I will most definitely post it here. What is the alternative? Reading other peoples suggestions and ragging on them in the vain hope that you one day find one you agree with?

That was the final straw actually. I’ve seen too many suggestions that were really bad ideas.

And I do not lack imagination. All it would take is one player that does not care if they die or not, they just want to grief. You are lacking imagination if you cannot see how this will vilify those that are new and don’t know about mechanics but just wanting to learn, those that just want to cause as much problems on the server they are playing against because there are spies and others that just want to cause problems.

Also don’t need to be debuffed just because my guild is running together and we happen to be over those limits you people are so hell bent on imposing.

You and anyone else that thinks applying a debuff to other players are the ones that need to be nerfed. Let you people play with that, I’ll play without the stupid debuff.

If you make a sensible suggestion that encourages smaller grouping without applying anything negative to other players, I would support such a suggestion. I have no problems with positive suggestions but not something that is going to penalize other players.

As I’ve understood it, there is a time limit but people get around it by switching gear(I think this was it.)

Dawdler.8521:

… or maybe instead of further making the GUI into a fireworks display of different colored circles that no one in their right mind can keep track of in combat… you remove all nametags from killed enemies thus cleaning up the view considerably.

You’re trying to use a nuke to kill a kittenroach.

I’d still like to tell if someone is downed or not. Helps for spiking or resing.

I can agree with removal of names when dead. I like that a bit more than a different color.

Yes.

I need to put 15 characters in this box.

Xsorus.2507:

fighting a zerg 45 to 85 isn’t terrible because you’re outnumbered

Its terrible because of all the crap mechanics in the game that make Zerging so much more effective.

AOE Cap, Downed System, Boon System (Crap tons of Retal) ect ect..All these add up to a system where stacking into a huge ball and spamming a bunch of blast finisher’s on top one of one another for boons followed by running over smaller numbers because your AOE’s are more likely to hit a larger % of their force then they will hit of yours hence your AOE’s are more effective, followed by a Down system that lets large numbers of people instantly res (Thus inflating the numbers of the zerg even more)

This is why people suggest things to counter the zerg, Because the zerg right now is vastly over rewarded..

It needs some major negatives added to it to make up for all the positives it currently has.

It has been stated in the past that WvW was about large scale battles.

I happen to like those battles.

There is more involved than what you describe. It isn’t all about pressing 1 if you can get other skills working. I use a variety of skills to deal with the other zerg when we don’t have lag(it does happen.)

If you want to suggest something to encourage small groups, that is fine but it should be something that does not add a negative just because of x# of players because that will just lead to other problems that would impact the game in a much more negative manner.

LilMcGinley.3890:

The rebuttal to a debuff is math…?

EDIT: I understand what you are saying. I posted this exact reason (server drama/player griefing) as why something like this wouldn’t be implemented. It’s the same reason outnumbered buff doesn’t give stat increases.

Sadly, as long as “more people less problems” is the meta, people are going to be looking to change it. It’s not skillful, people don’t enjoy fighting in huge lag-fests outnumbered 80 to 45. It’s not fun. I, personally, am glad people have been very vocal about wanting to spread out the player population, if not on a server basis but on a per-map basis.

I don’t think it is a stupid suggestion, almost no suggestion is stupid, if it is implemented correctly and very gradual, something like this could work.

The bad part is hitting multiple objectives is a WAY more efficient use of man power but it isn’t as easy.

The skill lag isn’t because of zergs.

Skill lag is a server problem. Zergs just make it show more.

Skill lag should be fixed with a server fix, not a player grouping fix. Any skill lag fixed for WvW will also fix the skill lag in PvE. It would be nice to do a Shatter, Teq, any other boss event without having the skill lag present(not that it would change those events from auto attack anyway but it would still be nice.)

Skill lag is what a lot of people blame and something they often want to fix with their suggestion but it doesn’t fix the actual problem, it would still be a band aid for what really needs to be fixed.

Those suggestiong cause more problems than they are worth. Think before you post them because it is obvious they are not very though out.

Here is why.

We have enough people on the server causing grief by using supply to siege cap and waste supply.

We don’t need to give these people another tool to cause problems.

If a debuff is applied because a group of players are in a area, all it would take is just that one player to put a group over the limit.

Then there is the defense. Say guild x left so many people in hills to defend and the rest to apply pressure. Hills get attacked so now so that we don’t get a stupid debuff, the commander will have to do some math and leave behind the group applying pressure. Add to that the rest of the server that happen to enjoy hills defense so they come along to help and instead they hinder because of a stupid debuff suggestion. So now we also get server drama because people wanted to help but didn’t know they were going to cause more problems than actually help.

These things are dumb. Quit suggesting them because they cause more problems than actually help.

If you want to encourage something other than a zerg, come up with something else.

I happen to enjoy all aspects of WvW, I don’t care to see the zerg portion ruined just because some of you people don’t like it.

These kind of suggestions do not make sense because we have enough people causing grief with siege, we don’t need someone to cause other players to have a debuff or condition.

A group would be working to keep the numbers down under the limit and all it would take is a player to put a group of players over the limit and cause the condition.

So, now we would have siege griefers and then we would give those players another tool to grief the rest of the map. Good going.

Just because you don’t like something doesn’t mean you need to suggest something so stupid that it would ruin a lot of fun for the rest of us.

No this is not logical nor does it make sense.

All it would then take is that 1 more person to cause a large group of players that are trying to not be over the limit and we already have enough people griefing others.

You cannot use debuffs as a way to counter something you don’t like. That is just plain stupid.

I like having the coverage that my server enjoys.

Only reason I would move would be if my guild moves and most enjoy that coverage also.

It would be too much.

While I have dreamed of a third set so I can keep my sword/warhorn handy, overall it would be a bit much and make warrior a bit too good

I don’t see them having such an impact that you all decided to quit. I think they were just looking for an excuse.