So today I logged into Lake Doric map and saw a commander, so I thought, “hey I need some leather so ill join the farm”…. I was not impressed to say the least. There were at least 40 Engineers there with hundreds of turrets just sitting. This has got to end. By making a class mechanic usable, its gets abused. So after much thought, I’ve come up with the simplest way to end all afk farming; REMOVE THE AUTO CAST FEATURE. It doesn’t get used but for people to abuse the system. This one simple thing that no one uses can easily be turned off and no one but the AFK farmers will be affected. No one says “oh let me stand here and hit 1 and walk away from the boss.” It doesn’t always stay on even when used. Also, no one uses auto cast to set off their other skills either.
Let’s get Anet to make Tyria Great Again!
edited: auto cast, not auto attack
I have stated before that IMO since not every character has the ability, no character should have the ability to automatically respond if attacked.
However, I don’t think this would solve the Engi farm since afaik they have to purposefully cast and recast the turrets.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
There’s a bug in the wiki software adding up the points, so this note is appropriate for the talk page so the wiki gurus can fix it.
Which is why you should always report wiki discrepencies on the relevant talk page (even if you also mention them elsewhere).
So you are saying that the total expressed in the text above the list is a formula?
Assuming that is true, I wouldn’t have any way to know that – I thought a person wrote that into the text. I also didn’t know it was “wrong” (therefore my question), so I wouldn’t presume to say so in the wiki talk.
However, it is a generally good note that if you do see something wrong with the wiki to bring it up in the Talk page.
I was just trying to provide you with an explanation; I didn’t expect anyone to realize it was a formula.
I went to look at the page to figure out why it was wrong — if someone typed in a bad number, I was planning to update it with yours (after verifying, of course ). It was only after the research that I figured out it used a formula and that seemed to be broken. (And that’s where I’m out of my depth — couldn’t figure out how to fix it.)
This is among the reasons why it’s best to ask the question on the wiki — someone there will figure it out (and if not, you can always ask here or reddit etc).
I want to actively encourage you to engage with the wiki community. I really didn’t mean to shut down your question or discourage you from asking here — I’m sorry that it might have come across that way.
And it’s always better to ask on the wiki talk page, regardless of whether you are sure or unsure about whether it was a typo, a mistake, someone failing to update a previously true number, or something you might have missed.
Ok, I added a comment to the wiki talk page. Thanks.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
There’s a bug in the wiki software adding up the points, so this note is appropriate for the talk page so the wiki gurus can fix it.
Which is why you should always report wiki discrepencies on the relevant talk page (even if you also mention them elsewhere).
So you are saying that the total expressed in the text above the list is a formula?
Assuming that is true, I wouldn’t have any way to know that – I thought a person wrote that into the text. I also didn’t know it was “wrong” (therefore my question), so I wouldn’t presume to say so in the wiki talk.
However, it is a generally good note that if you do see something wrong with the wiki to bring it up in the Talk page.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
Wouldn’t this be more apt for the Wiki’s Talk page?
Well, I would like the general forum population to have the opportunity to answer if they have information. This question is about the Wiki on it’s face, but the underlying question is about the total number of HoT Masteries.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
I was just analyzing the list of HoT Mastery Points to see which would be easy for me to get. I copied the list from the wiki page to a spreadsheet and saw that there actually were only 189. The top of the HoT section says there are 217. Just in case my copy / paste was off I counted the MP on the actual web page. Again I got 189. There is nothing on the web page to say what the other 28 MP are or where I could see a list of them.
In addition, 5 MP are listed that do not count toward the live game: the Beta MP. If you click on one it says “Notes: As with other rewards during the beta, these achievements were not transferable to the main account.”
So at the very least we need to remove the 5 Beta MP from that list of all “available” MP.
But assuming that this is actually the entire list of HoT MP available, without the 5 Beta MP the actual total is 184.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
Is supposedly a list of all MP. The HoT list which starts by saying there are 217, includes the “HoT: Act 1” through “HoT: Act 4” story MP. There is nothing on that page to say why it says there are 217 but then only lists 189.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
Is there any way to disable the popup that appears when you exp bar is full and a mastery is ready to train? It appears in bottom left with a big orange !
I am playing through the story and dont want to go to HOT to unlock masteries until I have finished lw2 but this stupid hint is appearing every 5 seconds on my screen and is making the game unplayable.
I believe I stopped that this way: open your Hero window and go to the Masteries tab and switch to a different mastery. You can’t gain XP in it but it will stop that notification. Of course when you are on the last Mastery you won’t have a different one to switch to.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
No you want to do them to attain some frivolous rewards, making them completely optional.
Mastery points are frivolous?
Considering how many excess ones we have, yes chasing the ONE located in a JP when you know you hate JP’s is not only frivolous but an exercise in insanity.
You’d think if you hate platforming, you’d i don’t know here NOT do that part and chase the literally hundreds of other alternatives.
But the rest are hidden behind in game games (mini games) so you have to do JP or Mini Games which really shouldn’t be part of the Mastery System in my opinion. This is forcing you to do one or both of these content types.
I go with the group that says give JP specific Achievements or Mini Game specific Achievements, even chests with awesome loot. Just don’t make them needed for Mastery’s that are tied to the flow of the general game and stories.
You yet again do not have too. You are literally choosing to frustrate yourself.
You can get enough masteries without ever touching a JP. Heck by now im pretty sure you can get enough without ever going above silver in adventures.
According to le wiki
There’s a total of 217 available points for HoT, and it only requires 137 to max out. That’s 70 OPTIONAL masteries. 30 of which are in Adventures…..
Yep totally required and forced content!
I have a problem with the Wiki page: I copied all of the HoT Mastery Points to a spreadsheet to analyze them and only came up with 189. So I counted the list one-by-one on the actual web page (in case something went wrong with my Paste) and only came up with 189.
Anyone know why this would be? There is no mention of this discrepancy on the web page.
The web page also lists 5 “Beta” MP which were only available during the HoT beta and were not carried to Live (according to the wiki). Not sure why they are even listed if they don’t count even for those who got them.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
Ah, yeah I guess I didn’t even consider those jump puzzles because they require almost no effort. I stand corrected.
They may require almost no effort for you. For someone like me who never does JP because even difficult Vista’s are too difficult, they are not “almost no effort”. But I guess the standard for these things is only from the POV of those who like them.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
a story i can’t complete because i need X mastery unlocked is exactly the reason why it’s flawed, i never heard of a single game or book that makes you do something completely unrelated to the story just to continue the story.
This is the issue I have with Mastery Points. Let’s stop doing the HoT story so I can go play some arcade games to get the MP I need to continue the story. And of course the Adventures are locked behind the Meta, so you either wait or give up and go do something else that doesn’t waste your game time. Just inane.
Yes, yes, there are other ways to get the MP. But sometimes it is a choice of 2 evils. Many of the Insights and Strongboxes are in locations that I can’t reach (specifically me, not talking about anybody else) without certain Masteries but I need MP to unlock them, etc.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
The problem with leveling the masteries for casual players is information that is not available at the time of decision. Consider that casual players aren’t expected to level all masteries. Consider the game recognizes this and thus is designed in a way that there are important masteries and not so important masteries. Consider the game provides enough easy mastery points for the important masteries.
But how on earth should a new player, a casual player, know which mastery is important or not so important? How on earth he should know that completely maxing the gliding mastery is very important and has a deep impact on his gameplay, while not even starting Exalted Lore isn’t closing too many doors. This is not transmitted by the game. A new player simply starts every mastery, because he doesn’t know the impact.
It’s made even worse by the game messages while playing HoT maps: “you need xyz mastery to eat mushrooms, to use this item, to talk to this NPC, to open that chest, etc…” The player is confused deliberately and is made leveling the wrong masteries.
So It gets slower and slower while he levels all, then the easy mastery points exhaust, and in the end he isn’t able to reach something like Ley Line gliding.
I completely agree. So many answers are “use the wiki” but everything I’ve read indicates that the VAST majority of MMO players do not consult outside sources. This might be due to time constraints or because they don’t even realize that it is necessary to consult an outside source if they aren’t doing something really difficult like raiding. I mean how would they even know that they should consult the wiki before training Masteries? I’ve never encountered a Mastery Point type system in any other MMO. If you need to train skills for your character it usually only requires XP, maybe after doing something to open the path initially. Most games with finite points to distribute is at character creation and you know exactly how many points you have and whether you will ever receive any more.
In GW2 there is no system to tell you how many MP there are in the game or how many are left to acquire. So there is no way to even understand that you should be concerned about how to spend them.
And, the wiki doesn’t really help you decide. It tells you what the various Masteries let you do but it doesn’t help you to know how important each of those things are. It would take a lot of research if you didn’t know about everything in the game yet. Like go to Itzel Lore: none of the individual masteries say whether they are important. Then it says: “Additional uses: Bouncing Mushrooms to continue In Their Footsteps story step; Itzel Leadership for Orders backpack collections”. Ok, Bouncing Mushrooms to continue the story seems important, but what is “Orders backpack collections” (if you’re new)? No link so I type “orders backpack” in the wiki, the only reference directs me back to the same reference. Now how do I figure out if “orders backpack” is important? I google “gw2 orders backpack” and get a lot of backpack pages but nothing clear. So using the wiki isn’t that helpful either.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
How an “optional” jumping puzzle killing the game?
By not being optional.
I’ve yet to see a jumping puzzle implemented into a story step. and no, jumping over kitten isn’t a jumping puzzle
If you want to go the route of “that content isn’t required”, even the Story isn’t “required”. However there are certain types of content that are fundamental to most MMOs: not only Story, but exploration, and Achievements. In GW2, you can start many achievements only to find out that in order to complete them you need to complete, or at least make some progress in a JP(s). This is what I object to. JP should have their own Achievements that are not connected to other content so they are truly optional.
Of which I only know 2: mursaat tokens and LWS3:5: firestone shards.
Then there might be some association in the legendary weapons collection, like Dierdre’s Steps, but then again, it’s a legendary collection, you’re supposed to show a proof of skill in all aspects of the game
What does skill playing the rest of GW2 have to do with skill in JP?
jumping puzzles are an aspect of the game, fractals are an aspect of the game, dungeons are an aspect of the game, world events are an aspect of the game
I’m not gonna write down the entire list
I understand that your opinion is that all of the “mini-games” in GW2 are integral parts of the game and there is no issue requiring them for content completion. My position is that an RPG is about the world and the stories within it. Mini-games are essentially different games inserted into the RPG. I’m not really sure why Anet felt the need to insert mini-games into GW2. Its like they were concerned that their world and its story weren’t enough. I would have preferred that they use their time and effort to improve the world and stories than on mini-games. So many of the stories are lacking or have bugs. And we hear about content that they planned but couldn’t finish. Also the amount of lore that was never finished or ever mentioned again. These things contribute to the world and stories. The money Anet spent on people to do JP and other mini-games could have been spent on people to improve and increase the world and the stories.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
All you can really do is update your ticket, and wait for a response. You might consider reading through the Sticky, ‘Not Getting Our Emails?’ found in the FAQ Sticky, above…just in case.
The Sticky, ‘Tickets for Review’ was removed; seemingly because there were rarely any posts in it, anymore.
Good luck.
The removal of that thread also made me wonder what was going on with Support. It seems strange to remove that thread – even if there are few posts, it is still needed at times. Now if someone like my guildie is having a problem with their ticket, they do not have that thread.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
All of the people in my guild who submitted tickets had in-game issues with items. Those should all be handled by the same team. 1 person submitted a ticket and complained in Guild chat 4 days after the ticket was created. The next day we were talking about it again, (now 5 days with zero response beyond the automated reply) and other Guild members stated that they had just submitted similar tickets which were addressed within 24 hours. This is what makes me question if there is a problem with the system. These people were talking about tickets that were all in the system at the same time.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
How an “optional” jumping puzzle killing the game?
By not being optional.
I’ve yet to see a jumping puzzle implemented into a story step. and no, jumping over kitten isn’t a jumping puzzle
If you want to go the route of “that content isn’t required”, even the Story isn’t “required”. However there are certain types of content that are fundamental to most MMOs: not only Story, but exploration, and Achievements. In GW2, you can start many achievements only to find out that in order to complete them you need to complete, or at least make some progress in a JP(s). This is what I object to. JP should have their own Achievements that are not connected to other content so they are truly optional.
Of which I only know 2: mursaat tokens and LWS3:5: firestone shards.
Then there might be some association in the legendary weapons collection, like Dierdre’s Steps, but then again, it’s a legendary collection, you’re supposed to show a proof of skill in all aspects of the game
What does skill playing the rest of GW2 have to do with skill in JP?
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
I had an issue with a TP purchase yesterday and created a support ticket right away. I’m concerned about how long it might take for my ticket to be addressed. In one of the guilds I belong to someone said that they hadn’t received a response to their support ticket for 5 days, yet other people in the guild submitted tickets and had them addressed the same day. In the sticky “Account Support: Helping Us Help You”, Gaile says that support tickets are addressed in the order they are received. So does that mean that there is a problem with the ticketing system if 1 ticket isn’t addressed for 5 days but multiple tickets created 4 days AFTER that ticket are addressed the very same day?
I understand that not every issue can be RESOLVED the same day, but I’m talking about getting a response beyond the automated email you immediately receive upon creating a support ticket.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
At best, masteries are tedious to get. It’s a timegating mechanism to stretch the player’s playtime, not a mechanism to provide the player with fun content. As they are in HoT, I never felt the promised “progression” associated with them. I always saw them as obstacles I was required to overcome before I was able to have fun.
The aspect of obstacle got less bad in the new LS3 maps, because the required XP are not very high. But the idea to earn the XP and mastery points for a mastery in exactly the same map where you need this mastery is what made me abstain HoT for almost a year.
I feel progression if I can level and progress something to be able to advance to the next game area. If I don’t level some ability, I would perish in the next are, so I level that ability in the previous area.
But the current mastery system is as you enter a level 80 area as level 10 toon and are expected to earn XP in that combination. You perish. As level 10 toon in a level 80 area where everything is so hostile that you cannot advance much from a outpost and survive.
I acknowledge that there exist people who need some leveling goal, some grind mechanics to keep him busy in the game. I am not that kind of person, and I know many other players like me. I like to move to the actual content the game provides. I found 1 year of stuff to do without touching HoT. I really didn’t need this artificial progress of mastery grind. Thus my suggestion to be able to buy out the masteries with real money. And real money is what you want, Arenanet, or not?
I made real progress in the fractals for example, where I learnt how to become a better player. That was fun, and that was real personal progress. But leveling masteries is nothing I call progress – it’s only a huge sink, where you simply unlock some locked obligatory game features that should be unlocked from the start.
Completely agree. Trying to get through Verdant Brink with zero Masteries was a nightmare.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
I’m guessing it is a problem with hairstyles clipping through the hats. That said, are there any programmers in the forums that use the same type of software that MMOs use that can explain why there is such a problem with clipping?
I have personally used art software like Photoshop and you can dictate which layers are in which order (on top vs behind another layer) and can dictate transparency, etc. In an MMO I would think that, just like you can give environmental objects “collision”, you could give clothing and weapons a property such that no character body part or other gear can go through them.
But as I don’t have experience with MMO software maybe there is some kind of limitation I’m not aware of.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
How an “optional” jumping puzzle killing the game?
By not being optional.
I’ve yet to see a jumping puzzle implemented into a story step. and no, jumping over kitten isn’t a jumping puzzle
If you want to go the route of “that content isn’t required”, even the Story isn’t “required”. However there are certain types of content that are fundamental to most MMOs: not only Story, but exploration, and Achievements. In GW2, you can start many achievements only to find out that in order to complete them you need to complete, or at least make some progress in a JP(s). This is what I object to. JP should have their own Achievements that are not connected to other content so they are truly optional.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
To make matters worst you cannot ignore them as they are intertwined and not once but often webbed in several achievement side quests.
You mean he wants to do optional stuff and is complaining that the optional stuff isn’t for him ?
Still not required content.
As the OP says, they aren’t actually optional unless you want to skip achievements or content that are started in regular game content. For instance, while doing the Ember Bay map I come across Mursaat Tokens that start an achievement. After collecting several of them, I hear that 5 are contained within the Chalice of Tears JP. Now there is no way I can complete that Achievement (which is a map Achieve, not a JP Achieve), and no way I can receive the Sentient Aberration mat eater. There are also JP required to complete Legendary Weapons, etc.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
“MMO” is an abbreviation of “MMORPG” so RPG content is normal MMO content. Playing a role in a story or stories, exploration, etc. Card game content is not RPG content. Arcade content is not RPG content. Etc.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
There’s nothing wrong with niche content in this game, except for the fact that ANet too often makes niche content matter towards things like meta-achievements or collections. Niche content rewards (because there have to be rewards or no one bothers after the first time or three) should not be part of reward structures for overall play. They should be intrinsic to the niche content.
This is true also. I used to simply ignore JP until the first one I had to complete for content that had nothing to do with it. If I am trying to do a collection or other achievement, niche content should not be put in the way of that.
The problem is that Anet decided (for whatever reason) to create niche content INSTEAD of normal MMO content and of course they don’t want that content to be wasted by no one playing it. If GW2 only contained normal MMO content, Anet could include any of that content in various achievements or collections and that would simply be part of the game. But forcing players to essentially play OTHER GAMES than the one they logged in to play is the problem that is definitely getting out of hand.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
With all that GW2 and the programmers have to offer and do well, the jumping puzzles IMHO were at best “OK” leveling up to 80 with a few exceptions.
On the level 80 maps and lets just take “the silverwastes” as an example, the jumping puzzles went from fun and challenging (for the most part) too just plain annoying and frustrating with no logic applied where the challenge is nothing but guess work, fail, rinse and repeat.
To make matters worst you cannot ignore them as they are intertwined and not once but often webbed in several achievement side quests. To be in a puzzle where moving left 9.26cm makes the jump and 9.25cm fails is incomprehensible.
The amount of precise jumps required to succeed can be as high as 10 in a row before you get a break towards the next ridiculous set of obstacles. Players actually use another off level 80 character for many of these jumping puzzles to leave it in the area until they succeed.
Its gotta stop. These jumping puzzles are hurting the game. I know there are fans out there that enjoy the sadistic ritual of rinse and repeat for hours on end soooo all the power to ya but for the majority of us who prefer playing the hack and slash this perverted version of Mario Brothers has got to improve. Having a limb support you sometimes and other times not, being able to walk a steep incline and other times not, jumping an absurd height and other times not, jumping blindly in the hopes of hitting your target has no logic, no appeal and is no fun. Where is the intelligent problem solving?
Otherwise make the jumping puzzle stand alone with their achievements and those that wish to deal with the guess work and terrible camera angles and views can do so to their hearts content.
I just cant see what we all need to suffer the poor planning and lack of imagination that these new jumping puzzles now offers us.
best regards;
I completely agree. A puzzle should be something you can intellectually figure out. Trial and error is not a puzzle – it is “throw yourself at it until you get past this part”. That isn’t skill, it is RNG like too many things in GW2.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
Most people want mastery points but not everyone likes the content you have to do enough to get those mastery points. If those players force themselves to do that content, they’re not going to be having fun, even though the got the reward.
That’s how I feel about all those mini games in HoT. I will eventually do them for the mastery points, but they are a duty and not fun.
Last time the karka mini game was a daily. I entered the arena and we were two (at times three) players who just sat down at the side and waited until it’s over. I tried to enter and leave immediately, but you have to finish to make it count as daily. You also have to use a skill sometimes to not get kicked.
Most stupid thing in the whole game. But the fourth daily was something worse.
So yes, the fun is not the activity itself, but the reward. If both is fun, that’s great, and most of the things in GW2 are like that for me. Otherwise I wouldn’t be here. But as you said, something that is fun for one group is despised by another. I don’t mind some grind., but many Tyria Mastery Points are no fun to get.
The problem with arcade games is that IMO they don’t belong in an RPG. Sure, a lot of people like them, but a lot of people like solitaire – that doesn’t mean Anet should put solitaire in GW2. If people like arcade games, or solitaire, or Mario Bros they should go play those games which exist elsewhere.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
To be honest, I don’t really understand everybody complaining about masteries being locked behind certain activities. You bought Heart of Thorns knowing that it would be this way, so if you don’t like doing adventures / jumping puzzles / whatever else, you should either have accepted and consented that you won’t have every mastery unlocked, or shouldn’t have purchased the expansion at all. And in case you didn’t actually read through what kind of features will HoT have, then, well…
Notice that this latter article (which is referenced at the bottom of the official feature description) was created in February 2015, more than half a year before the release of HoT.
Quoting from the article (highlighting done by me):
‘To train a specific Mastery track, you must first unlock it by spending Mastery points. Mastery points are awarded for completing various pieces of game content. Things like completing a chapter in your personal story, completing certain achievements, reaching hard-to-find locations, overcoming challenging encounters, excelling at adventures found within the Heart of Maguuma, or earning 100% completion for a map will award Mastery points. Each Mastery point can be earned once per account, so while Mastery points allow you to unlock Mastery tracks, they are also an indicator of how much of the game you’ve experienced.’
I didn’t know exactly how many Master Points would be required, how many would be available, how many would be behind adventures / story / etc. I also didn’t know that “excelling at adventures” meant arcade games. I didn’t see the explanation in the blog post.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
And I’ll be honest, it irritates me. Getting a Gerent kill isn’t too difficult with a semi-decent group. (Last night’s was brutally fast, actually.) But, it involves more of the taxi metagame that is utterly frustrating to deal with. Get in squad, world is full, find other squad, world is also full, continue spamming world taxis or resign to do something else that night.
The rest of the boss-parts of the collection are all guaranteed, so why is this one not? I really can’t risk having a pathetic drop rate on this, just because of the stupid logistics involved. (Find squad before event start, map-spam until hopefully getting in, wait 20 minutes…)
And if anything makes me paranoid about the drop rate, it’s one other part of the collection: https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Tail_of_the_Star_God_Fragment
I’ve been through three cycles of the event there, murdered hundreds of Grawl, and finally got the item to drop nearly an hour later. An hour. Of running around as an OP 80, silently spitting venom whenever another player appeared, because they’d be taking my kills.
tl;dr – Some of items in our Collections need a “balance pass” on their drop rates.
I agree. But asking Anet to be consistent across any form of content would seem to go against some core philosophy of theirs lol.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
Actually, I prefer epic fights to have a chance to fail. Clawr used to be my favorite; now it’s just a slog. When Tequatl was first revamped, people thought it impossible and there was an amazing sense of accomplishment when it was first (and even 20th) defeated. I get that feeling with Shattererererererer kills; I don’t get it from many other fights.
Mind you: I think it would be horrid for the game if all the fights were like that. It’s good to have some easy ones, some that we’ve figured out so well that it can be PUGged 99.99% of the time. It’s also good, I think, to have a few that aren’t like that.
I disagree. I think that equivalent content should be of equivalent difficulty. World bosses should scale in various ways as zones increase in level, but they should all be of the same relative difficulty. Anet needs to keep in mind that many players will only ever do Shatterer once. Maybe go back a time or two when there are dailies in that map but most players are not going to do any kind of boss farming or acheiv farming. It would be nice for open world events to have a good chance of success even without knowledgeable players to direct them. That’s also why I dislike HoT metas.
Open world PvE should not be like Dungeons / Fractals or Raids which people understand you might have to know the mechanics / dance etc.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
But here’s a way of doing it off the top of my head that I think might work more effectively at providing a sense of mastery and avoiding the base simplicity of “earn points, click button to unlock thing, earn more points” (granted, it would be more complicated to design):
Take, for instance, Lean Gliding. Rather than you unlocking it with XP and an unrelated adventure point, you unlock it by Lean Gliding. This might sound stupid at first, but bear with me here. You don’t get full Lean Gliding functionality at first. Instead, it costs a high amount of your gliding stamina and is high risk to use. The more you use it, the more progress you get on a bar, the less it costs in stamina with each use until you reach mastery.
Why? The idea is:
- Instead of being outright restricted, you get introduced to the ability by using it.
- You master it through using it, which means you learn as you go along, rather than being exposed to it all at once, and by the time you’ve mastered it in numbers, you’ll probably have a pretty good sense of how to make use of it, practically.
The reason I say it would be way more complicated to do may be obvious to some. For example, the jump mushrooms don’t really lend themselves to such a system. They have a specific distance they leap you to and that’s it. Features like that (and the maps themselves) would have needed to be designed entirely differently from the ground up to support such a system.
Lean gliding is a part of “gliding” and the mushrooms are a part of Itzel Lore. Using those masteries (whatever specific skill that Anet put first) could progress you to the next, etc.
This would not be difficult to do as GW2 had EXACTLY that type of “mastery” when the game first started. If you wanted to use a sword, you got the first sword skill only and opened the next skills by using it! It was a great system but Anet decided to give us the NGE (or whatever they called it) and completely screwed the learning experience.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
…since Anet added the defiance bar, it is very difficult to kill him unless there is a massive zerg or someone is coordinating.
The zerg is actually not very helpful — it can easily fail with a lot of people and succeed handily with relatively few. The key elements are
Have a good fraction of those present focused on being ready to glide — in an organized map, this can be done by the clock. With all randoms, it requires people trusting that success depends on their waiting by the jump pad rather and does not depend on their DPS being on the dragon all the time.
Another (smaller) fraction has to be ready to break crystals, which means spreading out.
Have a few people on siege and a few on siege defense; this is more helpful with randoms (since an organized map has plenty of other sources of CC/DPS).
If you aren’t experienced, the timing feels random — it’s hard to figure out just when the dragon will start to channel (aside from the first time). And it’s incredibly hard to convince people to wait-for-it|wait-for-it|wait-for-it when the timer is ticking down.
Unlike some other meta fights (Tequatl, SW Vinewrath, etc), you can’t ignore the mechanics by going turbo with DPS: crystals need to be broken before boss heals, people have to be ready to glide before defiance is up to drop bombs.
So it can be done with few people; it is just going to be unlikely that a random few are confident enough about how things work to make it happen.
Consequently, I’ll always use LFG for Shattererer.
That’s why I said a “massive” zerg, which I have seen succeed at times. But yes, it is difficult.
I also agree that the timing is key which is why I didn’t volunteer to lead the map I was in as I know what to do but not the timing. You can tell people to kill the healing crystals but unless you know where they will appear and can mark. And can warn people that it is time to go to the marks, you can’t kill the crystals fast enough to stop the healing. Etc.
It is a shame that they made it so the Shatterer can no longer be killed by people who just show up in the map as opposed to so many of the other map bosses like Maw and Claw of Jormag.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
Obviously we are all referred to as the Pact Commander in the story and treats us that we’re the only one there, but in the event stories, they do acknowledge that there is more than one player in the field. And most of these event stories are considered something that happened, like the Silverwastes meta or the Dragon Stand meta.
So who are the other players to us exactly? Are they treated as Pact Soldiers as we are Pact Commanders? Or are they actually Commanders too since multiple commanders could exist in a chain of command? Most of the time they are seen as “other adventurers” but in certain meta stories they are considered part of the Pact.
It’s especially strange when you group for a story mission. You are all “the Commander” or “the boss”.
don’t worry, only the Instance Leader is called boss, the rest of the party are “friends” or “called upon Pact Champions”
I know. What I’m saying is that it is strange when the NPCs in the story talk to The Commander or “the boss” and there are more than 1 of you but they only talk to one of you. It continues to be confusing to me (since I don’t group for the story often) when someone else opens the instance so I hear their Asura voice answering instead of my character’s or see their character in the cut scenes. And it frankly doesn’t make any sense. I think it was a mistake to make the PC the ONE hero of the entire world in an MMO.
Well.. you can argue about that, to each their own. You’re not wrong or right.
But on another note, raids do something else. Since there’s no pact commander in the raids, only adventurers, anyone can talk and respond to events by being the conversation trigger. Glenna for example will always adress the first player to enter the prison block. After that, the second player to enter makes a quip, and then the last player to enter.
With that in mind, between more bosses, the first player to talk to glenna or pass a certain flag on the map will trigger a quip, and sometimes the quip is even adjusted to the race. The dialogue in raids is actually very good.
Well, that’s interesting that there is no Commander in the raids, but I’m not exactly sure why it should be the case. The entire rest of Tyria knows who “The Commander” is, why would the people in the raids not know?
Seems like Anet decided to correct their mistake in the raid environment instead of having all the NPCs treat every PC as thought they were the same person lol.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
If Out-Of-Character-Balthazar turned out to actually be Menzies who just ran with people mistaking him for Balthazar, it’d go a very long way towards redeeming the last episode. That much is certain.
Excessive plot-twist, is contraindicated and amateurish. I think there are enough stories of “this was not what it looked like, it was something else”.
Its miles better than “Balthazar is now lolevil and the next big bad and has forgotten all the stuff he was about and now acts like a backstabbing sneak instead of a god of war!”, but that is just me.
Completely agree. Menzies being who we actually fought would be much better than it actually being Balthazar which was lame.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
Masteries is quite a unique feature in any mmorpg, I do not think I ever played an mmorpg to have something like this and it is quite clever solving the standard lets become a gear and stat treadmill of illusion, trust me these masteries are an amazing addition and we should be thanking anet for coming up with something so clever and unique that will hopefully give a better standard to mmorpgs in the future.
I have seen allot of complaints, but people do not realize they are trying to give you a good challenge/reward to give us incentive for the later content. Trust me it is far more fun then grinding for adding a new stat here and there.
Now if you want to compare it to something like the alternate advancement in eq2 well then that is indeed comparable since eq2 actually added new abilities to earn but in a way gw2 does as well with the elite skill.
Just my 2 cents, anet thank you, impressive job.
Masteries are great. Mastery Points that are locked behind arcade games that have nothing to do with the RPG or locked behind meta events that take groups, or locked behind platforming, or being able to find it on a confusing map – those are the issue.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
As for the transitional period, LS2 has a nice curve introducing new mechanics, so you can tackle the jungle with newfound confidence. If players skip that and go straight to the jungle, is anet at fault, or the players?
that’s like going from high school to university without doing a lectural period, I mean, you can if you’re good, but chances are, 90% of the people who try that will fail and then complain the leap is too big.
You have to pay to get LS2 if you weren’t logging in (like if you’re a new player). A lot of players don’t even know LS2 exists. So it’s not exactly like “choosing to skip”.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
I was also present at a failed Shatterer today. We decided to try since the map was a daily event map. However no one was commanding / organizing. A couple of people who needed achievs did taxi and we had a fair number of people, but since Anet added the defiance bar, it is very difficult to kill him unless there is a massive zerg or someone is coordinating.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
Obviously we are all referred to as the Pact Commander in the story and treats us that we’re the only one there, but in the event stories, they do acknowledge that there is more than one player in the field. And most of these event stories are considered something that happened, like the Silverwastes meta or the Dragon Stand meta.
So who are the other players to us exactly? Are they treated as Pact Soldiers as we are Pact Commanders? Or are they actually Commanders too since multiple commanders could exist in a chain of command? Most of the time they are seen as “other adventurers” but in certain meta stories they are considered part of the Pact.
It’s especially strange when you group for a story mission. You are all “the Commander” or “the boss”.
don’t worry, only the Instance Leader is called boss, the rest of the party are “friends” or “called upon Pact Champions”
I know. What I’m saying is that it is strange when the NPCs in the story talk to The Commander or “the boss” and there are more than 1 of you but they only talk to one of you. It continues to be confusing to me (since I don’t group for the story often) when someone else opens the instance so I hear their Asura voice answering instead of my character’s or see their character in the cut scenes. And it frankly doesn’t make any sense. I think it was a mistake to make the PC the ONE hero of the entire world in an MMO.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
mastery points in HoT are not that bad, mastery points in tyria are kinda bare. In hot they seem to have more extra points, and they have masteries that are not that important, so you can skip, unless you are a completionist, in which case you d be trying to do everything anyway
but the thing im unsure of, if you hate hot, why do you need mastery points? They are for HoT content. They give you access to more of hot, and make exploring hot easier.
while i think mastery system needs tweaks and improvements, its actually over all, a really logical system. it rewards people who like to do the content with more access and depth to the content.
???
All of the HoT Masteries are also required in the maps AFTER HoT: Bloodstone Fen, Ember Bay, Bitterfrost, Lake Doric, Draconis Mons.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
Obviously we are all referred to as the Pact Commander in the story and treats us that we’re the only one there, but in the event stories, they do acknowledge that there is more than one player in the field. And most of these event stories are considered something that happened, like the Silverwastes meta or the Dragon Stand meta.
So who are the other players to us exactly? Are they treated as Pact Soldiers as we are Pact Commanders? Or are they actually Commanders too since multiple commanders could exist in a chain of command? Most of the time they are seen as “other adventurers” but in certain meta stories they are considered part of the Pact.
It’s especially strange when you group for a story mission. You are all “the Commander” or “the boss”.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
You can ask someone to open a Rift for you, while you wait for the fix, (if the Devs feel a fix should be forthcoming).
I’d hope so. Having these “invisible” events show up all over the map is bound to give the impression that the event pointer is broken…
Nah, we finally educated enough people that the daily event maps are no longer full of complaints. People have gradually learned. (though I’ll still explain if anyone says anything, of course.)
They should have made the dot for a Rift event a different color.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
You can’t be troubled to show up to the map 15 minutes ahead of the meta and keep an eye on LFG until you secure a spot on an organized map? That’s what you call “tailoring your life to the game”?
Showing up 15 minutes ahead of whatever your goal is = 15 minutes wasted. Then if you don’t end up getting into the organized map (which has happened to me multiple times), then whatever time you spent clicking Join In is also wasted. If you only have an hour to play, 15-30 min is significant.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
People can say that players will discriminate or behave badly toward other players no matter what. But there is a difference between that and giving those players an approved tool with which to discriminate. And this tool wouldn’t be perceived as necessary if Anet hadn’t added raids to GW2. Since we have raids, Anet feels it is necessary to allow this tool, so unfortunately we’re just going to have to live with it. I wish that Anet hadn’t added raids at all.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
I droped The Legend from Teq, was farming it for 7 days. I watch boss timer at Dulfy site and did`t miss one spawn. Second was The Chosen and I got it from mystic forge. Trow only yellow stuff in it (lvl 74-80). My opinion is that is easy to get precursor just need to be patient.
I don’t believe you.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
The thing you have to understand here – The only way to get them is the way described (MF or random drop from high level content) – yet everyone says “save up and by one”. If everyone did this, there would be NO PRECURSORS
No, because they are a random drop. So they would drop from high level content whether someone is searching for one or not. If no one flushed items down the MF I suppose no one would get a precursor there. But they would definitely still drop in-game.
People who have had luck in the MF always tell others they should do the same. Yet I have seen people throw huge numbers of items in the MF and never get a precursor. They could have just saved their money and purchased one.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
LOL – same people saying the same thing “the maps aren’t dead”. Yet DIFFERENT people keep starting threads deploring that the HoT maps are dead! Hmmm, I see a pattern here.
Maybe the people who keep saying the maps aren’t dead know how to find full maps! Maybe the people who say the maps are dead don’t know how to find full maps because it isn’t told anywhere in-game. I see the OP being criticized because he doesn’t know how the DS meta works. Where is it explained in-game? And if you get kicked out of the DS map because you died and then can’t get into the main map because it’s full, “try again”.
Yes you are right HoT defenders, there is nothing wrong with the HoT maps. Everything is working perfectly. /sarcasm
One has to wonder if Anet fully thought out the consequences of their design. I certainly hope not because its pretty bad if they designed it this way on purpose.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
No one seems to want to have fun anymore. They are obsessed with numbers, averages, and metrics…
I mean the thread started off with an OP intended to diminish the preferences of others, to, essentially, describe others as being somehow wrong in their approach to the game. I mean a game exists to have fun. If playing the numbers part of the game means that one is not trying to have fun then one is not playing right. That is a significant part of the OP’s point in a nutshell. “Other people have fun differently than I do and that is disheartening.”
I disagree. The last sentence of the paragraph you quote states the reason he deplores the obsession with numbers, et al:
" The vast majority conversations I have had in game haven’t been about the world, the story or what is happening it’s all been about the math behind the game and it’s disheartening."
He is saying that this “obsession” is spilling over onto HIS fun. He did not state that he doesn’t like that others are having fun differently.
Then he ends his post with “Honestly this whole direction especially with the new raid has me more than a little bit sad.” So he’s talking about the new emphasis on meta that raids has brought to the game spilling over into the rest of the game. Which is absolutely true. The introduction of raids to GW2 effects the entire game. And as someone who doesn’t raid and probably will never raid, I don’t see an upside to these changes for me. Only negative impact.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
). It was only after the research that I figured out it used a formula and that seemed to be broken. (And that’s where I’m out of my depth — couldn’t figure out how to fix it.)
”, but that is just me.