Guild Wars 2

Nike Porphyrogenita.8137:

Snoozy.6701:

Broadicea.8294:

Snoozy.6701:

Broadicea.8294:

Snoozy.6701:

Agreeing with what u guys said.
But arena said no Holy Trinity and everybody can enjoy.
And if we avoid dungeons for slower players, arena net shout not put in update with more dungeons, which, many would avoid, which means, the updates are kinda useless

Example the dungeons in LA with aetherblades, slower players can’t get up the boxes on time while running and avoid the lasers ….
Any strategy other than running up the boxes?

The strategy is to go do easier content.

Then it just means that slower players cant enjoy the story or content fully ….

Content is not designed so that every single player can enjoy it! I don’t like PvP, so I don’t play it! I don’t like WvW, so I don’t play it! I don’t like open world PvE, so I don’t play it! I don’t like content that’s too easy, so I don’t play it!

Why can’t you people just NOT PLAY IT if it’s too hard?

That is why i said its a total fail that new content Living Story can’t be enjoyed by everyone.

Boy are you going to be kitten ed about the jumping puzzle coming back in the next patch.

Also, if you want to do this dungeon I will run you through it with a guild group for 25g. You can watch all the cut scenes and we will do the bonus achieves too.

Every part of the game should be made to be enjoyed by every single person. If that person has the desire to experience that part of the game, then he/she should be willing to put the effort in to do it.

If there is a deaf/blind amputee, should the game be catered so they can enjoy every single aspect?

Just like Lanfear said, I wouldn’t worry about it too much. There are instances like this all over GW2.

Who knows, maybe even one day we can pick two classes, like GW1

Are we talking about downed or dead? Just to clarify. I know you said dead, but a lot of people still say dead when refering to downed players.

1) Dead. I agree, but don’t really care. If somebody dies in a boss fight I won’t res them. The DPS loss it will take usually isn’t worth having the extra member. If 3 people go down and the boss is still 50%+ HP, I’ll either wipe or kite while somebody else reses.

2) Downed. If by chance you were talking about being downed. It should stay in.

DusK.3849:

But don’t kick a guy just because he’s wearing gear that falls outside of your closed-minded, elitist views of what “optimal” is,

I play how I want and will report you. Don’t tread on me!

Obviously this arguement is going nowhere.

Am I the only one who thinks its horrible that he reports people just for kicking him?

1) They aren’t kicking him after the boss
2) They are kicking him mid-run (how many of us have done that)
3) They are kicking him because they don’t like his build/playstyle. Maybe attitutde, we dont’ know.

These are acceptable reasons to kick somebody IMO. Are we really okay with him reporting, and suggesting everybody else report, people who kick others out of parties because they don’t like the gear they use?

You scream “Let me play how I want” from the rooftops. But right back at you. Let me play how I want. If we feel slow after a couple of bosses and I ask what armor you’re wearing and you ping cleric’s and staff, I’m kicking you. It’s not a zerk thing. If you ping knights with a GS I’m fine, as an example. It’s not a speedrun thing either, it’s just being efficient.

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

“For now I would encourage those not looking to skip…”, emphasis mine.

Then people need to stop joining other people’s party and DEMANDING to kill everything.

You’re toting his post like you’re inside his mind, yet you’re defending people who come on here and do the opposite of what it outright says.

Tree.3916:

Should make this thread 100 times so those people see it.

Sticky it so we can just link it without having to search for pages like the robert’s post.

RIP in peace Robert.

blessing nosferatu.3784:

There are some people on this forums that admitted that they kick dungeons sellers because “lfg is not a shop” or " I don’t care if they did it legit or not".
I would like to see their comments on this and apologise with the people they have kicked but that’s never going to happen they will just continue with their private justice.

Just keep waiting. I’m sure you wont be waiting thaaaaaat long.

Nike Porphyrogenita.8137:

Dromar.1027:

CC isnt even required on dangerous mobs because of the mountain of dps people have, watch them red bars shoot down before the mobs do anything… and then there’s defiant.

Try Dredge at fotm 79 and tell me that cc isn’t important.

Build diversity is the issue and people are being punished for going another route the game offers. Let’s hope the October 15th update helps with some of the frustration.

It won’t. Here is what I said two months ago about “support builds” and the scrubs who want them…

“A lot of players are used to traditional trinity MMO where a “support” character could hang around in the back out of danger buffing his team not really using any twitch or micro skills and get carried through content because even though his skills are low, the character type is important enough to warrant inclusion and thus the lazy man has a path to success. The lazy and less skilled players gravitate to support/midline roles because it allows them to blend into the background for the most part. They don’t get special credit when a raid goes well, but its also usually not their fault when it fails.
Not saying this description applies to everyone who wants to play a dedicated support character, but it certainly describes a significant enough portion of them to make it the rule not the exception.
As I have said in other threads on this topic, this is an action MMO. You can’t reach the top by playing a support necro who sits at 1200 range with staff auto, casting wells on cool down. You have to be in the mix pulling your weight. If this isnt appealing, this probably isnt the game for you.”

This guy…. I wanna party with this guy.

The Mexican Cookie.3690:

Ethics.4519:

Has anybody gotten this to work?

Many times :P I guess you just got unlucky or did something silly without realizing it :O

I’m NEVER silly.

Okay thanks, I’ll keep trying it then. I’m really baffled by what went wrong.

I was mainly just asking to see if I should keep making the effort to get it to work, or just quit wasting time.

Sanderinoa.8065:

The Mexican Cookie.3690:

colesy.8490:

Apparently untraited phantasmal warden absorbs Old Tom’s projectiles.

I’ll go test this because I’m bored. I’ll be back!

Don’t bother, it works (and has for months)

sincerely, axe of mossman

Last night we did mossman and I absorbed his axe with mimic. I kept it after swamp and we went to cliffside. We got up to the 4 champ room, and I targeted the ettin after the bunny when down. The ettin and shaman were standing right next to each other.

I thought perfect! Double checked to make sure I had the ettin targeted. Stared the ugly thing right in the face, hit my echo skill, Tossed that gleaming axe, swirling in the air.

It went to the left of ettin (he still never moved) and into the wall, completely missing everything.

I cried.

Has anybody gotten this to work?

Galtrix.7369:

Wolfheart.1938:

Galtrix.7369:

If you want to play with other people that are exactly similar to your stats, SAY IT.

This basically sums up the whole thread. People shouldn’t be such kittens to kick players mid-run only because they don’t run the gear they DIDN’T ask for. Simple.

Yep, perfect. That’s all I want.

Right, screw everybody with an opposing view. Report them for not agreeing with me!

Galtrix.7369:

Alright, I’m going to keep this thread on track and try to keep it as civilized as possible. I agree with you guys that are stating similar arguments like this. If you want to play with only other people that are similar to your stats, that’s fine. If you want to play with other people that are exactly similar to your stats, SAY IT. If you start a group with a simple LFM for AC part 2, I will instantly join that because I assume that it’s open to anyone. If they kick me from that group, THEN I will report them for wasting my time. That is what I’m saying.

You can’t report them for not letting you play with them. If it’s after they kill the boss, maybe it’s a form of griefing. You are only abusing Anet’s reporting system. Just because I say “LFM for AC part 2” doesn’t mean I have to let you play with me as soon as you join.

CryxTryx.9208:

You do realise that you are telling a group of people to respect others right to play how they want, by telling them they should play a certain way.

This is what’s wrong with people who wear that slogan with a badge of honor. When it’s not their way, they whine and moan about it, regardless of how it effects everybody around them.

It’s a form of Casual’s Elitism.

No. It’s broken because of the community.

How is this thread not locked yet? I’m beyond baffled.

Kilandros.2098:

but I think the fact that this thread was even started speaks volumes.

Tell me about it

Galtrix.7369:

I agree, people do not have to play with me. But starting a dungeon with me in their party and then kicking me halfway through because of my gear is reportable. I am not entitled to much of anything. It is an mmorpg and I should be able to play however the hell I want to play. That’s what an mmorpg implies.

If I felt entitled, like you said, I would be kicking literally every single full berserker player that tries to party with me. Do I do that? No. All I want is equality for all types of gear. I do not kick people because of the gear they wear. I simply report the ones that think they’re better than me because they wear different gear.

Half way through is not against the rules. It takes time for people to realize you have on clerics. My guess is they say zerk only, youjoin the group, then they find out halfway through and kick you.

You DO feel entitled. If others can’t play however they want, then why should you? Quit forcing people to play with your crappy build.

You DO realize you have compared racism to kicked people from parties right? Kick people from parties is the same as brutally enslaving a race of people? Got it.

Syn Sity.5826:

:(

Lol! Look at this gem! My heart hurts.

Galtrix.7369:

No, it is not abuse. I will be improving the game by reporting those elitists and getting them banned. So far I’ve reported many of those elitists, and guess how many times I’ve been banned/suspended? None.

Kicking people because you don’t like the gear they’re wearing is right up there with racism. It doesn’t belong here, nor does it warrant kicking people from parties. Kicking people because of their gear is not only rude and disrespectful, but it completely ruins the community. Take a look yourself.

Syn Sity.5826:

Dreamslayer.7659:

I agree with Blood Red.

Sometimes people want to do a certain thing, a certain way and there are a few players who think that they are an exception.

We saw this with the Underworld Speed Clears in GW1 and you saw it with the COF P1 speed clears.

I run Fractals 48 almost every night and I can’t remember the last time I saw a gear check request – maybe if someone has very low achievement points or if they die too easily people will ask them, but it’s not like it was a while back.

For some reason UWSC (or any sc in gw1 for that matter) didn’t get the organization hate that speedclears in this game do, I’m not sure why. Maybe because the difference between balanced way and speed clears in gw1 was a difference of many hours and hardly anyone did uw without either speed clearing or solo farming. I did uwsc almost exclusively for like 4 years straight and I don’t think I ever had one person join and demand that he be able to run with us just because. You got the occasional idiot who spoke no english and was on a warrior and just joined until he was kicked, but no one ever actually kittened and moaned about people wanting to do things in an organized manner. It was just a generally accepted principle I guess, let the speedclearers do their thing and if you want to do a casual multi-hour uw run then just try to form your own party. I miss that game and it’s players.

GW2 caters towards casuals and they get upset when you are better than them and wont let them join. Just look at my other thread in this forum. He feels so entitles that he is reporting players when they kick him for wearing cleric’s gear, and calling it the equivalence of racism.

Vox Hollow.2736:

I totally misinterpreted your ‘moot point anyway’.
My apologies.

No worries. I meant it as A Cow’s Opinion

coronaas.4362:

TheMaskedParadigm.3629:

A song about why Berserker is actually the best:

http://youtu.be/vlZQYZZtAHk

I personally prefer http://youtu.be/ab9176Srb5Y

God, what an awful racket. Eminem is horrible.

GWAR is legit though. =)

Vox Hollow.2736:

It’s not ‘too much work’, it’s just not the most cost-productive solution.

Look, I’m not about to explain software development from top to bottom to get you to understand my point. So, we’re going to have to leave it at a friendly ‘agree to disagree’. Okay by you?

Lol, you’re the one who brought it up again when you asked why we differed opinions? I wasn’t even talking to you with the other comment I made. Which is why it said @BRA….

I had already left it alone when you brought it back up. Not to mention “We’ve already discussed it and it’s a moot point anyway” is already saying that we agree to disagree. Not sure what other reassurance you need.

Yes Vox. I have nothing else to discuss with you. We agree to disagree.

I think OP was actually describing his first post with the subject.

Suddenflame.2601:

Ethics.4519:

The conversations in here are frightening.

You’re going to have to specify what area of the game you are talking about.

WvW: Hell no don’t go zerk. You’re either looking for 1v1s or you just don’t know what you’re doing.

sPvP: Sure, why not.

Dungeons: Hell yes you should be zerk, or working towards it. The dungeons in this game can all be done in full zerker. You should be trying to know the instances good enough to wear as many zerker pieces you can. This is for efficiency. If you don’t care if your dungeon run takes longer, then join other people that don’t care. Most the people running dungeons want it to be quick and efficient.

Healing and tanking is not needed IN DUNGEONS in this game, assuming everybody in your party knows what they are doing. If you feel special becaues you can heal people and take very limit damage, fine, it’s your choice. But it’s also the party’s choice to kick you because they want the dungeon done in 15 minutes instead of 25 minutes.

From what I seen ‘most’ people are not wearing zerkers into dungeons. Only dungeons I seen that want to be fast cleared with zerkers is COF and AC. I haven’t seen a single one saying Speed Clear zerker only for any Arah, SE, or TA. Another thing is zerkers have to work together cause a single mistake can cause a party wipe.

I wear zerker into all dungeons. Everything I do in PvE I wear zerkers.

Speedclear =/= efficient group.

The more zerker you have in the group, the more efficient it will be, if the people in the party know what they are doing.

Just because I might post something in LFG that doesn’t say “speedrun” doesn’t mean I’m okay with it taking an hour instead of 20 minutes. Doesn’t really matter anyway, as I always try to run with my guild. Even then I find a cleric’s guard in my group =(

Bismuth.3165:

Ethics.4519:

I usually play healers (TRINITY!) and my fiancee usually plays warriors, does that mean she wears the pants?

Contrary to popular belief, warrior doesn’t necessarily mean high dps.

Contrary to popular belief, I actually do wear pants. I make her go high dps. No sympathy!

Vox Hollow.2736:

Who cares.

That’s a fair point.
I think people like to use intention to help get an idea of where things are going…but the new dungeon kind of made the direction clear. So picking apart Hrouda’s post is a pretty academic discussion.

@Ethics
Eh? So why’re you at odds with me on this?
My position on skipping is pretty, uh, hard to summarize beyond a general sense that we’ve been given enough rope to hang ourselves with. But it’s definitely not taking a totalitarian stance on fighting everything, and it’s not like I’ve ever tried to justify my positions with that flimsy little PR gem.

We seem to be beating around a similar bush. My most recent comment was at blood.

My only issue with anything you’ve said was when you stated that removing leashing would be too much work. We’ve already discussed that and it’s a moot point anyway.

The main tips I can give to a new mesmer are:

1) Don’t try to go hyrbid. Too many times people take traits where phantasms do more damage, but mind wrack does 10% more damage. These are contradictory. You should try to go either phantasm build or shatter build. There are still different types of each, but “shantasms” don’t work well.

2) Try to act like your clone. Clones don’t dodge. Clones don’t strafe. Go invisible, pop a clone, then BE a clone. Act like the thing that’s trying to act like you =). Too many times I’ll see a mesmer pop stealth, pop a clone, then dodge immediately out of stealth. That mesmer wasted a dodge and a stealth, and I automatically know which is the real mesmer now.

Broadicea.8294:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Wolfheart.1938:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

I knew it was a male thing!

Makes sense, supporting in my (very little) experience is a female thing! (inb4 males that play support builds jump on me, I’m not being too serious)

Lol actually that is an accurate statement. Generally speaking, support is more of a female role, while damage is more of a male role. Simply due to basic human nature. Although, you do find exceptions to every ‘rule’ (which is why male nurses exist for example). I was just poking fun originally, hehe.

what kind of bullkitten kitten kittenin 1950s Mad Men kitten garbage is this

I usually play healers (TRINITY!) and my fiancee usually plays warriors, does that mean she wears the pants?

Broadicea.8294:

I said who cares because who cares what anet intended. who cares. who cares!

Sorry, it wasn’t at you. I edited my post.

I don’t like to quote out of line, sorry for the confusion…. I am a mesmer though.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Incorrect-Thinking/first#post3001310

It has spread to other forums. He will report you for not letting you play with him. MOM!

I thought those in the dungeon forums would like to read this.

Galtrix.7369:

I’m taking a stand here and now and saying I will not go berserker no matter what. I may continue to get kicked out of parties, but I will report each and every one of the people that vote to kick me, because this thinking is utterly wrong and is harmful for an mmo. I encourage every single player that does not use berserker gear to do the same. Report any players that kick you from parties because of your build, insult you, or demand that you use berserker gear.

This is an abuse to the reporting tool. You will be banned if you abuse that system.

Quit being spiteful. It is not against the rules to kick people because you don’t want to play with them.

The conversations in here are frightening.

You’re going to have to specify what area of the game you are talking about.

WvW: Hell no don’t go zerk. You’re either looking for 1v1s or you just don’t know what you’re doing.

sPvP: Sure, why not.

Dungeons: Hell yes you should be zerk, or working towards it. The dungeons in this game can all be done in full zerker. You should be trying to know the instances good enough to wear as many zerker pieces you can. This is for efficiency. If you don’t care if your dungeon run takes longer, then join other people that don’t care. Most the people running dungeons want it to be quick and efficient.

Healing and tanking is not needed IN DUNGEONS in this game, assuming everybody in your party knows what they are doing. If you feel special becaues you can heal people and take very limit damage, fine, it’s your choice. But it’s also the party’s choice to kick you because they want the dungeon done in 15 minutes instead of 25 minutes.

Brother Grimm.5176:

Ethics.4519:

Downside is low aoe in zergs, and you’re SO SLOW while running. You can bring focus but every 10-15 seconds you’re pulling it out to give swiftness then switching back.

Focus has the highest damage Phantasm (if not weapons skill PERIOD) in the game. I hope you are not swapping it out before dropping that on a semi-stationary target….

It’s actually not the highest. It comes close to duelist when factoring in bleeds I believe.

That’s besides the point. If you’re small roaming in wvw and you find a stationary target. He’s either afk or dead.

Dromar.1027:

Thread is moot imo.

Assuming player has moderate intelligence, Motivation + Time = Player Skill. If you have the drive and time you can solo dungeon paths if you want. In the end if your at the point of boredom to solo dungeons it’s probably time to look for another game unless your boosting a massive ego.

May or may not be (most likely is) directed at weth?

My boosting a massive ego what?

Charming Rogue.8071:

Sounds good, but it needs some failsafe way to work. Or else I’ll just buy a new account, run 2 instances of gw2 and make new alts every time for the extra rewards.

Working as intended. Anet just doubled sales.

knbBlackTemplar.3059:

Make skills special to reflect projectiles @ made them not reflect, anet logic.

Lol. In all fairness, it was way too easy (still is) but WAY too easy if you can reflect those. Now they just need to put a pool of poison/lava right where he stands.

Tree.3916:

No point in you being alive while the rest of your party is dead… unless you want to take a year soloing what you are fighting.

Everybody knows the last person alive is the best who’s carrying the bad PUGs. Only elitist will argue.

Tree.3916:

No dungeon is good for pugging.

Lol.

CoF p1 is still probably the least painful to pug.

I’m tempted to say AC, but a lot of PUGs go there, so there’s more of a chance to find baddies? p2 is a no-no for pugs.

TA up maybe.

Other than that, I can’t offer much. I almost always run guild groups.

Oh, fotm30+ is usually safe. People that high already tend to know what they are doing.

TKiller.6829:

Never got the point of saying the greetings when I join the group or someone joins mine.

Holy double kittenes from hell, you just’ve got a whole new UI element telling you my character, account name and what I’m playing, while I get same info on the party I joined.

Is that really not enough to acknowledge our mutual fact of existence?

Yeah. And screw other people in real life. I see you. Why the hell do I need to say hi to you? I don’t care how your day is. Jesus. I’m already judging you by your appearances and clothing. I don’t need you to open your stupid mouth.

Amiright?

Broadicea.8294:

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

That’s the thing: when Robert talked about skipping, he specifically said he doesn’t condone it. He spends the whole post talking about ways to fix the problem, and how previous game designs just created a different problem. The whole community segregation thing is just a temporary solution until Robert could find a way to please both worlds. But he’s gone now, so gates ahoy!

Who cares.

@BRA

Are you talking about the robert quote posted earlier? If so

1) Robert never said he “doesn’t condone skipping”. Nowhere in his whole statement does he talk about his preference towards the population skipping or not.

2) Robert does not talk about other game designs. If you’re talking about previous GW2 game designs, he also doesn’t talk about that, other than saying it didn’t work to make trash rewarding.

3) Robert specifically does say that the best solution (at the time) was to find like minded people. Form a guild and try to play with them. This is the opposite of what people are doing today and complaining about.

Infamous Darkness.3284:

I don’t understand why ppl keep saying this setup is so bad, you are able to survive when the rest of your party goes down, it’s a perfect setup for fighting tequatl. You always need dolyak runes for the extra 30hp regen per sec (they are amazing in AC) you contribute so much by mashing hammer 1 and giving everyone protection. There is no better mule around for holding my 20k+ piles of putrid essence, their efficiency at mining in southsun cove up by the champ karka is rivaled by none. A song dedicated to this subset of guardians listen to that sound.

let the flaming begin

I agree. I dance on those dead zerkers screaming my elitism as mobs hit me doing no damage! I just wish they didn’t nerf my magic find gear.

Flame On!

I’m biased towards mesmers.

Mesmers have a great condition damage/invisibility build that is incredibly fun to roam with. I think it’s best in 1v1s, but also good in around 5v5s.

You can still have very slight tankiness, but your survivability stems from confusion and damage avoidance.

When you run with the zerg you could just switch one utility to veil and drop it in front ofthe zerg.

Downside is low aoe in zergs, and you’re SO SLOW while running. You can bring focus but every 10-15 seconds you’re pulling it out to give swiftness then switching back.

TheMaskedParadigm.3629:

I’m sure I could do better than Trahearne and Scarlet.

We are ALL sure of that.

Lilith Ajit.6173:

Every time I read nearly any post in this sub forum I get sad. There are 5-10 people who comment on nearly every post, saying the exact same thing. No suggestions are worthwhile, unless it caters to the epic 1337 players who are seen all over YouTube soloing and speed clearing.

Personally, I really do get it. When I accomplish something in life or in guild wars I like to rub it in peoples faces. I want people to see my accomplishments, and either feel jealous or what have you.

I just feel like this sub forum is not helping anyone out. Every post in here is derailed into either a conversation of how guild wars has a billion bad players or how stupidly easy the game is for x, y, and z reasons.

I saw a post early that said that it is unacceptable for someone to not have 8 level 80s… And, well, wow. Have we all really gotten to the point where if you aren’t this epic caliber of player that you are simply bad?

I don’t know. All I know is that I am not cut out to be apart of this dungeon community, despite loving dungeon running, and doing it 9 hours a day for 3 months this summer.

Really OP, I think the summation of the 4 pages of posts in this thread is this: no one wants help and no one wants to help. The dungeon community has failed, the best thing to do is to join a guild, never pug, and make sure that if you aren’t the best or perfect player, you understand that there might eventually be a screen shot of your toon on that player fails thread, because it is just that toxic.

My 2 c.

I missed the 8 lvl 80 thing, could you post that?

I think the issue is that those same 5 people see the same thing over and over again. They respond sarcastically or non-helpful to people that come on here not actually wanting help. They just want to whine and moan and have people say “Yeah! I hate skipping” and agree with OP.

Anytime at ALL I’ve asked for a strategy, a better way, a question about build, they’ve been helpful.

Just the other day I asked about reflecting projecticles in fotm and how the stacking actually works in fotm underwater. Either emanuel or maskedparadigm gave a good answer.

If the question is “I’m having issues with the spider queen boss. Can anybody tell me a good strategy and what I should be running to make this easier?” It would be filled with helpful advice and some jokes.

If the question is “OMG! I hate stacking. Why do people MAKE me stack then kick me when I don’t??? Anet needs to stop this elitism!” Then yes, they will be shunned and jokes will be made at their expense.

Seras.5702:

If you still have problems with the mail hint, delete all of your mail, then start anew. I’ve heard this helps.

As for forcing broken gear, strip down to a single piece of cheap gear that you’ll just salvage when you’re done (to save on repair costs). Then throw yourself from a cliff. Preferably one near a WP. Repeat until thoroughly trashed.

As frugal as I am, I’d recommend doing it on a low level toon to save the Wp costs, or have a friend res you.

Vox Hollow.2736:

@Ethics

Again, I’d like to stress if you’re really talking developer intention ‘skip everything’ and ‘skip nothing’ are way too simple concepts.

I’m not arguing the “skip everything” side. Obviously I don’t think you should skip everything.

I’m arguing AGAINST the people who think you should kill everything. At random times there’s a flood of people who come on here and complain about groups that stack, skip, suggest they use berserker, suggest they use reflects, etc.

They cry “Anet promised play how you want!”. Yet they refused to see that they are forcing people to play how they want.

I’m also tired of hearing what Anet intended. Robert already made a statement, and that’s the closest we’ll have to what anet intended you to do with trash mobs, and that’s not kill everything.

5 cleric staff guardians would be a pain.

1 AH, 1 knights, 3 zerk guardians might not be that bad.

Most days I’m sad I cannot play and have to lower my IQ reading dungeon forum posts.

Today, today is the day, I say nay! The dungeon forum is better than gameplay. May this day live in infamy.

End game is PvP in dungeon forums.

Elitist vs Casuals it seems. No rules, because there are no enforcers (unless you get butt/hurt and report a post)