Do people actually care about the buffs effect/level of effect even? Yay more magic find?
The only people that care about that are the ones that will leave wvw if there’s no commander on the map.
What they should do is make outnumbered provide useful buffs to solo players and small groups. Things like…
*siege costs less supply
*sentries/towers no longer mark your location on the map
*white swords take twice as long to trigger
The problem is: if they give an actual useful buff to outnumbered, there will be people like “Gtfo of my map, I want my outnumbered buff back”. Also I wouldn’t mind some extra MF. The last time I dropped a precursor was 3 years ago.
4 years in and I still haven’t gotten a precursor
People are always going to kitten about something, at least this gives outnumbered players incentive to keep trying instead of just logging off.
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
They could add a pet finisher to “Sic ’em”. Maybe nerf the pet damage/speed buff bonus from it to balance it.
It would be better off on search and rescue since the skill was nerfed into the ground. Give it 900 range, rename it to something like “fetch”, and give it a 30 second cooldown.
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
Since when did they start balancing around zergs? I thought they were still balancing around pvp/pve raids…
Does this mean they are finally going to do something about the ridiculous boon sharing?
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LGN
Do people actually care about the buffs effect/level of effect even? Yay more magic find?
The only people that care about that are the ones that will leave wvw if there’s no commander on the map.
What they should do is make outnumbered provide useful buffs to solo players and small groups. Things like…
*siege costs less supply
*sentries/towers no longer mark your location on the map
*white swords take twice as long to trigger
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
As far as I know anet has never given exact numbers on how many players it takes to trigger the outnumbered buff.
If both of the other servers are queued as well that means the ratio of enemies to allies is 2 to 1, maybe that’s all you need to trigger it and everyone had the buff.
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
Honestly, this thief build has so many hard counters, they’re almost a non-issue (aside from near perma-stealthing.) Any class with AoE, GTAoE, PBAoE, or channeled non-target DPS hard counters this thief. These thief builds are a non-issue outside of their excessive stealthing and the runes are a non-issue.
….. I feel like you don’t know what hard counter means
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LGN
Sigil of earth, precision stat, sharpened edge, hidden barbs, sharpening stone, ancient seeds, madking runes or krait runes.
Its a gimmick build
What’s sad is that this is because Shortbow is so bad that people would rather pick Longbow as their condi choice…
I originally ran it with shortbow because you could proc ancient seeds x5…. then they nerfed that and there was absolutely no reason not to run longbow over sh*tbow
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LGN
No counter!? Equip a shield, run the defense traitline. You now have blocks, reflects, a kitten ton of sustain, and passive "save your kitten traits. And as a warrior you have plenty of gap closers and damage, you can pretty much brush up against a glass druid and ruin his day.
Lol, no, that doesn’t remotely cut it. Have you played the build before? It’s far stronger than you give it credit for.
You said against a glassy druid. Do you know how much damage a warrior can inflict on a glassy druid?
Now if you are talking about fighting a bunker druid you need to run a comparable berserker build in which case the fight will end in a stale mate unless one of them screws up.
Since the adrenal health buff good warriors have had no problems fighting druids. In fact the bunker druid build is pretty much the only build a ranger has where they don’t have to seriously outplay a warrior to win (and even then it’s unlikely you can kill them without the warrior just breaking combat), since warriors have such easy access to stability, (when built right) they are all but immune to soft cc, they have plenty of gap closers, high up time of retal paired with high vit and toughness, and they have multiple stun breaks on stupid short cooldowns.
He said base warrior, base warrior doesn’t have “multiple stunbreaks on short cool downs” or at least not ones you can list without most people bursting out laughing. They also don’t have high toughness, it’s higher than medium armour classes but it makes about a 5% difference as Choppy is saying zerk base warrior, I really wouldn’t make that a lynch pin of your argument.
The way to kill the base warrior is hilariously simple, deny burst skill and kite around, something the druid build excels at. Don’t forget base warrior needs to also build 3 bars of adrenaline to keep up the high adrenal healing unlike berserkers who spam it on cool down. Sad to say but core warrior is actually very balanced and losing to one as an elite spec is not something you should be doing.
If you hadn’t noticed I tend to use the names for the base profession and the elite specs interchangeably. If you read closely you would have noticed this line, “Now if you are talking about fighting a bunker druid you need to run a comparable berserker build”.
Complaining that a vanilla glass build has to fight an uphill battle against a HoT bunker build has no place in this discussion. That isn’t a druid problem, that’s a HoT power creep problem.
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LGN
No counter!? Equip a shield, run the defense traitline. You now have blocks, reflects, a kitten ton of sustain, and passive "save your kitten traits. And as a warrior you have plenty of gap closers and damage, you can pretty much brush up against a glass druid and ruin his day.
Lol, no, that doesn’t remotely cut it. Have you played the build before? It’s far stronger than you give it credit for.
You said against a glassy druid. Do you know how much damage a warrior can inflict on a glassy druid?
Now if you are talking about fighting a bunker druid you need to run a comparable berserker build in which case the fight will end in a stale mate unless one of them screws up.
Since the adrenal health buff good warriors have had no problems fighting druids. In fact the bunker druid build is pretty much the only build a ranger has where they don’t have to seriously outplay a warrior to win (and even then it’s unlikely you can kill them without the warrior just breaking combat), since warriors have such easy access to stability, (when built right) they are all but immune to soft cc, they have plenty of gap closers, high up time of retal paired with high vit and toughness, and they have multiple stun breaks on stupid short cooldowns.
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
Glassy druid builds, on the other hand, are generally part of the weaker builds.
Wait, what? Glassier druid builds are extremely powerful in the hands of a skilled player. To the point that I’ve pretty much resigned myself to accepting I have no counter for them as a vanilla warrior in small scale wvw (and I’m ok with that, I don’t think they should be nerfed).
Seriously, if you play druid and assumed going glassy is weak, you should have a second look at that. Staff/gs and staff/lb can be extremely effective if played right.
No counter!? Equip a shield, run the defense traitline. You now have blocks, reflects, a kitten ton of sustain, and passive “save your kitten ” traits. And as a warrior you have plenty of gap closers and damage, you can pretty much brush up against a glass druid and ruin his day.
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
Having to reveal themselves to apply basi is exactly the same as our recommendation for the trap change. How can you be okay with 1 but not the other? Where is the logic in that?
Alright, I’m trying to type slowly:
If I’m using a skill that reveals me on hit then it’s in my control.
If I had a trap that is triggered on demand, it would somehow destroy the purpose of traps and would also be useless if the “perma stealthed” thief works without any traps at all.
Now?
And btw: I care if I’m called he and man (although Heman is nice) all the time – I can call you she all the time if you like.
How would having the option to activate your own trap destroy it’s purpose? It would still work if someone walked over it, it just means you have the option to get rid of it if you placed it in a bad spot.
And there is a difference between perma stealth and ghost thief. Perma stealth isn’t going to be able to kill anyone. Even in your own example of a ghost thief without traps you couldn’t come up with an effective build without revealing yourself.
This is a targeted change that in no way hurts any other build and would actually give anet room to improve on the traps.
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
Having to reveal themselves to apply basi is exactly the same as our recommendation for the trap change. How can you be okay with 1 but not the other? Where is the logic in that?
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
Which is exactly what you are doing as you don’t get what I wrote the past 3 posts adressed to you
What do you expect: “Yes it would be great if traps had 2 buttons so I can activate them if I want them to do direct damage” which would be completely useless if this build works without traps – and I’m sure it does if it even works without rune of the trapper. So another useless nerf for thief and another “boohoo perma stealth thread” a few days afterwards.
The build doesn’t work without at least 1 trap… thats the whole reason it was targeted for a change in this thread.
For kittens sake man try to keep up…
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
I’m struggling to understand why you would be opposed to giving traps an overhaul to make them worthwhile outside of that 1 kittenty build?
Why are you defending bunker druids?
ETA: I hope you got my last point: I’m “defending trapper thieves” (which I don’t like as well, but I just leave them which must be very boring for them) because I don’t want my class to be nerfed because of bullkitten like this. And I’m honestly annoyed by all the incompetence when it comes to thief.
Deflecting again smh….
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
This completely solves the problem, it would allow them to improve on the traps since they would no longer be the cornerstone of a broken build, and it in no way “destroys thief”. If you are going to continue to argue please argue against those points and not some random thing you remember from another thread.
I already did answer to “those point” – and I only remembered caltrops from anther thread – as I also know that caltrops are the main damage source of a “ghost thief”.
You glanced over the thread again……
“They need the immobilize from needle trap to hold their opponents in place long enough to stack bleeds.”
I’m struggling to understand why you would be opposed to giving traps an overhaul to make them worthwhile outside of that 1 kittenty build?
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
Most ghost thieves trait one trap that being needle. tripwire does not do a lot, caltrops is used in most builds and is not a trap. traiting SA with some combo of SR BP and HIS and lower cooldown on deceptions will get more stealth than trapper runes.
It will still exist without trappers as it can be played without trappers.
ETA: I haven’t tried it myself, so I’m not sure it works but I guess if it does (what I assume) “ghost thief” will still be in game, no matter if it’s with or without traps.
Only problem would be to get enough dodges and still keep trickery and SA and do decent condi damage.
A thief could stay perma stealthed without the trap but they wouldn’t be able to kill anyone. They need the immobilize from needle trap to hold their opponents in place long enough to stack bleeds. This is why I’m suggesting adding direct damage to that trap.
To sum up this thread since you only seem to glance at the content before randomly attacking and arguing against things that no one wrote:
Trapper runes aren’t needed to make a ghost thief build, removing them solves nothing.
Adding direct damage to needle trap and tripwire would prevent a thief from remaining in stealth 100% of the time while fighting.
To prevent random reveals they would need to give those traps a second function that let you manually activate them
This completely solves the problem, it would allow them to improve on the traps since they would no longer be the cornerstone of a broken build, and it in no way “destroys thief”. If you are going to continue to argue please argue against those points and not some random thing you remember from another thread.
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
It slightly raises the skill floor when using traps (which isn’t a bad thing), but if that’s too difficult for you to deal with you might suggest a secondary skill on those 2 traps that let you manually trigger them yourself. This way if you place them in an area and end up not using them you can pop them yourself and not randomly get revealed later.
I wonder how much more you guys want to raise the skill floor for thief while lowering it for all other classes.
If you bothered to read what I wrote I offered a suggestion that would work without making things too hard for you.
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LGN
By that logic every thief weapon skill nullifies their base mechanics and they should always be allowed to remain in stealth.
Yes, there is a logic behind that: If I’m using stealth and backstab or any stealth related attack that reveals me it’s in my hand “I’m at 50% health, I can survive to be revealed”, if something like traps randomly reveals me without me having control over it it’s bad. If some other class has got reveal skills which also reveal me for a rather long time it’s also really bad as I have absolutely no control over that and often no means to pass the time until I can get my defensive stuff back.
Not randomly using the skill is your control over it…..
It slightly raises the skill floor when using traps (which isn’t a bad thing), but if that’s too difficult for you to deal with you might suggest a secondary skill on those 2 traps that let you manually trigger them yourself. This way if you place them in an area and end up not using them you can pop them yourself and not randomly get revealed later.
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
Saying that direct dmg on traps nullify a thief’s class mechanic is like saying, cd on other classes weapon skills nullify their ability to use weapon skills …
It does nullify thief’s base mechanics for the duration of reveal – better?
By that logic every thief weapon skill nullifies their base mechanics and they should always be allowed to remain in stealth.
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
Trapper runes have little to do with a Ghost thief.
The runes provide 2 seconds of stealth on a 30 second cooldown. How the heck is that OP?
If you trait for respite and mastery you can get 4 seconds stealth on a 24 second cooldown.
The issue is NOT TRAPPERS runes. It is stealth stacking via DP using BP and HS.
A much more potent ghost thief would use Hide In shadows , traps with respite and Perplexity runes. They can maintain permanent stealth with DP. They can also use Torment or Balthzar again adding conditions every 15 seconds just by healing.
Now I can make a Ghost thief work using Perpexity runes, Tormenting runes , Balthazar runes, Trapper runes but can not make it work using s/d or p/p or SB or s/p. Wh ys ithat if the issue trapper runes?
^This
Removing trapper runes doesn’t get rid of the ghost thief, it’s pointless to debate that any further. The argument now is whether or not ghost thief should be allowed to exist.
I don’t personally care either way. The only time they become a threat is when they run in groups of 3 or more and even then they are a lot less of a threat than 3 power thieves coordinating their bursts.
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
Of course other classes fully benefit of the rune and would furthermore benefit from it if thief the class was nerfed because of that rune.
If you add reveal on damage the dodge (caltrops) wouldn’t work anymore, traps wouldn’t work anymore and so on.
Is it really that bad that you guys have to take one for the team? “I want I want I want me me me me me!!”
Let’s remove the rune – wouldn’t be the first.
Wtf are you talking about? I never said add reveal on damage, I said add direct damage (which already causes reveal)to 2 of the traps. That wouldn’t affect caltrops at all because caltrops isn’t a trap and only does condition damage.
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
Adding a lot of good direct damage to trap would be a good way to go, on the other hand there is really no logical explanation as why we have these op runes that basically gives stealth to classes that shall not have it and makes classes that already has plenty of stealth get even more, not a single good player at any higher rate has used em it’s basically a troll spec that’s been working a bit over the top in WvW since release of the scrub runes.
So many contradictions in this post…
Somehow the runes are OP although they are only good for trolling and no good player will use them lol.
Here’s a reason they should stay, for variety and fun. Not everything in the game has to be the uber best meta choice, the game is dying, one of the ways to keep it fun is to goof around on dumb builds.
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
They already needlessly nerfed the runes once without fixing the problem. What they need to do is add direct damage to needle trap and possibly to trip wire so that the thief is revealed when using them.
No, they simply need to remove the rune as there’s no reason to destroy thief because of a stupid rune.
How would that destroy thief? What thief even uses traps unless they are going for a perma stealth build? All this would do is make (1 or possibly 2) thief traps function like every other trap. Hell they could even improve tripwire by giving it a nice damage spike.
Also, multiple professions use traps. If you are so worried about “destroying” professions you shouldn’t be recommending something that is going to needlessly harm multiple professions in order to fix a problem with 1 build.
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
+1 in any fight, no matter the profession or build is pretty deadly, unless you’re running bunker, then you might have a chance.
I do agree though that they should remove rune of the trapper from the game.
They already needlessly nerfed the runes once without fixing the problem. What they need to do is add direct damage to needle trap and possibly to trip wire so that the thief is revealed when using them.
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
I’d much rather have a ghost (trapper) thief +1 a fight than a power thief. All you have to do is have decent condi clear and keep moving and you can pretty much ignore them. A power thief can come in and wreck you if you are already low on health.
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
Ha, boomerang, cool idea.
What about a slingshot? Something that really was used as a weapon in history. Allthough maybe only as a distraction.
Or a spear/javelin, one for on land. Like the paragon
A hammer isn’t something I see equipped on a ranger/druid. Feels more like a brawn over brains ‘’me hulk smash’ warrior kind of weapon to me. Leave it for those professions imo
I still stand by the fact that the meta roaming Druid is OP. It takes a degree of skill to play but it is much the same as old school Cele Ele and many people agree. Almost anyone that doesn’t agree is a Druid main.
almost everyone that does agree are players that have 0 experience playing a druid.
I might main a druid but I play every class and I don’t even run the bunker build everyone is complaining about. I’m not defending it because a nerf would affect me in any way. I just understand how it works and I have been trying to share that knowledge with people who are clearly clueless (lol 8k staff auto).
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
Ha, boomerang, cool idea.
What about a slingshot? Something that really was used as a weapon in history. Allthough maybe only as a distraction.
Or a spear/javelin, one for on land. Like the paragon
A hammer isn’t something I see equipped on a ranger/druid. Feels more like a brawn over brains ‘’me hulk smash’ warrior kind of weapon to me. Leave it for those professions imo
Seriously, there isn’t any OP class atm. You might run into a build that counters yours but anything can be beaten 1v1.
Overpowered isn’t defined as any class/build that has no weakness to another build or builds in a cage match. Overpowered in this context means a significant advantage against most other players of similar skill using other builds.
In this case, the current Bunker Druid builds when played by a decent player are extremely difficult to beat. They are dangerous to non-bunker builds, can stalemate most bunker builds and can typically make it to any door on a map simply by running and stealthing even with multiple players trying to kill them. They also have a fairly shallow degree of difficulty to play.
Replace druid in that paragraph with any other bunker and you get pretty much the same result.
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
You guys shouldn’t cry “learn to play” whenever someone suggests Druid is unbalanced in a few areas. Delusional Thief players have been using that excuse for a very long time, so it’s lost all credibility. You don’t want to bring yourselves down to their level, do you?
umm…. losing to a thief is a l2p issue.
Seriously, there isn’t any OP class atm. You might run into a build that counters yours but anything can be beaten 1v1.
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
I’ve always wanted a main hand dagger with a 3 part auto that bleeds the target on the first 2 attacks and applies torment on the third. Skill 2 would be a 600 range leap that applies aoe chill where you land. Skill 3 would be an evasive roll backwards while you simultaneously throw a dagger that poisons and immobilizes.
Of course it would also be fun to have a hammer again. Bunny thumper elite spec
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
Sorry, this is not how advertising works.
I doubt you’ll get viewers like this.
I don’t stream myself, but out of curiosity, what would you do if you had a stream you wanted to ‘advertise’?
At the very least he could have given some kind of description the type of build, is it SPvP, WvW, roaming, dueling, havoc, etc.
I opened the thread when it was first posted and immediately closed it because for all I know this is a video of a bearbow in open world PvE.
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
You lose out on the reduced trap cooldowns but your traps will actually do some damage and you’ll constantly be stacking bleeds. Between spiketrap, taunt, takedown (smokescale) and point blank shot shot you should be proccing ancient seeds pretty much every time it comes off cooldown.
I haven’t tested this out yet so if CA isn’t recharging fast enough you may want to drop 1 of the traps for “protect me”. This will give you a second stun break, protection, another taunt to proc ancient seeds, and another 10 seconds of regen to help recharge CA. It also acts as another source of swiftness for better mobility.
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
Probably the build i crafted for roaming. The bleed is probably coming from the CC > immobilize trait (ancient seeds). You can find a video and written guide here:
It gives reduced cooldown for traps and smoke cloud, plus quickdraw would let them get off multiple blast finishers or hunter’s shot.
Shouts and ancestral grace x2 make for decent out of combat mobility. They might also be running regen food instead of on crit to recharge CA more quickly.
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LGN
Condis were only really coming from the traps…but this guy wa sin and out of stealth a LOT…i mean like every 5 seconds he was poofin away…and when we would get him close to down, out comes the staff and he goes from almost no health up to 3/4 full in like 2 skills…i just can’t figure it out.
Need more info than that. Were they stacking bleeds on you or were you only getting conditions when you ran into their traps? It could be a crit bleed build or just a standard power build using trapper runes for the stealth and super speed.
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
ya as op as druid is made out to be (it is pretty amazing) I still see fair representation of all classes when in wvw. I find it hard to believe that many people are so proper about not rushing to pickup the next op thing. If druid was so op it just had to be nerfed hard trust me, there would be like a 5-1 ratio of them in wvw because that’s probably the ratio of people who have no shame when it comes to winning.
That’s because druids are only strong in small scale and most of the people are just here for the blobs and ppt.
And these are the people that come to complain about dying to druids.
“I died to a dueling build on my staff ele, please nerf”
Easy now, was just about to post that. Yesterday I got my pixels beat up by a thief, while fighting a RANGER too, on my staff ele build.
It’s not fair that the thief can stealth over and over and over, while eles don’t have any reveal and their staff skills are so slow. Where is my ele version of double 10k vaults hmm? Am I expected to run DD for another 4 years to be even remotely competitive? Where are my stealth skills? Can’t even make use of runes of the trapper because we don’t have traps… Why is it that thief gets ultimate stealth PLUS ultimate mobility PLUS ultimate burst PLUS have access to make these super condi builds that melt you? Eles have low hp too so why don’t eles have similar movement skills to run away better? Where is my ele condi bomb build so I can laugh at my opponent frantically trying to run away while their hp are ticking out?
Speaking of condi, where are all my super condi clears? It’s not like the meta hasn’t been all about the condi for a long time… Would stand to reason that eles should get equivalent condi clears to other classes like necro and guardian and warrior and druid, and go into stealth like thief while removing condi too lol… It’s not right that thief can just layer stealth plus condi over and over and over while I’m standing there unable to clear or run properly…
And through the whole fight the druid was nothing more than an annoyance, it took the thief to kill me… Go figure… Nerf OP thief.
Edit- and the Druid was running that supposed “cheese op” builds people are complaining about too.
I checked, “See all messages by Swagger.1459”
because I remember saw you lot of times in the ranger forum before.
Do not disguise your self to ele fellow ranger, don’t try any dirty tricks.
I have one of each profession and that’s a true story. Thief OP, Ranger UP.
Still main Ranger and that won’t change, but I have to be honest.
I also have one of each and I can’t agree with meta wvw druid being UP. It’s plain kittened to say that considering they have all a cele d/d ele has but better and an easy access to stealth + a pet.
It’s not because other builds can do well vs that build that it isn’t overall over-performing. When you take in what is sacrifice and what is gained relative to what other can sacrifice and gain for the same sacrifice, it’s pretty kitten cheesy.
It sacrifices a crap ton of personal damage for sustain. That’s a big part of why it does so poorly outside of 1v1’s.
More than a cele d/d ele?
Cele ele was dominating before the HoT power creep. It was basically on par with current builds when everything else was significantly weaker.
Sure but you do realize you do all they ever did but better on every aspect and then add stealth and a pet?
Stealth is probably what makes it too much in WvW to be fair. In pvp stealth is no problem but in WvW it’s enough to break a lot. It’s just too easy to get away from situations anybody else would have died long ago whwn you have so many ways to evade death and pursuit. The only way to defeat a druid in WvW is massive cc chains. If you can’t pull that along with the required damage spike just go home, you loose your time.
If you are that hard to threaten, it should not be that easy to be a threat to others. Druids do WAY too good damage for their level of defense. Yes, I agree the HoT power-creep is largely to blame and that druid are not alone to drip cheese like that but it is what it is.
BTW, I did the same discourse for other builds including the cele ele back then. It’s not a case of nerf all but me or nerf all that kill me. It’s a case of do a better job at balance.
^
trust me people like jim hunter or justine only mained druid and obviously havent played other class
Lolwhat?
My first was a warrior, second a mesmer (was main), 3rd a new warrior (was main), 4th ranger (was main), fifth is rev(new main).
Not sure why I got to prove anything, I agree celestial shadow needs to be changed. Everything else? Those are the things that make for good roamers. They are used on other roamers, they are used on druids and if they didn’t exist on druids they would be more apparent on those other classes and zerglings would be crying about them instead. L2p or go hide in a zerg or tower and leave roaming to roamers who know how to build a roamer and play like one.
If they tone down the access to stealth I agree it would go along way to help re-balance.
Juts remove the stealth on celestial shadow and give something else instead and call it “celestial [something else]” instead. Why always more stealth ANET…
I’m thinking the noobs crying would benefit more from celestial shadow competing with ancient seeds as a grand master trait. Cause you know these are the same people who can’t figure out how to get out of roots that die to a mean glare or are rendered useless by all the reduction/removal of immobilize given freely to everyone that has the sense to use them. I’m surprised we haven’t seen “black hole op perma immobilize” type threads. Of course that would require them to actually know about the skills a druid has.
Funny how the 2 people that know about druid traits recommended the same thing at the same time.
Inb4 some zergling cries about how rangers would still be op
Everything about rangers and druids is op. That’s why you, I and 95% of the player base will only ever play this class cause we are skill-less noobs carried by an easy to play class.
2k range
15-20k rapid fire
100k barrage
perma stealth
perma protection/dmg reduction/ dmg immunity
evade chaining
blocking
10k laser beams
one shot f2 x 2
15k mauls
perma super speed
0% to 100% heals instantly every 10sec
probably more stuff
and more stuff
oh and that op thing too
don’t know why I put druid aside, oh I suppose it had something to do with all the bunker builds face tanking me on glass gear stat, yay block-spam dragon hunter, reflect-invulnerable scrapper, reflect-invulnerable tempest, regen/stance king berserker, block-invulnerable chronomancer, health bar-swapping reaper, evade-chain daredevil and I suppose dueling revenants.
Nothing else can come close to competing with druid leetness though. The only thing truly holding druids back from god-mode is flying pets that we can mount and ride around. Of course we don’t have flying pets but in the mind of the non-druids we do because lol fire wyrven.
Can you tone down the ridiculous staw men? I mean, come on, reply to what has been factually said on the other side of the fence instead of replying to what you pretend the they said.
I know Puck is not a new player so I have zero reasons to doubt his skill. I was making an argument using comparison between builds. If you disagree with it lets see your arguments instead of referring to all naysayers as “noob crying” or stuff like that.
You know we’re not making fun of you when we start joking like this, we’re just making fun of the ridiculous claims that people made like the druids 8k staff auto lol.
Your argument is basically that if a person knows what he is doing and plays well he can beat a druid, but druid is too forgiving in a 1v1. Nothing wrong with that. That’s a justifiable argument.
There are just way too many people here trying to claim this build is god mode and it can 1vZerg.
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
ya as op as druid is made out to be (it is pretty amazing) I still see fair representation of all classes when in wvw. I find it hard to believe that many people are so proper about not rushing to pickup the next op thing. If druid was so op it just had to be nerfed hard trust me, there would be like a 5-1 ratio of them in wvw because that’s probably the ratio of people who have no shame when it comes to winning.
That’s because druids are only strong in small scale and most of the people are just here for the blobs and ppt.
And these are the people that come to complain about dying to druids.
“I died to a dueling build on my staff ele, please nerf”
Easy now, was just about to post that. Yesterday I got my pixels beat up by a thief, while fighting a RANGER too, on my staff ele build.
It’s not fair that the thief can stealth over and over and over, while eles don’t have any reveal and their staff skills are so slow. Where is my ele version of double 10k vaults hmm? Am I expected to run DD for another 4 years to be even remotely competitive? Where are my stealth skills? Can’t even make use of runes of the trapper because we don’t have traps… Why is it that thief gets ultimate stealth PLUS ultimate mobility PLUS ultimate burst PLUS have access to make these super condi builds that melt you? Eles have low hp too so why don’t eles have similar movement skills to run away better? Where is my ele condi bomb build so I can laugh at my opponent frantically trying to run away while their hp are ticking out?
Speaking of condi, where are all my super condi clears? It’s not like the meta hasn’t been all about the condi for a long time… Would stand to reason that eles should get equivalent condi clears to other classes like necro and guardian and warrior and druid, and go into stealth like thief while removing condi too lol… It’s not right that thief can just layer stealth plus condi over and over and over while I’m standing there unable to clear or run properly…
And through the whole fight the druid was nothing more than an annoyance, it took the thief to kill me… Go figure… Nerf OP thief.
Edit- and the Druid was running that supposed “cheese op” builds people are complaining about too.
I checked, “See all messages by Swagger.1459”
because I remember saw you lot of times in the ranger forum before.
Do not disguise your self to ele fellow ranger, don’t try any dirty tricks.
I have one of each profession and that’s a true story. Thief OP, Ranger UP.
Still main Ranger and that won’t change, but I have to be honest.
I also have one of each and I can’t agree with meta wvw druid being UP. It’s plain kittened to say that considering they have all a cele d/d ele has but better and an easy access to stealth + a pet.
It’s not because other builds can do well vs that build that it isn’t overall over-performing. When you take in what is sacrifice and what is gained relative to what other can sacrifice and gain for the same sacrifice, it’s pretty kitten cheesy.
It sacrifices a crap ton of personal damage for sustain. That’s a big part of why it does so poorly outside of 1v1’s.
More than a cele d/d ele?
Cele ele was dominating before the HoT power creep. It was basically on par with current builds when everything else was significantly weaker.
Sure but you do realize you do all they ever did but better on every aspect and then add stealth and a pet?
Stealth is probably what makes it too much in WvW to be fair. In pvp stealth is no problem but in WvW it’s enough to break a lot. It’s just too easy to get away from situations anybody else would have died long ago whwn you have so many ways to evade death and pursuit. The only way to defeat a druid in WvW is massive cc chains. If you can’t pull that along with the required damage spike just go home, you loose your time.
If you are that hard to threaten, it should not be that easy to be a threat to others. Druids do WAY too good damage for their level of defense. Yes, I agree the HoT power-creep is largely to blame and that druid are not alone to drip cheese like that but it is what it is.
BTW, I did the same discourse for other builds including the cele ele back then. It’s not a case of nerf all but me or nerf all that kill me. It’s a case of do a better job at balance.
^
trust me people like jim hunter or justine only mained druid and obviously havent played other class
Lolwhat?
My first was a warrior, second a mesmer (was main), 3rd a new warrior (was main), 4th ranger (was main), fifth is rev(new main).
Not sure why I got to prove anything, I agree celestial shadow needs to be changed. Everything else? Those are the things that make for good roamers. They are used on other roamers, they are used on druids and if they didn’t exist on druids they would be more apparent on those other classes and zerglings would be crying about them instead. L2p or go hide in a zerg or tower and leave roaming to roamers who know how to build a roamer and play like one.
If they tone down the access to stealth I agree it would go along way to help re-balance.
Juts remove the stealth on celestial shadow and give something else instead and call it “celestial [something else]” instead. Why always more stealth ANET…
I’m thinking the noobs crying would benefit more from celestial shadow competing with ancient seeds as a grand master trait. Cause you know these are the same people who can’t figure out how to get out of roots that die to a mean glare or are rendered useless by all the reduction/removal of immobilize given freely to everyone that has the sense to use them. I’m surprised we haven’t seen “black hole op perma immobilize” type threads. Of course that would require them to actually know about the skills a druid has.
Funny how the 2 people that know about druid traits recommended the same thing at the same time.
Inb4 some zergling cries about how rangers would still be op
Everything about rangers and druids is op. That’s why you, I and 95% of the player base will only ever play this class cause we are skill-less noobs carried by an easy to play class.
2k range
15-20k rapid fire
100k barrage
perma stealth
perma protection/dmg reduction/ dmg immunity
evade chaining
blocking
10k laser beams
one shot f2 x 2
15k mauls
perma super speed
0% to 100% heals instantly every 10sec
probably more stuff
and more stuff
oh and that op thing too
don’t know why I put druid aside, oh I suppose it had something to do with all the bunker builds face tanking me on glass gear stat, yay block-spam dragon hunter, reflect-invulnerable scrapper, reflect-invulnerable tempest, regen/stance king berserker, block-invulnerable chronomancer, health bar-swapping reaper, evade-chain daredevil and I suppose dueling revenants.
Nothing else can come close to competing with druid leetness though. The only thing truly holding druids back from god-mode is flying pets that we can mount and ride around. Of course we don’t have flying pets but in the mind of the non-druids we do because lol fire wyrven.
Ummm the fire wyvern evades attacks for like 5 seconds while shooting fire. Super op pet, please nerf.
A possibly acceptable nerf would be transferring all the dmg I would have dealt to the evading pet f2 , with my 360° power/condi cleaves, to the ranger instead. This way it preserves my skillful aoe spamming while punishing the druid who is probably using those skill-less often single taget weapons.
That sounds fair. I mean wyverns are already doing 20k wing swipes, do they really need to be able to breathe fire on top of that?
Also known as Puck when my account isn’t suspended
LGN
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