Guild Wars 2

uknortherner.2670:

-1 for open world duelling and -1 for yet another thread on this topic when a million of them already exist.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Open-world-Duels-Merged/page/25#post3301763

haha you must really not like dueling. i never realized it’s even in your sig.

I can’t imagine how frustrating it must be to be against such a commonly requested feature.

timmyf.1490:

I believe the main problem is that it creates a TERRIBLE first impression of the game for anybody who begins with a human character. (Which is the plurality choice.) Those champ train folks can get rather nasty in map chat.

my first “wow” moment in the game was my first encounter with a map zerg. 30 people fighting one giant mob is what i got the game for. Also, this isn’t my first online game so i’m neither bothered or surprised that map chat generally sucks.

they said in an interview that they would like to add open world dueling at some point. Nothing really beyond that though, no time frame or anything.

that said, your thread will be moved to suggestions and merged with the amorphous blob that has become the original duel thread. This is assuming the duel haters don’t pile into the thread and and get it closed due to unhealthy discussion.

edit; called it! i should be a mod, lol.

Fortus.6175:

Scrambles.2604:

Ghostwolf.9863:

Fortus.6175:

16.5k (s) self buffed WvW, on lvl 80s…..goes to show “balance”

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9d4Og8KbEM

So how hard would you suggest a backstab should hit with 20 stacks of might, in a build that focus 90% around landing the first backstab, blowing all utilties, geared with full ascended berserk?

I think 16.5k is fine when someone isn’t equipped with toughness.
Since with some toughness and the protection buff it would take it down to 10k, with invulnerability 0. Someone can prevent getting hit at all by a build focusing 90% (the other 10% for casting 1 more cloak and dagger or 2 heartseekers) around hitting the first 2 attacks thanks to invulnerability and blocks, should invulnerability and blocks be nerfed?

Also by turning at the right time, it would take down that 16.5k to 8250,
with protection and some toughness even down to 5k in that case,
that’s 28% of warriors base health! and the hammer can deal overkill dmg with 2 strikes on that thief.

I would be happy if I could turn my front to the elementalist hitting me 10k to take 5k,
or turn my front to the warrior eviscerating me for 15k to take 7.5k dmg.

the video would be 4 times as long if it included all the footage of him getting two shotted and insta-gibbed with that glassiest of glass-cannon builds.

but it isnt, because unlike most thieves, he isnt a bad player and knows how to use stealth, blinds, teleports and above all; common sense…… things that your average Joe thief player cant do and hence they think their class is “bad”

Wanna play a profession on tribulation mode? Try elementalists with full zerker, with no stealth, clones, aegis, mobility, heals, disengage on lower than 40 seconds CD, then come here again , we will all accept your apologies

haha, nice try Fortus, but my first 80 was an Ele and is probably the char i’m most familiar with.

I rolled a Thief after getting ganked on my Ele a bunch and now i don’t have as much trouble with thieves. Maybe if you spent as much time playing a thief as you do QQing you may learn a thing or two

edit; i forgot to make a point, haha.

A video of highlights, of only the most positive aspects of the most extreme offensive build, isn’t great evidence. It shows only the positive potentials of the build but none of the negative potentials.

I would argue that if you run this build you would spend the majority of your time grappling with the negative aspects, and a small portion of the rest of your time ganking people.

Ghostwolf.9863:

Fortus.6175:

16.5k (s) self buffed WvW, on lvl 80s…..goes to show “balance”

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9d4Og8KbEM

So how hard would you suggest a backstab should hit with 20 stacks of might, in a build that focus 90% around landing the first backstab, blowing all utilties, geared with full ascended berserk?

I think 16.5k is fine when someone isn’t equipped with toughness.
Since with some toughness and the protection buff it would take it down to 10k, with invulnerability 0. Someone can prevent getting hit at all by a build focusing 90% (the other 10% for casting 1 more cloak and dagger or 2 heartseekers) around hitting the first 2 attacks thanks to invulnerability and blocks, should invulnerability and blocks be nerfed?

Also by turning at the right time, it would take down that 16.5k to 8250,
with protection and some toughness even down to 5k in that case,
that’s 28% of warriors base health! and the hammer can deal overkill dmg with 2 strikes on that thief.

I would be happy if I could turn my front to the elementalist hitting me 10k to take 5k,
or turn my front to the warrior eviscerating me for 15k to take 7.5k dmg.

the video would be 4 times as long if it included all the footage of him getting two shotted and insta-gibbed with that glassiest of glass-cannon builds.

sorudo.9054:

Scrambles.2604:

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

The only reason why I don’t want dueling is because I don’t want anet to start balancing PvE for 1v1 fights.

PvP nerfs are the worst of all and I don’t want them in PvE.

Are you implying that anet hasn’t already made any balance changes to PvP that effect PvE? Have you ever played an elementalist? haha.

I hope you can rest easy now knowing that 1v1 fights already occur, without open world dueling, and Anet has already implemented pvp balance changes that also effect PvE…again without open world dueling.

then why do you complain about having no duels if you can duel?
really, all you want is PvP everywhere while not keeping in mind the other side.
you’re pretty much what the saying is all about “give someone a finger and he wants the whole hand”

i already told you, sPvP sucks (IMO). The guy in the mysts is some doppleganger of my real character and i don’t enjoy playing on him. And arena dueling is not the same as open world dueling.

Where do you get the idea i “dont keep the other side in mind?” It’s called a duel request, not a duel mandate. If you don’t want to duel then decline and all is well.

I’m not asking for open world pvp, it’s open world duels. It requires consent. The very definition entails “keeping the other side in mind.”

If you took a second a reread some of these posts you might save yourself some typing…oh who am i kidding you’re not going to read this and just say duels belong in WvW.

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

The only reason why I don’t want dueling is because I don’t want anet to start balancing PvE for 1v1 fights.

PvP nerfs are the worst of all and I don’t want them in PvE.

Are you implying that anet hasn’t already made any balance changes to PvP that effect PvE? Have you ever played an elementalist? haha.

I hope you can rest easy now knowing that 1v1 fights already occur, without open world dueling, and Anet has already implemented pvp balance changes that also effect PvE…again without open world dueling.

Merlin Dyfed Avalon.5046:

Man i get so sick of the wvw was never meant to be balanced bullkitten..

No, the game meant to be balanced, but we don’t really care or have enough cash miked from our community to get people to work on it. Or had time before game release to get the system checked, tested or immaginatively designed. so we came up with this carcas people still play with and hope to get the game working as intended future. But that would require someone going over the horribly written code and try CPR for a couple of years.
So we took the easy way out and came up with the statement “it never was meant to be balanced” so we don’t have to look at it again.

Sincerely yours,

Ncsoft’s accountant overseeing Anet’s expenses.

If WvW is balanced then why was sPvP watered down the way it was. To be super-balanced??

sPvP is the closest your going to get to balanced pvp. WvWvW is imbalanced inherently, because one night your server may field a huge population, and another night another server may field that huge population.

Bevillian.1260:

• 10 Silver and 200 Karma per Duel from each player This could be increased or decreased

• Rewards should be double what you spend. For example, 10 Silver and 200 Karma would give the winner 20 silver and 400 Karma. This way the winnings are effectively being transferred from one player to the other.

• When players choose to duel, they are taken to a symmetrical square arena that has an observation mode. When they leave the duel they are sent back to where they were prior to entering the duel

• All players on the server can watch the current matches using the observation mode just like in sPvP now. There could be a list of all Dueling Arenas and anyone could join the server to observe

• Food and Banner buffs removed

• Players can agree on the time limit and set it from 1 to 10 minutes, if nothing is agreed on within 1 minute, the time is set to 5 minutes by default

• Players can only ask another player to duel if they have both friended each other. This will eliminate people spamming and will satisfy the crowd that does not want it because they will never be involved in it or bothered by it in any way

• If a player leaves the duel they will get the dishonorable debuff tweaked for duels that just says they left a duel but allows them to duel again right away

Thoughts?

this only sounds fun if you have no interest in duels or open world duels.

Or if you hate fun, you might enjoy this.

Morrigan.2809:

Scrambles.2604:

Peetee.9406:

No, it’s not.

If you want hard content, make your own. Take off some gear, run a sub-optimal build, play a class that isn’t a warrior or guardian.

When you barrage an inexperienced player with difficult content, you’re just going to make him quit. Look at how many people refuse to dungeons and temples, that’s a difficulty issue.

i hope you don’t honestly think this is a good suggestion.

“oh the content is too easy for you? Have you ever thought about tying your hand behind you back? Playing with your eyes closed? Unplugging your keyboard? Surely that will be fun wont it?”

Obviously i’m exaggerating, but putting it on the player to artificially increase the difficulty is a terrible suggestion. What’s the point of working hard for good gear to then just take it off so i can enjoy content?

The point is hard content shouldn’t be in starter zones- hard content by itself is fine- I love hard content- new players are still learning the game it is not fair to them

Yeah that’s fine. But putting the responsibility on the player to artificially lower the handicap is not fun and a terrible suggestion.

I have more difficulty finding the mouse cursor than i do clicking on the mesmer, thus, i have a lot of trouble clicking on the mesmer, haha.

Peetee.9406:

No, it’s not.

If you want hard content, make your own. Take off some gear, run a sub-optimal build, play a class that isn’t a warrior or guardian.

When you barrage an inexperienced player with difficult content, you’re just going to make him quit. Look at how many people refuse to dungeons and temples, that’s a difficulty issue.

i hope you don’t honestly think this is a good suggestion.

“oh the content is too easy for you? Have you ever thought about tying your hand behind you back? Playing with your eyes closed? Unplugging your keyboard? Surely that will be fun wont it?”

Obviously i’m exaggerating, but putting it on the player to artificially increase the difficulty is a terrible suggestion. What’s the point of working hard for good gear to then just take it off so i can enjoy content?

Pandemoniac.4739:

serialkicker.5274

And where are those plenty reasons? I can only see one, repeated over and over again, just in slightly different words – trolling/harrasing, for which we came to conclusion that no one can predict what would happen if dueling would be implemented and trolling would most likely not be such a big problem as you claim it would be, especially if proper system for accepting/declining would be put in.
But i guess you simply have chosen to ignore those ideas?

“We” did not come to that conclusion, you did. The folks that are opposed to open world duelling know exactly how big a problem it will be because other games have open world duelling and we’ve experienced it.

Spam challenging isn’t that big a deal – there are UI solutions for that – but folks dueling the bank, or in the middle of the dynamic event, or any other area where most of the folks are there for a different purpose is, and there is nothing that the folks that are annoyed by it can do to avoid it without having to leave the area and do something other than they wanted to do.

There is no compelling reason why duelling won’t work as well in a designated area and having a designated area opens up the possibility of making the duels more interesting and meaningful. The main reason I can see for being against designated duelling areas is because you want to troll folks that don’t want to duel, or otherwise annoy folks doing PvE content.

Cmon Pandemoniac, i thought we had been over this enough times to where you would at least understand that arena dueling is not at all the same as open world dueling. Of course dueling would work in arena, but that’s not what we’re asking for, i think that is a compelling reason. If arena dueling was just as good as open world, i would be here telling people to go play sPvP, but i’m not because it sucks.

You are still stuck with this idea that some how, open world dueling would be implemented without ANY of the standard restrictions other games feature (ignore, auto-decline, duel request cooldown) AND also are assuming that the worst possible consequences imaginable would happen all the time.

So, of course you would be against it. Stop thinking about the worst case scenario being common place and start thinking realistically. The exception to the rule isn’t going to all of a sudden become the rule. Or you could log into any other MMO with duels so you can see for yourself how no one will bother you.

And for all of you that claim to be harassed by trolls all the time…what is that saying….if you always meet a jerk in the morning, always meet a jerk at lunch, and you always meet a jerk in the evening…maybe you are the jerk.

Sernius Alathar.6538:

Here is an idea for you Scrambles, why don’t you form your own Duelling Guild, advertise in LA or WvW. Form your group of buddies, and create your own customised arena in the mists. Then you can hash it out with as many people as you like, it’s not hard, its not time consuming I tested out the feature myself. The game is divided into 3 sub-sections PvE (Player vs Environment), sPvP (structured Player vs Player), and WvWvW (World vs World vs World) just defining for you so I can be clear. PvE is not the gaming sub section for duelling, there is a place within the PvP side of the game for it to exist you just need to be more creative, and IF you can’t find a place for it there, then your obviously not thinking laterally. I will concede there is one/two possibilities in my mind where a Duelling Arena could be implemented without interruption to other players, and that would be the Queen’s Gauntlet or possibly the arena at the bottom of the black citadel.

Enable an auto-join 1v1 duel arena function into the lfg, and use the gauntlet as the battlefield. Otherwise, just use the tournament 1v1 in the mists to stroke your own egro and brag about your kitten. This will allow players who WANT to duel a location to do it, Instead of sending out requests every seven steps.

IMO: You are thinking about a global game change to satisfy your own pk inclination, you need to think smaller, because I do not believe for a second the population of open-duellers is as high as you claim it to be.

I didn’t even make this suggestion post. This is just one of many that get posted on here and other subforums almost daily. It’s a pretty commonly requested feature, up there with mounts and guild housing or whatever.

So, i think the amount of people that would like the ability to open world duel is actually higher than you claim it to be.

Open world dueling is a feature in all the other MMOs, and anet said they would like to add it at some point in the game. I would totally play sPvP if i could just play my regular character, but i can’t because of the way they made sPvP a separate game mode.

I don’t understand how wanting to duel equates to ego stroking or my satisfying my urges to kill other players…like it’s a bad thing. I dunno, by your tone you make it sound like i’m some sort of jerk for enjoying competitive gameplay. I mean, i could see where you were coming from if i wanted open pvp so i could gank lowbies…but dueling is a consensual act between two adults so i don’t see why you are trying to demonize it.

WvWvW is balanced in the sense that each server has to deal with the same imbalances.

And while a minor stat increases may be noticeable for an individual player, and individual player is not noticeable in WvW. And for the most part, the distribution of ascended gear should be about the same across servers, so the server you’re fighting most likely has the same amount of people decked in ascended.

Ascended gear comes into play on the micro level, but WvWvW plays on a macro level.

So, in a 1v1, you could theoretically trace a loss to someone being in ascended gear. But in the big picture of WvWvW your little 1v1 battle, or even small group battle, is insigificant.

sorudo.9054:

and what part of “duels ruin the immersion of PvE” is considered?
i don’t know how many games you have played but i have played to many games to count and every time there are open duels it always ends up with annoyance, not just from a PvE aspect but also from a PvP despise aspect.

i enjoy playing in a PvE environment where we battle grand monsters, go out on an adventure and solve great mysteries.
i don’t enjoy seeing others fight each others, being bothered with duel invites and having all kinds of insults being trowed at me.

as it is now is fine the way it is, adding duels adds problems even with an auto decline option.

This is just a difference of opinion. I find a world more immersive when you have players participating and interacting with it and eachother. I am also seriously confused that seeing a player fighting a mob is fair game, but seeing a player fight another player suddenly ruins everything?

You can claim that people will chase you down and harass you constantly in the open world all you want, while i can claim duels would gravitate towards a certain area and most people will just leave you alone in the open world, but in reality neither of us can say what would happen for sure.

The only thing we can say for certain is that in the event that you are chased down, duel requested, and harassed, despite any reasonable preventive measures that would be put in place that exist in other games, (functional ignore, auto-decline, or even a cooldown on how frequently you can request a duel from a person) you are still fully capable of playing the game just as if dueling wasn’t even there.

sorudo.9054:

i just don’t get something, you want duels, ppl give you options and you simply ignore all of them.
we suggested an arena, you ignore it, we suggest it only be done in WvW, you see it as a horrible idea.
however, the moment we say that open world dueling in a PvE place is a bad idea you come up with all kind of excuses that make no sense, you have no idea how many problems dueling adds in the game.
i rather have them not add something to prevent problems then add something that will only cause problems, even potential profit loss due players leaving.

you don’t have an issue with duel trolls because you your self enjoy duels, ppl who simply can’t stand it are plagued with all kinds of annoyances and it does effect the gameplay, even to a point of no return.

i don’t have a problem with duel trolls because – 1) they don’t exist in a significant frequency. It is a possibility if you consider the worst possible outcome and then say it will happen all the time, but in reality this rarely happens.

and 2) Even if you are duel spammed, this does not prevent you from doing anything in the game. You can ignore them, decline the request, go about your business, and the troll cannot do more than request a duel…and this is assuming ignore doesn’t prevent this or there is an auto-decline option.

If you don’t want to duel—don’t—and your game doesn’t change. Your other points have been addressed multiple times but despite all reason, you still seem to be ignoring them.

Sorry, i’m not trying to be disrespectful. I am not arguing against you, i am just arguing against your argument. And your argument is incredibly sensitive

I just feel if there was a feature that you would like to see implemented, that would greatly increase the satisfaction of your gameplay while not impeding my ability to play the way i would like, i would not take issue with it. But i am pretty easy going…if a troll wants to duel spam me for 10 minutes it’s not going to ruin my day, and may not even be a blip on my radar, haha. I would probably go let my dog outside and laugh about this fool who keeps trying to interact with an AFK me. In the big picture, that one interaction with a troll is a drop of water in the ocean that is the rest of my gameplay experience.

Where you argue the implementation of open world dueling would not be game breaking for you, i would argue the lack of open world dueling is gamebreaking for others. I have a lot of friends that never got into GW2 because they could never get into pvp (i wrote about this in more detail in an earlier post in this thread).

It’s sad that GW2 is the only MMO without dueling, because i’ve tried the other MMOs and GW2 is just a lot better in all other aspects.

Sernius Alathar.6538:

I’m not saying I don’t want to interact with players, I am an active member in multiple guilds, as well as an officer in my primary, do not presume that because I want to be challenged by some insignificant noobling that I am being anti-social. I do not like the mechanic, when alternatives exist.

There are no alternatives to open world dueling, except for in WvW. And even if you manage to duel in WvW successfully, you’re still taking a spot from someone who might otherwise be contributing to the war effort in WvW.

You’re not being anti-social by being afraid of getting duel requests, you’re just being too darn sensitive. Some “insigificant noobling” who requests a duel from you is not preventing you from playing the game. Ignore them and go about your business like an adult, so the majority of players who would use duels properly can enjoy it. It’s not fair that your fear of a tiny minority of players trumps the requests of a larger percentage of the player base that would not bother you.

I swear, if group invites weren’t implemented in this game originally, you would have people coming to the forums saying “don’t implement group invites! It’s not necessary since you get your own loot and you cant steal mobs from people! Trolls will just incessantly spam group invite and will never leave me alone!”

Sernius Alathar.6538:

Arenanet Your Community wants duels already.
options to duel other ppl in all over tyria….
so plz open your Eyes at :“duels” duels duels duels duels duels duels duels
duels duels duels duels duels duels duels and duels.
people could spend so much time dueling and having alot of fun instread of sitting in LA and doing nothing.

They listened to you and allowed you the ability to create private instances in the mists, it’s there please pay attention and use it. Open dueling is tedious and irritating, I personally have played enough games with that blah-blah wants to duel message pop op on my UI to know I never want to see it here, did you ever consider that maybe other players don’t want to be hassled while in the middle of chatting, or playing the game?

In an interview, one of the devs acknowledged that you can in fact play 1v1 in a custom sPvP match, but also said it was an awkward round-about way of doing it, and they would like to add dueling in the open world in the future.

I’m sorry that you get irritated when someone requests something from you in game, whether it be via request to duel, a private message, or a guild or group invite, but the very nature of MMOs is that at some point you may have to interact with another player.

I don’t think the argument “i shouldn’t have to deal with other players” carries much weight when half of the appeal of MMOs is that much of what you do involves consensual interaction with other players. As long as there is a measure of consent in place (accept or deny a duel request) the issue comes down to nitpicking and overblowing the worst possible consequences of dealing with other real persons.

Fastbucks.5073:

Hi,

I love this game. I have been here from the beginning and need some help from the devs. I play on a T1 server (Black Gate) and exclusively WvW when I login. The issue I face is that when I get home, login, there are hours of queues to get into the borderlands or EB where fighting takes place.

I know that new overflow maps are coming, but I really wanted to get this meta ache done (since our server will rein number one after the season).

I find myself loggin in, seeing the que and just logging out again. I havent play GW2s in a month for more then a few mins because of this.

Anet, I love this game and love supporting it, but I don’t think I’m alone in this.

Thanks.

haha, this is basically my experience on bg as well, so you are not alone. And when i finally do get into WvW, bg has already captured everything…i know, first world server problems. I don’t want to transfer because i’m poor and i’ve been on this server since the start.

Now i just avoid primetime WvW or hop in the FGS champ train until i get in queue.

I think the overflow WvW servers are gunna be where it’s at once they are implemented. I enjoy WvW for the big fights, not the PPT game.

Pandemoniac.4739:

Scrambles.2604:

So while players may generally gravitate towards dueling in one area, the difference is simply being given the freedom to do so. I think being given that freedom is a huge deal.

Like i said in my post above, most of the disagreement comes from the our own perceptions of the actual impact dueling will have on other people’s games. I think that impact is minimal and just overblown on these forums.

I have played other games with dueling, as well (WoW, SWTOR, DCU), and most duels occur in areas that players tend to gravitate towards, and not really as much out in the open world, yet they are still free to do so if they want. Which is why i maintain that dueling in the open world will not significantly impact your game or impede your ability to play if you choose not to duel.

At this point, we’ll just have to agree to disagree. We accept restrictions on our individual freedom every day so our community as a whole can have a better quality of life, so I don’t find the freedom to choose argument that compelling. You keep telling me open world duelling doesn’t impact me, and I keep telling you it does. If you can’t accept that something that doesn’t bother you could really bug someone else, we can’t make any forward progress and we’ll have to shake hands and part ways.

I’m not arguing my perception of what will happen with open world duelling – I’m arguing from my experience. Your experience is different from mine, because you are actually interested in duelling. My experience is getting pestered by some hyperactive player hopping in circles around me and spam challenging me as fast as I can decline as I’m trying to go about my business and folks insisting on duelling in the most populated areas of the world, which I can’t blame them for because it’s the best way to find opponents, but which is incredibly annoying to me, even though you might not find it to be a big deal.

He who sacrifices liberty for security deserves neither :P Not the best application of the quote but i believe it’s still apt. The point of trolls is to ruin everything, so if you let features get restricted based on the behavior of a tiny percentage of trouble makers you let the trolls win.

Just because someone has trolled you with duel requests once, twice, or a dozen times, is not a great reason to ban open world dueling for everyone for all of eternity.

But you’re right, we are just at odds on this issue. Dueling isn’t important to you, so i can see why you wouldn’t want to put up with minor inconveniences…that might not even happen…or could already happen in game and dont….or do already happen in game but apparently isn’t a gamebreaker at this point.

I’m still impressed you guys manage to get trolled so often in the same games i’ve played and not been trolled in. Maybe i just have a thicker skin then i realize :P

Don’t you get any satisfaction from the knowledge that you set a goal, worked hard, and achieved it, and as a result got the armor you wanted?

Bottlenecks! Forcing your enemy to come through a bottleneck to fight you, or baiting them into a bottleneck is crucial. Bridges work the same, too.

I was roaming in WvW when I stumbled across an enemy Guardian that was decked out in fresh Gem store gear. It was at that point that I laid down my weapons and surrendered—there was no way i could compete with his beauty.

P2W i agree with OP.

Pandemoniac.4739:

Scrambles.2604:

I’m not trying to be inconsiderate to the anti-duel crowd. I just don’t think compromises should be made for something that wont effect you if you don’t want it to.

For example, i have never cared for the super adventure box. I understand other people enjoy it, but it’s simply not for me.

I’m not anti-duel, I’m just against open world duelling. You keep saying it won’t affect us, and we keep saying it will. It’s not like most of us have never played a game with open world duelling. We know exactly how it plays out based on experience. You as an individual might not be inconsiderate, but you can’t speak for the entire population.

Scrambles.2604:

Now imagine if i cried on the forums, “why do they waste their time developing SAB?? why do i have to listen to people discussing the SAB in chat? why do i have to see people carrying around silly SAB skins with their annoying sounds? Why am i getting mail about the SAB!? SAB is detrimental to my gameplay!!”

But in reality, i just choose not to do it, and accept that their are people out their that do enjoy it. And their enjoyment of the SAB doesn’t effect my gameplay if i don’t participate in it.

I’m not arguing against development time being spent on duelling. I actually think it would be a really cool feature if ANet invested more time into it than adding /duel. SAB isn’t a very good comparison, because it’s limited to a specific area, and folks can’t spam you with invitations to join SAB.

On one hand the open world duellers are saying – “oh we’ll just duel in out of the way areas and you’ll never be impacted” and on the other hand they’re saying “I want to be able to duel anyone anywhere at any time”, so I remain unconvinced that limiting duelling to specific areas isn’t a good compromise.

Just like you believe that open world duelling isn’t that inconvenient for the folks that don’t want to deal with it, I believe that easily accessible, limited areas aren’t that much of an inconvenience to the folks that want to duel. As a matter of fact, I see a lot of advantages to giving duellers a location (or several) to gravitate to so they can find other like-minded folks to test themselves against. Actually what’s happened in every game that I’ve played with open world duelling is that there was an unofficial area where most folks would gather to duel. What’s the problem with making it official?

I agree that, in games with duels, players generally tend to gravitate towards what become known as “dueling areas”. It may not seem like that big a deal, but giving players the freedom to decide those things is what makes MMOs so epic. I like being given freedom to decide where i would like to duel, not being given a designated spot.

So while players may generally gravitate towards dueling in one area, the difference is simply being given the freedom to do so. I think being given that freedom is a huge deal.

Like i said in my post above, most of the disagreement comes from the our own perceptions of the actual impact dueling will have on other people’s games. I think that impact is minimal and just overblown on these forums.

I have played other games with dueling, as well (WoW, SWTOR, DCU), and most duels occur in areas that players tend to gravitate towards, and not really as much out in the open world, yet they are still free to do so if they want. Which is why i maintain that dueling in the open world will not significantly impact your game or impede your ability to play if you choose not to duel.

bloodletting wolf.2837:

Scrambles.2604:

bloodletting wolf.2837:

Dude calm down. Duels take place in small out of the way areas and don’t take up that much space. Both sides have valid arguments.

but why do anti-duelers care where people duel if they have no interest in duels themselves? The anti-duel crowd has completely exaggerated the impact duels would have on the game to strengthen their argument.

I don’t think the anti-duel arguments are valid because the frequency of duel spamming, trolls related to duels, and duels impacting people visual space are so slim that it is a non-issue. They’ve taken the most extreme, worst outcomes that might happen if duels existed and made it seem like it would happen all the time.

In reality, and in similar games with duels these events are outlyers and are statistically insignificant. They are possible and may happen, but not enough to impact an individual player’s game.

Are you not reading my post? I want dueling but I don’t want to screw over the entire PvE community to get it. Look at it this way. Some people wanted LS in WvW ( don’t ask me why). When it was implemented they put it in places that made a lot of people mad. Some people want to only PvE and that is their choice so why do we have to invade their game mode with ours everywhere.

Sorry i did read your post but i’m also addressing more issues that have been brought up in this thread. I didn’t get to edit that post so some of the general comments probably seem addressed to you.

I don’t expect us to completely agree on these issues, but more debate only brings to light different caveats on the topic that outside readers may not realize, which is why i persist.

That being said we generally disagree on if dueling even constitutes as “invading someone else’s game.” Yes, i understand it can be frustrating if someone wants to duel you and you…sigh are forced to click “decline” and actually interact with another person in a multiplayer game, but these issues are just insignificant to me.

I don’t see having to click “decline” as an invasion of someone’s space. I don’t see two people dueling in a open, generally empty world as “invading” someone’s PvE environment. I mean, if i’m going to duel someone i’m not going to say “oh hey lets go duel right where that dude is fighting that mob!”

bloodletting wolf.2837:

Dude calm down. Duels take place in small out of the way areas and don’t take up that much space. Both sides have valid arguments.

but why do anti-duelers care where people duel if they have no interest in duels themselves? The anti-duel crowd has completely exaggerated the impact duels would have on the game to strengthen their argument.

I don’t think the anti-duel arguments are valid because the frequency of duel spamming, trolls related to duels, and duels impacting people visual space are so slim that it is a non-issue. They’ve taken the most extreme, worst outcomes that might happen if duels existed and made it seem like it would happen all the time.

In reality, and in similar games with duels these events are outlyers and are statistically insignificant. They are possible and may happen, but not enough to impact an individual player’s game.

sorudo.9054:

and why would i, as a PvE-er, stay clear in a place where it’s made for PvE?
really, is it really so difficult to comprehend that a PvE place is made for PvE and not PvP
i don’t care if it’s not true PvP, i don’t care if it might hold a place in WvW, i care when players fight each other in a place you’re not suppose to fight in PvP style.
if you want to test your build, play WvW, that’s a really big testing ground.
also, allot of players don’t even go to WvW to play WvW, they go there to buy weapons and armor, to go to LA for free and to join up and make a party so they don’t need to look all over the place.

If you are annoyed by seeing two people duel you should be just as annoyed by seeing someone fight an NPC in the open world.

ok, i’m done with you, you simply have no respect for someone else’s play style.
all you want is shoove duels in a place where it doesn’t belong and keep on whining about it because you want it, you don’t even think about anything else but your self.
you are not the only one playing and i am not the only one against duels, play PvP in PvP places and leave PvE alone.
you want to test builds, play PvP where you’re suppose to.
you want an objective, play WvW or something.
STOP RUINING pVe, IF YOU CAN’T COMPREHEND EVEN THAT THEN I SUGGEST YOU STOP PLAYING PvE GAMES

so, is that clear enough or do i have to go all sesamstreet on you.

i didn’t know you knew how to use quotes, i’m impressed.

However, at this point you gotta be trolling me. You already have PvP in PvE zones with costume brawls, so you’re first point is out the window.

And do you seriously think that people on the same teams in PvP should be able to duel each other, while there is a whole enemy team that they should be dealing with? People are already complaining about GvGers taking valuable WvW spots, so also making it a place for people to duel is a better solution?

At this point i really feel like i am reading and comprehending your posts, while you have posted the same thing 3 times without zero regards to rebuttals against your arguments.

bloodletting wolf.2837:

Scrambles.2604:

bloodletting wolf.2837:

So your argument against arenas that would make the no duel people happy and give the duel people somewhere to go is that you don’t want to see a loading screen? You solve a lot of the problems that the anti-duel camp bring up if you limit it to arenas or ruins areas.

Yes, that is my argument. Firstly, you can already do this in a custom sPvP game, so there already exists an arena for duels, but like i said, no one does it because the barriers to entry are too high. It literally doesn’t get any more easier or accessible than just requesting a duel from someone in the open world.

I think the issue of loading screens is actually a stronger, more tangible case for open world duels than the case against duels, the issue of “i just don’t want to see them.”

The only detriment to your gameplay is that you just dont want to see other people duel on your screen, yet you are fine with witnessing other players fight against NPCs on your screen.

My detriment is an acutal detriment to gameplay. There is no gameplay happening in a loading screen. And this is assuming there would just be one loading screen. If you have to port into and out of a duel arena that’s two load screens right there.

So yes, basing my arguments around my issues with load screens, i’ll admit, is a weak argument, YET i still think it’s a stronger argument than the one against open world duels.

tl;dr
the problem with arena duels – technical issues (“load screens”)

the problem with open world duels – personal issues (“i don’t want to see people duel”)

If I was against watching duels I wouldn’t play so much wvw as a roamer. I want to duel my guildies so I can test my builds for wvw. There are some awesome arenas and ruins that would make awesome pvp areas. My argument is why can’t the two sides meet in the middle. Spvp is not the same because it is far more limiting in your gear/build choices.
There are far more reasons than I don’t want to see them in all of these duel threads. Interfering with De’s, griefing (imo mostly because the block feature is a joke) being two that I agree with.
Just mark areas on the map with a red circle and give a warning on your screen that you are entering a pvp zone. If you are a dueler you could shut the notice off but a pve only player would know to steer clear. Scatter them all across the map in those places that are dead to revitalize them. Put them near dungeon entrances so you would have something to do while waiting for your party to fill. Now does that sound like a compromise that you could live with?

I don’t like the idea of being limited to where i can duel in the open world, sorry. Maybe prevent it in major cities or near trade posts, that would be fair.

But the idea behind open world duels is that you can go: “See that cool cliff over there? Let’s duel on it!” That’s what i want to do. “waiting in front of a dungeon? Let’s duel here!” Designated zones eliminate the pick-up-and-play nature of duels.

Honestly, let people duel near DE. Then they will die, lol. If dueling in GW2 is anything like WoW, you fight to 1 health and the duel ends. Then you get hit by a low lvl mob at 1 health and die. That is incentive enough to avoid enemies during duels.

and further, FURTHERMORE, all your reasons against dueling don’t actually impact your gameplay. They do not impede your ability to play.

It might be annoying but youre character is not forced to stay there until you accept the duel. Someone writing to you in chat, may be annoying, but doesn’t actually impede your gameplay. Just switch to combat log and its like nothing ever happened.

If you are annoyed by seeing two people duel you should be just as annoyed by seeing someone fight an NPC in the open world.

sorudo.9054:

Arcuss.6457:

sorudo.9054:

ok, let’s play it your way.
why would anyone, with the way you want to push duels in an area where PvP should never happen, agree to add PvP in an PvE area?
better yet, we already have 2 PvP places and ppl giving you a solution to the duel problem by keeping it in WvW, give me one really good reason why PvE has to be ruined by duel lovers again?

you have 2 places to duel, sPvP and potentially WvW yet you want it in the only place PvE-ers can escape from the whole PvP crap.
all i see is “but i want to test my skills on other players” and “i just want to be able to duel someone” without actually giving a really good reason why, duels are fine if they stay in PvP-specific places.

and one more thing, if you want duels because it’s also in a different game then i ask you this, why do you waste our time when you can just as much play that game you so love to duel in.

give me one good reason as to why it shouldn’t be in PvE. It’s not forcing PvP in your world, you don’t have to accept duels. As for WvW and sPvP, those places are not for dueling. They have specific objectives to accomplish and you just make your team mad when you are holding up a spot and not contributing to the objective.

one reason, i even have to choose?
well, trolling comes to mind, annoyance also comes to mind, annoying duels while trying to enjoy the game is yet another one…….oh wait, you said one right?
also, if you’re holding a spot, how is that my problem?
it’s still in a PvP area and in an open world, not a PvE world but an open world nonetheless.

and again, you still have not given a reason why it should be in a PvE place, all you do is throw the exact same question to the opposite person and never provide even one good reason.

it should be in the open world, or “PvE” place because it is 1) accessible and 2) there is no specific objective in the open world.

I can’t believe i am explaining this. If you join WvW, sPvP or even a dungeon group, there is a specific objective at hand, and if you’re not working towards that objective your wasting everyone’s time.

If you are sitting AFK in the open world, you are only wasting your time and it is only to the detriment of yourself (unless it’s a zone with an overflow, like teq or something)

FUTHERMORE – Dueling is not “true pvp” because you do not actually die. If i’m not mistaken, you can costume brawl in PvE, which i would assume constitutes as PvP in a PvE zone…oh did i just blow your mind!?

Pandemoniac.4739:

Scrambles.2604:

the problem with arena duels – technical issues (“load screens”)

the problem with open world duels – personal issues (“i don’t want to see people duel”)

Having a defined area for duels doesn’t mean you have to go through a loading screen whenever you want to duel. If you’re just killing time, there’s always costume brawl.

I find the attitude that if other folks are bothered by something it’s their personal problem and they should just suck it up so I can do whatever I feel like doing really depressing and anti-social. If it was one person that was annoyed, it might be their problem, but there are a significant number of folks that don’t want to deal with open world duelling. Why not compromise a little and have some consideration for other folks? Can’t we all just get along? :P

Besides, the more I think about it having a duelling arena might actually make me interested in giving it a try. I do like PvP, I just find duelling pointless. It might be more interesting if the competitors could each ante up something, sort like racing for pink slips. Or if there were leaderboards. It might even be fun to just be an audience and do a little betting with an NPC bookmaker with odds based on a win/loss record.

In my opinion, making it a mini-game with achievements would be more likely to interest folks in PvP than being annoyed with strangers challenging them and duellers fighting around them. I’ve played plenty of games with open world duelling, and I’ve never once seen someone say, “Wow, I never realized how fun PvP was until I accidentally hit accept after being spammed 50 times with a duel challenge and then getting roflstomped by a player that was twinked to the gills.”

I understand the appeal of going mano-a-mano in your PvE gear instead of doing sPvP, but I don’t understand why it’s only appealing to some folks if it is open world.

i said it before and i’ll say it again, it doesn’t get more accessible than the open world. more accessible = good, less accessible = bad.

I’m not trying to be inconsiderate to the anti-duel crowd. I just don’t think compromises should be made for something that wont effect you if you don’t want it to.

For example, i have never cared for the super adventure box. I understand other people enjoy it, but it’s simply not for me.

Now imagine if i cried on the forums, “why do they waste their time developing SAB?? why do i have to listen to people discussing the SAB in chat? why do i have to see people carrying around silly SAB skins with their annoying sounds? Why am i getting mail about the SAB!? SAB is detrimental to my gameplay!!”

But in reality, i just choose not to do it, and accept that their are people out their that do enjoy it. And their enjoyment of the SAB doesn’t effect my gameplay if i don’t participate in it.

bloodletting wolf.2837:

So your argument against arenas that would make the no duel people happy and give the duel people somewhere to go is that you don’t want to see a loading screen? You solve a lot of the problems that the anti-duel camp bring up if you limit it to arenas or ruins areas.

Yes, that is my argument. Firstly, you can already do this in a custom sPvP game, so there already exists an arena for duels, but like i said, no one does it because the barriers to entry are too high. It literally doesn’t get any more easier or accessible than just requesting a duel from someone in the open world.

I think the issue of loading screens is actually a stronger, more tangible case for open world duels than the case against duels, the issue of “i just don’t want to see them.”

The only detriment to your gameplay is that you just dont want to see other people duel on your screen, yet you are fine with witnessing other players fight against NPCs on your screen.

My detriment is an acutal detriment to gameplay. There is no gameplay happening in a loading screen. And this is assuming there would just be one loading screen. If you have to port into and out of a duel arena that’s two load screens right there.

So yes, basing my arguments around my issues with load screens, i’ll admit, is a weak argument, YET i still think it’s a stronger argument than the one against open world duels.

tl;dr
the problem with arena duels – technical issues (“load screens”)

the problem with open world duels – personal issues (“i don’t want to see people duel”)

Pandemoniac.4739:

Nothing in this thread hasn’t already been said in Open world Duels [Merged]

I don’t understand why folks wouldn’t want to duel it in an easily accessible area like the arena in the Black Citadel. It would make it easier for duellers to find each other, and you wouldn’t have to spam challenge random strangers to find someone interested. Heck you could evolve it into a mini-game with betting, leaderboards, different duel types (disable healing for example) and all sorts of fun stuff.

I’m not opposed to there being a duelling option added, but I don’t want to have wade around folks duelling in the streets or have to fill up my ignore list with folks that won’t take no for an answer.

Sure, but the only thing more accessible than an arena in the Black Citadel is allowing access to duels in the open world. Half the fun with dueling is that you can just come across someone and duel them right there on the spot. No one is going to want to duel if you have to party up and meet in another zone.

What if your killing time waiting for the rest of your party to show up and some stranger wants to duel you in front of the dungeon portal? Simply porting to another area takes a lot of effort when with open world dueling you could cut the duel short if you needed to in the event the rest of your party shows up.

This is why duels should be allowed in the open world. It kills the fun/immersion/motivation to duel when you have to go out of your way to do it and sit through at least one loading screen. That defeats the purpose of quick duel skirmishes.
_______________________________________________
Additionally, i think duels would be a great way to introduce new players to PvP. I have tried to get my PvP minded friends to play this game but the barrier to entry for pvp is simply too high. On a new character you have two options for fights:

You can play sPvP— this is an overwhelming task for someone who logs into the game for the first time. I tried sPvP right when i first got the game, having no knowledge about the game, and here i was given a 80 character with full skills, utilities, and traits that i simply had no idea what to do with.
When i lvl up in PvE, i am slowing introduced to all my skills so by the time i’m 80 i understand the significance of my traits and the synergy between my abilities. But just being given a full blown character with no knowledge what to do with it is overwhelming and simply drove my friends away.

then there’s WvW— While i love WvW, there is not much pvp for a new player to do beyond rolling with the zerg. If you manage to stumble across a 1v1 or small group fight you will get wrecked.
It is still a good opportunity for you to learn the viability of your limited skill set in a pvp setting, but the penalty for failure is too steep (actual death followed by a long trek across the map to get back to where you were).

If i could duel my friends that i just introduced to the game, it would give an easier to digest, scaled down version of what combat is like and what to expect from pvp. The other options available are meant for people that are already well initiated with the game.

Phy.2913:

Quickfoot Katana.8642:

Shifu.4321:

You must not have played World of Warcraft

Still, in WoW there was no need to dodge the boss one-shot attack, unlike GW2

WoW also has a very UI-driven combat, unlike GW2. GW2 relies on animations to provided a dynamic combat. Problem is that effect clutter these telegraphs/animations, and you can’t see, thus you can’t dodge and you die.

This is why Effect’s clutter is such a big issue in GW2 compared to other games.

I main tanked and off-tanked a lot in WOW, and there were a lot of bosses that you had to dodge some form of attack.

WoW also had a system for resource management (mana, focus, rage, etc), so there was actually a penalty for running your finger down the skill bar to use all of your spells. WoW would look a lot more like GW2 if there was no penalty for using every skill every time it’s off cooldown.

sorudo.9054:

PvP = player verses player
PvE = player verses environment
so is aPvE place a place for duels, something that is, in fact, PvP?
NOOOOOOOOOOO

you just repeated what you first wrote, but in a different way. And duels aren’t necessarily the same as PvP because: 1) it requires consent from both parties and 2) you don’t die from a duel.

But if we went with you logic, empty, open world environments would remain as such, while people on the same teams in sPvP and WvW are dueling each other instead of focusing on the objective.

But by all means, continue to base you logic on arbitrary indicators of what constitutes as PvE or PvP and continue to ignore my rebuttals.

geist.3980:

I nominate excaliber.9748 for starting this thread and hoping deep down that someone would nominate them for the effort. there ya go bro.

i second this nomination, for without excaliber.9748, the distinction of player of the year would not exist.

Phy.2913:

All I want for Christmas is a movable target frame.

OMG or “display Target’s target”

I may not be able to see my target, but at least i’ll know if he can see me!

sorudo.9054:

i have an idea, what about making duels possible ONLY in WvW.
it keeps PvP where it belongs and keeps annoying duel brats away from PvE, we PvE-ers only have one place and you want to ruin it…..keep your hands of our only neck of the woods.

That’s funny, cuz i would argue for duels everywhere EXCEPT WvW.

I already have to wait an hour in queue just to do actual WvW. I wouldn’t want to wait that long or longer because people are dueling in WvW instead of contributing to the war effort. If you are taking a limited spot in WvW you should be WvWing.

Yenn.9185:

Scrambles.2604:

Yenn.9185:

Star Ace.5207:

Yenn.9185:

The whole “play how you want” doesn’t just apply to you. It applies to elitist as well. If the casual (lack of better word) can play with pugs, why can’t the elitist play with whoever they chose to? Double standards.

They don’t want to, since by definition they are elitists and they think they are better than others, and WANT to be segregated and play with the so-called “elite.” Thus they should play with like-minded players rather than complain about lacking a DPS meter “tool” which would inevitably multiply the real attitude tools, such as seen here and many other threads.

In short, the elitist doesn’t want to PUG because he thinks he’s better than the “average” PUG-therefore, he/she shouldn’t complain and just play with so-called superior players to have “fun”, rather than complain forever about PUGs or lack of DPS meters. He/she is still free to play the way he/she wants, but he/she has chosen that he/she doesn’t want to play with PUGs, due to ill-placed feelings of superiority.

(Note that not all speedrunners are jerks, BTW, nor have I ever claimed as much; but the bad attitude of a few of them is a cancer that can make other players-which they would dare call “bad” without knowing them because they are not part of their “elite” strata-even stop playing the game, especially given the seal of approval of an official ANet given DPS meter. It would confirm that ANet agrees that DPS is the one way to play GW2, which they have never ever stated, as popular as that opinion is with some that claim that GW2 is “DPS-only” role by virtue of not employing a trinity combat system.)

In a perfect world, 4 members would be waiting for me in LA so we can run a dungeon right after I log in. But it’s not that case, everyone needs to Pug at some point, not just want. The tool would help the elite find like-minded people.

the best tool to find like minded people would just be using the LFG properly.

I’ve never thought of DPS meters as a tool to alienate people, but rather a tool to improve your own skill by getting feedback on your performance. You could argue it’s a good way to filter the people you want to play with, but i can assure that argument wont sit well on these boards. People here hate elitism the same way americans hate terrorism.

If LFG post is all it takes, then by all means. If you’ve been using the LFG tool for some time now you know that players don’t read, they refuse to read your post or blatantly ignore it. I think this board is scared of elitism even if its barely going to affect them, at least not directly.

fair enough, i don’t do speed runs or anything so i’ve never had issues like that. You have a lot more group flexibility in “all classes welcome” runs

This and the gearscore argument has always blown my mind though. A lot of people here hate the idea of DPS meters for the reason you would use it, they don’t want to be barred from a group that says “LFM must do 500 dps or more.” Some people see this as “it’s not fair i can’t join” but i’ve always seen it as, “well i better figure out how to do 500 dps if i want to join.”

Same thing with WoW, when i saw groups saying “LFM – must have this must GS” i just thought, “oh well ok, time to get enough GS to be able to pug those runs!” and not “what! minimal GS required!? time to post on the boards!”

Yenn.9185:

Star Ace.5207:

Yenn.9185:

The whole “play how you want” doesn’t just apply to you. It applies to elitist as well. If the casual (lack of better word) can play with pugs, why can’t the elitist play with whoever they chose to? Double standards.

They don’t want to, since by definition they are elitists and they think they are better than others, and WANT to be segregated and play with the so-called “elite.” Thus they should play with like-minded players rather than complain about lacking a DPS meter “tool” which would inevitably multiply the real attitude tools, such as seen here and many other threads.

In short, the elitist doesn’t want to PUG because he thinks he’s better than the “average” PUG-therefore, he/she shouldn’t complain and just play with so-called superior players to have “fun”, rather than complain forever about PUGs or lack of DPS meters. He/she is still free to play the way he/she wants, but he/she has chosen that he/she doesn’t want to play with PUGs, due to ill-placed feelings of superiority.

(Note that not all speedrunners are jerks, BTW, nor have I ever claimed as much; but the bad attitude of a few of them is a cancer that can make other players-which they would dare call “bad” without knowing them because they are not part of their “elite” strata-even stop playing the game, especially given the seal of approval of an official ANet given DPS meter. It would confirm that ANet agrees that DPS is the one way to play GW2, which they have never ever stated, as popular as that opinion is with some that claim that GW2 is “DPS-only” role by virtue of not employing a trinity combat system.)

In a perfect world, 4 members would be waiting for me in LA so we can run a dungeon right after I log in. But it’s not that case, everyone needs to Pug at some point, not just want. The tool would help the elite find like-minded people.

the best tool to find like minded people would just be using the LFG properly.

I’ve never thought of DPS meters as a tool to alienate people, but rather a tool to improve your own skill by getting feedback on your performance. You could argue it’s a good way to filter the people you want to play with, but i can assure that argument wont sit well on these boards. People here view elitism the same way americans view terrorism.

bloodletting wolf.2837:

Scrambles.2604:

uknortherner.2670:

Scrambles.2604:

uknortherner.2670:

Xrel.6087:

there can always be a auto duel decline option

Yes, just like there’s an auto-decline option for parties and guild invites. Oh wait.

Even if you could auto-decline, the spamming dueller will still insist on harassing you through other means – whispers, map chat, bunny-hopping around your character and following you on the broken contacts list, knowing exactly where you are, even when blocked.

This doesn’t happen. I will give you that it is entirely possible, but only within the realm of fantastic hypotheticals that get parroted in these threads. And it doesn’t happen nearly enough for it to be the reason to dis-allow duels.

I mean, how often do you get party/guild invite harassed? Yes it’s possible, but does it happen enough to warrant removing party invites altogether?

Except, it does as it’s happened to me and a few other people on here as we have repeatedly said in these threads. I know you are getting desperate in your demands for duels, and that as far as you’re concerned, the only valid arguments in this discussion are those that support your position, but you can refrain from accusing me and others like me of being liars and fantasists. Thank you.

I find its a weird coincidence that the people that don’t want to see duels also happen to be the only people that are constantly harassed when they decline duels and are somehow magnets for “duel spammers.” Some would call it perceptual bias.

I will still maintain that a fear of people “constantly wanting to duel you” is not a strong argument against allowing duels in the game. You’re basically coming up with the most extreme, negative situation possible and making it seem like it would be common-place. Especially since it is very likely they would have an ignore/auto-decline duel option.

If a fear of being harassed by duel spam is that big a deal, i honestly don’t know how you’ve made it this far in the game with all the other things that could be potentially abused. I mean, it’s entirely possible for someone to invite spam you, guild invite spam you, spam your mail box, follow you around and spam your /s chat, etc.

This argument could be used for everything, because there is always a fantastic possibility someone could single you out and harass you to the extreme for no reason. But in reality this situation is an outlier and almost never happens…except for that one time in WoW you read about and feel the need to use it as an example when it supports your argument.

A quick fix would to have dueling areas sprinkled in maps instead of being every where. The fact that it wouldn’t be good enough for you makes me think that you would be one of those duel spamming trolls.

to be honest, i tend to play by myself and i don’t really bother anyone. In other games, dueling has been a good way for me to make friends.

No to DPS meters. In fact, lets get rid of the combat log too. Also, get rid of the floating text for damage. Better yet, remove all info about my spells so i can judge them based on how creative they are named and how cool they look.

Who cares about feedback on their performance, it’s just a game that i could never get invested in to the point where i care about my skills getting better. I just want to look at shiny colors. I mean if it’s dead i won right? Who cares how it got dead, or how i can make it dead better in the future.

uknortherner.2670:

Scrambles.2604:

uknortherner.2670:

Xrel.6087:

there can always be a auto duel decline option

Yes, just like there’s an auto-decline option for parties and guild invites. Oh wait.

Even if you could auto-decline, the spamming dueller will still insist on harassing you through other means – whispers, map chat, bunny-hopping around your character and following you on the broken contacts list, knowing exactly where you are, even when blocked.

This doesn’t happen. I will give you that it is entirely possible, but only within the realm of fantastic hypotheticals that get parroted in these threads. And it doesn’t happen nearly enough for it to be the reason to dis-allow duels.

I mean, how often do you get party/guild invite harassed? Yes it’s possible, but does it happen enough to warrant removing party invites altogether?

Except, it does as it’s happened to me and a few other people on here as we have repeatedly said in these threads. I know you are getting desperate in your demands for duels, and that as far as you’re concerned, the only valid arguments in this discussion are those that support your position, but you can refrain from accusing me and others like me of being liars and fantasists. Thank you.

I find its a weird coincidence that the people that don’t want to see duels also happen to be the only people that are constantly harassed when they decline duels and are somehow magnets for “duel spammers.” Some would call it perceptual bias.

I will still maintain that a fear of people “constantly wanting to duel you” is not a strong argument against allowing duels in the game. You’re basically coming up with the most extreme, negative situation possible and making it seem like it would be common-place. Especially since it is very likely they would have an ignore/auto-decline duel option.

If a fear of being harassed by duel spam is that big a deal, i honestly don’t know how you’ve made it this far in the game with all the other things that could be potentially abused. I mean, it’s entirely possible for someone to invite spam you, guild invite spam you, spam your mail box, follow you around and spam your /s chat, etc.

This argument could be used for everything, because there is always a fantastic possibility someone could single you out and harass you to the extreme for no reason. But in reality this situation is an outlier and almost never happens…except for that one time in WoW you read about and feel the need to use it as an example when it supports your argument.

sminkiottone.6972:

What about class balance ? you know the game is not balanced on 1vs1 right ?

I don’t want to duel for class balance, i want to duel for fun!

uknortherner.2670:

Xrel.6087:

there can always be a auto duel decline option

Yes, just like there’s an auto-decline option for parties and guild invites. Oh wait.

Even if you could auto-decline, the spamming dueller will still insist on harassing you through other means – whispers, map chat, bunny-hopping around your character and following you on the broken contacts list, knowing exactly where you are, even when blocked.

This doesn’t happen. I will give you that it is entirely possible, but only within the realm of fantastic hypotheticals that get parroted in these threads. And it doesn’t happen nearly enough for it to be the reason to dis-allow duels.

I mean, how often do you get party/guild invite harassed? Yes it’s possible, but does it happen enough to warrant removing party invites altogether?

bloodletting wolf.2837:

Scrambles.2604:

bloodletting wolf.2837:

Scrambles.2604:

Every couple days someone new posts a request for duels. And every time that happens, the same dozen people creep out from their WoW PTSD support group meetings to say “no! no one wants duels, and everytime this is posted everyone is against the idea.”

While there is no way to prove what the majority wants, i will say the fact that it’s never the same people suggesting duels, but it’s always the same people speaking out against them is telling.

That being said, i think the negative aspects of duels are blown way out of proportion on these forums. I just made a character on DC universe online over the weekend. This game has duels and an option to block duels. I can happily report that i was not duel spammed, harassed, my general play wasn’t disrupted by others dueling. In fact, i even declined a duel, and that was the end of it…go figure!

based on these boards i would assume a handful of max levels would have trolled me for hours until i finally accepted their duel, which after losing, i would be subjected to various levels of harassment and name calling until i logged out…hrmm..

I suggest that you go through the dozens of threads and count names. You would find out that you are wrong.

i dunno man, ive posted in the majority of the duel threads and i see a lot of the same people in the anti-duel camp posting in the same threads. I bet a lot of them have argued with me personally, as well, haha.

I mean, if duels were such a universally hated topic, why do we see so many suggestions, so frequently, that ask for it?

Because new people come into the game and want them – since the search function on the forums is broken they start a new thread.

that doesn’t change the fact it is a pretty common request/suggestion.

I mean, none of us can claim to know what the majority wants. But if dueling wasn’t such a popular request, we wouldn’t see so many people requesting it.

I mean, it’s to the point now where people are creating suggestion posts to request the creation a subforum just to contain the mass amount of duel and mount requests.

Like i said, no one knows what the majority wants. But it’s hard to argue that “no-one” wants duels when posts like this are made almost daily.

bloodletting wolf.2837:

Scrambles.2604:

Every couple days someone new posts a request for duels. And every time that happens, the same dozen people creep out from their WoW PTSD support group meetings to say “no! no one wants duels, and everytime this is posted everyone is against the idea.”

While there is no way to prove what the majority wants, i will say the fact that it’s never the same people suggesting duels, but it’s always the same people speaking out against them is telling.

That being said, i think the negative aspects of duels are blown way out of proportion on these forums. I just made a character on DC universe online over the weekend. This game has duels and an option to block duels. I can happily report that i was not duel spammed, harassed, my general play wasn’t disrupted by others dueling. In fact, i even declined a duel, and that was the end of it…go figure!

based on these boards i would assume a handful of max levels would have trolled me for hours until i finally accepted their duel, which after losing, i would be subjected to various levels of harassment and name calling until i logged out…hrmm..

I suggest that you go through the dozens of threads and count names. You would find out that you are wrong.

i dunno man, ive posted in the majority of the duel threads and i see a lot of the same people in the anti-duel camp posting in the same threads. I bet a lot of them have argued with me personally, as well, haha.

I mean, if duels were such a universally hated topic, why do we see so many suggestions, so frequently, that ask for it?

Xae Isareth.1364:

Aeolus.3615:

Cooperal.8704:

Viking Jorun.5413:

Trinity = Forced routine

No Trinity = Skill-Based

Fixed.

Yet this game is far from being skill based…

Judging by how I (by which I mean the whole party) end up rage quitting in high leveled fractals in PUGs a lot, and how my guild clears fractal runs like skipping across grass fields, I’d say there is some skill involved.

The thing with a trinity-based system is that you end up being almost able to do encounters blindfolded because they’re basically a set of steps you work off a list. at least in GW2 there is more randomness which you have to adapt to.

There is skill in trinity games and skill in GW2 dpsing. It’s just different skills.

Trinity games operate with rigid roles and more predictable encounters. Similar to how a musician gets good at playing a composition in an orchestra. It caters towards competence more than twitch reflexes (skill)

GW2 operates more-or-less every man for himself. The encounters are far less predicable. Similar to how a musician can get good at sight-reading (aka, playing a piece of music the first time seeing it on a music sheet).

Personally, I prefer the trinity type because it is less chaotic. Add to the mixture GW2’s overwhelming particle effects and it becomes just that much more chaotic.

not a bad idea, but i would expand this to allow players to create custom channels like in that other game… cough WoW. I had like 4 different channels i’d use for just my own guild.