Guild Wars 2

Danicco.3568:

This isn’t a problem to PvP, it affects the entire game.
If you played other MMOs you might notice that there is a certain point that everyone picks damage over defense, because the faster you kill, the less damage you take and is a generally much better bet than trying to outlast opponents.

In GW2 it is different, there is no point of damage that you’ll achieve and 1~2 shot people so you don’t have to build for defense.
This means, in a competitive scenario, bunkers are better than non-bunkers.

But this isn’t relevant to the discussion so I’ll leave it at that…

No, this is a problem too. It shouldn’t be balanced heavily in favor either way.

Do you play Guardian at all?

When I lost my first 1v1 to a Thief/Elementalist because they could outrun me in WvW, I hated Guardians.
When I was behind the gate watching it go down without anything worthwhile to do, I hated Guardians.
When I fought those “no melee allowed” fights, watching everyone else going ranged and I’m having to work 10x as hard to survive as a melee in a melee-unfriendly fight, I hated Guardians (lies, I enjoyed it because of the challenge).

If you were running from the thief/ele, you lost before they could chase you down. There is plenty you can do in fights that appear to favor the ranged. I run full melee in WvW and have great success, because I know when and where to drop siege, and the best moments to run out and cause some chaos in the enemy zerg. Guardians can do both of those things just as well.

Terrible range, no escape, weak mobility, poor target control, weak on-demand burst, lowest health forcing me to build/gear for it, highest healing cooldowns, melee-focused (means I can be kited)…

If Guardians were weaker than Warriors in melee, that I’d call imbalance. But no, I say they’re evenly balanced so it’s not a point to complain.

All of that, yet balanced out with such ridiculously over-the-top sustain and damage reduction that the only other primarily melee class in the game can barely touch them. They are far from being fairly balanced with one another. If you can’t see that warriors need serious help in competitive game modes, you’re completely detached from reality. Guardians have far too much advantage, one on one.

Sil.4560:

This is only regarding PvP.
I can easily outdo my Guardian’s performance by 1000% with an Elementalist in WvW with even less effort, because the mechanics there allow me to.
They give me plenty of space to kite and run, and huge walls to protect me so I can focus only on offense. I can for sure say that I got 10 or 20 times the amount of kills on my Elementalist than my Guardian in WvW, despite having played the Guardian longer.

So how are those duels with warrior treating you? Let me know how the effort ranks there compared to either guard or ele.

Now, I don’t expect to be able to outdo a heavy melee-focused profession in… melee.

And unfortunately, the point capping mechanic in PvP gives them room for it.

Clearly you do expect that. Because right now the balance is in favor of guardians and you’re a-okay with it.

Then rejoice, because you already can.
You can defeat any profession based purely on your skills alone, but it doesn’t mean you can win situations.

If you’re still not getting what I’m saying, try some WvW roaming. No objectives around, nearly open fields with few obstacles around, and have your matches with people around.
This is balance.

Wrong. This is exactly where class imbalance shows the most. Warrior is at a distinct disadvantage against pretty much every other class out there when roaming. If you’re getting your kitten beat that badly by roaming warriors as a bunker-oriented guardian, you should be pretty embarrassed. Even worse if it’s happening to a mesmer. If you think a mesmer and a warrior are fairly balanced 1v1, you’re on crack.

If you’re dead bent on beating Guardians on their own bunker game with another profession, then go check the PvP forums to look for professions who can pull it.
I’ve read that Engineers are pretty good at it, and Elementalists as well.

“Play another class” is not balance. It’s another cop-out to avoid the real issue of fairly balancing classes.

Good for you, you’re not playing easymode. That said, your class still has more options available for viable builds than a class like the warrior does, which is something that needs to change also. Forcing classes into little holes so that they can only play one or so viable roles is a horrible way to design a game with competitive play, IMO.

JaNordy.6149:

I didnt read any of your posts in this thread but I have seen you post walls of text in pretty much every thread Ive seen on this forum. From what I can tell you think warrior is bad and guardian good. Have you ever thought of playing a guardian so we can finally be rid of your 24/7 posting. Its pretty clear guardian is class choice for you since it does everything, you clearly are just nerfing yourself unless you play it. Unless you are not serious and are just trolling, in which case troll away, but do it in warrior forum so we dont have your clutter.

I want fair game balance, not to coast on the easiest mode of play I can find. I guess I shouldn’t be surprised if this is difficult for you to comprehend. I’ve got every right to post here, especially since guardians being an innately forgiving and easy class is the exact nature of this thread.

You must be high if you think that a zerk warrior has much forgiveness screwing up anything.

lol, right, so let’s nerf one of the only things that warriors have to deal with condition spammers in WvW. Great thinking.

Oh, of course they’re easy once you know what you’re doing. It’s just that the other classes don’t always have a stupidly high level of forgiveness for when you screw up.

Give me an epic pull like Kohler has. Or our own version of Scorpion Wire. I could destroy people with a skill like that.

How about the classes like warrior, which are at an inherent disadvantage compared to guardian due to poor balancing? There’s no “choose a counter” or “skill or teamwork” about that, it’s merely balanced badly. This game isn’t well balanced and is undeniably still in need of some fixes. I should be able to pick up any class and have options for defeating any other class, provided my build is suited for defeating their build. That’s balance.

JonathanSharp.7094:

Real fast, it’s Sunday, so I’ll keep this quick:

Yes, Warrior needs more help in PvP, but is already strong in PvE. Due to that you may see some new splits happening between the gametypes as far as balance goes, and you may also see new traits to help Warriors find a way into team comps.

How about WvW, which still puts us at a disadvantage even with the aid of having PvE stats?

Clear the thread? You kidding? This is the best one on the whole forum.

Except guardians, who are already too tanky, would benefit from that even more.

Drek Thalon.5490:

I do not think there is 1 op specc for every class but I do think that certain types of playstyle get popularized for every class. I also think that the speccs that have been popularized for warrior are gimpp with little thought put into them beyond “I want to train you to death” and “I want to press Bulls Charge, Frenzy, and 100 blades every fight and win.” Most people dont take astep back and to think about how they are playing the class, make adjustments, balance their approach, learn from mistakes, and continue forward. Instead they come here and complain.

Except warriors are legitimately underpowered and this is something that even the devs agree on. Come up with a legitimate argument other than some variation of “L2P” and maybe we’ll care.

Downed needs to gtfo of WvW anyway.

I was mocking the developers’ description of the warrior class.

I’d trade all of the temporary content in the world for some real class balance.

So you mean somewhere viable? /surprised

Most likely he meant to say “what-it’s” made for, minus the hyphen. Anet’s filter at work.

How about we get some other meaningful boon then. Like retaliation. That sure seems to fit warrior a hell of a lot more than guardian.

Plenty of games share horrible balance problems also. The bunkers you mentioned would be the one that outclasses the other two, however, so we seem to be in agreement on that. If anything, I’d rather see burst be the predominant style over bunker. At least that way the fights don’t just come down to these long, boring games of which class has the most overpowered sustain and every last dodge would be critical.

I watched this like three times. XD

I have to say, this is becoming completely ridiculous. When it gets to the point where some biased moderators are shutting down threads because the balance team is apparently too incapable – or unwilling – to fix the warrior class, wow.

Rock/paper/scissors is lazy and unimaginative. Especially when they kitten it up so bad that one greatly outclasses the other two.

Are rangers seriously comparing their skills to those of warrior? I lol’d.

TheGuy.3568:

Renewing Stamina

Daecollo…some times he trolls. Sometimes he writes really funny kitten. However, every now and again he writes something that’s right, and here he is right.

I agree, our traits need serious help.

Enmity.3428:

Roll a Warrior Rok. One day, ArenaNet will change the Warrior class and we’ll have our days in the sun.

And we’ll crush the privileged classes into darkness forever.

Oh, don’t you know? We’re supposed to rely on our sturdy body and our teammates for help with this sort of thing! HURR DURR DURR.

He’s saying the swiftness should be a 100% chance on critical. You know, like the guardian minor trait that gives them vigor on crit? Or the elementalist trait which does the same thing?

Bad thief got stomped. Justice.

Ugh. Yeah, roll another braindead guardian then. Just what this game needs.

So you used five of the most faceroll class in the game and are saying there is no challenge to it. Go figure.

I have fun kicking them off of cliffs and luring them into very unfavorable conditions in WvW. They might be hiding behind a class advantage, but the majority of them are poor thinkers as a result of playing a common build which requires next to no actual cognitive activity. The day we’re actually balanced against this preposterous class is the day we will get to relax in a pool filled with guardian tears.

I probably have more hours on my warrior than you do playing the game at all; take your presumptuous behavior and eat it. The last thing I need is to deal with the condescending behavior of some forum scrub.

What I am saying is that our ranged options are pitiful at best and they are not a true counter against something that is in dire need of a balance patch. “Use ranged” is not a fix, it’s a weak effort at overcoming something that should be balanced better in the first place. I kill guardians in WvW wearing full melee and /laugh at their corpse whenever the opportunity allows. They should be ashamed.

Grounder.7381:

increasing speed would make us thieves… giving us pets would make us rangers.. QQ
raw stat increase is the only buff that inclined with the warrior theme! lol.!

Rip protection and retaliation off. Make more attacks unblockable. Give us a pull. More sustain. Oh, and how about some minor traits that actually compare to other classes?

Guardian:
Radiant Power – Deal 10% more damage to foes inflicted with conditions.
Elusive Power – Damage is increased by 10% if endurance bar is not full.

Warrior:
Attack of Opportunity – Increases damage to bleeding foes by 10%.
Stick and Move – Increases damage by 3% if endurance bar is not full.

Even half of our damage increasing traits are undeniably inferior. It’s completely unacceptable.

Caedmon.6798:

Yes,you have the most chance of kiting them untill their buffs wear out.You realize the range on a rifle…Right ? Eventhough warrior is a melee class,is that enough for you to not use a rifle or longbow ? did you even bothered Trying to kite them untill their buffs wear out? I bet you didn’t but still want to contribute in the fact that you got no idea,but still want to say it’s impossible to do so.

Did you even read his post? Why in the unholy kitten should a class which the developers plainly acknowledge is meant for melee be forced into some stupid mediocre ranged fight against the only other predominantly melee class, especially when you have to be up close in order to keep them from taking a point? The game is unbalanced and no amount of pitiful kiting until their ridiculously abundant buffs wear out will change that.

What the warrior class needs is patch changes to actually bring us in line with other classes, not pitiful attempt to rationalize why we should be able to fight on equal footing with them. You aren’t helping.

They’re extremely good at holding points as such because the game is unbalanced. Yes, I’m glad people are finally getting this. The amount of sustain and tankiness guardians have is overkill. This is exactly the sort of thing that makes PvP a joke in this game. There’s no easing your conscience about it, GW2 needs balanced. It’s not a “trade” to be too strong in one game mode and not be able to chase someone down in another. That’s just a shoddy attempt to rationalize against the fact that other classses need buffed to deal with the excessive defenses that guardians have.

Oh but warriors can’t actually be balanced with guardians. That would make guardians QQ.

There actually was a video posted regarding a State of the Game live stream, but the thread seems to have “disappeared”. How surprising.

AlBundy.7851:

The moderation on these forums is totally and completely biased. Stupid troll comments and incorrect responses stay at the top of the page for weeks and when you call these lies out you get heavily moderated.

Now some corrupt mod probably one of the trolls that frequents the warrior forums with L2p comments, that would be too op or my personal favorite the tooltip quoter gets warrior posts moved from the actual warrior forums.

I understand it doesn’t make the game you work for or play and abuse the overpowered classes fun when people bring the truth out from under the blanket of lies you create.

Totally true. There’s zero accountability for mod bias on these forums and it’s pretty obvious that certain things disappear because someone on a power trip doesn’t agree.

I might not support all of Daecollo’s suggestions, but he’s entitled to post them just like anyone else. At least he’s showing some effort – something must come of it.

UH OH, BROKEN. Guess they’ll just have to remove it!

I think it would be cool to see both bursts and stances on F keys.

F1: First/Mainhand Burst
F2: Second/Offhand Burst

F3: Alt Stance 1
F4: Alt Stance 2

Pressing the key for the current stance again would return you to the “Default” stance. Possibly make burst skills change with the stance type as well, if you want to create an even deeper system.

Khyber.2693:

How about no?

You already dominate every other class in dps, you’re the most polished class in the game. You have nothing to complain about.

HAHAHAHAHA

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

HAHAHA

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Good one. Have you played a warrior against other classes recently?

Make a warrior! Join us on the One True Path!

And we’re talking like soda can quality, not that sweet aircraft stuff.

So the difficulty is in fighting the guardian the way our class was designed to be primarily played. BALANCE.

It’s okay, we have a STURDY BODY and 3% DAMAGE PER BOON.

You mean you were used to playing an EZmode faceroll class against the most underpowered class in the game, lol

I agree. Guild Wars 2 is not the answer. It is the question. The answer is “yes”.

Now if only it were actually a fair balance.

Just use another F key and swap alt weapons like eles swap attunements. I’ve considered this option myself in the past. It would be pretty sweet.

I made two guardians run from me in WvW before my group could come to reinforce. Greatsword/Axe + Warhorn. I think maybe there was something wrong with them, lol

I go out of my way to kill or at least harass each and ever guardian I encounter, especially if they’re arrogant enough to charge into our lines in WvW.

Anything you can do to pin them in front of allies, knock them down repeatedly, cripple them, burst down more of their HP than they expect, kick them off a cliff, ambush them underwater, crush them while they engage NPCs, feign defeat to lure them into unfavorable conditions – use guile to defeat the cheesy player using the class, rather than the character itself. Bunker guardian is the single most braindead and forgiving class that exists in this game to date and using /laugh at a dead one is more than acceptable.