Guild Wars 2

sanctuary.1068:

Hi!

Go back to creating living world only, it was more fun than the expansion. I rly dont like grind games and the mastery system has turned into one. I cant even do raids because theyre boring and time consuming. I used to be one of the people who vouched for an expansion but after comparing the fun between the expansion & living world… living world beats the expansion by alot. The friends that came back for the expansion are gone already because it wasnt entertaining enough and after you butchered the whole core game theres basically zero fun things to do anymore in gw2. Like what was the point of adding an expansion when you butchered the core game like you did?

Also, the living world should be how it was in season 1 with real changing events of tyria and not the lame instanced stuff we got with season 2. OR just put season 1 on repeat over and over every year (except the LA events) that would be more fun than the stuff we get now. Im just sad about what this game has become…aka zero fun.

Well the expansion helped to almost double their income last quarter so you are in the minority.

LS doesn’t appeal to most players, it was free events and is just story to have some story that the devs waste time on to keep players occupied. LS doesn’t generate the income needed to develop the game properly. LS is also another reason why it took 3 years to get this expansion and the devs learned their lesson because they are getting to work on another expansion.

We can’t keep getting freebies and have a good game period. I’m all for paid expansions that include story, but I think many players are tired of freebies that that drain resources and cut out development costs to other areas of the game.

You want strong future development? Do you want a robust and a more complete living story? Do you want more qol features? Do you want more stuff added to the game? If your answers are yes, then you can’t get lots of things for free.

Black Bat wings/glider.

Black and other colored Demon wings/glider.

Various Dragon wings/gliders based off of the current dragons in game.

Bladed armor style wings/glider.

Metallic style wings/glider.

Wings/gliders based off of the 3 orders and legendary gear and our professions and elite specializations and elements and various sources of magic and deities and everything… ok?

We need more black and grey scale and “serious” looking “stuff”, for real Gaile. Also, some of us are running with super computers and we would like to see some dark and darker color schemes on our characters.

If we cannot dye wings and gliders and back pieces and weapons, at very least create different base color choices for these items so we can have a bit more matching.

Hybarf Tics.2048:

Yargesh.4965:

There was a picture in the HoT website (can’t find it now) that showed a hydra surfing into the new lions arch on a huge wave. Could be artistic licence or the direction the game is going. The lack of work on underwater combat sort of limits this though.

Well if they are working the underwater combat which personally I find nothing wrong with and a lot of fun. What do I know the fussy picky majority left the oceans and thanks to them Anet left it out completely out of any future content for now which made Maguma looking a bit dry and ridiculous.

Well we also know that, Kralkatorrik= Crystal Desert Expansion. Opening the way to Elona eventually perhaps with the same expansion kill Palawa Joko for a second time thanks to Anet’s lack of imagination by bringing enemies a second time after they had already died.

Primordious= Dominion of Winds and underworld expansion. With the introduction of a new race the Tengu.

Jormag would lead us to the Far Shiverpeaks and to more Norn and Kodan cities and who knows what else.

Going after Bubbles of course would lead us all the way south to Cantha and it’s mysteries after 250 years of silence.

The devs are not working on underwater content. We are not even getting new underwater weapons and skins.

Primordus and underworld and Dwarves…

Zhaitan redux and tengu…

Jourdelune.7456:

This! +1

Smite like game are coming to the market in 2016. They claimed next gen MOBA gaming where action skill-based gaming (dodge mechanic) are shown into a third person view.

The Heart of the Mists game need to get reviewed and classified over MOBA website.

So, we can expose our game to a player base of 200 millions of people compare to the MMORPG crowd of the 20 millions.

Like MOBA they could open free classes/specialization over week basics than you can pay to unlock them with gem/gold.

But, I guess it’s their initial idea and that the MMORPG players are simply into a glorified Early Access (pay to play BETA).

Umm this game is not a moba so get that market out of your brain for gw2.

Yeah, let’s market a stand alone pvp “room” in an mmo with 9 subpar professions and hope it can take a chunk of the mmo and moba markets…

If you want a monitized moba then go play “master X master” when ncsoft releases it.

Phaeton.9582:

It must sound cringeworthy when people on your community forum try to talk shop. I can’t pretend to appreciate the many factors that go into these decisions, as I’m sure we as outsiders aren’t privy to most of them. All the same here’s my bit.

There are 2 things I’d like to see, as will be elaborated on below.

• Elite specs in sPvP made accessible to the F2P community.

• A ‘light’ version of the client stripped down just to the sPvP element.

---

Let’s look at how you’re attracting exclusivly ‘competitive’ players to spvp

The download is free. Presumably players are then expected to play ‘classic’ specs, and if they like the game enough they will purchase the expansion. Arenanet have been very vocal about their confidence, both in the b2p model and in their wider game, in this being an effective route to market.

In competitive sPvP however it isn’t possible to have fun on classic specs, chiefly due to balance

That’s an immediate turn off to these kind of players. As far as balance is concerned, this feeling in unequivocal across the board, so there’s no need to discuss it further here.

It’s a pretty glaring problem. It also puts you in a dilemma; will improving the initial player experience by rebalancing elite specs deincentivise their purchase of HoT? Let’s face it – even now most of it’s content lies outside of the Mists, no matter how tantelising Mr. Tibbles may appear to some.

There is only one clear way to break this dilemma, and that is for Conquest sPvP to fully embrace a f2p model.

• Competitive games do f2p better than everything else

• The infrastructure is now fully in place – it just needs to be signed off

• Marketing could do a lot with this news also

---

The second suggestion would be to allow the download of a stripped down version of the Client.

• This allows players quicker access to sPvP exclusively should they decide to try it out.

• It also makes it clear that sPvP is a game in its own right prior to download.

---

Thought I’d get this all in before the post-balance ‘dark’ period for devs on the forums.

Do you realize that professions and “roles” are not good enough to sustain spvp and wvw?

Do you realize that spvp is a shallow and one dimensional game mode that offers no substantial rewards?

Do you realize that lack of having gear incentive actually hurts this mode and could be better if they had matchmaking based off of gear tier that are restricted by actual spvp expirience levels?

Do you realize that all this is designed that way to give players incentive to buy the game?

Do you realize that a stand alone spvp experience cannot be sustained on its own?

It’s really frustrating to see all these ideas about increasing pvp and wvw populations and interest when the main things are that professions are an awful mess and have been neglected since launch, and rewards are atrocious. How about they revamp their subpar professions first, make fully formed roles, tackle some poor combat mechanics and give some good rewards.

Offer a separation for matches between paid and free players… How about the players who paid for the game are able to earn specialized looking pvp gear and skins in spvp and wvw that can be used in pve as well… How about offering better game modes besides bunker the circle, and cut out stuff like stronghold… How about supporting guild vs guild and having 10v10, 20v20, 30v30… death match modes on differ types of interesting maps without all the pve stuff…

Free is not good, it’s just an easy way to open the door. Both ncsoft and anet know that the conversion rates from f2p to b2p are low, as stated in the last ncsoft conference call. I’m assuming that gem store purchases from free players are low as well.

Also, quality of professions and things mentioned above will build quantity and interest… Anything less will just keep these pvp modes low quality and low quantity and low interest as they have been.

The huge gaming world of pve and pvp players won’t take gw2 seriously until anet takes things more seriously and reinvests in their game.

Matt Stacey.7415:

Not trying to generate even more hate for druid, I’m just wondering how many people are in the same boat as myself. Looking at my current ranger I feel using the druid spec would be a waste of my 3 trait lines, and as much fun as I am having with HoT I don’t feel like I have as much to work towards as other specs. As someone who has no interest in completing the “holy trinity” and being a healer it essentially means there is no ranger elite spec for myself (and others who think this way). It feels like the other elite specs aren’t as one-sided as druid, about how many of you out there are sticking to core ranger? I myself am loving pure melee ranger

Ok so you like homogenized classes, you don’t like roles, you don’t like diversity and you don’t like long term retention and playability for classes.

All things Druid are awful btw, and to call it the healing elite is a sad. The only things good about it are astral grace movement and my extra bar of self heals and self support…

All core classes and specializations are not good at all, but I stick to ranger/Druid the most because I have all map unlocks and is the most tolerable class for me. Earned probably 700 ranks in wvw until the end of last tournament. Did some eotm after with that and thief to around 850… Leveled all professions to 80 except for engineer…

Professions and profession development are poor, but let’s at least be thankful for them trying to do something other than just dps focus for classes.

Vayne.8563:

Substance E.4852:

Cirran.1429:

Phy.2913:

Cirran.1429:

Phy.2913:

Poor Wildstar.

…….

Best part of that graph is how bad Wildstar is doing, it makes my day.

Cirran

Wildstar is the poster child for how the market has shifted away from WOW style business and game play.

Meh, personally I think it has a TON more to do with how Wildstar presented it’s self. It is a “hardcore” and “elitist” players paradise. Just shows when you basically call everyone who is not one of those a cupcake and needs to grow a pair, you fail badly. I do feel the game had potential but the focus needed to change when it went free to play, it didn’t it is now reaping what it has sown.

Cirran

EvE online has been going for longer than almost any other MMO at this point and has done so well they literally built a monument for the player base in Reykjavik.

Going hardcore isn’t a problem. Going hardcore and doing a poor job of it is.

Well to a point, but I don’t think Eve online ever got many more than half a million subs at one time, and a lot of those were multiple subs because all the serious players have multiple accounts…much like Guild Wars 2.

Both Guild Wars 2 and Eve Online are niche games. ANet’s issue is they want to be mainstream, so they keep kittening off different niches. Eve’s success is that they focused on a single niche and stayed true to it.

Well said, I fully agree with you.

laquito.5269:

Swagger.1459:

snippet

Do you realize that you’re basically describing Blade and Soul PvP? If thats what you want for GW2 PvP go and play BnS instead of GW2. GW2 being conquest PvP is totally fine despite what people may say. The game isn’t balanced around 1v1, it never was and never will. With that being said all it needs is a shift in ANets philosophy back towards its roots, because after all GW2 used to be a good game, they just continue to make bad decisions for PvP instead of listening to their players.

No, I’m not talking about bns, that game was refunded quickly. I never mentioned 1v1 either, don’t know where you assumed that…

Also, sorry, but the professions in GW2 were never good at all, they were and are still subpar at best.

This is not the only game I’ve played, but gander below at all the “professions” and mixed teams that I experienced in zone and arena pvp… With the exception of the stone tank and fire/kinetics controller, everything was played. Sure there were “meta” builds and skills, but there was a hell of a lot more variety and diversity in coh compared to what we have in GW2.

Different “Professions” did different things better, but everyone contributed, depended on others for success and were also self reliant to a degree. There were tons of roles to play and actively control like tank, melee and ranged dps, control, buff, debuff, disruption and healing…

Also, things like status effects systems and management were better. All Stealth and counter stealth mechanics made sense. Play and counterplay and team support with powers and positioning and movement were keys to success. All players were given access to a variety of movement based powers as well to keep on equal “footing”, thus elimination movement disparities… Hi stuff like Necro vs Thief lol…

Overall, the professions in gw2 were budget made and are budget maintained, they pale in comparison to many things I’m use to…

http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Archetypes

http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Power

http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Power_Pools

Power pools served many functions such as movement skills and helped professions fill certain gaps. They added another layer to character building as well.

http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Inspirations

Inspirations were like “potions” in other games that added another layer of support to individual characters and served many functions.

http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Stealth_and_Perception

There was not mid combat stealthing, there were emergency use abilities in time of need to compensate. You had to break combat to restealth. These designs made much more sense than what gw2 does.

Gw2 condition system in spvp and wvw is terrible all around. This is what needs to be done…

“Status Effect Protection
In PvP zones, effects that normally provide Protection against status effects provide Resistance instead. It is not possible to prevent effects like Holds and Immobilization in PvP – only shorten them. (Knockdown, Knockback, and Knockup are not included in this. Protection against these can still be found.)

Status Effect & Knockback Suppression
Every time a character recovers from a Hold, Immobilize, Disorient, Sleep, or Fear status, that character becomes immune to all five of those effects from other players for 15 seconds. Every time a character suffers a Knockdown, Knockback, or Knockup effect, that character becomes immune to all three of those effects from other players for 10 seconds. These two timers are independent. It should be noted that Confuse effects, while technically mezzes, are on a separate 15-second timer than the other mezzes listed above."

I could go on and on with the far superior “profession” and combat mechanic differences of coh, but I’ll end with this…

GW2 profession roots were based off of self reliance, auto attacking, dodge rolls and dps, but professions were given “schticks” to make them different… In the end what you have are quasi roles because of a couple neeto powers that do something for 2-3 seconds… Yay… These things are not good enough, or even good for that matter. GW2 professions need to be blown up and the devs need to do a “gw2 fantasy game” revision based off the of the game referenced above.

GW2 needs a lot of work, and the “old” design concepts are what got us into this sad mess in the first place…

The base combat mechanics of freedom of movement and the general “smoothness” to gameplay are good. Professions are subpar at best. “Roles” and build diversity are the poorest I’ve ever seen in a game…

Professions don’t need tweeks, they need to be blown up and redone. Traits need to be redone and make sense. Many weapon designs and damage need to be reevaluated to become equally competitive. Actual and robust roles and builds need to be far far far better defined. Health needs to be reevaluated. Conditions need to be scaled back in spvp and wvw by diminishing returns and condition status effects immunity for X seconds after cleansing. Mid combat stealth abilities need to be given very long cool downs and designed for emergency only, not used over and over. Thief needs to be heartier outside of stealth. All pets, including mesmer “clones” should be given different colored nameplates with have above head texts that clearly mark them as AI. ALL professions should have EQUAL access to movement related skills because you can’t have a competitive environment with this imbalance. Spvp needs new maps solely focused on player(s) vs player(s) combat, not players attacking to get and defending circles.

This side of the game is a neglected mess, it needs a 2.0 revamp.

The unlocking system is outdated.

WP should be account bound ideally. I’d even rather pay 50s per unlock port over having to run through again.

For many players it’s tedious, particularly those of us who have many characters.

Tragic Positive.9356:

Trevor Boyer.6524:

…

but not when selecting the class originally designed for ranged DPS.

…

Rangers were not originally designed for Ranged Combat in GW2. It was designed as a pet-class.

CAF does not need a fix. It needs a redesign.
There’s way too many gates, it doesn’t feel rewarding enough, we got an ability that is most useful as a zerk for it’s damage spike unusable because you’ll blow up in PvP as zerk and in PvE the damage is stealth-nerfed (which needs a fix).
…
And all in all, you get the best use of CAF with 0 healing power. That kind of design is a sick joke.

Yup, the whole thing needs to be redone.

IMHO professions need to be redone, but evidently they are content with doing everything except worry about the #1 aspect of the game.

Masteries and mastery tracks are coming to wvw…

There should be a mastery point xp bar and more masteries for achievements and playing content.

This mastery system should not be about pulling teeth…

I disliked how they handled unlocking elite specializations. You spend almost the entire time unlocking traits instead of just enjoying the new spec. It made me enjoy the content much less because my focus was mostly just HP.

Also, the mastery grind is unreasonable because of how mastery points are handed out. Would like to see a mastery point xp bar to earn mastery points as well, and more mastery points given for achievements.

Behellagh.1468:

Beldin.5498:

What did they expected when turning the game from a casual into a hardcore game
and removed everything that so much people loved .. like play the way you want
and no raids .. especially when replacing visual outfits / armor skins with costumes and
more useless armor stats ?

My guild has mostly died since HoT and myself i only login for daily rewards
now since 45 days

I wonder really if ANet has ever heared of the fact that people in the forums don’t
represent the ingame population.

And sadly that’s the issue with level 80 only areas. Where are the crowds in Orr? Southsun Cove on non-daily days or Karka Queen time? Dry Top? Silverwastes are only busy due to the loot that you can get there.

I don’t mind a tougher area but you have to be able to enjoy it and tough doesn’t mean punishing. The lack of waypoints reminds me of corpse runs in other games to get back to where I was when I died. We have adventures you can do repeatedly but they aren’t available at all times and there is no way in game to know unless you get there, or it closes too soon because you got there toward the end of it’s window. Map wide meta events that count everyone who’s in the zone for scaling purposes. Wonderful new mechanics which unfortunately can gate your progression within that map if you haven’t unlocked them yet. Virtually zero areas where you could go AFK safely while you cross a map. Sometimes nature calls, sometimes the spouse or children. An area where formal teaming is nearly a requirement where the original game was exceedingly soloable.

It’s death of a thousand paper cuts. Gliding isn’t enough to justify so many core changes that it feels like a different game. I got the expansion just before it went live. I’m running a daredevil now. I’ve unlocked Gliding I. But that’s it. I can no longer play the way I enjoy playing in core Tyria, it’s too abusive. When you don’t bat an eye fighting vets in core Tyria and get repeatedly owned by them in HoT, it’s a distasteful shift in terms of play.

We need CoH 2… That will solve many problems.

Black Bat wings/glider.

Black and other colored Demon wings/glider.

Various Dragon wings/gliders based off of the current dragons in game.

Bladed armor style wings/glider.

Metallic style wings/glider.

Wings/gliders based off of the 3 orders and legendary gear and our professions and elite specializations and elements and various sources of magic and deities and everything… ok?

We need more black and “serious” looking “stuff”, for real Gaile. Also, some of us are running with super computers and we would like to see some dark and darker color schemes on our characters.

If we cannot dye wings and gliders and back pieces and weapons, at very least create different base color choices for these items so we can have a bit more matching.

crussell.8504:

In the news just now. Guild Wars 2 for mobile?
http://www.koreaherald.com/view.php?ud=20160211000566

Very interesting that Guild Wars 2 was not mentioned. And never is. Maybe because no one really cares about it. Ask anyone in the Korean market, which make up the lion share of MMO gamers, about GW2 and you will get a blank look of “Guild Wars Who?” LMAO.

No, the ncsoft mobile games projected to come are “master x master” and “lineage something”…

“HoT performance is weaker than expected. The conversion from F2P/core game to HoT is weaker than expected. They look for the reasons for this”

Reason 1… Profession designs are extremely poor and continued profession development is equally as poor.

2.0 revamp your profession. Y’all built in some decent combat mechanics (smooth gameplay feel and freedom of movement) and gave players completely subpar profession designs. Look up Paragonwiki for your future profession and combat and “powers” design role models.

Professions and combat are the #1 aspects of the game. Fix this stuff and it will improve every other area of the game, and make players more likely to spend more money.

Good luck.

Not impressed with the numbers overall, gw2 could do so much better.

None of these ideas fix anything.

You’ll take people off of another server and put them on another server just so your server is fuller… What happens to their originating server in this scenario?

Does nothing except creates the same problem…

Server pride is dead. Hundreds of thousands of players who hopped servers over the past few year do not care about server pride, they cared about good pvp and equal matches and winning.

Again, server pride is dead. It means nothing at all. Only a few care about this long dead concept.

Most players don’t have any alligence to their server, they care about themselves and their guilds.

Dadefyl.1908:

Hey!

Maybe a controversial suggestion but what if we had PvP builds in WvW…where everyone was on equal terms and you did not have to be a fully geared level 80 to participate. Maybe then more people would like to try it out?

You could even gain the same (or similar) rewards as in PvP with your WXP and at the end of the battle you could get a nice bonus chest in different “tiers” depending on how much you participated?

People probably fled this game mode for a reason, but at least we can let new players easily come and try it out and perhaps some of them stay….or perhaps this will kill the game mode entirely.

I am on Ruins of Surmia (EU) and the other night we managed to get five people together in EB on prime time and on another we were three people in EB spawn and a guild had built AC’s and catapults outside our spawn. Lol, they had the whole map and were bored I guess.

So, needless to say, my experience is that WvW is dead on my server. Here’s hoping that it will somehow come back to life in some form, it used to be great fun.

It’s too late to make a change like this and will do nothing to help wvw in any form.

WvW is dead because of a lot of reasons, none of which include gear disparity related issues. It’s easy to gear up in this game…

Also, doing so would cut out the opportunity for the devs to add in gear rewards down the road.

I understand your train of thought, but in the end it will have zero net gain and end up making wvw even more boring and generic.

Players are looking for fights and it’s as simple as that. WvW is dead and has been after last tournament.

Bannok is probably one of the last handful of long term commanders holding on to the game, and it’s players like that who helped keep wvw alive as long as it has been. There is only so long players will hang on to a dev team that shows little care toward what makes a great pvp experience, and those are profession development, combat mechanics and rvr development. All three go hand and hand, and with the exception of a general “smoothness” to combat and freedom of movement, this game is subpar and underdeveloped. There are not any real “roles” to diversify meta gameplay, and more and more “gimmicks” are thrown into the experience. To top it all off, there are ZERO meangiful personal and team and guild rewards. WvW is a waste of time overall.

Professions and wvw and spvp are a mess, players held on long enough. I forsee many moving on even after they see what is in the update as well.

DGraves.3720:

If you and I, as players, were against a group of enemies one of which is a veteran and the others regulars of the same type we would target the regulars first in most circumstances to kill them first.

Why is it that AI is forced to target enemies (players) with the highest armor? Isn’t that counterintuitive? We wouldn’t do it unless there was a gimmick reward to it but raids are always designed this way.

It confuses me. Raid bosses should target players with the lowest defense first… Because they have the lowest defense.

They did that as the “cheap” fix to tanking. Removal of amulets in spvp was another “cheap” fix.

So instead of designing good “roles” and really working on professions, expect more of these types of changes.

Randulf.7614:

Agemnon.4608:

Swagger.1459:

Has something to do with Depths of Tyria, Primordus and Dwarven playable race and such…

Ogden Stonehammer is the last remaining dwarf.

Last remaining dwarf on the surface. The remaining few are transformed into stone dwarves in the depths fighting Primordus
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Dwarf

Yes, and WE will rise again my friend!

@Agemnon… Their original origins are unknown. The ones on Tyria are stone. There could be more hidden. There are lots of plausible ways to have Dwarves return. No they don’t have to be the ones turned to stone, there could be others… like say from the mists perhaps…

Use your imagination my friend, this is the matrix after all.

My bet is still underworld and primordy and dwarves…

Has something to do with Depths of Tyria, Primordus and Dwarven playable race and such…

Exclamatory.8351:

I had an intention to get the thirst slayer achievement which is to consume 100,000 drinks. Now, obviously no one wants to sit here spamming (no sorry, breaking) your mouse so I used Aivia Ghost to do it for me. It’s just a macro program for my keyboard. I set it to spam mouse 1 so that I don’t have to sit here doing it and get carpal tunnel.

I’m concerned however, because I already did it for 4.5k drinks before realizing Anet might consider this botting. So I stopped, and here I am asking the fellow community (and hopefully an Anet employee).

Is using a macro program that only tells my computer to click mouse 1 bannable? Or am I expected to complete this achievement with health care bills?

Thanks!

Use “consume all” by right clicking the stack and you’ll see it at the bottom.

jheryn.8390:

Swagger.1459:

[SNIP]

Wow. That was a lot of pent up negative.

I understand why you say the things you do, but I am hopeful with the changes in the company (NCSoft is out of the picture), that things will improve.

Do I think they will improve with broad sweeps? No. I’m just hoping they will take into account things that people have been wanting and work on them.

LS3 is coming soon and I am sure it will lead to the next expansion which I am sure will be different than the current one we have. I think they will look at what did and did not work from HoT and hopefully make changes accordingly.

The White Mantle are coming back prominently into the picture, so GW1 nostalgia nuts like me find a reason to look forward to some content we will enjoy for the pure fact that they are infusing more GW1 lore into the game.

Also WvW has a big makeover coming. Hopefully that will revitalize that environment.

I am just hoping for positive things rather than focusing on what could/might be negative.

Just being truthful.

Ncsoft is not out of the picture.

Honestly Anet is the slowest to develop “stuff” game company I have experienced. Also, a game company who has spent more time experimenting than churning out fuller and richer products. Even Colin brought up the “expirimenting” comment himself. There are tons of half finished and missing things from this game because of this “expirimenting” and lack of focus.

Professions were and are still poorly designed. Players might as well have not posted on these forums providing suggestions and improvements. The devs know the poor state of professions and most of us know it too, yet they are trying to boost content like raids an wvw and spvp on subpar professions and quasi “roles”… 99% of the game is still about auto attack, berserker, self heals and dodge rolling… Look at the how poorly the devs introduced tanking into the game… Toughness stat. Look at how awful the healing specs and abilities function. Look at how they remove amulets in spvp to do the job of “balancing” to combat the self sufficient zerker bunker meta they created in the first place. Raid bosses are tailored to force certain specs to squeeze out gimmicky things to beat them while most of the boss defeat success is based off of jumping to green circles in time and gliding…

Professions are extremely poor and the only redeeming value to them is the general skill or action responsiveness, a feeling of “smoothness” to things and freedom of movement… but those are combat mechanics. I could go on and on about professions, but what we have with gw2 is AAA base combat mechanics with DDD professions.

These professions, the characters we play, are the #1 most important factor to this game but are given 10th place status. It’s a shame because gw2 could be one of the top tier games for professions and combat and pvp, but for some reason they don’t care to reinvest.

When can I customize my UI?

When can I color my back pieces and weapons?

When will legendary armor be ready as announced as raid rewards last year?

When can the game handle these expensive auras?

When are report functions going to be improved in game?

When are the devs going to release full matching sets of armor, weapons and backpieces and auras?

When am I going to play the Druid that can sustain the zerg as advertised, not the super self healing bunker that they are trying to kill off now?

Why do I have to aim mini reticles on moving targets to heal them? I mean wasn’t the highlight of the games combat movement? So just go create an anti movement friendly healing mechanics?

When are the devs going to rework stealth and conditions and provide equal access to movement skills across professions?

When are we going to get very defined and effective and enjoyable “roles”, not this 3 seconds worth of something that a couple powers can do to simulate a “role”?

The list of questions can go on and on…

Devs don’t communicate either, and by all estimates they are just working on expirimental systems for these other expiremental systems for a projects that will either come out half cooked or never see the light of day.

I’ve been gaming for a long time and I can say that GW2 has some good elements, but when you’ve experienced thousands of other games you can see the big flaws and potential that GW2 has.

GW2 could have the most kick kitten professions and combat system of any fantasy mmo out there, but they just keep tossing it away because they don’t bother to reinvest in these areas.

What needs to happen is a professions 2.0 revamp, but will we get that? No.

What you see happening now with patches will be what we are given to play until gw3.

Professions and “roles” will remain convoluted, mashed together and subpar.

More quarterly trait and number reshuffling that do not improve profession or “roles”.

More special events in a corner of DR.

LS3 will come and players will burn through it in a day just for mastery points and not care. Player will continue to ask to be able to skip dialog scenes.

WvW will just be about pve stuff and mastery tracks and reward tracks… Because this mode is not sustainable or enjoyable on profession vs profession combat alone.

Spvp will remain subpar because professions and roles are subpar.

Raid wing will be three more uninteresting bosses with a story tied in that 99.99% of players don’t care about.

Players will probably be able to earn legendary gloves and shoulder pads this year.

We will get another expac and grind out maps for hero points for “unique” elite specializations.

Forums will remain filled with suggestions and requests that we have seen since beta.

Same old same old for 2016.

lil devils x.6071:

Swagger.1459:

choovanski.5462:

server merges were needed a long time ago. this game has too many servers and too few players. it’s been a problem that has only been exacerbated over time, and the huge new BLs have made it so much more apparent.

In October GW2 doubled their monthly concurrent users to 3,100,000 players because of “play for free”.

The problem is not population to draw from, wvw is just boring as heck, mostly beating up doors, slow paced style gameplay where you are just running around 90% of the time and has awfully unrewarding rewards. Professions aren’t good either so that’s another reason why anything wvw and spvp related will never be anything but a subpar experience.

The devs want to increase overall population numbers so server merges are not going to happen. What needs to happen is this wvw overhaul, that’s the only thing that will make any difference.

LMAO .. you know what is REALLY funny about this? MANY WvW players made F2P accounts on all severs so they would be able to play any server when they wanted due to being tired of paying for transfers and just buff those accounts over time..
Some people made accounts for every NA and EU server… it isn’t like those are actual new players…

Most had already had a few other servers when they offered the $10 accounts, then just made them for all when they went F2P, and have them parked there for when they will get to them. That just reserves them a spot.

Sure, there are multiple accounts out of that added 1.8 million (iirc), but the amount of peeps who may have done that is negligible.

Ultimately the wvw experience is completely subpar and lacks any sort of mass appeal to pvp minded players. Also, obviously not good enough to draw in newer players to this game.

Kattenpootjes.4291:

I just found out about this while trying to make astralaria, which is a lousy messed up and incomplete collection on its own but holy moly when I saw all the junk needed to get that very last part down I alt+f4’d in complete disappointment, this is so absurd, there’s no legendary journey at all, or do they mean the path to the trading post and back? My interest in the new legendaries is completely gone.. I’ll stick with my cheap trading post axe thank you

Yeah. I just bought Twilight off the TP to get it out of my system and to look cooler in my darker themed outfit… I’ll never grind out this “legendary” journey for multiple reasons, and one of the primary ones is that almost everything cosmetic that GW2 is mismatched, and it’s just an annoying gold sink wrapped up in a whole lot of time wasters…

I’d much rather be able to purchase whatever legendary stuff I wanted in the future, but the devs won’t do that so I won’t bother doing expensive chores over the course of a couple months or whatever.

blueberry.2504:

I vote for Tengu or Dwarves. Only Dwarves won’t happen because they are supposed to be extinct. Unless they mess with time and space but that would not be such a good idea, even dr Who has hat its struggles with it :-p
And what is with all the people forcing opinions on others as a fact. let everyone have its own opinion please. Makes this forum a much better place to be on.

The Dwarves are not extinct.

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Dwarf

They are the oldest known race in Tyria and their true origins are unknown. A unique reintroduction could easily happen. I made a thread long ago about Dwarves from the mists as an idea to bring them back. There are many plausible ways to do it.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Dwarf

The Dwarves currently on Tyria are now stone, and are in the underworld preventing the minions of Primordus from coming to the surface…

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Primordus

Game wise we could have another elder dragon and all sorts of cool stuff with it in game, and a reintroduction of the Dwarves… There could be a very rich and sensible story, along with a great boost to gameplay from having Dwarves and Primordus return…

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Depths_of_Tyria

New zones…

I can guarantee that if the devs made an xpac with Dwarves and Primordus and Depths of Tyria… It would be one of THE top selling expansions.

Harny.6012:

Swagger.1459:

Dwarves are cooler than any other race.

Let’s bring them along with Elves. I bet they will be the best addition to the GW universe!

I think you should read up on some lore…

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Dwarf

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Dwarf

choovanski.5462:

server merges were needed a long time ago. this game has too many servers and too few players. it’s been a problem that has only been exacerbated over time, and the huge new BLs have made it so much more apparent.

In October GW2 doubled their monthly concurrent users to 3,100,000 players because of “play for free”.

The problem is not population to draw from, wvw is just boring as heck, mostly beating up doors, slow paced style gameplay where you are just running around 90% of the time and has awfully unrewarding rewards. Professions aren’t good either so that’s another reason why anything wvw and spvp related will never be anything but a subpar experience.

The devs want to increase overall population numbers so server merges are not going to happen. What needs to happen is this wvw overhaul, that’s the only thing that will make any difference.

You are not really getting anything free, except for playtime.

Doesn’t matter how the devs cut it because you still pay for the xpac. We are going to pay X regardless. The devs are not going to itemize each pack for $5 bucks each as some of you may hope. And no, we are not going to get the xpac for free because we paid for stuff before.

There is nothing wrong with bundles, it just makes more sense to do it that way. Doing so helps to populate old zones because players will have access to them. Most players who bought hot will be on the new maps so you don’t want mostly ghost towns populated with only the ones that purchased a particular access pac.

Also, it’s easy to spend $50-$100 going out one night and $5 per day on coffee, the prices for games are extremely reasonable considering the amount of entertainment you can get out of these products.

Save spare change if you need, you have a year wait anyway. Just be grateful there is not a monthly fee if you are that worried about prices.

Edit- assuming we get more elite specializations with a new xpac, it will probably require the unlocking of previous elites so players will want all those hero points from hot zones. That would be another reason to bundle it.

Randulf.7614:

Swagger.1459:

Dwarves are cooler than any other race.

You just won the internet
+1

No, WE just won the internet!

+2

Dwarves are cooler than any other race.

I could be wrong, but I think this map was voted out for hot maps so they retrofit it for wvw.

We don’t need mazes with overdone verticality for wvw.

GodOfWar.3624:

Why do I have to go through the trade center? This is literally the only MMORPG I recall that has this anti-social system as obligatory.

Why not implement a trading system? It would take no time at all and we wouldn’t get feed by the trading post market. I could sell high priced goods without a huge penalty or risking it with the mail system.

You can trade player to player at your own risk. That’s the best you are going to get.

Gw2 doesn’t need a better grey market system just so you can save more on high end sales… We don’t need anything that just enables and encourage gold sellers and scamming. We don’t need price inflation on the bltc because all the grey marketeers will just gobble things up and drive up the prices due to scarcity… We don’t need other gold sinks forced on us due to the loss of a major gold sink with the bltc… We don’t need grey market spam or a grey market spam channel either…

You don’t know what you are asking for. Your idea will hurt you, and everyone else, in the long run…

I don’t agree when the devs increase crafting mat requirements on established items, but I do agree with how they run the bltc and the economy in general.

I use it to heal and support myself because that’s what it’s best designed for.

@kamara

I’m fully aware…

I’ve mentioned before that they are not just going to throw in the old map… Maps aren’t going to change until the big update.

@lil

Once again you are preaching to the choir. I’m just looking at things more realistically given all known factors and past experiences.

I personally feel the maps could use a visual upgrade and DB should be changed because it’s a terrible map. I assume a snow map is coming too.

Also, there will be more so expect new rewards, wvw specific rewards, mastery tracks, new achievements… tied to these maps. I’m assuming a lot more is going in than anyone can speculate, but we will just have to all wait and see just how in touch the devs are.

lil devils x.6071:

Swagger.1459:

lil devils x.6071:

Swagger.1459:

lil devils x.6071:

Swagger.1459:

lil devils x.6071:

Swagger.1459:

lil devils x.6071:

Swagger.1459:

lil devils x.6071:

Swagger.1459:

erKo.9586:

Thanks all for signing up in this thread!
Today at reset on Far Shiverpeaks(EU) there was instant 60+ queue on EB and no queue on the desert maps, and the que in eb grew bigger but no queue during the whole evening on the other borders. Thats enough proof for me.

We were already told the maps would come back…

They are probably upgrading AB, EB and making a snow map… I’m pretty sure we will have 4 unique maps to play on, and rotations will happen based on color placement for ranking… See how eotm does it?

Again, it was clearly said before. The devs also have all the statistics too so I’m sure they will change up the DB for the big update.

The voting won’t progress things faster, and at this point the old maps would be outdated for what they have in store. It’s probably best not to put them back in at this point because they will just have to replace them with a different AB anyway.

They are ignoring the numbers in hopes they can get PVE players into WvW, not understanding that PVE players don;t like PVP game modes and the ones that do are already plaything PvP and WvW. the rest of them rage quit if another player kills them.

“Their progress” IS the problem, and thus why they need players to tell them what they think about the direction they are taking it. The DBL’s are going the wrong direction all together IS the issue. WVW map design should be centered around keeping players engaged in challenging, fun, strategic PvP game play the majority of the time they are on a map. IF the core map design is not built around that very simple concept, it is a bad map. They built these maps to be the opposite. They cannot be " tweaked" to fix that is the issue. They actually have to take them back to the drawing board because:

1) They are too big, you spend more time running around wasting time instead of in PvP action. If you only have limited time to play, you do not want to spend it running around trying to find the action, you want to spend it IN the action. Think more like Courtyard, less like PVE zones for map design.

2)Horrible terrain for PvP. too many escape routes, fall damage, and environmental gimmicky BS. Needs a flatter, less bouncy gimmicky map to allow for players to stay in the PVP action rather than avoiding it or trying to get back to where the fight was only to find it over by the time you get to it. Make direct routs instead of trying to run players all over the place. It does not make fighting more challenging, fun or strategic to just make it take longer for players to get to the action due to terrain and environmental issues. That is just lame, not fun. They need to drop the idea of incorporating the battlefield into a jumping puzzle. The vast majority of players do not enjoy dying from fall damage more than they die from actual layers. That makes it a bad battlefield when the majority of players avoid it for that reason.

3) lack of strategic placement of anything.. They did not put much thought into actually making the objectives count for strategic positioning, When you took towers and keeps on Alpine maps, you had a reason to take or defend them due to the targets that could be hit from them and the advantage they would give on the battlefield. That w as lost with the design of these maps all together. It appears that was not even a thought when designing them.

4) Remove the PvE elements and Environmental Gimmicks from WvW.. We need less PVE in WvW and more PvP. 99.9% of GW is PVE, they can allow WvW players to have their tiny little corner without adding more PvE champs in there. Get rid of them and use the extra resources it frees up to allow more players in a zone without lagging instead. Making rocks come out of the ground does not enhance the match, it just irritates the players so they move somewhere that doesn’t happen to fight instead. If players are leaving an area to fight somewhere else instead because they think that zone sucks, that zones is not a well designed PvP zone.

5)Lack of water combat in WvW. At least on Alpine maps you were able to have underwater combat fights inside bay, south of keep and at SW camps…. Now WvW is lacking in Underwater combat due to shifting their focus to bouncy run away and avoid combat that players overwhelmingly do not enjoy.

What Anet fails to realize is that if they stay on track with their " progress" they will Kill WvW for good.. Continuing with the direction and theme of changes that they applied with HoT by replacing EBG with one of these garbage PvE maps will keep players out of WvW all together. They are currently huddled up on EBG because they hate the DBL maps so much that is their only retreat to enjoy WvW anymore. Remove that and you will lose those remaining players from the game.

Sure you will have the tiny percentage left that doesn’t care about the maps and doesn’t care if they play with friends.. but hat is what you call a dead game mode at that point.

I understand the frustrations.

I’m sure the devs are aware at this point given the feedback and stats. Just a waiting game at this point, and the devs know the players frustration because of that post by the devs saying “looks like we can talk about wvw so we will have some info”…

They know, but the old maps are not going to be dropped in just to take them out in whatever months at this point.

Being aware and acting on that awareness are two different things. Until we see new WvW team replacing the one we have it isn’t going to change. They said they were keeping the alpine maps in the rotation. The best thing they could do now to save the mode would be " rotate" back to alpine, leave it stuck there a bit while making new maps ( it doesn’t take a year to do that btw they just chose to make it so).

They should issue a statement stating they are aware of the issues and are trying to bring WvW players the maps they deserve, and that would be better than staying the course of action to replace EBG to try and force players onto the DBLS..

They can choose to save this or scrap it, and if they keep doing what they are doing.. it is all downhill from here. They very well could step up and say " we are going to make this right" but if they fail to do that, I am not sure it will be salvageable after they keep going the wrong way with it. Our guild used to run a solid 40+ core the majority of our raids.. we are down to 10 and under due to HoT. It isn’t just us either.. Everyone is playing other games / not interested in playing WvW in it’s current state and have lost hope that Anet will fix it.

I’m pretty sure the devs had a wake up call after last tournament, hence why they have been working on stuff already for a year. Also, the devs need to compete with a game like CU coming out, so GW2 can keep and attract more players.

The devs know the wvw gas tank is running on fumes at this point, but it’s just waiting time. Can’t make them work faster, but it’s reassuring that they have been up to something and that all engineers are coding away as we speak.

I don’t think the devs would ever come here and say they are happy with the current state of wvw either. Big stuff like this hits the pocket books so I’m sure they wished they would have invested sooner.

lil devils x.6071:

Edit- devs want all sorts of players in wvw, they just did it the wrong way with map completion stuff before. Once incentives are in place then everybody can find what appeals or encourages them to play. More players the better, but we all have to wait to find out.

Wanting all sorts of players doesn’t work in PvP game modes. Many games tried it. PvE players view WvW like the open world PvP games they refuse to play as it is. You either like to fight other players or you don’t. Some just don’t. Adding PvE to a PvP zone doesn’t change that, it just makes the players who want to PvP leave to a game that focuses on PvP instead.

I’m fully aware, but of course developers want to encourage more players to play different game modes. I never said anything about “adding pve to a pvp zone”, I said incentives. Incentives such as unique personal and guild rewards, some type of universal character progress, alternate progress options… There are a wide range of things to entice players that could be used.

We will just have to see what’s in store for wvw and these maps.

Their focus isn’t even on WvW, it is on trying to compete with MOBAas, which even Blizzard could not make WoW do. That failed terribly. The ONLY reason this takes so long is because WvW is not where hey are applying their resources. You can make things happen at the pace you dedicate the resources and man hours to. The pace for WvW is due to lack of " care" on their part moreso than anything. If they wished to dedicate the resources they are allocating to PvE and PvP updates, WvW would have been fixed long ago. The problem is their idea of " fixing it" will kill the game mode entirely.

Their current focus is on wvw.

Only moba can compete with moba, hence why ncsoft is working on two of them.

Of course resources were spread out, some to the year long wvw development and much more to the expansion.

You are kinda preaching to the choir, and I’m aware of what you are saying. Point is that there is going to be an update this year so the devs are not just going to throw in the old version of alpine back in at this point just to take it back out again. It’s at a point where the alpine map alone will not have the desired result of pulling in more players like you think. Players are tired of the same old at this point and wvw needs the “super secret” update to make anything substantial happen.

Honestly, if the devs switched maps today then most players wouldn’t really care now. You’d just have whatever die hards left on the maps and not much of anyone else. You’d still have the population disparities. You’d still have the same “zero” reward system. You’d still not have tournaments… It would just be wvw with the old alpine and same low population and interest level.

LMAO, no, their focus ISN’T on WvW..
Have you been paying attention?
MOBA..
http://www.eslgaming.com/interview/future-guild-wars-2-esports-and-pvp-interview-arenanet-team-1974
http://massivelyop.com/2015/11/27/guild-wars-2-sees-a-bright-future-in-e-sports/
http://massivelyop.com/2015/12/15/guild-wars-2-e-sports-team-ragequits-over-design-meta-technical-issues/
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/announcing-the-esl-guild-wars-2-pro-league/
http://pro.eslgaming.com/gw2/proleague/

That is where all the resources have been going,…

If they switched maps today ques for EB would drop instantaneously and numbers would increase immediately. THAT is why they will not do it, it will show exactly how bad they wasted money making the DBLs… and could not blame anything else for the issues. No, they would not get pre HoT numbers, players are playing other games now that will not give them another chance since Anet burned that bridge, but it would have a very immediate and overwhelming response none the less. The longer they wait to do so the less of a response it will get simply because more people will have given up entirely on them by then.

Their resources are going to wvw for a year now, start of a new expansion, some to esports promo and a bunch of other stuff.

They removed AB to work on it along with the other stuff. DB was ready so they tossed that in to at least do something, but they will hopefully make changes. The devs just can’t throw in what’s not ready, nor will they just switch in the old AB map to replace with an updated AB map in whatever months.

If you are assuming I’m ok with the DB map or the pace of development I’m not, just being realistic here.

It isn’t ready because they were allocating resources to the wrong direction and have not allocated resources to taking wvw in the direction that players want to play. What they had ready was the opposite of what players wanted and why guilds have left and are talking about leaving GW2.

They are NOT however allocating enough resources to actually fixing it to where players consider the mode playable, for the past year, as seen above, they allocated more resources to their move to compete with MOBAs in Esports, as they have discussed in many interviews over the past year…

The hiring of people to work on multilevel zones is the opposite of what WvW players consider “playable.”

We could analyze this and that all day, but it won’t change things. The point is that the old AB maps are not just being tossed backed in. Everybody will just have to wait for the info, then the beta and following patch.

Or they could just leave and play something else because Anet didn’t listen ( like most have done already). They already waited.. too long. IS the point. ANet hasn’t said they weren’t putting Alpine back in, in fact they said the opposite, they stated Alpine was not being removed and would be kept in the rotation. Time to rotate before everyone else leaves as well…

If you can show me where they said they were not keeping Alpine in the rotation please do, as everything I have seen them say on the subject said it was coming back.. people just want that sooner and for them not to break it before returning it. Players do not want them to change it is what is being stated.

Had you’d been following my comments you would see where I said they are probably upgrading AB and that will go back in. I doubt they will put in the exact old AB.

Back up and reread my comments.

lil devils x.6071:

Swagger.1459:

lil devils x.6071:

Swagger.1459:

lil devils x.6071:

Swagger.1459:

lil devils x.6071:

Swagger.1459:

lil devils x.6071:

Swagger.1459:

erKo.9586:

Thanks all for signing up in this thread!
Today at reset on Far Shiverpeaks(EU) there was instant 60+ queue on EB and no queue on the desert maps, and the que in eb grew bigger but no queue during the whole evening on the other borders. Thats enough proof for me.

We were already told the maps would come back…

They are probably upgrading AB, EB and making a snow map… I’m pretty sure we will have 4 unique maps to play on, and rotations will happen based on color placement for ranking… See how eotm does it?

Again, it was clearly said before. The devs also have all the statistics too so I’m sure they will change up the DB for the big update.

The voting won’t progress things faster, and at this point the old maps would be outdated for what they have in store. It’s probably best not to put them back in at this point because they will just have to replace them with a different AB anyway.

They are ignoring the numbers in hopes they can get PVE players into WvW, not understanding that PVE players don;t like PVP game modes and the ones that do are already plaything PvP and WvW. the rest of them rage quit if another player kills them.

“Their progress” IS the problem, and thus why they need players to tell them what they think about the direction they are taking it. The DBL’s are going the wrong direction all together IS the issue. WVW map design should be centered around keeping players engaged in challenging, fun, strategic PvP game play the majority of the time they are on a map. IF the core map design is not built around that very simple concept, it is a bad map. They built these maps to be the opposite. They cannot be " tweaked" to fix that is the issue. They actually have to take them back to the drawing board because:

1) They are too big, you spend more time running around wasting time instead of in PvP action. If you only have limited time to play, you do not want to spend it running around trying to find the action, you want to spend it IN the action. Think more like Courtyard, less like PVE zones for map design.

2)Horrible terrain for PvP. too many escape routes, fall damage, and environmental gimmicky BS. Needs a flatter, less bouncy gimmicky map to allow for players to stay in the PVP action rather than avoiding it or trying to get back to where the fight was only to find it over by the time you get to it. Make direct routs instead of trying to run players all over the place. It does not make fighting more challenging, fun or strategic to just make it take longer for players to get to the action due to terrain and environmental issues. That is just lame, not fun. They need to drop the idea of incorporating the battlefield into a jumping puzzle. The vast majority of players do not enjoy dying from fall damage more than they die from actual layers. That makes it a bad battlefield when the majority of players avoid it for that reason.

3) lack of strategic placement of anything.. They did not put much thought into actually making the objectives count for strategic positioning, When you took towers and keeps on Alpine maps, you had a reason to take or defend them due to the targets that could be hit from them and the advantage they would give on the battlefield. That w as lost with the design of these maps all together. It appears that was not even a thought when designing them.

4) Remove the PvE elements and Environmental Gimmicks from WvW.. We need less PVE in WvW and more PvP. 99.9% of GW is PVE, they can allow WvW players to have their tiny little corner without adding more PvE champs in there. Get rid of them and use the extra resources it frees up to allow more players in a zone without lagging instead. Making rocks come out of the ground does not enhance the match, it just irritates the players so they move somewhere that doesn’t happen to fight instead. If players are leaving an area to fight somewhere else instead because they think that zone sucks, that zones is not a well designed PvP zone.

5)Lack of water combat in WvW. At least on Alpine maps you were able to have underwater combat fights inside bay, south of keep and at SW camps…. Now WvW is lacking in Underwater combat due to shifting their focus to bouncy run away and avoid combat that players overwhelmingly do not enjoy.

What Anet fails to realize is that if they stay on track with their " progress" they will Kill WvW for good.. Continuing with the direction and theme of changes that they applied with HoT by replacing EBG with one of these garbage PvE maps will keep players out of WvW all together. They are currently huddled up on EBG because they hate the DBL maps so much that is their only retreat to enjoy WvW anymore. Remove that and you will lose those remaining players from the game.

Sure you will have the tiny percentage left that doesn’t care about the maps and doesn’t care if they play with friends.. but hat is what you call a dead game mode at that point.

I understand the frustrations.

I’m sure the devs are aware at this point given the feedback and stats. Just a waiting game at this point, and the devs know the players frustration because of that post by the devs saying “looks like we can talk about wvw so we will have some info”…

They know, but the old maps are not going to be dropped in just to take them out in whatever months at this point.

Being aware and acting on that awareness are two different things. Until we see new WvW team replacing the one we have it isn’t going to change. They said they were keeping the alpine maps in the rotation. The best thing they could do now to save the mode would be " rotate" back to alpine, leave it stuck there a bit while making new maps ( it doesn’t take a year to do that btw they just chose to make it so).

They should issue a statement stating they are aware of the issues and are trying to bring WvW players the maps they deserve, and that would be better than staying the course of action to replace EBG to try and force players onto the DBLS..

They can choose to save this or scrap it, and if they keep doing what they are doing.. it is all downhill from here. They very well could step up and say " we are going to make this right" but if they fail to do that, I am not sure it will be salvageable after they keep going the wrong way with it. Our guild used to run a solid 40+ core the majority of our raids.. we are down to 10 and under due to HoT. It isn’t just us either.. Everyone is playing other games / not interested in playing WvW in it’s current state and have lost hope that Anet will fix it.

I’m pretty sure the devs had a wake up call after last tournament, hence why they have been working on stuff already for a year. Also, the devs need to compete with a game like CU coming out, so GW2 can keep and attract more players.

The devs know the wvw gas tank is running on fumes at this point, but it’s just waiting time. Can’t make them work faster, but it’s reassuring that they have been up to something and that all engineers are coding away as we speak.

I don’t think the devs would ever come here and say they are happy with the current state of wvw either. Big stuff like this hits the pocket books so I’m sure they wished they would have invested sooner.

lil devils x.6071:

Edit- devs want all sorts of players in wvw, they just did it the wrong way with map completion stuff before. Once incentives are in place then everybody can find what appeals or encourages them to play. More players the better, but we all have to wait to find out.

Wanting all sorts of players doesn’t work in PvP game modes. Many games tried it. PvE players view WvW like the open world PvP games they refuse to play as it is. You either like to fight other players or you don’t. Some just don’t. Adding PvE to a PvP zone doesn’t change that, it just makes the players who want to PvP leave to a game that focuses on PvP instead.

I’m fully aware, but of course developers want to encourage more players to play different game modes. I never said anything about “adding pve to a pvp zone”, I said incentives. Incentives such as unique personal and guild rewards, some type of universal character progress, alternate progress options… There are a wide range of things to entice players that could be used.

We will just have to see what’s in store for wvw and these maps.

Their focus isn’t even on WvW, it is on trying to compete with MOBAas, which even Blizzard could not make WoW do. That failed terribly. The ONLY reason this takes so long is because WvW is not where hey are applying their resources. You can make things happen at the pace you dedicate the resources and man hours to. The pace for WvW is due to lack of " care" on their part moreso than anything. If they wished to dedicate the resources they are allocating to PvE and PvP updates, WvW would have been fixed long ago. The problem is their idea of " fixing it" will kill the game mode entirely.

Their current focus is on wvw.

Only moba can compete with moba, hence why ncsoft is working on two of them.

Of course resources were spread out, some to the year long wvw development and much more to the expansion.

You are kinda preaching to the choir, and I’m aware of what you are saying. Point is that there is going to be an update this year so the devs are not just going to throw in the old version of alpine back in at this point just to take it back out again. It’s at a point where the alpine map alone will not have the desired result of pulling in more players like you think. Players are tired of the same old at this point and wvw needs the “super secret” update to make anything substantial happen.

Honestly, if the devs switched maps today then most players wouldn’t really care now. You’d just have whatever die hards left on the maps and not much of anyone else. You’d still have the population disparities. You’d still have the same “zero” reward system. You’d still not have tournaments… It would just be wvw with the old alpine and same low population and interest level.

LMAO, no, their focus ISN’T on WvW..
Have you been paying attention?
MOBA..
http://www.eslgaming.com/interview/future-guild-wars-2-esports-and-pvp-interview-arenanet-team-1974
http://massivelyop.com/2015/11/27/guild-wars-2-sees-a-bright-future-in-e-sports/
http://massivelyop.com/2015/12/15/guild-wars-2-e-sports-team-ragequits-over-design-meta-technical-issues/
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/announcing-the-esl-guild-wars-2-pro-league/
http://pro.eslgaming.com/gw2/proleague/

That is where all the resources have been going,…

If they switched maps today ques for EB would drop instantaneously and numbers would increase immediately. THAT is why they will not do it, it will show exactly how bad they wasted money making the DBLs… and could not blame anything else for the issues. No, they would not get pre HoT numbers, players are playing other games now that will not give them another chance since Anet burned that bridge, but it would have a very immediate and overwhelming response none the less. The longer they wait to do so the less of a response it will get simply because more people will have given up entirely on them by then.

Their resources are going to wvw for a year now, start of a new expansion, some to esports promo and a bunch of other stuff.

They removed AB to work on it along with the other stuff. DB was ready so they tossed that in to at least do something, but they will hopefully make changes. The devs just can’t throw in what’s not ready, nor will they just switch in the old AB map to replace with an updated AB map in whatever months.

If you are assuming I’m ok with the DB map or the pace of development I’m not, just being realistic here.

It isn’t ready because they were allocating resources to the wrong direction and have not allocated resources to taking wvw in the direction that players want to play. What they had ready was the opposite of what players wanted and why guilds have left and are talking about leaving GW2.

They are NOT however allocating enough resources to actually fixing it to where players consider the mode playable, for the past year, as seen above, they allocated more resources to their move to compete with MOBAs in Esports, as they have discussed in many interviews over the past year…

The hiring of people to work on multilevel zones is the opposite of what WvW players consider “playable.”

We could analyze this and that all day, but it won’t change things. The point is that the old AB maps are not just being tossed backed in. Everybody will just have to wait for the info, then the beta and following patch.

lil devils x.6071:

Swagger.1459:

lil devils x.6071:

Swagger.1459:

lil devils x.6071:

Swagger.1459:

lil devils x.6071:

Swagger.1459:

erKo.9586:

Thanks all for signing up in this thread!
Today at reset on Far Shiverpeaks(EU) there was instant 60+ queue on EB and no queue on the desert maps, and the que in eb grew bigger but no queue during the whole evening on the other borders. Thats enough proof for me.

We were already told the maps would come back…

They are probably upgrading AB, EB and making a snow map… I’m pretty sure we will have 4 unique maps to play on, and rotations will happen based on color placement for ranking… See how eotm does it?

Again, it was clearly said before. The devs also have all the statistics too so I’m sure they will change up the DB for the big update.

The voting won’t progress things faster, and at this point the old maps would be outdated for what they have in store. It’s probably best not to put them back in at this point because they will just have to replace them with a different AB anyway.

They are ignoring the numbers in hopes they can get PVE players into WvW, not understanding that PVE players don;t like PVP game modes and the ones that do are already plaything PvP and WvW. the rest of them rage quit if another player kills them.

“Their progress” IS the problem, and thus why they need players to tell them what they think about the direction they are taking it. The DBL’s are going the wrong direction all together IS the issue. WVW map design should be centered around keeping players engaged in challenging, fun, strategic PvP game play the majority of the time they are on a map. IF the core map design is not built around that very simple concept, it is a bad map. They built these maps to be the opposite. They cannot be " tweaked" to fix that is the issue. They actually have to take them back to the drawing board because:

1) They are too big, you spend more time running around wasting time instead of in PvP action. If you only have limited time to play, you do not want to spend it running around trying to find the action, you want to spend it IN the action. Think more like Courtyard, less like PVE zones for map design.

2)Horrible terrain for PvP. too many escape routes, fall damage, and environmental gimmicky BS. Needs a flatter, less bouncy gimmicky map to allow for players to stay in the PVP action rather than avoiding it or trying to get back to where the fight was only to find it over by the time you get to it. Make direct routs instead of trying to run players all over the place. It does not make fighting more challenging, fun or strategic to just make it take longer for players to get to the action due to terrain and environmental issues. That is just lame, not fun. They need to drop the idea of incorporating the battlefield into a jumping puzzle. The vast majority of players do not enjoy dying from fall damage more than they die from actual layers. That makes it a bad battlefield when the majority of players avoid it for that reason.

3) lack of strategic placement of anything.. They did not put much thought into actually making the objectives count for strategic positioning, When you took towers and keeps on Alpine maps, you had a reason to take or defend them due to the targets that could be hit from them and the advantage they would give on the battlefield. That w as lost with the design of these maps all together. It appears that was not even a thought when designing them.

4) Remove the PvE elements and Environmental Gimmicks from WvW.. We need less PVE in WvW and more PvP. 99.9% of GW is PVE, they can allow WvW players to have their tiny little corner without adding more PvE champs in there. Get rid of them and use the extra resources it frees up to allow more players in a zone without lagging instead. Making rocks come out of the ground does not enhance the match, it just irritates the players so they move somewhere that doesn’t happen to fight instead. If players are leaving an area to fight somewhere else instead because they think that zone sucks, that zones is not a well designed PvP zone.

5)Lack of water combat in WvW. At least on Alpine maps you were able to have underwater combat fights inside bay, south of keep and at SW camps…. Now WvW is lacking in Underwater combat due to shifting their focus to bouncy run away and avoid combat that players overwhelmingly do not enjoy.

What Anet fails to realize is that if they stay on track with their " progress" they will Kill WvW for good.. Continuing with the direction and theme of changes that they applied with HoT by replacing EBG with one of these garbage PvE maps will keep players out of WvW all together. They are currently huddled up on EBG because they hate the DBL maps so much that is their only retreat to enjoy WvW anymore. Remove that and you will lose those remaining players from the game.

Sure you will have the tiny percentage left that doesn’t care about the maps and doesn’t care if they play with friends.. but hat is what you call a dead game mode at that point.

I understand the frustrations.

I’m sure the devs are aware at this point given the feedback and stats. Just a waiting game at this point, and the devs know the players frustration because of that post by the devs saying “looks like we can talk about wvw so we will have some info”…

They know, but the old maps are not going to be dropped in just to take them out in whatever months at this point.

Being aware and acting on that awareness are two different things. Until we see new WvW team replacing the one we have it isn’t going to change. They said they were keeping the alpine maps in the rotation. The best thing they could do now to save the mode would be " rotate" back to alpine, leave it stuck there a bit while making new maps ( it doesn’t take a year to do that btw they just chose to make it so).

They should issue a statement stating they are aware of the issues and are trying to bring WvW players the maps they deserve, and that would be better than staying the course of action to replace EBG to try and force players onto the DBLS..

They can choose to save this or scrap it, and if they keep doing what they are doing.. it is all downhill from here. They very well could step up and say " we are going to make this right" but if they fail to do that, I am not sure it will be salvageable after they keep going the wrong way with it. Our guild used to run a solid 40+ core the majority of our raids.. we are down to 10 and under due to HoT. It isn’t just us either.. Everyone is playing other games / not interested in playing WvW in it’s current state and have lost hope that Anet will fix it.

I’m pretty sure the devs had a wake up call after last tournament, hence why they have been working on stuff already for a year. Also, the devs need to compete with a game like CU coming out, so GW2 can keep and attract more players.

The devs know the wvw gas tank is running on fumes at this point, but it’s just waiting time. Can’t make them work faster, but it’s reassuring that they have been up to something and that all engineers are coding away as we speak.

I don’t think the devs would ever come here and say they are happy with the current state of wvw either. Big stuff like this hits the pocket books so I’m sure they wished they would have invested sooner.

lil devils x.6071:

Edit- devs want all sorts of players in wvw, they just did it the wrong way with map completion stuff before. Once incentives are in place then everybody can find what appeals or encourages them to play. More players the better, but we all have to wait to find out.

Wanting all sorts of players doesn’t work in PvP game modes. Many games tried it. PvE players view WvW like the open world PvP games they refuse to play as it is. You either like to fight other players or you don’t. Some just don’t. Adding PvE to a PvP zone doesn’t change that, it just makes the players who want to PvP leave to a game that focuses on PvP instead.

I’m fully aware, but of course developers want to encourage more players to play different game modes. I never said anything about “adding pve to a pvp zone”, I said incentives. Incentives such as unique personal and guild rewards, some type of universal character progress, alternate progress options… There are a wide range of things to entice players that could be used.

We will just have to see what’s in store for wvw and these maps.

Their focus isn’t even on WvW, it is on trying to compete with MOBAas, which even Blizzard could not make WoW do. That failed terribly. The ONLY reason this takes so long is because WvW is not where hey are applying their resources. You can make things happen at the pace you dedicate the resources and man hours to. The pace for WvW is due to lack of " care" on their part moreso than anything. If they wished to dedicate the resources they are allocating to PvE and PvP updates, WvW would have been fixed long ago. The problem is their idea of " fixing it" will kill the game mode entirely.

Their current focus is on wvw.

Only moba can compete with moba, hence why ncsoft is working on two of them.

Of course resources were spread out, some to the year long wvw development and much more to the expansion.

You are kinda preaching to the choir, and I’m aware of what you are saying. Point is that there is going to be an update this year so the devs are not just going to throw in the old version of alpine back in at this point just to take it back out again. It’s at a point where the alpine map alone will not have the desired result of pulling in more players like you think. Players are tired of the same old at this point and wvw needs the “super secret” update to make anything substantial happen.

Honestly, if the devs switched maps today then most players wouldn’t really care now. You’d just have whatever die hards left on the maps and not much of anyone else. You’d still have the population disparities. You’d still have the same “zero” reward system. You’d still not have tournaments… It would just be wvw with the old alpine and same low population and interest level.

LMAO, no, their focus ISN’T on WvW..
Have you been paying attention?
MOBA..
http://www.eslgaming.com/interview/future-guild-wars-2-esports-and-pvp-interview-arenanet-team-1974
http://massivelyop.com/2015/11/27/guild-wars-2-sees-a-bright-future-in-e-sports/
http://massivelyop.com/2015/12/15/guild-wars-2-e-sports-team-ragequits-over-design-meta-technical-issues/
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/announcing-the-esl-guild-wars-2-pro-league/
http://pro.eslgaming.com/gw2/proleague/

That is where all the resources have been going,…

If they switched maps today ques for EB would drop instantaneously and numbers would increase immediately. THAT is why they will not do it, it will show exactly how bad they wasted money making the DBLs… and could not blame anything else for the issues. No, they would not get pre HoT numbers, players are playing other games now that will not give them another chance since Anet burned that bridge, but it would have a very immediate and overwhelming response none the less. The longer they wait to do so the less of a response it will get simply because more people will have given up entirely on them by then.

Their resources are going to wvw for a year now, start of a new expansion, some to esports promo and a bunch of other stuff.

They removed AB to work on it along with the other stuff. DB was ready so they tossed that in to at least do something, but they will hopefully make changes. The devs just can’t throw in what’s not ready, nor will they just switch in the old AB map to replace with an updated AB map in whatever months.

If you are assuming I’m ok with the DB map or the pace of development I’m not, just being realistic here.

lil devils x.6071:

Swagger.1459:

lil devils x.6071:

Swagger.1459:

lil devils x.6071:

Swagger.1459:

erKo.9586:

Thanks all for signing up in this thread!
Today at reset on Far Shiverpeaks(EU) there was instant 60+ queue on EB and no queue on the desert maps, and the que in eb grew bigger but no queue during the whole evening on the other borders. Thats enough proof for me.

We were already told the maps would come back…

They are probably upgrading AB, EB and making a snow map… I’m pretty sure we will have 4 unique maps to play on, and rotations will happen based on color placement for ranking… See how eotm does it?

Again, it was clearly said before. The devs also have all the statistics too so I’m sure they will change up the DB for the big update.

The voting won’t progress things faster, and at this point the old maps would be outdated for what they have in store. It’s probably best not to put them back in at this point because they will just have to replace them with a different AB anyway.

They are ignoring the numbers in hopes they can get PVE players into WvW, not understanding that PVE players don;t like PVP game modes and the ones that do are already plaything PvP and WvW. the rest of them rage quit if another player kills them.

“Their progress” IS the problem, and thus why they need players to tell them what they think about the direction they are taking it. The DBL’s are going the wrong direction all together IS the issue. WVW map design should be centered around keeping players engaged in challenging, fun, strategic PvP game play the majority of the time they are on a map. IF the core map design is not built around that very simple concept, it is a bad map. They built these maps to be the opposite. They cannot be " tweaked" to fix that is the issue. They actually have to take them back to the drawing board because:

1) They are too big, you spend more time running around wasting time instead of in PvP action. If you only have limited time to play, you do not want to spend it running around trying to find the action, you want to spend it IN the action. Think more like Courtyard, less like PVE zones for map design.

2)Horrible terrain for PvP. too many escape routes, fall damage, and environmental gimmicky BS. Needs a flatter, less bouncy gimmicky map to allow for players to stay in the PVP action rather than avoiding it or trying to get back to where the fight was only to find it over by the time you get to it. Make direct routs instead of trying to run players all over the place. It does not make fighting more challenging, fun or strategic to just make it take longer for players to get to the action due to terrain and environmental issues. That is just lame, not fun. They need to drop the idea of incorporating the battlefield into a jumping puzzle. The vast majority of players do not enjoy dying from fall damage more than they die from actual layers. That makes it a bad battlefield when the majority of players avoid it for that reason.

3) lack of strategic placement of anything.. They did not put much thought into actually making the objectives count for strategic positioning, When you took towers and keeps on Alpine maps, you had a reason to take or defend them due to the targets that could be hit from them and the advantage they would give on the battlefield. That w as lost with the design of these maps all together. It appears that was not even a thought when designing them.

4) Remove the PvE elements and Environmental Gimmicks from WvW.. We need less PVE in WvW and more PvP. 99.9% of GW is PVE, they can allow WvW players to have their tiny little corner without adding more PvE champs in there. Get rid of them and use the extra resources it frees up to allow more players in a zone without lagging instead. Making rocks come out of the ground does not enhance the match, it just irritates the players so they move somewhere that doesn’t happen to fight instead. If players are leaving an area to fight somewhere else instead because they think that zone sucks, that zones is not a well designed PvP zone.

5)Lack of water combat in WvW. At least on Alpine maps you were able to have underwater combat fights inside bay, south of keep and at SW camps…. Now WvW is lacking in Underwater combat due to shifting their focus to bouncy run away and avoid combat that players overwhelmingly do not enjoy.

What Anet fails to realize is that if they stay on track with their " progress" they will Kill WvW for good.. Continuing with the direction and theme of changes that they applied with HoT by replacing EBG with one of these garbage PvE maps will keep players out of WvW all together. They are currently huddled up on EBG because they hate the DBL maps so much that is their only retreat to enjoy WvW anymore. Remove that and you will lose those remaining players from the game.

Sure you will have the tiny percentage left that doesn’t care about the maps and doesn’t care if they play with friends.. but hat is what you call a dead game mode at that point.

I understand the frustrations.

I’m sure the devs are aware at this point given the feedback and stats. Just a waiting game at this point, and the devs know the players frustration because of that post by the devs saying “looks like we can talk about wvw so we will have some info”…

They know, but the old maps are not going to be dropped in just to take them out in whatever months at this point.

Being aware and acting on that awareness are two different things. Until we see new WvW team replacing the one we have it isn’t going to change. They said they were keeping the alpine maps in the rotation. The best thing they could do now to save the mode would be " rotate" back to alpine, leave it stuck there a bit while making new maps ( it doesn’t take a year to do that btw they just chose to make it so).

They should issue a statement stating they are aware of the issues and are trying to bring WvW players the maps they deserve, and that would be better than staying the course of action to replace EBG to try and force players onto the DBLS..

They can choose to save this or scrap it, and if they keep doing what they are doing.. it is all downhill from here. They very well could step up and say " we are going to make this right" but if they fail to do that, I am not sure it will be salvageable after they keep going the wrong way with it. Our guild used to run a solid 40+ core the majority of our raids.. we are down to 10 and under due to HoT. It isn’t just us either.. Everyone is playing other games / not interested in playing WvW in it’s current state and have lost hope that Anet will fix it.

I’m pretty sure the devs had a wake up call after last tournament, hence why they have been working on stuff already for a year. Also, the devs need to compete with a game like CU coming out, so GW2 can keep and attract more players.

The devs know the wvw gas tank is running on fumes at this point, but it’s just waiting time. Can’t make them work faster, but it’s reassuring that they have been up to something and that all engineers are coding away as we speak.

I don’t think the devs would ever come here and say they are happy with the current state of wvw either. Big stuff like this hits the pocket books so I’m sure they wished they would have invested sooner.

lil devils x.6071:

Edit- devs want all sorts of players in wvw, they just did it the wrong way with map completion stuff before. Once incentives are in place then everybody can find what appeals or encourages them to play. More players the better, but we all have to wait to find out.

Wanting all sorts of players doesn’t work in PvP game modes. Many games tried it. PvE players view WvW like the open world PvP games they refuse to play as it is. You either like to fight other players or you don’t. Some just don’t. Adding PvE to a PvP zone doesn’t change that, it just makes the players who want to PvP leave to a game that focuses on PvP instead.

I’m fully aware, but of course developers want to encourage more players to play different game modes. I never said anything about “adding pve to a pvp zone”, I said incentives. Incentives such as unique personal and guild rewards, some type of universal character progress, alternate progress options… There are a wide range of things to entice players that could be used.

We will just have to see what’s in store for wvw and these maps.

Their focus isn’t even on WvW, it is on trying to compete with MOBAas, which even Blizzard could not make WoW do. That failed terribly. The ONLY reason this takes so long is because WvW is not where hey are applying their resources. You can make things happen at the pace you dedicate the resources and man hours to. The pace for WvW is due to lack of " care" on their part moreso than anything. If they wished to dedicate the resources they are allocating to PvE and PvP updates, WvW would have been fixed long ago. The problem is their idea of " fixing it" will kill the game mode entirely.

Their current focus is on wvw.

Only moba can compete with moba, hence why ncsoft is working on two of them.

Of course resources were spread out, some to the year long wvw development and much more to the expansion.

You are kinda preaching to the choir, and I’m aware of what you are saying. Point is that there is going to be an update this year so the devs are not just going to throw in the old version of alpine back in at this point just to take it back out again. It’s at a point where the alpine map alone will not have the desired result of pulling in more players like you think. Players are tired of the same old at this point and wvw needs the “super secret” update to make anything substantial happen.

Honestly, if the devs switched maps today then most players wouldn’t really care now. You’d just have whatever die hards left on the maps and not much of anyone else. You’d still have the population disparities. You’d still have the same “zero” reward system. You’d still not have tournaments… It would just be wvw with the old alpine and same low population and interest level.

lil devils x.6071:

Swagger.1459:

lil devils x.6071:

Swagger.1459:

erKo.9586:

Thanks all for signing up in this thread!
Today at reset on Far Shiverpeaks(EU) there was instant 60+ queue on EB and no queue on the desert maps, and the que in eb grew bigger but no queue during the whole evening on the other borders. Thats enough proof for me.

We were already told the maps would come back…

They are probably upgrading AB, EB and making a snow map… I’m pretty sure we will have 4 unique maps to play on, and rotations will happen based on color placement for ranking… See how eotm does it?

Again, it was clearly said before. The devs also have all the statistics too so I’m sure they will change up the DB for the big update.

The voting won’t progress things faster, and at this point the old maps would be outdated for what they have in store. It’s probably best not to put them back in at this point because they will just have to replace them with a different AB anyway.

They are ignoring the numbers in hopes they can get PVE players into WvW, not understanding that PVE players don;t like PVP game modes and the ones that do are already plaything PvP and WvW. the rest of them rage quit if another player kills them.

“Their progress” IS the problem, and thus why they need players to tell them what they think about the direction they are taking it. The DBL’s are going the wrong direction all together IS the issue. WVW map design should be centered around keeping players engaged in challenging, fun, strategic PvP game play the majority of the time they are on a map. IF the core map design is not built around that very simple concept, it is a bad map. They built these maps to be the opposite. They cannot be " tweaked" to fix that is the issue. They actually have to take them back to the drawing board because:

1) They are too big, you spend more time running around wasting time instead of in PvP action. If you only have limited time to play, you do not want to spend it running around trying to find the action, you want to spend it IN the action. Think more like Courtyard, less like PVE zones for map design.

2)Horrible terrain for PvP. too many escape routes, fall damage, and environmental gimmicky BS. Needs a flatter, less bouncy gimmicky map to allow for players to stay in the PVP action rather than avoiding it or trying to get back to where the fight was only to find it over by the time you get to it. Make direct routs instead of trying to run players all over the place. It does not make fighting more challenging, fun or strategic to just make it take longer for players to get to the action due to terrain and environmental issues. That is just lame, not fun. They need to drop the idea of incorporating the battlefield into a jumping puzzle. The vast majority of players do not enjoy dying from fall damage more than they die from actual layers. That makes it a bad battlefield when the majority of players avoid it for that reason.

3) lack of strategic placement of anything.. They did not put much thought into actually making the objectives count for strategic positioning, When you took towers and keeps on Alpine maps, you had a reason to take or defend them due to the targets that could be hit from them and the advantage they would give on the battlefield. That w as lost with the design of these maps all together. It appears that was not even a thought when designing them.

4) Remove the PvE elements and Environmental Gimmicks from WvW.. We need less PVE in WvW and more PvP. 99.9% of GW is PVE, they can allow WvW players to have their tiny little corner without adding more PvE champs in there. Get rid of them and use the extra resources it frees up to allow more players in a zone without lagging instead. Making rocks come out of the ground does not enhance the match, it just irritates the players so they move somewhere that doesn’t happen to fight instead. If players are leaving an area to fight somewhere else instead because they think that zone sucks, that zones is not a well designed PvP zone.

5)Lack of water combat in WvW. At least on Alpine maps you were able to have underwater combat fights inside bay, south of keep and at SW camps…. Now WvW is lacking in Underwater combat due to shifting their focus to bouncy run away and avoid combat that players overwhelmingly do not enjoy.

What Anet fails to realize is that if they stay on track with their " progress" they will Kill WvW for good.. Continuing with the direction and theme of changes that they applied with HoT by replacing EBG with one of these garbage PvE maps will keep players out of WvW all together. They are currently huddled up on EBG because they hate the DBL maps so much that is their only retreat to enjoy WvW anymore. Remove that and you will lose those remaining players from the game.

Sure you will have the tiny percentage left that doesn’t care about the maps and doesn’t care if they play with friends.. but hat is what you call a dead game mode at that point.

I understand the frustrations.

I’m sure the devs are aware at this point given the feedback and stats. Just a waiting game at this point, and the devs know the players frustration because of that post by the devs saying “looks like we can talk about wvw so we will have some info”…

They know, but the old maps are not going to be dropped in just to take them out in whatever months at this point.

Being aware and acting on that awareness are two different things. Until we see new WvW team replacing the one we have it isn’t going to change. They said they were keeping the alpine maps in the rotation. The best thing they could do now to save the mode would be " rotate" back to alpine, leave it stuck there a bit while making new maps ( it doesn’t take a year to do that btw they just chose to make it so).

They should issue a statement stating they are aware of the issues and are trying to bring WvW players the maps they deserve, and that would be better than staying the course of action to replace EBG to try and force players onto the DBLS..

They can choose to save this or scrap it, and if they keep doing what they are doing.. it is all downhill from here. They very well could step up and say " we are going to make this right" but if they fail to do that, I am not sure it will be salvageable after they keep going the wrong way with it. Our guild used to run a solid 40+ core the majority of our raids.. we are down to 10 and under due to HoT. It isn’t just us either.. Everyone is playing other games / not interested in playing WvW in it’s current state and have lost hope that Anet will fix it.

I’m pretty sure the devs had a wake up call after last tournament, hence why they have been working on stuff already for a year. Also, the devs need to compete with a game like CU coming out, so GW2 can keep and attract more players.

The devs know the wvw gas tank is running on fumes at this point, but it’s just a waiting game until things are done. Can’t make them work faster, but it’s reassuring that they have been up to something and that all engineers are coding away as we speak.

I don’t think the devs would ever come here and say they are happy with the current state of wvw either. Big stuff like this hits the pocket books so I’m sure they wished they would have invested sooner.

lil devils x.6071:

Edit- devs want all sorts of players in wvw, they just did it the wrong way with map completion stuff before. Once incentives are in place then everybody can find what appeals or encourages them to play. More players the better, but we all have to wait to find out.

Wanting all sorts of players doesn’t work in PvP game modes. Many games tried it. PvE players view WvW like the open world PvP games they refuse to play as it is. You either like to fight other players or you don’t. Some just don’t. Adding PvE to a PvP zone doesn’t change that, it just makes the players who want to PvP leave to a game that focuses on PvP instead.

I’m fully aware, but of course developers want to encourage more players to play different game modes. I never said anything about “adding pve to a pvp zone”, I said incentives. Incentives such as unique personal and guild rewards, some type of universal character progress, alternate progress options… There are a wide range of things to entice players that could be used.

We will just have to see what’s in store for wvw and these maps.

lil devils x.6071:

Swagger.1459:

erKo.9586:

Thanks all for signing up in this thread!
Today at reset on Far Shiverpeaks(EU) there was instant 60+ queue on EB and no queue on the desert maps, and the que in eb grew bigger but no queue during the whole evening on the other borders. Thats enough proof for me.

We were already told the maps would come back…

They are probably upgrading AB, EB and making a snow map… I’m pretty sure we will have 4 unique maps to play on, and rotations will happen based on color placement for ranking… See how eotm does it?

Again, it was clearly said before. The devs also have all the statistics too so I’m sure they will change up the DB for the big update.

The voting won’t progress things faster, and at this point the old maps would be outdated for what they have in store. It’s probably best not to put them back in at this point because they will just have to replace them with a different AB anyway.

They are ignoring the numbers in hopes they can get PVE players into WvW, not understanding that PVE players don;t like PVP game modes and the ones that do are already plaything PvP and WvW. the rest of them rage quit if another player kills them.

“Their progress” IS the problem, and thus why they need players to tell them what they think about the direction they are taking it. The DBL’s are going the wrong direction all together IS the issue. WVW map design should be centered around keeping players engaged in challenging, fun, strategic PvP game play the majority of the time they are on a map. IF the core map design is not built around that very simple concept, it is a bad map. They built these maps to be the opposite. They cannot be " tweaked" to fix that is the issue. They actually have to take them back to the drawing board because:

1) They are too big, you spend more time running around wasting time instead of in PvP action. If you only have limited time to play, you do not want to spend it running around trying to find the action, you want to spend it IN the action. Think more like Courtyard, less like PVE zones for map design.

2)Horrible terrain for PvP. too many escape routes, fall damage, and environmental gimmicky BS. Needs a flatter, less bouncy gimmicky map to allow for players to stay in the PVP action rather than avoiding it or trying to get back to where the fight was only to find it over by the time you get to it. Make direct routs instead of trying to run players all over the place. It does not make fighting more challenging, fun or strategic to just make it take longer for players to get to the action due to terrain and environmental issues. That is just lame, not fun. They need to drop the idea of incorporating the battlefield into a jumping puzzle. The vast majority of players do not enjoy dying from fall damage more than they die from actual layers. That makes it a bad battlefield when the majority of players avoid it for that reason.

3) lack of strategic placement of anything.. They did not put much thought into actually making the objectives count for strategic positioning, When you took towers and keeps on Alpine maps, you had a reason to take or defend them due to the targets that could be hit from them and the advantage they would give on the battlefield. That w as lost with the design of these maps all together. It appears that was not even a thought when designing them.

4) Remove the PvE elements and Environmental Gimmicks from WvW.. We need less PVE in WvW and more PvP. 99.9% of GW is PVE, they can allow WvW players to have their tiny little corner without adding more PvE champs in there. Get rid of them and use the extra resources it frees up to allow more players in a zone without lagging instead. Making rocks come out of the ground does not enhance the match, it just irritates the players so they move somewhere that doesn’t happen to fight instead. If players are leaving an area to fight somewhere else instead because they think that zone sucks, that zones is not a well designed PvP zone.

5)Lack of water combat in WvW. At least on Alpine maps you were able to have underwater combat fights inside bay, south of keep and at SW camps…. Now WvW is lacking in Underwater combat due to shifting their focus to bouncy run away and avoid combat that players overwhelmingly do not enjoy.

What Anet fails to realize is that if they stay on track with their " progress" they will Kill WvW for good.. Continuing with the direction and theme of changes that they applied with HoT by replacing EBG with one of these garbage PvE maps will keep players out of WvW all together. They are currently huddled up on EBG because they hate the DBL maps so much that is their only retreat to enjoy WvW anymore. Remove that and you will lose those remaining players from the game.

Sure you will have the tiny percentage left that doesn’t care about the maps and doesn’t care if they play with friends.. but hat is what you call a dead game mode at that point.

I understand the frustrations.

I’m sure the devs are aware at this point given the feedback and stats. Just a waiting game at this point, and the devs know the players frustration because of that post by the devs saying “looks like we can talk about wvw so we will have some info”…

They know, but the old maps are not going to be dropped in just to take them out in whatever months at this point.

Edit- devs want all sorts of players in wvw, they just did it the wrong way with map completion stuff before. Once incentives are in place then everybody can find what appeals or encourages them to play. More players the better, but we all have to wait to find out.

erKo.9586:

Thanks all for signing up in this thread!
Today at reset on Far Shiverpeaks(EU) there was instant 60+ queue on EB and no queue on the desert maps, and the que in eb grew bigger but no queue during the whole evening on the other borders. Thats enough proof for me.

We were already told the maps would come back…

They are probably upgrading AB, EB and making a snow map… I’m pretty sure we will have 4 unique maps to play on, and rotations will happen based on color placement for ranking… See how eotm does it?

Again, it was clearly said before. The devs also have all the statistics too so I’m sure they will change up the DB for the big update.

The voting won’t progress things faster, and at this point the old maps would be outdated for what they have in store. It’s probably best not to put them back in at this point because they will just have to replace them with a different AB anyway.

Noob.5908:

Swagger.1459:

Most likely this “population balance” fix will come when the update drops.

I hear ya, but NcSoft/Anet sometimes doesn’t seem to have very good priorities. I can see them continuing to ignore this issue which imho is the single most important issue that runs players off in WvW. Sure lots of other things are important but without population balance, retaining players isn’t gonna happen and I just wonder how big of an issue NcSoft/Anet’s views pop-balance. Recently(since HoT) I see threads about dead game mode and empty maps etc but very few people actually complaining about population balance. Furthermore if they implement it without player feedback and listening to them this time, I don’t feel good about any implementation addressing pop-balance coming down the pipe. This one single issue I think would satisfy many players if NcSoft/Anet would at least open a discussion with us about whats in the plans for this issue.

BTW, answering my own question, yes I have many friends that would come back and play WVW if it’s fixed and obviously I feel player retention would probably double if not triple over what it is atm.

How about your friends would they come back or would it take more than balancing population?

I fully understand you.

Corporate policy to not talk about stuff is the norm, no amount of asking from all of us will change that unfortunately.

We will probably have to wait for the “beta” announcement to get anything.

Let’s refrain for “attacking” the messenger peeps, it’s unnecessary.

Noob.5908:

FogLeg.9354:

If you want to talk about WvW population balance why you keep dragging NcSoft back into this thread again and again?

Why you keep posting to THE thread about stuff that has nothing to do with WVW and the topic at hand. Let me SPELL it out for you.

C A N Y O U A N S W E R T H E P O S T E D Q U E S T I O N

Sound it out and maybe it will sink in…

Anet knows population balance is an issue, and of course they know it needs to be addressed. That’s why Colin said they are working on “population balance”… Most likely this “population balance” fix will come when the update drops.