Guild Wars 2

I always try to fix and repair things in WvW. Call me weird, but that is something I have always done in mmos.

There’s a couple heart missions in PvE where you’re supposed to fend off the attackers and/or put out fires and fix up buildings…..I am always the one repairing and putting out fires during that heart mission…..lol.

Would be kind of cool if when it came time to rebuild LA, the game would give the players a chance to help with that. I think you might be surprised at how many would try to help rebuild that place.

Maiday.9028:

Teon.5168:

smithkt.8062:

Teon.5168:

Kaineng Server…
Yito
Hardtankz
Steel Juggernaut

EB, and the other various borderlands depending on who we’re up against for the week. I haven’t been in EotM enough to know who are the best leaders.

There are a couple more that I am forgetting I am sure, but those are the ones that I have run with lately that have been the most fun/effective. (As well as being patient and willing to answer questions from players that are truly trying to get better in WvW)

We actually have quite a few good commanders in Kaineng,
I’d add Thorin Graf, Kingofnight, and Dangleon to this list.

There are others that only tag occasionally when needed and do a fine job as well.

I think all of these guys are patient for the most part and I have learned a lot following them.

Bonus is if you get Yito on team speak he may start singing.

Except for Kingofnight, who I have run with some this week(and he was very good, especially with the very small zerg we had a couple nights), I haven’t had the pleasure of running with those other commanders, yet. I have also run in some pugs that don’t have an official commander, but have been very fun to run with.

And yea, I was on last week when Yito started singing in the zerg Steel Juggernaut was leading……hilarious as heck!!!! He likes to do falsetto renditions of the songs he is listening to, atm…..lmao! Everyone on TS was cracking up after awhile instead of talking strategy/directions/asking questions……

Well, the cool thing is i can Sing in TS and still get stuff done -Yito

LOL….Very true……even while we were all laughing and you were singing, we still took several supply camps, killed bad guys, took some towers and keeps, and caused general havoc……you all are a fun bunch to run with

Deamhan.9538:

Teon.5168:

“Play the game properly”

Whoa boy, can that phrase ever have umpteen different meanings to so many different players…….lol.

Yup, that’s why I defined what I meant by it with “in contrast to…..”

Oh yea, I read that…….but just had to chuckle because I have seen that phrase in so many different mmo forums…..and it is truly amazing how many different meanings can follow that phrase, depending on the player/game/situation/etc.

“Play the game properly”

Whoa boy, can that phrase ever have umpteen different meanings to so many different players…….lol.

chemiclord.3978:

CuteLilKittenHugz.2064:

Hate hate hate LongBow i will never use it, don’t understand why so many rangers prefer it.)

Hey, it does have its uses. When I’m in the open world, and a huge world event starts up that spawns a heap of mobs, Barrage followed by Hunter’s Shot (after all the barrage ticks end… that is very important) deals a nice amount of AoE damage and clears aggro for a few seconds. Rapid Fire can be nice if the people you’re with aren’t maxing out Vulnerability readily (though that rarely happens).

Learn to avoid the “4” when you’re on longbow, and it’s not terrible, just very situational.

Agreed.

eleshazar.6902:

Well I think you are making some rather sweeping generalizations and playing to age stereotypes. I personally work a full time salaried job at a large legal financial/tech corporation. I have responsibilities in life a plenty. I still seek a challenge in my video game, because to me, without a challenge the game is boring. If I can just walk around with 100 people pressing “1” and get rewarded I ask myself the question of why the heck am I wasting my time doing this? If it presents a challenge then at least I feel engaged, like I have to react and actually do something. But I suppose that is why I can never sit through more than one movie in a row….

Was just stating my opinion. If I was still in my 20s-30s, when I had a much faster paced and competitive lifestyle, along with job/responsibilities/etc I would be approaching this game in a completely different way….so I can completely understand what you’re saying above. I still have a job/responsibilities/etc….I just am not near as competitive about my video games anymore. And yea, it’s not necessarily age based, as I do know some other game player friends in my age range who play for the high end challenges/drops/hard core stuff/etc much more than I bother to do.

Noobie.1073:

Well, rangers are the best at making people rage quit while solo roaming

Sure another profession can kill faster but no one cares when they get finished by: warrior, guard, necro, ele, thief, engi…..but a ranger! oh its the end of the world!! If it’s a LB ranger, hell just froze over!! If they died in entangle, the ranger is a HACKER!!!!!

Most thieves can not fathom losing a 1v1 to a ranger! What blasphemy is this!!! Rangers are supposed to thief food!! For some reason, the elitists in the game get too personal when they get finished by a ranger, and that is what rangers are best at. NO other profession strikes the annoying rage from a finisher like the ranger

LMAO!!!! Awhile back, I actually did that to a thief in wvw. I am sure it was a fairly inexperienced one…..had to be, as I am usually thief food when I am not being careful.

Was running back to the northernmost keep during a big keep defense, and noticed this enemy thief come running down the main stairs on the northern side, so I hit him with a couple long ranged shots, one crit, pet was on him…so he stealthed and I got lucky at guessing where he might come out of stealth, hit him a few more times and actually got entangle off and locked him down, then the pet and I killed him. Am sure he was a wvw newb, and just panicked…..but I got a good laugh out of how he must have been screaming and cussing at getting killed by a lowly ranger……was pretty funny. Pretty sure I used the bunny finisher on him, too.

SpellOfIniquity.1780:

LB can be great if used properly but it’s really, really not meant for duels… I think a lot of people are thinking Archer and not Ranger.

LOL…..quoted for truth! LB truly, truly sucks up close.

When I first started leveling a Ranger, I was guilty of thinking of it as an archer like I had played in other mmos……but you learn really fast that LB is not meant for in close battles. I have a difficult time imagining anyone playing a Ranger longbow all the time for everything……that person would really have to be completely clueless about the class.

But, stranger things have happened in mmos.

shawshank.4906:

Yes, it’s very good if not the best way to level (not counting crafting).
If there’s a good train going on you can get about 4 levels and 2-3 WvW ranks per hour.

Completely agree. All depends on the zerg going, though. You have to expect that you’ll have some bad days/nights out there, so don’t get frustrated. When you get in with a decent zerg, you can level, wvw ranks and actual character levels, very, very quickly.

Enjoy and have fun out there!

Imo, give it some more time. I really think that the megaservers and boss encounters/schedules will be adjusted/tweaked some more, and people will begin to get bored with the massive boss encounters and you’ll see the crowds start to thin out, as well.

geogyf.5087:

After all this is all about efficiency.

To lots of players out there, it’s all about fun and enjoyment and who gives a kitten about maximum efficiency. When parts of the game become all about maximum speed and efficiency to me, then the whole thing starts becoming too much like a job, instead of an enjoyable game.

I don’t know…..the guild that I belong to is really good about running some of the dungeons every Saturday, and the guild dungeon groups take any and all classes in the guild……

Sounds to me more like what you’re running into is dungeon pug attitude, which is not necessarily the fault of the game makers.

Jmo

smithkt.8062:

Teon.5168:

Kaineng Server…
Yito
Hardtankz
Steel Juggernaut

EB, and the other various borderlands depending on who we’re up against for the week. I haven’t been in EotM enough to know who are the best leaders.

There are a couple more that I am forgetting I am sure, but those are the ones that I have run with lately that have been the most fun/effective. (As well as being patient and willing to answer questions from players that are truly trying to get better in WvW)

We actually have quite a few good commanders in Kaineng,
I’d add Thorin Graf, Kingofnight, and Dangleon to this list.

There are others that only tag occasionally when needed and do a fine job as well.

I think all of these guys are patient for the most part and I have learned a lot following them.

Bonus is if you get Yito on team speak he may start singing.

Except for Kingofnight, who I have run with some this week(and he was very good, especially with the very small zerg we had a couple nights), I haven’t had the pleasure of running with those other commanders, yet. I have also run in some pugs that don’t have an official commander, but have been very fun to run with.

And yea, I was on last week when Yito started singing in the zerg Steel Juggernaut was leading……hilarious as heck!!!! He likes to do falsetto renditions of the songs he is listening to, atm…..lmao! Everyone on TS was cracking up after awhile instead of talking strategy/directions/asking questions……

Relaxation and enjoyment and lots of chuckles for a few hours after work.
And as others have said here….I also enjoy improving myself in WvW….learning from my mistakes…..being more helpful to others in the group…etc.(On nights and/or weekends when I am feeling a bit more serious about my gaming…lol)

And there are also some nights after work when its just enjoyable to clear my mind and just mindlessly enjoy what the game throws at me….the exploration……..the gorgeous graphics….the sounds….talking to others in game….etc. Better than sitting in front of the tv and getting completely numb, imo.

Plus, my wife enjoys the game as much as I do, so we have a lot of fun playing the game together.

Nick.6972:

Phy.2913:

Nage.1520:

Lankybrit.4598:

Zergs are simply a by-product of:

No Holy Trinity.

Simple as that.

Rift has a holy trinity. Rift has zergs.

Rift also has real raid content and endgame.

Why can’t Arena Net balance out open world zerging with “elite hardcore” instances?

Why would they want to? The majority of players aren’t after something like that. Sure, they could make a few of them to please the elitist min maxers out there, but then those few players would start complaining about how there wasn’t enough of them as they’re getting bored with the few they have. It’s just not worth the dev’s energy and time, imo. It’s all about pleasing the largest number of people that Anet can, as that means more $$$ for their business.

Sure, they could make a game that had all sorts of graduating, tougher than nails instances and encounters, which would have high appeal to a small niche of players, and that game probably wouldn’t even make enough money to pay for development costs.

Reikou.7068:

Zergs are a direct result of “everyone gets rewarded/loot.”

Remove unlimited shared loot, and zergs will disappear really quickly when 95% of the zerglings don’t get anything for zerging.

Limited shared loot is fine. For example, a total of up to 5 players being rewarded for an event/mob that was designed for 1 player. Total of up to 10 players being rewarded for event/mob that was designed for 5 players to tackle, etc. A reasonable spread of of players being rewarded. However, it should not be unlimited players being rewarded for an event/mob that was designed for 1 player.

Zergs are a direct result of the game being a mmorpg. You could get rid of all the huge and shared rewards and replace it with some simple little shinies/glowies and you would still have zergs taking on the bosses/champions, because it’s a massively multiplayer online game.

Astralporing.1957:

Turgut.4397:

Games used to really test people back in the day, now it’s moved onto catering for the ultra-casual and lazy.

Ah, you see, maybe it’s because games are not a sport, but an entertainment. As such, i don’t want them to test me. I want them to entertain me for long enough that i can consider what i paid for them a money well spent. A hard, but short game is way less interesting for me than an easy one with a good and long story, or one where i can disengage my mind and just have some fun for an hour or two after work. Especially after work, when i am already tired and would really hate for the game to tire me even more.

Quoted for truth!

It’s amazing to me how many people on this forum simply do not get that.
(Well, not that amazing, when I start thinking about what the average age probably is of forum posters)

It just occurred to me that this may be a spy thread for the WvW tournament to determine which leaders to approach with care……..GASP!!!!

Nevermind my last post.

Kaineng Server…
Yito
Hardtankz
Steel Juggernaut

EB, and the other various borderlands depending on who we’re up against for the week. I haven’t been in EotM enough to know who are the best leaders.

There are a couple more that I am forgetting I am sure, but those are the ones that I have run with lately that have been the most fun/effective. (As well as being patient and willing to answer questions from players that are truly trying to get better in WvW)

Deamhan.9538:

Oh man, the potential for WvW is huge.

For Borderlands:

To take a tower, you must first take and hold two adjacent supply camps. To take a keep, you must take and hold two adjacent towers.

For EB:

Same as the borderlands with the addition that you must capture and hold the keep of faction claiming the castle, and capture and hold the two towers closest to the castle of that same faction, in order to take the castle.

There, it’s not as much of zergs going in circles. You actually have to defend, not only for the sake of keeping it from you enemy but you must also defend in order to take more.

Agreed. You do see some zergs that just do the circle runs, but most of the zergs in WvW I have run with do it somewhat the way that you post about, which is a lot more interesting, imo.

Aeolus.3615:

^well pve needs more events and chain events to unlock the bosses…

This is how see it:

In WvW, zerg its a product due map size and game “lack” of mechanics.

Maps are just AB shrines with walls, just a rush game, take tower while empty move to next where castle/tower/keep design is not competent imo, the zerg its a easy solution to take it almost with zero effort.
Siege is the “mechanic” Anet wanted to fight the zerg but forgot that towers can be taked with just easy naked pvd under 2.30minutes, almost the time that an entire group can cross the map, wich leaves to the lack of “want to deffend/need to deffend”, and the redundancy starts over and over after each RI ends.

I am not against large groups, but on gw2 they look far more
clueless just spamming 1 key and roolling to avoid auto atack mostly.

It certainly can be that way in WvW. But one can also be more creative and go in small havoc groups with friends and just run around and disrupt things, take on small roaming groups, etc. The zerging mentality has been around since the start of mmorpgs with WvW/RvR, and the mechanics don’t seem to matter much to that mentality. Jmo, of course.

Eles and mesmers and guardians are fun. I have a few 80s, and decided to build a tiny asura warrior. Hilarious fun, imo……and speedy for world exploration, too.(maybe it’s just his tiny size that makes him seem speedy…..I don’t know, as other larger class warriors are plodding slugs….lol)

Plus you can use several different weapon sets, and you’re really durable with tons of damage.

And don’t listen to those here that say you can only do a few builds in each class to be viable. “Play how you want” is a very valid way to approach the game, as you can always respec if you want to with very little trouble.

Best of luck!

Deamhan.9538:

I agree with you OP.

ANet monitors the game. They know what the player base is doing. They know what and where the players gravitate toward.

Taking that into consideration, now consider the following…

I play ESO and I’ve noticed a glaring design flaw. Things like mines, Dwemer ruins, Ayleid ruins, etc. are not instanced. They each have a boss npc at the end with better drops than the typical mob. Guess what? Zergs. It’s like the Champ train except the zerg doesn’t actually move from location to location.

They don’t do this because the game forces them to. They do this because the game allows them to.

It’s pretty well known that the forums tend to be the vocal minority of the game’s player base. So going back to what I first said to consider, ANet is a business. They will appease the masses to line their own pockets. Since the majority of the masses simply want to play the meta of amassing in-game wealth and decking their toons out with shinies, the easiest and most effective way is to champ train, or boss spawn camp, etc.

So the content is centered around this. Zerg centered content. Sure, you get massive scale battles involving dozens of player but there is a cost to this.

1. The complexity of the battle on an individual level is inversely proportional to the number of individuals involved. The more people there are, the more the fight becomes standing in place pressing 1.

2. The feeling of personal accomplishment is inversely proportional to the number of individuals involved. The more people there are, the less you matter.

With ESO, they are in a place to fix the situation. All those explorable areas involve pressing “E” (default) on a door and going through a loading screen. They could make these areas instanced. They could also set the boss up with a trigger. Clear the randoms to access the boss. They could also make the boss spawn as a boss npc only once per character. After that, the boss is just a regular mob. If you want to get another shot at the boss, you’ll have to party up with someone who hasn’t completed it yet. All kinds of possibilities that would fix the current camping/botting situation.

As for ANet and GW2….I’ve all but given it up completely. Although I’m close. I suppose they could modify the dungeons so that you have to clear the randoms along a path before you can access the boss(es) of the path. It would kill speed running them.

While I agree with a lot of your points, I am not so sure that all people play the game just for the shinies and/or rewards. Imo, there is probably quite a large number of people who play it for the exploration and different things they can do in game. A lot of those players are casual, as I am. Sure, shinies and glowies are cool, but they’re not required for a lot of people who enjoy the game for different reasons. Jmo, of course…..I certainly could be wrong.

I most certainly agree with your point that the forums are not necessarily a good place to garner any sort of valid opinion on those that actually enjoy and still play the game.

If you really want to upgrade, I would just go with a radeon 7800 or better with at least 2gig of memory on it. Your current setup, with the integrated video gpu shares memory with your motherboard cpu, so that 6gig you have on board is not being totally used by the cpu/motherboard…….if you are able to turn off the integrated video gpu, and then go with a dedicated separate high end video card with it’s own memory, your results in game should be pretty good.

I would experiment more with your graphic settings in game before shelling out the cash for a new graphics card and memory.

If you want to play on the max settings, you’ll definitely need a better graphics card, or even a dual graphics card setup. A Radeon 7800 or better would work pretty good. You might also experiment with overclocking that cpu.(Be very careful and be sure you know what you’re doing when you do that)

Also be sure you don’t have some memory hog virus software in the background running, like mcafee or nortons.

Also, adubb’s suggestions are very good ones.

Your computer shouldn’t have any problems with the game, as my laptop has similar stats and does fine. When you get into the boss battles with a ton of people in the same area, hit your escape key, hit options, then hit graphics(it’s the little mountain icon), then click on the pulldown box just above the individual graphic settings and pick ‘best performance’. While this will decrease the visual quality, it will also increase the fps and playability. When you get into an area with less people, just click on that option again and pick ‘autodetect’, and you’ll get better graphics again.

It’s a good option to use as you can do it on the fly at any time in the game.

Also, after you do the ‘best performance’ option, you can experiment with some of the individual graphic options to see which ones you can kick up a bit to increase the graphics quality without too much of a penalty to the fps. A great place to try it is in one of the main cities or in Vigil Keep, as there will be tons of players in those areas, and you can experiment with the graphic options at your leisure with no threat of your character getting into a battle with an npc.

Best of luck!

My main is a Ranger. I rotate between longbow/shortbow and longbow/warhorn-axe for WvW, depending on the situation-zerg size-etc, and longbow/greatsword(normally PvE)

I don’t have much problem running with the zerg in WvW. I play ranged support the majority of the time, and there are usually a couple rangers there who are doing the same(unless the zerg is really small…then there’s usually only 1 or 2 rangers). If ranged support is played well on a ranger or 2 or 3, with a well run and organized zerg, it seems to me that us rangers can provide some real problems to enemy zergs.

Of course, you never want to use knockdown in the zerg, as that is the quickest way to tee off other players…..one learns that very quickly……lol. But barrage seems to work well in a lot of situations.

Normally, my survivability is decent enough where I can pull away from the zerg as they engage an enemy zerg and provide some effective long ranged support. Of course, one has to be very careful where you put yourself outside the zerg,(terrain awareness is very important on a ranger, imo) and you gotta be ready to move a lot and quickly and use those survival skills like crazy and have your head on a swivel all the time. This, of course, works much better when you have another couple rangers who are doing the same, as then the enemy won’t have such an easy time zeroing in on ya. Rangers are also very effective in keep and tower defenses….it’s a ton of fun taking down/bothering those squishies running around below the walls.

Of course, there are quite a few classes that are much more powerful/versatile than my ranger, but it truly can be a ton of fun to play in WvW, as it can be extremely challenging, and very rewarding when you play one smartly.

And yea, my ranger is not terribly good in 1v1 combat in WvW(not so much because of my class, but rather that I need to get better/smarter at it)…….I can usually last long enough and give the other player enough problems where another member in the zerg can get to me and help by that point. I have taken down a few 1v1, but generally am not very good in melee, unless I can get a good stun off with my shortbow, or use my survival skills well enough where I can put some distance between me and the attacker. Sometimes the pet works well, sometimes it doesn’t…..lol. I think that would be my real problem with the ranger…..the pet ai could be better. And yea, bears and cats work great…..and spiders are also fun to play around with.

Rangers might not be the ideal class to play in WvW, but they sure can be an awful lot of fun! I love my ranger in both WvW and PvE.

Angelweave.1856:

The core issue i hear is not the number of people, but standing still pressing 1 = win.

Events need to require skill again… bosses send out ground targeting aoe and also blockable/dodgeable aoe but boss aoe works like Piercing Arrows so the whole zerg feels it, immobilize people for 30 seconds who dps through the wrong phase (kinda like Lyssa only more punishing), put reflect back on bosses so people can spike themselves to death, have bosses spread mass aoe conditions, rase the condition cap on bosses and/or make player applied conditions last 1/12 of what they normally do but cause 12 times more damage (so conditions are still viable but a zerg can use their condition builds), remove the blinding ball of light so that you can see boss mechanics, boss range is 0-2000 on all attacks so range or melee you gotta watch, blah blah blah…

It’s not the zerg that’s the problem it is making all fights a dps check instead of a dodge, heal, armor, vitality, timing and ultimately skill check.

For those who are still struggling with this… basically the idea is have a boss fight where the boss self destructs (aka dies) regardless of the dps, the reward is for those who stay alive inside a set area. This extreme would be boring I think but adding such elements into a boss fight to make them less zergy and more interesting.

Some interesting ideas. Correct me if my memory is not serving me well, but I seem to remember that the really big generals/bosses/scarlet’s commanders in the LA destruction story required a bit more skill/effort/time. I remember being in a zerg trying to kill one of them before the final kill scarlet mission, and he had lots of adds around him, as well as moving a lot, doing some random aoe(although there was always some sort of que that the aoe was coming), healing, and generally just being a real pain in the rear to take down. I even remember that pets needed to be stowed on some of them, as they caused more problems with the encounter.

Are the bosses in some of the PvE areas with the huge zergs a lot easier?

Zepidel.5349:

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Teon.5168:

Zepidel.5349:

There no increased reward for doing things solo or with a small group.

Warhammer online (yes I know it was crap), was the first game to have public quests really open world stuff like mega bosses. And they made it so zerging it was harder, and the chances of a good reward was A LOT smaller.

To iterate, take jormag. If you solo him you get a chest and 2 rares. If you kill him with 200 people… you get the same chest and 2? rares. If they used the warhammer system…

There are 3 gold chests, 5 silver 10 bronze, and infinite “bags” (consolation prizes). You roll a dice 1-100 and this is added to your contribution, based on time being there, dps, healing, supporting others etc… up to 200. the gold chests go to the 3 ppl with highest scores, 3-8 get the silver, etc… you can see were zerging is discouraged.

In “WvWvW” killing a player yielded a ton of XP, but that was divided by how many people tagged them. So again solo/small group play was greatly encouraged and rewarded.

While I understand your points(and yes, Warhammer was a piece of disappointing junk)….but if you brought back dierolls, peoples’ amount of damage and/or time spent on a boss or other encounter, then that would only bring back kill stealing, loot jumping, griefing, and a generally uncooperative/everyone for themselves type of mentality that exists in so many other older mmorpgs.

I am not sure why some people get so perturbed and annoyed that someone who joined the fight halfway through gets the same rewards, when the people that were there for the whole fight still get the full reward as well. Isn’t that the point of the boss fight….to get the drops and have the fun of taking the boss down? Why be so overly concerned that some other player got the same drops for being there for only half the battle…..so what? How does that affect one’s own play? I would be much more upset and peeved if someone came in and did a kill/drop steal, or got a super lucky die roll and got the prize, rather than just equally giving the prize to everyone who participated.

And as another poster already said, scaling never seems to work quite right in mmorpgs. Just the way it is. Maybe it can be adjusted better….maybe not.

It was never that way in Warhammer, no one “kill stealed” or ninja looted. You couldn’t anyways, the people who were there longer and did more had a way better chance at higher tier loot.

A system like this wouldnt really benefit GW2 PvE, but it would make a world of a difference in WvWvW. I cant stand zerging in PvP, and there literally zero reason not to in WvWvW, as there is actually LESS reward for doing so, and if you want your small scale fix SPvP exists. Not to mention the server rotation and no player names means you can’t make sworn enemies with people on the other realms.

At least we agree that Warhammer was mostly a piece of junk(and I had such high hopes for that game, too!)

viralthefrog.6130:

foofad.5162:

The reason you have zergs is that there is no player collision in the game, there is an AOE cap on most damage skills, and the ranges on most support abilities are short, often below 600. Between those three reasons there is no disincentive to not stand as close together as possible.

Player collision alone would be enough to mitigate the majority of zerging, and removing the AOE cap or increasing it greatly to 8 or 10 would put the last nail in the coffin. Increasing the range on support skills would also enable people to spread out more without feeling like they have to be standing inside one another in order to get the full effect of an ability.

Player collision means the few can block the many.

AOE cap increase means the few can damage the many.

Support range increase means the few can support each other more effectively.

No more zergs, tbh.

Then they just all stop standing on top of each other and start ranged zerging.

I have to agree. Your ideas wouldn’t stop zerging, foofad….it would just cause the blob to spread out a bit more. You would have the same zergs with the same number people….they would just take up more physical space in the game.

Rouven.7409:

I think the main message, or vision, for this game always was “the more the merrier”.

I would not want a system where my first thought seeing other players would be “oh great, less loot – go away!”

Don’t get me wrong – I love to roam solo (PvE).

Completely agree. If players want that type of of mmorpg, there are tons of other ones out there that offer the “oh great, less loot – go away!” system of playing. I am glad that GW2 chose not to go that route.

Zepidel.5349:

There no increased reward for doing things solo or with a small group.

Warhammer online (yes I know it was crap), was the first game to have public quests really open world stuff like mega bosses. And they made it so zerging it was harder, and the chances of a good reward was A LOT smaller.

To iterate, take jormag. If you solo him you get a chest and 2 rares. If you kill him with 200 people… you get the same chest and 2? rares. If they used the warhammer system…

There are 3 gold chests, 5 silver 10 bronze, and infinite “bags” (consolation prizes). You roll a dice 1-100 and this is added to your contribution, based on time being there, dps, healing, supporting others etc… up to 200. the gold chests go to the 3 ppl with highest scores, 3-8 get the silver, etc… you can see were zerging is discouraged.

In “WvWvW” killing a player yielded a ton of XP, but that was divided by how many people tagged them. So again solo/small group play was greatly encouraged and rewarded.

I can somewhat understand your points(and yes, Warhammer was a piece of disappointing junk)….but if you brought back dierolls, peoples’ amount of damage and/or time spent on a boss or other encounter, then that would only bring back kill stealing, loot jumping, griefing, and a generally uncooperative/everyone for themselves type of mentality that exists in so many other older mmorpgs.

I am not sure why some people get so perturbed and annoyed that someone who joined the fight halfway through gets the same rewards, when the people that were there for the whole fight still get the full reward as well. Isn’t that the point of the boss fight….to get the drops and have the fun of taking the boss down? Why be so overly concerned that some other player got the same drops for being there for only half the battle…..so what? How does that affect one’s own play? I would be much more upset and peeved if someone came in and did a kill/drop steal, or got a super lucky die roll and got the prize, rather than just equally giving the prize to everyone who participated.

And as another poster already said, scaling never seems to work quite right in mmorpgs. Just the way it is. Maybe it can be adjusted better….maybe not.

Rauderi.8706:

Lankybrit.4598:

Zergs are simply a by-product of:

No Holy Trinity.

Simple as that.

Ugh, gods no. It’s a much more complicated issue than that. There’d be zergs even if there were tanks and healers. Because tanks would sit up front trading off aggro while the healers lazily lob heals and dps safely nicks away at the boss.

So just no. It’s not that.

If you wanted a simple answer, it’s because the content is open world and anyone can wander in or out at their leisure. The zerg’d content provides some of the better rewards (I don’t want to say “best”, because rewards in GW2 are… bad) for relatively safe and efficient participation.

Completely agree. Zergs would still exist, even with the holy trinity. I have played several mmorpgs that had the holy trinity, and in WvW/RvR/PvE the zergs were just as bad.

I am not sure why some people seem to think that the holy trinity would fix elements of this game. It would cause more problems, imo, as it would push this game backwards towards the older style mmorpg.

I, for one, am glad there is no holy trinity in this game……one of the reasons why my wife and I got this game in the first place. She used to always play a healer in past mmos, and when we first got this game, she was like “omg, I can actually hit back with some efficiency now and don’t have to kite all the time in PvE when soloing!”

The holy trinity, imo, is an out of date concept in mmos anymore. Glad to see that this game stepped beyond that with it’s classes.

Been playing since just a couple months after release, and I still find that I immensely enjoy this game. Sure, there are some elements that need to be tweaked/adjusted…..but I still get a ton of fun out of this game.

Some great suggestions! The upgrades have been a bit bewildering to me as to what are the best ones. I am only rank 50ish, so am fairly new to WvW compared to most others out there. So far, have been putting most of my upgrades into supply, supply capacity, treb, siege might(I tend to do a lot of trebbing when there is not a whole lot of other stuff going on in WvW) and repair and building. Will start saving up points to get the fortitude upgrade, as that sounds very good.

Thanks again…really informative thread!

viralthefrog.6130:

Spiuk.8421:

Teon.5168:

Just in case you didn’t read your own post, you said +750 precision…..not +150. HUGE difference. When you’re bragging about your ‘math’ skills, it usually helps to type in the correct number, or something that is at least close to it.

Woah… ok, lets just go back to the basics:

150 × 5 = ???

The way you worded it originally was very poor.
Yes, you may bring a total of 750 precision to the entire party combined…
But you only bring 150 per person.
The way you had it worded was as if you were providing 750 per person.
Math may be your strong suit, but English is not.

Thanks, Viral……I was beginning to think maybe I read too much into the post. At least there is one other person out there that read it the same way I did.

Fafnir.5124:

Id argue immersion is how well is the game made = hours you can play with out sleeping

You’re kidding, right?

Gearbox.2748:

Found another thread on same topic back a yeah ago.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/deaths-age

Back then the collective data showed this:
class – # deaths per hour (total deaths / total hours)
1. Thief – 0.65
2. Engineer – 0.88
3. Ranger – 0.88
4. Elementalist – 1.11
5. Warrior – 1.39
6. Necromancer – 1.46
7. Mesmer – 1.65
8. Guardian – 1.67

Will be very interesting to see what numbers we get now a year later.

3 is just about right on for deaths per hour on my Ranger

I definitely agree with the lag issues and having to turn graphic settings down. I could normally run at max graphics in PvE with no trouble before the megaserver, but now have to bring the settings down a bit for things to run smoother. Have also also noticed a few more crashes in game after the patch. Hopefully these issues will get tweaked.

I haven’t noticed not being able to get with parties on the megaserver….although, I normally just run with my wife in PvE. I haven’t noticed too many complaints in guild chat about that issue. Am running on NA servers, so the language problems that the euro servers are experiencing doesn’t exist here……can see how that would be a pretty big issue for some.

All in all, I like the megaserver so far, as am on a low pop server, and it’s good seeing so many people in the different zones, now. Heck, last night I was out exploring more of Frostgorge Sound, and there were even quite a few people out there. That place used to be deserted before the megaserver.

I realize there are issues that need to be resolved with the megaserver, but, for the most part, I like it.

150 to each player in the group……..I was looking at it as what it gives to a single player, not everyone totalled. You could say the same about any ability that grants abilities to allies. Oh my gosh, he gives x power total to the group, or she gives massive x total healing to group.

Probably comes from you running in speed groups where I run in a 2 player PvE group with my wife. If I had spotter, I would only do 150, as I only have one player with me.
If I ran with 5 other players in PvE, then yea, I would probably be more likely to run spotter. I don’t run it in WvW, as I mainly play ranged support to the zerg.

Hope I am making myself clear how I am looking at it as 150, while you’re looking at it as 750.
I came back rudely about the ‘math skills’ because of your rude comment about me knowing nothing about a ranger, just because I don’t run your build.

Again, that particular build doesn’t work well for me and the way I enjoy playing.

Zaxares.5419:

Immersion is an important factor to me, but I don’t go into MMO’s expecting immersion. It’s just about impossible to achieve. If I want a RPG I can fully immerse myself in, I play a single player game. :P

Completely agree. Any of the Elder Scroll single player games come to mind for me.

Draknar.5748:

Menoob.1627:

“If 2v1s are bothering you, stay out of any competitive gaming.”

If only it was that easy. World completion requires you to part take in competitive play.

It requires you to go to an area that has competitive play. You don’t actually have to engage in competitive play. Saying otherwise is just a blatant lie. I’ve successfully mapped WvW without getting into any kind of fight. You just hop in, get everything you can that your side owns in your BL, check EB, if your side has Stonemist, sweet, go grab everything you can there, and everything in your corner.

Then you go back to playing the PvE game and check periodically to see if your color has changed. Then just do it again. Mapping WvW will always require multiple trips in to get the spawn points for each color, there’s no way around it. But you certainly don’t have to do any kind of PvP if you don’t want to.

I always suggest people do BL/EB mapping during peak hours, because odds are most players will be busy focusing on capping things rather than chasing down the random straggler trying to map. Plus, if you come up on an spot that you see a bunch of the enemies, run to a safe spot, say something in /map, wait 5min and odds are they will be gone. If enemy has capped a tower on your side, just leave and come back later, those things flip constantly.

Good point. There have been several times when the zerg battles have just gotten too crazy for me, and I just take a break and map WvW zones…..always kind of fun exploring those zones while having to constantly watch your back.

Might as well add in unlimited stacks, while you’re at it.

Zyst.3514:

Thing is, you’re talking about a specific ranger build. Theres other kinds of rangers that (ppl who say they suck) ppl are playing. Theres the bearbow sitting back with a longbow and never dodging. Theres the ppl who use axe and draw aggro from everything neutral in the zone but then cant handle fighting a group. Theres the signet rangers who just want to plink away at things w/ auto attack. Theres trap rangers who can’t always bring frost spirit. (but maybe they will if you ask them, and they do provide support to party in other ways)
Thing with spotter also, it has to compete with longer LB range, piercing arrows, that 2nd slot of marksman is a very busy one.
I can agree though, if you find a ranger who’s using spotter and frost spirit, or can switch, you’ve found a good member for your party. But you cant force everyone to play the class your way, which is what I fear this update might bring. (change your build to xxx now or we kick you!!!) It’s just not fun anymore, at that point.

At least there is one person here who realizes that other players play different builds that they find enjoyable, instead of someone’s idea of the perfect build being the only way to play that class.

Good post, Zyst.

Spiuk.8421:

Teon.5168:

Spiuk.8421:

Teon.5168:

Spiuk.8421:

Tarrek.7436:

Khal Drogo.9631:

Necro is the worst class in PVE right now.

No DPS, condi damage sucks

Also, I have to argue against this. I run with a lot of necros and they all seem to do as well as anyone else. Rangers on the other hand are actually refused in pve.

Rangers are one of the top classes in PvE because no one else can provide spotter and frost spirit, necro on the other hand offers absolutely nothing, everything a necro can do other classes can do significantly better.

Rangers have no reason to complain at all, if you think your ranger underperforms in PvE you are simply using it wrong, and that’s not a balance issue.

Obviously this is just your opinion, and not fact, as at least a few people here disagree with you. I would imagine that there are at least a few in game who also disagree with your opinion.

Sorry mate, math is not an opinion.

+750 extra precision
+7% party wide damage (up to a ridiculous +12% if stacking with non-traited FS)

Only a ranger can bring those two things, just like only a warrior can bring banners.

Sorry, I should have been clearer….I was disagreeing with the Necro comment mainly.

Although, where the heck are you coming up with the +750 extra precision a ranger supposedly gets? I fail to see what sort of math you’re using to come up with that number. I must be doing something incredibly stupid on my Ranger, like running naked, as I get nowhere near 750 more precision than any other character….lol….if I did, I would be one shotting just about everyone….lol……and then everyone would be running rangers in WvW….lol.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Spotter

Why would you comment on a class you know absolutely nothing about?

It seems like a terrible idea to me…

Zyst.3514:

Thing is, you’re talking about a specific ranger build.

The same applies to any other class, when some says Eles wreck everything they are reffering to zerker FGS/LH/Staff eles, not some guy running around in clerics gear being useless.

Rangers are perfectly balanced in PvE, if you don’t know how to properly play one (or just don’t want to) that’s fine, but you can’t blame the class for it.

Like I said, I might be doing something incredibly stupid on my Ranger.

Just in case you didn’t read your own post, you said +750 precision…..not +150. HUGE difference. When you’re bragging about your ‘math’ skills, it usually helps to type in the correct number, or something that is at least close to it.

And I do just fine in WvW, thank you, without spotter, on my ‘know nothing’ build. Also did just fine leveling in PvE on my Ranger. I found that I wanted more survivability since I was mainly playing pve with my wife…..as I usually ended up being the tank/agro. Spotter would have ended up not working as well as a more durable build, imo, especially for the way my wife and I play the game.

My sincere apologies for not playing the build that you seem to think is the ideal build. Once again, it’s only your opinion.

Have a wonderful day!

Esoteric.4395:

Banker golem only lasts 2 weeks, I want a sort of permanent solution lol…

My bad on not including the 2 week timer comment……but I still fail to see how going to your bank is such an incredible time waster. /shrug

Lord Kuru.3685:

Lots are saying leveling is just as easy as before. But that’s actually not the issue.

The issue is that leveling was horribly tedious and dull. And now it’s far worse than before.

If all you’re doing to level in an mmo is killing npcs and doing a dungeon run here and there, then yes…..it gets dull as hell….in ANY mmo. However, with all the different ways of getting experience in this game, and the socialization aspect from guildies, friends, and other people in mmos, I fail to see how it can be a complete bore.

Just my opinion, of course.

JustTrogdor.7892:

I love my L80 Mesmer. I can carry my own in open world PvE, I’m a valuable asset in most dungeons, and it is just plain fun to play.

Agreed. Mesmers are a ton of fun to play.

Spiuk.8421:

Teon.5168:

Spiuk.8421:

Tarrek.7436:

Khal Drogo.9631:

Necro is the worst class in PVE right now.

No DPS, condi damage sucks

Also, I have to argue against this. I run with a lot of necros and they all seem to do as well as anyone else. Rangers on the other hand are actually refused in pve.

Rangers are one of the top classes in PvE because no one else can provide spotter and frost spirit, necro on the other hand offers absolutely nothing, everything a necro can do other classes can do significantly better.

Rangers have no reason to complain at all, if you think your ranger underperforms in PvE you are simply using it wrong, and that’s not a balance issue.

Obviously this is just your opinion, and not fact, as at least a few people here disagree with you. I would imagine that there are at least a few in game who also disagree with your opinion.

Sorry mate, math is not an opinion.

+750 extra precision
+7% party wide damage (up to a ridiculous +12% if stacking with non-traited FS)

Only a ranger can bring those two things, just like only a warrior can bring banners.

Sorry, I should have been clearer….I was disagreeing with the Necro comment mainly.

Although, where the heck are you coming up with the +750 extra precision a ranger supposedly gets? I fail to see what sort of math you’re using to come up with that number. I must be doing something incredibly stupid on my Ranger, like running naked, as I get nowhere near 750 more precision than any other character….lol….if I did, I would be one shotting just about everyone….lol……and then everyone would be running rangers in WvW….lol.