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What is the best 1v1 duelist build for necro?

in Necromancer

Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

yeah no real point in trying to 1v1 with necro rn.

Necromancers have a high skill floor!

in Necromancer

Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

In regards to hitpoints gained, life force regeneration will always be more effective than regular healing.

Thats debatable. LF depletes naturally while in shroud, natural health pool doesn’t. Lets not forget that most the professions who have loads of built in healing dont even have to rely on statting in healing power since the base values of the heals are naturally high.

As the state of the game is right now I would disagree.

About necros..

in PvP

Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

Things is, you are in trouble on any class if you get focused by multiple enemies.

Well this is not true.

Thief / Mes can disengage via stealth and multiple evades
Guardian can be practically invincible for about 14 seconds unless unblockables are used.
War can be invincible for nearly as long but also has better disengage.
Engi has access to blocks and invuln.
Ranger was practically immortal last season but still has top tier sustain / invuln vs heavy focus-fire.
Surviving is what Ele’s do best now.
The only other profession that comes close is Revenant and thats with a class who has an invuln on a 12 recharge, 3 second block, and a heal that’s pretty much the best heal vs focus fire in the game.

Necromancers have nothing that completely nullifies excessive focus-fire. Paired with little access to stability; you have the perfect punching bag.

This is why Necromancers are the focused class. You can ask a newborn baby who to focus and their first words will be “the Necro”. Everyone knows this. Even I focus the necro first lol.

Devs only allowed to play power Necro

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

BTW GS 5 is bugged as hell. Doesn’t even show up half the time.

I’d suggest removing the targeting and replace it with a free cast ground target like wars gs3. As i usually do

Devs only allowed to play power Necro

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

They won’t actually say GS is bad. They can’t. It’s obvious to thousands of players but apparently either not to them or they just don’t want to admit it for some reason.

Devs happiest w/ necro when they can't 1v1

in PvP

Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

Seems like devs are really happy with the state of necromancers right now.

“They have lots of counterplay” (paraphrasing). Not, they’re strong in [blank] or they have been doing well in [blank]. They are pretty much saying they are happy that necromancers are getting their kitten beat frequently lol. It’s actually the only “positive” thing they said about necros and is apparently enough to keep them as is.

I just don’t think devs want necro’s to be a viable 1v1 class. They really push the spreading conditions and aoe theme as much as possible. Maybe this is why there is no official 1v1 mode. Some classes are just not designed for it.

Look at it like this:

Every class hase some inherent downsides which are made-up by strong mechanics.

Thieves have low health and very little access to stability but have but loads of stealth, evades (evades while attacking) dodges, shadowsteps, blinds, etc. This makes them a bit more balanced. Evades and dodges and shadowsteps and blinds all completely take care of their lack of health and stability.

Guardians don’t even have that huge of a health and don’t really have that much mobility. This is covered by their access to lots of stability, lots of heals, blocks, blinds, flash blinks, invulns and low-recharge condition clears. Its balanced.

I can continue with all the other classes and will do if somebody requests but lets cut right to necromancers.

Necromancers have zero access to invulns, blocks, stealth, evades, blinks (save ds 3 and i dont even want to talk about it), shadowsteps, or other fancy stuff like that. They also have very little access to high base-value healing effects. This is supposed to be okay because of….. shroud bar? Lets continue:
Necromancers have long cast times, low mobility, but we have plenty of stab.. wait. Nope we also have really bad access to stability… and no blocks or any of that other stuff. Woldn’t it make sense if we had faster cast times? Something to make up for the lack of all this stuff?

Apparently the ONLY thing that is supposed to make up for this is LIFEFORCE. You know, that thing that is only given to us on a handful of abilities. That thing that can be completely wiped out with half measure of focus fire by the enemy team. That thing that requires you to spec in FULLY; forcing your hand into making the most bland and cookie cutter build so you can at least survive long enough to do the ONE thing you’re meant to do; corrupt boons. Thats it. Then you die.

Even after building entirely around LF generation you’re still getting tossed around like a little ragdoll and will LOSE. EVERY. SINGLE. 1v1.

Which makes the devs happy with the state they’re in lol.

(edited by TheDevice.2751)

Make WvW Alive

in WvW

Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

No. We like simple games.

k

Make WvW Alive

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

Here is my (and others) list of suggestions to make WvW better and gooder

1. Guild Airships I would also include boats and land vehicles

2. Food / Sustenance. Make a new supply called food which can be gathered or implement the food already in the game. Create a mechanic that will make your character weaker while having not eaten after a period of time.

3. Weather. Make rain and fog and other harsh conditions really play a part in sieges and treading the world. Rain should slow you down and maybe cause weakness. Fog should hinder your range of sight.

4. Sleep and rest. Make it so your character needs a minute or two of rest to recoup. . A meter maybe that depletes over time. Weather conditions, food/sustenance and travel can play a part in the depletion of the meter.

Uh and other stuff!

[Suggestion] Guild Airship

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

This is an amazing Idea.

I think this could really add some depth to WvW and such.

I also think adding smaller land-based steam carts should be introduced for smaller sized groups who need a little extra firepower.

These heavy armored carts could carry maybe up to seven players and can be upgraded in various ways.

- Cannons
- Shielding
- Storage for transporting supplies in bulk
- Speed

Steam vehicles yes

Devs only allowed to play power Necro

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

well lets ruin my points even more by saying I myself went mostly GS necro last season to reach legendary. This still doesn’t make GS a better choice

BTW I got my dark harvest finally…

Attachments:

(edited by TheDevice.2751)

(suggestion) Make vanilla Elites.

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

Nobody has any thoughts at all?

(suggestion) Make vanilla Elites.

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

Step 1. Nerf all vanilla Minor Traits.
Step 2. Allow vanilla specializations to be “upgraded” into Elite specializations once placed into the third elite slot; gaining new minor traits to define the spec.

The slot where you can place your elite spec should upgrade any vanilla trait line into an elite specialization with new minor traits which are stronger and which define the elite.

- No need for new profession mechanics (i.e. all new shroud like Reaper shroud). All that is needed is a simple but defining tweak to the overall playstyle.

EXAMPLE: Placing Blood Magic in the necromancers third specialization line will upgrade it into the Vampire elite spec. The new minors cold look something like

Tier 1 Minor: Blood Shroud – You gain 33% of all incoming healing effects while in shroud. Does not apply to siphons.
Tier 2 Minor: Vampiric – Same as before but increases the effectiveness of all siphones by 20%
Tier 3 Minor: Unnatural Shift – Your dodge rolls are replaced with a shadowstep with slightly increased range. Gain 1 second of quickness after dodging.

Might seem strong but, hell, so do elite specs.

None of the Major traits will be effected. This keeps things a bit more simple while still providing a very hefty buff to vanilla specs.

Making the elite spec Minors exceptionally stronger than non-elite specs will help define the playstyles of the elite specs; making traits easier to balance overall. (by having one definitive leading specialization.)

EDIT:

Btw, yes, that would mean every class would have access to 5 vanilla elite specs. (albeit without as much stuff like new weapons and new class mechanics)

(edited by TheDevice.2751)

Agree that different classes are different?

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

Sure, it helps with build diversity in terms of giving more choice, but it dos not help with build diversity in terms of making more build viable. This is why instead of adding amulets just for classes that would not be OP with them, Anet should just add the amulets back in the game for everyone after altering skills and traits so it would not make certain classes too strong again.

Hope this makes sense.

No not really. It would be easier for Anet to just add amulets to certain classes that are okay with using them.

“Sure, it helps with build diversity in terms of giving more choice, but it dos not help with build diversity in terms of making more build viable”

You absolutely don’t know that for sure. Celestial amulet could be a really strong alternative for necromancers right now and was being used competitively.

This only helps.

Agree that different classes are different?

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

I do not believe that certain amulets are OP on certain classes and not on others…

Well. If you disregard facts then sure.

I am not disregarding facts. There is no amulet in the game right now that is OP on any class. Strong, yes, but not OP. Balance is fairly good right now and the thing that makes certain classes slightly stronger than others is certainly not amulet choice.

Additionally, removing amulets for certain classes is basically the same as removing them from the game- if Menders was removed from Druid and ele, other classes would not start using that amulet. It would just become an unused amulet (other than occasionally for engi) which is no better than removing it from the game in my opinion.

WHY IS ANYONE REMOVING AMULETS?

IM only talking about bringing some amulets back but only for certain classes. How is this so hard to explain id;lkjsdlkjg;lkjg

I admit that I did not read the post when you said you were talking about adding amulets, and I apologise for that. However, I still do not believe it is a good idea. For example if merc amulet was added but only for classes that were not too strong with it previously, it would just be an unused amulet because the classes it would be added for will already have better amulet choices. Of course it would open up more options for people to run different builds, but they would all be useless builds compared to the meta so it doesn’t really matter.

Adding amulets that have already been removed is good as long as classes are balanced to not be too strong with these amulets, but it must be for every class. I can just never get on board with the idea with certain amulets for certain classes becaus they will either make the class too strong again or just never be used.

Now i have to apologize because this actually doesn’t make sense. It really doesn’t. Anyone reading this would know this isn’t true. It just isn’kittens obviously not true. The logic isn’t there. Like what you’re actually saying is that since celestial amulet was too strong on an engineer or ele, that it was too strong on a necromancer. This is blatantly untrue.

You’re saying either some amulets are either going to be too strong or useless and I don’t know how or where you got this assessment. I really don’t know it just makes zero sense at all. You must know in your heart of hearts that this doesn’t make sense.

Even in the sense that they might not get used… Its still promoting build diversity. Its still opening up the possibilities.

Just a second ago you were complaining about build diversity now you’re an advocate for less build diversity. You are against build diversity now?

Agree that different classes are different?

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

I do not believe that certain amulets are OP on certain classes and not on others…

Well. If you disregard facts then sure.

I am not disregarding facts. There is no amulet in the game right now that is OP on any class. Strong, yes, but not OP. Balance is fairly good right now and the thing that makes certain classes slightly stronger than others is certainly not amulet choice.

Additionally, removing amulets for certain classes is basically the same as removing them from the game- if Menders was removed from Druid and ele, other classes would not start using that amulet. It would just become an unused amulet (other than occasionally for engi) which is no better than removing it from the game in my opinion.

WHY IS ANYONE REMOVING AMULETS?

IM only talking about bringing some amulets back but only for certain classes. How is this so hard to explain id;lkjsdlkjg;lkjg

Agree that different classes are different?

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

Look at it this way: My idea is only opening up more diversity. Thats the only thing its doing.

1. no amulets that are allowed right now would be removed. So at the VERY LEAST, diversity wouldn’t be worse.
2. MORE AMULETS Would be brought back but only for certain classes that are deemed safe to use.

Its being a realist. Its acknowledging that DIFFERENT CLASSES ARE DIFFERENT and some classes would be completely okay with using an amulet that another class would be too strong with. This is called reality.

This is why in League of Legends, some items are only usable on melee champs while some are only usable on ranged champs.

Agree that different classes are different?

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

I do not believe that certain amulets are OP on certain classes and not on others…

Well. If you disregard facts then sure.

Agree that different classes are different?

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

So because classes are different, you want to harm build diversity?

how is allowing some classes to use certain amulets whole other classes cannot automatically considered limiting?

it might open up plenty of amulets for classes who could really use them for other builds.

its like this:

Arenenet wont allow celestial amulet because of classes like engineer and elementalist.

What i’m saying is how about allow some classes use them; the alternative what we have now. Zero diversity.

Nothing you say will validate your argument. The only way your argument would apply is if all amulets including ones already removed from spvp were brought back: ITS NOT GOING TO HAPPEN . And its not goign to happen because some classes are extremely broken with certain amulets. How is this so hard to explain?

YOU ARE LIMITING OVERALL BUILD DIVERSITY by not ALLOWING some amulets to be used because they’ve been proven too strong on a minority of classes. Why should this hurt the majority?

What you’re saing is “oh his class can use X amulet but mine can’t thats not fair” And im saying “different classes are different.”

Anyone who disagrees with this suggestion just doesn’t actually believe diffrent classes should be different or are just being insincere because they enjoy having overpwered specs.

(edited by TheDevice.2751)

Agree that different classes are different?

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

So in the end. You still haven’t come up with a reason to state why we should restrict amulets on some classes.

Hint: its in the name of the thread.

Agree that different classes are different?

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

Why do many a DH build use marauders?

The removal of any amulet would hurt the game.

Less build diversity = less creativity = everyone is a clone of each other (as far as builds) = less fun. Compare pre-June 2015 to post June 2015.

Before there were a lot more options and traits. After that there were a whole lot less options because the amount of traits afterwards were limited.

One time I saw a guy playing Mercenary ele condi. It was fun to watch because I wasn’t sure what to expect and I respected him for beating a player with an off meta build.

tl;dr

Removing amulets is bad for the long term health of the game

OK then bring back celestial, bring back soldiers, all these amulets that work perfectly fine on necromancers.

None of your arguments actually make any sense btw.

So in the end. After all of your arguments you don’t agree that different classes are different.

Agree that different classes are different?

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

No. We cannot remove amulets from the game with out creating a negative effect. Imagine if marauder wasn’t there. Then DH would have to run something like berserkers or barbarian. With the low hp pool berserker wouldn’t be viable except in yolo hotjoin and barbarian could never kill anything except thief or a mesmer clone.

In addition, people like having more options, not less, which is why build diversity is such a big deal

Who said anything about removal of all amulets?

Who said anything about removing marauders from DH?

Agree that different classes are different?

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

BTW this is probably the easiest more logical way to deal with class balance. Just so you know.

Agree that different classes are different?

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

Limiting an amulet for only a few classes is a good way to kitten people off. I think it’s a bad idea, it further limits build diversity and it’s a poor solution to address class balances.

Actually why would this kitten people off? Tell me.

SO, you’re saying if one class can use something another class can’t use, then its not fair right?

OH good. That means i can start requesting Anet give Necromancers stealth, blocks, invuln, ambient cc’s/dazes, etc. Should be fair right?

Or… are different classes different? Can’t have it both ways.

Agree that different classes are different?

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

Limiting an amulet for only a few classes is a good way to kitten people off. I think it’s a bad idea, it further limits builf diversity and it’s a poor solution to address class balances.

No it doesn’t limit diversity at all. ANet already restricts Amulets from certain classes only they do it across the board indiscriminately. This is not called balance

Also, I didnt know we were balancing based on peoples feelings. “kittening people off”?. Yeah, no wonder this game never made it.

Petition to auto-target Necromancers

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

Match should start with Ctrl+t already on the Necro.

Even better if the necro start the match dead.

THIS x10

Petition to auto-target Necromancers

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

Match should start with Ctrl+t already on the Necro.

This.

Petition to auto-target Necromancers

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

your target should always default to targeting the nearest enemy necromancer.

Agree that different classes are different?

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

Then you would have to agree that some amulets should be allowed on some classes while not allowed on other classes.

Some amulets are perfectly fine on the majority of classes while being too strong on other classes. Why?

Because different classes are different.

Why do many a DH build use marauders? Because it is perfect for their class. They don’t need a lot of defensive stats because their kit is overloaded with defenses like blocks, invulns, 1k heals on ability use etc.

Other classes need defensive stats… I know that might sound surprising.

Also, I read that anet was considering making fixed builds or something? IDK if thats true (it would certainly be the final nail in the spvp coffin) but why not first try to make amulets restrictive based on profession instead of shooting right to the extreme?

Devs only allowed to play power Necro

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

Devs should only be allowed to play power necromancer in spvp until the next update. And they should stream

How to Beat a Thief

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

you don’t

/15characters

Mad King’s Labyrinth update

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

I really wanted to not say anything but i just cant help it.

Why cant you just be honest and say “power growth of the game” instead of “power growth of the playerbase” as if we have some control over the damage abilities do. The game has obviously had a power growth across the board. Its not even a big deal to just admit it. I just don’t even see the necessity to be less truthful in this scenario even.

What does “power growth of the playerbase” even mean? Maybe If i knew what that meant this wouldn’t bother me so much lol. I dont even know why im bothered by this its like when my nephew lies even when there is the smallest degree of chance it might look poorly on him if the truth were to be told.

Why couldn’t you just say the fact?

(edited by TheDevice.2751)

Off-meta sPvP Build Collection

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

Another Update

I didn’t want to really update until a new balance patch but meh. IDK When that will be.

Balance Patch?

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

If they haven’t said it yet it probably means they dont even know exactly when.

New to Necro

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

Turn back while you still can

Good Season, Now dont F up.

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

TBF the op is actually right. This season sucked for only two professions: Necromancer and Elementalist.

If there were to be a Tier list it would look something like

Rev
Ranger
Gaurd
Mes
Engi
War
Thief

There would be some A > B > C but C > A scenarios (rps) but essentially they are all really strong right now.

Ele’s and Necro’s are in the dumps. Completely outclassed.

(edited by TheDevice.2751)

Anyone else find it funny...

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

how since Deathly Chill was op before… they just nerfed it into uselessness? XD

I mean really. How is this even a grandmaster trait?

The noob class of sPvP?

in PvP

Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

This guy is still going at it :‘D
I thought there’d be a restriction on how many times a person can write the exact same blabbering on the the forums. But if there was, I am sure Device would have hit it a long time ago.

Maybe you misunderstand what I’m saying. I play necromancer btw. This isn’t some attack on people who play necromancers.

I don’t care that the class has a lower skill floor and lower skill ceiling than some others (say revenant, engi, mesmer, etc). I play the class myself and don’t really care too much for playing the “high-skill cap” professions. I’m actually not very good at using a class with an over-aboundance of flashy mechanics or at least I’m not as comfortable on them.

Necromancer has some range and my comfort zone is probably around using more risky / unorthadox builds. I haven’t really found much pleasure in splashing conditions as much as I used to.

The point of this thread is that there are indeed professions that are easier to play. Furthermore, some specs are surely easier to operate than others. I’m going to out on a limb and bet that the devs would agree.

The noob class of sPvP?

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

You had me until you said necros don’t need to worry about positioning

well the idea is that every player has to worry about positioning. Anyone would agree that necros have a lot of built-in toughness and durability and not a lot of mobility. Thats because they’re meant to be hit and not avoid as much damage as everyone else.

The Necromancer and why it sucks

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

“1. They need to hit things to succeed.”
Which class doesn’t?
This isn’t a necro specific trait, but rather one that is inherent across all classes, and a fundamental principle behind the game in general. In order to defeat an opponent you need to hit them.

“2. Necros are designed to be hit.”
Yes necros can take some punishment, and be able to use that to their advantage. How is this a bad thing? It’s a integral part of the class mechanic. In fact, with certain traits, the more damage you take, the more powerful you become.

“3. Blocks > Blinds”
I disagree. While blocks can be useful, blinds also serves their purpose. A well timed blind can render a powerful attack useless and without the cost of forgoing an attack skill. For Necro, I would much rather use blind to negate an attack than block one.

“4. It’s the SLOW class”
It is slow. But the longer the Necro is in the fight, the more powerful they become. But it takes time and skill to survive that long. That slowness makes for great defense, as they can take the punishment, while ramping up their power.

“5. Not an attrition class.”
It can be. It depends on what specs you are playing. A defensive condi necro is most certainly an attrition spec. A bursty power spec is not. It largely depends on what you play, and how you play it.

“6. Lifeforce / Shroud is the worst and laziest designed class mechanic.”
A mechanic that takes time to be able to use, and is quickly depleted. Sure it adds a bit of survivablity, but it also comes at a cost. I think it’s actually well done.

Overall, if you know what you are doing, and not playing a cookie cutter meta with little to no understanding of how it works, or how to play it, you’re going to be a force to be reckoned with. I have tried the meta builds, and they seemed lacking. In the end I made my own build and tend to do quite well. I can hold a point for a decent amount of time. Even when being focused, as well as control the flow of battle to a surprising degree. It just takes a bit of know how and watching what the enemy is doing.

I feel like every response was in response to the title of each section without even reading the points made in the section.

1. They need things to hit….. yeah you didn’t read what I wrote at all. Sure.. essentially, every class has to hit the enemy to defeat them. Thats not the point I was making. If you didn’t understand what I wrote or didn’t read it, I would suggest reading exactly what I wrote and then making a counter argument. The actual playstyle of the necromancer is based upon hitting; even as a defense. Look at all the shouts given to classes. War, gaurd, ranger, ele, necromancer. The only class that requires you to hit large numbers of enemies to maximize effectiveness of the shout is necromancers. Name one skill outside of CC that doesn’t require you to hit an enemy to cleanse conditions. Name one skill other than our healing skills that give us life without needing to hit anyone. Blinds require an enemy being hit by your blinds for you get get any use out of those blinds.

And i’m fine with this playstyle, it just needs improvements.

2. Necro’s need to be hit… “how is this a bad thing?” Again, you didn’t read what I wrote. I told you why it was a bad thing. It’s a bad thing because we don’t have enough stability. We also don’t have as much retaliation as gaurds do.

3. You are very welcome to disagree. As for me, you have not given me adequate reasons as to why blocks are not better than blinds so my opinion on that hasn’t changed.

4. Its the slow class and thats not a good thing. It just isn’t. When have you seen a necro be unstoppable in pro play even? The die in seconds. All they’re meant to do is spread conditions and die. Thats it.

5. Not when every other class in the game can be attrition. Devs try to specifically make us attrition while at the same time offering all other classes attrition specs that out-attrition our own. The only difference is they don’t die in the first 5 seconds of a fight from getting 5-man focus fire.

- Btw; requiring a guard or ranger to babysit you and continue to res you doesn’t count as attrition.

6. If your simple explanation was the entirety of the mechanic then who could disagree? Surely no-one.

(edited by TheDevice.2751)

The noob class of sPvP?

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

I think necromancer is one of the classes atm that requires the most skill to be effective at higher level PvP. You have to solve situations without good defensive skills/mobility skills and are very vulnerable to burst damage and cc. No good health regen. While also having long cast heal + long cast elite stability. Most of other meta classes can just run in zerg like headless chickens without thinking and run away if kitten happens regen fast then come back, so they are all the noob classes in reality.

to OP you got legendary as gs necro. That means nothing. League farming, duo q, premades. Doesn’t really matter what spec you use as necro in that league. If your teammates better than enemy you win with both if they are worse and they die in seconds than you lose with both.

You made this post because your gs necro got killed by condi necro?

I’d like to see you go from amber to legendary on GS necro. I’d actually love to see that.

And, no, it doesn’t matter what class, what spec, or who beat what. The truth is that the way necromancers are designed (the examples I’ve given) shows to me that the class is made as a low risk / low reward class. Its easier and safer to use. The devs designed the profession this way lol.

The noob class of sPvP?

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

Funny that you complain all the time about Necromancers being weak and that Anet doesn’t play it, but then you also call it the “noob class.” If it’s so weak, then it obviously would require more skill to play against more powerful classes.

Oh I see. He’s trolling. He’s saying something nonsensical to start an argument.

Oh not at all. I absolutely believe that necro’s are the noob class for the most part. Especially condi’s and mm. The builds do most the work for you.

And I’ve never once said conditionmancers are weak. Not once. Actually, I urge you to find the comment in which i said conditionmancers are weak. I absolutely think there are problems with necromancer.

The fact is; the only viable playstyles for necromancer cater to low risk / low reward playstyles. Its a droning experience which I’ve pretty much washed my hands of.

Several other classes offer higher skill cap viable builds; not the necromancer. Not at all.

Everything I’m saying, i mean it 100%.

The noob class of sPvP?

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

The lack of mobility means necros have to rely more on positioning, map knowledge, and situational awareness, which are separate skills that many players aren’t even aware of. It also requires better jumping-puzzle and juke skills to kite; many of the trick-jumps are things “newbies” don’t know about and average players can’t execute under pressure.

Lifeforce and base stat scaling is to offset any need for positioning. This is designed this way. Necros have great health scaling and bonuses to armor through traits in several trait lines specifically to offset the requirement of making any sudden reaction to incoming attacks. Necromancers are supposed to face-tank. That is an actual design that can’t be argued.

The low amount of defensive skills means that necros can’t afford to waste dodges on non-critical skills. Whereas some other classes can afford to waste dodges/blocks/etc. on autoattacks.

When it comes to offense, the difference between a good necro and a bad necro is huge. Necro is one of the few classes who run unblockable CC in this meta, which is something that needs to be timed right to get good effect (e.g. interrupting mesmer Shield4, or knocking rev out of Shield5/Staff3). Same deal with corrupting stab into fear.

The idea that looking at a boon pop up and placing a very easy unblockable corrupt on them isn’t what i’d call pro level play. Thats necro 101.

It’s easy to denigrate any class as being a “newb class” by ignoring (or perhaps being unaware of) all the nuances that go into playing it at a high level.

I’m aware of these necromancer “nuances” and I don’t believe they are as high as skill cap as you praise them to be. It takes much more skill to play a revenant than a conditionmancer. The nuances of a revenant afford a skilled player who applies them much more reward and are more difficult.

These necro “nuances” are easily explained. They are essentially no more than what you’ve just explained yourself. There is no need for higher mastery of understanding the way conditions work or when to apply them. More skirmisher-type playstyles with high risk-high reward methods will always require more skill (or should). Necro is the exact definition of whatever is opposite of high risk/high reward.

(edited by TheDevice.2751)

The noob class of sPvP?

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

You didn’t really explain why they are “the noob class”. Can you elaborate?

Absolutely im so glad you asked.

Condition Necromancers (well all necromancers) must rely on allies to function.
Condi necros only splash ambient conditions and try to cleanse conditions. Thats all they do.
Condition necromancers have nearly zero mobility which means even though everyone should worry about positioning, necromancers have to rely purely on their defensive stats. No active defenses like predicting shots to evade/block or out-thinking the enemy. They just plash conditions. Thats it.

condition necros always run staff. Staff is the simplest two-handed weapon in the game if not the simplest.

Condition necromancers damage is all ranged and passive. Again, there is no concern for positioning. You’re pretty much a snail farting constantly. If snail’s fart.

The noob class of sPvP?

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

Has to be condition necromancers. (actually its the only necromancer in spvp save maybe the mm which is the second most noob class in spvp)

Look at necro staff lol they’re all marks XD I mean just in case anything else was too difficult to use. I laugh every time.
Slow, relies on teammates to function.

Honestly I got to legendary as gs necro; and i gotta say. Would have been a million times easier as condi necro.

anet has made the noob class of spvp he necromancer.

Anyone else have an opinion on this?

Edit: just so you know. I can go all day explaining why condition necro is made for “noob” players. If you’d like, I can list them. Just let me know.

Honestly this feels like more of an elephant in the room more than anything else. Everyone already knows the necro is the noob class just nobody wants to either admit it or have the heart to just say it.

(edited by TheDevice.2751)

My super emotionless list of suggestions

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

General suggestions / reasons

Add more stability and damage mitigation to the necromancer.

Necromancers are made to take damage. As it is a fundamental playstyle of the necromancer; they should not be penalized for it.
If the absence of damage-avoiding mechanics (blocks, immobilizes, evades, stealth) are to offset the greater armor/health stat scaling then there is no reasonable offset to the lack of stability. The lack of damage evasion makes necromancers the most compatible with the stability mechanic.

Protection is also another strong avenue for damage mitigation. If active defenses such as blocks, invulns, steaths, and evades are not allowed as part of the necromacners kit for reasons stated, then the protection boon is the easiest method to integrate into the necromancers traits/skills.

Trait Suggestions / Ideas

Spite
Siphoned Power: Now adds 3 seconds of Weakness on struck enemy.
Spiteful Renewal: ICD reduced to 3 seconds from 5.
Spiteful Spirit: Now also makes Unholy Feast unblockable (affects Axe skill as well)
Spiteful Talisman: Instead of 5% bonus damage to enemies with no boons -> Add 3 seconds of retaliation when protection is applied to you (see Reapers Touch change below) / when regeneration is applied to you (if no RT change)

Blood Magic
Vampiric: Now triggers when enemies are damaged by retaliation. Minion siphoning is moved to Vampiric Presence.

Curses
Chilling Darkness: Now Crippling Darkness – Blinding a foe cripples them for 2 seconds. ICD Removed.

Add stability to spectral armor.

Reapers Touch (focus 4): Adds protection to allies instead of regeneration.

Spectral Grasp Overhaul
- Make the hand larger / more visible.
- Initial activation will immobilize enemy on hit and will continue to immobilize for 1 second every second until hand is destroyed (like Binding Roots). Reactivate while holding on enemy to pull them towards you and chill them (ends destructible hand / immobilize effect).

Add a base amount of damage to all wells, say, 200 damage per pulse.


I’ll actually add more later.

The Necromancer and why it sucks

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

Everything wrong with necromancers

1. They need to hit things to succeed.

In many situations; you can have the least available condition cleanse in a fight. It’s true.
Unlike every other class in the game, you rely on hitting enemies to cleanse your conditions. If enemies step out of range of your skill, block your skill, evade your skill, or are currently invulnerable to your attack or conditions or you are blinded or some freaky targeting glitches your cast, or your attack becomes hindered, or several other things; you will not cleanse any conditions. This is why Consume Conditions has become such a staple on necros and also why Staff 4 has been one of two reasons the weapon is ever used (the other being Staff5).

Shouts are also a very telling example of how we are constantly penalized for our class theme. All shouts are only effective in larger fights while warrior shouts are always effective no matter the enemy/ally count effected just like guardian shouts are always effective no matter the ally count effected. Necromancers are the only ones who are penalized for using them against a low number of targets.

2. Necros are designed to be hit.

We are second to the least stability in the game. We are also the class that is supposed to be hit. We are essentially penalized for a playstyle fundamental to the profession. Get rekt necros.

Blocks, Invuln, Evades etc are always going to be better than pure health/armor. Throw in lack of mobility and you have a class that can’t even move half the time. while being pummeled to death. Why? Cuz lifeforce and shroud. I’ll get to that later.

Less retaliation than guards. Guards also have the most blocks which is non-compatible with retaliation. It doesn’t even make sense.

We have only 3 skills that deal with being hit. Spectral walk. Spectral armor. Signet of Vampirism. Three.

3. Blocks > Blinds

You need to hit enemies with blinds for them to work. Blocks work automatically.
Blinds are never successive. They always happen in 1 second intervals at the most. Bocks can be successive; preventing X number of attacks for X duration. Blinds can never do this the way they are now. GG blinds.
If anyone says “yeah we have blocks but you guys have blinds”; promptly facepalm and link this thread to them.

4. It’s the SLOW class

Everything about this is bad. Not a slow build. Not a slow spec. The entire profession is slow. This deserves a slow clap

Slow animations / telegraphed abilities along side nearly zero stability is just Anet telling everyone to focus and demolish the necromancer first. They are the easiest ones to kill and will probably not even get a single skill off if focused hard enough.

Slow projectiles make dodging a piece of cake for enemies. In fact, necromancer attacks take so long that the mathematical chances they are interrupted are so high it renders necromancers activating the least amount of skills in the game. Enemies will activate their skills up to four times as much as you will in any given game.

5. Not an attrition class.

Whatever anyone has ever said about the necromancer, it is not an attrition class. It is held back by devs constantly trying to fit them into this design while simultaneously making other classes/builds more effective in long-lasting fights. I’ve personally played guardian enough to know that this is a fact. Every other class has the ability to last in long fights; and last longer than any necromancer can. This is a fact.

All other classes have manageable ways to allow their other skills to come off cooldown in time for another volley of unavoidable damage.

6. Lifeforce / Shroud is the worst and laziest designed class mechanic.

Not only is it restrictive to our utilities and healing; lifeforce/shroud bar is the entire reason we are left without a million other things. No bocks, invulns, stability, evades, dodge support, stealth, or any real damage mitigation. This one mechanic has its own list of bad things:

- Can be moa’d to nothingness. No other class mechanic in the entire game is so vulnerable to moa.
- Shroud bar is not an equivalent to blocks or invuln. Shroud doesn’t scale as well as invulns or consecutive blocks vs high number of attackers. it will always be weaker.
- Is worse than healing. Look at a ranger and how well they are able to continually heal themselves with no class mechanic required. they are also allowed to use invulnerability and blocks and evades even though, essentially, gaining lifeforce is the same as a ranger constantly gaining health.
- Locks us out of our own utilities. What more can you say?
- Attacks are too slow.
- Life force depletion rate. As stated, rangers heal life just as much if not more than necros gain lifeforce. Thing is; rangers health does not constantly deplete like it does for necromancers shroud. So even after building up all that lifeforce, its just going to be taken away from you passively.

(edited by TheDevice.2751)

New Dark Magic Class instead of Necro?

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

You don’t even know if “metas” are cyclic. You’re just saying stuff just to say it like some professional game analyst which you are not.

Uh have you actually played this game? We’ve had a different meta for every season, and that not even counting the preseason1 where we had a meta a week.

No it’s not “cyclic” in the sense of A>B>C>D>A>B>C>D but to believe that Necros are somehow locked out of ever being meta again is stupid and flies in the face what the metas have done in the past.

I enjoy playing necro, and I don’t wan the class turned into a guardian wannabe just to suit a temporary meta.

Have you ever played this game before? Nobody said necros are locked out of every meta; thats a strawman. We get meta’s through change. If you’re expecting to see soldiers amulet again then by all means, pretend there is some upcoming necro-specific meta. The only way we’d become just as viable as other classes is by changing amulets or changing classes.

You’re actually proving there is a problem with the profession by stating that its only viability is tied to a single meta. An entire profession. The whole thing. Why not just make the necromancer better? In fact, many people applaud this seasons meta since so many other classes have several viable builds. Why not just change the necromancer to suit this meta more so there would be less need for wonky imbalance changes? Nobody likes the bunker meta anyways. Why tie an entire class to one freaking meta?

You also still have not commented on power necro viability.

New Dark Magic Class instead of Necro?

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

There is nothing wrong with necromancers. We simply don’t do well in spike metas, which is what this meta is.
We do extremely well in bruiser and bunker metas, which is why we did so well in season 1 and 2.

The meta will change as it always does and we will be fine again.

You just said necromancers are not fine and that they are fine in one post. That’s pretty messed up.

You don’t even know if “metas” are cyclic. You’re just saying stuff just to say it like some professional game analyst which you are not.

You also completely ignore the state of power necro as if the class is meant to be linear.

So, overall, no; necromancers are not fine.

I don't think devs play Necromancers

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

This isn’t exactly some salt thread or just some venting, I honestly don’t believe that the devs who work on the necromancer profession, play the profession.

I actually think this would help very much to give them a first hand look into the daily frustrations of many necromancers.

Try playing ranked pvp and try getting to legendary solely on necromancer.

You’ll understand the frustration of getting singled out every game and not having adequate defenses to actually play the game in front of you lol. Try it. give it a go :P

A while ago some dev posted the stats of an anet employee who plays necromancer… Now i never did think of it at the time; but I have no clue which department that guy even worked in lol. He could very well be a janitor or like work in marketing or something. Who knows. The point is that I don’t believe anyone with any actual influence on the profession plays the profession.

Power Build SPvP, Antimeta Build?

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Posted by: TheDevice.2751

TheDevice.2751

You want power antimeta?

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(edited by TheDevice.2751)