Guild Wars 2

At least his Ranger segment was longer than the Necromancer’s. Necro was in-n-out like a burger.

This was discussed when the stream previews were announced that none of them ran a Ranger or Necromancer as their main – so no surprise if some of them appear as though they know nothing on certain classes.

To be fair on the part of DPS, he at least showed some of the Ranger changes, including Beastly Warden + Wolf [F2]. Also, I caught that SotP has a shorter CD, but I did not catch if the duration was adjusted to match that.

Edited for grammar.

I would prefer Empathic Bond to stay in Wilderness Survival and be improved. Lowering the internal cooldown does not address its passive and weak nature. If Empathic Bond were to be given the ability to transfer up to 3 conditions from the pet onto a single-target with [F2] commands, it would add some active play to the trait and provide a way to relieve some conditions from the pet, along with the reward of using those conditions offensively.

I agree with option #2 and everything that was stated.

I’m wondering if the AI improvements will be applied to our Pets/Minions. If anyone watched the “Building a Better Centaur AI at Massive Scale” presentation at GDC, I’m hoping that some of those behaviors apply, such as attacking so the damage is more evenly spread out amongst targets (Drake cleaves and other AOEs).

Even shifting positions away from allies when engaging an enemy to reduce splash damage or recognizing high density damage zones and moving out of them. Also, one point Sebrent mentioned that I hope Anet touches on is taking a look at pets and tweaking their numbers.

It would be a great QoL improvement and boost to have diversifying stats among each pet and species. Examples would be the Fern Hound to be the only canine with a base Healing Power stat and Spiders with a base Condition Damage stat. Something that further emphasizes their utility and strengths and can be further augmented by traits that boost a certain stat.

I like this idea, though I would rather see Spiteful Spirit and Weakening Shroud be tied to a Shroud skill so the effects can be used more on-demand. Possibly Weakening Shroud at the end of Shroud 2 and Spiteful Spirit with Shroud 3?

Anyway, good idea all around.

The Wizland.8435:

Sounds legit, but I’d rather not have to risk it in the first place than get an extra 740 heal (yaaaay). I think I just wanna keep the current CC or turn it into a spectral skill.

+1 to this.

If the targets have only 1 stack of Stability, using Beastly Warden and Wolf’s [F2] will at least proc one of the effects. Something to consider having an AOE that can knock off 2 stacks of Stability from 5 targets.

Not sure about a Hawk/Jaguar setup on bosses. Even with might and companion’s might “bleed on crit” proc, it seems better to sub in a Lynx running double cats instead. At least with Rending Pounce it can used smartly to have it leap through a useful field like Ice or Water and there’s no DPS loss due to Quickening Screech.

Starlightpaw.5871:

I’ve seen veterans be called “entitled,” “spoiled,” “toxic,” “scum,” and “salty” so far. I should make a bingo chart.

Gotcha covered. Now, everyone can play along!

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Crippling Strike is only 1 target

It hits 3 targets =/

No, I do not think Ranger needs an overhaul. Some more QoL and a few trait adjustments here and there would be nice, but Rangers are in a good spot. Maybe not the best spot in every mode, but the class holds its own.

I think if any class deserves the “God Mode Overhaul” treatment now is Necros. For all of the complaints, we look like golden gooses compared to what treatment they got.

Tragic Positive.9356:

This is definitely true. But makes me think… It sacrifices a lot of DPS. Maybe if we ran the numbers we might see that ranger by maintaining the rotation would apply lots of Weakness and Blindness – while thieves have to hinder their DPS in order to do so without the weakness.

The DPS sacrifice is worth it because the blind uptime is 100% vs 1 blind every 5 seconds and weakness, which is a gamble in itself and party members are getting hit. Blinds are also for trash anyways and w/e composition is there can DPS to their fullest without worrying about being damage.

Even if Thief is sacrificing some DPS to blind a mob, their Stealth and after the update, their 1v1 damage on bosses with D/D is worth taking over a Ranger. Go for the Eyes is a nice trait, but let’s not pull the card Necros tried to at launch saying they can compete with the blinds a Thief can.

We got an AOE blind, and as Elorna mentioned, we’re bringing Cats and Drakes to the PVE group. Using a Bird and dropping Companion’s Might for Go for the Eyes will be, at best, for bad PUGs.

Edit: Last chain of Sword auto for Thieves applies Weakness. The duration may not be as high as the weakness from Protective Ward + Wilting Strike, but they don’t need to spec into a traitline nor take a major trait to apply it either. Crippling Strike

Klonko.8341:

But you dont want to because it cancel the dmg too…

Yes, the dmg…

Sol.4310:

This might be useful in PvE, but having long cast time and locking you in place will get you killed in PvP.

You can move to break the animation…

No! Flame shields come only with a charr plushie, hugs, and a cup of coffee!

It’s hard for them to talk when they are spending so much time and energy holding up the flame shield.

Actually, it would be 6secs, followed by another 6secs for complete uptime. Would have to hold the pet back until the player’s application ran out or vice-versa.

Refined Toxins could be better if the health threshold % was lowered or removed.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Imagine a spider with Refined Toxins too, since they are ranged and hardly get hit, they will proc it constantly, so 60% uptime of poison right there, without factoring in their poison skills.

Kui mentioned for Rangers to, “check back in later” on Refined Toxins, as he said it will probably change so the proc depends only on the player’s health rather than being split.

People are choosing to voice their opinions and concerns, and that’s fine. I agree that no one should impose on the other to do so. I can also see the other side and as to why those people want to see complaints reduced (or at least the amount of threads).

Like it or hate it, vote with your wallet, and move on.

Now you got me thinking. Did Anet intend “Most Dangerous Game” to be taken as a dangerous game we are playing by staying below 50% health, or being a dangerous “game” like an animal being hunted?

Natfrog.4310:

I love the bark skin that sound crazy good but I see it being useless in PvP and WvW. Other than that our pets already have 300 stats with the current system so that was kinda already there. Pack Alpha I think is new? Sharpened edges is kinda weak as well as my pets unless ranged didn’t hit hardly anything even with the 30% IMS. Also did they get any armor or health buffs beyond that? If not they still going to melt when one AoE burst in WvW hits them. 50 plus casting on a single point and pet will always die so they are useless even with 50% reduction.

No improvement to toughness or vitality as far as I know. They could be tweaking stats behind the scenes or even in the future if they feel pets need an adjustment for the unknown “challenging PVE content” in store.

Only brought up the +150 stat points since it’s baseline. Yeah, the 300 points were already there, but it’s a nice bonus for Rangers that don’t take Beastmastery. My take on it at least. Pack Alpha is new, yes. It was basically Peak Strength moved and converted to affect the Pet instead. It’s also a nice bonus since Pack Alpha is a minor trait.

As for Bark Skin’s uses, there was some discussion on it for another thread. I still believe it was Anet’s solution for Rangers that wanted a -50% damage from AOE damage to pets in World vs World zergs. Took me awhile when pondering on it, seems like a fair enough compromise (if that was the intention).

As for being useful for PvP and WvW, any build that goes into Wilderness Survival for either EB or WK condition cleanse will benefit from it as it’s a minor trait. So, another nice bonus just for investing into a traitline.

Wouldn’t it be better to PM CalmonHuang since he’s the dev for Ranger (and Engie)?

You are correct. Coincidentally, these tests were done with a Marsh Drake, Alpine Wolf (chose for cosmetic reasons), and a Raven. The KD and Tail Swipes (when available) were immediately casted once the pet appeared.

I’ve been tinkering around with Zephyr’s Speed lately in prep for the updates. It took me awhile to “roll” [F4] > [F1] while making sure I’m light on my feet (intended) during combat.

[F2] is also an option after the swap. Same thing applies. As long as it is pressed immediately after [F4], there is no delay on the cast or spazzing.

I’m tossing in again, “+50% critical hit chance when underneath 50% health.” Makes a Ranger extremely dangerous, options to drop precision for toughness for gear, and creates a “Kill me or be killed by me” situation that can change the pace and dynamics of a fight.

I want to say someone asked once during a livestream and they basically beat around the bush and then ignored it. Cosmetic options would be cool, though, be careful for what you wish for. I can see Anet making cosmetic options into Gem Store cash grabs.

Pink Ribbon for your pet? 350 Gems. Brown-colored Saddle for your pet? Rare RNG drop from BL Chests. I shudder to think of the possibilities.

Natfrog.4310:

Are you going to throw in a mele weapon?

I read that and instantly thought of how the Revenant uses 2-handed Hammers LOL

Not trying to pose an argument, by the way. Cheers!

Likewise. Same for access to Resistance. Probably just me, but Resistance + Druid seems fitting. Though, I am not familiar with how Anet envisions Druids.

Natfrog.4310:

How are pets getting more damage? The tanky part effects each (pet and master) independantly or just based off the master? So while I am above 90% health does my pet take 50% less damage the entire time?

• Predator’s Onslaught: +10% damage vs foes with movement impending conditions (up from 5%).
• Sharpened Edges: Now applies to pet.
• Pack Alpha: +10% pet damage when the Player is above 90% health.
• +150 to Power, Precision, Toughness, and Vitality as a baseline

Probably a bit more but I can’t be kitten d to look up the rest. Also, Bark Skin is dependent on the Player. So, as long as you are above 90% hp, your pet will continuously take 50% less damage.

Yes, I also tested it with Zephyr’s Speed. Rest assured, as long as you press [F1] immediately after the pet swap [F4] – the pet does not “spaz” and there is 0 DPS loss.

On topic with Spirits, does anyone know if the buffs provided by Nature’s Vengeance will be persistent after a Spirit dies? Similar to how the passive buffs linger.

Jump Shot was said to be classified as an Explosion.

Prophet.1584:

Any thoughts on if zerk is still going to be the go to gear set for PVE rangers? the same goes for ranger runes vs scholar runes. Maths will have to be done once the patch actually hits and things are more permanent. If axe or sb did more direct damage i could see rampagers competing with zerk for best dps.

It’s going to be Zerk most likely. With the changes to Flanking Strikes, it relieves having to take a couple pieces of Assassin’s gear now. Likewise with other classes and how much crit chance modifiers added in.

Prophet.1584:

with the improved pet stats + Natural regeneration buffing healing power, would that make the invigorating bond heal worthwhile?

I don’t know about that. Even if Natural Regeneration’s Healing Power was buffed, it doesn’t make Invigorating Bond any more worthwhile. IB needs something more attached to it, be it condition cleanse, conversion, or supplying a specific strong boon like Resistance, Aegis, or Stability.

Ltomato.8649:

Pets also have a tendency to just spaz and not attack for a second after swapping, so you’re losing DPS there.

About that. I did some testing when you mentioned that earlier in another thread. Though it does happen, this issue can actually be corrected by pressing [F1] immediately after [F4].

This thread started out so nice…

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Aegis means little next to a Ranger that can AoE Blind for 5s and Weaken for 4s every 4.75s.

Aegis means a lot when blinds don’t. And 1 AOE blind every 5s vs a Thief that can do it 100%… Yeah. When it’s blind, weakness means nothing. And between Weakness and Aegis, Aegis is better.

That and Guard providing Aegis rotations is a difficult thing to substitute out. Even a Ele/Thief/Guard/War composition, Chronomancer looks like to have taken a niche role in that spare spot.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Why would you want SD for PvE? Spotter is in that slot.

I don’t think you got what I was saying about SD in Master Tier without the damage mod. If there are 2 rangers in a party, and one took spotter, the other can take SD if and do a bit more damage than the other if it had a damage mod still attached to it.

Also, we knew very well that everything was not final, but that doesn’t change the fact that the 1st iteration allowed a Ranger to freely choose WS, NM, or BM as the 3rd spec and the numbers would not have been too off.

2nd iteration, it’s only NM and BM as options with Quick Draw as the only GM choice in Skirmishing. Pretty lame to me.

That’s not the point of my post. It’s not about what is more active than the other. Choices are now more narrow for PVE Rangers. And of course Frost Spotter is better, that’s a no brainer for any PVE Ranger.

The point on SD is that it is no longer a viable option for PVE, and without any damage modifier in the Master tier, a 2nd Ranger will have less to offer in a party than a 2nd Warrior.

Again, my beef is that options were taken away.

Did the numbers on this myself using Sebrent’s spreadsheet as well after the update announcement. Still not happy losing out on our damage modifiers.

The only reason PVE Rangers were disappointed was because we were presented with extra damage modifiers we could take due to the new system. On the other hand, other classes will have access to more damage modifiers with the new system.

Yeah, our disappointment was warranted, especially with Strider’s Defense losing the 10% sword damage modifier and then being knocked down in the same tier as Spotter. The removal of Peak Strength also killed off the opportunity for Rangers to have access to another condition cleanse while dealing additional damage when above 90% health.

Between updates, PVE Rangers LOST the opportunity for build diversity to have Quick Draw or Strider’s Defense as our GM in Skirmishing, and WS is no longer a viable option compared to NM or BM. The 1st iteration of changes were not perfect, but it offered Rangers so many options in PVE. Just my take on it.

NapTooN.6283:

if they priced it with a few $ off, there would still be enough People screaming: “Why did i have to pay 60$ for the Base earlier and 40 for the Expansion while New Players get both for 50?”

Well, that’s the thing. The only option that would satisfy a large portion of consumers that already own the base game, regardless of the price paid, lingers around $20-30. The price has some flexibility since the base game is worth something in my opinion.

I may fall into the minority with this thought, but I believe when Anet states that they are giving the base game for free with the expansion undervalues the work, effort, and quality that went into the base game.

With that thought in mind and recent sales in the past leading up to the expansion in which the core game was priced between $10-20 seems like a reasonable amount to discount from the current packages that include the base game for expansion only packages.

It’s not perfect. As you stated, there are people who are or have recently purchased the base game for more than $20. At the same time, I also feel that any price below $30 for the initial release of Heart of Thorns would also undervalue the amount of work the current staff of ArenaNet has put into creating this expansion.

Just my opinion. Hopefully, we all can agree to disagree. Cheers, mate.

There just needs to be more options available. Having options won’t detract from this. The current 3 packages are fine and encourages new players into the game. However, all of these issues could have been avoided if there were options available for those that already own the core game and want only the expansion.

• Heart of Thorns Expansion ONLY Standard. Price $29.99-39.99
• Heart of Thorns Expansion ONLY Deluxe (same extras). Price $54.99-64.99
• Heart of Thorns Expansion ONLY Ultimate (same extras). Price $79.99-89.99

The price has some flexibility, but overall, more options are better. For the consumers, the fans, and the people at ArenaNet, the extra time and effort to add these additional options would be well worth it.

My 2 cents. Cheers.

TheFantasticGman.9451:

Happy for y’all in PVP… In PVE, on the other hand specifically dungeons/fractals, we will be worse off… I’m pretty certain of that just on the basis of losing so many damage modifiers.. I will be doing LESS damage than before.

I share the same sentiment. As far as dungeons and fractals are concerned, the Ranger has dropped off that list as a sufficient 5th in parties. Even without seeing the rest of the elite specs, I doubt the Druid traitline will bring enough to give us an edge in PvE.

Looks like they took notes from Capcom.

Most likely the Expansion Only option will appear once Heart of Thorns releases. My guess at least. I’ll be waiting for an expansion only option, too.

At least it’s not called, “Hunt the Dragon.”

Fluffball.8307:

Darkness.9732:

Btw i still don’ t understand why devs think ranger is overpowerd..and they keep nerfing it.

Made even more bizarre by the fact that it seems like the lead on the ranger changes was the same guy that made engies into friggen Greek gods.

Reminds me of Robert Gee giving mesmers a lot of love, and at the same time, not loving necros since he’s in charge of balancing both. At this point, I’m willing to take Roy as the Ranger specialist. At least he’ll make the class, “Pretty Good.” #Roy4Ranger <3

As Sebrent pointed out, if one of those Spirits grants Fury with Nature’s Vengeance, it would define a very clear path for PvE core Rangers.

Marksmanship: Clarion Bond, Steady Focus, Remorseless
Skirmishing: Sharpened Edges, Spotter, Quick Draw
Nature Magic: Bountiful Hunter, Windborne Notes, Nature’s Vengeance

If Frost Spirit was the one to grant Fury with NV, it would be icing on the cake, and fights would start off immediately by swapping pets once in combat just to proc Clarion Bond to pump up Bountiful Hunter and keep that pet out for as long as possible.

If another Spirit provided Fury other than Frost… well… I’d be disappointed, to say the least.

I’d actually be happy with that as well, Heim. Constant 8 stacks of might from the get-go is far better than having to ramp them up and possibly losing all progress due to a boon strip or steal.

+1 to that suggestion.