Guild Wars 2

Orion the Cursed.1206:

i have it… by accident

imposible = giant slayer 1000 kills

Do the giants in Orr count? Because if they do I might be REALLY close.

I got a better idea:

Everyone should roll a thief and learn the class.

Dog.1472:

I lol’d when I saw this was moved to the thief forum. Mods are great sometimes.

Thanks guys for bringing some sanity to the thread.

What if they do that on purpose because they know this forum is filled with rabid wolves waiting to tear apart the inexperienced?

Acension.9270:

I made a thief and wanted to get to level 80 so I could join more guild activities and be better in zergs in WvW, but I started to think what thiefs could actually do to help. I dont know much about thiefs and thats why Im asking. I wanted to know:

-What can they do to buff there allies?
-Do people want them in dungeons or not really?
-Other stuff that thiefs can do which is.are helpful.

Thanks in advance

Thieves have traits the give fury and might on steal and traits that grant everyone the thief stealths regeneration. You can also blind bosses constantly if you trait and gear up properly.

Last time I went with a group to do Sorrow’s Embrace p1-3, I used this setup. I was with 2 guardians, an engi and a warrior. The only person who was experienced was the warrior and the guards kept getting downed.

Since I was playing the conditions/support part of the group I would use my AoE stealths as a way to res them because not only did they get regen but the stealth broke targeting long enough that I could get them on their feet.

With Shadow Strike I would hit enemies as soon as they would get in range letting me play the tank when neccessary.

When we get near groups, Caltrops and Dagger Storm used in the middle of the groups would kill them really fast…. I mean REALLY fast. Not only that, I would get healed in the process due to SoM.

1-skill isn’t a combo, its a ranged-determined attack. If it was, I would specify that it turns into <blank>. :P

And yeah, I liked the concept when I thought of it but I am not in charge of balancing… of course the skill wouldn’t be that great. So if you had to redesign it how would you do it?

The two main differences between thieves and every other class is we have a resource we have to manage AND we only have damage avoidance. Now people seem to think stealth is a form of damage mitigation in a sense but all it does is break targeting and visuals.

The difference between damage mitigation and avoidance is mitigation reduces the severity of damage dealt whether it hits or not while avoidance increases the likelihood that actions will cause attacks to miss but do nothing to reduce the amount damage taken when damage is dealt.

Since alot of attacks land regardless, damage avoidance can only do so much.

This is why thieves are “squishy”… no mitigation.

You have a link to it?

The resemblance is impeccable.

Fortus.6175:

Simple question really, do seeing a person with a legendary make you go like; “Ohhh!”, are you indifferent, or another reaction?

Nope.

Fortus.6175:

Is there any reputation on getting one?

Nope.

Fortus.6175:

Would you go for it for the reputation or for the looks?

Nope.

Fortus.6175:

If it became harder/easier would you appreciate it more/less?

Nope.

Fortus.6175:

If you do appreciate something from legendaries or its users, what is it?

Nope.

EDIT: I just wanna remind everyone…. **** legendaries.

I hate everything. Anet should remove it.

12. Kiel is not part of the Flame Legion.

You have to account for armor type aesthetics. But since I am all for thief buffs…. +1

Excalibur.9748:

Zacchary.6183:

Excalibur.9748:

we need a trait to make it 1500 range also..but

I’d rather want 1500 range shuriken to feel like a real ninja

That would cause some kittening. If there was a damage dropoff at that range then maybe it could be put in.

no damage drop off needed, we’re like assassins we should be good at long range attacks. oh and do warriors suffer damage drop off at 1500 range? No right? So why should we? Come on we’re assassins. We should do the most burst.

We got Snipe/Fire. :P

Excalibur.9748:

we need a trait to make it 1500 range also..but

I’d rather want 1500 range shuriken to feel like a real ninja

That would cause some kittening. If there was a damage dropoff at that range then maybe it could be put in.

LilMcGinley.3890:

Doesn’t the bigger army always win the war?

No in fact.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Omdurman
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_watling_street
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vietnam_War

To name a few.

I lost 35 lbs. with Kiel.

Tolmos.8395:

Zacchary.6183:

Well, if experience wasn’t given by percentages and granted based on level, then maybe the amount of experience would be so minuscule that staying in Queensdale would be almost pointless.

It’s likely Karma they are there for, not experience.

Then perhaps they should cap that kitten too?

How about just reducing the amount of xp, wxp and drop rate of loot bags further the larger the zerg is? Why go zerging when it doesn’t really get you anything besides lag?

Some used common sense on these forums. We all know what that means….

/point xcavars

Well, if experience wasn’t given by percentages and granted based on level, then maybe the amount of experience would be so minuscule that staying in Queensdale would be almost pointless.

castlemanic.3198:

Why limit it to mesmer spell effects? Wouldn’t it be cool to change the colour of all the effects of all the classes into whatever we want? /sarcasm

I don’t understand why people want to change the colours of the mesmer class only, and ignore the effects of other classes. The reason mesmer spells are pinkish/purple is because that colour represents chaos, alongside the butterflies also being an aspect of chaos as well.

To change the colour of mesmer spell effects would be to change the representation of what mesmer spells are supposed to be.

so no for this.

Some people just do not like those colors or shapes. They just don’t want to see thier character produce such effects. Besides chaos means a lack of organisation or order. Those effects really could be any color and shape and it’ll still fit the bill.

GuardianOMS.8067:

I run with a focus and Blink, never had a problem with speed. Every class is not the same. There are clear differences, disadvantages, and advantages between many of them.

Learn to play and deal with it.

This.

Evilek.5690:

Make passive element on this Venom skills.

Spider Venom – every 3 hits applies poison
Skale Venom – every 3 hits applies Torment

Problem fixed

This. I would use venoms more if this happened.

You thinking about something different than what I thought up for the 3 skill? Which reminds me. I didn’t put the condition removal on shadow return.

Ideas for Traits:
>Penetrating Rounds: Rifle attacks pierce.

>Dark Rounds: Rifle attacks inflict Blind. 33% chance.

>Ankle Shots (revamp): Pistol and Rifle crits have a 60% chance to Cripple for 3s. (CD 10s)

>Sprinting: +10% running speed while wielding a Rifle.

>Steady Breathing: 10% damage with rifles. Activation time for rifles skills are increased by 1/4s. Ghillie Suit and Snipe have a 20% chance to not drain initiative each tick.

>Rifle Round Roulette: Rifle attacks have a chance to inflict Bleeding (5s), Vulnerability (5s), Weakness (2s), Blind (5s) and/or Cripple (5s) on crit. Each condition is applied randomly. 15% chance for each condition.

>Target Acquired: Targets that take damage from your traps become marked for 5 seconds. The next rifle attack deals 10% more damage.

> High-powered Scope: Increase Rifle range to 1500. Decrease rifle range bonus to 150 per initiative spent while Snipe is active.
-more trait ideas later…. perhaps-

At least you understand the bullkitten that thieves go through.

I only use the mystic toilet for dailies.

You shouldn’t take so much damage from sliding down a hill. I screwed up my knee by dropping 15 ft and landing on it. Every time I slid down a hill, I would come out of it with a minor scrape and some worn down pants.

The amount of damage taken sliding down the side of a hill is stupid imo.

I understand this is a troll post but then again I hate it when you take 48k damage by sliding down a steep hillside on your kitten .

Nikkinella.8254:

selan.8354:

Mordecai.6318:

Never have I seen a community complain about something so much. My god, this combo has an infinite amount of counters that multiple people have listed throughout this thread. Clearly this is everyone’s first MMO and first experience with a stealth mechanic because thieves are easily countered by every class.

Shut up and learn from your mistakes. The combat in this game is so simplistic compared to basically every MMO ever, yet people want their hands held because being a brainless ham is too easy.

says the thief that cried a couple of months ago about confusion, because he couldnt spam 2222222212222221 yeah sure an entire community needs to learn to play, because u are so awesome and so godlike that u can play any other class and kill any other class with no problems whatsoever.

This always bothered me. Thieves cried and cried over retaliation and confusion, which I never had a problem with even before they were nerfed. Retal and Confusion were never OP. You just had to pay attention and not mindlessly spam skills like the majority of thieves do all the time. But they cried and cried until it was nerfed despite the fact that there were plenty of ways to deal with both. Yeah confusion mesmers and retal guardians were annoying, but killable on any class if you didn’t just mindlessly spam and kill yourself. Yet thieves refuse to accept the fact that stealth, despite having no counters like confusion and retal have, is incredibly op. I wouldn’t care if they permastealthed if there was an active way to counter it that all non stealth classes had access to. And no, other classes shouldn’t have to carry around a trap to remove stealth. Do thieves have to carry around traps to strip boons off of people? Other classes should have traits or utility or weapon skills that can cause reveal.

Like how people kittened about stealth so much that they gave them a direct counter and constant nerf after nerf?

If you like disrupting zerg trains do this…

You: “troll up”

Someguy: “troll isn’t up yet”

You: “yes it is. TROLOLOLOLOLOL”

Excalibur.9748:

Zacchary.6183:

Dagger 4.

it’s a given that you need to spam dagger 4 along with all the other mobility stuff to even have a chance of catching a roaming warrior.

It should also be given that heartseeker is also a great gap closer. In which case, using both and then covering the enemy in caltrops would make it very hard for them to flee without taking more damage first.

I would really like a skill that goes like this:

Aim Down the Scope (7 initiative)

Get on one knee and aim down the scope. Initiative regeneration stops so long as you remain in this stance. Movement will cancel it and you regain 3 initiative upon leaving it. 1 initiative is drained per second.

Fatal Shot

Fire a piercing bullet that becomes more powerful and flies farther the longer you aim. Automatically fires when initiative hits 0.

Damage: 702
Range: 1200

Aiming Bonus
Range: 200 per initiative
Damage: 2% per initiative

6/10
8/10
8/10

I have two Charrs.

Kitara Bloodtail – Blood Legion, Guardian
Bauccus – Ash Legion, Mesmer (Kitara’s brother in a long fanfic I am writing)

When I shoot lasers with my Greatsword I stand upright.

GuardianOMS.8067:

Nerf Death Shroud pls

And boon spam pls? I know I haz LS but still nerf pl0xorz?

Gandarel.5091:

Zacchary.6183:

Gandarel.5091:

Kain Francois.4328:

Why would ANET rig the election? They are the ones trying to collect data which character we want to see in the future.

It’s more about which fractal do we want to see in the future. Or are we so shallow that a WP discount can mesmerized us.

Like how Abbadon mesmerized that half of the population?

The fractal is a permanent addition which should drive your vote, not the temporary 4 week reduced wp costs (probably 10%).

What drives my vote is the FREE temporary content that I get rather than the temporary content I HAVE TO PAY FOR to experience. Not only that, I have absolutely no clue wtf happened at the reactor. I would like to see what happened.

I’m going to see how high I can get on the flying ship in Labyrinthine. I got pretty high at one point.

Got to a point of no return. I then took a close up.

Gandarel.5091:

Kain Francois.4328:

Why would ANET rig the election? They are the ones trying to collect data which character we want to see in the future.

It’s more about which fractal do we want to see in the future. Or are we so shallow that a WP discount can mesmerized us.

Like how Abbadon mesmerized that half of the population?

Dagger 4.

inazuma.7021:

Razor.9872:

BobbyStein.2315:

AnthonyOrdon.3926:

Just ask yourselves if you really want to elect a fancy cat with a lead designer in his pocket. We’ll just have double up our support for Kiel on SATURDAY.

Brought to you by the people against smelly animals in office.

This man speaks the truth.

Remind me which Edge of Destiny member screwed over the others…oh right…the human -_-

Oh please, all Logan did was restore party balance. Six is too many for a dungeon run.

AND he is a Guardian. Sooooo I think Logan did a great thing.

wish.1027:

Galsia.4102:

Bambu.4270:

1) Remove Initiative from normal skills and make skills work like in other professions.
2) Remove Stealth from all skills and make it Initiative-only boon.
3) Add ability to attack while in Stealth.
X) Stealth will go off when your Initiative “charges” are off, like a counter, ya’know?

Your numbering…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gVGbDEAnDyo

Regarding #3, Backstab is an auto-attack, and auto-attacks have no CDs. How does 7-10k damage repeated instantaneously sound to you?

He’s actually proposing the biggest buff ever to thief… I wonder if he realized that.

o. o ho-ly kitten

Jack of Blades.2153:

Well i would preffer a sword but wear it as a two handed (like katana) that would be crazy, and probably make new weapon style only for this class, slicy slice

:O I can totally see that happen! We should get that option and some traits to go with it.

I agree that retaliation is a little crazy but we do have boon stealing capabilities. I mean, what better way to screw up a guard’s retal spamming capabilities by simply taking it? If they hit you it’ll only hurt them.

I do like the cooldown idea but I believe 1 second is a bit too long. Gotta give them at least SOMETHING.

Pleurodesed.7625:

But do you agree with me then that all roles should have a weakness? That’s the whole purpose of balance in variety.

Caltrops, Caltrops and more Caltrops.

Lucky.9421:

Buy the perma-rep button off the trading post.

Problem solved.

PS – Buy the Kiel one

fixed*

Amun Ra.6435:

Zacchary.6183:

What does the comment I replied to have to do with the topic? This thread is about balance in general. Not another “dis kitten OP” thread. Nice job derailing and enjoy your infractions.

So you would like to have a serious argument on balance and in-balance, only you want no examples brought up? Examples are at the heart of any argument. A would think a seemly intelligent person as yourself would realize this. FYI: you can’t receive infractions for adding to an argument one way or another.

I would like examples, yes. But I would like examples that relate to the topic at hand. The example posted earlier was stemmed from the assumption that this is another “QQ don’t nurf theef” thread when it was clearly stated that it wasn’t.

That example could have explained why people think Thieves (maybe even Guardians and Mesmers too) are OP and then come up with counter-examples to compliment them. Instead it was a “thieves are OP” comment which is not only off topic but it will derail this thread like all the others.

Wryog.5073:

BTW why do people keep talking about stealth/thieves? Stealth balance threads that way ->
I don’t like thieves either but mentioning stealth and talking about thieves just because the OP is a thief is wrong. He’s obviously not defending his class/mechanic, he’s defending an idea.

This! Thank you!

Allisa Wonderland.8192:

Zacchary, please let me start by saying that I have a matching/similar position. I suggest there is only one bias-free type of balance required: exploitable imbalance. The explanation of how a thief may sneak out of a combat situation (to the great frustration of most of the people who play against them.) My counter has become to spin around in circles and guess where their best course of exit would be… and the more I do it, the better I get. BUT, if there is a skill that gives one profession a distinct, unintended, super power, I see that as an exploit in the intention of the game, not just a failure to vanilla-ize all the classes into equality.

I feel that PvE is suffering because of the balances focused on PvP. In PvE, it isn’t a huge deal if a short bow fires the same distance as a long bow (since we are supposedly working together in PvE, not competing), but in PvE it may have a huge impact. Separating the skills, a la GW1, feels like the best solution to this.

I have all 8 classes, with only the thief below 80. My personal favourites are Guardian and Ranger, but I find that each brings its own strengths and weaknesses, and all are completely playable in the PvE world. It took time to learn about these differences, but it is possible.

Now that I’ve started playing PvP, I am understanding more the potential reasons for the “outcry” after each nerf. It makes a much bigger difference. Once again – split PvP and PvE.

Perhaps the biggest problem is that WvW is tied to PvE instead of PvP. PvE is “help others,” while PvP and WvW are “kill others.” If a PvE profession is underpowered, it will be at a disadvantage in WvW. Is this where players are crying out the pain of their profession being underpowered?

Thank you for not just pointing out specific professions/strengths and then calling them OP. Hopefully the rest of the comments do the same.

As for your question, most of that tends to come from WvW but depending on the profession there are gripes from PvP and PvE as well. I think what the UP complaints come from is that not every profession can eat damage like others can and not every profession can deal damage like others can and these major divides between professions can cause some envy.

That’s just how I see it anyway.

Sil.4560:

ITT: Thief talks about how balance isn’t important to avoid changing the status quo. Report away, I’m well within my rights of saying this. Best yet, it’s totally true.

Not really.

Erasculio.2914:

I was using assassins in GW1 as an example. The same example could be told using ritualists, paragons, dervishes, or the PvE only skill Ursan Blessing. Your post fails to account for any of those scenarios. You are actually focusing, whether you realize it or not, on why ArenaNet should not nerf thieves.

And the same could be said about Guardians, Rangers, Mesmers, Engineers, Thieves, Necromancers, Warriors, Elementalists, Hunters, Paladins, Rouges, Death Knights, Priests, Druids, etc. because they all have their own strengths. Those who use those strengths effectively will cause those classes to seem overpowered.

Yes, you are using assassins as as an example but you are also basing my intentions off of a disclaimer. That disclaimer was solely meant to warn people that assume and discriminate a post based on the author to not assume and discriminate my post. If you took it like it was meant to be taken and read the rest of the post, you would see that the topic applies to any QQ thread.

Although, I don’t blame people for assuming that since most of those topics are based on a PvP basis.

I’m talking about balance in general. You however are not and not only are you off topic, you are derailing this thread.

If you wanna complain about thieves and assassins, you can make your own topics in the general discussion, suggestions or the thief forum. Until then I am just going to keep reporting your comments.