Guild Wars 2

Erasculio.2914:

Zacchary.6183:

3 out of 4 definitions scream, “You got your kitten whooped”. It’s something the original posters of those topics almost never takes into account.

Cool story bro, but what does that have anything to do with the example I mentioned, about assassins in the original Guild Wars? I had an assassin character, they were extremely overpowered in a given moment of the game, yet it was not something good for me – even being an assassin player – nor for the game as a whole. What do your statements have to do with that kind of scenario?

IMO, nothing. You are writing a reply to a topic saying “Please nerf thieves, they are overpowered in PvP”. That’s part of balance – but not all of balance, and not even most of balance. Balance isn’t just a matter of nerfing or not whatever people think is imbalanced in a 1vs1 PvP scenario, but rather something that deals with fixing what is broken in the entire game.

What does the comment I replied to have to do with the topic? This thread is about balance in general. Not another “dis kitten OP” thread. Nice job derailing and enjoy your infractions.

Bud.5617:

Most other classes are ok, but whenever I run across a semi descent mesmer, I’m hosed – unless I have got back up (Or I’m the backup).

So how do you beat mesmer as a thief without resorting to gimmicky build like P/D, that can’t seem to kill anything else?

The illusionary berserkers hits for a ton of damage. They can’t be killed easily either because they apply daze when destroyed – leaving me open to other attacks.

To make matter worse, once I’m on top of the mesmer, they just stealth and re-appear a way off, firing that purpple beam thing.

Despite their low health, they regenerate that pretty fast and seem to stack a bunch of boons (regen, prot, etc.) – while mine just continues to deplete from guessing the correct clone, chasing the teleporting – stealthing mesmer and being slammed by the berserkers.

What is frustrating is that most other classes have a weakness. But mesmers don’t:

They can hit hard in melee via the illusions, put distance fairly fast, stealth and clone which makes targetting a real pain, esp when there’s more than 1.

The stealth also magnifies the problem with targetting because even after you identify the correct one, you’d lose them again.

They also have long range artillery via. the greatsword (probably the most damaging long range weapon there is).

Good up close tanking with that blurry thingy, and they regenerate their health fairly fast despite dishing a ton of damage.

The illusions also allow mesmers to continue dishing damage, even while the real player is stealthed. Thief on the other hand has to choose between surviving or dealing. The illusions also has the effect of suppressing fire. When fighting another stealthed thief I can just roam around swinging – I can’t do so with a stealthed mesmer because that’d leave me way too vulnerable to clone attacks.

If there is one thing is that their health is low, but so are thieves and we don’t have that many options to us at any given time.

I’m hesitant to call another class OP – so I’m hoping someone show me how to beat them effectively.

By doing this.

@ Erasculio

Last time I checked, combat is the biggest part of GW2. Balance within combat is good for it to a point but treating it like it is the most important thing for it will kill it. That is the point I try to make here, but I guess you just couldn’t resist bringing it up.

In a game with multiple classes, there is absolutely no doubt that each profession will have its own strengths. Some classes have more strengths than others. Players fail to realize this when they confront those classes with jealous posts asking for nerfs. Guess what… they used those strengths to outplay them.

Why do you think I talked about the term overpowered?

3 out of 4 definitions scream, “You got your kitten whooped”. It’s something the original posters of those topics almost never takes into account.

FYI: I said I wasn’t going to argue about specific professions on a topic that isn’t about specific professions. Perhaps you should read my entire post instead of just reading a title, picking out a piece of the disclaimer and writing about something completely off topic.

Thats why I don’t mess with RNG boxes. :D

Kam.8109:

fadeaway.2807:

Would you solo roam on anything besides a thief?
If so – why?.

Poxheart.2845:

For the challenge.

Still loling from this.

I think he is talking about resource management vs. rotation.

The Talcmaster.7391:

perfect imbalance or cyclical imbalance as used in extra credits is a really terrible term for what they were talking about because it gives people the idea that it is somehow the opposite of balance when in reality it’s just a different type of balance. A better term would be Non-transitive Balance which comes from mathematical term Nontransitive game, which is something like Rock Paper Scissors. Which option in Rock Paper Scissors is actually more powerful? None, they are all perfectly balanced. But if you were to solely compare them in pairs, you would be under the impression that one was inferior to the other. This sort of comparative weakness allows for vast metagames to emerge, and many successful games that rely on strategy often have multiple layers of nontransitivity going on. So please, let’s not call it imbalance, it’s confusing and not really accurate.

more stuff

I actually like the way you described this. At some point in writing, I was going to make a RPS example but it was getting late so I cut it out. I am going to put this into the post if you don’t mind.

@ matemaster

I am not going to argue my class when the subject matter gets popped. Instead I will just report those comments whether they are about my profession or not. Just a fair warning.

BobbyT.7192:

Zacchary.6183:

Rahar.9872:

Zacchary.6183:

-snip-

EDIT: A tactic I use in fights against more skilled players is when my opponent and I are low on HP I let them down me so I can hit them a few times with my downed attack and rally. Afterwards, I proceed to kill them. It works.

Let me correct you here for clarity and other’s understanding. You cannot rally from downing someone. You must defeat them, or another creature/NPC to rally. Simply getting them down does not rally you. Don’t try this at home. You’ll likely die.

I checked wiki to make sure and saw that it was changed on the 17th of last month. I remember being able to rally off of players I downed before then but I didn’t have the chance to try it for a few months. If they fixed it then that would suck but then again how often do people actually get to that point in fights? :I

You’ve always had to defeat another player, not down, it’s been this way since…..well ever. if you check the history for rally, you can see it states this way back when the page was first created.

I might have seen a bug then. I’ll get rid of it.

Sunflowers.1729:

Zacchary.6183:

Regardless of that, there is always a counter to everything but like anything else it needs to be worked for. People can’t keep thinking inside the box forever.

This is blatantly untrue.

I guess you are right in a sense, but then that says something about the people who refuse to do so. (don’t mistake for “can’t”)

Azure Prower.8701:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E4I4OCgVAv8

If Abbadon asks you. You say yes.

Vote Kiel.

Fixed.

Sunflowers.1729:

Cyclical imbalance? Must be a pretty long cycle then, because for the past 9 months the best team composition for PvE has been some combination of Mesmer + Warrior + Guardian + something, and for WvW roaming the Thief (no comment on sPvP, because I hate it).

For zergs, you have the clump-together-spam-1 strategy which works exceedingly well, and 90% of zergs use it to great effect. There are a few other ways to zerg (e.g. kite groups) but if there was ‘Cyclical Balance’ we would see more of such strategies appear, then counter-strategies appear to remove that. This is (at least on T2 NA where I am) not the case.

Can’t you get it into your head? People are complaining not because they don’t want to counter it, but because there is no counter (or nothing better in the case of PvE).

If there was a cyclical imbalance, we would see (for example) a surge of roaming Engineers to counter all the roaming Thieves. That’s obviously not happening.

You have no idea what you are talking about.

I never said we had a full-fledged cycle going and I feel you completely missed the part where I stated that this game is very unpolished. It should go without saying that this game has alot of fixing that needs to be done so of course people are going to settle into lazy tactics like zerg 1-spam.

WvW is still unpolished. PvE is still unpolished. Maybe not so much PvP but I havn’t been there in months so I wouldn’t know. The point I was trying to make is that there a cycle going, but its really slow because of how incomplete this game is.

Regardless of that, there is always a counter to everything but like anything else it needs to be worked for. People can’t keep thinking inside the box forever.

Wryog.5073:

I’m getting the feeling that this is in the wrong subforum….
I don’t think that the golden classes for PvE have changed since launch(someone said it before me).

I don’t think it is. Its about the game and players in general so general discussion works best.

Rissou.7213:

Shadowstrike is still not worth using in my opinion…

Cloak and dagger cost 6 ini, shadowstrike cost 4 ini. Cloak and Dagger gives 4 sec stealth and sneak attack with 5 bleeds. And in most builds stealth removes conditions and heal you and blinds your target.

Shadowstrike gives 2 torment stacks and teleports you away.. but anyone with range can keep on attacking you.

Can someone tell me why you use shadowstrike over cloak and dagger, to open my eyes to something i missed, because i just dont see how it can benefit you.

Those who use ranged tend to back up when you start meleeing them which is one of the reasons I have d/d as my second set. Its good for bleeds and I doubt people will stay in one spot to avoid taking damage from moving while I add more bleeds. Shadow Strike also is a good evade if you time it right.

Doug the Great.7581:

You don’t like venoms, traps, or stealing and you use a pistol? So, you are playing engineer then?

Thiefgineer. Its an alternative to stealth. They’ll never know whats coming to them. >:D

Rahar.9872:

Zacchary.6183:

-snip-

EDIT: A tactic I use in fights against more skilled players is when my opponent and I are low on HP I let them down me so I can hit them a few times with my downed attack and rally. Afterwards, I proceed to kill them. It works.

Let me correct you here for clarity and other’s understanding. You cannot rally from downing someone. You must defeat them, or another creature/NPC to rally. Simply getting them down does not rally you. Don’t try this at home. You’ll likely die.

I checked wiki to make sure and saw that it was changed on the 17th of last month. I remember being able to rally off of players I downed before then but I didn’t have the chance to try it for a few months. If they fixed it then that would suck but then again how often do people actually get to that point in fights? :I

Now lets talk about another concept that Extra Credits touched upon, “Cyclical Imbalance”.

Cyclical Imbalance is where metas are constantly replaced by setups that become the new meta. Metas often get taken down because people start noticing weaknesses in it. Players will work around that meta and create setups that will eventually become the new meta and continue this cycle.

What drives Cyclical Imbalance is the players’ skill. The creation and posting of new unorthodox builds is the catalyst that starts this cycle that keeps gameplay engaging. It prompts players who keep getting their kitten handed to them to turn around and see what they are doing wrong. This is the first step to building upon a player’s current skills which in turn contributes to the cycle.

Now, GW2 remains unpolished in almost every part of it’s being, albeit getting better over time. We will not see this cycle in full force until Anet finishes tweaking the professions. However, that doesn’t mean that cyclical imbalance doesn’t exist in this game. In WvW, players are starting to build more towards survivability than before when full zerk was the way to go. For some professions, condition builds are becoming the new meta instead of direct damage. All of this will only change as time goes on and everyone will adapt eventually.

So, the next time you scream for balance, go back and figure out how to counter it first. You’de be surprised how minor of a problem it was and you become a better player in the process.

Thanks for reading.

Before I get started, I would like to remind everyone that this thread is not about class discrimination. I know people look at my siggy and say, “Omg this guy is a thief” and start disreguarding anything I say because this thread somehow translates into me complaining about my class being UP. I also understand that there are people who will see my name and think “Oh its the trolling thief forum warrior again.”

Unfortunately, that isn’t what this is about and I am not going to let this thread be derailed into that. This thread is meant to get people in the frame of mind that balance isn’t as important as some make it out to be. So as a treat to you all, I am not going to argue my class when the subject matter gets popped. Instead I will just report those comments whether they are about my profession or not. Just a fair warning.

Onto the topic at hand…
————————————————————————————————————

I see alot of people complaining that there is a major lack of balance in this game. The story usually turns out as the original poster recently getting outplayed by something, perhaps multiple times in a row, which irritates them enough to make the player log onto the forums and post their complaints. Bandwagoners and anyone else with a small personal vendetta jumps in to support the poster as well.

The term that’s almost guaranteed to be used in this kind of thread is “overpowered”. To reinforce their point, they will use “lack of balance” that “doesn’t reward skill” in “1v1”. If you don’t feel like clicking the link I’ll just give it to you by quote:

dictionary.com

o·ver·pow·er [oh-ver-pou-er] Show IPA
verb (used with object)
1.
to overcome, master, or subdue by superior force: to overpower a maniac.
2.
to overcome or overwhelm in feeling; affect or impress excessively: overpowered with confusion and desire.
3.
to gain mastery over the bodily powers or mental faculties of: a strong drink that quickly overpowered him.
4.
to furnish or equip with excessive power: a giant motor that overpowered the pump.

What do you expect when a game is not built for 1v1? What do you expect when each profession is unique and has greater access to specific aspects of combat than every other profession?

More rewarding content requires groups that have enough knowledge, patience and skill to complete it. Because each profession has their own strengths and drawbacks, every class requires varying amounts of skill to complete said content. It all really depends on the person, the content and the profession being used. Regardless, it forces people to plan before they jump.

So would balancing them for 1v1 do any good? Not really, according to Extra Credits. Balanced games force players into specific strategies which makes gameplay predictable, grindy and boring. Yes, it breaks down combat into a form that rewards skill but in reality, the “skill” players were looking for gets replaced by knowledge of the best available strategies and the ability to execute them rapidly and more efficiently.

Using preset knowledge at the fastest pace possible does not take skill. Creating that preset knowledge does.

But let’s say Anet were to balance this game for player skill/level in combat. One way is to just make no set classes, like in Runescape. Weapon skills will be replaced with a simple auto attack and the extra slots will be for weapon-based utilities. Everyone has access to all weapons and all utility skills so long as they have the appropriate level and weapon equipped to use them.

The meta would then start settling into long ranged combat, a specific gear setup and the best DPS and control for utilities. Kinda like how the Bandos Godsword in Runescape is the best budget weapon in the game. In the quest to make skill more relevant in combat by balancing it, you will have effectively collapsed the jedi curve into an extremely high wall on raised ground. In other words, the skill floor will allow little to no progression on a personal level until you start hitting world-class levels of playing.

The only way to prevent that from happening is trusting in the players ability to adapt and grow skill-wise instead of adjusting everything until people stop complaining. Someone will ALWAYS gripe about petty things so it’s best not to worry about it. Eventually that someone will realize they are not getting anywhere by complaining and either give up or adapt. If that someone chose to adapt, they will build upon what they know until they overcome the very thing they were complaining about.

Skill level is relative but it is also something that is increased through experience.

I played PvP until I realized I couldn’t get laurels from both PvP and PvE dailies.

Jscull.2514:

EZ mode class- allows bad players to feel like they can compete.

Put the same player on a warrior/guardian, and see how good they are in open field without stealth. TERRIBLE.

The same can be said the other way.

BTW I have a guard and I am doing pretty well on it.

Sitkaz.5463:

I rolled a thief because I’m trying all classes, and because I think it’s true you have to play something to understand it. I’ve found they’re not an “I win” button by any means. I’ve also found I still can’t read other thieves’ minds and know where they are in stealth just because I use it to, so that suggestion rarely helps. I’m still learning of course.

Basically they’re an anti-social class, able to roam better than others and survive in a non-supported non-supporting way that sets them apart from the others (in wvw anyway.) Stealth and thief gameplay is impossible to balance with the rest because it’s just so different than other classes’ gameplay. This isn’t to say it’s bad or should be removed, it’s just totally different. I’m not sure they’re meant to offer group value, as the OP puts it. It seems intended that they’re loners.

This is a perfect example of the third line in my siggy.

This guy is learning how to play vs. thieves.

I just came up with another idea! Thieves should be called Tear Cups.

Piola.3782:

You should to try to use Riochet!

I thought I put it in there…. hold on.

EDIT:
=w= what is this trickery.

Shufflepants.9785:

If you guys truly wish to nerf stealth or nerf how often players can stealth, you’re going to have to be ok with an increase in thieves’ out of stealth damage. Backstab is a huge part of pve and pvp damage for dagger thieves. And then you’re gonna need to give thieves other ways to avoid damage, say, give thieves access to aegis?

This, but unlikely to happen. The removal of stealth would almost require an entire profession overhaul.

Best thing that can be done for now is just to get better at fighting them.

Ryuujin.8236:

According to every other class – We are

Hey I was about to say that. >:c

EDIT: Btw my charr mesmer alt is leveling up quite nicely. I am loving phantasms so much right now.

Redscope.6215:

Another thief nerf thread that will be met with strong opposition from the block-headed, thief-only, terribad players that troll these forums complaining about [insert latest thief patch notes here]. Thieves will continue to get nerfed, but more than likely this is not the way it will happen.

As I’ve said before, numerous times, thieves still have way too much access to ‘mulligan’ for the amount of forgiveness the rest of their skills offer them. Many things have been brought into line, but it’s not over.

Anyone who thinks the thief is balanced is delusional; I’ve said that one before too. The “L2P” acronym has been tossed about on this forum more than any other, and guess which class got the most nerfs since release…

The truth is that Anet devs are learning their game’s strengths and weaknesses. They’ve finally submitted that mobility is the highest power available to any one class and they are now balancing around it. The ele nerfs proved it a while back and the re-upping of guard symbol size confirms it.

This thread is neither the beginning nor the end of a massive forum trollfest sparked and fueled by the simple fact that this is the troll class and trolls will always flock to it. It’s not specific to GW2 either. It’s like this with every thief, rogue, assassin, burglar, etc class in every game. In the end, people never seem to stop and I continue to read the wrong-headed feedback about how balance changes killed the game for thieves. So far, Pistol Whip has been the most fun to read about…oh, the world that some people live in.

Let’s me find that poll for you…

Idk about good eles. Tbh the last one I faced just bled to death. I stayed out of their AoEs and kept laying on bleeds until they died. I think I was using SoM at the time though so my heals beat his heals out.

@ OP

Rotations and waiting for cooldown + a proper time to activate available skills takes less skill than split-second resource management. Although, I don’t think you get the concept of “Resource Management”.

We have 12 or 15 points of initiative we can use to perform attacks. Once it is gone, we have to wait for it to regenerate before we can do ANYTHING except 1-skill auto. Now seeing as how most of our skills are weaker than the 1-skill and have high utility as compensation, thieves must make sure that they have some initiative left to use those abilities when the time comes. Otherwise we could jeopardize ourselves.

Now if a thief starts spamming one specific attack, it is because the thief believes thakittens appropriate at that specific time whether or not it truly is wise to do so. It is a legitimate strategy and takes way more contemplation beforehand than a rotation does.

For example:

Is my opponent weak enough that I can safely burn out my remaining initiative to kill him? Do I have a form of damage avoidance available and if so, will it drain my resources? Will I have enough initiative left to use CnD when I need it? Will I have enough initiative left to perform Y action after I do X? Will I need this initiative more for offense or defense? Etc.

Now I have a mesmer alt which I am starting to do fairly good at. Right now its kind of a phantasm build but it does have its rotation. I normally use Illusionary Berserker > Switch to Staff > Illusionary Warlock > Chaos Storm > Illusionary Defender and then spam Spatial Surge at another target. If one of my Phantasms die, I replace them with another.

My guardian… Binding Blade> Pull > Symbol of Wrath > Leap of Faith > Whirling Wrath > Switch to hammer > Zealot’s Embrace > Ring of Warding > Banish > Mighty Blow > Switch to Greatsword > Rinse > Repeat. All this gets pulled off fairly quickly.

Now if I REALLY need some control for those professions, all I have to do is wait for it to get off cooldown and then use it when the time is right. Once they get hit, then continue on my rotation until my target dies.

Very little resource management.

EDIT: You might also want to click the third link in my siggy since a thief just told you the special word.

Duke Nukem.6783:

the same reason i would vote for someone like evon in real life, prosperity is based on the suffering of others, all powerful nations are built on genocide war conquest and intolerance and thats the way it is, dont try and change it accept it and join in.

nations only die when people forget how to wage profitable war

And that’s why society is decaying.

I once dreamed that caltrops became a torment combo field. Then I woke up. :C

If you are getting killed by a thief spamming 2, you are doing something wrong .

#2008electionalloveragain

Why?

Junkpile.7439:

Simple. Just remove stealth and nerf thief damage.

Simple. Learn to play.

style.6173:

Zacchary.6183:

I don’t get hit enough.

I’m not sure I understand your build. On one hand you don’t get hit enough to need a stun breaker but on the other hand you get downed enough that you need back fighting. Something seems out of place there.

Edit: I also see you said you don’t use steal. Why??? It is easy way to get into stealth in combo with CnD.

Lol! I don’t NEED it. I am saying that it has helped me whenever I get downed. Rally is a powerful thing if you know what you are doing. Besides, you don’t lose until you are defeated.

As for my trait choices, I hate venoms so I am not planning on using IV, V and VIII. I don’t use steal because I just don’t like it so III and VII are out of the question. II is gone too because of traps. So all I am left with is I, VI, IX and X.

If I was going to using steal, though, I would definitely choose Improvisation and Mug. The benefits from those two outweigh the 50% of extra damage I deal in the downed state or pretty much every other trait available.

EDIT: <deleted>

Viking Jorun.5413:

He could have just been running an initiative regen build with dagger offhand and spamming CnD. My best guess.

This.

naphack.9346:

I should slap you for putting 25 into deadly arts in a non-venom build.
Getting 25 deadly arts and grabbing garbage traits just for the condition duration is simply a waste of trait points.

Also, durations boni are capped at 100%, so stacking that much cond. duration(20% weapons, 25% traits, 40% food) = 85% +45% from bleed runes, 10% from Agony = 140% bleed duration) is just unnecessary.
Drop the points in DA(-25%): +60% cond duration.
Swap out one Bleed rune for Lyssa: +70% cond duration.
Remaining +Bleed duration from bleed runes: +30% bleed duration.
Drop Sigil of Agony for something else
=100% bleed, 70% cond. with 25 trait points ready to be dropped into defensive traits.

I hope you also understand that I don’t play thief like anyone on this forum. Back Fighting might look like a garbage trait but it has saved me from Defeated numerous times in the past. Downing someone while Downed yourself makes you Rally which often leads to a win and Back Fighting makes it happen faster.

I will however look at bleeding duration. Understand, though, that I put the food there for looks. I consider food as a crutch and refuse to use it. :P

Travlane.5948:

oh … why not drop exposed weakness for sleight of hand?

I don’t use steal but I have looked at them when I was making the beta. I figured that if I wasn’t planning on using steal that I could add some raw power in the mix.

Xavi.6591:

How would this build do if armour was switched to Carrion for the power over precision?

You could try it and see. I don’t really feel comfortable unless my toughness and vitality are over 1400 so I never really try it.

Clockwork Bard.3105:

That’s hilarious, because it’s probably our most predictable set. Well, other than possibly P/P (zomgthatthiefhastwogunsRETALIATION!). Still, I love it for being an almost melee-ranged set. All the fun of the melee dance, with none of the pain that comes with having to stand there for more than a single attack. It’s my favorite range on any profession I play.

If you use Shadow Refuge and then use Dagger Storm before the refuge goes away, it makes leeching bolts that heal 170. I havn’t tested to see if it is exactly like spin2win though.

I don’t get hit enough.

If you die, its because the thing that killed you is overpowered.

This is what my current condition build is at.

I am currently enjoying this build more than my d/d signet build as it allows me to watch my enemies bleed/torment themselves to death without worrying about melee bursts melting my fragile body. :O

Initiative usage is low so I don’t trait for it but it causes this build to be a little trolly while in p/d. I have found out that with Shadow Strike, positioning is awesome as well as slightly disorienting. That doesn’t stop me from running through my enemies pressing 3 and then watch them for that split second while they get a visual relock on me.

Sometimes they say fk it and switch to ranged combat. THAT is when I start using stealth. Sometimes when I do that they believe that I am going to backstab them (on a condition build?) so they back up/freeze/something. Suddenly they are covered in a double layer of caltrops and dodge out of it. That’s when I go in for my backsta-SNEAK ATTACK!

My favorite part about this build is when those who pull out their ranged weaponry start backing up. I like to lay on the torment so take advantage of their backpedaling.

I havn’t tried it out on multiple mobs or small groups, yet. I’m still practicing with 1v1.

They know nothing because none of the devs play a thief.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Zacchary.6183:

I like how warriors got the most buffs this patch.

I hope you’re not surprised given that the head of the balance team is a freaking warrior.

I’m not. I am a little depressed that all we got were tooltip corrections but I am loving p/d now more than my d/d signet build.

Combat in PvE is:

Champion: “I’m going to hit you with my 1-hit melee attack.”
Me: “Nope. LOLOLOLOLOLOL”

Combat in WvW is like:

Some Guy: “I am going to esplode you in your face.”

Me: “Nope. Enjoy your cooldowns. LOLOLOLOL”

Some Guy: “No matter. I haz range.”

Me: (poof)

Some Guy: “kitten ”

Me: "Tell me how my caltrops taste. (covers Some Guy in caltrops)

Some Guy: “Ow! Ow! They taste like bleeding!”

Me: “Lolz0rz”

Does anyone ever wonder that there is maybe the slight possibility that they… you know, suck?

MOAR torment too plox?

Ellen Kiel is a dedicated service woman who helps protect the very city you, your friends and family spend almost each and every day in.

Evon Gnashblade is a selfish trader sits in his Trading Post eating up all of your hard-earned gold with 15% fees and small overpriced cosmetic items.

Ellen Kiel helped support the settlers of Southsun in their time of need… for free.

Evon Gnashblade funded the Consortium who enslaved the settlers of Southsun Cove regardless of the massive karka infestation’s presence and he did it with your hard-earned gold.

Ellen Kiel loves small children.

Evon Gnashblade eats small children.

Ellen Kiel is part of the Lionguard. A vote for her is a vote for protection, peace, sanctuary, lower travel costs and the truth behind the devastating accident that nearly annihilated a city’s worth of asura.

Evon Gnashblade is suspected to be part of the Flame Legion. A vote for him is a vote for eating children, the sinking of Orr, the attack on Ascalon, the army of Zhaitan and the death of Tybalt Leftpaw and the many soldiers that died and turned while fighting the Risen forces.

Its obvious that Evon Gnashblade does not have your best interests at heart.

Vote for Ellen Kiel.

I like how warriors got the most buffs this patch.

People in WvW have gotten a little wiser as of late. instead of going full glass you see more hybrids and bunkers. Instead of going full glasscannon, you might wanna get survivability down pat first. Thieves have been nerfed almost every patch due to the large amounts of scrubby bandwagoners crying over backstabs. As of now everyone is going d/p for the blinding powder > Heartseeker to stealth combo. It’s pretty effective.

Engels.8537:

Everybody (except zacchary because he’s… well he’s zacchary) understood that we are talking about d/p thieves, right?

The same bullkitten applies with d/p.

Engels.8537:

Zacchary.6183:

There is this thing called the “camera” which can move 360 degrees and it shows you things like that thief that just stealthed about 2-3k yards away who is trying to land that backstab.

There is also this thing called a “wall” that you can stand on and watch people die while you bask in the quasi-safety of your keep. Not only that, there is a great chance the thief won’t be able to hit you from there.

I don’t know if you guys heard of them.

I’m glad this guy does not play my main class, without any doubt he’s the worst lawyer I ever saw,

Oh yes, I forgot. We can trait for the 15,000 range shadowstep-steal that bypasses walls and kills the Keep Lord in one hit. I can also snipe you from across the map with my 90,000 range Insta-death stealth shot. Let’s not forget about the near infinite amount of walls I destroyed with my infiniteclusterbomb spam.

On another note, it would really help your cause if any of you knew what you were talking about.

Ratty.5176:

Celtic Lady.3729:

If I could flag whether or not I want to be attacked at any given time, I’d spend more time out there.

How would that work. An entire zerg could run to the place you want to take then flag on?

If that was put into effect it would probably be done in the starting area only. Doing so would also make you unable to attack other players.

Sunflowers.1729:

Zacchary.6183:

Monsoon.2589:

Zacchary.6183:

EvilSardine.9635:

Dual.8953:

17k is a number I’ve heard attached to 100nades, but I’ve yet rarely heard with BS (like once against someone without armour rare).

Say again? This backstab was done to my warrior with 1500 toughness. I had full health, no conditions like vunerability, or anything. I was just standing outside of my keep watching a few people in the distance. I died in just two hits (C&D and BS).

Thieves, how can I “L2P” if I can’t see almost 20K in damage coming?

You were standing outside the keep. You were too busy watching those few people to scan the other 260 degrees for incoming enemies. Your fault for letting you guard down and standing out in the open.

I believe you are the original thief troll forum warrior I have heard so much about…a unique combination.

You did not address the point the person was making which was about the amount of damage dealt in 2 hits and in instead blamed the person for not being prepared and ready to be attacked by an invisible foe. Further more, your original first two posts on his issue on the first page clearly seem to show a lack of maturity and a clear desire for trolling instead

And my point is they asked for it. They failed to use situational awareness. They made themselves accessible to the thief. So whether or not they got killed, it was their fault that they got ambushed. Also here is a little secret…

So what if I stealth in then do the combo (just as the stealth times out)?

Next you’re gonna tell me that ‘situational awareness’ (congratulations, you managed to slip a fancy term in) involves placing stealth traps everywhere you stand?

There is this thing called the “camera” which can move 360 degrees and it shows you things like that thief that just stealthed about 2-3k yards away who is trying to land that backstab.

There is also this thing called a “wall” that you can stand on and watch people die while you bask in the quasi-safety of your keep. Not only that, there is a great chance the thief won’t be able to hit you from there.

I don’t know if you guys heard of them.

Monsoon.2589:

Zacchary.6183:

EvilSardine.9635:

Dual.8953:

17k is a number I’ve heard attached to 100nades, but I’ve yet rarely heard with BS (like once against someone without armour rare).

Say again? This backstab was done to my warrior with 1500 toughness. I had full health, no conditions like vunerability, or anything. I was just standing outside of my keep watching a few people in the distance. I died in just two hits (C&D and BS).

Thieves, how can I “L2P” if I can’t see almost 20K in damage coming?

You were standing outside the keep. You were too busy watching those few people to scan the other 260 degrees for incoming enemies. Your fault for letting you guard down and standing out in the open.

I believe you are the original thief troll forum warrior I have heard so much about…a unique combination.

You did not address the point the person was making which was about the amount of damage dealt in 2 hits and in instead blamed the person for not being prepared and ready to be attacked by an invisible foe. Further more, your original first two posts on his issue on the first page clearly seem to show a lack of maturity and a clear desire for trolling instead

And my point is they asked for it. They failed to use situational awareness. They made themselves accessible to the thief. So whether or not they got killed, it was their fault that they got ambushed. Also here is a little secret…