I’m leveling a monk in WoW as we speak and queuing for dungeons as they open up. I have never once spammed chat for healers or tanks. I use the excellent LFG tool and it does all the work. It takes far less time to put a group together under the trinity than it does in GW2. I’m averaging 3 minute queues as DPS. This is a marketing BS to sell a system other than the trinity and it simply isn’t true.
Yeah with the LFG tool sure.
Wait till you start pugging raids, or raiding in general… enjoy the BS there. There’s LOADS of it. (And I mean, even if you get into a guild and get a constant raid spot, think about your position in the guild in relation to guild leader/raiders and those that are not… there’s loads of social (and drama) bullkitten aside from just class roles).
3 minute queues… that’s cute. It’s instant for a tank and/or healer. Wait till you hit max lvl… lol…
Well…
Those are some good changes to thief…
Instead of getting a massive nerf bat almost every patch, this one is a little one.
I’m also going to guess that the more good things, means you will only be nerfing one thief skill in this patch as a opposed to several.
Good changes! Me Gusta.
(Though, we could say… that… it’s a 40% nerf to choking gas, which is more MASSIVE than a 33% buff we once got….)
Straight up, bad idea.
Feline Grace is used widely, not just for S/D… Even if the change you suggested would go through… it will be a giant nerf for a lot of builds, and it will effect every mode (WvW/PvE/sPvP) in a rather negative way too… (but, hey, for S/D it might be considered a trade off… for everything else a giant nerf bat)
Though, this has been already been brought up a few times that thieves are too evasive… so I wouldn’t be surprised if they do get nerfed again…
Okay, that’s just a hilarious mindset Deimos. One does not simply stun lock a thief.
well, maybe only against just the minority few thieves who do not have excellent latency (average 200ms – 400ms ping instead of 20ms – 100ms) and do not have jedi reflexes perhaps?
please do remember that not everyone have the same hand eye coordination motor skills and lightning fast reflexes.
so, i would like to rephrase that as “one does not simply stun lock a decently skilled thief” there you go.
Heya guys,i cannot believe some of the nerf requests,ppl are so lazy they dont even try to understand why they died.My chars are necro and ranger and i play lot of wvw and of course i met a lot of thiefs,some i killed(the noob ones)some i didnt(the decent ones).But i dont start to blame a whole class for my lack of skill thats just kittened.i actually whisper a good thief after he killed me and ask him for advice and if he wants to duel me and most of them are really awesome dudes and do just that.once it took me 7 tries to kill a d/p thief(i suck that bad)but thx for the poor guys patience i managed and learned something so ppl should try to put a bit of effort and actually try and stop kittening and qq.ohh and btw i started a thief too and its so hard compared to my necro and ranger i was totally lost in pvp,so ppl should try playing a thief and see the lvl of skill requiered to be decent.
Not everyone is like you, some would rather get the class nerfed down.
That’s not a bug, it’s a feature. Hard to Catch triggers on CC and Tow Line is a form of self-CCs. Now try it with Stability, which will cancel the effect of Tow Line but still trigger Hard to Catch because you targeted yourself with CC.
The fact that you can trigger an anti-stun trait yourself just goes to show exactly how bad they are.
Guys…
STOP, don’t nerf warriors…
What am i going to re-roll to?
Nerf thieves instead, there’s plenty room left (just pick a skill off the top of your head).
I can’t wait for the next set of thief nerf because of you kitteners …
Makes every patch that much more exciting… never know what will get nerfed next (i didn’t expect the up coming choking gas nerf…)
I think what’s being said in the video is relevant…
I don’t know what’s being said, it’s just an other rant. At least now I know what a rant actually sounds like.
Quit honestly, I think the gaming community (in general, across different games) is just going down hill… (increase in toxicity, increase in causals (and cater to them), among other issues…).
I disagree, Tomb Raider was great, decent story, very well executed, I’d like more of it and there will be more of it, no matter how much you don’t like it. I can always load up some FPS or racer if I want smooth play without fancy graphics and story.
…whatever happened to FPS games like ut2k4 and Q3, where you would have to run around to find your weapon of choice…? Now there’s classes…
They should stick to their genre, improve on it and don’t try to fish in all ponds at the same time.
True it is rant. Isn’t Tomb Raider single player…?
Permastealth thief is dead. They are just annoying now. Once they’ve stacked invis they have no initiative to actually open more than once. If you really think they are bad now and not just annoying you need to spend some more time fighting them.
Sorry… it’s permastealth… it’s perma… you can’t get rid of it. it will always be around because it’s perma…
I think what’s being said in the video is relevant…
Quit honestly, I think the gaming community (in general, across different games) is just going down hill… (increase in toxicity, increase in causals (and cater to them), among other issues…).
This is on a tangent here but… whatever happened to FPS games like ut2k4 and Q3, where you would have to run around to find your weapon of choice…? Now there’s classes…
Complexity of trees/traits/skills in games have gone down…. WoW pre-pandaland vs post-pandaland … d1/d2 vs d3… gw1 (skills) vs gw2 …
Wonder how league will get dumbed down (though it’s already compared to dota2)…
3 pages and nobody came up with EHP? Goood troll bait, gooooood.
….
EHP is over this community’s head, trust me… They only see what’s in front of them. And for now that will do… That term will just confuse them.
The problem that will become if people start thinking about this term would be the same problem as trying to find out DPS in this game… (never mind EDPS either) And at this point there’s no real (magical website) to “correctly” measure/quantify it either.
Who the hell wants to play a game you always win? Tell them to have fun on their no skill, didn’t win anything worth mentioning victory and then go play with cool people.
:/ Now why would you crush how people are brought up…
Access to boons… can you please list how and which boons the thief has access to? Please.
You’re trying to justify everything by saying “stealth”… good job.
… they don’t need to use any defensive gear as they are simply defensive enough even if they go FULL zerker thanks to the Mechanics and skills they have.
Thief = Stealth, Mobility, High Burst, Boons
High burst is implied to be a defensive mechanic… How? explain that please?
Regen, Haste, Quickness, Stability, Swiftness, Might, Vigor, Fury. They can also steal that item (Mesmers i think) that steals Boons as well. So sure while they don’t have a huge amount of access to them, they still have a decent amount considering they have Stealth, Blinks, Evades and such as well.
Again trying to justify it by mentioning stealth…
Thanks for the list, can you provide ways in which the thief can acquire those boons?
High burst can be a defensive mechanic. It forces people onto the defenisve.
Yeah kind of valid, but you have to be on the offensive, rather then defensive to do high burst…
it’s kinda like “i will support you, by killing everything that can harm you”
Perma stealth…perma? Its Not perma! If you really want to get rid of easymode thieves aka d/p “ineednotargettostealth” remove dat infusion of shadows trait. Dagger offhand doesnt need it, only d/p. Just to make it clear..i Do Not want d/p thieves to be nerfed. Just wanted to share this idea to you “perma perma Evrything dudes”.
You can’t fix the “perma”… It’s “perma”
:| “Perma”-QQ-ers are perma… can’t fix, sorry.
Thieves are now officially stuck with perma-stealth since it’s perma :| aint nothing gonna change that…
Wait… what? “Simply defensive”, “High Burst” is defensive?… What?
The only thing i can think of what you’re tying to imply is… They use their high burst to kill the target so they don’t get hurt too much… Is that what you’re trying to get at here?
Possibly the only reason to go full zerker as a thief is if you go full tank (can there be such a thing?) your damage will be that of a critter and if you go anywhere in between zerker and full tank you will see a good decline in your damage but a very little (if any) increase in survivability. Essentially you will be dropping dead just as if you had zerker on but doing less damage then in a zerker… (For reference I’m mainly talking about WvW, as in sPvP I run condi p/d).
Boons? can you give me a list? Swiftness, and might? What else? Aegis? Protection?
Does might count into your “High Burst”… are you trying to say the same thing with it?
Stealth is probably the only valid thing there in terms of their defensive mechanics…
Maybe mobility depending on what you mean by it too…
You can’t kill someone if you are dead. Thief burst (very safe from stealth) is very good at that. Any boon is good for you, they all work in different ways. Plus, they can steal other peoples boons as well, that works BOTH ways seeing as it removes them from the target thus making them weaker and giving them to you making you stronger.
Of course it is not as strong as the stealth they have, which is why i didnt put it at the top but it is there. Of course Stealth is top of the list when it comes to defense.
I would count boons as being good defense on any class that has access to them. Of course their are better ones but they are all very useful.
Access to boons… can you please list how and which boons the thief has access to? Please.
You’re trying to justify everything by saying “stealth”… good job.
… they don’t need to use any defensive gear as they are simply defensive enough even if they go FULL zerker thanks to the Mechanics and skills they have.
Thief = Stealth, Mobility, High Burst, Boons
High burst is implied to be a defensive mechanic… How? explain that please?
@Prysin
Hey, goodluck with that. By all means let them make that change. I would be curious to see what happens… if you do turn out to be correct and nothing really gets worse, awesome, fixed the stealth spamming issue.
Funny you mentioned that…
The skill level, or the ability to PvP (as player versus player combat in general) of players in sPvP and WvW are on two different worlds… Yet both are PvP…
Sometimes I wonder if people playing WvW ever tried to sPvP…
while we at it can we also remove invul, blocks, aegis etc.? just to make it fair..tnks
LOL everytime i see thief thread this guy has to show up to protect it.
Thief in spvp dont need perm steath to survive. i dont see why in wvw they cant do.
ofc unless they are not as skill as …
i don’t defend perma stealth, i am all up to nerf that (i pvp mostly actually)
the problem is, the suggestions ppl make would completely ruin the class/entire weapon sets in pvp and pve as well
as a side note, last perma stealth thief i ran into ended up in stealth trap…you can paint the rest :P
To add to that…
Every suggestion to nerf/change stealth, has been ONLY about stealth… It’s like stealth is on it’s own little planet, and if they change it, it won’t have any other impact other then their intended change on the thief…
:| It’s like… well let me cut off your hand because I want to stop you from typing this B.S. … Well if that was to happen, not only would you stop typing, but a lot of your other aspects of life will change… (how you eat, how you open doors, how you dry yourself after a shower, how you drink…. But hey, I just proposed that so you could stop typing)
… but that they jump in and out of stealth constantly breaking target….
Which isn’t “permastealth”… :/ I guess “permastealth” is catchy and they attribute it to what you’re saying… Kind of ticks me off since it shows they don’t really understand what permanent means and what the thief is doing… Rather it shows that they’re annoyed, frustrated, and irritated enough to QQ (not you Dark, just people really DO miss that)
Honestly, the only three professions i feel should be moved around is
Mesmer down to Low HP
Ranger to High HP (to offset their lower DPS thanks to pets) Thief to Medium HP (at the cost of stealth only stacking twice)
It’s like people think stealth is godly and brings immortality or something…
The fact that people use it, to survive, is due to how you can’t (or you can do a half kitten job) survive without it…. if there was some balance that allowed you to survive outside of stealth just as well as (supposedly) inside of stealth… Right now, there really isn’t a balance between surviving with stealth or without it…
Give medium HP to a thief while only allowing to stack stealth twice… LOL, you really hate the class don’t you?
I have a level 80 Mesmer, no Bias here. The problem with Mesmer along with Warrior, Thief and even Engineer to an extent is that they don’t need to use any defensive gear as they are simply defensive enough even if they go FULL zerker thanks to the Mechanics and skills they have.
Thief = Stealth, Mobility, High Burst, Boons
…
Wait… what? “Simply defensive”, “High Burst” is defensive?… What?
The only thing i can think of what you’re tying to imply is… They use their high burst to kill the target so they don’t get hurt too much… Is that what you’re trying to get at here?
Possibly the only reason to go full zerker as a thief is if you go full tank (can there be such a thing?) your damage will be that of a critter and if you go anywhere in between zerker and full tank you will see a good decline in your damage but a very little (if any) increase in survivability. Essentially you will be dropping dead just as if you had zerker on but doing less damage then in a zerker… (For reference I’m mainly talking about WvW, as in sPvP I run condi p/d).
Boons? can you give me a list? Swiftness, and might? What else? Aegis? Protection?
Does might count into your “High Burst”… are you trying to say the same thing with it?
Stealth is probably the only valid thing there in terms of their defensive mechanics…
Maybe mobility depending on what you mean by it too…
I’m okay with Necro having 18k health, since it has light armor. Warrior, on the other hand, is a problem.
See…
Going by that, and I’ve thought about it too, would mean:
18k (max) health for Mesmer/Ele/Necro
15k (mid) health for Thieves/Engineers/Rangers
13k (min) health for Warrior/Guardian
The reason Necro is okay with 18k health ISN’T because what armor type it has but because how very little defense it has. Mesmer would be unstoppable if it had that much health, same goes for Ele. Both of them have way more defense than what the Necro has and that is why Necro needs to have more health.
15k (max) health for Warrior/Necro
14k (mid) health for Ele/Engineers/Rangers
13k (min) health for Mesmer/Thief/Guardian
That is how i would see it, though it would be a nerf to Necromance, i think that can be fixed by a few tweaks. Warrior doesnt need any due to how much Passive Regen, Mobility, CC and everything that it has access to
Mesmer, Thief i think would need a little nerf to counter the fact they would have more health. Guardian a little off its defense to against counter the more health they would have.
Ele, i think needs the health buff after getting so many nerfs and the fact they are forced into getting Vit due to the fact they would melt against pretty much all classes otherwise.
;) I like how you swapped Ele and mesmer’s tiers… Not even going to touch on other mentioned classes as I don’t want to start a kitten storm… (but feel free to add a thief nerf to the nerf wish list in my signature! We get at least one nerf request each week!)
Ugh at the very end of my post I said
“And they can keep that… just that they now have to balance it out via traits… while trying to make every class not feel the same as another…
Yeah it’s hard… It’s also amusing to watch…”
See, the discussion was/is originally about base health (kitten everything else)… but now we’re getting into who has better passive regen, who has better “defense” (whatever that word means… armor? skills? boons? play skill?)…
Essentially you can really leave the tiers how they are now and balance it out via traits/skills….
(I guess the core issue is the balance in general… stemming from the need to balance traits/skills because of different health/armor pools)
:| Actually, personally I would promote buffing the lower health pools to 14/16/18 (someone already mentioned this combo)…. I wouldn’t consider touching anything outside of that (like nerf something down because of the increase in health)…
I’m okay with Necro having 18k health, since it has light armor. Warrior, on the other hand, is a problem.
See…
Going by that, and I’ve thought about it too, would mean:
18k (max) health for Mesmer/Ele/Necro
15k (mid) health for Thieves/Engineers/Rangers
13k (min) health for Warrior/Guardian
Pretty much like reversing the health/armor tiers…
At the same time, having played other MMO’s (WoW)… Warriors (archetypes) generally do get highest health and highest armor, primarily so that they can “tank” if need be… Spell casters typically get the least amount of health and armor, because they tend to not be up-front in combat… Hunters/Rogues are either in the middle or closer to spell casters, typically again they don’t have to engage in up-front combat OR their up-front combat is really quick. This is typically in a system that has some sort of a trinity…
GW2 doesnt exactly have a trinity (aside from what did they say… CC/Damage/??). So that kind of balancing is not needed to start with… since an Ele can take aggro off of a warrior just as “easily” as the warrior can take aggro off of the ele… “Everyone” can tank/support/cc and even heal (in some cases the group too)… BUT it seems like they would still like to maintain the health paradigm from a typical trinity system… for some odd reason (who knows why…? I guess it makes sense that these giant 8 foot warriors are beefy and do have a lot of health compared to the frail ele’s that spend time reading books)
And they can keep that… just that they now have to balance it out via traits… while trying to make every class not feel the same as another…
Yeah it’s hard… It’s also amusing to watch…
…
My argument is that if this base-gap in HP was reduced to say 13k, 15k and 18k base HP then the devs could also go about limiting some of these aforementioned extremes and move everyone a bit more towards a middle ground.
…
More like 13,15,17 … just to keep it evenly spread, 2k apart each… Also possibly switch classes around between the three tiers… Considering also, base armor is higher for heavies than it is for meds or lights…. Essentially warrior at this point is getting the best of both worlds, highest base health and highest base armor. (And let’s not go into damage…)
At this point the game is no where near balanced… But it’s fun watching dev’s try and balance it… how they balance it… the QQ’s that come out of it… the whole process has become more amusing than playing the game itself…
I don’t oppose any ranger buff/fixes… because truly in at least sPvP they get wrecked by EVERYTHING…
:P I am jelly of their +1200 range though, that’s useful in WvW… wish thieves had their 1200 range back…
The only somewhat annoying ranger spec, and it’s not because it’s hard to deal with… is the one that uses a lot of spirits… :/ It’s annoying to tab to a spirit or to target a spirit by accident and start attacking it. That’s about it though…
Hope you guys get some dev love…
Cleansing Ire by itself can grant more condition removal per second than a Necro with every single condition removal skill available to him, mostly due to the putrid mark nerf.
Necro doesn’t just cleanse but can also cleanse and transfer. Transfers and just a raw cleanse are different. You can kill people with a necros condi tranfers.
A warrior can just kill people by hitting them really really hard.
While still having highest armor, and a good amount of health being a glass cannon.
Oh god that’s pretty much prefect of what the gamer community is like… He didn’t cover the toxicity in there though… that also seems to be leaking (4chan…? CoD? WoW?)…
…
just because warriors are popular does not necessarily mean they are dominant.
Why are they so popular?
o.O I’m in no way suggesting a nerf (nor would I know what to nerf) to warriors (I re-rolled a warrior too, why would I want it nerfed?). A buff to all other class would be more welcomed, to open up new roles/uses in some cases…
We will have to wait to see the full extent of the upcoming changes before we break out into a QQ fest. Apparently Thieves can expect a range of QoL improvements (fix for Last Refuge).
Until then we better zip it.
yeaaaah that hard to catch was an amazing change yo….
;) I hear there will be more good things for the thief to come…
More improvements on hard to catch!
Why: I went afk in the middle of EB to make a sandwich and I came back to find myself dead and a Thief dancing on my corpse. This is clear evidence that the whole class is unacceptably OP and requires immediate deletion and replacement with the sandwichmancer.
I like sandwiches.
On the contrary, I went afk on my thief to eat a sandwich and came back 30 minutes later and wasn’t dead! Clearly thief is OP!
Next time be sure to /dance then go eat a sandwich. Come back to bodies piled around you and bags everywhere.
Or you could just scream…
“MOM SANDWICH… kitten!”
(sandwich replaced meatloaf…)
Me Gusta.,ppl are so lazy they dont even try to understand why they died.My chars are necro and ranger and i play lot of wvw and of course i met a lot of thiefs,some i killed(the noob ones)some i didnt(the decent ones).But i dont start to blame a whole class for my lack of skill thats just kittened.i actually whisper a good thief after he killed me and ask him for advice and if he wants to duel me and most of them are really awesome dudes and do just that.once it took me 7 tries to kill a d/p thief(i suck that bad)but thx for the poor guys patience i managed and learned something so ppl should try to put a bit of effort and actually try and stop kittening and qq.ohh and btw i started a thief too and its so hard compared to my necro and ranger i was totally lost in pvp,so ppl should try playing a thief and see the lvl of skill requiered to be decent.
Now there’s classes…