ArenaNet is very adamant that skill splits are too much work to be possible.
You mean they have made a business decision based on profit margins which is totally valid but lets not beat around the bush. SPVP makes very little money for them and there for gets the least consideration for balance concerns. That’s why we see stuff like DH getting gutted despite already being mediocre. WvWvW Zerglings were complaining.
Just like tornado on ele is game changing.
Moa was broken in pvp even before chronomancer. The only counter to it is reflect and it leaves you as a free kill for 10 seconds. It requires no real skill but gives your team a huge advantage.
Polymorphs are bullkitten and overpowered period end of story. If you get MOA’D its pretty much a death sentence and your right it involves very little skill. It should be totally rewored for pvp only at the very least but A-net doesn’t have the guts as usual. It’s a crap skill and the game would be better without it.
I have the same problem but it is easily overcome by trio q with other good MMR players.
MatchMaking should put 10-9 togethers vs 10-9 togethers like it was season 1 ranked.
10 or 9 should never be put with/against 3 or less.
I don’t think season one worked that way. It MMR averaged teams that is not the same as saying on a scale of 1-10 both teams had all 9’s and 10’s. Lets make a theoretical scale of 1-5 for player ability. I believe that season one would say 3,3,3,3,3 is the same as five,5,2,1,1 or at least the matcher would green light that matchup. Surely the team with the two 1’s is at a huge disadvantage yet the teams average are the same. I’m out of here if we go back to MMR averaging personally. I dont wan’t to be forced to group with anyone outside of a fairly tight MMR window.
A lot of people weren’t using Moa if I remember correctly before the expansion in spvp. Really Mesmers in general were kind of out of favor the last six months or so before the expansion. Chronomancer is what brought them back.
I have two words for these types of posts Stockholme Syndrome. We are going to have another pvp season where the majority of the player base plays 3 or 4 classes because they are clearly the strongest. By all means keep shaving away. Taking 6 seconds off MOA totally balances the class yup. In another three months, which would make 9 months of Mesmers being op, maybe we will make some more changes to them. As much as I complain I just adapt and play whats strong in the end but I personally find A-nets methods to balancing totally lacking.
That’s why torment whould [sic] be the perfect condition, because someone moving with chill + torment deserves to die.
The big problem with DC now is that we are forced to play curse for a better trait’s synergie (bleed duration etc) before patch we could play curse for more condi pressure or spite more physical damage pressure.
The damage in reapers shroud is really strong. The only left counterplay against it (like many people told you in this forum) is kiting the reaper when he is in reapers shroud. Now you want reaper to throw a condition, that has doubled damage if you are moving, like candy?
Kiting and running away from reaper is meant as the counter for reapers. Anet want you to stay away from them. You can’t punish running away from reapers because of that.
Thats backward logic. You can make that argument for any class that can put out high dps and a lot of those builds have cc to keep you in place. With stability being nerfed for reapers and this change how do we stay on any target for long?
What a joke. This company doesn’t really care. The MOA fix is totally unacceptable. Why don’t these geniuses every come here to discuss these changes? Because they are cowards. I used to play Dark Age of Camelot back in the day and love Mythic or hate them there devs would lay out in detail the thought process behind balance changes on the forums and take feedback and sometimes even act on the feedback. And they dealt with plenty of abuse or just ignored it so I don’t want to here that they won’t come here more because of abuse. Suck it up. These guys take feedback from a small group of pros and don’t even act on it 90% of the time and then they put out these lame patches with no explanation. Season three is going to be anther joke with people glomming onto a handful of classes while the rest just get ignored. I am amazed it surprises me anymore.
Don’t know if they will be meta but they are better then I thought they were still after the big nerfs after giving it a chance and playing with it a bit. Probably still as good as anything but Mesmer, Ele, and Rev.
If you zerg too much the enemy team can easily out rotate you and keep 2 points while you are all busy only winning one point.
But every game and every skill level is different. Generally the lower the skill level the bigger the team fights. Depends on comps too.
Of course at super low skill levels (hot join) you will get people just dueling 1v1 off point too. So it really varies…
Disagree with this. The lower the skill level the smaller the team fights are because you have people doing stuff like dueling on side points, fighting in the middle of nowhere, or chasing secondary objectives where they make no sense to do so.
Why does it have to be just DH. I don’t want to play my guardian with a bow and traps. Thats the problem its like lets make x elite more competitive instead of lets make Guardians more competitve. Haven’t they sold enough copies of HoT? There are going to be more expansions with more elite specs. Is this the game that is going to be played going forward class x is only good as the last elite spec they kitten out in an expansion?
They have worked a ton on the matchmaking believe it or not and I don’t see any magic bullets coming in that direction. I am sure they can improve it some but there will no magical revelations from heaven imo. I bad mouth these guys a lot but they are actually pretty smart people and have been working on this for quite awhile now. The answer to me is stuff like allowing people to lose divisions. They need to decide whether they want leagues to actually be really competitive and a reflection of skill or not. The problem is there are a lot of people that think advancement in a league should be mostly grindable and it a significant number and A-net doesn’t want to kitten them off. As long as there are competiting interests its not going to be a good system. A-net needs to decide whether the goal is to make this as competitive and accurate as possible or allow the greatest ammount of people feel like they can advance to ruby and beyond.
They don’t know what they are doing the game gets less and less diverse as we go on. Guardians are complete garbage against meta classes but they’ll probably tell you that Guardians are “in a good spot.” They made all the elite specs too strong and then nerfed some of them way more then others and refuse to buff any of the old traits and abilities significantly. It’s all horsekitten.
How do you propose capping the number of legendary players at 500? Whats to stop people from getting to legendary and never playing again during a season. They way leagues currently work I don’t see how it could be done. Also, your matchmaking suggestion really sounds like russian roulette to me. Quite a bit of luck involed if you are going to grab 10 players and put them onto two teams with zero considerations. For that to work those 10 players would have to be very similar in skill level. Even at the highest level of spvp we frequently see some players that are significantly better then some of there teammates.
What the hell are you on about? Doesn’t bring anything to the team? Well of course it doesn’t if you don’t play it like that.
There are a lot of selfish classes out there and a lot of selfish builds, that’s doesn’t mean anything. Your comparisons with thief and dh are way off too. The absolutely only thing that thief does better than warr(and any class at that matter) is mobility – it has less sustain, less CC, less dps and less team utility. DH has way less CC and sustian than a war has, and after the nerf bat, it’s even more useless outside of teamfights.
Want to bring something to the team? Play this build.
It can be tweaked for more damage, less cleanse, depending on the enemy comp.
You cleanse 12 condis from your allies. Not even ele does that. It’s madness. While doing about 1560 heal per shout. That’s roughly 6200 heal to all allies. Not to mention the added bonus of fury, might, fear and endurance from the actual shout effects. Plus two of them are pretty spamable. And with the amount of healing, cleanse and regen you have, you’ll outlast most teamfights. It’s actually a challenge to die with this build.
Sure, you might say the build does kittenty damage, but it’s far from kittenty. You can stack up some nice burning and with a well timed fear and headbutt, those ticks are there to stay. And when you’re opponent is low and vulnerable, sigil of intelligence lets you get that sweet big crit with a well timed final thrust.
I know it’s fun to say war sucks. But they’ll keep buffing him until we have a new necro. And then we’ll get another round of QQ and nerfs. Not saying war is 100% fine, but he’s way better than last season.
Shoutbow is not the best build available to warriors are the moment.
More… Llamas?But seriously what would you like to see on that vendor?
Serious question… Why are Mini Llamas able to be purchased from the League Vendor? They were the only thing that we could use as “Prestige” to show off our skill level, how well we did in ESL/AG tournaments, etc. So now every casual player has a llama…
At least this is how I feel.
Why do you believe more people got to legendary in season 2 then season 1? Not that I am necessarily disagreeing I just don’t have access to any kind of raw data that would point to that nor has A-net said more people made it in season 2. If you think about the changes they made to matchmaking I would imagine less people made it in season 2 because in season one with MMR averaging teams and the system trying to force you into 50/50 outcomes over time it seemed very possible to me for quite bad players with a little luck and a lot of grinding to be carried to legendary.
I feel like the build Tarcis posted, which was around and used before, with some minor changes based on preference is the way to go. LB is a must imo because you are guaranteed the adrenal health procs. That’s the main thing that has a chance of making warriors viable the extra sustain from adrenal health.
Amulets are nothing but a symptom of problems elsewhere. For example Celestial amulet. The only reason this amulet was a problem is because of how op condition damage and buff stacking is. They can’t balance there game correctly so to compensate for that they try to restrict certain stat combinations. It’s sad and they should be embarrassed because as I’ve said many times I’ve played a lot of MMORPGs and this has the worst balance easily and its not surprising as they involve the player base in there decisions less then anyone I can remember of any game that started out pay to play and of course no public test server.
Trying out new builds and practicing is not the problem. You can do that and still try to play the right way. Like half the people in unranked are complete beginner level players that don’t know the basics. Thats main problem half your teammates not knowing what they are doing dieing in ten seconds and putting you in uneven fights all match long. You can’t even really practice because fights are so awful on average you win in 10 seconds or die in ten seconds not even good for practice. Need to have a place for the more serious player that expects a minimum level of compentency to practice in offseason.
I mostly liked the matchmaking for S2 but its pretty obvious they will be tweaking matchmaking yet again for season 3 at least in some way. Any reason we haven’t had any info yet or have I missed something somewhere? Surely they must know most of what they are going to do by now. The earlier stuff like this is released the more time there is to elicit feedback.
There are none that will allow you to compete evenly with people your skill level imo. Sure you will be able to beat people that are worse then you and if you are very skilled that could be quite a few people but I always look at it from a perspective of how good I would do against someone at least as good as I am. That’s why playing something meta is so important because it will allow you do better then anyone your skill level playing something non meta and even some people that are better then you that play non meta. A personal example I played a Guardian in season 1 and a Chillomancer season 2. It was much easier to win playing the Chillomancer.
I think most people who are complaining are the ones that got teamed in ranked with the best players because of high mmr & against full newbie player teams which they steam rolled and had no kinda challenge, and got a little bit too used to that. Now you can see how it feels to be put with new & not so great players sometimes, its harder to win. But like everyone was saying to me when I complained about horrible matchmaking in ranked….. if you l2p you can carry and win. >.<
Nonsense and stop feeling sorry for yourself and envious. Those two emotions cause 99% of the world’s problems.
Most of these people don’t care. They are just happy that if they play a strong class/build and it wasn’t nefed then everything is right with the world. It doesn’t matter to them that these kind of severe nerfs, while other powerful things are left untouched, shows how stupid the devs involved in balancing are. Paging Karl and Evan.
No it doesn’t bother me I’ve payed about $100 dollars for three years plus of gaming counting the original box plus expansion. I’ve had my problems with A-net but the cost of the experience is not one of them. You numbnuts that think you are entitled to free games or $40.00 or $50.00 buys you unlimited content forever I don’t get one bit because these games cost a lot to develop and maintain. Although apparently there is enough of you that some 75 year old commie clown almost got the nomination for president of a major political party. When you get a little older or actually accumulate some assests you’ll understand that nothing is free and that you are entitled to nothing but life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.
The funny thing is strong AoE is good for mass pvp as it can counter skill less zerging. WvWvW in this game really is the sick cousin of great Mass pvp games like Dark Age of Camelot and Warhammer.
Most people would give up long before 650 games if all they were doing was winning 50% of there games without getting legedary. Also, we are talking about simulations here if you were really unlucky you could end up never getting to Legendary. What do you propose by the way to make it more skill based? This is only like the third or fourth time you have floated this kitten .
Why do non-pro league players care about meta comps? Baffles me…
Why because it shows you what’s the strongest. Keep playing what’s weak though and then complain when you don’t have success. That’s not aimed at you personally just at anyone that plays non meta and then wonders why they struggle.
To be fair they don’t know what to do with any class because they don’t listen to the people that play the game the most which is the playerbase. There the experts even though they barely play there own game.
Obtena and Nike you’re both kinda talking out your kitten. Obtena I’ve been over how you don’t seem to get it in an older thread. Guards aren’t in a sweet spot unless you consider stale, slightly mouldy bread sweet. They don’t fit their class role, and they don’t cover anything else worth writing home over.
Nike settle down. Some reactions may be overblown but you aren’t very calm yourself. Reducing the base cooldown of F3 by 15 seconds is like getting 3 points higher than your previous of 30% on a standardized test. 5 aegises on a 75 second cooldown is lame. 5 aegises on a 60 second cooldown is less lame. LB2 WAS the damage of LB. Sprinkling damage on high cooldown CC’s won’t fill the void. The hammer/staff walls do 0 damage on high cooldown. It’s not even rev specifically as a basis for comparison: other classes can now do what we were/are doing but better.
Obtena is a noted contrarian Troll. They would tell you Guardians were fine if A-net gave them one utility and all you could do was autoattack. If our sweet spot is being the worst spvp class in the game , certainly no better then bottom 3 , you can count me out and I have taken the only route which is not to play mine. Did not play one rated match with a Guardian this past pvp season. I have 100% moved on from this class. I don’t know what Nike’s deal probably a bored Troll as well or some kind of White Knight riding to the defense of A-net.
I feel as a class we’ve just been neglected for the past 3 years.
Eh, its not so much neglect as its the ONLY profession in the game that consistently works right and turns in use/success numbers that hover around the midrange. They nerfed one over-performing skill hard and handed out a huge number of small buffs that make you more involved (more buttons off cooldown more often, more willingness to punch the big buttons early). That’s the profile of a class that’s mostly on track. Beyond that we’re on the exact same page about reviewing our forgotten underperformers.
Guys, GIVE UP. There is no reason to even try any more.
Would you? Would you PLEASE? If you don’t have the wherewithal to operate a Guardian/Dragonhunter under these terms then yes, absolutely: GET OUT. GET OUT NOW. because nothing will do a better job of getting some other profession nerfed than a mass exodus to the flavor of the month ((looking at you, Herald)) and I’m sure all the people over in the class you migrate to will be so happy to have a pack of turn-coats stinking up their boards.
And maybe if a few of our more cheese-reliant brethren for whom having to use the whole tool bar is just too hard step out, then maybe the Dev’s will bump the Guardian up the que to look at our diversity (and the lack there of…) issues because there won’t be this cloud of no-talent trap-monkeys skewing our numbers.
No they won’t. They probably thought these buffs were significant. They don’t know what there doing. I don’t know how long you have been playing this class but I have been for three and a half years. The class is easiest at its lowest point ever effectiveness wise and A-net has shown know willingness to buff non-elite aspect of guardians. This is a time to panic. As for the trap monkey’s they were never that strong to being with. They weren’t meta in pvp in season 1 or season 2. There is zero reason to play a guardian in SPVP. ZERO.
They were a fun goof years ago when they were basically invulnerable but never anything more then a parlor trick and now totally worthless. A-net doesn’t care about guardians we are in a “good spot”.
They don’t respond to stuff like this. Be a lickspittle though and talk about how great it was to be in a spvp match with them and how it shows they want to learn about whats needs to be done yada yada yada and they’ll respond in 2 seconds.
You don’t balance classes. You either make them op or unviable.
Scrapper and Reaper were too strong and instead of adjusting those classes you make them pretty much unviable.
Druid and Eles sustain seems entirely overpowered now after Reapers are gone, Mesmer didn’t even got touched while Revenant nearly remains the same as before.
Next patch you probably will kill two other classes while making others overpowered.
You are just unable to find a healthy midway.
Killed reaper by nerf to chill skill? Please be patient, reaper was very difficult to kill with both conditions that can drop, corrupt, etc. It was really needed this nerf in reaper, so do not come crying that this class is bad, because it is still good.
Yeah Necros were so awesome no one played them in season one. After a truckload of nerfs they are still awesome. Seriously go away the chill damage was the thing that was making them viable. Unless they cram in some more changes before season three its going to be ludicrous the lack of diversity it’s going to be all mesmers, revenant, and elementalists.
Can’t help but feel like this is just overreaction.
You’ve been playing with the changes for a day, it’s way too soon to call failure. Especially since the 20% to Trueshot was the only nerf the Guardian got, among a few buffs. Yes Mesmer (and Rev) was unchanged when it deserved to be nerfed, but only because their grass is greener doesn’t mean that Guard is trash.
I can only imagine what you would do if you mained Warrior.
The buffs they got were to skills DH don’t even use and were ridiculous anyway. Big deal slight shaves on some cooldowns. Don’t be so kitten ed ignorant. Guardians are probably the worst class now. Just because Warriors were/are bad doesn’t mean Guardians have to be equally as bad for awhile.
Glad they take time to respond to kitten kissing but zero time discussing upcoming balance changes or getting community feed back on the hot pile they just foisted on us. This type of fawning bs is why they suck.
This was a kitten patch if you like spvp. I don’t care about the rest. No real nerfs except to Necros and for some reason DH again. Looking at the next pvp season being all mesmers, revenants, and elementalists I’m thinking. hooray for diversity!
R.I.P Guardian 4/19/2016. What’s most infuriating is they take zero feedback from anybody. The just roll out a steaming pile of kitten with no warning. The way they operate is an embarrasment. No nerfs to revenant or mesmers and yet another round of nerfs to DH with no meaningful buffs elsewhere.
No nerfs for mesmer, only buffs. ANet be trolling.
They almost never do the right thing why should we be surprised now. They don’t really involve the community in anything and they don’t have a test server to test changes and allow people to give feedback or suggestions. They are the worst devs when it comes to balance and soliciting feedback of any group of devs of any MMORPG I’ve ever played and i’ve played a lot. They are take it or leave it we know better then you types. I really haven’t seen that type of attitude since Everquest 15 years ago. I am used to playing games where the devs are on the forums a lot and explain there reasoning with the playerbase and sometimes gasp change things based on the feeback they get and sometimes even implement things that were suggested first by the playerbase. Not just roll out garbage and say “eat up” fools.
The whole patch is pretty much awful. They only nerfed two classes signficantly Reaper and Dragon Hunter while ignoring tons of problems elsewhere. Some classes got garbage fixes. This company is tone deaf and the devs involved with pvp are idiots. If the game wasn’t free since purchase and I didn’t have some really close friends playing it I would not be playing it.
Guardians are not in a good spot from my perspective as a pvp only player. One build medi DH that is not even really meta is not a good spot by a long shot. Being better then feeble classes like thief and warrior in pvp is not what I would call a good spot.
So you don’t think any nerds are coming for Mesmers Ross? I think past history would tell you there are at least minor nerfs coming for every class that is currently meta including Mesmers.
But like everyone was saying to me when I complained about horrible matchmaking in ranked….. if you l2p you can carry and win. >.<