The better change would be to make precog grant invuln so that it prevents those affected from contributing to cap point progression. The OP’s suggestions are poorly thought out because they will impact a lot of mesmer builds, like power shatter. They don’t actually target the unique problems that bunker mesmer presents.
All bunkers, including bunker mesmer, should be able to hold onto a point 1v1 or 1v2 long enough for backup to arrive (as every other bunker can). The problem with bunker mesmer right now is that it can hold the point solo nearly indefinitely against 1-2 players (depending on matchup and terrain).
Nerfing the bunker mesmer’s ability to contest a point while cycling through all of its defensive cooldowns is really the key to bringing the build down to a reasonable level. The build would still offer support to the team via timing boonshares and well drops, but would no longer be able to singlehandedly contest a point. This nerf would also be limited to bunker mesmer, which is the only chrono spec that really needs toning down in Conquest.
So the answer is to delete precog? Who would use an aoe cap giveaway utility…
Dank, it seems like you’ve only just started playing mesmer and are only familiar with the bunker build. Prior to just a few weeks ago, mesmers generally played a roaming role that did not revolve around contesting points. Precog would still be a very powerful defensive skill for that role.
Furthermore, even in the bunkering context, preventing precogged players from contesting a point just means that you’ll need to coordinate with your team to make sure someone else is still able to contest the point (which adds counterplay in that the other team can focus the players who are still contesting). This is no different from using shadow refuge, stealth gyro, or mass invis to save your teammates. They’re all powerful defensive skills that come with a tradeoff.
“You have played this character for 1,765 hours 30 minutes over the past 1,186 days. Across all characters, you have played for 6,752 hours 59 minutes over the past 1,201 days.”
I admit, I am pretty new to Mesmer. I happen to like that precog serves as a point -team bunkering tool. I find no issue with having bunkers in the game. However, I do think some things need toned down, including pre-cog, but I don’t want to see its base function change.
For the record, shatter mes is has and always will be my main <3 as well as burst thief.
Precog’s base function is to provide 3s of evade to those in its effect. That part wouldn’t change — it might even get slightly buffed if A.net changes it to grant invuln in order to prevent cap contribution.
Also, you’d still be able to use precog as a point-contesting tool, you’d just have to be more strategic about it. For example, if your teammate is getting focused, you can drop the precog so it lands on him but doesn’t affect you. That way, you protect him but are still contesting the point yourself. You and your teammate could then switch places if the enemy decides to focus you. People want more active play, this change would add that.
Invuln is not the same as evade and I don’t feel like it’s much of an uprade when you consider “on evade traits”.
You have a point with the more strategic play but I feel like an increased CD could do the same thing without gutting the skill.
I agree it is overtuned currently and there are many factors that contribute to why. I would like a broader approached looked at for ways to balance without overnerfing like past experience.
The better change would be to make precog grant invuln so that it prevents those affected from contributing to cap point progression. The OP’s suggestions are poorly thought out because they will impact a lot of mesmer builds, like power shatter. They don’t actually target the unique problems that bunker mesmer presents.
All bunkers, including bunker mesmer, should be able to hold onto a point 1v1 or 1v2 long enough for backup to arrive (as every other bunker can). The problem with bunker mesmer right now is that it can hold the point solo nearly indefinitely against 1-2 players (depending on matchup and terrain).
Nerfing the bunker mesmer’s ability to contest a point while cycling through all of its defensive cooldowns is really the key to bringing the build down to a reasonable level. The build would still offer support to the team via timing boonshares and well drops, but would no longer be able to singlehandedly contest a point. This nerf would also be limited to bunker mesmer, which is the only chrono spec that really needs toning down in Conquest.
So the answer is to delete precog? Who would use an aoe cap giveaway utility…
Dank, it seems like you’ve only just started playing mesmer and are only familiar with the bunker build. Prior to just a few weeks ago, mesmers generally played a roaming role that did not revolve around contesting points. Precog would still be a very powerful defensive skill for that role.
Furthermore, even in the bunkering context, preventing precogged players from contesting a point just means that you’ll need to coordinate with your team to make sure someone else is still able to contest the point (which adds counterplay in that the other team can focus the players who are still contesting). This is no different from using shadow refuge, stealth gyro, or mass invis to save your teammates. They’re all powerful defensive skills that come with a tradeoff.
“You have played this character for 1,765 hours 30 minutes over the past 1,186 days. Across all characters, you have played for 6,752 hours 59 minutes over the past 1,201 days.”
I admit, I am pretty new to Mesmer. I happen to like that precog serves as a point -team bunkering tool. I find no issue with having bunkers in the game. However, I do think some things need toned down, including pre-cog, but I don’t want to see its base function change.
For the record, shatter mes is has and always will be my main <3 as well as burst thief.
The better solution is to just make it not contribute to capture point control. You don’t need to change the skill in any other way.
I don’t see how removing any use of a good utility is a way to balance it.. Better to make it something still useful but has counterplay… Like aoe blocking instead of blur or aoe aegis pulsing… Something, anything, other then just making it another useless util..
The better change would be to make precog grant invuln so that it prevents those affected from contributing to cap point progression. The OP’s suggestions are poorly thought out because they will impact a lot of mesmer builds, like power shatter. They don’t actually target the unique problems that bunker mesmer presents.
All bunkers, including bunker mesmer, should be able to hold onto a point 1v1 or 1v2 long enough for backup to arrive (as every other bunker can). The problem with bunker mesmer right now is that it can hold the point solo nearly indefinitely against 1-2 players (depending on matchup and terrain).
Nerfing the bunker mesmer’s ability to contest a point while cycling through all of its defensive cooldowns is really the key to bringing the build down to a reasonable level. The build would still offer support to the team via timing boonshares and well drops, but would no longer be able to singlehandedly contest a point. This nerf would also be limited to bunker mesmer, which is the only chrono spec that really needs toning down in Conquest.
So the answer is to delete precog? Who would use an aoe cap giveaway utility…
Oh just to clarify: I’m talking about the bug where you just stop moving for no reason, nothing to do with actually being immobilized. It usually happens to me on engi, but sometimes on other professions too. I’ve really only noticed it happening since this summer, but maybe it has been going on for even longer.
Yep it’s been around since as long as I can remember (probably beta).. /sit or /dance or use a leap type skill or something like that.
It doesn’t fall just within DH but rather core Guardian as well. It’s slow, had(scepter) the worst ranged weapon in the game, still has very little access to controlling conditions to keep enemies close with the least amount of powerful passives of any profession.
You can’t make a primarily melee class have little-to-no mobility with no way to keep up with your enemy, it makes zero sense. Look over each trait-line and compare it to other professions and you’ll find that they’re terrible in comparison. Example:
-Aegis at 50% hp threshold…what is this?
-Nerf to might of the protector. Guardians could NEVER might-stack well even before this nerf.
-tons of retaliation traits when retal is by far, the worst of all boons.
This isn’t just a dh issue but a Guardian as a whole issue. I could name countless other skills/traits that are sub par or absolutely terrible in comparison to other professions.
Retal traits leftover from before they neutered the boon with yet another over nerf.
We play pvp to play pvp. It’s up to the system to match us with players on our level. If i decide to queue alone, I don’t get queue pops, so what do you suggest I do? Pve? I dont play that. Pvp? Queues arent popping :p. Only way i actually get to play the game is to queue with lower mmr players in my party.
First, if you wouldn’t duo/triple/5man Q before and only solo/duo, you wouldn’t have problem now. You may consider it funny, but Rom or Helseth doesn’t have your issue.
Second, you got separate MMR in Unranked. You can try to play there until Anet fix this and/or there will be more people close to your MMR in Ranked.
So…you’re suggesting that:
1.) Him queueing with friends is wrong and he should limit how many friends he plays with to benefit random players and/or potentially have idiots fill the empty slots in his team.
2.) He should play Unranked which does ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to progress leagues to pass time until ArenaNet get their act together?
How is any of that fair?
Nobody said it was wrong, it’s just what put him into his current situation… Look 95% of the players are not near Diamond.. The ones that are are manipulating matches lowering mmr so they aren’t even matching his Diamond when they queue either…
How can we even tell if the system will work if everyone is manipulating it and kittening it up constantly… MMR system like this takes time to adjust to the players, it can’t learn you if you’re a diamon queing with a kittening amber constantly..
I really don’t get why so many people have come in here to complain about Sunfish.
I do agree the current state of “soloers being farmed by premades” is bad and that bringing back SoloQ would entirely solve the issue. But that is not the point of this thread.
I can’t really fault people for making teams of 4 diamonds and an amber. All of the people who are diamond right now predominantly play the game to play PvP. As Sunfish has highlighted above, without “abusing” the system, high-division players are forced to endure egregious queue times that even time out. (Even worse yet, all while, imprisoned inside the PvP lobby, literally unable to do anything else). What are these players supposed to do? Sit back for days to weeks and wait in 2-hr queues that don’t even pop until the rest of the game catches up? That’s pretty s—tty for people who do nothing but PvP. They’re literally being punished for being effective. If I was waiting out 2 hour queue times, other than contemplating quitting, you’re DAM- RIGHT I would look for every possible avenue to reduce my queue times, whether the playerbase at large considers it “dishonorable” or not.
The issues plaguing sPvP right now are entirely ArenaNet’s fault and you shouldn’t fault other players for doing what they can to cope with the current situation.
Diamonds putting ambers on team – getting matched against sapphire/ruby.. And here we have a diamond soloer with no diamonds to fight….. hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
I really don’t get why so many people have come in here to complain about Sunfish.
I do agree the current state of “soloers being farmed by premades” is bad and that bringing back SoloQ would entirely solve the issue. But that is not the point of this thread.
I can’t really fault people for making teams of 4 diamonds and an amber. All of the people who are diamond right now predominantly play the game to play PvP. As Sunfish has highlighted above, without “abusing” the system, high-division players are forced to endure egregious queue times that even time out. (Even worse yet, all while, imprisoned inside the PvP lobby, literally unable to do anything else). What are these players supposed to do? Sit back for days to weeks and wait in 2-hr queues that don’t even pop until the rest of the game catches up? That’s pretty s—tty for people who do nothing but PvP. They’re literally being punished for being effective. If I was waiting out 2 hour queue times, other than contemplating quitting, you’re DAM- RIGHT I would look for every possible avenue to reduce my queue times, whether the playerbase at large considers it “dishonorable” or not.
The issues plaguing sPvP right now are entirely ArenaNet’s fault and you shouldn’t fault other players for doing what they can to cope with the current situation.
your defense is false logic, if all the diamond players are playing the game mode for PvP as in “competitively”, drop MMR to have faster que time but with opponents that probably way below the skill level is not playing the game mode “competitively”. THat’s call farming. In PvE you kill mobs that are easy and fast to get items or experience, so please stop defend these pro players are playing league now for competition, they are not.
We play pvp to play pvp. It’s up to the system to match us with players on our level. If i decide to queue alone, I don’t get queue pops, so what do you suggest I do? Pve? I dont play that. Pvp? Queues arent popping :p. Only way i actually get to play the game is to queue with lower mmr players in my party.
You are diamond. Almost all the Diamonds right now are teams ( as it’s supposed to be)..
So, uh, kittening queue up duo or trio or with a team like how you got there in the first place.
Guess what.. Us actual soloers are in sapphire/ruby right now and we get 3min pops all day long.
If you get matched with anyone as a diamond soloQ it’s going to be you + 4 lower plebs vs PZ or something. You might not care if you lose, but those 4 progress gonna be hindered by it as we see by the plethora of topics here.
I already “mained” mesmer/thief (play all classes regularly).. Currently I’m playing my mesmer if I want wins depending where I am in a tier, otherwise still working on 5 win per class.
I’m still stuck on tier 4 of division 2 (emerald). Almost every time I solo queue, I notice that the player(s) that are in sapphire are really bad, just awful, and the players in my division generally know what they are doing. Has anyone else experienced this?
Why would anet choose to give bad players an easier time moving up in the ranks? Literally makes zero sense.
Just because they play bad doesn’t mean they are bad. Those could be their alts, new classes, trying to achieve the (Win 5 games per class) achievement. I can say for a fact. I just played Engi for the first time. And dear god it did not go well.
whats the 5 wins per class achievement? cant find any info anywhere -.-
Minor achiev for the leagues. You need 2 of them for the meta.
I don’t think it’s fair to assume all Ppl at the top are gaming the system. Especially w/o proof. I think in most cases they’re trying to cut down on queue times. If anything the “culprits” are the designers if the system.
We look at the leaderboard and we see it in front of our face, who is assuming anything? Why they do it is irrelevant.
I do expect Anet to do something about it, I doubt it will be significant but they are known to not put up with exploiting and I think they will at least attempt to preserve that reputation.
Current Leagues are not for solo players.
Current Leagues are not for the average 50 winrate.
Current Leagues are not for casuals.
Players have complained constantly about wanting Rank PvP to revert back to old leaderboard MMR system. Congratulations, Leagues is exactly that only better. We no longer have that “win 10 games straight to be top 5, only playing 1 game a week to maintain the rank” old MMR system anymore.
It takes consecutive wins to climb up the ladder; not meant for the average joe… the entire GW2 community. If Anet really wanted to cater to casuals, a grind system for Amber, Emerald, and Ruby players should be in place.
An example of what casuals are probably wanting
800+ won games in a season guarantees Tickets equivalent to Diamond players.
1200+ won games in a season guarantees Tickets equivalent to Legendary division players
numbers can be altered and changed depending on X number of players reaching these thresholds.
Solo players need to give out solutions instead of complaining about an awesome system that was never meant for them.
Could your ego be any bigger? You make so many assumptions, and you are so condescending if you had a point to make at this point IDGAF because you are a *******. This topic is so ignorant.
Yeah thief is almost unplayable in this meta, at the start it’s handicapped against guardians but also because it can’t bunk as an ele or mesmer can.
I had to get my 5 wins.. I’m not pro conquest player (wvw roamer), but I can handle a thief. At first it was rough, but I got into the swing of things.. S/D-SB backcapping like a mofo and just doing my best to deal killing blows and not get aoed to death.. You have to play a lot harder, but you can still make plays and win games.
It would be nice if they brought back the mystic forge. (for those of you who didn’t play at launch, there used to be a mystic forge right in front of the windows to the right of the new league vendor). Especially because you gain a crap ton of loot from the reward tracks. I like tossing in lvl 80 yellows for a change to get an nice excotic
I agree, it was a bit annoying when I went to make the Vial of Salt. Gathered everything in the pvp lobby while waiting on queues then to make it, I had to leave to LA rather then queueing my next match.
Tbh thief should murder any viper rev. Ez prey. Right as they swap to Mallyx, steal stab and unload burst. But cause everyone and their mom thinks thief is in bad spot (it inst) viper revs can run and counter other braindead condi classes and dont worry about being bursted 100-0
So that’s why so many thieves are running P/P now. Not that I’ve seen any of these thieves win 1v1 yet. I think it’s just the stun there that can kill the rev tbh. If timed right when the rev is low on health you should have a free kill.
I think he just meant “do your burst”, anyways I agree after initial learning curve every rev 1v1 with my daredevil has been as easy as killing old necros. I find that projectile you get (especially with double steal) is key to easily beating the rev. It doesn’t hurt that I played Rev hard for a couple weeks and know when to not attack (which as a thief you have that choice when to pressure and when to be wherever you want)
My teams never know what to do on Nifhel. They always seem to rush the creature with at least two players.
By the time they get to midpoint, their teammates at midpoint are dead and the point advantage they gained from the creature is gone.
Wow.
You basically never kill the creatures unless it will win you the game and even then it’s debatable.
Not common knowledge for people who haven’t been spvp regulars.. As a previous wvw only roamer, the only reason I know is I spend a lot of time on forums and read it once a apon a time. Also, I see it happen in many games @ open 1-2 sometimes even 3 people going for this beast(which almost always gets stolen)..
Perhaps if with pugs and worried about it, start match by saying hi to team and asking “please don’t do these common mistakes”.. You would be surprised how teaching people instead of insulting (not implying you insult people just commonplace) them will change your matches.
Tying pips to personal score will just lead to players double and triple capping nodes because they want those personal points. This will make the team less effective and may end up losing the match.
I agree it would turn soloQ into soloPlay. Everyone going for the kills no matter where they are on the map, double-triple caps, killing beast just because etc etc
its okay, once you lose enough games, match making will start pitching you against opponents of lower MMR.
btw i thought reapers are supposed to be powerful.
what build are you running?
I’m running the carrion condition build. It’s pretty strong, but it’s got nothing on DH’s, Chrono’s, and Diamond skin ele’s. I watched a DH solo 3 of my team mates in one of those matches…
You are running corrupts and unblockable interrupts, you absolutely can handle DH and/or Chrono —- May need to ask help on the DS ele but thats beatable too.
You are quite literally playing on the of the easiest specs in the meta atm.. Or that’s just my opinion because I’m so used to playing old necro it just seemed easymode.
Lol @ all you people. I have high mmr, in sapphire, solo q often and out of all my matches, I have had only 1 person tanking mmr and 1 person afking after losing first team fight. That’s after 135 games.
Maybe you’re the toxic one? If you were actually nicer to your team mates right from the start.. Pft.
I open every single pug match with /t hi! or some variant.. Normally it kicks things off on a good foot..
I have had a lot of good experienced in the last few days, but definitely ran into plenty of toxic players. Blamers who usually sitting at score of 0, usually not following the style of the team.. (for example- your team loses mid, you end up holding sides, doing well with it cuz you have a bunker locking down far(with me on scrapper rotating to him to win the point again and again), one guy on our team is deadset at dying at mid 1v3 over and over while blaming us in chat for not being in mid, meanwhile we win the game holding sides_)
9) Or create a build that you can play on a class you know extraordinarily well. My homemade builds work for me better than any meta I have tried. I have a curious playstyle.
Just thought I’d have some fun =P
Love this last point. But it would be nice if people do like I’m doing and run meta builds when they are ranking with an unfamiliar class(I want the 5 per class achievs). I have several classes I can play very well and always did my own thing with, but those not on that level I just run meta and good to go.
I wish people would stop with referring to top esport teams when they are trying to make a point, most people are not playing at that level even if they think they are.
why? when the professions are played correctly and skillfully, it clearly shows that DH is irrelevant, literally the ESL has proven that if you’re struggling with DH, the answer is l2p and get better, because its not a broken mechanic that is making DHs powerful, its your lack of skill.
D/D cele saying l2p is completely different when teams with 4 D/D comps are winning ESLs vs DH saying l2p when 90% of the ESL teams don’t even run a single DH.
Meh I’d rather balance around the general population instead of the elite. The top players will find what works and/or make it work regardless. If DH is over the top in the general population then it should be toned down.
After playing against DH’s for awhile now. Trap’s I don’t have much issue with besides the elite one being over the top in my opinion (the duration you are stuck standing still if you don’t have a counter play up is far too long its basically insta win vs thief with no SS up for example).
After playing ON my DH for the obligatory 5 achiev wins. True shot is silly as f, that is all.
From my experience in general a DH seems to be the deciding factor. I think the difference between DHs are people who mained or played Guard before HoT and know the class, and people who are jumping on the band wagon thinking they can get some OPness. It is pretty easy to tell the difference. A decent DH in a bad team will still lose, but even in an average team they make a big difference.
Don’t forget about people who know how to play the game, don’t like guard, never did, and just want the 5 wins.
If you aren’t a pvp player then the pvp legendary is not for you,
Wrong.
You seem to have this completely misguided belief that legendarys are something every player is entitled to have regardless of their playstyle or effort put into the game, they arnt, they a LONG term goals for people DEDICATED to playing the game to earn them.
and I’m fine with that. I’m fine with it being a long term goal, I’m fine with having to dedicate myself to the task. No problem with either of those conditions. The condition that bothers me is the “AND you have to do it in this ONE specific portion of the game, whether you enjoy that portion or not.”
I think that there should be goals that require time and dedication.
I think that there should be goals that can only be earned in specific areas of the game.
I think that these two situations should NEVER overlap each other.
The wings are a PvP reward, if you don’t like playing PvP, then the reward is not for you.
Wrong.
It’s set up so that when you see someone with the wings, there is a prestige behind them and you know that they deserved the item.
Pssht, all it means is that they played a lot of PvP, what silly “prestige” is involved in that? No, when you see someone in the wings, it shows that they have pretty wings on, nothing more than that, and there’s absolutely no justification for restricting it only to people who enjoy PvP.
If they want to have something that conveys “prestige,” then it should be something that people wouldn’t want otherwise, something that ONLY serves to show that you have accomplished something, not something that would be cool and desirable whether you accomplished that task or not.
That would make rev impossible to play as just plain immobile spam would completely cripple it. You seem to forget that while with resistance it holds up vs condis and such but it doesn’t actually remove them well with any viable legends.
Well… You still have shiro’s retreat. I am mostly worried about blind, weakness and vulnerability not working.
I meant while in the Mallyx legend. Beating a rev would be as simple as – wait for Mallyx, stack immobile, ping pong and burst to your hearts content.
I like stronghold because #1 it’s closer to my preferred mode WvW. #2 I’m not a fan of bunker wars and stronghold allows many different comps to win.
I like WvW and stronghold is not really like it.
Bashing down defenceless doors, and killing npcs… Sounds like your typical sox wvw experience. I’m surprised you don’t love the gamemode.
Eh not quite.. Never was a zergling or ppter… PvD does not float my boat. I have been a roamer/small group player since beta. So take your condescending attitude and put it where, you know where.
Now that this exploit is mass common knowledge I really agree with a disable until fix.. Though this is the only mode I’ve been enjoy of late, I feel it’s worth the wait.
That would make rev impossible to play as just plain immobile spam would completely cripple it. You seem to forget that while with resistance it holds up vs condis and such but it doesn’t actually remove them well with any viable legends.
Yep playing a pretty strong bunker condi build, my experience has been as such: Can handle most meta builds 1vX.. The only thing having real issues vs is a good condi reaper with corrupt.. The other issue comes vs 2x tempest or the inability to kill a diamond ele in the same year.
I’m of the belief whatever setup we end up in, the community will manage to re-invent it’s pride. Whether that is faction pride, guild pride, whatever the case.
Just please don’t limit my style or playtime. Thanks love ya!
I am happy as long as I can : Join wvw whenever I want. Run solo/small group/mid group/zerg whenever I feel like, have fun with people to play with and against.
I don’t care what my team or server or faction or color or w/e is called.
Wow, really?! just remove stealth from the game then. Whats the point of stealth if you can’t use it….
Minions being able to be stealthed is intended. Minions that never come out of stealth even if stealth wears off is not intended.
I see I did notice some buggy behavior. Like doorbreaker models that seemed to freeze in place while the real doorbreaker was actually near the gate. (being used to this from yaks in wvw i still killed them )
Please reconsider.. SH has been a place largely unaffected by the MMR fiasco for me.. I have been having so many wonderful pug vs pug good matches…
Doorbreakers being stealth is not a huge deal compared to not wanting to join the conquest which i dislike.
Honestly I thought it was intended play as someone who is often defending. I just read the signs as I would any stealth entity and killed them with aoe.
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