Guild Wars 2

Hurtappl.6405:

Or maybe this to make up for you lack of a good heal while using the venom heal for burst.
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQRAqY6YnMJSXTW0EONB/TmImI26j79/ctPaCA-TVCEwAp2fgwTAYrSQmK/kcSA6ohot+BAHIAXq/QKgIWGB-w
Just kill stuff even HARDER for me so I can watch it!

i know i was the one who made full venom with condi spec a valid build (with lots of criticism)but with power build with low health and low armor you wont survive long for sure as your only escape from melee is shadow shot and cnd and from range none but 2 dodges

i have tried it with little success

you can also try this

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQRAqY4al0MpypdPx0J8PNBNBtdGGeE8OLdZLaFAA-TFCEwAGODAMV+la/hO6HAcQAcp+DhHAwWlgkC4htAA-w

with higher ini management you should have above 8% dmg so you lose 200 power and 10% but gain 5% from rune 5% from flanking strike+8% from ini so it compansate
and with food you can have even higher

GL

xihorus.2804:

Just in case anyone has been following this thread I thought I would share my experiences with some of the rune sets:

Krait:

• Pros: Bleed duration is devastating against opponents with little to no condition removal. I could apply bleeds and pretty much hide in stealth and watch them die.
• Cons: Bleed duration pretty useless if they do have good condition removal. Also the 6th set bonus pretty much forces you into using Basilisk Venom, and applies conditions you are already normally applying.

Balthazar

• Pros: Burning is not a condition you normally have access to, and can really help out if your opponent has good condition clearing.
• Cons: Burning only happens when you heal near the opponent. If you’re using HiS, that will be every 30 seconds only. Withdraw helps with this, but you lose the stealth and bleed/poison/burning removal of HiS.

Perplexity:

• Pros: Adds a condition you can apply that synergizes really well with Sleight of Hand.
• Cons: To trigger the condition with Sleight of Hand, you actually have to interrupt a move your opponent is doing. I found that at the beginning of the fight, especially if you jump someone, Steal->CnD won’t normally trigger it.

As a follow up question to this topic, what utility skills do you guys normally run?
I’ve found Spider and Skale Venom to be pretty useless (since those conditions are getting applied normally anyways). It also seems that a stun breaker (Roll for Initiative / Shadowstep) and a stealth move (Blinding Powder / Shadow Refuge) is almost mandatory for this build.

for me balthazar >any rune. i use withraw and cleanse condition with SS and stealth cleanse.
skale buff your dmg so you can tick higher in shorter time so even if the enemy got cleanse you will do dmg. so many p/d thieves which not use this cant even kill me just harras me as only 5 bleed and 2 torment wont do much

thanks and pls do as for now i can fight them for 1-2min but boom doing one mistake with no endurance or no ini and getting dead
so maybe i try to focus on longer fights and small bite on their health bar

thanks!

i am using it in wvw and spvp for practice
i use valk and not knigh armor for more vitality as my crit chance is in good spot

you can go 4,6,0,0,4 and take flanking strike for more 5% dmg from side and back so you will lose only 5% which can be compenate if you take streangh rune or other rune with % dmg
so you lose only the 200 power when revealed which is nice short buff for p/d set

so far this set and build work fine for me against all other class/build but the guardian shout heal as not enoughf burst like the d/x, few condi class like engi and hammer warrior if they cought me . also its great if roaming in small group 2-10, but in bigger group the d/x is much needed

so if you take p/d +d/p with this build you can work it fine as confuse your enemy as he wont know what you do next , melee or range burst

i like
i also play in raid 2,6,0,0,6 build but more hs one than bp
i didnt see you dueling condition spec so how do you manage against condi necro/engi/thief etc as they are my biggest problem

regarding the argument about dmg above

both condi spec and power spec can yield the smae dmg the main different is time

condi spec can tick in average 3k dps thus his sustain dps will be around 6-10 seconds as even if he is not hitting the condition will tick

power spec which can yield huge burst can do in fast combo 14k dmg so his dms will be 5-6k dps but it migh take longer to down the enemy so his sustain dps can be longer so his actual sdps will be the same and the condi spec

in short both spec in duel situation would take same time to down the enemy (but in open world the favor is for the power one as he can surprise the enemy and down it faster)

steal+ cnd →dodge →sneak →shadow strike
if you close to him as first use shadow strike→steal+cnd…

i dont agree it is only two skill and if you use only 2 of them you will have 5 stack of bleeding (500 dps) 2 torment (200-400 dps) poison (150 dps) and 5 confusion (1000 dps)

so smart play will dodge and get maybe 1-2 bleed which make the dps probably 1500 if using skills so lets say its around 750 dps which is very low

i think pd is strong because with venom which put 3 more torment and also ppl cleanse too early but i agree that the longer the fight the advantage is for the condition base combine with good escape tool as stealth .

condi necro is much dangerous but have less escape tools

if you go condi you can go through them if you manage your condition after his cleanse
if you go power just range him to death

he will use carrion for more hp than he is glassy
or some other mix variant but still 2500 armor and 15k vitality

put pressure on 1 points and harrass from range and gl

so glad condi gurad are more commonly used

i would say bp should reduce its blind duration to 2 seconds but give stealth ability for 3 seconds thus d/p will be more tacticly than bp hs spamming and p/p will use stealth also

+1
if they give 1 buff like mobility /evade/stealth in the skills set (not utilities the set will be popular

the balance should be simple
risk versus reward

the more cirect dmg you get the less vitality and tougness you got
the more condition dmg the less vitality and tougness you should have
this is why condition duration trait goes with power as they want you to split your decision making between the two. but alas condition duration above 50% is not very demandable right now
if you have less condition duration rune the less vitality/toughness it should bring you

so if they delete the +duration food and switch the condition duration trait with condition dmg it will make sense to all classes

Jayden Ennok.3687:

Condi builds still need a bit more survivability than power since condi is dot.

Someone posted a great idea in some other thread: remove +/- condi duration food or make the global condi duration food in line with single condi duration foods. That would be like +/- 10% . And add a new gear stat to the game with condi duration, which would essentially be power glass equivalent.

That would allow condi players build either safer or more dmg oriented builds.

i think the time anet will do it the meta will move directly to power again
condition dmg to be effective need both dmg and duration. with the runes and food which decrease up to 60% the duration and also some powerful skills with add 33% like guardian have this is the reason you here groups dont look for condition dmg rather direct dmg as conditions get cleanse easily
in roaming and small group if enemy wont take 1 skill that remove conditions it his fualt.

so i might suggest dont touch condition rather buff the power again

6,0,6,0,2 full dire full venoms and share with group grenth rune for chill or balthazar for burning

so funny. when i post my p/d videos some of this community call it cheesy even when i put outnumbered situation…
they explain it cheesy because its the most easiest playstyle atm. so what about other class build …
conclusion every class has cheesy build

i play condi thief p/d long time and took it to extream with full venoms which made me more experience in cnd which is my only escape tool

now as i turn to p/d power and from 12 fights i had against p/d condi i won 10. why because i dodge thier sneak and unticipate when they gonna use venom so 80% i was right.
ppl dont dodge and w8 for you to attack them in the face so they can burst you easily
this is thier mistake
if i fight good guardian its gonna be long fight if he’s smart as his block prevent me to cnd, also mesmer if hiding behind his clons, and ranger on his pet. so many time my cnd got stuck in the ally and not the enemy.
yes p/d condi is hard to counter but doable. like pu mesmer, signet warrior, d/d ele, torret engi etc

pvp warrior go zerk and want you to stand for easy kill… dont

so play and kill and punish them

for 1v1 or 1vx the duration is important a bit as after the signet warrior which has 800 heal per second use is utilities u can tick 5 seconds and above . without it you wont be able to kill anyone with -40%-60% condi duration

short video in spvp my testing area.
this combo with shadow strike can yield 12-16k dmg in 2 sec while your enemy has hard time to dodge/evade as you use shadow step abilities
also with 55-85% dmg modifier and in wvw food and buff you will have 2.95k-3.2k power you will do insane dmg from range
i use muhammad ali speech as the word “fast” suitable to this combo
hope you like it

go full dire
if you 1v1 a lot you’ll get bored pretty fast as this set is super easy and forgiving

go balthazar rune as it give bruning which is huge dmg ppl wont expect thieves to do and perplexity only give you 3 stacks mainly and you already got 5 with trait

use 10,0,30,0,30

about duration
AA will tick 4 seconds so 100% is 8, 75% is 7 50% is 6 and 25% is 5
shadow shot and BA (trait) is 5 seconds so 100% is 10, 9 sec is 80% , 8 sec 60%, 7 sec is 40%, 6 is 20%
balthazar rune is 4 sec burning so 100% is 6 , 66% is 5

with 2 in DA line and 40% food you will have 50% condi duration so to go higher you will need 25% for bleeding which will be trade off with condi dmg and only give you 1 sec tick which is about 600 dmg while more condi dmg will benefit also torment and confusion

so i say aim for 60% (with malice sigil)
you will have burning 6 seconds , torment and confusion 8 sec, bleeding 6 sec
you will do in 6 seconds around 3k dps which is 18k dmg

for me its the 2,6,6,0,0 build
any weapon can be used, cleanse conditions, good dmg, good way out with stealth

as for thieves any build in the right hand can work rather in warrior hand u will need special build to work

this is my new build for the p/d power

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQRAqY4al0MpypdPx0J8PNxLRt9I0cbAX/g2LQA0hA-TFCEwAGODAMV+1R/AgDCgL1fI8AAuv/wWlgkC4ptAA-w

basically this build doing lots of dmg from safe distance
as you have 2.8k power and while revealed 3k power and with +50% dmg modifier
vital shot will do 1k-2.2k
shadow strike easy 4k-6k dmg
sneak 3k-4k

i made this build mainly for group fight as my d/d couldnt handle tight moving group so with pistol its much easier to snip them.

works like a charm against melee classes

tell me what you think

take any power runes
ogre, pack, strength, scholar, vampirism, privateer
or eagle, rage

you got my vote
maybe we see more thieves if more exp thieves will show tutorial instead of just 1v1 or 1vx video

for your next (or mine) try to do thief v other class tutorial lessons

+10% dmg with main hand pistol is still very low compare to 1k health but you can switch whatever you like even critical haste for more dmg as the CS trait tree is wide open for any trait which benefit your game style.
if it was 20% more dmg on pistol when crit than it would be another story

it really seems to me that anet try to take thieves from the 1 shot kill spot to the more evading/dodging game so enemies will have the chance to kill you. this why shadow strike so awesome

thanks!

i think its the weapon set which demand you to use almost all the skills with good ini management and play tactically accordingly to your enemy acts as its direct dmg is the lowest compare to all other weapon sets
d/d uses 5+1 mainly and in the right moment 2
d/p 5+2+1 and needs good ini management
p/d condi 5+1+3 with almost no ini management needed
s/d if you master it its so much fun but can cause dizziness

i am glad you think its cheesy as its so uncommonly used to verify that its so easy playable (or maybe in duels all thief weapon set are cheesy )

so far in wvw 1v1 i hardly died to any warrior who stay and fight
against mesmer 80% succsess and only longer fight to pu ones
and against engi 70% succsess and yes they are the hardest from the above two.

so dont know what you talking about

in group fight the bigger the group the less neediness for a thief beside scouting, tagging, doly hunter, solo camps and periphery harasser
so far while rolling a thief in guild raid while my team down in their burst 5 ppl i down alone 3…

i tried warrior and got so bored as it too easy even more than p/d condi

hope you like it
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HPuUQVDMjKU

i once play shatter 4,4,0,0,6 build full zerk in group/zerg play to kill the periphey
you can use your illusions with GS mainly to do nice dmg on ppl but you wont be able to shatter fast also
i use shatter when i see the opportunity
but thief are the best periphery ganker imo

sry to say i didnt like it much
1. music too relaxing
2. d/p v d/p is too boring fight if both of you just play the stealth game
3. why didnt you go for the mesmer at first as he the most dangerous one . and when you did you didnt finish him and finally the veteran tree took the ele
4. and yes poor quality pls put 1080

good luck on your next vid. i am sure it will be better

anet shoud bring f2 f3 f4 which would be some trait application which will be pop up when hit several limitation

like 25% hp f4 is ready to use
shadow step when stun f3 is ready to use
etc

when i see me going below 40% hp i try not to use stealth ability unless i am sure i am gonna cnd and w8 till this trait proc

i kinda see lots of s/d in pvp these days and less d/p

dont work at all
maybe in some p/d+d/d variant as you need to stakc more conditions

go bloodlust for sure

traps is bad combination with the thief aspect. thief cant stay in one place and the dmg is so low and the recharge.

i saw you vid 4 months ago. i was also experiment in the power idea but want it to be more fast bursty dmg with shadow strike combo (sometime with life steal rune/sigils)
the reason i use d/d as well as pd is my range pressure when i need it to be and d/d my melee pressure so sometime 1 hs can down my enemy . but also sometime i fell d/d alone or p/d in enough to down enemies.
i wish anet will raise the p/x dmg

now blacktide server

another power build which use the p/d
few ppl want me to make a tutorial on d/d so i combined them
hope it will helps the new d/d thieves out there and also if ppl can put here more tips&tricks about the d/d set would be nice contribution to ours community

here is the build i use
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fZAQRAqY4Yl0MpyplOx7J8PNBNBt9wbQI4uG5YGaFAA-TFCFwAAOCAz3f4qSQkK/EcSAI8AAyofQl6PkC4ptAA-w

i use the privateer runes as i like the parrot which yield 1k-2k dmg and give 3 stacks of might

why i like p/d – although its not powerful as d/d and less than sb direct dmg the p/d bring nice combination of condition pressure to the mixture. your enemy dont know what to expect when he sees 5-8 stacks of bleeding +2-4 stacks of torment, thus the condition contribution can adds up 1k dps which is nice. so it can make your enemy to use earlier his utilities to your advantage.
also the p/d is great weapon set against melee as shadow strike keeps you away from them while doing nice dmg 3-4k. and while in stealth with cnd you can choose how to hit. is it with deadly bs or sneak attack (which is great to hit from SR as it will heal you around 2k health)
the shadow strike combo is deadly fast one and can down unaware enemy or 50% hp enemy as it 12-15k dmg in 2-3 seconds

also the p/d can enable few more skills combination like:

cnd+sneak+shadow strike+steal+shadow strike+signet+cnd+bs
3 + 3 + 4 + 1 + 4 + + 3 + 5 = 18k dmg+3k from sigils and 2k from parrot -> 23k

i hope it helps

so maybe guard hit me when i was dueling … wierd. will check it again

have you notice that when you get hit you get retaliation for 10 seconds?
i really dont know from which trait it comes

nice vid but omg so many players just didnt do anything to pressure you at all. and some only aa spam.
@emi d/d thief is mainly cnd and bs you dont spam skills. maybe 1 hs if you target below 25% hp so ini should not be any problem

my intuition tell me that in 5v5 the condit thief will over power the necro condi.
he can steal and use aoe fear. he can gank the necro 1v1 while his team have access to cc with venom share. the necro survivability base on his team while thief can role alone from the outside. also group always try to burst the necro first as he is easy pray. while thief can stealth away

@vinc – power venom share has few drawback – hp and armor is low . low movement abilities so he must at least 2 utilities . so to go venom share just for immobilize and stun . i dont know. but i will try it again

instead bp use torment venom for more pressure

the condition dmg done by venom share is scale by the party condi dmg and not mine. but the venoms i use are immobilize and chill for cc to catch ppl off guard so my team can burst on them fast and easy. the torment is for both spec. condition and power which get vulnerability which is nice +4% dmg buff but if some attack the same target it can be higher so its advantage

true , power build are more harder and require you to play smarter and faster
i am also hate when i get down by p/d thief. but that’s life. i rarely duel and look for 1vx so far my best win was 1v5 and again after 15 min its kinda boring so i try to took it for group play and some time its fun to hear your group shouting “omg see how many conditions messiah stack on this poor guy”

but so far why dont you think full venom share with group play cant work?

hope it helps

i will put video in few min to show you how to do it step by step

use many AA to take out the aegis.
never stand in aoe
if BB used try to dodge as it wont pull you (migh be tricky)
use blind if you go d/p (as i see)
move alot around your target and AA and kite it alot even 1k dmg in 10 sec is 10k
if he use hammer stealth and bs
patient for 20 sec dont try to burst him as you lose all ini and utilities. as after that he will use his med heal and than you can pressure. so think you wanna kill him after 30 sec till than just kite him

or go p/d condi

go what ever you like

as you see ppl use all.

find what works best for you.
dont think you can role with the melee even with 3k armor
so look the periphery and hit from their
sb is the most useable set power with #2 spammnig

i once use nurse build variant and manage to revive 15 man in outnumbered till we won. but beside those 15 no one notice the difference.

here is short vid (without the runes above)

step by step

1. press left click
2. press about face (bound key to it)
3. use withraw
4. press right click to get back 180

practice it few times. even i sometime mistake it with fast clicking.

also you can bound the keys all together to 1 key.

look in youtube you will found it. if not i will put some short clip