yay more doomsday posts. you should work for the government. this is why devs are told “never say a date something will be done” and choose to be vague about everything.. because anything that is said feeds this drama b.s. 30 seconds of an interview caused so much kittening on so many forums without any information. you took one or 2 sentences and are doing this crap here. its not even in testing. get over it and stop whining and wait for some actual facts first.
(edited by zaxon.6819)
yay.. every single profession has thier own doomsday prophet in the forums. patch is comming, boon hate,stealth nerf, kit fix blah blah.. really is this how people go through life.
i would not suggest that these guys roam on a t1 server either. its not about just being a mesmer its about skill lvl and i dont think they are at the point where it would be fun for them. if they ran into these guys on even ground it wouldnt have gone so well. and jump puzzle people dont even pvp usually they are pve idiots who want free loot once a day and spam “is there a mesmer in jp” a couple times before heading back to LA.
killing these guys in no way means they should roam to camps.
pretty sure boon hate will not be given to “theives” as a profession. but will be put in a trait line.. this means that to take a skill in boon hate you will need to spec out of something else. so instead of being a direct damage thief or condition thief you may be a boon hate thief. meaning that the same theif that will be better vs boons will be worse vs a normal player.
in the same way that a boon stacking guardian is worse at doing other things like damage/healing because they focus on boons.
i agree with your guide. if people are newer to mmo or gw2 and are having issues staff is an option that adds protection vs multiple mobs. even with slower kills it will be safer. i did not use it while leveling but i do remember my mesmer being kinda squishy ,,, just a suggestion.
i use gs s/focus.. while i like the dps on izerker..(ignoring the stealth nerf).. the reason i carry greatsword is cc from wave. using wave to knock someone away from you switching weapons then using curtain to pull them back to you is a very very long cc(knockdown) and it lets me set up into a ileap blurred combo very easy.
the next reason which is more situational is.. greatsword (and focus) both create all thier clones at the target so you can fight off or on a wall and down attackers in one combo where the staff creates clones at you that are pretty crappy in that situation.
for roaming / jumping into the middle of 5 guys i would most likely want a staff. to fight 3 or less people while im solo or doing tower wvw stuff i like sword better.
if you want to play a mesmer rolling an easier profession will not help you play a mesmer. it will just delay learning the class you want. especially since you may not even want 2 or 3 80s.
i agree with davrollen you will get alot of your play skills by repeatedly pvping so hopping into spvp packs alot of fights into a short period of time and helps you train. win or lose you should be learning something. watch the videos in the stickies to see the build you want to be in action. you should be able to tell your playstyle by what weapons you gravitate to and research specs that use them.
anything with a staff should be easier for beginners.
they are just normal spells a mesmer can use. other then using clones they have no aoes that can target a wall. do you think you should be untargetable on a wall? on there is the staff aoe but thats garbage. so yes players can target someone standing on a wall it isnt god mode.
and a spell with a vortex …… causes vortex when used.
the damage reduction is in effect in LA on the training dummies. there should be 0 pathing issues since the ground is flat and the izerkers do not even move through the target when they attack. they spin in place in range of thier target.
we do not know what is needed to get this worked on. they said that they would maybe kinda look into it and see if anything smacks them in the face as a mistake. it may be all pets that have been nerfed. they havent said a word to anyone about progress. if it was going to end up fixed in the next patch they would have said something. looks like this is a long term nerf weather it was a mistake or not. wish they would be more active commenting on stealth nerfs or development errors the least we can do is keep this topic at the top of the front page so they dont fix any of this pvp graphics glitches before addressing gameplay errors they have caused.
seems silly to say greatsword is a noob weapon when the alternative is a defensive crutch. harder to fight mid field vs more then 1 person. greatsword keeps pressure and damage on your target adding cc with wave. staff stalls and trys to stay alive doing chip damage until your next i leap combo is ready.
taking the bite out of izerker takes half the function out of the weapon. yes im just complaining to bump this because we have had no follow up to this situation. i dont want new content.. i want old content to work properly.
(edited by zaxon.6819)
if there is any change to shatter i hope it is done in a way that only hits mindwrack specs. a blanket nerf to shatter would be silly if it also hits phantasm/ condition specs.
that same kid(xefp) said that the only spec people play is shattercat build..
how was he sent there to represent mesmers thinking like that.
out of any class i would think mesmers have a good amount of specs to chose from,
my main issue is i would rather see the damage traded for mobility or survivability. adding something fun or an aspect of play that adds to the spec while moving them away from being 1 trick pony.
not saying that backstab thieves want that.. because they want thier one trick.
i dont disagree with the fact that they arent super high skill lvl. i dont want the spec to be made more clunky and awkward just to raise its skill lvl though.
its odd that people say you get “infinite backstabs” as if that were true.
i guess it would be true if your target stood still doing nothing for an infinite amount of time.
anet and everyone else who plays thief seems to agree with sifu.
if they didnt they could have easily put initiative cost on a backstab skill.
it is not a valid balance issue because you(the person who is calling for the nerf) said that if the nerf was put in place that not even you would be able to play the thief in that condition. you would need to move up from (what you seem to think is the top of the skill ceiling) and practice to even make the spec function propperly.
this would cut everyone who is below the skill cap out of playing the spec all together.
if you do not consider yourself high on the skill cap.. then asking for a nerf that would make you unable to play your own class is illogical and deserves to be derailed.
or has another motive.
i.e. you were on another class and got killed by a thief you thought you were better then and dont think you deserved to die.
or you think its too easy for thieves with less skill then you to kill people.
just stating it again.
you..(a person who considers themselves a good thief).. would not be able to play the thief after the nerf you are calling for is put in place.
so… even high end thieves would have trouble compensating for the nerf you are asking for.
the only problem i see with stealth stomp is it stops abilities that rely on target from triggering. make those targetless in some way and leave stealth stomp the same.
ehh. the whole topic is garbage imo. thats my valuable addition. it is you saying you have had it easy for too long and want to be nerfed so people will respect you more when you kill them.
gg on a topic that is all about how good you are.
thieves did not earn thier kills … they were given them unfairly..
they should have those kills and skills taken away from them to make it more fair for everyone else. we should make it harder for theives to earn kills while making it easier for other professions to earn kills off thieves..
ive heard this argument somewhere before. theives = 1% i guess.
question for kaon.
would you play a backstab thief if this change was made.. and why?
Yes, precisely because of the higher skill floor involved.
It would clearly separate the thieves who actually play well versus the others.I’m not saying that I’d definitely be in the former category, as I, myself, have gotten quite used to the forgiving nature of backstab as it is currently. But I’m willing to put in the time and effort to become better.
Right now there is very little room for differentiation for a zerker backstab thief. The skill floor is simply too low.
because as you stated…
you want to nerf your own class to the point where only people better then you will be able to play it.
because you are saying thief is too easy and you are at the skill cap of the current thief.
because you are claiming that thieves that kill in the current state did not earn the kill it was given to them by an easy unfair skill.
maybe play with 1 hand or your eyes closed if you are so skilled that your chest thumping cant be heard over the next thieves chest thumping. dont call for a nerf on your own class. that is just pompus and pig headed.
i i knew it was something.. this is a im better then other people thread.
there are only a very few reasons why a person would call for a nerf on thier own class.
this reason is “im so good even if you nerf me it dosent matter” thread.
when you make a kill people question your ability because the damage is so high and you get 2 trys..
you will show them. you will do it without a second backstab… because you are that good.
question for kaon.
would you play a backstab thief if this change was made.. and why?
the only reason other peoples skills get put on cooldown is because they do not use initiative. none of our skills get put on cooldown when used.
the skill that did get put on cooldown is whatever you used to get into stealth. that is the ability that gives you backstab.
the damage backstab does is pretty high if you 100% spec into glass cannon.
they are also one of the easiest people to kill in game.
so let me hear your idea kaon how do you see a thief playing. any miss of an attack causes unstealth plus reveal debuff.
imo this causes every single stealth damage ability + sneak attack to be next to worthless or an after thought to your spec.
this erases backstab thief as an option completely and also changes theif stealth to a defense only ability or a movement skill rather then a way to attack.
Kaon.. how long do you think stealth is? if a person evades a backstab the thief needs to reposition and try again before the stealth is over. that is a huge punishment and will most likely lead to the backstab not happening. stealth caused by stealing lasts 2 seconds. in those 2 seconds the thief needs to position behind for an attacka nd compensate for the evade. the dodge did work… you evaded steal which evaded (fury,might,swiftness) evaded mug which caused basalisk not to trigger screwing up the thiefs position to try to get a backstab off. congrats
by default guardians sit with aegis on. not only does it take 0 skill 0 spec and 0 button presses.when traited it heals and causes retaliation and burning when it is removed.(still 0 buttons pressed) people saying spammable backstab isnt skilled when they compare it to the skill it takes to block??
where is the logic in that.
so what the o kitten aying is aiegs is skilled play.
how about something that speeds us up.
right now condition mesmer = switfness on heal runes.
shatter mesmer = swiftness on heal runes.
whatever…. swifness on heal runes
you took one whole aspect of the game and gearing away from us by giving us no options in rune choice.
nerfing shatter with no fix to i leap is garbage. you are going to take away our damage before you fix our damage? i agree shatter builds are good on a flat surface. if you want to nerf a shatter build all you need to do is put more hills in the game because that completely breaks i leap.
if you nerf shatter before you fix izerker that is garbage also. take responsibility for your mistakes and fix them.
the speed that you fixed prestiege + the lack of speed to fix izerker leads me to think you are catering to people who complain about a class more then you are to the people who actually play the class.
Always say less than necessary.
Use selective honesty and generosity to disarm your victim.
Do Not Commit to Anyone.
laws of power. they seem to be using them as a forum philosophy.
i feel more insulted when im stealth nerfed and treated as if im too dumb to notice rather then really nerfed and my class is ruined on purpose.
we were told it was an accident. they know the only changes that could have caused this since it was a limited patch only effecting a hand full of skills. (none that were really directed at the izerker) in this amount of time they cant figure out what of the 5 changes they made caused this?
the prestiege was fixed almost instantly and that was a weapon noone used in comparison to the greatsword.
maybe i need a ranger to show me how to play but i use heartseeker to close a gap and if i am in range i choose to use the basic meele over heartseeker almost every time.
so its 1200 a hit.. pretty sure thief shortbow is alot better then that. it seems the only benefit to being a ranger in that situation is having to push less buttons. or you can just put auto shoot on your 1 button and pooof… you are a ranger.
ya, making traps 1 slot that you click and your bar changes to 5 trap options would be alot more worth it. not sure how they would play mid combat. the same option could be given for venoms.. venom kit.. im not sure how clunky the skills would end up on demand.
the main time i use traps is wvw while beating up a door ill trap the sides of a fort to catch people trying to run into thier base. other then that there are just better options to chose from .
nice start, getting bad link on a couple though.. double check.
forums seem to degenerate so quickly into kitten fests. so many crys and qqs on every single forum. you go here and hear qq stealth, you go to the guardian forum and see qq boon hate you go to the mesmer forum and see qq shatter (may shave off some shatter damage). no wonder anet likes to just sit back and say nothing ignoring the community(refusing to say a date or time something will be done) because people are ready to spout tears at a moments notice. learn to play with the game you are given or leave. in less then 5 mins of class future speculation they inspired 100s of tears. i do not think it was the things that were said that inspired tears but the squishy spines of children on the internet.
all other professions have cooldowns on thier core skills. thieves do not because they use initiative.
i have another idea… if an elementalist uses ride the lightning and they dont hit an enemy.. its instantly reset.
if a mesmer uses blurred strike and dont hit an enemy they can just repeat it over and over.
chaining stealth pretty much erases you from the game until you decide to go back in.. without very specific things like a vortex ability. even in other games with perma stealth the trade off is reveal on damage so you can fish for stealthers and they cant enter the center of a fight without alot of work. gw2 traded the damage reveal for not having perma stealth and that was stated from the start.
i play a thief and i dont have any issue with this. i hate gimic fights taht dont rely on any kind of skill. chaining stealth isnt out playing someone its failing to do your job and trying to reset it and go again.
learn to be more effective and if you fail….. you may have to eat the 3 seconds visible using evades or some other non stealth skill to handle it .. then you can crawl back in the womb of stealth where you feel safe and warm.
thief was not supposed to walk around stealth just incase they ran into someone. that has been stated since the start.. this is not wow if you want to hide until someone gets low and run up and ambush them there is still a game for that. it is used as a tool durring a fight … you chooose if it is better to use it offensive or defensive and then yes you will get the reveal buff, need to deal with the short time you can be seen before choosing what to do with your next stealth.
if you cant handle yourself for 3 seconds without dieing inbetween being stealthed then im not sure any amount of buffs can save you.
hmm. did you even watch the video? you know the one that this thread is based on.
there is no patch. they were theorycrafting ideas to try to balance classes and this is one of the ideas to stop thieves from perma stealthing. there has been no testing in any way of this idea and this would only come along side buffs that were mentioned in the same conversation. this nerf to stealth was a side note in a conversation based on buffing thieves skirmishing ability.
if a thief dies to retaliation or confusion it is not a problem with the class as much as it is an issue with the player.
this same conversation talked about giving thieves boon hate. the same conversation talked about buffing thieves to make them better at entering and exiting combat then the current elementalist is.
they are not taking away stealth. stealth using thieves can still use stealth. they just cant chain it. if you are a thief that relys on stealth to do your damage this change will have 0 effect on you because when you do damage you will get the reveal buff anyway.
if you cant figure out how to kill someone without needing to chain stealths together it may be a learn to play issue. at the point where you are needing to hide 3x in a row you already lost and are trying to reset and get a second chance. sad to say you may get downed once or twice because you are forced to play instead of hide.
thieves have all the tools to win almost every 1v1 fight vs any profession even if they are able to see you for 3 seconds.
once you charge and do a leap combo your pistol skills will not be ready even if you trait them. at this point you will have to switch weapons to continue fighting. do you want to continue to dps/pressure with greatsword cc+izerker or do you want to start creating clones with staff+protecting yourself while setting up for the next combo.
if devs have a ton of extra time i would say go for changing upgrading traits.. as a matter of priority i would say fix all the bugs way before focusing on this.
There is no reason to kill a thief who cant kill you. you both bunkered to the point where you cant burst. so you are just playing hide and seek pretty much. if you kill a thief by putting 17 stacks of confusion on them and then they kill themself …. you could have done anything to kill them at that point because they are dumb.
(edited by zaxon.6819)
ya, turning the clone into a shadowstep would be better, and you have that in game already. or a leap that dosent leap back.. not sure if there are pathing issues with the swordsman.. but leap+cripple on hit and then stay at the target.
the main reason for the 25 in inspiration is how powerful focus is with cooldown reduced + reflect. imo
wow. just imagine how powerful this ability would be if it actually worked. it is one of our best skills and it almost never works..
if you give us illusions with elasticity + a working leap we would rule the world.
hoooray!! no need to farm new gear. thx for response
the main issue with mag = we have numbers…. that only show up when we are winning.. so t4 we have a half hour queue and t3 we have outnumbered buff.. for the most part these people are just lazy levelers who somehow translate to winning via zerg.