Guild Wars 2

I’d delete personal score completly and just show who did best in certain categories. Most kills,most rezzes, most healing/damage applied,most damage tanked etc – simliar to overwatch. It’s a much better indicator than personal score to show who did work and who did not.

the game skillcap is too high

This kind of situation is why PvP is running on thin population. It’s simply too hard to learn.

- Ithwilen 2016

That’s such an unconsidered and wrong statement, it does hurt.
Gw2 is by far one of the easiest games with a super low skill cap.You don’t have to be ‘good’ to be successfull. Every single fps-game has a much higher skill cap and you ushally have to spend twice as much time to reach competitive top tier. Gw2 is a joke in comparison to that.

All I read from you is that you know you are bad in comparison to ESL players and you don’t like to be bad. And since you aren’t interested to spend some effort to improve you’d rather extinguish the whole competitive scene so that the playerbase is playing on your casual lvl.

Fun-Fact: considering your season complain threads where you posted your amounts of games played during the season, you play more than most ESL-players do.

I don’t go to pvp because pve provides more gold
=
I don’t go on the beach because austria has more mountains

You don’t play pvp to grind gold little man

yea s1 pvp was full of nomads...
warlord knowledge

XD XD

@Nickname it is perma resistance you can apply it over 4 minutes with new amulet. Just use healing signet and zerker stance at the same time, signet again and zerker stance is rdy again

Rastislav.1652:

Dave.6819:

all it takes for anet is to look back at gw2 pre HoT. maybe even pre June patch 2015. those weren’t the best times but still.. atleast more then 1 or 2 builds were viable for each class. zerker mesmer? sure. go for it. condi mesmer? sure. as good as zerker. condi guard? sure. OP. medi guard? sure. even better. anyway no idea tho.. anet has to figure things out somehow. but i guess looking back at stuff is the way to go. like.. maybe bring old trait system. make more choices available and mixed up builds/traits. changing trait system would be a start.

Indeed, you have a point there. I too, stated before (In a different post) that since HoT PvP became significally less balanced. The number of aviable builds has shrunk. (From 2-3 to 1, which is, always the current meta. No putting it mildly, it is just plain bad balance of traits/skills.) The way I see it condi builds are easier to play, offer wide variety of advantages (Being chilled, or weakened is especially deadly for a power build.) and deal similar, if not more damage than power builds, while requiring less stat combinations. (Condition damage vs. Power/precision/ferocity.) I would suggest anet tones down condition damage, or rather condition application to bring more viability to power builds. You can easily see the huge difference in power vs condi on mesmer. A power mesmer mostly utilizes F1 shatter and some phantasmas to deal damage, while F2, F3, and F4 are more of an utility. He also has a window when he cant spike you down, wheter he has F1 or phantasms on cooldown. If you manage to dodge those skills, it opens up a potential window for your own attacks. On the other hand condi mesmer deals conditions with each of his shatters, and pumps out so much condition damage, that dodging becomes redundant, you will get hit anyways. There is no spike to dodge, his damage is constant. Compare that to Necromancer, who, despite having condition build has to land his attack properly, and the cast times are VERY telegraphed, except for staff. You can clearly see what is he doing, and act accordingly. Maybe a bit too easy to dodge, during those painfully slow cast times. So to compare, mesmer has more ways to apply conditions, does it from safe distance, and constantly, while confusing you with his clones, has invisibility, and other utilites. Necromancer has to properly time his attacks to land conditions effectively, for example signets are easily dodged, scepter attacks slowly, and if he misses these attacks, he is without life force, and becomes easy target in close range. This causes one proffesion to apply conditions much faster, easier, and is punished way less (Or not at all) for missing his attacks, and not timing properly. Also traits could be more streamlined. My idea is, each triatline would offer a set of traits tailored to certain build, while still following certain theme. For example, top traits could be power, middle traits could condi, and bottom support/healing. Not to mention some core specializations are just plain WORSE than others. (Hello, Warrior Discipline, Elementalist Arcana, Guardian Honor, Necro Blood Magic, etc. What happened to you? Or, should I ask what did not happen?) It seems to me as if the devs have this mentality, where they overhaul some core specs, and pretty well, (Give credit where credit is due.) but leave others terribly underpowered. This leaves other specs useless, becuase nobody uses them? Or what is the excuse here? Well, duh! Of course nobody touches them when they are underwhelming. The best balance (At least in my opinion, because we all know perfect balance is very hard to achieve, if at all.) would be that each class has three avaible builds at all times (Power, Condi, Support/Heal) with some variations on them. (For example there could be condi Necro with corruptions, or Signets, one with spite, the other with curses traitlines.) Each triatline would offer traits for the specific playstyle, but each with different flavour and function to them. An example for necromancer Spite traitline here:

Minor Adept: Reaper’s Might – Shroud skill 1 grants might.

Minor Master: Death’s Embrace- Inflict vulnerability when you strike a foe below the health threshold. Deal more damage while downed.

Minor Grandmaster: Siphoned Power- Gain might when you strike a foe below the health threshold. (1 sec ICD)
(Minor traits pretty much as they are now.)

Major Adept: Spiteful talisman- Focus skills recharge faster (20%), Reaper’s Touch now grants 2 stacks of might (5sec) to allies, and 2 stacks of vulnerability (5s) to enemies it bounces to. (No regeneration). Spinal shivers now additionaly causes weakness, instead of chill. (2s per boon removed.)

Major Adept: Spiteful Renewal- Focus skills recharge faster (15%), regeneration lasts longer (20%). Reaper’s Touch now grants regeneration (5s) and removes 1 condition per bounce on ally. Spinal shivers now additionaly pulses healing around foes (300 radius) per boon removed. (400 hp/pulse, 3 pulses max, 1 sec interval.)

Major Adept: Blight Talisman- Focus skills recharge faster (15%), conditions applied by your focus skills last longer (10%). Reaper’s Touch now burns foes it hits (1 stack for 3s) and removes 1 boon. Spinal shivers now convert boons to conditions, and grants you resistance. (1s per boon removed).

Major Master: Unholy Fervor- Reduce recharge of axe skills.(20%) Axe skills deal increased damage to vulnerable foes. (10%) Rending claws now send out a wave that damages foes in front of you. (3 targets max. 600 range) Unholy Feast now deals more damage (3%) and grants retaliation (3s) for each foe it hits. (It no longer converts boons.)

Major Master: Torment Cleaver- Reduce recharge on axe skills. (15%) Rending claws now apply bleeding, and bounce bethween foes. (5 sec per strike, 2 bounces) Unholy feast now converts 2 boons to conditions, and applies torment (5s) per condition converted. Torment lasts longer. (10%)

Major Master: Vampiric Axe- Reduce recharge on axe skills. (20%) Rending claws and Ghastly claws now additionally siphon health from foe. Unholy feast now heals around you (360 radius) for each enemy it hits.

Major Grandmaster: Signets of power- Signets recharge faster, (20%) grant you might (3 stacks for 15s) and cause vulnerability on foes. (5 stacks for 10s) Signet of Spite now pulses Unholy feast 3 times, with 30% reduced effectivness (damage), instead of causing conditions. Signet of undeath now finishes downed foes, as well as reviving allies (3 targets max, 120 radius), and grants life force per foe finished and ally revived. (10% per target).

Major Grandmaster: Signets of suffering- Signets recharge faster (15%), and convert 2 boons into conditions. Signet of spite now deals damaging conditions. (Pretty much as it is now.) Cast poison nova (2 stacks of poison for 7s, 360 radius) around you when you use a signet. Poison lasts longer. (10%)

Major Grandmaster: Signets of renewal- Signets recharge faster (20%), and remove 2 conditions from you. Signet of spite now pulses 5 times, removing 1 condition per pulse from you and nearby allies. Last pulse now also heals allies (240 radius). Plague signet now additionaly removes 1 condition from nearby allies every 10s, and grants you resistance (1s) per condition sent when cast.

I know what you think…this is over the top! But if all professions were altered in such a way, that each traitline upgrades/alters weapons/skills, and focuses on either Power, Condi, or support/heal playstyle, it would open up new quite a few new builds. It would be a lot to rework though, no kidding. Adept and Master traits would improove upon certain weapons, while Grandmaster traits would improove upon specific type of skills (In this example, signets.) I used necromancer as an example, becuase I am most familiar with him. Each profession could be improoved upon in this sense, however.

You wrote more than I did in my whole semester

scrapper/druid/warrior

basically every class that has 1v1 potential and enough self sustain to kite around 1v2 without dying.

A reaper does. Problem is that you never would rotate your reaper into a 1v1 against a scrapper

Your “proper” analysis gave me 3 stacks of bleed and torment

I never said that it would be equal. I’m just wondering why none of all those guys has ever participated in such a tournement if they enjoy 2v2 so much.

If everyone likes so much 2v2 , I don’t understand why none participates in 2v2 tournements anymore since 2015

Balance patch isn’t today. But as compensation you can play lovely unranked matches with backpedaling pve roleplayers who die 3v1 and who complain about you to push far instead of caping close with 3 people

I’ll just give some critique:

1.
- once you reached a decent winrate you win every game
- you get paired with good players against terrible players
-the leaderboard is a complete joke
- top 10 for example always plays together but never against each other

2.
-the divisions mean nothing
-a bad player in ruby isn’t worse than a bad player in legendary
- every player no matter how bad he is, is able to reach “legendary”
-legendary has absolutly 0 prestige

3.
-a league system does not work with only such a few active pvp players
-therefore you have to let bad players progress to legendary
-otherwise only about 50 players who really deserves it would be there
-you are not able to seperate visibly good players from bad players

—> What should be done imo:

-No leaguesystem anymore just a leaderboard like the old one
- with the difference that everyone gets an ELO which represents his mmr
-everyone starts with 1000 (mmr reset)
- if you lose as low elo player against a high elo player you don’t lose much elo
-not possible to play as 2000 elo player with a 1000 elo player
-create those bullkittenrewards once you break each 1k mark

at least you should try to create a pvp leaderboard which isn’t less competitive than the pve achivement-point-leaderboard

@Burtnik

It’s obviously you who doesn’t seem to understand.
The advantage of power damage is that it is caused way faster than condition damage.
A skill that takes away 10k in 2 seconds is “stronger” than a skill that takes away 10k in 5 seconds. You have a longer time frame to get heal from your allies and you have the opportunity to cleanse conditions which does not exist for power damage.

Saying that condition builds should not have any defensive stats to be on pair with marauder or berserker damage-wise, just proves how limited your comprehension of the balance is. Same to your knowledge of the current builds with reference to their viability. Neither a reaper nor a mesmer would be ever viable if they would miss those vitality- or toughness-stats or would simply deal way less damage.

The reason condition builds are so great at the moment is boon inflation and the power damage hate ( revenant + scrapper for example) which makes so many power builds just unviable. Solve the problems by cutting the roots and stop creating problems where actually aren’t any.

naming the thread “buff wishlist” and talking about warriors…

1.
There are no condition -“bunkers”. Neither a reaper nor a mesmer is a bunker, warrior has indeed too much sustain imo but is still not considered bunker.

2.
Removing wanderers amulet has absolutly 0 impact on the current situation. Reaper and mesmers already use carrion while warrior switches between carrion and rabid.

3.
Saying that condition dmg should need as much offensive stats as marauder/zerk is just super stupid. You wouldn’t see any condition class/ build at all. Just imagine the current mesmer or necro with so much less hp. Not viable at all.

4.
The problem currently is the boon spam and the power damage hate via evades,blocks and invulns which is the reason that there is no any other option than playing condition bruisers.There is a reason you don’t really see any other power class than revenant- and the reason is the powercreep that came with HoT. It has any other powerbuild like thief,shattermesmer or powernecro made unviable and made it just 100 times worse than revenant.
If you want to solve a problem you have to consider the roots of it.

Yea because thiefs and revenants cant cleanse it by pooping warriors dont run around with resistence and druids or eles have so less opportunities to cleanse.
You make believe of you would start out of your base with 2minutes chill

A slow class does not slow the game. Classes like cleric eles slow the game

Naming the thread condi bunkers and talking about reapers. Reaper needs to be babysitted by scrappers eles or druids and is just 100 times less bunker than warrior or mesmers

Bunkers exist because of necros is the best joke Ive heard so far. Its actually the exact opposite. Necs always have been decent against bunker mesmer bunker guards etc while they suck against powercomps

I dont understand why you want to give warrior 33% reduced condition dmg and 10% reduced condition duration. Warrior right now has kind of the best condition management of all classes and already wins against necros and condi mesmers…soo… whats the point of that?

Well, with the word “multiclassler” I actually was reffering to real multiclasslers like Drazeh, Frae, Texbi etc, who reroll for their team whatever they need. I wasn’t reffering to any soloq hero who tries out warrior for 2 hours.

You don’t get what I was trying to say with that example.
You’ll always notice a difference between someone who played exclusively warrior for 3,5 years – no matter what – and a multiclassler when you duell on this one certain class. But fact of the matter is that condition warrior currently is as easy to play as never before and the skill ceilling is as low as never before. That’s not any biased offensive comment to my own class it’s kind of the simple truth.

And that’s the reason why I was wondering that interrupt asks for “help” to play the easiest warrior build we ever had in history.

I don’ think we need to argue about this, we all know this proven fact

kdaddy.5431:

Im not sure about you but in regular ranked games, who ever the better player are win not matter the class. At the ESL level from what i saw, all anyone could talk about was the mesmer to thief aspect and imo the necro be lesser then the warrior.

^
TCG and Rank 55 did even confirm it themself that nec and thief does work but is simply inferior to revenant/warrior comps. You have to play much more properly and are still in a slight disadvantage. So to say that thief and necro comp is equal to warrior/rev is just wrong and that PZ would have lost against TCG anyways even with a different composition doesn’t matter at all.

Then people telling how great Toker was on thief and how great Nos was on nec – they indeed were absolutly amazing and from what I’ve seen astral played much more impressive than rank 55 somehow – and that’s the point, they still lost. You simply can do much less mistakes and wrong decisions with a rev/warrior comp not to mention that the classes themself are way easier to play.

And I’m 100% sure neither PZ nor Astral would have played necro/thief comp if they scrimed EU comps more often before. Necro just sucks in comparison to warrior and a thief simply will create a more complicated game to yourself by making rotations way harder.

Mashedwarf.8235:

snip

I actually did play with and against the top warriors. Two of them – Roms brother and Amstardam – are even in my team and I used to main warrior myself. When I rerolled back to warrior after 3 months break I could literally faceroll Levins revenant when we did serveral test 1v1s.
But np mate,you can’t know.

@interrupt guy, it doesn’t bother me, I’m just wondering and find it funny. It’s not meant offensive in any way but warrior in the current situation makes even old settler shoutbow look skillfull and considering your forum posts you don’t seem any new to warrior.

my dog mastered condition warrior within 1h. why do you need help to learn rotations and tricks etc ? There isn’t anything new and especally as warrior main those builds are super easy to master – and yea I indeed mean “master”. Even as non warrior main it’s super easy to reroll and you barely notice any difference between a multiclassler and a I only can play warrior guy

Hes absolutly right with what he did state. Necro is like warrior but inferior and thief is like revenant but inferior.
That was actually the main problen from Na teams. Thief and necro does work. But only if the enemy comp plays with thief and necro as well. Against revenant and warrior comp you are in a disadvantage right from the start.

And you ALWAYS should balance from an esl point of view and never from a causal point of view where learn to play issues are considered with

yea exactly

your whole list is incorrect and even my dog whould have done a more accurate one
…..
daredevil god tier lmao

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vJAQNApeRnMdAtkiVhAehAElilqA7d02antIFgGQAQpHE7yBA-TpBHABJVGQgHAQBHCAAOCABcCAKf/BA

that’s the build you looking for

#DrazehMVP #bestduellerworld #Drazehisbeast

Pvt Frosty.6973:

Why do you have this idea that I want to go to WTS. I just want competition

Because you quoted the part that is reffering to WTS spot and not the first and last part which is dealing with the topic competition.

You already agreed to the fact that the EU PL scene is dead. Whats the point in dragging along sceletons of these teams!

Neither it is the fault of pl-players that they are inactive nor its the pl scene which is dead. Its the pvp in general. The “challanger team scene” is as dead as the pl scene – there are about 2-3 teams that started to try in pvp when everyone else stoped.
The only difference between both is that the challanger teams went on with playing yoloque matches while most of the pl-players aren’t interested to play matches that blast out 500:100 each game.
I wouldn’t call this competition.
The guild leaderboard was in all 3 seasons just a huge joke and even the achievement-points-leaderboard seems more competitive to me, to be honest.

A simple solution would be to allow everyone to participate and not only pl-teams or those 2 challanger teams who farmed PuGs in yoloq.
Still it is a shame to not provide anything to those teams. Everyone should be able to compete in someway. If not in a tournement like that, they defintly should provide something else, especally because anet even announced something for those teams. But anet always has been better in announcing and talking than in implementing and carrying out.
The best thing would be Go4 Cups, ToL etc. which fit best for both, a growing and a dieing game. But I’ve already said this before.

Pvt Frosty.6973:

dominik.9721:

On the other hand, even if it would be open for everyone it doesn’t really matter because vermillion would and will win anyways – so w/e.
It’s WTS where the best teams should play and hands down -that’s TCG/Rank 55/Vermillion and not any Top 10 Challanger-Team which is “on top” because 90% of the former players ain’t playing actively anymore at the moment.

Yes Obviously WTS should host the best 3 teams of each region, and right now it is easily Vermillion. But that does not mean they should just get the spot uncontested. Whats the point in hosting a “competition” for this proclaimed Wildcard if in actuality there isn’t any competition. You might aswell just say “hey WTS will be the top 3 teams of the last PL” instead of hosting a turnament.

Why are teams that don’t even play this game anymore just handed money without them running any risk of having their positions taken away by anyone else. How can they not think that teams that were the top of the game almost half a year ago (more or less) are still in any way current?!

Ah man just so let down. I don’t even care about money, I just want to compete in some way. Any way. Anet doesn’t want me to T:T

As long as Vermillion is allowed to participate hey will get the third spot “for free” and "uncontested"anyways – no matter if they have to compete against challanger teams or pro league teams only. The only way where a challanger team could get a place is to exclude every pl team which also means to exclude vermillion.And tbh this would be stupid because a team would get a spot that defintly does not belong to WTS and would only get the spot because of inactivity of other players.

I agree that it is bad to not even give the teams any chance to participate.

On the other hand, even if it would be open for everyone it doesn’t really matter because vermillion would and will win anyways – so w/e.
It’s WTS where the best teams should play and hands down -that’s TCG/Rank 55/Vermillion and not any Top 10 Challanger-Team which is “on top” because 90% of the former players ain’t playing actively anymore at the moment.

In my opinion they just should make Go4 cups again. A game made for causals where 90% of the good players are inactive currently needs tournements which fit for the present situation. Gw2 PvP lacks players primarily. This means everyone has to be able to compete in some way, to make it grow.

tbh, the only streams that are worth watching are helseth’s and rom’s and not because of guildwars 2, gameplay or anything but because of their person itself.
considering they are super inactive in streaming gw2 and considering all good players are inactive in general – there is absolutly nothing that would make me watch gw2 twitch. I’ll probably watch the finals for a bit but that’s it.

only thing which is more boring than playing dead pvp is watching dead pvp

Acandis.3250:

When the top players of the population are leaving the game once they get Legend, and tell their friends they only play for a couple days to get Legend, then they leave the game until next season

Can only speak for EU but the lack of players does not come from that there is nothing to do once you reached legend.
With reference to the good players, most of them didn’t even get legend simply because we immediately stoped to play actively after pro league. Basically, every good and cool tournement-player is inactive except tcg and rank 55 (finals) because there is no real incentive to play.

What’s mainly left in pvp are the usual causals and a few wannabes who suddenly come out of their corner and start to tryhard in a time where 90% of the good players don’t play anymore.They have been non existent for the pvp-scene for 3,5 years and suddenly think they would be the peak of pvp itself. Only a very few people I’ve already seen before season 3 are still playing. So since this is atm additonally the worst pvp-community and playerbase we ever had in gw2-history, I also doubt that anyone will come back tbh.

alchemyst.2165:

dominik.9721:

I don’t main thief and never did. I’m just stating facts which you will notice and agree with once you reached a decent lvl. At this lvl you also will stop to ask about revenant buffs.
pathetic.

Um, sorry but I still disagree with your whole argument. And thief actually does see play in pro league, just look at any of their streams. It’s literally right there.

inb4 you say I’m not at a decent level: I’m a champion shadow, legendary thief, rank 80, who is on the GCL team that is hovering between around #1 and #2, and on another team in the same guild (same people, different name) that is hovering around #4 and #5. I’ve been on two formal PvP teams, this one is for fun.

I can frequently 1v1 and am actually an asset to teamfights because I run a build that supports teamfighting. I am also still the fastest player on the team. If you tell me you can’t teamfight, even by sacrificing mobility, I just have to laugh. Don’t call people pathetic and condescend when you obviously can’t figure it out yourself – Thief’s role is a roamer, and even then, you still can teamfight. (Changing your build around also increases teamfight ability) So I would suggest looking at yourself rather than the class.

Edit: you also said you don’t main thief. That explains a lot as to why you seem to be having trouble.

We nearly won in pl against sindreners team only because of composition, they had defintly the more active and more motivated players – but thief comp.
And sindrener was basically the only thief that showed up in EU pl saying himself that thief is suboptimal because he has no usage apart from decaping and +1.
So don’t talk about the viabitly of thiefs in tournement play if you never have played there. None gives a kitten if you are legendary,rank 80 or champion shadow

I don’t main thief and never did. I’m just stating facts which you will notice and agree with once you reached a decent lvl. At this lvl you also will stop to ask about revenant buffs.
pathetic.

Ye so let’s balance the game around those 95% random games filled with crying causals that have not a single clue about anything. If we would do this DH is the first class which gets nerfed.

gg mate

Tomiyou.3790:

dominik.9721:

it actually is a problem since revenant is able to do the same with the difference that rev is also able to stay in teamfights and 2v2s. thief on the contrary can’t do anything apart from decaping and +1. considering now that thief +1 sucks against certain classes like scrapper and warrior it is pretty obvious that there is a problem.
considering that anet does not care, never did care and considering that pvp is dead anyways – it is kind of irrelevant, tho

And rev has no condi cleanse. Thief is in a good spot and if you think conquest is all about 1v1s and teamfights, you are bad. I’d rather decap enemy points and chip away something like 50-100 points because of it, rather than be able to 1v1.

Who cares if the rev has “no” condi cleanse if he is still 10 times better than thief in any fight where conditions get spammed? And saying that the game is not only about teamfights and 1v1s is as stupid as saying the game is not only about decaps. It seems even more stupid because it shows that you didn’t even read properly – simply because I already said that thief is great at decaping but that’s it.

There is a reason why every team runs revenant and nearly no team runs thief – in 5v5 conquest thief is kitten compared to revenant atm.

but keep trying mate, you look better if you call others bad who are obviously better than you ever will be

it actually is a problem since revenant is able to do the same with the difference that rev is also able to stay in teamfights and 2v2s. thief on the contrary can’t do anything apart from decaping and +1. considering now that thief +1 sucks against certain classes like scrapper and warrior it is pretty obvious that there is a problem.
considering that anet does not care, never did care and considering that pvp is dead anyways – it is kind of irrelevant, tho

Pvp is dead. Most of the tournement players don’t even log in anymore or only play one hour per week. Pvp is flooded with causals and a few wannabe-tryhards who suddenly come out of their corner since everyone good is gone and since none is playing seriously. 99% of the cool people that you already knew in 2013/2014 aren’t playing actively anymore.

It’s still a powercreeped environment with long queuetimes,without build diversity, without any competitive leaderboard and without any prospect of improvement.

Sad but true

It’s too late anyways. Already 90% of the good players don’t play this game actively anymore.
What’s left is:

1) the 10% because of finals

2) a bunch of wannabes that have been irrelevant till HoT but suddenly think they are “competitive” because they finally can play in a powercreeped environment and because everyone else isn’t playing seriously anymore.

3) causals

There is no way to make pvp great again.

Heimdallr.7021:

warrior has been good for 2 weeks? nerf the class to the ground.

Nobody wants to nerf warrior into the ground.

And that warrior was too weak the last seasons is completly irrelevant and not an argument to justify anything.
The present balance matters.

I like how xanctus “dragonslayer” is always telling other warrior mains they wouldn’t know much about their class,allthough they already have achieved in pvp more than he ever will.

If you think that…

-> passive 800~hp heal
-> a condition-cleanse that removes three conditions every 3~ seconds ( no bug)
->the ability to cause four stacks confusion,four stacks bleed,blind and daze with only one skill on a 2,5 s cd

…would be fine, I have to tell you that you are as clever as those guys who defended revenant and scrapper in season 2.

But however, there is no point in arguing with biased people, they will defend their own class when it’s powercreeped and fall in tears when other classes are stronger than their own class.

I know what you are trying to say but I didn’t make any statement about pro league itself.
I did just like to set the record straight and added some thoughts which should be considered. That’s it.

leman.7682:

Grimkram missing the point by thinking in absolute values.

“Thinking in absolute values”. It sounds more intelligent than it actually is, trust me.

You implied that 200k pl budget is not cheap..

I’m pretty amazed with the marketing-for-living guy who said PL is cheap marketing.

… which is simply just wrong – consider the number ‘absolute’ or ‘relative’,it doesn’t matter, your intimation is still wrong. 200k budget for a marketing project is basically nothing, even for a simple research that has no impact at all it would still be considered ‘cheap’. Of course, you could hire four employees,paying them 50k p.a and let them create content instead. Maybe it provides more success,maybe it doesn’t. But fact of the matter is that 200k budget is nothing even if it would be a whole failure.
Up to this point I didn’t say anything about pro league whether it was successfull, usefull or what not else.

Still, the most basic purpose of marketing is to increase the engagement with your product by people. And by this most basic measure, PL has failed completely.

True. The main goal of most marketing projects is customer acquisition and with reference to this goal pro league was a huge fail. With reference to the goal to keep customers it is a completly different case,tho.

I still didn’t evaluate pro league, I just gave an objective answer without any subjective influence, saying that 200k budget is cheap and stating that marketing is more than customer acquisition. Nothing else.

leman.7682:

I’m pretty amazed with the marketing-for-living guy who said PL is cheap marketing.

Why are you amazed? 200k budget is nothing. I know corporates with 10 men that do spend more for marketing.
Also marketing is not only there for customer acquisition it’s also used to keep customers.
And that’s the point, guess how many would leave this game if there wouldn’t be any of those “marketing-tournements”

Ithilwen.1529:

I’m seeing match after match with 2-4 Wars and DH on the other side and none on mine. It’s very clear that my side is set to lose.

This is not “competitive.”

Yea with two dragonhunters in enemy team it should be very clear which side is set to lose – but it’s not yours.
And yes this is indeed not competitive but it is the reason you are stucked in sapphire and hopefully you will still be there at the end of the season.

But if you message me ingame I can send you some gold because you’ve won the award of the season for the first player who is still complaining about dragonhunters and talking about mmr-hell