Guild Wars 2

Chaith.8256:

Also if you’re a high MMR player, you get a 500-0 spawn camped more often because you’re always stuck as the messiah to somehow bring 4 new players to success against a 5 person premade.

pretty much the most true thing ever said

Chaith.8256:

Zord.6130:

Chaith.

Yeah you make a lot of great points and I can see you’ve obviously played enough of the build to know what you’re talking about.. I think Engi can be more impactful than D/D Ele and Guardian in teamfights. It’s top tier CC and downed cleave and you can potentially full wipe a team of foolish revivers, it’s probably the biggest swing profession in teamfights if disrespected. D/D Ele is much more defensive in nature, it doesn’t get those decisive stunlocks and then corpse cleave into submission.

Also Magnet is not brokenly instant, it’s better when you save it for an immob/knockdown or a severely pressured enemy because it gets dodged a lot and that’s fair. Fake casting it is better against enemies that you know have nothing preventing them from reacting and dodging.

Here’s what a realistic duel looks like when a D/D Ele assaults your point.. many similarities to when a Cele War assaults you, or Ranger/Necro/Mes/DPS Guard.

He stunbreaks your first Overcharged Shot with Armor of Earth, possibly Updrafts you, which you stunbreak. He puts Ring of Fire down and attempts to Drakes Breath you to death. You block the full drake’s breath, use Healing Turret, and then you are completely out of cooldowns. This is where you need to get the hell off, otherwise you are going to start a downward spiral to losing the 1v1 as soon as he gets the next Drake’s Breath on you. If the fight blows up, and both teams rotate there, they may totally get wiped from being a man down, if you’re easy pickins’, stay healthy. Be off the point within 15 seconds, I’ve run this scenario a lot.

Crating in the first 15 seconds is a viable way to temporarily bunker a point, interrupting or healing through Drake’s Breath. This is an exception to me.

You’re not wrong in saying that Engi can throw his body on the point for a minute, but since you’re throwing the fight to do that, I don’t consider it an option. Best to recruit a node fighter like Cele War/Ele who are optimal on point and keep your Engineer roaming.

if you cant dodge an updraft you should probably l2p

Chaith.8256:

Arachnid.4062:

Maybe we should give Mesmer an undodgeable auto proc that puts 5 stacks of torment on their opponent every 10 seconds instead of buffing the scepter auto.

Alright cool, Mesmers can get Tormentiary Powder,

And then Turret Engineers in hotjoins & unranked get to apply bleeding on all turret auto-attacks and apply AoE conditions on death. Hahaha. Or we could just not.. because that sounds completely awful.

I’d rather not play the game of ‘whose proc is it anyways’ but maybe closer to ‘what builds are not viable in tPvP and never should be’? Stealth-Condi Mesmer is certainly one of them.

theres our forum warrior thinking that celestial engi isn’t brokenly overpowered and that its fair that it does more dmg than 90% of berserker amulet classes while having more tankiness than everything except a bunker guard and cele ele (wont even say warr because vs burst engi is 10x better)

youre a grizzard harry

Saiyan.1704:

ArrDee.2573:

HamHat.5201:

cele ele isn’t really all that op, they are actually pretty healthy they have counters and counter other classes. condi engi on the other hand only countered by another condi engi and longbow ranger, and counter every one else.

wat

Wahoo! Bye frands!

… idk what HamHat is smoking. I beat most Engi’s and I’m a Guard no less. On the other hand, d/d celes ele’s should never lose to a zerker guard…

Move on. Nothing to see here.

burn guard

Darnis.4056:

Based Devs.
Good Changes Overall.
Reduced TTK for Glass by nerfing Might.
Some passive play nerfed(Battle,Nightmare),
Some underpowered weaponsets buffed..
This meta is probably over..

But Some changes make me shake my head..
Add More passive play with new Sigil of Fire™, now available for condition classes.
Buff Duel build ranger to also be effective in team fights.
Buff Medi guard which is a mostly a faceroll class which hard counters Zerkers.

We did not get buffed.

Aaron.2413:

Rickster.8752:

And I know what I am talking about. I won EU solo queue leaderboards WITH the best win % and in fact everytime I was active I was right at the top. You can say it means nothing or whatever, but the fact is I did and you didn’t. And that is SOLO, so I proved my INDIVIDUAL SKILL in every respect. So get over it. If you want to claim you know more than me then you should of proven it by winning at as high a rate as I did and having as high an MMR.

Ele/engi is OP to the extreme and that is a FACT. And its not just celestial, the classes themselves should be nerfed, that is another FACT.

End of story, gg all. If you think you know more than me you are wrong completely.

Thats cool. I won NA team q leaderboards with the second highest MMR in the game. I played condi engineer for about one year until celestial came about. During the summer I transitioned to celestial amulet. I agree with you 100%, engi and ele are OP or Outplayable. I hate when i get outplayed on my engi, i cant do nothin about it… and to be fair, your resume is pretty dang strong.. hell you won the solo q leaderboards… so yea i agree, we need to buff these outplayable classes

its funny cuz engi is liek the least outplayable class lmao

Inb4 forum warrior 5G comes to defend his OP class

1. Save dodges for grenades. If youre using sw/f you can counter most of the other skills with blocks and blinds and ZD.
2. Generosity sigils help
3. If vs condis, count to 9 and dodge the swaps (or blind)
4. You can usually predict overcharged shot.
5. Save contemplation of purity. You really dont need to use this skill vs celestial engis until youre about to be kittened by either slick shoes or an overcharge combo.
6. If vs Elixir S make sure you land your binding blade 2x in a row. Its practically a gauranteed win since their stunbreak is 60s.
If vs Slick Shoes, dont really use binding blade unless you know you can and want to land a smite condition for sure. If they burn their stun break for some reason because they can, make sure you DEFINITELY land it.
7. Land Focus 4 every single time, you lose if you dont. I use it when they use magnet usually.
8. Save JI vs Cele Rifle. Like with most celestial builds, JI needs to be saved for CC, not for doing dmg. The classes have too many ways to stop a burst which means its best usage is to save yourself.
9. Land smite condition. Every. Single. Time.
10. Outplay them. If they’re in grenade kit, sit back and turn around a little and watch them throw the grenades in the wrong spot. Once they have, using Flashing Blade to get back up to them and they wont have anymore greandes to land at ther feet.

In the end, just play perfectly. Its lame but medi guard really is OP at the highest skill level in 1v1s.

oh and if they drop crate or theyre a good cele engi with slick shoes you wont win every unfortunately (with sword at least)

ArrDee.2573:

Don’t forget traiting for downstate!

Wahoo! Bye frands!

that too

i think i might do this and singing my favorite song
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t2mU6USTBRE

I tested this over a year ago and it did not prioritize might.

Narcarsis.5739:

brannigan.9831:

The vast amount of players playing N/A don’t want to put in the work or take it as seriously as the Abjured does. So they aren’t going to have any real competition any time soon.

This. We have practiced maybe three or four times. Abjured plays almost every day. On top of that they refuse to scrim so there’s hardly any point to play the game when your best source of improvement harbours feelings towards a certain individual and denies that. Solo queue and Team queue are a waste of time as well. Our best practice would be during the weeklies if we were able to get everyone on.

Anywho, doesn’t matter much in the grander scheme of life.

Radioactive practices multiple hours evey day of the week but it hardly matters when we try to make something incredibly ineffective like double power necro + bunk guard work.

Chaith.8256:

Harbinger.8637:

Searing Flames is underwhelming, hardly any Guard will take it over something like Blind Exposure. Might is applied so fast in this meta, that stripping it every ten seconds isn’t going to do much.

If it actually strips might 100% reliably, it’s not underwhelming when you consider how much god mode you’re denying when stripping an Ele or War’s might every 10s so they can never go past 3-6!

This is all in theory based on Eura claiming it prioritizes might.

it removes might like 70% of the time. I think its actualy a “last applied first removed” trait. But really the problem is that guardians dont even burn people every 10 seconds LOL.

uberkingkong.8041:

, and sadly I don’t know of any recognizable medi guards.

after all those compliments ;_;

as much as I dont think linking gw2drama is a good idea on the forums..
https://twitter.com/GW2Drama/status/555545412145528832

was this legit? did karl really ask this?
I honestly cant tell if this dude is serious. if it is I think Im seriously just going to go off myself at this point.

Im glad you think Im such a good player LMAO but dude lets be real each person for abjured is either the best player for their respective classes or like the top 3 for their classes.

I hate to burst your bubble but Iuck and darth are even farther away than I am from being esports LMAO

give flashing blade 1s chill and make zealots defense wind up 1/4s instead of 1/2s.

uberkingkong.8041:

OzarcTheDefialer.5346:

uberkingkong.8041:

MystikaLsmuRF.7150:

brb talking in 3rd person on another account

Lol +1,

If anything he played at odd hours, avoided all the good players and won 99 times against scrubs.

Just think about it, do you really think your that good that you don’t lose any games 99 times?

Maybe if your playing scrubs yes, but theres a lot of good players out there to knock you the kitten out.

Backpack plays only during prime time, and then all day on the weekends….
He qs with the Abjured….
If Backpack Phantaram Noscoc Wakkey and Toker are quing…. name 5 players that will beat them…. there are no good players that can knock them out

Zoose, Iuck, Ostrich Eggs, Caed, Darth Vanquisher.

Theres more people out there than that, that can own the people you mentioned.

I read this during class and literally laughed out loud and got a bunch of funny looks. If you’re serious I feel sorry for you LOL.

Tael.5432:

I think these answers are very subjective because people just seem to be listing what they have trouble against in PVP on the characters they play in PVP.

I’ve seen necro as underpowered a lot on this thread, and d/d ele as overpowered. However I have played D/D ele for about 600 games over the last 12 months and the one class I am genuinely scared of fighting 1v1 and even on teams is necromancer.

The reason matching up against a necromancer even in a team fight is scary is because if they are smart, and wait until I just finish my water attunement then use the utility corrupt boon which transfers all my boons into conditions, I can basically be spiked down very quickly, certainly before water comes up again. It’s no secret that D/D ele requires high boon duration and having a tonne of boons always active, one well timed corrupt boon in a team fight or 1v1 and they are crippled from being able to defend themselves.

TLDR; Builds in GW2 are much like playing paper scissors rock, something can always hard or soft counter apparently ‘OP’ builds.

l2p and save cleansing fire and use cantrips effectively

Phaeton.9582:

^

“so ya. not meta because eles and engis”

Celestial* Engis and Eles. Without those builds medi guard beats everything but non-spirit condi rangers…

Also if you’re running scepter and/or GS (for the leap/weapon swap) positioning is a complete non issue and entirely L2p, especially given the hard mitigation that can facilitate moving back into play.

That being said my tier list would be:

S: None
A: None
B: Celestial Engi/Ele
C: Everything else (why you being such a hipster? You won’t go pro with that attitude!)

Actually it beats any ranger except settler amulet haha

Lordrosicky.5813:

ArrDee.2573:

glock.6590:

I agree , saying that medi guard and shatter mesmer is C tier is dumb. A good mesmer can kill anything 1v1 except thieves and medi guards. And medi guards destroy any class with zerker ammy equipped. I remember in the king of the hill servers people almost banned medi guard from there .

Because Medi Guards have 0 mobility, are mostly zerk melee with no disengages like Thief, and get melted by condis! Tiers aren’t based on 1v1s bro!

Wahoo! Bye frands!

Medi guards dont get melted by condis in the slightest. They have some of the most efficient condi clear in the game. And their mobility isn’t that bad.

you have to really really be efficient with every single port you use (its approximately 5x less forgiving than thief in terms of positioning imo).
the problem with medi guard is that, even though its true they kitten everything with a zerker amulet, this meta HAS NO ZERKER AMULETS.
In fact, s/d thief is probably the only zerker class that really can beat a medi guard at top tier vs top tier. Like wise its the only zerker class in this meta.

so ya. not meta because eles and engis.

the real tier list:

S elementalist
A Engineer Thief
A- Warrior Necro
B Guardian
C Ranger Mesmer

Black Box.9312:

I run a 0/6/6/1/1 with sw/f and sc/t. It’s more single-target oriented, but what a lot of people don’t realize is that single target combat can be very beneficial even in group fights as long as you know how to focus and prioritize properly. I’ve just never really thought that the standard 2/1/6/1/4 really has enough of that burst potential, and GS is just too easy for a skilled player to avoid IMO.

I disagree Greatsword has strong auto attacks that can really hurt, causing people to dodge which lets you land binding blade etc. however it’s true whirling wrath will not land very much.

Even I have had trouble carrying really bad players vs decent players. Yesterday I was 6-12 which is the worst Soloq day I’ve ever had.

ArrDee.2573:

Actually if a teammate attempts to revive you, I consider that a blessing! Unless he’s like a D/P Thief attempting to res me through Engi grenade cleave! That’s just silly! Bad players never revive!

Wahoo! Bye frands!

most truthful thing ever said. for some reason the completely stupid people that have been appearing in my matches dont even know how to rez. I honestly feel like they just replaced ranked q with hot joins.

i have a lot (a lot) of meditation guardian footage on my stream at twitch.tv/holymoobs if it helps

outplay them

I think meditation guard is definitely viable especially in EU where teams aren’t stacking engis and eles as much as they can

ArrDee.2573:

• Nerf Entangle!
• Guardian Sword 2 gives 5 seconds of swiftness, even if you cast it without a target!
• Guardian GS 3 chills for 1 second instead of blind!
• Gadget traits reworked!

Wahoo! Bye frands~!

why nerf GS ;_;

Anastasis.7258:

Chaith.8256:

Narcarsis.5739:

P.S. If they nerf sigils other classes will be hit harder than Ele and Engi unless they specifically target Battle/Doom/Intelligence alone.
-Caed

That’s just something we disagree on.. and your stinging disapproval and disappointment in me doesn’t bother me much, lol.

While you blame all the abilities that have been constant through all metas, I think the Bird of Fire’s suggestion of removing Celestial Amulet in PvP would be better for the game than messing with such things.

How you see that as being out of selfishness, I don’t know. Nerf Cele Engi. Nerf Cele Ele, Nerf Cele Warrior. Nerf Cele

Nerf it.

Pls.

And shut up with all this bull about defending my teammates or own profession. I seriously don’t care about what professions are on top, we will adapt. I don’t like Cele Eles and I have no qualms about playing Rabid if you are actually serious.

Just nerf it intelligently.

I want to play a game. We should look at you posts histories to find out if you really care about Cele engineer getting nerf my son.

+1

glock.6590:

Mesmer and thief are not that hard to be honest. I played engi ( usually thief) for the recent days and its not as faceroll as people think even if you’re celestial. The only faceroll thing about cele engi is the supply crate, without crate it really has a high skillcap.

I cant talk for cele ele but cele engi is definitly not faceroll if you dont crate your 1v1’s.

theyre both seriously so easy.

Yumiko Ishida.3769:

What really hurts is everyone thinks they are good using a build off a website!

I lost more matches on my Guard recently than I am winning due to people using these builds and sucking.

I then talk in map chat and if gets into another meta vs non meta fight and people saying I’m the problem to why I’m losing when i know for a fact its my team and not me. As I even were winning on my own custom builds on my engi only to lose the lead 500 to 400 or worse because someone else drops the ball when i have been carrying and leading every kitten game!

I am smarter than the meta and it really sucks that everyone targets me with name calling and kitten saying in the noob and scrub.

Who’s better? A player that knows his or her classes more in pve and pvp for 2 years and just started in pvp or a person copying off a website just because they were told it works and doesn’t know any better?

If you ant to not resort to petty name calling and circular arguments and rather want to help a new and rather disgruntled pvper, you know where to find me.

lets be real meta builds have been proven to work better than, as you said it yourself, some build some guy from pve who hasnt done pvp made up.

lately ive been playing the hardmode where I have lagspikes that last 15-20s every couple minutes or so. makes it really interesting when theres an automatic you die implemented at random times.

Keksmuffin.1450:

huehuehueuhe

on topic: if you want to do pve with it there is no point in not just getting full zerker.

steam gizmo focus represent

uberkingkong.8041:

Haven’t had any real bad streaks lately, like 8 is probably the biggest.
However my games are looking like, L L L W L L L L L L L W W L L L L L L L L L L W.
Is losing majority of games frustrating? YUP.
Prior to this new system I had 49.9% solo que win rate, before that solo que system I had 56% win rate. Currently at 42%.

So I’m not really liking this new system. Also, the players I keep getting que’ed with are end game PvP’ers.

Game likes to pit me against the good players too. I’ve noticed I played against Thee Faux like 10 times, but all 10 of those games were against him. The only player I tend to get on the same team with is Ostrich Eggs, sometimes Zoose (and it isn’t no blowout win, we still struggle, but win most of the times I’ve had one of them on my team). Also, Drunknpossum, is always on the other team too, I played against him a lot, and I don’t think I’ve ever won a game against Thee Faux or Drunknpossum.

no offense to them but thee faux and possum are not that great lol

i once lost like 7 in a row cuz we went against the same team every time and it was pretty frustrating ya

witcher.3197:

Rune of the Pack should be nerfed too. Either reduced the duration of the AoE boon application (Fury/Might/Swiftness) to 5-7 seconds (down from 10) or increase CD to 30 sec (up from 20).

50% Fury uptime (or more if you’ve got boon duration) for you and your allies, passively, from a single rune is just not right IMO.

how about just remove the AoE effect?

tbh solo vs premades can be really fun as long as they put you with people who have a half brain and will listen to you.

Laserbolt.6731:

“Half the people on the front page are in the 50%’s.”

Doesn’t this just mean the matcher does a good job of giving a match where you have a only a 50/50 chance of winning? As designed?

then people like lux who do mostly soloqs still have 70% wins so clearly theyre carrying a little harder

I’m really really surprised chaith is trying this hard to keep his build completely OP. Like honestly I thought he was smarter than this.
Chaith you realize the only classes that have any problem at all with shoutbows are the d/d eles and engis right? Zerker classes have ABSOLUTELY NO PROBLEM WHATSOEVER vs them. Literally just cc/burst them to death. The reason you think “theyre op” is because its a kinda (KINDA) counter to your build in SOME situations.

Like holy crap dude.

cymerdown.4103:

Here’s my suggestions, slightly modified from the other thread (similar in a lot of ways to Tarcis’s suggestions):

General
Amulets
Celestial amulet: -20 to each stat (-140 stats total).
Runes
Nightmare runes – (6) Fear lasts 1s instead of 2s.
Balthazar runes – (6) Cooldown of AoE burn on heal is 30s instead of 10s.
Sigils
Might from Battle Sigil lasts for 15s instead of 20s.
Blast Finishers
Might from Flame Blast finishers last for 15s instead of 20s.

Engineer
Gear shield cd is 25s instead of 20s.
Magnet lines should be visible from stealth if possible.
Slick shoes – utility skill is 60s cd instead of kitten , toolbelt skill is 40s instead of 30s.
Poison Grenades are blockable.
Incendiary Powder burning lasts 2s instead of 4s.
Overcharge shot has a tell animation and a cast time of 0.5s instead of instant and the self-cc is reduced in distance and duration by 50% each.
Magnetic Shield lasts 2s instead of 3s.

Elementalist
Lightning whip cannot be cancelled.
Drake’s Breath deals 2s of burning per hit instead of 3s.
Cleansing Water has a cd of 5s instead of 0s.

Necromancer
Reaper’s Protection fear lasts 1s instead of 2s.
Dark Path has a tell animation.
Doom fear lasts 1s regardless of range.

Guardian
Shield of Absorption can be used while moving and lasts the full duration if not cancelled (4s).

That nerf on ele will never happen since renerfing that trait will completely destroy it

Anastasis.7258:

Anastasis.7258:

General
Runes

Necromancer
1. Add obvious animation to Dark Path.
2.Add Different animation to Staff Mark skills.

Based on that.
you have no idea what you are talking about.

reading the rest. I am going to assume that you play either a Ranger, Guardian or Thief. And although I agree with you more or less that they are in a “OK” spot. Are you trying to nerf the rest of the classes into oblivion?

he plays warrior (and is probably the best on NA) and knows exactly what he’s talking about

Bitty.1409:

Booms.2594:

ArrDee.2573:

Downed state is for newbs! Get good moobs!

Wahoo! Bye frands!

i get downed like once per match

More like 16+ when Shnicky’s in the game!
Wahoo! Bye frands! (does this make it sound less personal?)

that was once………………….. ;_;

ArrDee.2573:

Downed state is for newbs! Get good moobs!

Wahoo! Bye frands!

i get downed like once per match but i still probably have gotten rezzed 4 times since this season started

“but what i’m trying to say is that if you mentally prepare for the worst in your teammates it will hopefully prevent you from raging as hard and appreciating when they actually do something well. Even if that thing they did well is second nature to you.”

most truthful thing Ive ever heard

I honestly praise my teammates if they are smart enough to just rez me when no one is cleaving. That’s honestly better than 95% of the people Ive played with.

Aaron.2413:

I enjoy this new system.
I love playing new players that solo q…
The leaderboards finally don’t show me on top (was getting bored of seeing my name)
I can finally play more than 1 game at once since I get multiple pops in game.
This system gives me fun surprises all the time! In the form of random q pops…
I can finally solo q without worry of fighting other solo q players!! I get to fight real teams!

On another note, how can no team beat CM? Last I checked they were pretty meh..

nobody in EU knows how to play on 3 points and rotate with a cele comp lol

Zypher.9536:

Randomly came across this post just now and I’m wondering, has anything been implemented to fix this by now or is it still an issue?

standardized models lol.

Tao.5096:

Don’t go Far, because we can’t handle 2 players from opposite team with 4 players from our team. You’re necessary. Don’t be a nab and help.

That’s 90% of times what I see in PvP ranked arenas.

mistsim.2748:

Booms.2594:

no you need like 100-200 once you know how to play one class

in order to play said class at a passable level, sure. but not expertly. if you think otherwise, youre basically a theorycrafter/armchair philosopher.

no it means youre a decent player.