Guild Wars 2

frifox.5283:

I made two videos showing how to get the two POI’s back in february. Tried it last week, still works:

- The S S Cuttlefish POI
- Kudu’s Crucible POI

i hope i will never get to do wvw against you lol

fractals
shaman fight
we have a thief in group
asked him to use dagger storm on worms
he uses basilik venom during fight
told him he should probably use dagger storm next time
he: " i have my own playstyle"

Swagg.9236:

Thieves are OK for the most part outside of [Pistol Whip]. The only thing that needs to be addressed are their spammable teleports and teleports in general. The real issue with Thieves with regards to balance is how they just don’t know the meaning of overextending or being in bad position. Their skills instantly forgive them for over committing every time.

It’s really hard not to suggest that the entire class just gets cool-downs, charge skills and longer cast-times and we scrap initiative, or just removing the class entirely. The way that Thief plays now simply put just doesn’t fit well with how GW2 combat was initially conceived.

I can say exactly the same with any other class: they “don’t know the meaning of overextending or being in bad position” due to 2 HP bars, due to stability, due to crazy tankiness etc etc. I have a warrior as well and i can screw up so much on him and still not die where my thief would have died 10 times at least. Same goes for my necro.

1 bad dodge on thief, you are dead; 1 bad dodge on warrior, w/e i can face tank it.

The problem is that ini is required pretty much for every skill. When i play my necro i can just use skills that are not on CD and switch weapons and have new set of skill that i can use. On a thief, if i don’t have ini, i don’t have it no matter what weapon i switch to.

I have no problems with HS spammers tbh i know i can dodge/blind that crap and then they won’t have ini to do anything else besides as long as i stay above 50% it won’t do much dmg either.

I am quite surprised this is still a complain though as lately, even in HJ i saw maybe only one HS spammer.

MaXi.3642:

not completely, but still weaker… maybe it has some influence on initiative regen? or maybe its intended to affect him only partially

Try to get backstab off while being chilled, GOOD LUCK!

DaliIndica.9041:

Romek.4201:

cause this ranks mean nothing and there are some rank 5 players better than rank 50s

rank shows only time played – nothing more

Prove it

This gets banded about so often yet it is never proven. And even if we can find one aspect, I can show 500 instances of low level players being worse when the gap is big. Every one instance of a new account being better than a seasoned played, I will produce 500 showing the other way.

I can show a cat to tap dance. All cats cannot tap dance.

actually i think i saw on Caed’s stream someone smurfing on rank 5 or so.. i know there was person with 1 digit for rank on scoreboard

fugazi.5139:

That is a made up excuse from anet. You can run both regions on one. They just chose to separate for other reasons.

no they don’t

i play from EU on US server and i did play on EU servers as well.. the delay is noticable

i am rank 29 currently and i have beaten bunch teams (not all of them but still) consisiting of rank 50-60… what’s your point?

i agree rank does represent certain amount of experience but it doesn’t represent skill nor team work

you also have to realize that if they actually implemented that change, not only queues would be insanely long but very skilled players of same rank would wash the floor with low skilled players of same rank aka getting free points

i think there should be rank requirement for ranked like you should be at least rank XY before you can start doing ranked that way you won’t have rank 1 getting destroyed in ranked matches

still no reasonable explanation

Nerf this crap aleardy. Even 5 year old can tell that tank with high dmg will beat squishy with high dmg.

In no other game i saw such imbalance where one can build tank and still do really high dmg. Why is this still not adressed?

if you wanna ask that question you should post it on pve/wvw forums…<_<

Forzani.2584:

Cynz.9437:

i find this suggestions pointless unless you add suggestions to severly nerf other classes to make it fair

thieves are already considered bottom tier in pvp (yes few teams run 1 but nobody would consider to bring more, same goes for pve too btw), let’s beat the dead horse

This is ‘WvW’ Discussion. If you believe Thieves are weak in PvP then Anet should consider fixing it. It seems like a common refrain …but but we are weak in ‘fill in the blank’ . So what many are saying is yea, we are freaking overpowered in WvW roaming but it’s only fair because we are weak in other parts of the game.

i can do as good if not better roaming on my warrior, what is your point?

@Sanduskel: you don’t even play a thief

i find this suggestions pointless unless you add suggestions to severly nerf other classes to make it fair

thieves are already considered bottom tier in pvp (yes few teams run 1 but nobody would consider to bring more, same goes for pve too btw), let’s beat the dead horse

in fact i would actually love to see anet to bring other classes to thief current level:
- you shouldn’t be able to go tank and do dmg regardless what class you play
- CCs should have very high CD and last only 1 sec
- any high dmg spells should come at high costs (either cD or recources)
- HP pool from every class should be brough to thief class
- traits that improve toughness should be removed
- all stability spells should be put on 90 sec CD
- all heals should be nerfed to heal for 30% of HP
- all aoe from every class should have long travel time like cluster bomb
- all ranged weapons should have their dmg reduced by half at least
- melee attacks should have positional reuiqrement (aka you can’t do skull crack unless you face the person, if you hit it from wrong side the person doesn’t get stunned but immobbed for 1/4 sec)
- all aoe team support utilities should be removed
- 90% of the utilities shouldn’t be useable underwater
- when you use ranged spells underwater that involve some kind of movement it should daze you (yes, thieves that that underwater spell that dazes themself….ironically)
- condis from each class should be nerfed, each class shouldn’t be able to put more than 3 condis at time
- invulnerability spells should be removed
- protection spells should be removed

i mean i can continue with this ridicilous list but this is what it mean to play a thief currently; so yeah sure, let’s implement suggestions from OP but might as well implement this silly list as well

Lopez.7369:

Actually, every single high-level player currently agrees that thieves are toward the top of the food chain.

1 thief is good.. more than 1 is a los

jk, everyone is around rank 40-60, yoloq

3 engis on team is guaranteed win
3 thieves on team is in 90% of the cases a los

what does anet do? nerf thieves, buffs engis… /slowclap

wtb new game modes that are not based around building tank and mindlessly spam aoe/condi on point…

so ya hours of work on upgrades, sieging up, karma and gold…all gone within 30 sec due to entire map zerg + max amount of superior rams on door…

can’t even defend with sieg because everything is getting destroyed by eles/rangers/necros

wvw = bring map zerg or don’t even bother

i hope you realize that thieves don’t have any survivability outside of moblity and stealth…. they don’t have real stability, they don’t have blocks nor invul, their heals are pretty bad too….

if you gonna ask for such changes you might as well ask for thief changes to remove protection and ignore invulnerability on each dagger strike just to make it fair

phantomlord.3417:

Get off the wall and come open field fight

brb grabbing 20 man pugs to face map zerg, mkay

comming from person who likes d/d in pve: never miss dodge and pray your target dies before you get downed

there is reason why any decent thief is usually the last person to die on high lv fractals: at lv 49 it doesn’t matter if you play tanky class or not, everything can one shot you and since thieves have to dodge they are more used to it, i think

ironically lv 40 is one of the easiest… try out lv 44 or lv 43 lol, it will make you want to uninstall

1) i am already close to uninstalling this game tbh because all i face is engis in pvp and it is pretty much hopeless to fight them on thief; if they nerfed build i play (d/p) i don’t think there would be any really viable tpvp build left so i wouldn’t be able to pvp really unless i reroll other class…

2) i am not quite sure, there are not many options left really… i guess if our utilities got nerfed it would be the end, at least in pvp

3) i would assume majority play in wvw since pvp community is relative small, so wvw changes would probably have bigger impact

4) considering that the buffs we got recently were more of tooltipp change and placement of useless traits in lower tier…. yeah go figure

5) any nerf to survivability… it is already very very low

Kadin.2356:

The nature of the class makes it annoying to fight despite how ineffective it is (see: “run away warrior specs”). It also makes it a lot of fun to play meaning that even though you have to work 3x as hard as some other classes to do the same things the overall satisfaction is greater. What I’m trying to say is that even if they nerf us into oblivion people will still be calling for nerfs because stealth, by it’s very existence, causes some people to have mini-strokes. The flip side is that even when useless people will still play it just because of the fun mechanics.

So yes it will survive. The real question is if areanet balances off of quantitative data or popular opinion.

recent nerfs indicate the latest…. i really wish they would actually look into thief issues and not what issues other classes have with thieves :/

1) Condi builds nerf: sick and tired and about to quit because of mindless aoe/condi spam + tankiness from many classes…really really wish condi builds (aka toughness/condi, cough engis) would get punished with survivability los if they go for dmg like direct dmg builds do.. right now if you go direct dmg, you have to stack power and prec( and crit dmg in most cases), condi builds only need condi stat, rest can be healing/toughness etc.. making powe builds really weak in comparison and obsolete

2) skyhammer removed from tpvp

3) spiritwatch orb redesigned: while carrying orb every class regardless traits/runes/utilities runs at the same speed, the first 5 spells are replaced by orb special spells, porting/popping invul/stealth makes you drop orb

4) add skins obtainable only on pvp but usable in pve (like zenith skins kind of)

5) new game modes

every time i see engi on enemy team i want to uninstall…. tanky, absurd dmg, absurd condi, dazes dazes dazes… can’t do kitten against it

lately every match was just pure frustration due to engis mindless condi spam but i guess this is how we suppose to play: play bunker and spam condis/aoes on point….if you can’t then don’t even bother doing pvp in this game heh

Deli.1302:

See how the wall juts out further at the top of the stairs?

i tried that spot too… still gets hit by eles/necros just didn’t get to capture it on screenshot

even stairs get hit actually

still nothing done about massive aoe spam from eles/necros/rangers/engis etc. on walls making it impossible to defend with sieg….

anet, you gonna do something about it or not? please tell me how we suppose to defend this? how are we suppose to kill this catas? any sieg i would build would either get destroyed by massive aoe or won’t reach the target unless you abuse hacks…

what is point of defensive sieg? why is this issue ignored for so long? if zerging is promoted as only viable defensive tactics why do we have any sieg but rams ?

while i agree with some changes and i do question other

- perplexity runes have no place in pvp imo, it is already terrible rune set and shouldn’t have been introduced at all… there is already too much condition flying around, i would rather less of it than more

- nerf to stealth might cause huge complains from pve community since stealth is about only reason why ppl take thieves in “hard” content, while i understand where you are comming from i don’t think pve community (which is majority of this game) will do

- i think i am not only person who is sick and tired of AI and would rather see less of it, so i think buffs to thief guild, dog and trap are unnecessary

- traps: i think traps need to be completely redesigned because even if you lower CD on them and up the dmg, i personally would still never use them… i think traps should be team utility fields kind of like water field…

- i kind of do like poison and smoke bomb change, i personally don’t use them as much due to slot limitation i think it could be usefull for certain builds

- i think the issue with revealed and last refuge will still persist with this change, i do like current last refuge (despite the issue) since there were quite few times when i could do absolutely nothing while being knocked around and dazed for my entire HP bar (cough engis) and last refuge did save my kitten there… if your proposed change would be applied it actually would force me to stop from any agressive actions for few sec :/

- i miss old pistol daze :’(

- dagger training: i think it is hella massive buff to d/d… while i understand that d/d doesn’t have as much utility as other sets i think d/d already does quite a lot of dmg compared to other sets, the only issue is that CnD is very unreliable… i would rather add some utility to CnD and death blossom maybe than give flat 13% dmg increase to d/d.. this is comming from person who played d/d for a while an had to drop it due low utility in pvp :/

oh lastly, can you add tow line change so it doesn’t daze thief himself on use :/

lol this thread was actually fun to read

i want that mug O.o

just to make it clear… you complain about 5 → 2222? if you really do i highly doubt you actually do any tpvp as any half decent thief wouldn’t run “perma stealth” in pvp…. it is pointless

and trying to mask it under “oh hey i get such noobs on my team”, well guess what… i get bunch of “noobs” warriors, necros and what not fighting mid road, mindlessly mashing hammer etc. should we ask to nerf all of other classes because ppl playing it are “noobs”?

cymerdown.4103:

Cynz.9437:

as far as thief requirement on team, please tell me the source where you got such idea… the reason why high ranked teams still play with a thief is simple: would you rather play with some random person you don’t know for the sake of the class or would you play with the guy you know for long time and you know he good?

i would go with the last and as far as forums go, all i see from posts is that thieves are bottom tier, please prove me wrong

also don’t forget, that this game is not balanced around 10 ppl that are amazingly good at their class but around majority and in big picture thieves are a joke in many cases

Ok, well don’t read forums to find out about class viability. I’m going based off of tournament results and personal experience with teams. Thieves are highly desirable on teams for the following major reasons:

1) Highest horizontal and z-axis mobility in game, very important in a game mode about point capture.
2) Fast kills on a called target, especially on ones that have used some of their cool downs in a teamfight.
3) Because of evasion and/or stealth, they can build full glass and extend and pressure the other team’s squishiest members without as much fear of counterpressure as other glass cannon builds.
4) Sleight of Hand stops Stability-covered resses, stomps, and res utilities.

A shatter Mesmer is the closest match for the Thief, but are somewhat outshined by Thief at the moment.

1) which tournament are you talking about?
2) many classes can kill someone fast, it is not something that special to thief; as mes or ele i can blow someone really fast and won’t even have certain positioning requirement… heck even as war i can eviscerate people for 13k and still have certain survivability
3) the reason why thieves build glass is because tehy don’t have any other viable choices: if you want to do any half decent dmg on thief you have to go glass, if you invest into survival your dmg will be pathetic and even if you build full tank you still get 2 shot; yes, there is condi/toughness build but it is sad dmg wise and can be easily countered… thieves don’t really have a choice and stealth is hardly an good survival tool when game is based around spamming aoe condis/CCs on point

saying that pressuring thief is not possible is wrong, it is pretty easy to kill a thief if you know how they work and i saw quite few teams that were focusing the hell out of thieves and they were useless the entire match

4) there are pretty of things that also stop rezzes and stomps…. 30 pts traits is not only one… and besides, if thief wasted 21 sec CD to stop rez i think you won than one

i know this is soloq but it just a prime example where thief is completely worthless; the score was somewhere around 125-500…
take a guess why? because as i stated before in other thread, thieves are only good as their team they can’t carry it simply because tournament builds are not ment for dueling and they can’t bunker points nor capture them if someone is already guarding it (unless player is bad or another thief)

lastly i still don’t see any good explanation why squishiest class in game with no survivability what’s however should have their only reliable stun break nerfed

yeah i gave up on those… ironically i had better luck getting precursors (got 3rd today) than this weps…lol

Quickfoot Katana.8642:

D/P thieves are far more useful than S/D thieves. They should not be in the same tier.

S/D thieves could use a revert on the introduced cast time for IR, while compensating by reducing the gap-cover distance from Flanking Strike by 33%, so 3-3 spammers would be punished by bad positioning and counterplayed by good positioning.

ppl still have flashbacks… give them another month or so

and i had a match full of engis and necros and i wanted to uninstall -_-

super steal and ini gain, that’s all

thief survival is a joke anyway, no SA in the world will save you from mindless aoe/cc spam in pvp atm

Please, give us option to report players for afk in ranked matches. There are some players that do it on purpose and refuse to play due to map, team compistion and what not….

take a guess who won that match

yep necro/guards… 1 bunker guard on each point while necros run aoe fest

42 d/p trickery thief lf team

30/30/x, zerker amulet, zerker gem, equip D/D, target only squishies and pray you won’t get hit lol

i had a match in yoloq with 6 warriors… i think we are getting there

engis in open field might be not as strong, in capture point game they are one of them best imo since you have to fight them in their “gadgets” or lose point

as far as faceroll go, i don’t think they are as mindless as pet classes or warriors but are quite close there

A Rank
Necro – depending on enemy team build may vary, but you kind of have to have necro for condi, boon strips, dmg, bunkering sometimes etc.

Warrior – i think more than enough was said about them, they have everything at little trade off costs, good team utility, good dmg, amazing survivability and CC, you lose a lot if you don’t bring at least one of them, you also might as well bring few.

Engi – people often undervalue them i think, engis are quite tanky and can still do a lot of dmg, have long range, a lot of conditions and can cover entire point in puddles of death. While they might be not as effective in open field, in capture point based game they are really strong.

Guardians – while i don’t find them extremely OP or anything they are a must in tpvp to bunker points imo. If guard builds for it he can hold and knock ppl off point forever not to mention team utility.

B – rank
Rangers – spirit ranger specifically, bring team utility (buffs, rezzes), can bunk point. I personally don’t find them that OP just extremely annoying to deal with.

Mesmers – good spike dmg, ports are really good and can provide a lot of tactical advantage, i saw some nasty tactics with TW + ele conjured weapons doing kittened dmg on point, they also go down fast though and do lack certain aoe dmg to spam points.

C Rank

Thief – really good xz moblity which allows them to contest/capture open points however their survivability is non existant, stealth itself is pretty bad for contesting, offer little team utility and other classes can do as much dmg while staying more tanky. They are good to turn 2v2 situations into 3v2 however they have to heavily rely on own team to be good, they can’t really carry them like some other classes. Can be easily countered by bunkering 1 point and contesting other.

Ele – i personally find eles actually decent in team fights thanks to team utility, dmg and certain moblity however they are indeed squishy and usually end up in mist form pretty fast. They don’t have mobility of the thief to steal points as fast but they do offer more in team fights hence why i out them in same tier.

D – i don’t think any class is unplayable right now tbh.

Svarty.8019:

I’m pig sick of this:

i can pull same if not higher dmg with mesmer, war, engi, ele and guard in the same time frame…what is your point?

ah i thought i was only one getting weird delay from time to time

so lonely in BLs… outside of few mesmers and some war/ranger i didn’t meet anyone T_T

no shadow refuge and shs, it is called venom build…usually a joke in pvp…but it is what we should be running i guess looking at recent patches?

wtb bunker thief…wait what

the mesmer fight was fun to watch actually

i am more fan of Caed vids though

Shockwave.1230:

Rank is not a good indicator of skill. There will be players 20 ranks lower yet better than you and players 20 ranks higher yet worse than you.

Identify the core reason you are having an issue and address that. Ranks are likely not the problem you are having.

while i agree with it, i still think in generall it would be better for both sides if tourneys had some kind of requirement

i remember when i started to pvp and had no idea what the difference was between tpvp and HJ, luckily i didn’t actually go to tpvp right off the bat to get facerolled by more experienced players.. but i did meet players who started pvp with tourneys and got destroyed obviously, they had no idea what was going on and how to play and it was not only frustrating for their teammates but also for those new players themself

as for topic: considering the current amount of pvpers i don’t think it would be wise to add such hard separation between ranks in tpvp, the queues would be extremely long..besides what would you do if friends of different ranks are playing ? just an example: my rank is 28, my friends ranks are 58, 39, 42, 24… what would we face?

fun fact ppl want lyssa to be nerfed and thief stun breakers as well looking at pvp forums… /facepalm

So why exactly does tow line daze my character when i use it on target? The tooltipp doesn’t contain any information on it neither does wiki.

- if anything 50 sec is rather short actually for a class that doesn’t have any kind of survivability outside of stealth and mobility, nerfing shs won’t make other options better simply because by design they don’t offer good alternative in the world of stun/daze/fear/condi spam; you can’t compare spectral walk to shs simply because necros have other ways of survival (2 healths bars, high HP pool, tankiness, CC, boon conversion, regen etc)… how is 10 sec nerf reasonable? you still didn’t provide good argument why should it be nerfed on first place… thief has stun break and 3 condi removal on 50 sec CD, oh noes! you know how long it takes warrior to apply condis and stun/immob someone? yeah exactly…

- reducing CD on thief guild not gonna make it less silly, thief guild is gimmicky spell and is fine in pve but shouldn’t have place in pvp on first place simply due to lazy ai based gameplay…. once again, pvp is already plagued by AI, we don’t need more of it…

- devs made it quite clear with recent nerfs that they don’t want thieves to have more dodges and s/d definitely has more than enough of those? after all i personally would rather have more ini so i can actually use spells than extra dodge where i don’t do crap but trying to dodge aoe spam on point (which probably won’t do much anyway)

- thieves don’t need stability….. but they also shouldn’t be able to use stun break as often…. do you want them just to stand still and die? what is wrong with you? if we gonna go by that logic then every stun break and stabiluty needs to be removed from this game

what is absurdly good? thieves or runes? lyssa runes are horrible for thieves stats wise outside of 6th bonus and they are not build defining, at least not for thieves again… build definiting runes would be perplexitiy runes for example

venom has very long very obvious animation, runes effect is very delayed as well, that stability doesn’t even last that long, so what that you can’t CC thief for 5 sec, thief can’t do many things to other classes as well (cough endure pain, cough grenade spam on point); why in the world would i blow 45 sec CD to stomp someone? lastly, not even that many thieves use it as ogre runes for example offer way better dmg

nerf condi/CC/aoe spam on points and then come back with lyssa nerf ty (but then it won’t be even used anymore heh)

as far as thief requirement on team, please tell me the source where you got such idea… the reason why high ranked teams still play with a thief is simple: would you rather play with some random person you don’t know for the sake of the class or would you play with the guy you know for long time and you know he good?

i would go with the last and as far as forums go, all i see from posts is that thieves are bottom tier, please prove me wrong

also don’t forget, that this game is not balanced around 10 ppl that are amazingly good at their class but around majority and in big picture thieves are a joke in many cases