Guild Wars 2

at least you get any…i get nothing at all due to transfer bug -_-

i would say keep

Romek.4201:

necro not op in foefire mid cause enough room

only that one lol

silentnight warrior.2714:

Thedenofsin.7340:

Right now stealth is ‘balanced’ around the concept that you cannot cap while stealthed. This allows for thieves to have extensive access to stealth, as well as all kinds of benefits while in stealth.

Letting stealth cap points would mean thieves would get less access to stealth and fewer benefits while in stealth.

I’m all for it.

If they nerf stealth to give them that option i´m for it too.

they are already nerfing stealth…

if they didn’t have it they would die even more..

i bet necros love such maps

that is why i open dungeons myself now…. people abuse LFG and nothing you can do about it

kitten…while i agree with pawned, but paragraphs man….i hear they are OP

oh god…why

PU mesmers, that is all i gonna say

Writetyper.1985:

I hear if you dodge or use stability CC diminishes in returns by an amazing factor of 100%.

except CD on CCs is very short while CD on stability and dodge is quite long in comparison

it would be fine and all not to have DR in this game if CCs actually came at high costs and had long CD, but they don’t… many CCs in this game are spammy (not to mention stupid immob changes that prevent you from dodging for 30+ sec)

majority of classes play w/o immob and do fine… pvp is dynamic you are not gonna have people sit in same spot like training dummy and wait for you to kill them

i think ele taunt is OP

is this…. really not a troll post?

thieves don’t have protection, invul, their heals are bad, their condi removal comes at quite big costs, they are really squishy and anet is already nerfing their survivability next patch…. you want even more nerfs? comming from warrior? seriously?

what will be next? people being abvle to dodge? NERF! SO OP!

i can bring example where wars have stupid mechanics where they shouldn’t: orb carry, while other classes can’t use their movement spells while carrying orb, wars can go invul and zoom through map with orb by using GS… how is that fair?

Galsia.4102:

Stability, Stunbreaks, and Saffron Bread/Lotus Root.

/thread

not every class has easy access to stability
stunbreaks usually have long CD, CCs are spammable though
food can’t be used in pvp yet mechanics still apply

not sure if serious

Conncept.7638:

Maesk.8753:

Conncept.7638:

Oozo.7856:

TooBz.3065:

Agreed. There is a great video out there of a thief with only an off-hand pistol killing people with these runes.

You must have missed his video of killing people with perplexity and fireworks.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1z-d9vGO52E

While perplexity runes are undoubtedly a massive problem, that’s just as much a testament of how ridiculous thieves evasion is when combined with all the passive-defensive abilities and traits they have.

Tell me sir, what passive defensive traits do we (thieves) have that are so ridiculous?

You can’t be serious? Let’s see:

• Condition removal upon entering stealth and every three seconds thereafter, half the classes in the game only have 1-2 damaging conditions and 3-4 total. This is virtual immunity to condition builds from those classes merely by chaining 1-2 stealth skills together.
• Condition removal upon evading
• AoE disable upon dodging
• AoE Blind upon entering stealth and every three seconds thereafter. This procs when stealth is activated not when it resolves. Meaning this completely nullifies the single possible counteraction to stealth, interrupts.
• Not one but two regeneration in stealth traits. 3600 damage healed without any investment in to healing power. If you read the comments you would know this is how the guy in the fireworks video survived.
• Healing upon using initiative
• Healing upon evading
• Fed initiative upon evading
• Fed initiative upon healing
• Fed initiative upon entering stealth and while in stealth

And of course not a single ICD anywhere

And I said ‘all the passive defensive trats’ not ‘a passive defensive trait’. None of these trait are game-breaking unto themselves. However enough of them (and there are a lot, I didn’t even list them all) and the thief works in a nearly self-sustaining system. What the thief is meant to spend it’s resource and cooldowns on (the risk and reward of thief play, go all in and have nothing left, or hold back and escape) instead feeds them, meaning that no matter how far a thief delves in to an attack, it always gets enough back to survive, and most importantly, without any active play.

woah i wanna know how you got enough points for all those traits and use multiple spells even though classes can use only 5 spells at given time…. must be a hax

jokes aside, there is so much wrong about this post:
- yes thieves can remove conditions in stealth, yes chaining stealth is possible however it comes at quite high costs (either long CDs or possible dmg + you have to invest points into tree for it -> more dmg/utility sacrifice)
- evade doesn’t remove all conditions but weakness and cripples, also comes at costs of dodge and trait (and is actually located in completely different tree as condi removal on stealth)
- aoe disable upon dodge what? that is new to me
- aoe blind upon entering stealth again costs either ini or long CD + points into shadow tree -> less points for dmg; also it doesn’t blind enemy again, it is 1 time blind, get your facts straight
- regen in stealth again….costs stealth (ini or long CD) + traits and they don’t stack either…
- healing by using initiative -> trait
- there is no healing upon evading except for withdraw, however if you took withdraw you have 1 stealth spell less, meaning points above are way less effective/less used
- there is no ini gain on dodge unless you ment withdraw and hastened replenishment trait (grandmaster in trickery)
- gaining ini in stealth again costs trait and is getting majorly nerfed next patch btw

from the look of your description every thief must be using following spec:

0/0/30/30/30
have withdraw and 0 dmg, but not hide in shadows
note: ran out of points in shadow tree, as listed “passive” traits come from same tree but you can only choose 3 so in given game it is not possible both regen traits, blind trait, condi removal trait, ini gain trait etc. active at the same time
note2: since idk wth is disable upon dodging, i ignored that point

the issue with all those listed “passive” traits is that they all sounds nice on paper but it is not possible to have them at the same time and they come at high cost of trait + CDs+ ini, ignore the fact that choosing them thief gives up dmg, a lot of it too

lastly, let me remind you why thieves have to rely on stealth/dodge: they don’t have protections, blocks, invul or any good heals, their healing/toughness scaling is horrendous

you say thief evasion is ridicilous? i can take warriors right now, make list of their crap and suddenly thieves look like a sad joke

back to topic: glad something gonna be done about runes; runes should be helping builds not define them

CreativeAnarchy.6324:

DR on CC is not needed so it isn’t in the game.

it IS needed…. i honestly don’t understand why it is still not implemented

CCs in this game would be fine and good if they came at high costs, sadly, quite few classes have access to strong CCs with low/no costs almost

i want to pvp vs players and not vs map

AngelSayaka.8605:

Edo Tensei.8254:

redslion.9675:

AngelSayaka.8605:

Well if all of you think about it!! We all where level 1 one day.

I waited until rank 15 before jumping into tourney

same here i did wait aswell until i had rank 15-20 and then i did start with tpvp.
hence the word tpvp (tournament pvp) means its more for experienced people so why would a normal thinking human join tpvp as a total newbie? but then again there is more and more dumb humans on this earth.

i think there really need to be a minimum requirement to join tpvp , lets say r20 or something like that. To avoid none normal thinking humans joining tpvp.

My friend. OK look, you told me you have to be Rank 15 or 20 to enter right?
So when you reach rank 20 and them join a tournament for the first time and you see people around you killing and wining and you can’t because you don’t have the idea to know what is happening. Well for example it’s like driving for the first time in the road with a lots cars. You need experience to do a better job and how you get experience? well dealing with the highers level.

First for all this in my opinion. So please don’t be rude.

yeah but if you don’t even know what gas pedal does, throwing you on the road wouldn’t do any good really; even for driving you still have to take lessons first before you can even drive a car on the road

nobody expects rank 15s perform amazing but at least they have general idea of how pvp structured in this game and have some exprience

clint.5681:

Match making balance isnt good now, not the first time this has happened since the change

i had a match with 3 thieves before… we won somehow O_o

Ulalume.9584:

Can we please not allow people below r20 to queue for tournaments? It takes just a couple of hours to hit that rank but it would improve the quality of matches you get in solo q.

My r9 team mate just died to Svanir…

it takes more than couple of hours to get to 20 unless you exploited…

but in generall i agree

despite all issues, LoL does have pretty good match making/reward system

i support those suggestion

as said in other threads:
add weapon/armor skins that are only obtainable through pvp but can be used in pve (just like zenith or similar); right now i can be most amazing pvp’er but can barely show off for that and at the end people like skins and show off with them (look at fractals)

also as said before too: you should be certain rank before you can do tournament matches (be it 10 for all i care, as long as person entering matches is not completely new to game); LoL has it, you have to be lv 30 archived by doing normal pvp games before you can do ranked matches

i helped some low lv to get skill point while i was farming platinum for incinerator

dungeon wise: i patiently stealthed mesmer 3 times in a row through harpies in fractals because he kept dying to them for w/e reason

Krayiss.4926:

Next you’ll ask for them to remove fear stacking. After that you’ll ask for burning duration to not stack, when does it all stop? They either rework all the stacking because its not fair to make only 1 skill not stack and leave all the others.

Bring more condi cleanse or reroll imboa kings like the rest of us

there is one huge difference between burning and immob…. you can’t dodge while being immobilized

they should have done it like in LoL: you have to be certain rank before you can start to do ranked

i don’t think it would be that bad for rank 1 either as they just get farmed by high ranked players and don’t even realize what happend

zerotwo.4731:

You should post specifics. Did you get kicked as soon as you joined the group? Or fighting a boss and they rage kicked you? for examples.

i got instantly kicked…and no, there was no post as “looking for heavy etc”

at the end of the day i just start dungeons myself now since it least it garantees that i don’t get kicked…but i still get asked if i could log in on other class before we even engaged any fights….

to add background info: i am at lv 48 fotm (or 49 to be exact), have 55 AR and few ascended wepons for any case, done aether path after release within 2 hours etc. it all doesn’t matter as people just want warriors and guardians… and i can’t blame them really

would love more group utility on thief tbh

Zenith.7301:

…….

Shaman stats.

/garbage bin

Don’t you love it that PvE gives you a condi wep. It’s telling me to go WvW with my spirit ranger.

exactly same thing happend to me 2 days ago

lv 48 fractal
got ascended…shaman…. i play thief EL OH EL

inb4 alts with 15AR in lv 48 fotm

gesho.9468:

lol, how about you folks just click “i win” button from opening. perma stealth capping points in gw2, which is all about capping?

can’t perma stealth after 10th dec

Forz.1725:

I think a good compromise to something like this would be to allow a stealthed character to decap an enemy point, but not cap it. That way a stealthy can keep pressure on an enemy node against bunkers.

i guess it wouldn’t be that bad (with slower rate of course)

Alissah.9281:

Hype.8032:

Alissah.9281:

Cynz.9437:

i am a thief…what is stability?

You know, that thing you get for 5 seconds when you apply Basilisk Venom or Consume Ectoplasm from a Mesmer?

You realize that requires a specific set of runes to get stability from BV right? Why don’t you mention breaking dagger storm early as well? None of these are viable/reliable methods.

As far as I can tell, 80% of the thieves I meet use lyssa runes :/.

And I didnt really think of dagger storm, but its rarely used anyway.

thieves are pretty much forced to get those runes for that very reason…

-> add weapon/armor skins that are archives only through pvp but can be used in pve (like zenith skins)
-> add some decent way of making money in pvp
-> everyone suddenly wants to do pvp
-> add skins, icons and what not in gem store
-> ???
-> profit

after trying everything possible in game, at the end it is all about skins in gw2, i don’t understand why anet isn’t even trying to abuse that in pvp when it could be profitable for players (bigger community) as for anet (more $$$ from gem store)

yet for some reason they decided to go awkward way and make $$$ from custom arena…

Awe.8049:

Thanks for all the replies guys. I’ll keep an eye out for things and might just level my warrior for now.

good choice

it can be used underwater….just not the spells stolen before…

what i find funny though is how i can’t use smoke bomb or refuge underwater yet stolen stealth works lol

eh… people are already crying rivers about stealth in pvp… if they actually could contest while in stealth the QQ would be endless

besides i can see it being abused by few hieves chaining refuge

Lux.7169:

JinDaVikk.7291:

GankSinatra.2653:

CntrlAltDefeat.1465:

“thing you’ll see before years end”
-Less particle
-legendary weapons

Already conflict there. legendary weapons produce the most particle effect

Thats a pretty unfair assumption to make, that those two are exclusive to one another.
Also some dude having a purple shine on a weapon isnt going to distract or clog up the screen like every skill having a purple explosion of legendary proportions.

Have you ever seen a norn with twilight/the other one use hundred blade? You cant see anything anywhere near that 300+ radius. Just massive massive particle spam.

Norns in pvp?

Let’s be serious now

i saw huge norn thief in pink clothes in pvp….

as topic says: wtb this hair http://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/7/7a/Cymbel.jpg

Yasha.5963:

Cynz.9437:

a t s e.9614:

The people that hate skyhammer refuse to adapt their build . Bring CC and stability , I know you give up on some stuff but knocking people off the cliff is fun . Skyhammer is my favourite map and I don’t want it to be removed it from the game . I always win on skyhammer , 75% W\L ratio on that map , it’s where my build shines , a full CC warrior

what if my class doesn’t have stability…. nor really good CCs?

For thief its good to steal fear off necros, then shadow step into a group while stealthed and trigger the fear. I have knocked 3 people off the map like that.

However, knowing the cheesy moves just reconfirms how silly it is to have that map in a ranked game (ie. solo queue). I can avoid it in normal hotjoin very easily, but have to leave my team short when it pops in SQ.

i know i can do those things along with scorpion wire to glass from stealth

the question is, is it really that great of gameplay…

if i go to pvp, i want to fight players not map or their pets…

i am a thief…what is stability?

having a team of rank 3-10 fighting ranks 50s and watching them getting farmed…. yeah no

NevirSayDie.6235:

Sword/greatsword warrior is about as fast over distances as thief, but yes, teleports with the orb would be horrible. Infiltrator’s arrow—shadowstep—infiltrator’s arrow—steal and you’re there!

but war does the same thing basically tho

let’s put the fact aside that they are tanky and take no dmg for given period of time

my point was, i agree that if you carry orb you shouldn’t be able to teleport around with it, i just don’t understand why wars allowed to do it or maybe it is just a bug

After reading this thread all i see is noobs and roleplayers complaining that stealth is cheesy and unhonorable… i am sorry but i think you did mistake by going into wvw, it is not dungeon nor it is DR role play bar.

Thieves are build around stealth, their entire survivability is based on it. Pretty much every class has access to really good aoe and CCs. If you can’t use them on thief, i am sorry to say but you are bad and either need to l2p or go back to pve.

Caffynated.5713:

These threads are always fun. Bunkers and bad thieves think stealth and high burst from stealth are fine. Everyone else thinks it’s stupid and broken to have that kind of defense on an otherwise glass cannon build.

What does a burst thief do when his health is low and his heal is on cooldown? Stealth and wait until things are back in his favor.

What does a burst ele do when his health is low and his heal is on cooldown? Die.

^^This is just another example how ignorant and misinformed people are.

Let’s take that scenario that thie fis on low HP and heal is on CD, meaning that he already engaged the fight, if thief engaged the fight meaning he used his ini so only form of stealth he has at that point is refuge. Let’s assume he used refuge and sits it out for full duration to have ini back. It doesn’t mean that w/e class he was fighting doesn’t have their CD back.

Stealth might allow you to excape fight but it doesn’t stop CDs from enemy to come back nor it allows you to capture any points. Thief running away means he lost fight, i don’t see what the issue there.

Now let’s talk about eles. Yes eles might be not that easy to play, but their heals and sustained is way better than thieves. An ele with same HP as thief would last way longer in a fight than thief. I saw an ele from BG dueling people, he had 12K HP yet he didn’t lose a single duel no matter who he fought simply because his dmg was high and his survival kit allowed him to keep his 12k HP up very well.

roll a warrior
equip hammer/bow and healing signet
….
profit

If i as a thief carry orb and try to use either shadow step or inf. arrow, my character drops the orb yet warriors can use their GS moblity spells w/o losing orb. What?

Zenith.7301:

How are dagger tanks being gutted next patch? With the 33% increase on ini regen troll LDS evasion tanks will only be stronger, and unlike stealth builds they can hold points while evading.

they nerfed every trait that gave ini by quite a lot

jk i don’t get any chests in pvp due to transfer bug…. :/

+1
15 letters zzzz

NevirSayDie.6235:

It can’t be fixed, currently. It will go away if you play as many tournaments in NA as you have in EU. It is also likely that the new reward system will make it a non-issue.

well at least i know what is causing it

tnks for responses

Sanduskel.1850:

Cynz.9437:

Arvizal.8436:

I hope an Anst dev sees this!!!!

devs don’t care

they are more busy reading QQ about stealth from clueless people on wvw forums

as for topic: i think it is fine that thieves have low HP, thieves supposed to be squishy but their defensives on dodge/stealth could be really better

you can so easily kill a thief with random spam w/o realizing you actually killed him….

Only baddie thieves die that way, sorry.

with amount of aoe CCs and aoe dmg going on atm….i see every thief dying to that from time to time, doesn’t matter how good they are; even if you don’t run into mark someone else will and you will be affected as well, even if you avoid aoe, you will get pulled into it by something

Mrbig.8019:

muscarine.5136:

EverythingEnds.4261:

I actually saw yesterday some kind of Bunker/condi/aoe/ thief in solo queue ^^
He was using caltrops, daggerstorm, smokescreen and Leaping Death Blossom.
Dide quite well.
Of course he had not that much sustain like a “real” bunker, but still.

But to be honest, when I was fighting him, my thoughts were “So, has PvP rly become so low, that even thiefes are now playing aoe condi spam?”

Yea, that would be me.

I only lack on demand stability and i can join the cheesy wagon.

I’m Vanh, you played against me somedays ago ( the match was on spirit watch). I play S/D thief and we had 2 1vs1 where i killed you in less than 20 secs.

That build is ineffective, i appreciate the effort but bunker thief is not viable ( not the way you play it, at least).

I would say that thief is barely viable in current meta ( even cheese S/D thief) and we seriously have a problem with current meta builds overall.

Tanky builds deal too much dps, that’s the problem.

Untanky builds have to totally outplay their opponents in order to win ( and the only untanky builds being decent are GS-Staff mesmer and S/D thief).

Current state of game is based on slow TTK and neuts due to too high sustained damage.

Thanks god i’ve very little time to play due to IRL issues, at least i’m not raging.

^^so much this
i really wish Anet would stop listening to major QQ from clueless people and add actual trade off to classes
if you go bunker you shouldn’t do high dmg
if you go high dmg you shouldn#t be tanky
if you want high CC you have to sacrifice either survival or dmg for it etc.

the problem is that certain classes that still do high dmg while being pretty tanky

thieves don’t fit there as they can only run squishy high dmg builds and get kitten d by random aoe spam

on top of it Anet for w/e reason decided that thieves are OP and need to be nerfed to the groud, let’s beat on dead horse eh?

Arvizal.8436:

I hope an Anst dev sees this!!!!

devs don’t care

they are more busy reading QQ about stealth from clueless people on wvw forums

as for topic: i think it is fine that thieves have low HP, thieves supposed to be squishy but their defensives on dodge/stealth could be really better

you can so easily kill a thief with random spam w/o realizing you actually killed him….

cnd is melee….you kind of have to stand still and do nothing for it to land so well….