I honestly don’t see what’s so exciting about getting +10 to a stat every level but will agree that a 30 level gap is going too far. Like I said either cut level cap to 40 and refund skill points for each level people had above that or let people choose trait lines from level one and “bake in” the relevant stats from the start.
Yet another ANet flop. I’d say wait for Wildstar, but given that it’s a NCSoft product…enough said. Not wasting my time again.
Would’ve been better if they cut the level cap to 40, refunded skill points for every level players had above that and then scaled all of the content to match.
Blizzard ruined WoW? That’s news to me since I still play. You might want to mention that as you level in WoW you learn skills in addition to getting a talent point every 15 levels, whereas here you unlock all your weapon skills very quickly. They basically rolled all of the straight stat/dmg increases into your chosen specialization, which was welcome since I never found spending a talent point on +2% damage or +10 of a stat very compelling.
Also, Diablo 3 no longer has any sort of AH.
(edited by Dark Catalyst.1028)
Just grind out the legendary armor that’s coming! You can probably swap stats on that! Probably.
I just logged in a little while ago. I confess that I haven’t actually played yet. Just looking at the new trait panel makes my heart sink. My ele was at 80 and now has only 14 points to spend? Really? I don’t even really want to play at all right now.
14 total skill points to spend over all those possible slots? This is part where you announce that it’s all part of the April Fool’s joke, right? Because I don’t have the time or energy in my life right now to grind for Ascended gear to make my character as effective as he used to be.
I would save my energy for grinding out legendary armor (it’s coming!).
’Nother nail in the coffin it seems. Can you buy skill points in the gem shop yet?
Knowing Anet, they will use this to their advantage to sell Skill Unlock Packs in the Gem Store…..
I was wary when I bought Guild Wars 2 because it generates revenue purely with the cash shop and it turns out my suspicions were correct. This is what you get with B2P and I will never make this mistake again.
’Nother nail in the coffin it seems. Can you buy skill points in the gem shop yet?
Have fun grinding! LOL
Such a disappointing change because it kills my desire to ever have an alt again.
It’s dropping because there are better gaming options there at the moment. Sorry, F2P doesn’t cut it anymore.
The content is super weak and disappears in two weeks time and half of the patches are dedicated to functionality which should’ve been there from the beginning. I’ll pay for a service I value but not when half the game is in the cash shop.
It’s not dropping. We ALL know you don’t like this game. We all know you prefer WoW. We all know that a lot of people hate wow. But making up stuff to try to push a game you like is like self fullfilling prophecy.
There’s zero evidence the population is dropping. Zero…evidence.
Do you hear about mass layoffs? Nope. Do you see huge panic going on at NcSoft at stockholder meetings. Nope.
Do you see people coming back to this game every single day on reddit. Yep. So much so that people are complaining about all the returning player posts.
Stop using a personal prejudice to draw a conclusion that may or may not be warranted.
Mega servers say hi. Also the fact that you have to guest to one or two full servers in order to get anything done. All Borlis Pass was capable of doing was the Queensdale champ train.
What do you expect? This is a F2P play game with a cash shop, so enjoy having basic functionality monetized.
Can’t have them because:
1. Reveals horrendous class balance.
2. Players who run snowflake builds will get called out for dragging groups, events, and world boss attempts, down. This will hurt their feelings.
Same game but now with more grind. Very little actual content added. Enjoy.
I guess people got bored of the Zerg Zerg Zerg – Grind Grind Grind LS pseudo content that can be experienced in an hour or two on a Saturday morning. The quality is akin to Saturday morning cartoons anyway.
It’s dropping because there are better gaming options there at the moment. Sorry, F2P doesn’t cut it anymore.
The content is super weak and disappears in two weeks time and half of the patches are dedicated to functionality which should’ve been there from the beginning. I’ll pay for a service I value but not when half the game is in the cash shop.
How is it bad? The only “arguments” I’ve seen so far amount to
1. It might annoy me
2. Vague handwaving about how it might be “bad” for the game while conveniently ignoring the fact that every addition to the game might bring in some perceived negatives. Like supposed “elitists” with fractals, easier dungeon kicking and selling with LFG, and griefers/spies with WvW. Not a valid reason to not add something to the game.If they implement it correctly, it won’t even affect you, but you have to be willing to use the tools they provide. Duelers usually congregate in a couple of areas, with few duels happening elsewhere in the open world. If it offends you so much, don’t go to that one area.
Dueling will scale up events, even though the people dueling don’t participate in the event. The game was NOT designed for it.
Don’t worry. Very few if any duelers are going to duel far from major population centers. The precious champ train won’t be impacted.
Right click, ignore.
You’re welcome.
Unlike GW1, GW2 is not instanced at all. This means you need to have everything downloaded for the game files otherwise things can be problematic for you if you try playing with 1/2 the client files downloaded (you dont know WHICH half was downloaded).
Meanwhile, WoW has allowed you to play while downloading for years. Heck, I maybe downloaded 1/4th of the necessary files to play WoW, and I was still able to play it while it was downloading.
Also: Instances/no instances have absolutely nothing to do with being able to play while downloading.
Haven’t you been paying attention to the forums? Anything from WoW is evil and bad, no matter how much it might improve this game. #sarcasm
How is it bad? The only “arguments” I’ve seen so far amount to
1. It might annoy me
2. Vague handwaving about how it might be “bad” for the game while conveniently ignoring the fact that every addition to the game might bring in some perceived negatives. Like supposed “elitists” with fractals, easier dungeon kicking and selling with LFG, and griefers/spies with WvW. Not a valid reason to not add something to the game.
If they implement it correctly, it won’t even affect you, but you have to be willing to use the tools they provide. Duelers usually congregate in a couple of areas, with few duels happening elsewhere in the open world. If it offends you so much, don’t go to that one area.
You can setup your own PvP arena for Dueling – Invite the person, DONE.
People want open world dueling so that they can be irritants. They want to be able to harass others and flex their kittens. They want to roll flavor of the month dueling builds, play their scissors and specifically hunt down their paper to cut, then crow about how awesome they are.
Otherwise, they’d be fine with specific arenas where they could easily find other people like them. But that would mean they’d actually have to fight other people who are built for dueling… and well, they can’t have THAT.
That Goldshire example I mentioned earlier? There’s a reason that dueling crowd hangs out in a low-level zone, and it’s not because it’s easy to find others duelists. It’s so that they can harass “easy marks”, low level players who are either new to the game or new to a certain class and might not know everything about it.
Straight up untrue. Sorry you had a bad experience that one time.
People hang out there because it’s right outside a major city.
Anyway, I suggest you stop worrying about how other play and whether or not they choose to duel. It’s really none of your business.
WoW has open dueling and they’ve had it for years. I can count the times on one hand where someone tried to duel me and couldn’t take no for an answer. /ignore fixed that. Then they added an option which allows you to auto-decline all duels and that was that.
People who want to duel in the open world usually end up congregating in a couple of areas anyway. If that’s what annoys you, then too bad. They have the right to be there as well.
And WoW has some of the most obnoxious and toxic twits hanging outside Goldshire that I have ever seen.
You want open world dueling, too bad. You’re not getting it any time soon, if at all.
Oh, Goldshire does? I wouldn’t know it because I was given the tools to completely avoid it while letting others play how they want.
Dueling isn’t fun. Dueling is annoying. It’s particularly annoying in a game that was never meant to be balanced for 1v1. Guild Wars 2 was balanced around 5v5.
So dueling would just open up large numbers of people complaining about how unbalanced the game is.
We already know it’s unbalanced.
Don’t like dueling? Then don’t duel.
I think what you’ll find from the “no dueling” crowd isn’t so much that they are against dueling as much as they are against OPEN WORLD dueling. I personally fall in that crowd, as I have found open world dueling tends to encourage some annoying behaviors that I’d rather not have to deal with and runs contrary to the cooperative nature that the open world in GW2 is designed to encourage.
Now a dueling arena in a controlled environment in capitol cities or a rebuilt Lion’s Arch where players could spectate in real time? I’d be down for that.
WoW has open dueling and they’ve had it for years. I can count the times on one hand where someone tried to duel me and couldn’t take no for an answer. /ignore fixed that. Then they added an option which allows you to auto-decline all duels and that was that.
People who want to duel in the open world usually end up congregating in a couple of areas anyway. If that’s what annoys you, then too bad. They have the right to be there as well.
First of all:
Try improving your character.
I’m so totally sure you aren’t using a potion of undead slaying, not to mention any food at all. Maybe even, your gear is lackluster, greens at level 60 when you are 75.
After that, Orr is going to become much more populated after April 15th(theoretically)…
I thought gear didn’t matter in this game?
Maybe they should try to make it more like WoW’s LFG system? You know, in a way that makes sense. Oh wait, can’t have that because it’s WoW afterall and we all know nothing good ever came out of that!
Ditch party merging, change votekick to a 3/5 requirement, and stop kicking everyone out of the instance if the party leader leaves. BOOM DONE.
It’s gonna be over 1,000 gold because drop rates in this game are horrible. That’s the design.
You want a precursor? Buy gems, convert to gold. Or hope you win the precursor lottery but I wouldn’t hold my breath in hope of that happening.
It’s a big world. If you’re new to the game, you’re probably in a starter area. If you had finished most of the content, is that where you see yourself hanging out?
This is a problem with most MMOs. You have to get to end game areas (or at least places were people congregate) to find most people. No MMO I’ve played has people in all zones.
That said, there are busier servers and less busy ones but after the 15th things should pick up. In the mean time, try guesting to Tarnished Coast if you’re on a US server, and you’ll probably find more people in the open world.
Wait, wait, wait LOL…
I thought GW2 was advertised as having THE ENTIRE WORLD as the end game?
1. There are only a small handful of populated servers on the NA side. Blackgate being the main one.
2. Roleplaying a zergling is optimal play here.
But roleplaying a zergling and being forced into one gear set and a small handful of trait builds is apparently fun?
Bad balancing + communist style gameplay = boring = loss of players
I lol’d at describing GW2 as “communist.” GW2 is basically the game saying: “play how you want, create your own build, combine skills/traits how you wish, perform any role you can manage.” It’s a “free market” of ideas and skill sets. You can quibble about game balance and whether or not X build is as viable as Y build, but the fact is people are free to make those mistakes and experiment.
By contrast, a traditional “holy trinity” MMO says: “This is your role, this is what skills you must use for that role, this is what you are allowed to wear, and any deviation is punished.”I’ve noticed more players recently giving up this game/logging far fewer hours to pursue real life or other gaming ventures. I’ve no idea if this is a legitimate trend (it most likely isn’t in the scheme of things) as I don’t have access to Anet’s playerbase statistics.
/sigh
Why even bother saying something like this? I see this tired cliché all the time. “I want X in GW2. In my opinion, people are leaving the game because we don’t have X. Therefore, I am right.”
You said it yourself, you don’t have access to ANet’s playerbase statistics. Of course some people do leave the game, especially if they’ve already played for hundreds of hours. It happens all the time, in every game. But new people come in all the time, and some other players do come back after a break (myself included). I didn’t quit because there was no “holy trinity.” In fact, I’d probably quit if there was.The fact is, we don’t know if more people are leaving than staying, at what rate people leave, or why. It’s not data you can factor into your argument, and is a non-sequitur best left unmentioned.
Anyhow, my take on the “holy trinity” is:
- it was a necessary evil for a long time, providing the nearest semblance of a “game” that massively multiplayer online infrastructures could manage, given the technology at the time
- MMO devs still fall back on the trinity today mainly out of laziness, familiarity, and lack of imagination
- It consistently results in 3/5 players waiting around for upwards of 40 minutes or more to get into a dungeon. To this day, I’ve yet to see any trinity-based game provide an adequate solution to this colossal waste of player time — despite the fact that these games are incredibly focused on dungeons as the delivery method for all endgame PvE content.
- 2/3 roles in the trinity have no place at all in leveling & soloing, and if you want to do them effectively you have to take gear & skills that utterly dismantle your ability to be efficient while solo or in the open world.
- In abandoning the “holy trinity” GW2 did leave some good mechanics behind, and created some new dilemmas that have yet to be solved perfectly. Still, I would take the worst aspects of GW2’s combat over the best aspects of the trinity model, any day.
1. My wait times are on average 10 minutes for a random during which I can do other things to occupy myself.
2. Remedied with allowing people to switch specs on the fly. I have both a healer and a dps spec.
Any other criticisms which aren’t mired in 2005?
What’s the point of a healer if he can’t out heal one dpser’s damage?
To heal other people? That’s what healers do…they heal other people…The trinity requires multiple classes to work. It isn’t the trinity if player is on their own. The trinity implies group play with roles. Healer can out-heal DPS unless it is on them. That’s the point. How would it be fair if healers and tanks can kill DPS, but DPS can’t kill either of them?
If a healer is attacked by a DPS, they need to focus heal themselves long enough for someone to pull the DPS off of them and/or a secondary healer spot healing. That’s the trinity. Healers shouldn’t be able to sit there mashing heal skills loling while being full DPS’d by a max DPS class build. That would be so OP.
In a 1v1 DPS v Healer, if both players are exactly the same skill level (somehow that being measurable) and they have the exact same level of gear, the DPSer should always come out on top. Always. Otherwise everyone should roll healer because you can kill pretty much everyone…(if you can out-heal DPS classes, you sure as heck can out heal tank DPS, you would be unstoppable).
What game are you playing where healers kill dps?
Huh? No game, you’re the one who said “what’s the point of a healer if he can’t out heal one DPSers damage”
That clearly implies you think healers should be able to out-heal one DPSer DPSing them. Which I’m saying wouldn’t be fair for that DPSer (assuming same skill level and gear).
A healer can’t kill a dps and a dps can’t kill a healer (at least until the healer runs out of resources). Seems fair to me. If I can’t out heal the damage I’m taking then I can’t out heal the damage someone else is taking. Much less so if a healer has to deal with other dps while healing. At this point it’s better to bring another dps and try to take someone out super fast.
What’s the point of a healer if he can’t out heal one dpser’s damage?
To heal other people? That’s what healers do…they heal other people…The trinity requires multiple classes to work. It isn’t the trinity if player is on their own. The trinity implies group play with roles. Healer can out-heal DPS unless it is on them. That’s the point. How would it be fair if healers and tanks can kill DPS, but DPS can’t kill either of them?
If a healer is attacked by a DPS, they need to focus heal themselves long enough for someone to pull the DPS off of them and/or a secondary healer spot healing. That’s the trinity. Healers shouldn’t be able to sit there mashing heal skills loling while being full DPS’d by a max DPS class build. That would be so OP.
In a 1v1 DPS v Healer, if both players are exactly the same skill level (somehow that being measurable) and they have the exact same level of gear, the DPSer should always come out on top. Always. Otherwise everyone should roll healer because you can kill pretty much everyone…(if you can out-heal DPS classes, you sure as heck can out heal tank DPS, you would be unstoppable).
What game are you playing where healers kill dps?
What’s the point of a healer if he can’t out heal one dpser’s damage?
So back to my original question. At the current conversion rate, how long would it take to grind enough gold for 800 gems? If I have the choice between working a fraction of an hour, x, in order to earn enough money to buy 800 gems and grinding in game for x+1 hours for the necessary gold, why would I do the latter?
I would chose neither of those. I would pay 15 bucks a month and have access to a full game and play for the fun of it. Some people prefer the existent system sure. I have no problem with that. It’s their time and money.
But here is my opinion.
This game is so unrewarding in every aspects which is the main reason I don’t play it anymore. I have been playing for more than 1 year and I never been satisfied with this system.
To get a legendary, which is one of the ultimate goals in this game, you either grind till your eyes bleed or pay. Either way, no sense of accomplishment there.
Many people in so many topics come to the defense of this system by stating that the grindy things are optional. This translates into “You can play half a game and be fine”. Sure, I guess.The interdependence between gold and gems makes this impossible to be fixed. The whole thing is wrong. There is no way out of this. So get you zerg trains running or pull out your credit cards for sparkling quaggans and such and enjoy whatever rocks your boat in this game. I know I won’t.
Agreed. I prefer the sub model as well because I get actual content and devs are forced to make the world fun and rewarding. Gems to gold was a bad move for this game because it’s possible to make the game just unrewarding enough to herd people into the gem shop.
Sure, sure spending real money is entirely optional! You’ll just have to work 5 hours instead of half an hour!
So back to my original question. At the current conversion rate, how long would it take to grind enough gold for 800 gems? If I have the choice between working a fraction of an hour, x, in order to earn enough money to buy 800 gems and grinding in game for x+1 hours for the necessary gold, why would I do the latter?
The ONLY problem with your argument is… that:
1. You can buy gems with in game Gold.
and
2. Many of the new games that have a subscription also have a cash shop. And that is a Shop where the Only way to buy items is with cash, NOT gems which can then be purchased with in game gold.
Is there a temptation for some players to NOT be patient, earn the Gold, buy the gems, and instead use cash? Of course there is, but is that Anet’s fault? How hard is it to simply play for free… save up your gold, buy gems… and have whatever it is that someone that uses cash to buy gems can also buy?
Name ONE item that can be bought for cash that cannot also be bought with in game Gold? well the ONLY thing you Buy with cash..is gems… and you can also buy gems… with GOLD.
Last time i checked… the amount of gems you can by with Gold…varies based on demand.
TESO has a subscription fee…and a cash shop.
WoW has a subscription fee…. and a cash shop.it seems to me that if you were discussing " MMO’s that ONLY have a subscription… compared to MMO’s that have a cash shop" you might have a point.
The problem is, that in today’s market, it’s " MMO’s that charge a subscription and also have a cash shop… vs… gw2…. No subscription + Gem store, where you can play for free if you wish…. and buy gems with in game gold…if you wish."
The problem as I see i is ..most people do not play the game for free out of their own desire to have things NOW…so will spend cash…but..NO one is forcing them to use cash… they can play for free…. but that requires…patience. Something which most of today MMO’ players seem to lack.
How much time would it take you in game to earn enough gold to to buy 800 gems? Why would I grind all that gold when I can work at my job for a fraction of an hour, buy what I want, and spend the time I would’ve spent grinding for gold doing whatever I found fun.
WoW has a cash shop, yes. But that cash shop only a few mounts, a few pets and dumb looking transmog helms that everyone mocks if you dare show your face in game with one of them on.
Meanwhile, I can get hundreds of mounts and pets in game.
Welcome to cash shop games and the ability to buy in game currency with real money.
The game is structured in such a way as to make farming extremely unattractive. It’s way, way, way easier to just spend dollars and spare yourself the grief and boredom, because like another poster said…if your time has ANY value at all, your best bet is to just drop cash on the game and do whatever it is you find “fun” in game.
It’s not about being bitter or jealous. A lot of us thought we’d have to do an amazingly difficult questline which would take us all across Tyria in addition to having to defeat really difficult enemies. You know, you do something legendary to get a legendary weapon.
Instead, we get a “Shopping at the TP” quest.
No. No. A million times no. Flying mounts, along with lfr and lfg ruined world of warcraft. I don’t want immersion in this game to be ruined by everyone flying around saying ‘OH LOOK I CAN GET ALL THE WAY UP HERE’ and kitten.
Yes, making it easier to group for dungeons and letting people who would ordinarily not raid see raid content are terrible, terrible things.
This is pretty much why they put Ascended weapons and armor in game as something to aim for that isn’t as demanding as a legendary . Why would they seriously consider lowering the difficulty threshold for people that playing the game that much. Crafting a legendary is a task that is extremely dificult, and tests the resolve of even the intensely dedicated players. Before committing you should understand what you are getting into. There are many places were blind luck and changes in stuff like trading post can really delay progress, all along the way you will ask yourself if it is worth it. You don’t need to quit the game in protest if you don’t feel its worth it, just continue playing and enjoying the game, you could even try for one in tournament.
There is nothing legendary about buying from the TP and grinding.
Your best bet is to just buy gold. I know you said you didn’t want to do that, but you can’t farm in this game. It’s unrewarding and you get diminishing returns. The game is centered around the cash shop as its source of income so please try to keep this in mind when you find one area of the game frustrating.
Thanks! I suppose now I shall begin my quest for the gear~
Just buy some gold and then buy exotics from the TP. Much easier and faster.
Then get ready to grind for your ascended gear if you do stuff like WvW if you want to be on an equal footing. Despite what anyone on this forum says, stats matter.
To further the OPs comment about grouping, I’m disappointed that we still don’t have an inspect feature to view both gear and traits on other players. Some of us care about clearing content quickly and efficiently and inspect will help us find like minded players and allow us to “play how we want”. We need a way to avoid snowflake gearing and builds.
But if we all take the zergling role, then there is no need for a trinity! Just brute force all the things!
Yes because they want you to use the cash shop. You can’t really farm in this game.
what stupid argument is that? so what do you call farming gold and transforming it into gems?
What’s the current gold to gem rate? Then ask yourself how long it takes to farm the gold for, say, 800 gems and if it simply isn’t more rewarding to spend the $10.
1000 gems for the deluxe edition right now is around 100g, 100g is as easy to farm as a 10 days doing 5 dungeons a day (not really hard if you ask me) of course the person who only plays 10 minutes a day is not able to grind enough gold to replace the gem store, but it’s not an overwhelmingly difficult task to have a steady income of gold that allows you to buy anything you want from the gem store.
Why would I wait 10 days when I can have what I want in 10 minutes with the swipe of a credit card. I can have what I want and spend the next ten days doing something other then grinding gold.
Yes because they want you to use the cash shop. You can’t really farm in this game.
what stupid argument is that? so what do you call farming gold and transforming it into gems?
What’s the current gold to gem rate? Then ask yourself how long it takes to farm the gold for, say, 800 gems and if it simply isn’t more rewarding to spend the $10.
Yes because they want you to use the cash shop. You can’t really farm in this game.
I don’t understand the idea of trinity balance.
Does that means that healer can defeat a fighter? That’s not balance, that’s making healer OP.
Your right, it would. Balance would be each not being able to kill the other. A tank is suppose to be good at taking damage without dying and not dish it out (that’s the dps job). A healer is suppose to heal damage and not dish it out. A tank vs healer, if balanced and all variables equal (eg. player skill), should result in a stalemate. The healer doesn’t do enough damage to break a tank’s…well…tank and the tank can’t out damage the healer’s healing.
And the third leg of the trinity? The DPSer? Can’t out-DPS heals or tankiness either? Or DPS can kill both. That sounds OP to me. And probably why the DPS:tank:healer ratio in trinity games is always terrible, causing groups to wait around forever just to get a group together.
That’s funny , because in WoW my dungeon wait times are less than 10 minutes as a dps and I don’t need to wait for raids because of guild/flex/Oqueue/open raid, etc.
Well why rent a product instead of just buying it? No matter how low or high the sub fee is, it will add up. For example you can’t rent 5 games without it getting really expensive. You can own 5 games though. I am “renting” world of warcraft from time to time. I’m extremely unlikely to rent something else when I’m already paying for that.
I’m not renting a product, rather, I’m paying for a service. The same exact service everyone else pays for which means everyone has access to everything the game offers. I like not having to pay real money for basics like bank and bag slots. If I like mini pets I can go out and get them. Same with a certain look. Same with mounts. All of this without bring funneled into a cash shop. Alts don’t cost me money either.
Very, very few people are going to sub to 5 MMOs at the same time. I was at one time subbed to both WoW and EVE Online and still didn’t like splitting my time even though they are very different games.