As long as they didn’t nerf stealth itself(which at one point, I thought they would just for this issue) then I’m onboard.
Sanctum of Rall and Isle of Janthir should merge
Sanctum of Janthir.
I laugh because they have to requeue.
Usually by the end of the week the gains are so far ahead that one team has all their players riled up and the other two just die off in WvW. It needs to be kept refreshing, imo. One week is perfect.
Seems it’s all a matter of perspective, but you might be doing something wrong.
I don’t know what your class is, though it sounds like stability/aegis/invulnerability would help you here. Alternatively, pile damage where the one player is reviving the other, and now you have two downed players! If you still can’t win, well, you are fighting a 2v1.
Problem is that I’m a thief so I’ve no invulnerability/stability with almost no AoEs. I’m also using a P/D condition build so doing mass damage upon a target takes time, unlike glass cannon thieves. Stealth sometimes works but using CnD at the feet of a down player is obvious(and it was for that particular battle).
For PvE, engineer, imo. Thief mostly shines in PvP and WvW. In a dungeon, thieves aren’t really that great.
The problem with thieves in PvE is first off, thieves are naturally squishy. Yes they have stealth, but the amount of times my stealth has caused things to reset is stupid. It’s very glitchy, and at best only de aggros the mob for a few seconds(or if you run, meaning they reset completely). Shadow Refuge is helpful for reviving downed players, however.
Second, thief stealth can be achieved using ash legion spy kits(you can purchase). Basically it stealths you for 10 seconds unless you move. It’s extremely effective, if for some reason you were to need stealth.
Well, I’ve only seen it once. It has potential to be game breaking, but it isn’t ruining WvW at all atm, imo…
Just goes to show that every class, including the elementalist can have burst. It is not just limited to thieves and warriors, despite popular belief.
Why is it so fast? I just played a 1v2 where everytime i downed one of them, the other would use his mesmer pull then revive his downed teammate before I could even get up. He saved his pull just so that everytime I downed his teammate he could use it. The end result was I couldn’t win at all because they would knockdown/pull the second I downed one then simply revive.
I feel it needs to be changed, just in my personal opinion. If you’re one second late for the finish their teammate is going to get revived to half HP, which imo, is absurd when it comes to smaller fights.
My own(personal) solution would simply make it so that upon revival in downed mode, you don’t start with half HP. Either that or just make the revive time slower.
Do you guys have trouble with this? Am I doing something wrong? I don’t understand…
Do minipets reveal thief positions?
Things that would destroy the class if nerfed(coming from a thief)
Increasing the debuff
I believe the debuff is fine at three seconds, however the culling and rendering issues is not. These should be addressed before, if any, stealth nerfs are needed. Stealth is an important aspect. If both the debuff and culling issues are fixed in the same patch, thieves would be relatively easy to kill, in my opinion.
tl;dr:Fix the culling/rendering before any stealth nerfs(not just the debuff) if needed
Adding cooldown to skills
This would completely destroy the point of thief in my opinion. Cooldown for skills is not needed. That and stealth is what makes us unique. Otherwise, we’re just squishy warriors. Keep the initiative system the same
Things I believe the thief class can suffice without
Backstab
I used to run a backstab thief. I never thought it was OP at all. In fact, it was too squishy for me, but a lot of hatred towards thieves comes with it, and I thieves can survive without it. A nerf to damage wouldn’t be too bad in my eyes, seeing as I don’t run it anymore, but it should still be a viable build(not nerfed to the ground). How I would go about this is making steal interrupt CnD, buffing back CnD damage, nerfing steal damage 50%, then a 30% nerf to backstab damage. This is still more than enough to kill squishies without needing to do follow up attacks, however it would also force the thief to take other, extra measures besides backstab again non glass cannon builds.
Some Buffs I think the thief deserves
Pistol number 2 skill
It’s just to weak and offers nothing yet costs initiative. I haven’t seen a single build that utilizes this. IMO, it should either by removed and a new skill put in place, or have a substantial buff or more added effects.
Adding a rifle
Thief needs variety. This is one of the main reasons why everyone is using backstab. We simply have no variety in terms of builds. Adding a rifle would really benefit balance, so long as no skills are extremely overpowered/underpowered. One thing if added though : please make the range 1200!!
First off, revealing names like that is against the rules, I believe, however I do agree with you.
Make it so that a thief cannot cap after a certain amount of time in stealth.
Carrion.
Just one thing. Carrion gear can run 2-3G even for the shoulders. A great alternative is “shiro’s gear”. It has the exact same stats, but different, more standard looks, and sometimes tends to be cheaper. About a week ago I bought every single shiro armor set for only 1G a piece. I don’t know the price now, but you should check it out. Might save some serious cash.
Our stellar performance tonight has been shadowed by the almost sure looming drop in performance overnight. SoR is in need of oceanics and europeans to battle other servers. We are a friendly community made up of many guilds and we are a fierce competitor, at least during NA primetime. We have made it to Tier 2 however we cannot get you Tier one without full coverage…that’s where you guys come in :P
Dear Anet,
Please fix culling and rendering issues before changing any aspect of thieves. Therefore any beforehand thoughts of balance with thief may or may not be addressed with this bug fix.
Sincerely,
A thief
How much HP do you have?
The heartseeker hits themselves add up to 18K+
You expect me to believe he scored a 5.5K heartseeker when you had almost full HP? I’ve used pure glass cannon before and have never gotten that high a hit unless the guy had low HP. This might have been possible before the nerf, but not now. You expect us to believe that picture was taken this morning?
Based on my experience with a fiery greatsword…
Warrior’s look very fun to play.
Depends really. Personally I would go with thief, but both classes are great and if the two were to fight, the better player would win. Be warned though, thief may get nerfed to the ground.
I use signet of shadows for everything regardless. I cannot stand running around without it. 25% increase is the norm for me now.
Other traits are shadow refuge and usually a venom
Glass cannon is never really good. Maybe for a little WvW, but when you’re outnumbered you have little choice but to run. I suggest a nice P/D condition damage build. However, if you want Glass Cannon, use berserkers gear. It should give power(self explanatory), precision(higher crit chance), higher crit damage. If you don’t want to pay the price for berserker’s gear, the Citadel of Flame dungeons offers nice rewards that have the same stats, with better looks.
Shadow Refuge is extremely reliable. Prevent’s downed teammates from imminent finish, stealth for quite a while, with the healing in stealth trait, it can heal as much as hide in shadows, just over a lengthy period of time.
People saying… “There were lots of chances to kill him” are soooo missing the point.
If I take ANY other class in the game and try to cap a point alone vs 20 people I will be dead in 3 seconds. Why should a large group need perfect timing and technique to beat thieves when no other class in the game is anywhere near that difficult to kill?
Exactly. I think the most I have ever managed to take on was 4. I know I’m no pvp genius, I won’t pretend to be, so I’m sure others make that look paltry, but I’ve seen one thief destroy 20 easily like Raincrow was saying. It isn’t about WHAT IS THE BEST METHOD. Fighting against a thief in pvp shouldn’t be more tiresome and lengthy than soloing a champ in pve. lol
A thief killing 20 guys? You can’t be serious.
If anyone here honestly thinks a thief can kill 20 guys head on, make a thief and try it for yourself. You won’t succeed. Preventing a cap, I’ve seen annoying thieves do that, but killing a zerg, not going to happen…
Make it so that staying in stealth longer than 10s makes it so that you cannot cap. In order to be able to cap again you must leave stealth for 3 seconds. Don’t actually touch stealth itself. And fix the culling issues.
Are you traited correctly? The numbers add up to 16K, which imo, isn’t really that high. My own thief actually has 19K. Are you putting 30 trait points into vitality?
I’ve found that most of the medium leggings look like horrible sweatpants. Does anyone know some really nice leggings? I’ve wearing COF armor and the leggings I have right now look horrible. If only thieves could use light leggings…
Well as a thief, I much prefer vitality over toughness. It just seems to be much better overall for me. Especially when it comes to conditions.
222222 is kind of noobish, but I don’t think it’s OP. However, I play as a P/D thief, so they are pretty easy to counter in 1v1s. Have not made another character to see how it goes from their prospective, and I certainly don’t care seeing as I don’t use heartseeker :P
I’m a P/D condition thief. I pretty much pick on everyone regardless, however I do not prefer certain necros and other P/D thieves. I still attack regardless though :P
I can’t recount how many times I have died by this. It’s a broken mechanic in WvW, I just played a fight where 2 enemies I down both rallied on a dolyack that was killed by krait, then proceed to kill me. Why is this there? It should not happen. Rallying on players is cool, but on NPCs?
I thought condition builds used to be bad too. This is coming from a former Backstab thief
CD > backstab
You can easily handle 1vmultiples
Backstab sucks after the first kill. When I was using backstab, I would only look out for squishies & under level 80. I would never target certain mesmers, some warriors/guardians/some tank eles. I used to love assassinating commanders with ease, though. I miss doing that…
(edited by Doomdesire.9365)
Always fun when there are only about 15 guys on your server at night
Fix the culling issues, then continue from there if needed.
You should check out P/D. The number 5 “CnD” skill allows for constant stealth and bleed unloads from stealth. It’s what I’m using now, and it’s much much better than P/P. If it were the case that you should choose this, go for carrion gear(however, with that said, carrion gear is expensive at 3G per even shoulder pieces, instead look for “shiro gear” at TP, they cost a mere 1G and have the exact same stats)
Here is a youtube video of a thief demonstrating this build
Link in description is a link to a very helpful site detailing almost everything about it.
Pistol Dagger Condition build > any burst
I’ve gone from backstab to this, and honestly, it’s a million times better, much more rounded, much more survivability. Looking back, backstab wasn’t even that great.
I’m just annoyed that at times people can revive faster than you can kill. This especially goes for tank v tank builds.
If your server has random pugs following around random commanders then you have far more problems than you realize. Fix your server first, please.
Well hello there, fellow Sanctum of Rallian. Don’t mind me now….
Does anyone have their own way of addressing this issue? Do you agree that this is an issue? Disagree?
I would love to see more ideas on how to change this up a bit.
(edited by Doomdesire.9365)
A commander tag is an icon on the map, nothing more. They are expensive, but they are perfectly balanced. Why? Because they are used by guilds to provide our members with a point of reference. They attract zergs, but that’s not the primary function. The primary function is to serve as an organizational tool for guilds.
Caedas has many commander’s compendiums, and we use them. Their primary purpose is to inform our guild members where we are located, and to inform other guilds where we are located. If you plan on using one with the mindset of “If I buy this, people will follow me” then you’re going to be very disappointed.
Intelligent people need more than a shiny blue speck on the map to earn their respect.
Also, successful generals are never elected. An election process would cause nothing but drama and failure.
Then perhaps Anet should change it so that certain guild members can have the icon and have it not visible to anyone else. Have commander be a separate thing. It doesn’t have to be an election process, but the system right now is broken. As long as there is a way to pick commanders based on actual WvW experience and not money.
The new event today could also really irritate the problem imo. Many many people looted precursors. Some, even on trial accounts. I don’t think it’s right that someone(who may not even be 80) finds a precursor in a chest, gets lot of money, becomes a commander and ruins it for the server. That however, is just a scenario, but a likely one. I myself expect some sort of influx of commanders who got the tag from pure luck with today’s one time event.
That’s not to mention, eventually many people are going to get a commander tag. At what point does it become totally broken so that we have an entirely new commander entering the server every hour or so? When does it come to the point where 1/10 players are commanders?
I’ve been watching this two commanders attack SM for the past 2 hours and failing each time. IF this is not a problem in WvW, what is? All the manpower could be used elsewhere. Bump. Would like to see more opinions.
As of right now? I missed out and I hear some overflows still have the event going. Anyone know any guild members or even themselves who still have the event going where they are? I might be able to get in last minute….
To OP: So, you prefer other people to tell you who is a good commander, don’t you? I prefer to test it by myself and follow them using my own experiences.
I either choose a good commander or I don’t follow one at all. Most of the time it’s the later. Let’s face it, commanders are only people with deep pockets, nothing else 99% of the time. There are more experienced players in WvW. I spend 99% of my time in WvW, I’m very disappointed when a commander who spent a month farming 100G in PvE comes in and ruins everything. We need a new way to find a commander(s), one that ensures these guys know what they are doing. This should be based on a various amount of features, especially achievements in WvW, kills, badges of honor, time played, ect.
And your post kind of misses the point. No offense, but this is not about me. This is about the 80% of the WvW population(PUGS) who follow the closest commander icon, even if they are bringing them into a garuanteed slaughter.
It’s really up to you. If you’re happy with what you have(sounds like you like it in WvW), by all means, keep it. However, if you don’t like your performance in dungeons, it’s as simple as making a new build, right?
but then it just becomes a glorified popularity contest. I know plenty of lousy commanders in big guilds that would still probably get a commander title due to the size of the guild they are in.
I’d be much happier if the Commander rank was based on achievements rather than wealth or popularity. Make it something that is awarded to players who have X number of kills plus have captured X locations/used X siege…etc. True you’d still get a few dodgy badges, but at least if it was based on achievements people could be sure that the commander they’re following has at least got a serious amount of WvW experience. In the past week i’ve come across two seperate commanders that needed directions around the map or didn’t know what the orange swords on the map indicated.
Personally, I make a point to know my realms commanders and to know which one’s are good and which one’s are going to waste our time/resources. The real problem isn’t that we have some lousy commanders, it’s that we have players that blindly follow that blue dot around and don’t use a modicum of common sense.
Very good point. I didn’t think about how guilds would affect this. Having the point and achievement system like you put out is a pretty good idea, but it should also be voluntary. I know a lot of great guys in WvW who are high up there, but most just stick to the shadows.
5PM to 11PM pacific is almost no queue times for SoR. It’s a good option. Also, the later it gets, the lower the amount. Especially lately I’ve been having 0 – 5m queues at worst. The only exception is the WvW reset, the queue can be annoying.
I agree, but I don’t think B is such a great idea. The trolls and spys would love to see that happen :/
I agree. Farming dungeons is much more rewarding and efficient than that of farming Orr.
To me, this dungeon is a pure example of the brilliance and originality of Anet’s map designs. I may not agree with their balancing, but the maps never cease to astonish me. It’s a great dungeon IMO, and even PUG players can do it with the right communication.
Perhaps my favorite little fractal is the blizzard one, however. The darkness and snow really makes it. I hope there will be a map designed solely with that.
Is the whirling attack different for thieves? I was wondering why warriors never used it because as a thief, when I steal that skill and use it, with an all glass cannon build the max I’ve gotten is 10K. I’m assuming anet nerfed it for warriors but not thief steal?
I’m not saying we should take away the commander icon for those who paid lots of money(although I’m all for it, assuming they get refunded). I just really think we should have commanders we can elect. Once a week, on reset, XX amount of commanders are elected. If a commander is inactive for over 36 hours, a new one is elected. This will ensure there will always be elected commanders on the field. Elected commanders should have a different map icon as well. Reason for all of this is because I don’t think a bad commander with deep pockets should ruin it for the entire server. Good commanders will stick out and eventually be always nominated, which is a good thing.
Plain and simple presentation. Didn’t really go into detail yet, I just want to see what you guys think.
I think it’s all the skills that hit multiple targets. I have the same problem using clusterbomb and dancing dagger. Trying hitting them with the “3” skill when using a shortbow.
Will you guys change builds? What are you currently using and what will you be using? I don’t expect many people to migrate from Backstab, however I am eyeing a condition stealth thief as a possible alternative.
Thoughts? Opinions?