big bosses with hundred of people?
geez…
check out a jormag fight.
boring to death.
spam autoattack, nothing else to do.at least its pretty the first time, but the gameplay really doesnt shine during those mass zerg events…
Those fights does not need look like that! That’s what they need to improve. And what should they never try to do: “race with blizzard about who can do more dungeons at the same time”. WoW is a game about dungeons. And if you want that kind of gameplay then you should play it.
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where is the new dungeons? Why are they torturing with garbage we have? this is so disappointing…
This game is not about doing dungeons with a small bunch of people in co-op… You can find that in games like Gears of War for instance. This game is about fighting Avatar of Balthazar with dozens or even hundreds of people! This is how true MMO should look like! There are dozens of interesting bosses within the game. Problem is that there are no reasons to fight them.
If they add those reasons and gather people through the guilds then that’s going to be more then enough to blow away all those saying that: “raid’s are the only good end-game”.
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Is just amazing!
I’ve tried it just from curiosity and it rocks in this game! The overall experience feels much different and fun. Now I don’t know how to go back and play it with keyboard and mouse. Some time ago I’ve played tera with gamepad and even thaw the gamepad controller is officially supported by that game the overall experience it is not even close to the guild wars 2.
All skills are just in a reach of my finger. I don’t need to trigger them with mouse anymore. I mean utility skills specifically. 1,2,3,4 and in some degree 5 are ok and quite convenient but any above that is not. And with gamepad everything just clicks as it should. Dodging, using utilities and even targeting is not an issue here. And one more thing… sitting on my couch while playing gw2 rocks!
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This is GW2…its not as ‘hard’ as other MMOs. All you would have to do is introduce a scaled difficulty. Those doing the hardest difficulty would be expected to be skilled just like in the highest level of fractals. You generally dont take PuGs into high level content so the highest difficulties would be reserved for guilds/groups that think/know each member is skilled enough. Simples!
So I do get you now. Your thinking about making raids just like fotm. This is some kind of solution… But still I do think that AN should do something different then raids. If they put their efforts on raids, people will always compare gw2 with games that also focus on that. That’s why AN should make things different.
For me dungeons are fun addition but should stay the way they are now. And AN should focus on making open world gameplay as appalling as possible.
Read my posts please! PLEASE!
Could you PM me the ones you think I should read? You wrote a lot…
Now read my lips (text!) I am not saying we need to rely entirely on RNG to reward people like this old MMO did, but giving a chance to get something really cool, added to the prestige of doing something amazingly hard and having your name written down in the history of the server as well as raid dungeon tokens and drops you get would keep people playing. Not grinding no, but playing. Plus it would add some much needed ‘epicness’ to the game in my opinion.
Your describing raids as one time thing. And it should be something with a lot of replayability. There is no point at spending a lot of resources just to create a dungeon that a lot of people complete in a matter of days. After that they will go straight to the forums and wine again about how they have no more things to do.
I think AN needs to be smarter.
Why I don’t want raids in gw2:
1. Raids are for most people huge content gates. And people are already complaining about fotm and ascended items (I don’t but still consider raids as ultimate content gate).
2. There are already few Raid heavy MMO’s out there. So why to bother and do the same thing again? This isn’t what I expect from ArenaNet and their game.
Roleplaying …
We are talking about loot here… So it’s off topic.
If there’s only 1 or 2 sets in the game (Very likely) that you like… Once you have that.. Then what? Just sit around and wait for new content?
Exactly… This sucks.
I really love Gw2. But lately I’ve been playing Rift and in opposite to this game I feel rewarded for anything I do! And it feels great.
In Gw2 rewords look more like this: choose one particular thing to do and do it AGAIN AND AGAIN! And after hundreds of similar runs you will get your reward. And this sucks.
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It’s fun for some people to farm things. I find it satisfying, as long as I’m getting a decent return for time invested. That’s how you get a decent supply of things in the market. Those who like to farm, do, and sell the items to those who don’t. If items can’t be farmed effectively, you see the kind of prices we have on charged lodestones.
Ok, but for me it’s not satisfying to not getting as much when I try to actually enjoy the game. I don’t like the thought that I’m missing something simply because I play it only the way it feels fun and not like a second job.
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There is no source. It’s just common sense.
There are only two possible explanations why servers fluctuate from very high to high and back on a daily basis.
1) people are creating new accounts every evening and delete them 12 hours later every day
2) people simply go to bed
On top of that. If it was actually Accounts number. Then it wouldn’t be possible for servers to go from all being full at first few weeks to some of them to being full right now.
All that said. The Game is not even close to being dead.
Data part 1 : 10 Hours farming onyx lodestones – 1 onyx lodestone – earth ele.
Data part 2 : 7200 earth ele. killed – 1 onyx lodestone
Result : 100 onyx lodestone needed = 1000 hours ( 1 K hours ) or 720000 earth ele. kills !
Match this data with your testers that see nothing wrong with drop rates please !
Have a nice day !
I just really hope that they never encourage people to kill any type of enemies over and over again…
Data part 1: better chance to get onyx loadstones from elementals then from chests
Result: people instead of enjoying the game are killing the same monsters over and over again.
Asking me to support them and then change the entire base of the game in 1 patch is wrong.
I don’t think they’ve done anything like it. They’ve talked about level cap increase long before launch. They’ve also said that they are separating PvP from PvE because of the change in their character progression design.
Personally I don’t consider items as content gate but the way you acquire them (like raids are the ultimate content lock for me – it was never possible for me to progress through them).
And the “No new tier in 2013” means also that there will be a new tier in 2014.
…
Really good point dude! Pursuing more powerful gear is fun! And there is no real reason to resign from this. I’m also fun of original gw but the lack of progression was the worst aspect of that game for me.
What will happen next? Their will be Party Groups saying “Only Full Ascended gear only~!”
So your saying that the worst thing that can happens is that some people will ask you to acquire these ascended gear… Just like they probably asked you before to have full exotic and level 80 character? And what if you will be able to acquire ascended gear through any aspect of the game? Like doing dynamic event where you don’t need a group?
Why extending progress appears so bad to some of the people? Diablo games get so popular because of their endless character progression. This is just fun!
Whole effect on the game through ascended gear is minor (Dungeons, WvW) or non existant (sPvP, Open World PvE). So why so negative?
There are also problems with your point of view. That is the one with no vertical progression. Because what if I don’t like any of the new armors? Like now… I’ve done like 100 times TA dungeon and just a few times any of the other dungeons because I liked only one of the dungeon armors. Is it ok to you?
As long as this game stays casul friendly, everything is ok to me. I’m afraid possibility of raids introduction a lot more then ascended gear. Because if they focus on that then this will probably mean that I will never see the most impressive parts of the game. Currently Ascended gear isn’t even close of having that effect to the game.
Do you remember when the game is started and the areas had a lot of player? I want it back!
Posted by: HiddenNick.7206
Underflow? Make this happen.
Nah… Better make people do events instead of dungeons over and over again.
“A new player enters the designated area” is the same thing as a constant check. I’m not sure how to explain what I mean, but it’s not a one-time thing.
How does scaling work for dynamic events?
I was wondering the same thing. Would it be so hard to make spawn rates scale, like it happens for dynamic events?
It can be handled by a trigger. Also take note there are hundreds of events in the whole world and hundreds of thousands enemies.
To the OP:
I think that the only thing we should ask for is Arena Net doing a better job with educating people how to make a successful healer/tank build (ie. something else then dps). And make them feel their power in other ways then by looking at their damage.
There are a lot of other MMOs out there that are beautifully catered towards raiders, I don’t see why GW2 has to be one of them as well.
I was/am attracted to the casual nature of GW2. Once raids are added games cease to be casual, IMO. Suddenly there’s a level of exclusivity. Raiders will always have the best everything: best gear, best titles, best vanity items, etc., basically leaving anyone who doesn’t like to raid inferior.
Plus, I can honestly say I’ve met very few people who raided for the enjoyment of it. They do it because it’s the only way to be “the best”. I’m not saying nobody enjoys it, but I really do believe that those who do enjoy raiding are a very small percentage of any given playerbase. It’s not something I’m convinced the masses would participate in or enjoy, so I’d rather see developmental resources go elsewhere.
One of the best posts in this thread.
Personally I’m not sure that raids shouldn’t come into the game. But I agree that the casual nature of the game is one of its biggest strengths for people like me. I’ve seen everything in the game only because it didn’t required from me to waste a whole night to gather a group and raid!
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People will ride the kharma train in Orr, since it gives the most kharma. What do you think?
No if they implement something that makes doing different events more profitable then doing the same thing over and over again.
So I ask, do you think these updates are a “make or break” for GW2? Do you think it will bring new players back to the game? Will it help the mid-level zones that suffer from lack of activity? Can you speculate what Arenanet’s solutions will be? Is it enough? If they falter here, do you think the game is going to plummet down hill?
Their updates are probably target toward fixing all that.
There is no subscription fee so people who really enjoyed the game will probably come back if they have a reasons to play. And those updates will be just that for a lot of them.
Also I really hope AN will do something toward educating people how to play the game to have fun. Just point them in the right direction and make it easier to understand the game better in all aspects.
Besides that obvious example, we could look at something like the Paladin or Druid from WoW, hybrids that are capable of filling all roles.
But you HAVE TO choose one of those roles!
For example you choose to be a tank (like Paladin with Protection) and you use healers equipment then you will suck hard with tanking.
In gw2 it’s combined effort that counts. So if you tank a bit and heal a bit then your doing a lot.
PS. I’m not saying that holy trinity is completely broken! I’m just saying that Gw2 system isn’t as bad as some of you say it is.
Wtf? Those are just… basics.
Yes they are… I’m not arguing with that.
DPSers can do A LOT of mistakes, gearing, doing dps,
Covered all that here:
Just choose the best build from the internet and use your skills in the correct order.
failing at boss mechanics
Did you even read my post? Or did you just skipped this:
(I’ve just skipped specific boss mechanic intentionally. I’m aware of that some fights require much more from all roles)
Same with healer
You said it…
If you ask me most of the problems araise from players forgetting that they got those defensive trait lines, foods, rune sets etc to make their char something else then a glass cannon. You can be any of the trinity if you spec for it and get right gear.
Exactly. For the people complaining about the lack of roles ArenaNet could introduce it as some kind of build recipe for the kind of role they want to play.
You want a healer? Then make a guardian with staff/maximize healing power/get monk runes and choose healing skills… And there you go!
One one hand I’m a bit sad that there will be no new zones, on the other hand it’s probably for the better. I’m glad they’re trying to focus on improving the foundation of the game instead of adding new floors.
I’m with you on that!
c : having no particularly distinctive quality or application
Especially letter C represents the class structure and combat design in Guild Wars 2.
Can you be MORE specific?! Like give me an example of game where you have a good variety of classes and why do you think that all classes in Gw2 are the same?! I really have no idea why are you saying that. You are trying to be a wise guy. And that’s not a discussion in any way.
Just because you don’t get, doesn’t mean you should call him a wiseguy.
I called him a this way because he didn’t try to explain anything but tried to be wise guy instead. I KNOW the meaning of the word! So it wasn’t an answer to my question in ANY degree. You shouldn’t try to excuse him just because you agree with him.
The truth is simply that there is too little definition in GW2. The classes are distinct in name but not so much in purpose. So a ranger or warrior or elementalist are different names, technically with different names but their purpose is to dps and support. Both really is best.
I do agree with that to some degree.
Then the rest of it depends not so much on your skill choices or trait assignments (what could have been depth but isn’t in the end) but on your ability to dodge and ress team mates.
Skill choices and traits DO matter. They just do… Why do you try to argue with that?
Also… Let me describe to you in the exact same way what your abilities have to be in standard MMO:
Tank – you just need to use threat skills in the simple manner (you just spam it).
Healer – you just watch the single health bar and use your heal skills when it drops.
Dps – you don’t have to be good at anything really… Just choose the best build from the internet and use you skills in the correct order.
In Gw2 everyone needs to CC, dodge, heal themselves, support and DPS. So it doesn’t look that bad to me…
(I’ve just skipped specific boss mechanic intentionally. I’m aware of that some fights require much more from all roles)
This is what gives it all a generic and non-specific feel to it. Trinity games have clear roles.
Yes they do… But what exactly does it change? Trinity is just for grouping. So when you go into dungeon you need a tank healer and 3 x dps. And this specific feature doesn’t make the game any more interesting to me. I’ve tried it.
In SWTOR for example you can play a tank in heavy armour or light armour. Different types of damage mitigation. Also healers there have different styles.
Any of 8 classes have their own specific mechanics just as in SWTOR. The only difference is the lack of specific roles.
Also… You CAN heal in Gw2! The difference is in how it works here. You don’t have a single target that every mob attacks. Instead you need to heal yourself and CC monsters to the degree you can handle it.
…
And then you go in all directions… Most of it doesn’t have anything to do with trinity.
And about game class variations. When I play my guardian I use almost always highly defensive build. So for that purpose I’m using Mace and Shield. All my traits and equipment is build toward tank type build. And it works brilliantly to me. I can’t simply transition from that to Greatsword DPS build! Because I would need to change ALL my gear to do that.
Also when I use mace I’m becoming a hybrid healer/tank which is never possible in Trinity games.
Whole Gw2 character system is very deep to me. Just try playing something else then pure DPS in Gw2 and you will appreciate it. Why it does not matter to you is a problem for ArenaNet. But it doesn’t have anything to do with the false assumption that every class is the same.
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I totally agree.
GW1 had very distinct variations between the gameplay across the 10 professions. GW2 is more like…. most ranged is the same, most melee is the same.
What?! Why do you say that?! Do you really think this way? Can you be MORE specific? Why Assassins where so much more different from warrior in gw1 then thiefs from warrior in gw2? Can you explain me that for an example?
c : having no particularly distinctive quality or application
Especially letter C represents the class structure and combat design in Guild Wars 2.
Can you be MORE specific?! Like give me an example of game where you have a good variety of classes and why do you think that all classes in Gw2 are the same?! I really have no idea why are you saying that. You are trying to be a wise guy. And that’s not a discussion in any way.
There are basically 8 DPS classes that are very generic in and of themselves.
I can’t disagree with that any more then I do!
There are rather 8 hybrid DPS/Healer/Tanks in Gw2. And what’s so generic about that?!
“Everything the same” is the very definition of generic.
In what way? I don’t get you…
You probably don’t play WoW to the extend of end-game raiding.
99.999% of WoW encounters have mindless cooldown mechanic. Raids are just a tiny part of all game encounters. And still… They aren’t so complicated as you would like them to be. Also there are available only for very limited part of population.
Interesting game mechanics need to be programmed on a per boss basis. High HP are just one value to edit.
Part of it is the lack of trinity. If you have a trinity system, it can be rubber stamped onto every encounter and no matter how boring it is, the encounter retains the trinity mechanics of players being cross-dependent. GW2 does not have this option. While the game has some bosses who have interesting game mechanics, there are far too many to expect a custom programmer’s job be done on every single one of them.
Trinity mechanic is only interesting from healers perspective (and tanks in far smaller degree). Others just stand in one spot and hit all their skills as fast as they can… From their perspective it is far less interesting then Gw2 system because they can’t die.
Have you ever actually played a real MMO?
What do you mean by “real MMO”?
One with combat that doesn’t consist of mindlessly blowing cooldowns, or one with boss encounters that aren’t just trash mobs with ridiculous health pools, or one with real PVE progression that’s an actual challenge.
You know, one not like Guild Wars 2.
Hmm… So WoW also isn’t real MMO because I’m most certainly playing that game this way.
There are basically 8 DPS classes that are very generic in and of themselves.
I can’t disagree with that any more then I do!
There are rather 8 hybrid DPS/Healer/Tanks in Gw2. And what’s so generic about that?!
I said there’s no tell warning about this attack. A lot of attacks in this game have a tell that is proportional in duration with the travel time between the mob and you. How could I dodge this when the damage happens instantly with no visual cue?
I just try to talk generally. I know there may be some minor issues with the game… I don’t care about discussing them.
Heavy shutdown tactics don’t need you to think during the fight : you just apply rotation and the mobs are dead before they can act. Mostly this is for trash in dungeons so it’s not that bad but not all classes can help in such fashion so it’s a source of unbalance. And full kitting fights are kind of uninteresting. And the chaotic mess isn’t fun at all to play and the level 0 of group play skill.
As you said… Bad teams do it safe and slower.
Also… Have you played all arah paths?
I disagree about that statement. Try the hardest bosses in Tera to see. In a lot of those fights (some of those were actually soloed by a non healing class) the healer role is more to catch up mistakes the rest of the team does because they can actually avoid all damage if they are careful and the tank does it’s work. And there are a LOT of damage coming their way to avoid. The tank himself can carefully mitigate most damage to the point is self healing is enough to sustain the whole fight.
So first of all I was talking GENERALLY and you are talking about some specific exceptions. Your example does not prove me wrong.
You can notice something in that. There is a trinity in Tera, but in some fights, one of the components isn’t actually “required” so it’s more of a matter of having one tank and the rest DPS. I think GW2 really needs some nothing of tanking to shine in PvE. At the core of it, tanking role isn’t here to absorb all damage the boss does so that the DPS can stop thinking and DPS more. Tanking for me is a role that when carefully done makes the boss more predictable thus avoiding the chaotic mess that happens when aggro goes all wonky.
And here your talking about how Tera is not as “Trinitish” as it appears. Why?
There is also CC and healing in Gw2. But it’s just not obligatory. While I play my guardian I always keep try to aggro monsters. When I lose it is more probable for people to die. So I’m kind of tank. But the way I am a tank in Gw2 it does not mean that other people are safe.
The fact that most trinity games work like that : tanker keeps aggro, healer heals tank, DPS stand around picking their noses while their macro does the work isn’t desirable for GW2.
So actually you are agreeing with me
But the current system of : there’s that champion icebrood wolf. We attack him, I position myself in it’s back to avoid his AoE swiping melee attack while some guy in from is kiting him or plain mitigating and overhealing the damage. Then, suddenly I get aggro and he just decides to launchs his leap attack. Leap attack in melee range = KD + 2×7k damage instantly with no tells at all. Even if you tell me to build ultra defensive to survive that attack, the damage received would still be that much to cause lost time due to having to run away and heal all that damage and in many fights the situation wouldn’t happen either.
In my opinion if you die this way it’s YOUR fault. Dodge mechanic is for this kind of situations. And I don’t really think that something like “suddenly” in any of boss encounters.
This is one of the main problems with GW2 PvE. Either you use tactics that completely shutdown the mobs or their damage or you go heavy kitting or it’s a chaotic mess of people resed all other the place.
What’s wrong with that? Do it right and your ok. Do i wrong and try to survive… It looks fine for me.
We need more fights like the better Tera boss fights with always visible tells, importance of placement of all players and of reading mob behavior and harsh timed kill speed to prevent boring full on defensive gearing for all players.
I do agree with that.
Sadly, the only sign of this takeovers is a contested waypoint.
There are events where bridges are destroyed Even some buildings can burn when you fail events.
About the Opening Post. I do agree with some of the things you wrote. Especially with: “there are so many things to do but to few reasons to do them”. I just hope that ANet knows that.
But with some of them I can’t agree. Especially those where you expect some things because you imagine them differently.
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Interesting game mechanics need to be programmed on a per boss basis. High HP are just one value to edit.
Part of it is the lack of trinity. If you have a trinity system, it can be rubber stamped onto every encounter and no matter how boring it is, the encounter retains the trinity mechanics of players being cross-dependent. GW2 does not have this option. While the game has some bosses who have interesting game mechanics, there are far too many to expect a custom programmer’s job be done on every single one of them.
Trinity mechanic is only interesting from healers perspective (and tanks in far smaller degree). Others just stand in one spot and hit all their skills as fast as they can… From their perspective it is far less interesting then Gw2 system because they can’t die.
Have you ever actually played a real MMO?
What do you mean by “real MMO”?
Interesting game mechanics need to be programmed on a per boss basis. High HP are just one value to edit.
Part of it is the lack of trinity. If you have a trinity system, it can be rubber stamped onto every encounter and no matter how boring it is, the encounter retains the trinity mechanics of players being cross-dependent. GW2 does not have this option. While the game has some bosses who have interesting game mechanics, there are far too many to expect a custom programmer’s job be done on every single one of them.
Trinity mechanic is only interesting from healers perspective (and tanks in far smaller degree). Others just stand in one spot and hit all their skills as fast as they can… From their perspective it is far less interesting then Gw2 system because they can’t die.
I do agree with you to an extent, after you’re geared, which don’t take long, even less time if you want to buy the gold, there’s not a whole lot to do. The other day I noticed myself running around in circles in Lion’s Arch when I said, “wtf am I doing”?
Ye… And you know what is the saddest thing about it? There are so many bosses, epic events or really cool places that just scream to visit them! But the problem is there is no reword for doing so.
So much content not so much reasons to play with it… That’s my opinion.
PS I’m still loving the game and finding things to do! But this game lacks so little to be so great!
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8. Add mounts and less way points.
Waypoints are better than mounts, I can’t see practical use of a mount and the devs already stated they don’t want mounts to be just speed buffs.
Most people use speed buff skill as one of their utilities.
Problem with WP is that the game is about doing dynamic events that occur around you while you travel through the world. You can’t participate in any events when you jump past them.
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Gold trading is in almost all MMO’s.
Why this bothers you so much when you had so much fun ‘playing’ the game?
Combat needs to be sharpened in terms of responsiveness of controls. Too many abilities lock up or delay further input in inappropriate ways. For a game that supposedly emphasizes skill, combat often times feels clunky, slow, and at times, just plain unresponsive.
Can you be more specific? I have no clue what your talking about!
I’ve not played for the past couple of weeks. For me, it was a combination of the Fractal + Ascended + Reddit AMA. It’s kind of ironic that it was the Reddit that finished pushing me over the edge.
I think that people like you just look for excuse to leave and go back playing what you used to… If it wasn’t about ascended gear or not getting the exact answers you expected, it would be about something else.
I’ve been without a MMO for over half a year because I didn’t like any of my options on the market. Each MMO was left after the devs started to noticably change their games or produced content that was clearly against their stated goals for the game. At this point, I’m even crazy enough to think about getting into The Secret World since it meets many of the criteria points that I care about (regardless of the enforced trinity requirements and the hard mode dungeon grinding in the end game scene). While I certainly don’t agree with everything that Funcom is doing, they are being consistent with their concept and haven’t tried to make any kind of substancial promise that they have no intent of keeping.
So your saying I was right!
My problem with that is that some TP stuff are considered almost mandatory, like the BL salvage kit and the bank space.
Now that the gem prices have gone through the roof I feel stucked.
They’ve added an NPC with Black Lion Key that you can acquire by sacrificing equipment/food or other stuff. So you don’t need so many gems.
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I’ve not played for the past couple of weeks. For me, it was a combination of the Fractal + Ascended + Reddit AMA. It’s kind of ironic that it was the Reddit that finished pushing me over the edge.
I think that people like you just look for excuse to leave and go back playing what you used to… If it wasn’t about ascended gear or not getting the exact answers you expected, it would be about something else.
I have a friend who stopped playing because he didn’t like the fact that there are quests like feeding cows which he considers it silly. How is that any different then your case?
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I really like your ideas! It would make people go and visit different places and this is what this game needs.
But I see one more problem with the current game state. Even with your idea incorporated. People still wouldn’t travel trough maps… They would just teleport in, finish event and teleport out.
Is there a good Condition Damage (burning) build out there for a guardian?
Also: Is Precision in a any way a good combination with Condition Damage stat?
gw1 had just as many players as wow during its peak.
No it didn’t. Still it was a great game and I loved it!
Those exotics are expensive because of their skin. And the skin can be transmuted to ascended stats. Legendary is a Tier above Ascended so it must be up scaled.
i would sugest letting NA and EU servers compete with one another so we have one global ranking
That’s also probably just not possible.
I think it is technically impossible to merge more people into the same server. Most of the servers are at High right now.
Instead merging servers I would rather suggest giving people credit for traveling through the world and doing different events. Because right now most of the people are just doing dungeons or farming single events over and over again.
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