Guild Wars 2

Mournilg.4870:

i agree that thief/rev comparison isn’t good. Thief is supposed to burn a lot of init to spike the ennemy where Revenant build up energy on the long run. Actual problem is survivability on this long run.

Yeah, as I said before Revenant is something between ele, warrior and thief, and very different from all of them.

I agree on survivability (and 0 energy on healing skill would help a lot).

It’s not the same. You need to be punished if you used energy carelessy and you need to feel that you need the legend’s power to keep doing skills (=legendswap/invocation)

That’s not a bug, but it’s a serious issue. Sword#3 needs a way to be interrupted or a dodge frame.
Could you change the title of the thread?

Mournilg.4870:

He doesn’t want to “get rid of it”. Only on weapon skills.

That means getting rid of the mechanic.

first of all energy on ws is there to punish you if you use too much energy not wisely (they say it clearly in the first Revenant video in February).
And second it’s there to force you to weaponswap if you want to use ws after you’ve used many utility skills.

Mournilg.4870:

And i agree on heals with 0 energy. On the contrary of GW1 we can’t count on others for healing.

If they lowered energy costs on utilities, it would be fine too even with energy on ws.
As Kidel said, ws at worst delay you energy gain, they don’t really empty your bar.
Right now, too much skills be it weapon skills or utilities are too limited in what they do for the cost they have.

yep

also thief don’t have an instant 50% initiative generation.

They said multiple times that Ventari is meant for selfless heal. It’s to heal others.
You can’t say “Shiro has poor self healing, let’s compensate with Ventari because it’s the healing legend”, because Ventari is worse then Shiro for self sustain. It’s meant to help others.

And yeah, if used correctly Ventari can be useful for any group play. Needs some work on healing tho, it felt low.

It seems that if a class gets a oh-weapon then something is added to the mechanic, while if a class gest a 2h-weapon the mechanic is replaced by a similar one.

Asking to have 2 shrouds not only is not really useful, but would require them to make Dragonhunter with 6 virtues.

And at least Reaper Shroud is good, DH virtues are not.

Griffith.7238:

Vennyhedgie.5369:

Honestly I dont think removing the energy cost is a good idea. Having an energy cost means they can have impactful skills on shorter CDs (or they said something of the like in the first revenant reveal back when). I dont wanna be that guy but I think people are just plain outright playing Revenant wrong. I never had an issue with being out of energy for my weapon or heal skills. The ONLY time this has happened was right after using an upkeep skill (usually shiro’s, and honestly that skill’s energy drain needs to be toned down for what it does)

The problem is they said this yes ,but in reality our cds aren’t any lower then other classes when it comes to weapon skills and they still don’t do as much damage. Or have utility tied into them like Blinds, Evades, Etc.

Isn’t that resolved just by lowering energy cost on some skills and increasing the effectiveness of others? Why do you want to get rid of the class mechanic?
The only skill that should cost 0 energy is probably the healing one.

Healing skills need to cost 0 energy.

https://youtu.be/MfYvmHyqumA?t=20m29s
20:29 is what I was looking for, but they mention it also earlier if you care.

They want you to use the power of the legend until it’s over, so that when you legendswap you “feel” you are invoking the power of the legends to do stuff.

Griffith.7238:

Kidel.2057:

it’s not “my” vision.

Oh but it is.

Sure, I decided to add 50% energy on legendswap. It was all my idea

lol, but I said many times that weaponskills need an energy reduction (and some even 0 energy). That’s my suggestion in the first post of this thread.

I just don’t want the core mechanic to be changed.

it’s not “my” vision.
and please, don’t compare it to ele, nobody wants revenant to be a skillspammer with plain cooldown on skills.

I’m not the one doing 2-3 posts in a row everytime. Use the edit button.

I agree, but that has nothing to do with skillspam and energy, it’s because we lack survivability skills and traits, and yeah, energy costs are too high.

I’m not saying we don’t need a higher skill throughput, because we do need it objectively. I’m saying that the core mechanic is fine and a cost reduction on skills will suffice.
They don’t need to change everything because a player refuses to legendswap.

Griffith.7238:

Kidel.2057:

If you want a class that is able to spam 10 diluted skills go ahead. I prefer a class that is a little bit hard to use, that forces you to make choice, but those choices are meaningful.

Yeah you know what else needs to happen in that scenario said high skill cap class actually needs to be rewarding. Why play a class that’s hard to play when played at its highest tier it only achieves mediocrity? Oh wait not even mediocrity the worst DPS out of every class.

Sure, and as I said before, if you want an easy class, maybe you shouldn’t bother with Revenant.
Revenant is supposed to be a nostalgia class for GW1 players. Sorry if it doesn’t suit you, and please avoid postspamming.

skowcia.8257:

Im sorry to break it for you guys, but energy is almost fine in current state is fine. Youre not supposed to spam everything off cd. The moment where you remove weapon energy you will be able to spam utility skills like riposting shadows and jade winds like no tomorrow which will lead to some serious cd and balance issues there. Weapon skills also at this point will get up espesially after added weapon swap. If you cant manage energy properly, just stop playing it. Maybe that class inst for you. Revenant is supposed to be a complex class like engi and ele.

He posted many videos if you don’t believe me.

You probably ignored all the pvp-only player that basically told you l2p in this same thread.

it’s the only mentioned source of energy aside from the slow pips.
Again, if you want a skill spammer where energy management is trivial, go ahead.

If you want a class that is able to spam 10 diluted skills go ahead. I prefer a class that is a little bit hard to use, that forces you to make choice, but those choices are meaningful.

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/revenant-the-master-of-the-mists/

Let’s start with the basics. A revenant can select from a pool of legends—epic characters from the past that you can invoke power from—and slot two different legends at a time. With this constant connection to the Mists, you’ll always have one active legend and one inactive legend. The current active legend will determine the skills on the right half of your skill bar. It’s similar to weapon swapping, but instead it affects your healing, utility, and elite skills. Not only will the legend you select determine your skills, but you’ll have an energy bar tied to your currently invoked legend.
This energy bar is a new resource that the revenant relies on in order to use skills. Some skills will have a low energy cost, allowing you to use them more often, while others have a large cost with a very large payoff. When you invoke a new legend, you’ll begin at half energy and generate more energy over time. This creates a push-and-pull feel with the energy that you manage as you use your skills.

by Roy Cronacher on February 18, 2015

Is that enough to convince you Griffith?

Lol yeah, guess I’ll just ignore him at this point, no point in repeating.
If they remove energy from ws I at least hope they buff Invigorating Howl. I hope it’s not needed however.

Legendswap is not meant as a solution (my god, that’s dense), it’s the main class mechanic. They made legendswap the only fast source of energy so that you use it when you can’t use weaponskills anymore (and that’s why weaponskills have energy cost).
Having you unable to use weaponskill is a punishment policy for having used too many skills and/or no legendswap.

I agree that skills need a reduced cost, but if you’re unable to use the class mechanic then it’s your fault.

If energy is so easy to manage that you can camp a legend without legendswapping then it means that you have 10 utility skills (double compared to other classes) and you’re NOT paying any drawback for tham.

But no class has the same luxury of having 10 utility skills with no cooldown.

Loex is right, you want a class like warrior but with 10 utility skills and no cd.
Sorry, you can’t have both. If you want all those skills and with no cd you need to accept energy management and less customization.

If you’re unable to manage energy just don’t play Revenant (or maybe learn).
Since many players are ok with Revenant’s current mechanic, probably the problem is the way you play.

Shiro/Jalis. Want damage? You have 3 dps oriented utility skills (1 on Jalis, 2 on Shiro). Want survivability? You have 4 survivability oriented skills (2 on Shiro, 2 on Jalis). 7 utility skills you can adjust to all the situations, of course you have to make a choice, they can’t allow you to spam all of them

If energy is so easy to manage that you can camp a legend without swapping then it means that you have 10 utility skills (double compared to other classes) and you’re NOT paying any drawback for tham.

uhohhotdog.3598:

Kidel.2057:

uhohhotdog.3598:

Kidel.2057:

lowering the cd on legendswap is not easy, since you would increase the skill throughput of the elites. I’m not saying I’m against it.

I’d add cool down to elites

sure, a nerf is what we need. -_-

I rarely used elites when I was playing because I was always low on energy. Unyielding anguish is too useful.

The fact that you didn’t use them doesn’t mean we all didn’t. A nerf is a nerf.

uhohhotdog.3598:

Actually it wouldn’t even be a nerf if you make the cool down 10 seconds because that’s the cool down on legendaries now. Or something like that. Just enough to prevent spam.

Meaning you can’t build up energy to spam 2 in a row. Still a nerf.
The whole point of having energy management is so that we have less cd to worry about.

Loex.5104:

Griffith.7238:

I love the exaggerated 5 Phase Traversals and 2 Jade Winds in row you guys really pull this kitten out of your kitten haha. It’s possible to do that now removing energy from weapon skills isn’t going to make it more possible. Rev’s as they are now can’t survive long enough without using a utility to pool 100 energy unless they are being completely ignored in which case the Rev in its current state could do these things just as easily. You guys crack me up.

… you don’t see the difference between nuking the kitten out of your utillities and beeing unable to do anything after that and nuking the kitten out of your utillities and beeing still able to run your whole rotation without thinking 1 second about it?

so actually you want a warrior with 2 util bars and no cooldown on utils ..

Just ignore him. It’s pointless at this point, he doesn’t understand.

Mournilg.4870:

It would change the fact we can’t use weapon skills while at 0 energy and still be limited in our utility uses.

But you just need to legendswap to use weaponskills again, and it’s instant.
Remove cost on ws and there is no need to legendswap, that’s the point.
And if your legendswap is on cd and you used all your energy it means you managed poorly or you spammed a lot.

Mournilg.4870:

5 Phase traversal in a row means you sat on your energy for 10 seconds using only weapon skills. If an ennemy sees you keeping energy for a long time, he can easyly see what’s coming as he knows what is at you disposal.

Dude, he was replying to Griffith who wants 100 energy (ooc or on swap, can’t remember). You don’t need to build up for that, and that’s why it’s wrong.

uhohhotdog.3598:

Kidel.2057:

lowering the cd on legendswap is not easy, since you would increase the skill throughput of the elites. I’m not saying I’m against it.

I’d add cool down to elites

sure, a nerf is what we need. -_-

Loex.5104:

i mean without any cost changes it would be : "yay … 5 Phase Traversal in a row if i dont use IO "… great balance.

This.

With 100 energy on swap or ooc things would go crazy. I mean, 2 jade winds in a row, lol

To fix that they would have to increase the energy cost on skills, so we would end up nerfed (since our max energy is still 100, and if they increase it then it’s just the same as before but with bigger numbers).

Removing cd from weaponskills is bad too, because people would just stop using the class mechanic.

The easiest and probably the best thing to do is to leave the mechanics untouched and just lower some energy costs.
Overall our throughput will increase a lot, making us on par with other classes, still avoiding skillspam and still having legendswap useful for energy sustain.

lowering the cd on legendswap is not easy, since you would increase the skill throughput of the elites. I’m not saying I’m against it.

So the reason for being upset is that other people get a 10$ digital game included while you get a 10$ digital item included?

I’m glad you’ll probably stop playing soon.

Bumping and reminding to add that sword3 follows even in mesmer portal (enemy portal). Could be a bug.

Even if you get the package with 1 extra slot, if you are a veteran you get an additional one.

If you got gw2 after the 23rd of January then you can buy HoT and ask for a refund of your base game cost. After buying HoT if you don’t want your account deactivated.

It’s all in the FAQ however.

So anybody tried? Or what do you think about it?

The skill has a similar cd to CttB, short cast time, 18s of aoe unblockable chill and poison, plus you can keep using your skills while it lasts.

Are you kidding? As said multiple times by multiple users, linking attacks to legend is bad. For variety and mechanic. Legendswap and weaponswap are decided on very different needs

Guess I’ll jump on this wagon then and ask for racial/mistfire wolf skills. Following this reasoning we are the only class that can’t use them

Kaiden Valor.7163:

makagoto.1204:

finally we will find out about those signet like looking skills :-)

I’m more curious to know what the class mechanic change/addition will be. Are they going to alter how energy works? Change legend swap? Add a third legend to the legend swap?

But I do want to know the skills too

Since we only get an offhand weapon, following Tempest and Chronomancer, the class mechanic should get something added instead of something replaced (so unlike Reaper and Dragonhunter). Just a theory.

So maybe Glint will be on F2? Or we may get additional passive effects when channeling a legend (like 10% damage reduction on Jalis)?

Hammerguard.9834:

Kydar Schattendolch.6879:

General: Give Rev in each legend 5 utilitys to choose from….so it’s in line with other professions (20 Skills) ans theres more variability in the builds.

So what would be the point of choosing 2 legends and so of having 20 utility skills at the same time? You basically want the same freedom of other classes plus the advantage of 2 custom skill sets.

The point of revenant is that you don’t pick your skills but just your legends with 2 skillsets set in stone. Because of this “handicap” you have a double number of skills to choose from during the fight, and so energy to avoid spam. It’s a chain you can’t break.

And what’s the matter with the NUMBER of skills? What really matters is the quality.
You can’t use all of them anyway.

Mace is indeed good, never said it’s not. Mid-range would just add weapon variety since we already have 3 melee. I’m nitpicking here.

Glad you like the other suggestions.

makagoto.1204:

finally we will find out about those signet like looking skills :-)

yfw they’re signets xD

what’s the point of picking Jalis if you can choose his same heal on Shiro? That’s just an example. Picking skills would just make legends useless. You’re simply saying that you don’t like Revenant’s mechanic, and you’re free to do it. However don’t ask to ruin the class please.

Well I guess it’s not a big deal since that item will be replaced with a functioning one when it’s ready. And it’s probably nothing rare.
I’ve sent a ticket just in case and that’s what I’ve been told:

[…]
Thanks very much for letting us know about your Beta ??? item. I will be sure to pass this information to the proper teams! In the mean time, I would suggest not destroying the item.

Also, the next time that you’re in the game and you find a bug, you can do us a favor by submitting an in-game bug report. This will send detailed information about your character and your position directly to our Quality Assurance Team and will help us kitten the issue as promptly as possible. To submit a bug report in the game, simply click on the “Game Menu” button in the upper left-hand corner of the game interface, then choose the “Support” option on the Game Menu. That option will allow you to review known issues, report a bug, or contact Customer Support.

If you have any other questions, please let us know!

Regards,
[…]

Of course, submitting the in-game bug report was the first thing I did after receiving the item, just report.

So don’t delete the item.

Yeah, I agree with healing skills consuming no energy. Healing is a panic button.
That’s way more wise then removing cost on ws.

Made a Sylvari Reaper, so I could not test it. How was it at the end?

legendswap is literally instant energy generation.

Guardian can play defensive roles effectively, but more importantly has a lot of survivability. Revenant is squishy atm.

I find every single Shiro skill useful in pve (expecially Riposting Shadows and Phase Traversal, LOL, are we kidding? The first is a stun breaker and the other one is a leap). The only skill I find useless among all the skills we have is Jalis taunt, but only because it costs too much.

And if you don’t find them useful (lol) then just swap Shiro with another legend. We have )soon) 5 of them, I’m sure you’ll find something you like. Just as with utility skills.

See you Verdant Brink

if you get customizable skill sets then you don’t need legendswap+customizable legends.
The fact that you choose 2 legends and 10 skills is to make up for the fact that you can’t customize skills. That’s our trade.

CountzuCrytus.7256:

No Synergy with Runes/Sigils

What is Superior Rune of Rage and Superior Rune of the Pack + Invocation line?
Or Superior Sigil of Frailty + Devastation line?

High res from Tilion@DragonSeasonCom https://i.imgur.com/CWBJdeP.jpg

https://youtu.be/jgrvm6OI_9Q
You will give the people of Tyria an ideal to strive towards. They will race behind you, they will stumble, they will fall. But in time, they will join you in the sun. In time, you will help them accomplish wonders.

See you in the Heart of Maguuma