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[Spoilers] Theory on the Summit

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Mickey Frogeater.1470

I personally suspect what we think is the avatar of the Pale Tree might not be who she says she is…..

The Dragon's Reach. (Spoilers, bookahs!)

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Norn are hunters who obsessively believe that one must hunt alone to get the highest respect……

Let Mordrem Fight other Dragon Minions?

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Mickey Frogeater.1470

Mordremoth is an Elder Dragon with ties to the mind….. I’m quite certain that Mordremoth could trick the Branded into thinking everything’s normal….

The Lore Interview that claimed that the Elder Dragons would fight weremerely putting forth one of the Durmand Priory’s theories…..

They never said it was the right one…..

For all we know Mordremoth and Jormag are all on the same side!

They both target the mind first before corrupting though Jormag is more subtle than Mordremoth who straight up just wears down the mind’s defenses while Jormag offers power….

Kralkatorrik and Primordus seem bestial while Zhaitan, Mordremoth and Jormag seem intelligent….

The Dragon's Reach. (Spoilers, bookahs!)

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Mickey Frogeater.1470

So Jormag is more insidious and evil than Mordremoth is…..

Explains why they are saving him for later…..

No idea why Kralkatorikk is being held back…

Primordus seems to be an Elder Dragon that we’d most likely fight directly rather than by ship….

Most likely the order is: Zhaitan, Mordremoth, Kralkatorrik, Primordus and finally Jormag as the last one….

Mordremoth is the most overtly threatening Elder Dragon…. Even Zhaitan wasn’t as threatening to Tyria as he was….

Jormag and the Mists

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Mickey Frogeater.1470

Jormag has been shown to use portals from the Mists to invade the Northern Shiverpeaks….

Is there a slight possibility that he may have already relocated to the Mists?…..

Possibly even invading the Underworld?…..

The Dragon's Reach. (Spoilers, bookahs!)

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Mickey Frogeater.1470

So it seems Mordremoth is no different corruption wise from Jormag….

He seems to have a similar reach as Jormag…. Jormag has access to the Mists so his reach is much stronger than we would normally assume…..

It wouldn’t surprise me if Jormag hasn’t already relocated himself to the Ice Wastes of the Underworld!

zaitan/dark green orb

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Mickey Frogeater.1470

Jormag had help from the Sons of Svanir just as Mordremoth had help from Scarlet…..

Deep Sea Dragon could have woke up at the same time as Jormag……

[Spoiler] Ancient Dragon (?)

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Mickey Frogeater.1470

So you meant absence of evidence….. Yes my theory is merely based on the OP’s assumption that the central orb is an Elder Dragon……

Unfortunately we have no idea what the center orb actually means…..

All we can do is preform Wild Mass Guessing until we get the answers in the upcoming Living Story releases…

(edited by Mickey Frogeater.1470)

[Spoiler] Ancient Dragon (?)

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Mickey Frogeater.1470

How does the notion that an Elder Dragon is posing as the will of the Pale Tree in all known go against evidence?

Malyck’s tree dosen’t seem to have a Dream…..

Seven Dragons

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Mickey Frogeater.1470

The central Orb could embody an Elder Dragon of Light….

Everyone takes it for granted that it’s the Pale Tree’s voice Scarlet heard and that the Pale Tree has an avatar…..

What if these are all illusions?

What if an Elder Dragon corrupted the Pale Tree and is passing itself off as said Pale Tree?

What if it turned a random Sylvari into it’s avatar or should I say Dragon Champion to further the illusion?…..

Kralkatorik is Air not Chaos judging from the crystals made from his Dragon Champion Glint’s flesh…

7 gods, 6 dragons and tyria?

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Mickey Frogeater.1470

The Elder Dragons aren’t combinations but rather pure form of Elemental Magics….

Primordus – Fire
Jormag – Ice
Kralkatorrik – Air
Deep Sea Dragon – Water
Zhaitan – Death
Mordremoth – Plant

The central Orb represents Light……

Are we sure the voice that claims to be the Pale Tree is infact the Pale Tree and not just another Elder Dragon?

How do we know that the Sylvari aren’t unknowingly corrupted by a Light Elder Dragon passing itself off as the Pale Tree and using a random Sylvari as it’s avatar?

That would imply that Mordremoth is cutting into it’s territory as well as it’s subjects….

[Spoiler] Ancient Dragon (?)

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Mickey Frogeater.1470

Are we even sure that the voice that calls itself the Pale Tree is infact the Pale Tree?

We may have yet another Elder Dragon(one of Light) on our hands trying to corrupt the Pale Tree’s children by giving them the Dream and getting interrupted by Mordremoth/The Nightmare cutting in……

Pale tree is the final boss

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Mickey Frogeater.1470

Do we even know for sure that the Pale Tree the Sylvari are born from is the same entity that calls itself the Pale Tree?

How do we know that an Elder Dragon of Light isn’t passing itself off as the Sylvari’s Pale Tree through the Dream?

7 gods, 6 dragons and tyria?

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Mickey Frogeater.1470

Grenth was called a prince of Ice and Sorrow before fighting Dhuum…

Ice in GW does not mean water but rather Cold…..

Dwayna could have given Grenth Cold Icy Air powers to fight Dhuum.

Dwayna could be Ice and Air, Abbadon Water, Dhuum Death, Balthazar Fire, Melandru Plants and Earth and Lyssa Chaos….

Kralkatorrik is Air, Primordus is Earth, Jormag is Ice, Mordremoth is Plants, Deep Sea Dragon is Water and Zhaitan is Undeath….

None of the Elder Dragons match Lyssa before she stole Abbadon’s Water powers…….

dragons, gods, and cataclysms[spoilers]

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Mickey Frogeater.1470

Mordremoth is plant(similar to Melandru)

The Deep Sea Dragon is Water(similar to Abaddon and later Lyssa after she stole half of his power)

Primordus is Fire(similar to Balthazar)

Jormag is Ice(similar to Grenth who most likely got his Ice powers from his mother Dwayna rather than Dhuum)

According to the ingame book The Elder Dragons Zhaitan is Death(similar to Dhuum)

Kralkatorrik is Crystal with purple energies and might be tied to the Chaos Crystal Caverns which look like Branded Crystals(Lyssa has purple magic though not crystals last I heard….)

The only Magic I don’t see Elder Dragons embodying is Light…..

Could it be the center orb?…..

Ending Cinematic

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Zhaitan’s Champion was getting stronger with Zhaitan’s death so his power is likely going to the strongest minion available…..

Ending Cinematic

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So it is the Pale Tree’s mind we’re seeing!

Her mind shows the Dream as an orb with a map on it…. then it get’s corrupted by Mordremoth…..

Most likely the continent of Tyria…..

The Pale Tree was planted in Arbor Bay which was once Mursaat territory….

Mursaat once hid in another dimension to be safe from the Elder Dragons…..

Could that very dimension be the Dream?….. Could the Pale Tree have been planted in a place where the barrier between the Mursaat realm and Tyria was weak? There were Wind Riders surrounding the lake where the Pale Tree was planted in GW1…..

Ending Cinematic

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Malyck’s tree does not have our Dream of Dreams as he never experienced it.

The Pale Tree was planted in Mursaat territory and Mursaat once hid in another dimension to be safe from the Elder Dragons…..

What’s the likelyhood that she bonded with the Mursaat alternate dimension version of the continent of Tyria they use to traverse the continent while unseen?

*Spoilers* Machine at the end

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Glint may have put mental protections on her maybe?

She may have been planted in a specific place tied to Tyria’s dreams…..

Wind Riders which are Chaos Magic beasts circled the lake in which the Pale Tree was at the center of…… So the lake must be connected to the Dream….. Tied to the continent itself as it were….

The question we must ask is…… What makes Arbor Bay’s lake so special that it is linked to the Dream of the continent of Tyria?…..

This living story season might give us the answers…..

Personally I suspect it was placed on a Mursaat rift into their dimension….. In other Words the Dream is the same place that the Mursaat hid away in when the Elder Dragons previously terrorized the continent…..

Now thanks to the Pale Tree being connected directly to it Mordremoth got himself a link to the Dream that the Mursaat used as a hidaway…..

For all we know the Mursaat created the Dream!

(edited by Mickey Frogeater.1470)

pale tree SPOILER question

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Mickey Frogeater.1470

It shows Tyria or rather the part of Tyria connected to the Pale Tree….

The central orb shows a distorted map with a golden glow in the center….

Maybe Mordremoth corrupted the dream of the continent of Tyria itself….

Malyck’s tree has no Dream and as such this means that the Pale Tree’s dream is tied to Tyria’s spot in the Eternal Alchemy…..

Mordremoth had corrupted the continent’s Dream….. Yes…. it would seem that the continent dreams….. And was corrupted by Mordremoth creating the Nightmare….

Ventari’s tablet keeps the Pale Tree and those protected by her safe from the Elder Dragon corrupted Dream of Tyria….

Do note that the Nightmare appears to be everywhere in the Dream….. The Pale Tree’s protection keeps Sylvari from being corrupted by continent’s Nightmare into Mordrem….

S2: Entangled observations

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The central orb has a map on it….. It could represent the continent…..

In which case we should not be surprised that entering the Pale Tree from the Eternal Alchemy would show us that since she unlike Malyck’s tree is connected to the Dream….

*Spoilers* Machine at the end

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Posted by: Mickey Frogeater.1470

Mickey Frogeater.1470

It shows Tyria or rather the part of Tyria connected to the Pale Tree….

The central orb shows a distorted map with a golden glow in the center….

Mordremoth corrupted the continent of Tyria itself….

Malyck’s tree has no Dream and as such this means that the Pale Tree’s dream is tied to Tyria’s spot in the Eternal Alchemy…..

Mordremoth had corrupted the continent’s Dream….. Yes…. it would seem that the continent dreams….. And was corrupted by Mordremoth creating the Nightmare….

Ventari’s tablet keeps the Pale Tree and those protected by her from the corrupted Dream of Tyria….

Do note that the Nightmare appears to be everywhere in the Dream….. The Pale Tree’s protection keeps Sylvari from being corrupted by continent’s Nightmare into Mordrem….

S2: Entangled observations

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We were passing by alchemical symbols before reaching the Pale Tree and diving into it……

What we saw after that was either the inner workings or even the mind of the Pale Tree herself….

We entered the Eternal Alchemy from the Maguuma Jungle as did Scarlet Briar……

If we were to enter the Eternal Alchemy somewhere else we would most likely run into another powerful entity or mind…….

(SPOILERS) The Eternal Alchemy Cutscene

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The writers said that the Great Destroyer’s death made it so that Primordus’s awakening was delayed by two generations.

Vision ( spoilers )

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We were in the Maguuma Jungle…

Obviously we would run into the Pale Tree(who lives in the Maguuma Jungle) and be able to access her inner workings/mind.

If we entered from Ascalon we would most likely run into Adelbern and get influenced by Foefire….

(SPOILERS) The Eternal Alchemy Cutscene

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Primordus’s champion was to wake him up early yet was interupted.

Basically this was the intended order before Glint and the GW1 players derailed everything.

Primordus woke up first though at the wrong time(most likely at the same time as the Deep Sea Dragon).

Next came the Deep Sea Dragon(didn’t do much until after Zhaitan rose Orr from the depths).

After that came Jormag(Sons of Svanir woke him up right on time).

Mordremoth starts corrupting the Pale Tree to get her to wake himself up which fails due to Ventari’s Tablet.

Zhaitan wakes up on schedule.

Kralkatorrik wakes up late due to Glint not helping it.

Mordremoth succeeds in using Scarlet to wake him up despite being later than intended(Guess Mordremoth is bigger than Kralkatorrik is if he takes longer than Kralkatorrik to awaken on his own).

(SPOILERS) The Eternal Alchemy Cutscene

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Remember We only saw this after entering the Pale Tree. Everything we saw before entering the Pale Tree was the Eternal Alchemy while everything after we entered the Pale Tree was her mind….

What we saw was her mind not the exact number of Elder Dragons existing…..

Kalkratorik(purple), Jormag(white), Primordus(red), Zhaitan(yellow/black) and the Deep Sea Dragon(blue) seem to be actively feeding off of the Pale Tree while Mordremoth is actively corrupting her…..

Ending Cinematic

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What would happen if one traversed the Eternal Alchemy around the Pale Tree all the way to the part embodying Cantha and looked into Kuunavang’s mind?……

Would that be safe?…..

If people keep breaching the Pale Tree’s mind she is likely to fall to the Nightmare completely!

Our minds may be safe yet the Pale Tree’s mind most certainly isn’t!

Realm of Torment Likeness

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They feed on Magic and Mordremoth merely corrupted this food source first!

Jormag is heading south and is likely seeking the Pale Tree as well…..

Realm of Torment Likeness

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Mickey Frogeater.1470

That part at the end is the Pale Tree’s mind obviously.

The start is the Eternal Alchemy though once you pass through the tree you enter the Mind of the Pale Tree and see how Mordremoth corrupted her with the Nightmare….

Such a shame….. If we hadn’t dove into the Pale Tree we would have had a more indepth look at the Eternal Alchemy…..

At least I know enough about Tyria to know what is the Eternal Alchemy and what is part of the Pale Tree’s mind….

The only reason we ran into the Pale Tree in the Eternal Alchemy was because we were in Maguuma Jungle….. Her home……

If we had entered the Eternal Alchemy in Cantha we would have run into something different….. Maybe Kuunavang’s mind….. She seems associated with stars so looking into her mind could give us data on the Celestials.

S2: Entangled observations

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Very convinient for us to use our access to the Eternal Alchemy through Omadd’s machine to get inside the Pale Tree’s mind…..

Scarlet most likely got overtaken by the Nightmare immediately upon getting too close a look at the Mordremoth corrupted Pale Tree…..

Explains the vines she was using upon climbing out of the machine….

Does not explain the entity giving her good ideas making her more intelligent than she originally was…..

Plant Dragons logically shouldn’t be technologically inclined!

The Master of Peace is too suspicious to be trusted…. Especially since his extracting a certain energy from Aerin got him corrupted by Mordremoth.

If he plans on exploiting Scarlet and other Mordremoth corrupted entities connection to Mordremoth then he is a serious threat….

Ending Cinematic

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Now we know that Modremoth can corrupt anyone who looks into the Pale Tree’s mind(the most easily findable target within the Eternal Alchemy when inside the Maguuma Jungle).

If one were to open their mind to the Eternal Alchemy while in Cantha who knows what we would run into……

Ending Cinematic

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So we’re the ones diving into the Pale Tree’s mind in this episode?….. Fascinating……

We follow Scarlet’s footsteps and don’t attempt to avoid the Pale Tree which would have given us actual data on the Eternal Alchemy…..

It didn’t drive us insane like it did Scarlet….. Probably because we’re not dumb enough to get a closer look at the Mordremoth corrupted Pale Tree in her mind…..

Ending Cinematic

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Scarlet only saw that orb and the Elder Dragon orbs after diving into the Pale Tree…..

In other words the Pale Tree knows of 6 Elder Dragons and that one of them invaded her to create the Nightmare…..

Any other Elder Dragons are likely not known to the Pale Tree…..

What Scarlet saw was the Pale Tree’s knowledge of Tyria not the whole Eternal Alchemy……

If there are Elder Dragons in Cantha she wouldn’t know it….

S2: Entangled observations

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Of the 6 Elder Dragons surrounding the Pale Tree only 1 actually sought to corrupt her…..

And it was in it’s sleep too…..

We still don’t know about the Elder Dragons in other locals…….

S2: Entangled observations

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We get to see how Modremoth corrupted the Pale Tree……

What we saw wasn’t the Eternal Alchemy but a map of the Dream and how Modremoth managed to invade the Pale Tree to create the Nightmare….

Scarlet did start off wandering through the Eternal Alchemy yet her curiosity led her to dive inside the Pale Tree where she got exposed to Modremoth’s invasion of the Pale Tree….

She should have went around the tree and continued seeking out the real mysteries of the Eternal Alchemy honestly…..

Ending Cinematic

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So what Scarlet saw was how Modremoth’s mind barged in and corrupted the Pale Tree it would seem……

Now we know where the Nightmare came from…..

And yet we don’t know for certain that the Elder Dragon was the entity that assailed Scarlet’s mind upon her leaving the machine…..

What we do know is that Mordremoth created the Nightmare….

Ending Cinematic

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What does the central orb represent?…… Is it the Pale Tree?…..

We know that Mordremoth targeted it while the other Elder Dragons ignored it…..

Is….. this the birth of the Nightmare?…..

Naming Mordremoth

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The Inquest know who Mordremoth is…… Once the Elder Dragon’s corruption became known they would obviously give out the name publicly since one of their members are on the Arcane Council….

Kasmeer's gift

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Mickey Frogeater.1470

If she did get her lie detector ability from the Tower of Nightmares then it brings up another hinted potential threat to us…

We currently have Faolain, Scarlet’s Alliances, Menzies, Mr E, Master of Peace, Evon Gnashblade, Captain Ellen Kiel, Mordremoth, Caithe(Scarlet hints a dark secret is tied to her) and now Kasmeer….

[Spoiler] Realm of torment reference

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Mickey Frogeater.1470

The only Abaddon likely to appear would be one torn from a Fractal and judging from the potential future version of the Asuran Player wouldn’t even have the same memories(in reality Scarlet created the Steam Creatures while potential future version of Asura Player claimed to have created them so Fractals not having the same memories is accurate).

In all likelyhood Fractal Abaddon would just be you average megalomaniac without any of the real Abaddon’s motivations.

Why have the gods become inactive?

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Mickey Frogeater.1470

Grenth is likely still in the Underworld and hopefully will make an appearence during one of the upcoming Halloweens.

What happened to Evennia?

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Mickey Frogeater.1470

The unresolved plots from GW:B that never came to be were just the Halloween plot (including the lich), which seems to be getting concluding with GW2 (we just missed a stage or two where the Lunatic Court’s attempts backfired); Elona, which we never got a hint to but likely would be the stepping stones for Joko conquering Vabbit 55 years later; and the establishment of Ebonhawke (and the outcome of Evennia), the former we were told in GW2 via The Founding books in Ebonhawke. Technically M.O.X. wasn’t part of Beyond, but lets include that assassin too.

So really, we missed only 3 of 5 remaining Beyond plots, with the two we didn’t miss just lacking a first-person showing, rather than the second-person telling we got.

Now, plots left loose in GW1 in general… that’s a lot, but only because they were tiny threads that could be picked up, and not threads that would be.

The Palawa Joko plot’s lead up seems to have been set up satisfactorily as being tied to the Lunatic Court plot.

The Lunatic Court plot showed Mad King Thorn goading Palawa Joko into conquering Elona.

The actual invasion not being shown is better off not being shown for the same reason Emperor Usoku’s banishment of the Tengu isn’t shown.

In other words there was the Tyria arc(War in Kryta), Elona arc(Lunatic Court), Eye of the North arc(Hearts of the North) and the Cantha arc(Winds of Change) and only the Tyria and Elona arcs left loose ends(Evennia for Tyria and the Nameless Lich for Elona).

With how things are going in this season of the Living Story we might learn who is responsible for the Golems sent to assassinate Salma, Emperor Kizu and the Princes of Vabbi.

Personally I suspect Menzies the Mad is behind it….

[Spoiler] Realm of torment reference

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Just let Mordemoth be some ultra-mists corrupting abomination who can corrupt the Realm of Torment too, and let us visit it for some reason to defeat him.

Plz, ANET. Y U tease us so?

Or have Menzies hijack the plot as Abaddon’s successor as the Nightfall bringing villain seeking to finish what Abaddon started using all methods including the Elder Dragons to merge Tyria with the Realm of Torment.

Realm of Torment Likeness

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I’m not suggesting that we visit the Realm of Torment but that Menzies merge the Realm of Torment with Tyria like Abaddon attempted in Nightfall.

Realm of Torment Likeness

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She assumes Scarlet would treat the Pale Tree with importance and as such assumed that the 2 overlapping white circles(which seem to match the 2 central circles holding the Gate of Torment and Abaddon’s Gate in the Realm of Torment map) were the Pale Tree simply based on both the color and that fact.

She is not an expert on Ley Lines nor does she know what’s on Scarlet’s mind…..

If that is indeed the Realm of Torment then a variant of the Realm of Torment map is what Scarlet saw when in Omadd’s device….

Could that realm be considered the entire Eternal Alchemy? Of course not! It’s part of the Eternal Alchemy/Mists yet not all of it….. The most dangerous part to say the least…. Scarlet is ignorant of what she saw and assumed in her insanity that a small speck of the Eternal Alchemy is the entire Eternal Alchemy!

Realm of Torment Likeness

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Mickey Frogeater.1470

Considering multiple NPCs use the term Realm of Torment as a curse the majority of that realm is still a Realm of Torment….

Needless to say it’s possible Kormir’s ascension is the reason the two central circles are white(if I’m right in assuming it’s not the Pale Tree but the circles containing the Gate of Torment and Abaddon’s Gate) rather than black like the other spheres.

In other words it’s possible that a few holdouts of Abaddon’s army are hiding out with the Shadow Army of Menzies the Mad in the Realm of Torment(it’s specifically stated that Menzies the Mad is using the Ravenheart Gloom as his army’s staging area).

Realm of Torment Likeness

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The white “tree-like” drawing looks more like the 2 circles containing Abaddon’s Gate and the Gate of Torment…..

It could be refering to the Gate of Torment and Abaddon’s Gate either overlapping each other or colliding….

We may need a better and closer angle of the picture to be sure it’s not a tree….

[Spoiler] Realm of torment reference

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Abaddon is dead yet Menzies is stated to be staging his armies in the Domain of Angiush(specifically the Ravenheart Gloom)….

Menzies is coming back and in all likelyhood would take great advantage of Evon’s interest in an Abaddon Fractal(Evon is stated by ArenaNet to have religious reasons for researching such a Fractal) and bring Fractal Abaddon to Tyria to help with Nightfall…

The question is: will Abaddon take over the Living Story in Tyria once the Master of Peace who I suspect to be Menzies returns to Cantha?

Will Nightfall come?…..

Soundless & Mordremoth.

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If Faolain embraced it than the Dreamers can and do fall under Mordremoth’s control even with the Pale Tree’s protection….

Her protection is tied to Scarlet’s picture of what she thinks is the Eternal Alchemy but is infact the Realm of Torment….

She is depicted as being in the middle of the Realm of Torment which indicates that she’s a stopper blocking Menzies and Dhuum’s plans….

Menzies it seems certain is the voice whispering into Scarlet’s mind…. Whispering from the forest under the Pale Tree….

Mordremoth obviously corrupted Scarlet immediately upon her abandoning the Pale Tree due to well… abandoning the Pale Tree…. He takes what he can get!

All enemies of the Pale Tree are potential subjects of his…. Nightmare Court and Soundless can all be used as Dragon Minions…

Of course said minions when missing their protection from the Pale Tree(even the Nightmare Court has that protection and they show obvious ties to Mordremoth with their minions) can hear the whispers of the Realm of Torment…..