Showing Posts For Olba.5376:

Need Balanced PvE Build

in Warrior

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

Raidium that build sounds pretty solid though I am yet to find any power/toughness/vitality gear where can this be obtained?

Dungeons, WvW and some karma vendors.

There’s a handful of Karma vendors that sell pieces of Power/Toughness/Vitality armor. The only piece that they do not sell is a helmet. Sadly, each karma vendor that does sell that stuff is at a Temple in Orr, so you have to do those event chains and none of them sell more than 2 pieces of the gear, so you have to visit multiple vendors.

Also, each of the sets have a different Rune in them. They all share the same skin though. And the cost. 42,000 karma per piece.

PvE: Hundredblade seems really overpowered...

in Warrior

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

I hit for 108k with my rifle burst. Buff HB.

I hit a Rabbit for 460k with Eviscerate.

Buff everything!

It’s not overpowered. You just see higher numbers because of the channeled attack with the Greatsword. But the dummies go down just as fast.

The thing is, Greatsword is greatly superior to any other weapon when you look at the traits they get. GS gets a cooldown reduction, might on crit and a damage boost.

(edited by Olba.5376)

How you prevent players from buying gold to goldsellers ?

in Black Lion Trading Co

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

You people are all rather messed up.

The people who would buy Gems with cash are saying Gems aren’t worth enough. The people who want Gems with gold are saying they’re worth too much.

The people who are poor are complaining that freaking Legendaries are too expensive. Hello, those items were purposely made to be something not many would have.

Complaints about RNG in regards to Mystic Forge and BLCs? I know games that sell the equivalent of our Exotics in their cash shop in a box that has much worse odds than either the Mystic Forge or the BLCs. The same game also has the equivalent of our Legendaries in their cash shop, up for a price that is about four times as much as what you would pay here. And the kicker? The gear is the cheap part, it’s the gems and refinement on the gear that costs twice as much. And how many people have that stuff that costs like 10 times a Legendary on GW2? Well probably a 100 people per server, so a total of somewhere around 1,000. And some people have those gear sets on multiple characters too.

Recount Add-on

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Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

No, no no.

One of the last things you would want in this game is number-based elitism. You used the word classify. Well let me tell you, that’s a synonym to words such as rank, rate, categorize and separate . And then there’s the word “elitism”, which is synonymous to pride in being in an elite group . And I think we all know what “elite” would mean in this context.

One of the things that got me into GW2 was that a friend of mine pretty much told me that I can pick up any weapon and I would still be viable. In fact, I was originally not going to pick up the game because I figured that it’d take a month or two for the forums to have stickied “guides” for the “preferred” or “optimal” ways to build specific professions, which I find to be rather dull.

And let’s be honest, the game has guilds for a reason. You want efficient runs where no one is idle? Do them with your guild. There’s been similar talks about justifying gear inspect so that you can use it to weed out people who use Magic Find gear.

(edited by Olba.5376)

Traveling Costs Have To Go

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Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

It’s a little hyperbolic to say people are refusing to help their friends and have their priorities messed up. The real impact is people choosing not to volunteer to help someone they don’t know very well in their guild or ignoring requests for help from person in map chat. They’ll do that by simply being silent. It’s the social connections that aren’t getting made because of that decision point around travel cost.

So you want to help people, but you do not want to help them if it costs you petty change?

That’s pretty messed up if you ask me.

Warrior class mechanic suggestion

in Warrior

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

Ultimately I think if the game is ever going to be balanced competitively some things need to be more normalized. I feel like the warrior has an abundance of damage but lacking in versatility. Elementalist has all sorts of versatility but are rather weak for the hp pool.

Warriors lacking in versatility?

You do know that a Warrior can use a literal crapton of weapons, right?

And besides, when you think about a Warrior, you think about something simple. A barbaric brute. There’s no trickery, just force.

On my warrior, I carry two axes, two maces, a shield, a warhorn, a rifle and a longbow. Out of those, only the warhorn is Masterwork, the others are all rares. I used to carry around two swords as well. The only weapon I actually dislike is the greatsword. And that’s just mostly because of it being the go-to for most warriors and the fact that I had some bad experiences with Whirlwind Attack on my lower levels.

What warriors lack in professional mechanic, they make up in the total overload of weapons we get. There’s pretty much a situation for every single weapon and weapon combination out there. And that’s more than you can say for most other races, especially the ones that do not get weapon swaps.

If anything should be changed, there’s plenty to work on in the warrior utilities. There’s quite a few utilities that aren’t used simply because they are too weak, have too long cooldowns or have similar but better implemented versions with weapon skills. For example, you don’t see many people using Kick because there’s already a Rifle and a Hammer skill with the same functionality. Or you don’t see people using Berserker Stance because Signet of Fury gives better adrenaline and it has a cool passive. And you don’t see people using the Banners outside of group thingies because of the long cooldowns. Also, there’s tons of complaints about how most of the Warrior Elites are useless.

(edited by Olba.5376)

Traveling Costs Have To Go

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Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

Most of you are missing a major point here.

This is supposed to be a great social game, instead ArenaNet have made a single player game.

People just go about their business of chopping tree’s gathering nods, “farming” if you want to call it that.

Personally I would like to go and help people, join parties, go to town, go around the dungeons see what going on, I have never felt so lonely ever in an online multiplayer game (MMO).

Please don’t give me the gold sink bit, you can easily earn it back, your doing something wrong lines

There’s no logic in having something in the game that prevents people travelling and making it a single player game.

I’m just lost for words……………………..

So what you’re saying is that the travel expenses result in you not wanting to go out to participate in lower level content and help people? Well, that’s just your opinion.

Personally, I like playing on my own. One thing that I want to avoid at all costs is dependence on other players to achieve things. I have played games where there’s content that you have to do in order to progress all while that same content is also rather impossible to do alone.

One of the key reasons why I decided to buy GW2 was because a friend told me that they had gotten to 60 without having to party with anyone even once.

I would say that the amount of people who are refusing to help their friends and guildies because of the waypoint costs is a minority. The reason there aren’t many groups going on is because you just don’t need it. And it’s not like the game is empty either: there’s people everywhere. Of course, some places that are kinda out in the boonies that have like a single renown heart or a vista or a skill point aren’t going to be too popular, as aren’t the mines. People gather in places where the story takes them, where there’s plenty of renown hearts and where you can experience the wide, open world.

Let me just put it simply: Anyone who refuses to help their friends or guildies because of some 10 silver waypoint cost that might incur on them has their priorities messed up. That or they just don’t really give a crap about their friends. 10 silver? Friend of mine made me full sets of level 70 and level 80 masterwork accessories with the mods I wanted and didn’t ask anything from me. Looking at the costs of the ornaments that he made me, that’s probably upwards of 20 silver just for the second set.

(edited by Olba.5376)

Reduce stats further for high levels in low level zones

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Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

I think it works just fine.

Granted, if I go roll around in Shaemoor on my level 80 Warrior, most things die quickly. Granted, I can do some things I couldn’t when I was lower level, such as prevent the takeover of Nebo Terrace all alone. However, I still cannot solo any group events. The bandit chief in the mines in Shaemoor? Got my kitten handed to me. The Champion Wasp Queen? Got killed there too.

And besides, you can always just go to the nearest armorsmith and weaponsmith and get some blank white low level gear, that’ll make things difficult again.

Better loot pickup

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Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

Who in their right mind doesn’t pick up everything? That’s free money. Why would you not want free money?

My guess is the OP is farming events with MF gear. That tends to get you a lot of armor and weaponry, which fills up your inventory quite fast if you’re doing multiple events without going to an NPC to sell it. And generally speaking the gear tends to NPC for more than you would get from salvaging a few pieces of leather or so.

Though to me that just seems like trying to find a free work-around instead of buying bigger bags and the expansion. You gotta be doing a lot of stuff to fill up the maximum of 120 inventory slots.

Heck, I run around with 52 and I rarely find myself in the 40s.

But I suppose it depends on the person. Some like carrying around two or three different armor sets, a ton of weapons, a ton of mining equipment and then some WvW stuff. But if you ask me, if you’re carrying around all this “What If?” stuff, you really do not have any right to complain about lack of inventory space.

Major Sigil of the Cheetah

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Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

Gain +.1% swiftness each time you kill a foe. (Max 25 stacks; ends on down.)
= 25% swiftness

This way all professions can benefit from runspeed, not just a few out there.

Actually no, it would amount to +2.5%.

You would need +1% for it to be 25%.

And for the record, every profession has a Swiftness The only one not on that page is Thief, and they get Signet of Shadows

And this would also affect some races in a negative manner. For example, a big part of using Warhorn as your offhand weapon has to do with the Swiftness boon that Warhorn 4 gives.

Fully separate PvE from PvP

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Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

It’s a bit funny that there are actually people who have some kind of compulsion to do all the possible dailies/achievements.

The monthly reward isn’t even that hard to get. You can pretty much get the monthly WvW kills by sticking with some zerg and tagging enemies with AoEs.

And the exploration reward is just that: exploration. That tends to involve participating in things. In case you didn’t notice, you also need Skill Challenges and Vistas to get the exploration points. And is that fair? How is it fair that poor old me, who just wants to see all the beauty of the world is forced to jump around like a circus freak, or that I am forced to duel various enemies or commune with arbitrary locations? That’s just wrong!

My take on warriors thus far

in Warrior

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

For Hammers, it’s not really the damage that you’re looking for, but all the control skills you get. And by the way, there’s a Trait in Defense that gets you a significant boost in damage, especially since you can combine two skills so that there’s always a disable on the enemy.

How come you can sell to the trading company anywhere but you need to go get purchases?

in Black Lion Trading Co

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

I don’t want a whole delivery session, just a mail like other things are delivered in the game. Some small percentage of the order price would be fair and make them plenty of money.

It won’t happen as long as they have the Black Lion Expresses in the Gem Store.

Please GW2 Community, Stop it with the World of Warcraft References.

in Suggestions

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

The thing is, the community for GW2 takes great pride in the “mission” of ANet. That “mission” in turn is to be different. ANet has literally said that they do not want to be perceived as a WoW-clone.

A lot of people will bring in the “WoW Clause” simply because it’s the easiest way out. You said something about gear progression? Well, ANet has said that they do not want gear progression to be in their game, as that separates casuals from hardcores.

And let’s be honest: when you talk about MMORPGs, you’re pretty much always going to be talking about either WoW or Guid Wars. With that in mind, you kinda have to take a side. And since we’re on the Guild Wars forum, it’s obvious that the minority that wishes for the game to have popular features found in WoW to be in GW is going to get attacked.

Trading Between Players?

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Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

You know how I asked “What’s the problem with undercutting ?”. Hold off on answering that until you’ve answered the following: Why doesn’t undercutting happen in less anonymous systems ?

It happens less because there’s no need for it.

Of course, it’s not just the anonymity. Adding seller names to the TP wouldn’t do much at all. However, if you were not given a straight-up cheapest option, but you rather had to go look for it, such as in the case of player shops, the change is apparent. What happens is that the merchants start making a name for themselves: By being consistently low price and offering desirable goods, you get a reputation. That turns into regular “customers”, people who come straight to your shop, regardless of the price.

And in a setting like that, undercutting is unnecessary effort that only makes you look bad, which in turn costs you customers.

So if you want to convince me undercutting is bad, you’re going to need at least one of the following:
– An explanation why giving more information to everybody is a bad thing.
– A hole in my logic above.
– A different reason why undercutting isn’t as bad in less anonymous systems.

Well let’s see. Firstly, you’re not actually giving more information. You’re just making it easier to access. You are however, taking away the information about the sellers. Secondly, you stated that you’re unlikely to trade with the same people again in a less anonymous system: I spent the past 2 years trading in a system like that and I experienced the opposite: I had regular customers, ranging from people whom read my posts on a forum to members of guilds I had been in to complete strangers. And how do I know they were regular customers? They talked to me. They asked me about the prices and my stock.

I am not saying that undercutting is a completely evil thing. In fact, undercutting promotes stability and often makes it impossible for a single person to take advantage of a market shortage. Both of these are good things.

However, undercutting in a system where the price is everything results in ridiculous competition for the lowest price. This is obvious when you look at how many items in the Trading Post are priced at 0-1 copper over the vendoring value.

Trading Between Players?

in Suggestions

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

Have any of you ever seen another MMO with as little trade spam as GW2 has ?

I haven’t. The key difference is that the trading post forces anonymous trading, removing most of the incentive for trade spam. Any method that removes that anonymity is a method that brings incentives for trade spam to begin.

I don’t want trade spam to return.

That same anonymity is also why there’s vehement undercutting in the Trading Post: because it’s the only way to guarantee that your stuff sells.

So either you deal with wanting-to-sell or wanting-to-buy spam in a chat window, which can be filtered out, or you deal with undercutting in the Trading Post.

Both have their issues.

Get rid of the downleveling system or limit it

in Suggestions

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

The effective level is one of the best systems I’ve ever seen in an MMORPG.

It keeps things interesting, it promotes progress and it makes exploration a ton of fun. I’m not a person who makes a ton of alts, so a lot of the race specific low level areas end up totally unknown to me. Heck, I only explored Snowden Drifts because a friend took me there and the area around Black Citadel because I was trying to find my way into Frostgorge Sound.

If they took away level scaling, I would not have any fun in those areas. I could just go, steamroll all of the renown hearts and be bored again. Heck, since crafting gives experience and you got a system that makes it possible to acquire high amounts of Gold on a low level, removing the effective level would allow people to just use RL money to buy their way to a high level via crafting and then steamroll all of the quests. And that’s just bad game design.

Similarly, the downscaling makes it so that it’s actually fun to help friends. A lot of MMORPGs suffer from lower level content being too easy for high levels, thus when you introduce a new friend to the game, you usually just tell them to quickly get to the level cap so that they can get to the content that you find fun. In GW2, you could totally stick around for their whole progression, even if you were already level 80 when they were just level 1.

Economics versus gameplay

in Black Lion Trading Co

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

I suspect that the above points result in very little demand for items crafted by other people. I also suspect that the demand that DOES exist is mainly created by those who take part in “flipping” on the TP.

The opposite is actually true. There is virtually no difference between armor that you created and armor that someone else created. Thus, the only reason to make your own armor is for experience, using the materials that you farmed and doing it yourself. If you don’t need the experience, selling the materials and buying the armor from the TP is pretty much always a cheaper option.

Personally, I played most of the game until level 70 with a friend who had already leveled a character to 70. So, I got a bit of guidance from him. And what did he tell me? To buy new gear from the TP once every 5-10 levels. The reason I got into crafting? Stubborn self-sufficiency. When I picked up crafting, I didn’t know that it gave experience. Heck, it took me a ridiculously long time to get a hang of the Discovery panel to maximize efficiency.

4) One giant economy = lots of the same available + very volatile economy: The “monolithic” economy in the game creates a higher supply of crafted goods on the TP than what would be observed had the games economy been designed around smaller sets of server-cluster based economies. And because of the existence of “flipping”, this creates a very volatile economy which further discourages any sustainable profitability in crafting.

Crafting can never be a source of long term profitability. That wouldn’t make sense, since there’s a increase in crafting materials and the only thing that reduces them is crafting. So if crafting was profitable, then that would mean that all the materials would be undervalued. Which in turn would result in people using them to craft instead of selling them. Which would put the prices back up to an equilibrium.

If anything, a healthy crafting economy is one where crafting shifts from being profitable to not being profitable on a constant basis and varies based on each different item.

5) Anti-farm code: The situation with the “anti-farm” code discourages players from trying to “farm” specific materials and instead encourages players to just buy the materials from the TP. Which, in theory is a good concept. HOWEVER, it isn’t good when the next point also exists….

That’s very material specific. For example, I was able to farm tons of Platinum Ores in a short period of time because I found a place where a cluster of nodes spawned in a relatively small area. On the other hand, Orichalcum is limited by the rarity of the nodes and the respawn time. On yet another type, Mithril Ore was rather capped by the location: majority of the Mithril you can find is in Cursed Shore and Malchor’s Leap.

6) The game rewards players with very little income whilst adventuring, whilst imposing heavy costs on them when travelling via the WP’s and incurring armour repairs. Both this and the above point does nothing but encourage players to buy gold. Either via legitimate, or illegitimate, means. And whilst buying gold via the BLTC is good for the devs, the price is perhaps a little high.

High costing waypoints promotes exploration within a specific zone. If not for the costs, I am pretty sure the progression for any unexplored zone would boil down to hunting all the waypoints and then porting between those to do all the renown hearts and farming the DEs.

The repair costs promote planning and grouping. You rarely die when you’re alone, unless you’re trying to do something that just was not intended to be done alone, such as Group Events or defense type DEs.

Evaluating armor damage against the philosophy of fun

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Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

Oh dear, not another one of these.

Firstly, let’s get one thing out of the way. Just because it’s a game and a pastime, does not mean that everything in it has to be fun. Also, just because you think it isn’t fun does not mean it’s a universal truth. If you start eliminating things based on what individual people think isn’t fun, what you get is basically an empty space. For some, roaming mobs attacking you isn’t fun, so remove it. For some, doing quests isn’t fun, so remove it. For some, crafting isn’t fun, so remove it. For some, the storyline isn’t fun, so remove it. For some, leveling isn’t fun, so remove it. For some, getting exotic gear isn’t fun, so remove those as well. For some, being forced to choose a single class and race isn’t fun, so let’s remove classes and allow you to change your race from a drop-down selection in your Hero menu. See where this is going?

Secondly, you are not meant to play the game in a way that aims to avoid all costs. Hell, by definition that can’t be fun. So basically you’re playing in an inherently unfunny way and are complaining because it is what it is. That’s kinda hilarious. The costs are there for a good reason, so appreciate them. If you’re going to avoid certain content because you’re afraid of the repair fees, you should probably stick to other games.

If anything, obvious penalties for death, such as long traveling time due to contested waypoints, costs due to using waypoints and repair fees encourage you to get a group. And it’s an MMORPG, that’s a pretty big part of it. Granted, GW2 does get a buttload of points for allowing people to solo almost everything. Heck, most of the time I see DE’s failing because of lack of participants or because there’s a time limit to succeeding.

How about a "subclass" system?

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Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

Additional weapon types for all classes?

Um, I am pretty sure they put quite a bit of thought into the weapons that they chose to gave to each specific class, for good reason too. Some weaponry are clearly magic oriented, whereas others are clearly melee-oriented, while some are betweeners. A warrior with a staff? Or an elementalist with a greatsword? I think not.

And looking at OP’s first and second post in the topic, it looks like he changed his stance. In the first post, it’s clearly about some quest that would allow you to completely swap your profession, whereas in the second post he talks about swapping and then gaining access to new weaponry.

Both of these ideas are kinda dumb. Subclasses would bring a ton of balance issues, whereas being able to completely change your class doesn’t promote the longevity and integrity of the classes. Not to even mention that the Hero of Shaemoor converting from a Guardian to a Thief would bring some really weird things to the personal story.

Mounts [Merged]

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Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

I can pretty much bet that if you actually said that what you want is what you use as a counterargument for every single person who’s disagreeing, then you might get some points.

As for what that is? Well, it’s a mount that is the same speed as a non-Swiftness boosted character. The mount also cannot be taken into cities and it cannot be used to outrun monsters. Also, it will not be restricted to the Gem store. And it will not be a lore-shattering one, such as centaurs.

However, even with that, you still run into issues. I brought up character size and was met with a talk about racial mounts. That’s really not the answer. After all, if different races get different mounts, that will just result in people asking for their race to be able to use mounts of other races. Similarly, the different races obviously have different ways to dealing with things. To a Norn, a Dolyak is not much different than our sheep, whereas to a Charr a Dolyak might be tonight’s dinner.

Similarly, even if the vocal portion of the pro-mount crowd is saying that they would be cool with mounts that have no speed boosts, you can bet everything you own and then some that the crowd that wants mounts to be fast so that they can get around the waypoint costs is just as large in numbers.

National lottery

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Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

seriously anet this is a fantastic way to make money unless this is a grey area with gambling but i would definetly sign on for this. maybe the prize money could reflect the interest as well. if no ones buying the tickets except 1 guy then 20 g is a bit unfair….. but if everyones buying them then make it like 100 g. or unique skins or anything.

Pretty sure there’s some online gambling related legislation. Particularly those regarding minors gambling.

Also, I don’t think that just implementing a lottery or a raffle alone is a good idea. You should make it a coin sink. If you want to scale the rewards, then make it so that a percentage of the total gold put in gets removed while the rest gets distributed as prizes. Either way, it should never generate gold. It should only recycle it from one player to another, or remove it.

Though, I think it should also include some pretty severe limitations. Because let’s be honest, without limitations you end up in a situation where one person can potentially gain thousands of Gold from this thing, just based on luck. And that’s really not something you want to do. Re-distributing wealth like that should always be monitored to a reasonable level. And of course, it should be as random as possible. It’d be ridiculous for them to implement a gambling system that you could use to consistently turn over a profit in, after all.

(edited by Olba.5376)

Marriage System [merged]

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Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

What is the problem with genders and weddings?

Well, if they choose to implement gay marriage, they will without a doubt get some unwanted publicity for that, all while losing some younger players because of their parents prohibiting them. I doubt ANet would want publicity for being the first major Western game to “support” gay marriage.

If they choose not to implement it, they end up with a guaranteed couple of times a month when someone will post into the Suggestion forum about implementing it. And they will, again, lose some of the players, this time those who wanted gay marriage.

So either way, it’s a lose-lose situation for them.

And if they implement marriage, that’s just one step away from in-game animations like hugging and kissing. And that’ll bring the same issues again. Not a path you want to take.

Marriage System [merged]

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Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

Weddings tend to cause more problems than benefits.

If you add weddings, you get to the whole big issue of genders. And that’s really something that you want to avoid at all costs. Because let’s face it, whichever side you pick, you’re going to lose something.

Adding in-game weddings also tends to bring in unnecessary drama. And it tends to lead to account sharing, which leads to false accusations of being “hacked” or “scammed”. And that is also another unnecessary workload for ANet.

Fixing Warrior's Discipline Trait line

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Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

The “empirical” numbers, were the power on a generic, PvP warrior, with an axe, at it’s maximum damage, and the skill specific coefficient damage from data. You can test it yourself, if you want to pop in to the game, and go to the Heart of the Mists.

I tested them against a standard 20/15/20/0/15 roamer ranger with Ranger’s Insignia and force sigils, and against the three armored golems. I only worked with the axe, because the post would simply get too long if I was to do the numbers on every burst skill.

And that’s exactly why I said it’s not a proof, but a test that you did. Heck, you even used the word “tested”. A proof is always generalized, never a particular case. And the only thing that is going to be general when comparing 3% Burst Damage to 30% is that the increase will be 1.3/1.03= ~1.26 = +26%.

Of course, testing isn’t necessarily a bad idea. Nor is showing some actual figures, sometimes it makes the point more obvious. For example, saying that it results in 26% more damage might not have the same effect as saying that it turns a 10,000 crit into 12,600.

But all of this just comes from my personal experience dealing with in-game mathematics. It’s been a sort of a hobby of mine for the past six years or so. That and studying math in university, which I’ve done for three years now.

Fixing Warrior's Discipline Trait line

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Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

If you look at the above stated mathematical proof, you’ll see that increasing it to 1% per point would dramatically increase the bonus damage the trait line provides, when it is already on par with at least one other profession.

No offense, but I cannot take what you wrote above as a “mathematical proof”. You included a good formula, but then you asspulled a bunch of empirical numbers. That’s not a proof, that’s a test.

Right now, 1.03 on burst, 1.8 on crit. If you raised the multipliers to 1.3 on burst, 1.8 on crit, well, see for yourself.

1.03 * 1.8 = 1.854
1.3 * 1.8 = 2.34

Those numbers are only part of a formula. Multiply in 1048 for axe damage, and you get this:

1.854 * 1048 = 1942.992
2.34 * 1048 = 2452.32

As you factor in more and more of the numbers that make up the damage formula, you’ll see the gap between those grow larger and larger. Already, with just weapon damage and the two modified stats, the current version on par with other professions is 509.3 below your proposed fix.

No, no, no.

You’re ignoring the fact that the relative change, which is 1.3/1.03 = ~1.26 = +26% stays constant across the board. And that, my friend, is the important bit. That by increasing the Critical Damage% from Discipline from 0.1% to 1% effectively makes skills like Killshot and Eviscerate deal 26% more damage is freaking massive. It’s so massive it’s not even funny as a troll.

But similarly, the suggested change of reducing adrenaline costs for Burst Skills is bad, as that brings a host of issues with all skills and traits relating to Adrenaline. And the Discipline line already has Adrenal Reserves to reduce the costs. Just for a “short” list: Healing Surge, Signet of Fury, Quick Bursts, Adrenal Reserves, Thrill of the Kill, Inspiring Shouts, Sharpened Axes, Embrace the Pain, Adrenal Health, Furious, Berserker’s Power, Building Momentum, Short Temper., Heightened Focus. Most of those are traits that are placed all over the trait lines and most of them would need to be completely scrapped if you suddenly gave people the ability to gain adrenaline at triple the speed.

And just for hilarity: Eviscerate + Quick Bursts + Adrenal Reserves + Heightened Focus + Critical Burst + Berserker’s Power. Think about it.

God / Dragon weapons

in Suggestions

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

Weapons that have a ridiculous repair fee that is tied to the time you use it?

Nah, sounds way too abusable.

And as someone asked: What gap is there between Exotics and Legendaries? They have a slight difference in stats, in that one mod gets swapped for another. Other than that, they’re identical except for the rarity and the skin. And that’s good.

It might sound silly, but a game that hinges on endgame gear taking weeks or months to farm discourages new players. A lot. Because if it already takes you a ton of time to level up to even start farming, by the time you’ve farmed that stuff, something might have changed. Your friends who invited you might have quit. They might have released new, better gear. They might have pushed up the level cap, thus making all of your gear kinda worthless.

Of course, by eliminating that by allowing the players to get the almost-best gear in a relatively short amount of time, you end up with some people getting bored. Because no matter how much you argue that the world is beautiful and that there’s tons of exploration and quests to do and voluntary events to participate, there will always be people who only have one thing in mind: getting the absolute best gear as soon as possible. And no matter what you do, you aren’t going to change that.

GW2 is an MMORPG that has something that pretty much every single MMORPG out there lacks: It’s extremely newcomer friendly. There is no Super Elite Extreme Farming Squad Only-type gear, it doesn’t take weeks or months to get to the level cap and there’s tons of ways to level up in the game. And let’s be honest: even if it makes some of the hardcore farmers and diehard grinders bored, getting total newcomers into the game is much harder. And since they’re doing that right, let’s not ruin it.

Commander Manuals Shouldn't Use Gold.

in Suggestions

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

They could just add in party leaders and build it from there. Have some kind of WvWvW related achievements tied to the leader position, with enough of those achievements making you eligible for some kind of public vote for a Commander title. Throw in a similar system for the voters and voila, you have a situation where a Commander title means you have been a party leader in a significant amount of WvWvW combat and that there’s a significant number of seasoned WvWvW people who want you to have a Commander title.

I think some people call that a … “democracy”, is it?

Im Bored, GW2 need improvments...

in Suggestions

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

Right now you basically can craft/farm, buy, do dungeons to get exotic gear. Simply extend that mentality to WvW where you have to achieve something very difficult, like have to hold every tower in the borderland and have 500 badges of honor to be able to purchase exotic lvl gear (better build specific armor).

Something that gives them a reason to mass war!

One of the things that I liked when I first tried WvWvW was the realization that it freaking works. You can do your daily quest fully in WvWvW. You can level up in WvWvW via those same quests. The one thing that kinda does not currently work is the gear in there. I’m not much of a PvPer, but I spent a pretty hefty amount of time last week grinding the 50 WvWvW kills within a day for the monthly. I walked away with less than 10 Badges of Honor. That kinda means that the gear available in WvWvW, which I might be very interested in otherwise, would take me literally a month per piece to get. And that’s not very nice, considering that I got to level 80 in less than two weeks.

But yes, I think that they should definitely improve WvWvW to truly make it an alternative to playing the whole renown heart game. Right now, you can go to the world, do renown hearts and events to level up, then do dungeons to get gear. Or you can craft your way up in levels and gear. But doing WvWvW for gear and levels? Well it’s kinda kittened right now.

But there is one thing you should never, ever do. And that is give the WvWvW players an actual unfair advantage in the form of access to better gear. Because not everyone does WvWvW. Heck, if I didn’t want the monthly, I probably never would’ve stepped in. Just because PvP might be a big part of what you do once you’re 80 and got your exotic stuffs does not mean that it should make you superior to people who do not. Because you can bet all of your exotic gear, all of your gold, all of your gems and everything that you’ve ever sold in the Trading Post that there’s a significant amount of people who will never, ever, play a single second of PvP on this game.

(edited by Olba.5376)

An idea

in Suggestions

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

That could work. Content updates will help this as well. My main problem is there isn’t enough as far as “rare” loot drops to make the skinner box run properly. Hard to get excited when the very “best” thing that can drop is only going to be equal to that which I can already craft. Very little motivation to PvE when you’ve already got all your gear completed really.

They already got some pretty good gear in the dungeons, including some stat combinations that you cannot really get otherwise.

Because let’s be honest, adding the best gear to be only droppable as rares would result in a massive grind fest. And as much as I hate to quote the fanboys, that kinda goes against what GW2 is standing for right now: There is no grind fest.

If anything, I am extremely happy that you can craft gear that is nearly or exactly the equivalent to the best gear that you can farm. The previous MMORPG that I played had the best gear only available with RL cash and it tookittenerally years for them to put in a gear set that was farmable and comparable. And even then they made it strictly farmable, meaning you had to do the dungeon runs to get it. Which screwed me over, since I dislike running dungeons endlessly.

But as for a hard mode, that’s kinda a weird thing. We already have level downscaling, which means every area is roughly equally difficult when you first get there. Of course, as you level higher and get more traits, you obviously start being superior to the area. I don’t think we need to beef up the lower areas at all. Currently, I can only foresee that leading to allowing lower level area monsters to drop stuff at the level of your actual, non-downscaled level. That, in turn, would defeat the purpose of progressing to a new area. Why go to a new, more difficult area, when you can just take the easier route and get the same drops?

Also, there’s the problem that the current system works. One of the biggest upsides of the downscaling is that even if you significantly out-level your friends, you can still participate in their progress without ruining it by being higher level. And that right there is worth its weight in gold and then some, because there’s countless of cases where people get introduced to a game by a friend, only for them to later drop it because said friend cannot really play with them: They’re a higher level so the only thing they would get out of it would be the social aspect. Of course, if you’ve somehow managed to do all the renown hearts, you end up with a similar situation, but it’s not nearly as bad, as there’s always dynamic events.

If anything, I would like them to beef up the renown heart system. Maybe make those rewards scale or allow completing them again for a different reward. Maybe make it so that you can repeat the renown heart for a small portion of the previous reward?

Fixing Warrior's Discipline Trait line

in Suggestions

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

That’s why I suggested changing the mechanic from +Damage to a Adrenaline strike reduction mechanic.

But that would require additional balancing. For example, what would happen to the active effect of Signet of Fury, which right now gives a full 30 strikes of Adrenaline? In comparison, what about Healing Surge, which gives 10? Would both of them give the full 30 now, resulting in Healing Surge being absolutely ridiculously overpowered and Signet of Fury being kinda useless in comparison? Or would you have them scaled down as well?

Also, we already have a trait that heals us based on adrenaline and a trait that gives our adrenaline based on damage. If you leave those alone, coupled with any skill that gives adrenaline, you end up with warriors turning into Burst-spamming machines of death. And that’s probably what happened with the Discipline line when the trait was +1%, as I can see Eviscerate and Kill Shot being absolutely ridiculous with a full +30% on top of what they already are.

Artaz.3819:

As it stands right now, the 0.1%/per point is basically an easy way to balance warrior builds that focuses on Discipline (Brawn) versus those that do not but the true outcome is that the Discipline point investment is meaningless (except for the traits). This is unlike any other class in GW2 where their own class-defining trait line actually has a noticeable impact on the class mechanic.

Not really. The Discipline trait line does still get the Critical Damage boost. And for some, that’s a pretty big deal.

Tab targeting is awful

in Suggestions

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

Breeding mistakes through poor controls is the exact opposite of good. Challenge should come from…you know…the game actually being challenging. Not having to fight past crappy controls.

That’s kinda my point: there should be a challenge. If you could automatically tab and it would always pick the optimal target in a rather inhumane manner, that turns killing monsters into a boring tab-attack-tab-attack cycle.

Truhan.8912:

Though I had no idea that “target nearest enemy” is a completely different button from “target next enemy”. This is a great example of something that makes literally no sense whatsoever. At least have tab target be target nearest enemy than this wonky next enemy mess.

I had the exact issue of the tab targeting going to weird places at bad times. By mere coincidence, I noticed in the controls that the targeting for Tab, by default, is “Next Enemy” rather than “Nearest Enemy”. I instantly swapped that.

Tab targeting is awful

in Suggestions

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

I think it’s fine as it is.

Well, the default tab target is set to “Next Enemy”, which is kinda kitten Personally, I swapped that out for “Nearest Enemy”, which is actually much more useful.

The thing is, the tab target should be an aid, not an auto-aim. Your suggestion would be kinda like putting auto-aim into a first person shooter game. Because let’s be honest: the game is not supposed to pick your targets for you. That’d just be silly and make the game very dull.

A lot of the stuff that you suggest is actually already achieved by the Nearest Enemy targeting option. What it doesn’t do is ignore non-hostile monsters, nor target the weakest. Both of these things are actually good in my opinion. They breed mistakes and that’s what separates a game from a machine. Because let’s be honest, if you could just tab and it would automatically pick the best possible monster for you to target, it would get really, really boring really, really fast.

(edited by Olba.5376)

Remove Stats From Traits

in Suggestions

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

I’m personally against this.

For me, the +stats allows another degree of flexibility. I can choose my gear to be a bit more damage oriented by statting for Toughness or Vitality, or I can choose my gear to be defensive by statting towards Precision and Power. However, while I am doing that, I also have to make some actual decisions: do I want this trait or the stats from the other tree? And that’s a valuable thing.

Also, there would be some pretty serious backlash or balance issues with removing it. If you just smacked those stats onto the level 80 base stats, or onto gear, you’re pretty much left with two ways to do it: Firstly, you can add a certain amount across the board, but that would just cause a backlash from people who specialized in damage. Similarly, if you added it to gear, you would end up limiting the current flexibility, or you would end up creating overpowered gear.

If you were allowed a total of 700 stat points that you could allocate however you want to each of the four stats, with a cap of 300, you would probably end up with even more balance issues, as people wouldn’t be limited by the traits. Right now, you often have to “sacrifice” the stats you would gain for a good trait skill. Remove that, and you get “perfect” builds. And that’s not balanced, nor is it ideal. Having a de factor “perfection” to builds leads to everyone going the same route, which goes against everything GW2 stands for.

What Is A Quest?

in Suggestions

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

The thing is, programming repetitive quests is much easier.

Also, there’s a large portion of the player base that expect to see repetitive gear grinding at higher levels. Heck, just take a look at these forums, you’ll find plenty of topics talking about the lack of gear grinding at the level cap.

Also, adding long quests tends to come with the issue of adding proper rewards. If the rewards aren’t perceived as being valuable, then no one is going to do them. Just take a look at all the complaints about some puzzle chests and some event chests. And if they’re not worth it, then they get ignored. And that’s a waste of resources.

Also, if you look at the whole progression of the game, you’ll see that it is exactly what you wanted: It’s a freaking long journey that takes you across a good part of the world. Especially in GW2, where that progression is driven further by the personal story taking you from your starting area to Orr.

Heck, majority of RPGs have a very similar progression in terms of character development. You start out as a hopeful, idealistic person who usually achieves some kind of localized heroic feat, such as the starting quests in GW2. You then gets noticed by influential people and you get tasked with increasingly heroic feats, which your character tends to undertake because of some underlying set of values that they, as a character, have. This pattern repeats until some world-threatening evil arises and your hero is, again, tasked with dealing with it. This is where MMORPGs differ from regular RPGs, as MMORPGs tend to make those world-threatening evils such that you deal with them in a group of similar heros, rather than being the sole hero.

Please bring end game gears progression to the game

in Suggestions

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

Bigger stats? Nope.
More skins? Please.

we don't need another game that bloats the numbers to the point they lose all meaning and break all balance all with one single swing.

A lot of games seem to put in the large numbers for endgame stuff just because people expect them and like seeing them. There’s a certain feeling of power when you realize that you’ve gone from your best attack dealing 1,000 damage to a scrappy to the same attack dealing 450,000 damage on the same monster. Interestingly, only a few people actually look at the numbers you’re doing, so it wouldn’t make any difference if you started out dealing 1 damage and ended dealing 500.

Karma instead of experience

in Suggestions

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

There is a vendor next to the mystic forge who uses skill points as currency to make gear.

Rather, the NPC trades bits and pieces of stuff you use to make high level gear for skill points. And some of the things the NPC sells require quite a bit of points.

Please bring end game gears progression to the game

in Suggestions

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

I think it was marketed as having no need for a gear grind, not that it wouldn’t provide the option for players that wanted one.

Whatever happened to the whole “play the game you want to play it” philosophy? Some people want to get better/newer stuff once they hit 80. It’s already obvious with the legendary grind many players are currently in.

The thing is, you already have 3 sets of gear on 80 that have a stat progression. Masterwork, Rare and finally Exotic. That’s the gear grind you’re looking for.

They were all made relatively easy and close in terms of the stats they provide exactly because if there were massive gaps, you’d be forced to get the highest tier of gear.

As for “playing the game you want to play”, there’s plenty of that in the game. I have never played a game before where you can level up your character by participating in PvP or by crafting. And even on 80, there’s plenty to do. Some prefer to go grind the dungeons for gear, others will go out to mine all the resources they can find and master all the crafts, while someone else is probably going to explore all of the world and do every single renown heart, vista and skill challenge.

Looking at the posts that a lot of people make here, it’s clear that to a big, vocal portion of the player base, the fact that there’s different skins for different weaponry is actually a big part of the endgame “grind”. And if you ask me, that’s how it should be. A lot of the games that do have layers and layers of progressing endgame gear usually end up with most of the older, “outdated” gear not being used by anyone because it’s just not “the best”. And that right there is content wasted.

Also, looking down the line, if you had level 80 gear that had vastly superior stats and required a long grind to get to, you end up with the new level 80s feeling weak and forced to grind that same gear to stay competitive. And that’s what this game tries to avoid. That and it means that the longer you’ve played the game at the level cap, the stronger you are. That is also something you should avoid as it turns away the new players.

Who sets Gem prices?

in Black Lion Trading Co

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

If you think those prices are too high to reliably sell, place a buy order for a lower price. If any sellers agree, you’ll get it for that much.

I think part of the complaint is that you can’t set a lower offer.

What are you talking about? Buyers have the ability to ask for items at whatever price they want. Keep in mind that if you set your asking price too low on a Buy Order, and someone else offers even 1 cp more, they’ll get theirs listen first.

What he means is that there is no “Buy Orders” in the Gem Store. You buy at the rate they give you and that’s it. Same is true for sales, you can’t set an offer, you sell at the rate they dictate.

crippling

in Suggestions

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

I’m currently in the Straits of devastation zone and the mobs there, way too many of them, have this crippling effect that lasts at least a minute. That is WAY too long since you have no chance of escaping when you’re getting swarmed and in underwater combat getting swarmed is as common as doggie doo in a kennel.

I’m tired of paying for repairs for the endless deaths because when I most need to get away, I cant due to the too long cripples. Please reduce them to a much shorter time. Hell, if our chars cant cripple/root/stun for durations that are that long the NPCs should’nt be able to either. Fair is fair!

6 out of 8 professions already have a native cripple remove.

As for the underwater thing, yes it’s annoying. However, it also makes it so that you can’t just swim your way from Straits of Devastation to Cursed Shore without a fight without getting killed.

Warriors should carry all weapons

in Warrior

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

I carry 2 maces, a shield, a longbow and a warhorn with me. My warrior uses dual axes and a hammer.

The problem with carrying everything is that not everyone likes to play with every style. Similarly, traiting for specific builds is a valid way to play, especially since some weapons, such as greatsword, warhorn, axe and swords benefit massively from their specific traits.

For example, I made two lvl 80 rare swords because I wanted to have the option of a bleeding build if I ran into a boss that would turn me into mince quickly. However, I ended up ditching that because I found that I just prefer seeing the consistent numbers you get with stuff like axes.

My traits are 30/20/20/0/0, which lets me have high crit with any weaponry I choose, along with good defenses if I so desire, plus a decent amount of power. Heck, just the specific traits give me pretty good usage of axes, greatswords, swords and maces.

Gamewide Trading Post is a mistake

in Black Lion Trading Co

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

With everything else having to do with GW2 being server specific, the approach of a gamewide Trading Post is just contradictory. I think the economics of a server should be just as specific to the server as any other aspect of the game.

There should be servers with a glut of a specific item and a lack of another. It helps make each server more unique and I also believe this separation of Trading Post will actually benefit the players.

Why should my decisions on what to farm,craft,buy or sell be impacted by players who will never contribute directly to the overall health of the server I play on?

I suggest changing to server specific Trading Posts, or at the very least a clustered approach. Tie only 3 or 4 servers together on a TP if individual TP’s don’t fit ANETs business model.

A gamewide Trading Post makes sense when you consider that we currently have free server transfers and eventually will have Guesting. Without an economic model that balances that factor out, you would end up with people switching over to one server to buy cheap materials, only to jump to another to sell the finished product for the most profit. Heck, most people would then jump back to their original server, which is likely to be neither of those.

Of course, once everyone starts doing that, after a while it’ll balance out. But by skipping on the server-specific markets altogether, it’s balanced out from the start. And that’s good.

Also, having a Trading Post that has literally humongous supply of pretty much everything means that there’s very little opportunity for people to take advantage of momentary shifts in the supply and demand ends of various products.

Finally, crafting as a trade can never make you consistent profit. That would mean that the system is flawed somewhere along the way. Because there’s very little difference between the materials that you have to buy and the finished product. The only thing that separates them from being literally equal is the necessary level of crafting. That, in turn, should not have a positive effect on the cost of the finished product, since we already get a hilarious amount of experience from crafting. Because let’s face it, if you’re willing and able to farm all of the required materials to level up your crafting, that’s going to boost your leveling speed significantly for a currently minimal cost.

The reason why the finished products are currently costing less than they’re worth in terms of materials has to do with other aspects. Everyone is crafting for experience, so there’s a massive supply of finished products to sell. With this in mind, to actually sell yours, you’re forced to undercut the others. Repeat this process across thousands of players and you have a chain of undercuts, with some major clusters of a specific price along the way to make sure that the margins you make stay minimal or that you’re making a loss by selling the product on the Trading Post rather than NPCing the item.

So yes, the massive Trading Post is currently affecting crafting in a way that makes it not profitable from a monetary point of view. Crafting will still be profitable from a time-is-money perspective: it provides pretty much the fastest and easiest source of experience in the game. However, the Trading Post is also balancing out the fact that you can currently transfer servers, plus it’s stabilizing the market much quicker than smaller Trading Posts could do. Both of these things are very much worth the loss of profit from Crafting.

Dual sword bleed build broken?

in Warrior

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

Pretty sure it was already established that the Sword 4 skill applies all 4 bleeds, just that they’re not all applied at the same time.

Another thing to note is to take advantage of all the crit boosts you can have on swords and take full advantage of a 60% chance to bleed on crit Sigil in your weapon.

And personally, I rather like dual swords as a combination. Sword 4 is a good, ranged attack and Sword 5 is a block with 4 stacks of long lasting bleeds. Axe in your offhand isn’t going to work too well, considering that the only useful attack out of that is Axe 5 and it can get interrupted easily. Mace gives you vulnerability and a knockdown, neither of which are too useful for a bleed spec. Shield gives you a situational block and a short stun.

I would say that the top three choices for an offhand with a sword mainhand would be sword, warhorn and shield, depending on what you’re doing.

(edited by Olba.5376)

Mounts [Merged]

in Suggestions

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

I just want a cool little mount to prance around on. Slow, fast, tiny, small, I don’t care. And before anyone thinks they’re being clever by telling me to go back to WoW, there are reasons I left it in the first place. Mounts are not reason enough to go back. But here’s a gold star for trying? I guess?

What’s small for a Norn or Charr is big for a human and downright gigantic for an Asura.

If you scale the mounts to the size of the character, you run into obvious issues with Norn and Charr blocking places just because, as you said, they want to look cool. And even if you can talk to NPCs with the F key, that still does not mean that having a bunch of gigantic mounts in a popular location isn’t annoying or disturbing.

If you don’t scale the mounts, you end up with Asura riding gigantic mounts or Norn and Charr looking like they’re trying to ride a puppy.

And majority of the people here do want a speed boost and low costs so that they can get around the supposedly expensive waypoints. If it’s a speed boost you want, there’s a large selection already

level 80 cap- dont raise it ever

in Suggestions

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

If they add Cantha and Elona , they might raise 10 levels for wach zone getting the final level cap to 100. After that they will just add content in all zones or just new dungeons and lvl 100 zones for cosmetic gear.
Lvl 100 can be a good reasonable level because I was always wondering, why 80? why not 71? or 67 or 83 .

The same can be asked about 100, though.

However, I would say that 80 has a lot to do with all the level-related mechanics. Take traits, for example. You start gaining them at 11, which is a reasonable level, as it’s about the time you’ve been introduced to the basics of the game. The total amount of trait points is also nice, as it tends to allow for just one specific build at a time and forcing you to make choices.

If you look into it, the same is actually true of the zones and skill points: the amounts that you get by 80 tend to be enough. You can still skip some zones by crafting if you have enough gold, but it’s not feasible for you to do that without buying Gems or being decently high level already. Similarly, you can get plenty of skills by 80, but if you want everything, you’ll be doing a decent amount of skill point challenges.

As for the level cap, I am personally against raising it for a few basic reasons. Firstly, raising the cap means that previously awesome gear, specifically exotics and legendaries, will be made less powerful, which would force a gear grind and that’s not optimal. Similarly, by putting in higher level areas, the current cap zones will be left just as abandoned as the current mid-level zones, which is bad. Not to mention that the level scaling allows them to put in new lower level zones and actually expect them to be decently popular with the general player base.

How to fix botting.

in Suggestions

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

All of these options seem to result in a ban if you’re afk for a bit.

And since you have to start with the assumption that whatever can be abused, will be abused, that’s not going to work.

Also, since it’s questions, that alone could be used to mess up PvP.

Your message was surpressed due to excessive messaging.

in Suggestions

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

Or they could just add an option available to the guild leader where they can choose to send a specific mail to everyone in the guild.

Noob question about selling

in Black Lion Trading Co

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

The items that you sell have a tax, which you have to pay upon selling. That is the deduction that you see.

The money that you got from selling has to be picked up from a Black Lion Trading Post NPC. Their icon is a scale on the map.

Why I think teleport costs are unreasonably hight

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

So let me get this straight, this guy is going to refuse to help his friends if the teleport costs are too high? Yeah, I think that’s a bit… weird.

Also, I do believe that the high teleport costs serve a purpose. Firstly, it makes it so that you can’t just teleport around event spots farming them endlessly. Secondly, it encourages exploration, which puts people into the world, which makes things livelier. Thirdly, as I already mentioned, it encourages you to plan ahead.

Why I think teleport costs are unreasonably hight

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: Olba.5376

Olba.5376

Um… you’re not really supposed to do the hearts and attend the events solely for the rewards.

And really, if you start thinking of everything in terms of gain and loss, the game loses pretty much all meaning.