I’m not concerned with dc’s as much but it is a valid point. Otherwise, really really great changes. I saw all of these suggestions from the community. Well done.
If everyone continues to queue up alone then nothing will change. The idea of premades 5 mans vs pugs is not going to happen as its matching teams with teams. Allegedly. Plus, this type of thing already happens in teamQ now, but it should fix that.
So if you soloQ, just keep playing solo. Won’t change much.
Of course premades vs pugs is going to happen.
The pvp community is small, so you are going to q up with your premade, wait 2 minutes, and then get matched up with whatever pugs are Quequeing.
All that’s going to happen is you will drive the solo Q players out, and ruin team Q.
Also, unless they change the achievements, play is just compete without rewards. Same game mode, just no rewards. Who wants that?
Exactly.
The only way this is happening according to the new matchmaking is that there are so few players online, but here still manages to be a full premade team out of hardly any players on that gets matched against pugs. Seems very unlikely. The sky isn’t falling.
Plus, this type of matchmaking already occurs in teamQ, with less ways around it than Anet is introducing in this patch. So what you’re afraid of is as bad as it gets right now, not after the patch.
Sounds to me like these issues were a lot of work? Hopefully improving pvp infrastructure means its easier to launch new game modes with these issues taken care of beforehand. Plus, all this is off the to-do list.
Necro axe isn’t solely underpowered because of its poor power scaling, it is underpowered because it is condi/power, and there is no way to efficiently build for both condition duration and power, as well as vulnerability itself being really poor compared to the defensive boons it has to deal with. 25 stacks of a very difficult to maintain condition are more than nullified by a single boon which at least two classes can have up at all times.
It’s not condi/power. It applies no damaging conditions. It’s weak because it deals weak damage and has little utility.
I’m totally gonna love this autoattack chain with blind on chill trait!!! O_O
It’s chill on blind, not blind on chill, unfortunately.
I really can appreciate that people are hopeful for the new weapons, but this type of thing will be datamined before its released, so it’s a long way off, if its coming at all.
Talking it over with my guild, unranked arena is going to take away from hotjoin, not ranked. Some of our players want to get into pvp, but don’t want the pressure of letting the team down. At the same time, they know their time playing hotjoin isn’t helping much. We plan to use unranked as a way to get more of the guild into pvp. When they are more comfortable with how pvp works, we can have them on our team for ranked matches.
So I’d say unranked was definitely needed.
Solid points. Unranked sounds like serious practice or relaxed competition. I think it should pull all serious hotjoiners and anyone not quite ready for ranked play.
After reading the second blog post I’m even more hyped. Really good changes.
If everyone continues to queue up alone then nothing will change. The idea of premades 5 mans vs pugs is not going to happen as its matching teams with teams. Allegedly. Plus, this type of thing already happens in teamQ now, but it should fix that.
So if you soloQ, just keep playing solo. Won’t change much.
Yeah realistically any decent player can pop in pvp for the first time and get a super lucky winning streak. It happens a lot and then they fade out since no one maintains anything higher than a mid 60s win percentage. Shouldn’t RNG this type of reward, just sort of cheapens it.
?
I have been using the trait for a very long time – since I swapped to Terror, which was… at least 8 months ago or so, if not more. And it does save me countless times.
Like I said, telling me about an occasion when the trait helped – an anecdote – is anecdotal evidence. If I played long enough with Toxic Landing I will eventually be able to report on the epic tales of how I poisoned people to death by falling on them.
Besides, I never said the trait doesn’t work at all. Obviously it does, so it is bound to force an opponent’s reaction when they’re hit by it. But that doesn’t change that alternative traits outperform it.
Also, the video you posted… um, tbh I was expecting some awesome showdown where the fear turns a team fight and secures the win of the match after which you ride into the sunset to an epic rock song, explosions, rainbows, white doves rising, all that jazz.
But instead magictoker is feared once during an off-point fight while being at almost full hp the entire time. So yeah, in that case the trait was close to being useless even though it actually triggered on someone. xD
If the trait protected him from toker it’s absolutely worth taking over anything else you could get for the trait point investment. Few traits in the game could do such a thing, and a necro off point to a player like toker is fresh meat. It 100% proves his point that the trait has value.
The matchmaking will adjust for the loss of SoloQ. I mean, how many people solo join to teamQ? This will even that out so they play where the belong and more premise teams play other premades.
I like soloQ too but if this is implemented well it won’t matter.
Yeah, that’s what I’m thinking. I already usually have more fun soloing in team queue than I do playing solo queue :/
Right, but think of the other changes mentioned, like choosing maps and really cutting down on AFK players with an I’m ready button.
If the matchmaking works well, it will be really nice. Sounds like it should.
The matchmaking will adjust for the loss of SoloQ. I mean, how many people solo join to teamQ? This will even that out so they play where the belong and more premise teams play other premades.
I like soloQ too but if this is implemented well it won’t matter.
You seem to derive bias from phrases like “a million times better”. So perhaps I need to clarify: that was an understatement. I can not emphazise enough how bad Reaper’s Protection is.
This is disingenuous. You can hate it all you like but it doesn’t make it bad. I can get not liking the trait, but calling it bad in pvp is just false.
If DS (F1) was actually a stunbreak (or you had a trait that turned it into one), FitG would actually be better than RP, because it could get you out of trouble rather than just prevent you from getting into it.
You make it look like RP has a similar effect to stability. But it doesn’t, you’re still getting stunned. At best it protects you from follow up damage. And by “at best” I mean almost never. So in that sense FitG is a million times better.
I certainly hope OP is taking your bias into consideration with such a subjective post.
I played with Reaper’s Protection a lot when doing ToT on my berserker perplexity armor and found it as inconvenient for me and the group as it was for the mob. I wish it was a 0.25s Fear with a 3s stun.
Scattering mobs all over and having to chase after them like a handicapped Necro after being stunned in the opposite direction myself is not fun.
Capture the flag would be great. Plus I think all types of specs (dps, bunker) could play a role in assisting a flag carrier.
The only thing is that you would need to have some sort of limits on the flag carrier as would already be stated. It could end up being some bunker GS warrior feat just trying to carry the flag, where actually anyone should be able to carry, IMO.
The game already uses Glicko for matchmaking. The press release says they’re tweaking the formula and how the ladder works, but it sounds like the matchmaking is barely changing. It’s certainly not using an entirely new system.
The biggest announcements in the press release are the new game mode and PvP seasons, but we don’t have substantial details for either.
It says significant improvements to matchmaking.
Sounds like good changes to me. I’m sure some people will want more but I’m happy about it. That being said we’ll see how it all pans out.
As you are new, both ranger and necromancer are good/great classes to play.
Both are intuitive and easy to control, easy to master, the necromancer is tanky and the ranger can spike somebody down quickly from range.
At high levels, the necromancer doesn’t have enough mobility, but this is not your concern until you get to high levels. The ranger is better on maps that are big and flat and less good on maps with lots of line of sight issues.
Tl;DR
Both are great choices.
This.
Plus that topic applied more at the time, but the meta has changed since then.
What do you think Roe? I know that you PvP but I know you prefer power right?
I do play condi necro in pvp when it suits the team comps (basically, multiple enemy engis for me to nom) and I always take reapers protection, because I find it very valuable in pvp. As much as it can be a crutch which I will admit, it can also save me when I need to be fighting on point or I’m getting focused or whatever. I can see the point that it is passive and uncontrolled and not liking it for that reason, but it is still a very good trait.
That being said, I wouldn’t ever bother taking it in WvW where I roam as condi. I find dhuumfire much better due to there being more space, more available life force, etc, hence my previous comment about pvp vs WvW.
In two years of playing this game, I have never once been whispered in PvP by someone who was worth chatting with. Do yourself a favour and block liberally.
I have a little over 2 years, and only a handful of decent interactions that came from these types of whispers. A few cool opponents in WvW, one new guy in spvp, and that’s it. But that’s still only 1 guy in pvp, ever.
Most whispers, map chat and say chat comments aren’t worth your time because they are coming from people who are mad, usually from thinking they are superior one way or another but they lost. Just lol and move on.
Easy classes tend to be crazy popular, and power necro isn’t. Dealing damage is a lot of auto attacking, but knowing how to live in a glassy spec with no escapes, and your main defense being a resource you need to build is where the intricacies of the spec arise.
The dhuumfire build generally misses out on the heavy boon corruption that really helps condi necros in the current meta, and it is so very reliant on having a lot of life force to get those shots off. So any time that you’re out of life force that whole trait line is pretty much wasted.
A lot of WvW players are pretty bad. Dont get me wrong, there are some really talented roamers out there, but I would say more than half of the players I encounter in WvW are bad, whereas only about 20% of my pvp solo/teamQ experience are bad players.
I would really love to see this signet buffed, it’s passive is too weak and the active cast time is too long to ever really take. A lot of necro signets are too weak, partially because they don’t work in DS, so the OP should actually say: 5 minutes without using death shroud before it gives you a full life force bar.
^ I think OP is asking that when you roll a new toon, it should start at the level of your pvp rank, all the way up to dragons rolling a new level 80 toon as a way to get people to pvp more.
But leveling a toon to 80 is much faster than getting to rank 80 in pvp, so it’s sort of a moot suggestion IMO.
Don’t listen to anyone but yourself. Play the class and spec you like, and check out metabattle.com for specs, especially when you check out pvp. Pretty much anything with a proper set up can work in most gamemodes unless you plan to take things really, really seriously.
^ That’s been mentioned before but I think it never hurts to mention it again. I think nerfing total DS and really ramping up regeneration is the only true way to address necro sustain.
Yes and no. A large chunk of the reasons Necros get no blocks, evades, or Vigor is because Death Shroud can be used for a long period of time. For example, when ressing or stomping, having a large pool is far better to having a smaller, more rapidly refilled one. Unholy Sanctuary, Unholy Martyr, and Death Shiver all get benefit from larger death shroud pools rather than quick refills (which some builds pull off anyway).
Reducing the size of death shroud means a lot more work to re-balance things than just increasing life force gain. Would the end result be better? Possibly, but not certain. I’m not against the idea, but I don’t think it would be as helpful as you think.
Right, staying in DS benefits traits that are largely considered bad or subpar and are used in niche builds if at all. But I see this change as being more balanced and potentially more skill based than it is currently, much like OP’s suggestion. Both changes would really make necromancer a more interesting class.
So what happens to those traits when you lessen their sustained use? What you are advocating is essentially “those traits are weak, so let’s nerf them.”
Not the way to balance a game. Reducing life force pool and increasing life force generation is a possibility to make a more sustained necromancer, but it also completely kills things that are currently too weak. There is a lot more work that needs to be done than just altering some numbers, and the answers are not straightforward.
Ok I get your point, but after thinking about this, I’m not totally sure that these traits would be nerfed, because if it were actually done and done properly, overall DS uptime would be the same, and in the hands of a skilled player it should actually be stronger. Also, I never at any point said that it was just tweaking some numbers, I think we realistically need bigger death shroud reform that not only includes this idea, but the OP’s idea, and giving us back our weapon swap, and seeing our utilities’ cooldowns, and allowing our healing traits to work, and allowing signets to work, let alone more meaningful group support.
With that said, it seems like you’re suggesting that balance needs to include these traits, which are just bandaids to larger issues of sustain and group support. Why balance around those, when you can address the real issues that caused those traits to exist in the first place?
Are you trying to ask the vital question that nobody came up with before?
Btw soloq is broken too, is PvE not enough for you?
My contribution is to ask why you’re trying to fix the part of the game that won’t fix what you’re complaining about. You complain about 5 v 4s, and runaway point totals. How will preventing people from joining the winning team make them want to join the losing team? I don’t do soloqueue much, only when I need to finish off a reward track. I don’t like dragging down other people with my lack of skills in pvp. Hotjoin is perfect for me. I always try to win, and I don’t just afk. I don’t, however, stay on losing teams, unless the tide turns late in the game.
Your suggestion seems to me to make hotjoin worse. You could never join a winning team, unless you’re there from the start. So people would just leave losing teams, and look to start another team. And then the match collapses, because people quit, the winning team gets another 200 points unopposed, and people look at the difference, and say “screw it.” and leave.
You obviously haven’t read any of my posts, or the OP.
I’m not bothered by 5v4 in hotjoin
Preventing people to join the winning team is a must (not much to say about this if you really missed this point)
You don’t do SoloQ, you are playing pvp for rewards and you never stay on a losing team. You reply with: “So, Teamqueue, and solo queue aren’t enough?”
Its funny that players like you seem to be the only problem for my Fix. At least players like you will now leave the match instead of autobalancing and joining the winning team again and again…
So to answer your question: my fix will slowly remove players like you from hotjoin, to give room for players that actually want to play. And don’t autobalance the teams each day, every day.
Currently, any fix would be better than its current state. Even mine (which was a 1 minute iteration).
Again, why should I stay on the losing team?
I think you have a valid point. But the bigger questions are why are there losing (and by this i also imply, outnumbered) teams to begin with, and why do to have the option to switch?
^ That’s been mentioned before but I think it never hurts to mention it again. I think nerfing total DS and really ramping up regeneration is the only true way to address necro sustain.
Yes and no. A large chunk of the reasons Necros get no blocks, evades, or Vigor is because Death Shroud can be used for a long period of time. For example, when ressing or stomping, having a large pool is far better to having a smaller, more rapidly refilled one. Unholy Sanctuary, Unholy Martyr, and Death Shiver all get benefit from larger death shroud pools rather than quick refills (which some builds pull off anyway).
Reducing the size of death shroud means a lot more work to re-balance things than just increasing life force gain. Would the end result be better? Possibly, but not certain. I’m not against the idea, but I don’t think it would be as helpful as you think.
Right, staying in DS benefits traits that are largely considered bad or subpar and are used in niche builds if at all. But I see this change as being more balanced and potentially more skill based than it is currently, much like OP’s suggestion. Both changes would really make necromancer a more interesting class.
Agreed. Hotjoin is hardly useful for even testing builds because its so regularly unbalanced one way of the other. Most people, for whatever reason, are content observing a 5v4 than join on the losing team for some rewards as opposed to none.
^ That’s been mentioned before but I think it never hurts to mention it again. I think nerfing total DS and really ramping up regeneration is the only true way to address necro sustain.
I remember once, before the buffs, I was in a pvp match and doing everything I could to get a thief away from rezzing their downed teammate, and I casted everything I had due to them being stealthed. The thief ran out of stealth with probably 1k health left, but all my cooldowns were gone, except staff 1. I cast it and it hit, downing him. I remember thinking, if only staff 1 were faster, this would be a decent skill.
It’s actually worth casting now from time to time. Not an auto attack like dagger, obviously, but getting a few casts off isn’t be joke it used to be. For a power build.
Roe – You have a point there, although I have a hard time generating LF without Soul Marks.
That’s just my gameplay style I guess..
Again, thanks for taking your time to help
Soul marks isn’t the worst option for you there, but I would suspect that picking up spectral armor and then the spectral cooldown trait (over soul marks) would net you more life force than soul marks does. I would suspect that you’re hurting for life force because of your dagger offhand and lack of spectrals – or at least, if I made those changes to my build, I would probably lack life force. Maybe it fits your playstyle more, but those would be my recommendations.
Soul marks can go for unyielding blast. Realistically staff is not much more than a quick support or just a way to harass while you close your distance. Staff shouldn’t be more than like 10% of your time, the rest is all dagger and DS. You may disagree, but the next time you’re fighting a spirit ranger or a turret engineer and you can’t land a hit, you’ll wish you had it. Plus it helps cleave downed and can land more hits with good positioning.
Next I would ditch off hand dagger for warhorn. If you’re running glass, your options are to pretty much overpower people or lose, I’ve found that a blind and some weakness aren’t difference makers, but the damage, CC and life force from warhorn is.
You have almost no defense without life force, so that should drive a lot of your decisions, like wurm vs spectral armor, for example.
Since this seems like it would require a lot of cooldown balancing and proper timing to actually execute, I’m for it. Skill based play should be promoted. Although this does seem mostly like a buff to power necros more than all necros, since most condition skills have short cast times. But, it would definitely buff foot in the grave to help get off important casts, and this whole thing could help necromancers more effectively stomp.
I think if you add, the mid point caps for the team with the most players, you might be onto something. But if the point doesn’t cap if contested like it does now, that middle point will never cap.
Sort of adds some flavor too – do you rush mid or guard your home point? Also, is that mid point worth more?
I’d like if the area around the actual skyhammer interface had a few less ledges, or a somewhat different design that didnt make it such a CC haven, but otherwise I think the changes were good. Still not crazy about the glass panels, though.
This is why I’ve mentioned having a necromancer specific boon that works just like soothin mist, but also works in death shroud. Necros actually can get a decent amount of regen (mark of blood, reapers touch, blood magic minor adept trait, well of power), but it doesn’t help when you would most need the healing.
I’d rather just have Regeneration work normally in death shroud than creating a necro-specific boon.
Fair enough, but this also in some way addresses necro’s lack of unique group buffs.
Obviously things would have to be rebalanced, but I think peripheral heals like Regeneration, heals from water blasting should be applicable in death shroud.
However, the thing with that is that ANet will probably compensate with a nerf to Death Shroud.
I wiser approach would be to begin allowing more healing in death shroud, such as from our own traits that are shut down by death shroud. Then allowing some healing in as a percentage if necessary. But seeing as how any other class is never prevented from healing received, and necromancers have longstanding issues with sustain, I can’t see it being overpowered.
This is why I’ve mentioned having a necromancer specific boon that works just like soothin mist, but also works in death shroud. Necros actually can get a decent amount of regen (mark of blood, reapers touch, blood magic minor adept trait, well of power), but it doesn’t help when you would most need the healing.
I’m not sure it’s only fire fields, as someone else pointed out, these professions also get the most out of swap sigils. I’m not sure what the best way to approach it is, but I’m sure that’s it’s a combination of these factors that leads to the might stacks on these classes.
We need a general overhaul of life force generation. It’s been pretty clear that we’re not getting the active defenses that are always brought up. But I think it’s more of a problem that some specs have hardly any ways to generate their main defense. I usually play power necro and I don’t have much trouble getting some life force, but if you switch to condi it can be really difficult to get life force in comparison which is really limiting, in my opinion.
I would love to see some adjustments to life force on spawn, life force generation on weapon sets, and maybe even some kind of exponential degeneration if done right.
