Guild Wars 2

Here is the build YOU posted, the newly “updated” loadout you’re playing. It’s what I looked at. It’s why I commented the way I did.

http://en.gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAW7fnknBFphdqBmpBEgilXj6sICijDNAypjoeYP2lF-TJxHABz+EAMqMwO7PAwFBAA

If you’ll notice, it has things like torch selected. So if you’re wondering why you’re getting the responses you’re getting, it might have something to do with you! :D

And if you will, can you state what the role of this build is (roaming DPS, bruiser, support, etc) and in brief the playstyle.

SlimChance.6593:

Probably the same developer that decided that quickness, slow, and chill no longer affect rez/stomps.

That’s ANets idea of ‘balancing’ and that’s why I play this game less and less.

Holy

godkitten

kitten

This was one of the most important changes the game needed after the travesty that was S1 and beyond.

There will never be a more potent Mesmer build than the current setup so long as spamming through your shatters is as potent or profitable as things currently are. In fact there’s no reason to play any other Mesmer build, unless you enjoy a life of pain and hardship.

Is limiting CS the way to do this? Possibly, it’s one way to go about it at least.

Just to state it again, the excessive reproduction of clones via chrono traits/weapons and instantaneous spamming of shatters is only necessary due to the ridiculously underwhelming pressure, and easily destructible nature of clones/phants!

There is every reason to mash those shatters under this (only) build of mesmer immediately.

godkitten I hate playing mesmer these days XD

Pro conquest tip: If it comes down to it, just make sure you keep the point decapped if not capped, and stay alive. You can continually reset the fight on the point to decap it from him, or cap if he moves on. In this way you won’t be earning any points for the team with that point, but neither will he. It’s a zero sum neutralizing of anything.

Rotate around him with portal.

Clownmug.8357:

Ithilwen.1529:

An ANET staffer stated on the official stream that he had lost to a clone death Mesmer and went on to say that he had decided the build should be removed. Iw was strongly implied that the decision was based upon that match. This was on ANET official stream and the build was removed the very next patch.

This is fact.

In my opinion, that was not sound decision making and it should be rescinded.

I don’t remember any staffer being that blantantly biased, but that’s where the “purple cheese” thing came from I believe.

I still have that icon!

But yes. I suppose one could imagine a dev suddenly facing a clone death build, and getting so beat up by it he has an emotional response, and after returning to his keyboard with a spent box of tissues and the wells of water dried away so as to no longer blur his vision, sit down and vow on his life to remove this travesty from all existence of he’ll slit his own throat. It’s quite a story, but certainly within the limits of the imagination.

On the other hand, I could also imagine a dev facing a certain build, sitting back and saying “Hmm, I don’t like how that plays out in the game. It’s poor design with numerous gameplay problems. I think we’ll make some changes for the better.” -Then do what Anet devs do best and makesomechangesthatbreak10otherthingsandovernerfabunchofthingsnobodyhadaproblemwith etc while doing the one thing they did actually intend to do (but I’ll digress).

Makes you wonder what scenario is the closer interpretation. I suppose the bias lays with the individual, in the end.

Ok, for the sake of argument I’ll grant you it’s a different build regardless of if it’s traits, role, and playstyle are almost entirely the same (with a few obvious degrees of difference in offense vs defense etc).

The question is: is it better at the same job? You mention Helseth and high level play. Don’t worry, I know all about Helseth. I also know all about Mesmer. I also know all about appropriately balancing out offensive and defensive features in a build, and that you take as much as you need and anything more is waste. The power of portal and why it doesn’t matter if you’re forced to flee the point if you have it. The synergy of mes traits, shatters, and sig of illusions. I know all of this. Which is why when I look at your build I see a condi chrono mesmer, albiet non-meta variant, which is why I state “So in the end you’re just playing meta condi chrono but with the on point sustain weapon set swapped out for some more direct damage condi.” I could have added much more I guess, seeing as this build has vast limitations when we do a comparison.

Have I made some sort of factually inaccurate statement?

Anyway, I’m sorry if you feel trolled. Here’s a fun and factually accurate meme to show I both know my mesmering, plus related trivia, and have done so for a long time!

Implement voice comms in PvP and 5 randoms instanly become a communicating team.

Even if only 1 of the 5 has a mic.

Amazing.

XxsdgxX.8109:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

XxsdgxX.8109:

DrDivine.5378:

This profession has had an interesting history, from being almost unusable to becoming the staple on any serious team. People might disagree with me on this, but one issue I’ve always had with the revenant in pvp is that it doesn’t feel like it knows what it wants to be.

Power shiro, the most prominent build in it’s history, is really just a thief. Once they were able to take their role back as the sort of glassy but very mobile dps, they don’t have much to work with. The revenant is a heavy class, but it doesn’t really take hits (conditions for that matter) very well.

Thief and mesmer used to suffer from this problem for the longest time, the reason old fashioned shatter power mesmer didn’t work is because it was heaviy countered by thief but trying to fight for that role of “glassy mobile dps guy” and failed. Once mesmer started to lean towards it’s own role, the really annoying confusion, manipulation with portal it started to stand on it’s own. Thats what we need right now. Thief and mesmer are now doing their own things, revenant needs to do the same.

It was jack of all trades (and master of none), but the saltiness of people destroyed the class and now it does at best an average job at niche things, it’s pretty sad because arguably it’s one of the most interesting classes, both mechanically and thematically.

And you can see how people in general don’t give kitten about balance when they keep expressing how happy they are that the class they hate is almost unusable and hope it stays dead.

You mean it was shipped overpowered compared to all other Classes forcing Multiple classes out of their Roles for close to a Year.

Sorry the Rev finally got a dose of reality, maybe now they will start fixing its plethora of bugs instead of making it rely on overpowered skills.

First one, here we go. Good mature community proving my points.

This deserved a meme because some tears need evaporating.

People care about balance. Which is why they’re so happy the unbalanced Revenant has been knocked down a peg until such time as it can be properly developed.

I don’t know why the game can’t just divvy things like duo’s and equally ranked players over the two teams either. The thing is, duo’s are just a couple of solo’s linked together. It only makes a difference by guaranteeing two good players on the same team, and potentially four, but this assumes these are truly good players.

In cases like the image, the duo’s might have only helped balance out the solo’s.

Bio Flame.4276:

Aitadis.8269:

I think we were in the same match
http://imgur.com/a/qvQZT
If this was league of legends or any other competitive MMO, this kitten would be fixed day 1.

I don’t understand. If I were this lazy on my RL job and I didn’t fix this kind of mess, I would probably get fired rather fast.

I mean…it’s just so mindblowingly stupid that such a bug still exists that I am left speechless.

Your boss would tell you it’s good you have nothing to say because he wants you to go fill some customer orders and get that all important PvE content out to them pronto.

Also Christmas. The business is on break. I know for a fact my Anet buddy is still currently durping. He just ask if we’re on for D&D this week :D

Cynz.9437:

XxsdgxX.8109:

Cynz.9437:

Burn.5401:

Cynz.9437:

Burn.5401:

Cynz.9437:

Revs needed nerfs badly, they are roamers after all and roamers are not supposed to be so stupidly strong (Anet logic, not mine). Not to mention until all HoT specs (rev including) get nerfed, there should be no buffs.

thief main

So? Why should Anet treat revs differently than thieves? Welcome to the club.

Dunno, your post is ironic since thieves atm are the ones that are stupidly strong.

In what exact way?

Dude, thief is stupid powerful at the moment, and the excuse is that it doesn’t give boons to a party so it is way overtuned in every other aspect.

You didn’t answer my question. I can also say “dude, rev is stupid powerful!!!”

Thief post-HoT crimes are: Evade spam
in conjunction with: High damage
in conjunction with: High mobility

The one saving grace for the playerbase is that most people playing thief are sub-optimal at it. Truly experienced thieves who know who and when to engage, and in a manner that always produces results are what highlight the thieves evil potential.

Obviously in a post-HoT world, Thief needs its evade spam, and can’t exist without its high damage and high mobility. It also suffers bad matchups and a world full of post-HoT aoe death spam, somewhat limiting (or making difficult) it’s life.

Thieve’s issue is now as it always has been. The difference from the Thieves side of things is just that his opponents have more in their kitten nal to help deal with him, making it a more dangerous world. Personally I don’t have much of an issue with Thief, but I do understand how frustrating of a class they are simply because their unique mechanic (much like rev has its unique mechanic) have given it an unreasonable edge.

Here’s a fun question, if Thief were removed from the game, would it make for a more enjoyable pvp experience?

OriOri.8724:

Bio Flame.4276:

To be fair, it’s not only Mesmers that need a serious nerf – almost all classes do.
But yes, double-Moa, double shield 5 (each with double stun, double quickness), double shield 4, double or triple shatters…it’s a no-no.

Can’t the balance team look at this spamming mess and think that maybe, just maybe, it’s not how PvP should be?

Even if you get hit by a double Moa (which should almost never happen anyway. There’s almost no point in using CS for Moa if you are just going to use it again right away and take the 3 min CD in the first place), you are still Moa’ed for less time than you used to be with the skill, and its harder for us to hit you with now because its more telling, and we can no longer hit people behind us. When will people grow the kitten up and quit whining about this skill? Its not overpowered, its been nerfed plenty.

Shield 4 can only be used again if it actually blocks an attack. So, make sure it doesn’t block any attack and suddenly they can only use it once, not to mention that you can dodge the phantasm summon regardless.

Bio Flames overall point is valid. CS as a mechanic does add to the excess of skill and effect spam in the game. Before HoT the game was far cleaner. Simpler in some ways, sure, but hardly the mess of skill effects we have now.

Fay.2357:

Ithilwen.1529:

To return to the topic, clone death was removed after an ANET staffer was killed by a clone death Mesmer.

You keep saying this a lot. It’s still false though. It’s amusing because this false statement seems to be the very basis of your argument for reinstating clone death builds…And it’s nothing but a falsification.

Personal objectification is commonly the basis of your arguments, Ithilwen. When something happens that you don’t like it’s because “the man” was out to get you/it. This undermines your case heavily.

And despite the dismissal of it, the argument “passive procs are poor design and should be removed from all aspects of the game” is a strong and valid argument. So overcoming that is the biggest hurdle this endeavor currently faces.

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Ross Biddle.2367:

OriOri.8724:

I’ll just let Ross take care of this thread for the most part

Lukas.7159:

- Dont let Continuum Split affect Elites
- Nerf the shield #4 (just make it a single block over 3secs duration like war shield, the additional phantasm on both blocks that slows enemies plus gives alacrity is too op), also the #5 needs to be tuned down a bit (double stun, quickness, damage, missile block, combo field PLUS cooldown reduce is too much imo)

- give blurred frency a higher cd, reduce the damage output OR the evasion time; its a 2,5 second evade on a 12sec short cd that actually does good damage

BF is fine. It leaves the mesmer stationary, and is just a blur. Retaliation procs 8 times if you can put it up when mesmer uses BF and isn’t paying attention. And since it leaves the mesmer stationary, any competent player should be moving out of range, making the applied damage pretty low. Its in a pretty good spot balancewise.

We can also compare it to Unrelenting Assault on Rev (another HoT introduction) which IS OP by design for various reasons. BF is a standard. Which is how we know kitten like UA is OP as kitten

Haha UA is OP? Procs confusion each hit and long precast and unreliable damage outside of 1v1? Plz your biases are showing. I’d happily trade.

Oriori owned this one but I’ll fully acknowledge my bias. I have an extremely strong bias toward over powered features, such as UA, and HoT release Rev in general. We’re fortunate it’s been nerfed off the scene (though it’s still being played to good effect, let’s be honest) since otherwise we’d have to continue to face it’s OP’ness in abundance in every game.

You got me, I have a bias. It’s a good bias to have.

viquing.8254:

For instance, I know that you could proc on death condi’s by simply destroying your own clones (via generation). No mindless melee or aoe spamming opponent necessary!

Nice, you learned your lesson well.
We have only 1 melee clone, other are ranged.
So unless your ennemies are staying between your clones, you don’t do perma cripple and weakness. Fighting a clonespammer is all about positionning.
But I agree that they can reduce the aoe from 240 to 120.
And remember that during a moment, deceptive evasion didn’t pop more than 3 illusions, so only clones from weapon can trigger on death.

If you couldn’t manipulate your enemy into position that’s a L2P issue on your part. In conquest it’s very easy to control an enemies movements. In WvW any amateur player knows choosing where and when to engage makes or breaks a fight. PvE, who cares. Since you’re a pro, you know all this.

Redundant pro tip! If you have two phants out, any clone on the field will pop the moment you generate another clone. From weapons or DE on a dodge roll! Right on top of you, and or your favorite enemy!

Anyway, I will grant you, some sort of clone death could be viable under the right circumstance of trait and weapon synergies. I dont know that its worth the time or resources though. You could just play a mine laying engie.

Hyper Cutter.9376:

DeceiverX.8361:

Elites were intended to provide playstyle changes and new synergies, not improvements. Claiming otherwise is factually incorrect as ANet said repeatedly before HoT that the elites were designed not to provide more power, despite the name.

An elite spec with two core specs is always going to be better than three core specs if for no other reason than the inherent mechanical benefits (changed mechanics, new skills, a new weapon), nothing short of actively hamstringing them will change that. Anet doubtlessly realized that almost immediately.

Since elites are clearly made to be balanced against each other (which is why you can only have one, and the weapon/skills are tied to the trait line), this will probably improve when there’s more than one option available.

In theory.

Then we look at Chrono as an example. The line proves +25% move speed, incredible clone generation, alacrity for universal cd reductions, the sustain and cc power of shield, the potency of CS in its various forms, and it leaves you to wonder: Are they going copy over these important features into the elite lines?

If not mesmer will be left wanting, and holding dearly to Chrono.

Balian.5314:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Balian.5314:

Honestly think all classes are at a good spot balance wise this meta. They all provide for some form of counterplay.

If your call out is X class being too strong, then all classes are equally strong. If X class needs a nerf then all classes needs a nerf. All these came as a package in HoT. Every class had a buff in the form of their elite specs.

These classes are merely fulfilling their individual roles in PvP. Instead of crying nerf, L2P and choose ur fights wisely. If you lost a fight ur meant to lose from a class vs class perspective, then ur meant to lose anyway. If ur meant to win and u lose due to player skill issues then suck it up and get good instead of crying OP.

Balance-wise, the nuclear kitten nals of the worlds super powers relative to their prospective world views and personal levels of self imposed responsibly is quite balanced. That doesn’t make nukes good or justify their existence in collective humanities best interests!

There is a functioning META currently. The game is still in a terrible state when you look seriously at the issues. The devil is in the details. Be honest if nothing else.

Perhaps it’s a matter of perspective.

My perspective of ‘balance’ here would mean making X class in line with the others, using other classes as a benchmark.

Imo, balance does not equate to re-designing X class and it’s skills based on personal standards.

If you noticed, I’ve indirectly proposed for all elite specs to be balanced out vs core specs.

Perhaps it’s due to the fact that I solo roam and duel a lot in WvW as well. From a WvW roaming standpoint I do not think mesmers are that strong, due to their inability to effectively finish off opponents kiting them. In PvP however, people are forced to fight within point often, thus being more susceptible to a mesmer’s shatters which is their main source of damage post HoT.

My saying that the classes are currently balanced out in this meta is simply because I view it as ‘rock, paper, scissors’. Every class has its strengths and weaknesses which provides for counterplay. Ultimately it boils down to engaging fights in a position that benefits you, whichever class you are playing, in whichever game mode.

Here is a visual representation of HoT Elite specs. I don’t know what meta you’re playing

BTW, you speak really well and I enjoy reading your view

I have no problem on my rifle/GS war under the current META. Climbing in rank, and in win ratio.

Yes, DPS warrior is alive.

Balian.5314:

Honestly think all classes are at a good spot balance wise this meta. They all provide for some form of counterplay.

If your call out is X class being too strong, then all classes are equally strong. If X class needs a nerf then all classes needs a nerf. All these came as a package in HoT. Every class had a buff in the form of their elite specs.

These classes are merely fulfilling their individual roles in PvP. Instead of crying nerf, L2P and choose ur fights wisely. If you lost a fight ur meant to lose from a class vs class perspective, then ur meant to lose anyway. If ur meant to win and u lose due to player skill issues then suck it up and get good instead of crying OP.

Balance-wise, the nuclear kitten nals of the worlds super powers relative to their prospective world views and personal levels of self imposed responsibly is quite balanced. That doesn’t make nukes good or justify their existence in collective humanities best interests!

There is a functioning META currently. The game is still in a terrible state when you look seriously at the issues. The devil is in the details. Be honest if nothing else.

Just as soon as Anet is off holiday

Sometime around 2025

viquing.8254:

Churning out unlimited cripple and weakness

You were just facing mindless melee or equivalent?

while kiting endlessly

Due to stealth (pu combo), nothing to do with one death.
Have you ever try a clonespammer without stealth ?

I get bored of people who cry about eliminate something they don’t like.
It just leads to : as much as cheesy as before, sometimes even more, and 0 diversity.

I’m fed up about shatter who do the coffee, and the full shatter orientation.

---

Another note : can we hope one day a come back on the speed proc on mantra cast with centaur’s runes ?

You’re talking to the wrong guy if you want to burn me down with ideas of sticking to the status quo burst shatter spec. I’m the guy who was running scepter/torch in WvW from release, stuck it to the man with interrupt builds, and rocked with great success such things as Phantrupt even pre trait revamp and Mental(lockdown) Anguish days.

For instance, I know that you could proc on death condi’s by simply destroying your own clones (via generation). No mindless melee or aoe spamming opponent necessary!

Honestly, if you’re going to come to school, listen to teacher. Don’t stand up and try to lecture the class. You’re clearly still learning!

Anyway, now you’ve sat back down, I’m all for build diversity. I also know how GW2 needs to achieve that. I don’t see how you draw the conclusion that therefor clone death is the way forward XD

Here’s an idea! Let’s give Mesmer some builds with good access to cripple and weakness that don’t involve clones being killed by the enemy! /GASP/CONTROVERSY/

I think the takeaway from this is that, had you been running berserker instead of warrior, you’d be +20 instead of -20 right now

XD

OriOri.8724:

I’ll just let Ross take care of this thread for the most part

Lukas.7159:

- Dont let Continuum Split affect Elites
- Nerf the shield #4 (just make it a single block over 3secs duration like war shield, the additional phantasm on both blocks that slows enemies plus gives alacrity is too op), also the #5 needs to be tuned down a bit (double stun, quickness, damage, missile block, combo field PLUS cooldown reduce is too much imo)

- give blurred frency a higher cd, reduce the damage output OR the evasion time; its a 2,5 second evade on a 12sec short cd that actually does good damage

BF is fine. It leaves the mesmer stationary, and is just a blur. Retaliation procs 8 times if you can put it up when mesmer uses BF and isn’t paying attention. And since it leaves the mesmer stationary, any competent player should be moving out of range, making the applied damage pretty low. Its in a pretty good spot balancewise.

We can also compare it to Unrelenting Assault on Rev (another HoT introduction) which IS OP by design for various reasons. BF is a standard. Which is how we know kitten like UA is OP as kitten

Chapell.1346:

That was truly a Masterpiece indeed. also in addition; while currently having troubled against this scenario and since forum is the only transparency that i can rely into, in regards on offhand pistol and their weapon five skill called Magic Bullet that we all know/knew its so magical, does this said mention skill intended to defy Line of Sighting aswell?
Thanks for clarification in advance.

Magic bullet needs Line of sight (it’s a projectile and can be destroyed/blocked/reflected aswell). The bounce doesn’t need LoS (from the Mesmer), but that’s irrelevant.

@DecieverX

Actually Core mesmer does have a lot of problems, including pre-HoT. These are design problems, or flaws. That’s why only certain types of skills could be utalized in the way they were, and why there weren’t many viable specs. Arguably outside of power shatter in a +1 roaming role, there weren’t any viable builds (depending on game mode of course).

Generally speaking you do make a well reasoned response but it misses the point. Take for example you pointing out that shatters are AoE, which of course they are. Same with sword AA. But neither of these functioned in the way anyone regarded as “AoE” back in the day. We simply compare them to a warrior cleaving in a team fight with an axe or GS, or a staff ele’s genuine AoE capabilities. Necro wells. Even a D/D ele going through his maped out rotations. Mesmer did not have AoE unless you were unfortunate enough to be standing next to his singled out burst target. After that don’t worry about his sword AA, he’s disengaging to prepare for his next burst.

Or, mobility solved with focus? Please. Could Mesmer afford to drop torch for that? or were you meaning GS? Reduction in stealth = Dead Mesmer. No GS? No burst. Or maybe double ranged was your thing, but GL exchanging the survivability of staff for the swiftness of focus. Let’s be real when we’re talking about core mesmer, particularly in the past, and the problems (or as you reduced it to- payoffs) it faces.

Chrono does need nerfing, along with all HoT introductions. But with that Mesmer needs reworking, and/or redesign, particularly in the “payoff” areas, and including clone functionality and mechanic. This is known.

Chapell.1346:

Idk if this one is by design or perhaps I’m just being delusional, though I’ll embrace any possible feedback but what currently holding back mesmer right now is/was (power or condi) their ability to inflict condition on shatter while dodging/evaded their raw damage but still went thru. Intended? Who knows.
Other than that I see no problem on their intended concept and design in which make them fun to play.

*All of the old Mesmer problems persist once you drop the Chrono line.

• Mesmer: Slow with no reliable access to swiftness
• Chrono: base 25% movement speed increase

• Mesmer: Tied to Deceptive Evasion (and the dueling line) for clone generation (along with the Illusions line for CD reductions)
• Chrono: Illusionary Reversion + Chrono Phantasma, + alacrity for CD reductions

• Mesmer: Shattered clones move to slow, die to AoE. Die quickly to AoE generally speaking, especially in glassy power builds (which was the best way to spec)
• Chrono: Shattered clones have superspeed to get to their target. Shattering also generate new clones (IR, CP), witch restores their HP’s. Those clones also get superspeed on the subsequent shatters, and on and on and on.

• Mesmer: Poor condi cleanse, particularly in builds optomised to the only viable role (power shatter). Inspiration line alleviates this but at a major cost to either damage (making it an unviable burst), or functionality (giving up dom, dueling, or chaos just for condi cleansing in Insp).
• Chrono: Amazing synergy with Inspiration line. Csplit allows for doubling (or trippling) of shatters which = more condi cleanse, especially in the post HoT condi spam world.

• Mesmer: No AoE, poor team fight presence, Zero on point sustain. Relies on kiting, stealth, and repositioning. Stealth unreliable with newly introduced revealed skills (rev/Engie etc).
• Chrono: Requires NO stealth. Has sustain, defenses, and AoE tools to make a dramatic impact in team fights etc.

• Mesmer: Food for power Rev’s and Daredevils, not to mention anything with range (like the millions of LB DH’s out there who hit like nukes on AA)
• Chrono: HoT level tools to help level the playing field some

and that’s just off the top of my head.

Lukas.7159:

- give blurred frency a higher cd, reduce the damage output OR the evasion time; its a 2,5 second evade on a 12sec short cd that actually does good damage

See, this is the kind of short sighted change you should expect out of these sorts of threads.

Sword is a base weapon, non-HoT, and untied to Chronomancer. Nerfing blurred frenzy is a MAJOR nerf to all Core mesmer specs, all future non-chronomancer mesmer specs, and all power based chronomancer specs, all of which are unviable in the current HoT Meta climate.

You see sword and think it’s CD is to low. But that’s based purely on a broader build that has a plathora of defensive options, creating a difficult enemy to fight. This is true of all Elite specs. To many defensive options, to much evade, to much block, to much healing, to much to much to much. This sort of change is what leads to an overnerf.

Get better at balancing, honestly.

If you understood Mesmer, you’d know the broader problems with this issue, and why your suggestions aren’t really helpful.

There’s a recent thread on the mes forum that goes into a lot of what you’re raising.

As Chrono is currently designed, it’s the only thing holding Mesmer up at the moment. It does need redesign, but it can’t happen without a complete overhaul of the post HoT GW2, or a dramatic redesign of mesmer, clone and phantasm functionality. Atleast for the pvp arena.

There’s been almost no mention of ELO hell on the forums this season. Except by Helseth and his twitch fantasy show of course.

Maybe you should get good at reading trends. ElO Hell Controversy (ELOHC) was SO 2016.

Ithilwen.1529:

I don’t really see the support Mesmer becoming a strong thing in pvp. Still, clone death would re expand quite a few options. Perhaps even a support playstyle.

Churning out unlimited cripple and weakness while kiting endlessly will prop anything up. Especially with all our post HoT sustain power.

Buran.3796:

Ross Biddle.2367:

All this said, had a staff rev on my team last night. Did an amazing job, and his team support really boosted the team potential. It was death and destruction for the enemy in the team fights. Good revs are still good I suppose.

I don’t think that Rev is viable outside ultra god tier players; easiest class to kill at the moment. I would like to se the Pro League soon again to prove my point due my bet is that is out of the meta (maybe could work in a couple of teams or so, but anything from perfect play + team support and Rev falls apart like a house of cards).

Good thing 99.9% of players aren’t playing in the pro league then!

And since when does a player need to be “ultra god tier” when facing your day to day pvp player? Never, and people say I’m dramatic. I’ll grant you one thing, that Rev isnt meta right now. Not in the god tiers of pro league, nor the day to day gauntlet of ranked conquest. However, in day to day ranked conquest, rev can contribute from what I’ve witnessed. FYI, Rifle warrior is not meta in ranked conquest, never has, but I’ve always succeeded with it regardless. Hmmm.

XxsdgxX.8109:

LinhZeri.6412:

Revenant needs to have its damage back on sword skill 2 or revamp the skill to something new.. I mean the description doesn’t even make sense for it precision strike yet hits like a wet noodle. Right now it tickles more then a firefly monster does. Just saying. Staff 5 is acceptable however missed. the staff 3 was un-needlessly increased in cooldown as well after those other 2 changes. Just the typical overnerf like so much balance is these days.

DH: lol so outrageous it has an on point random brain dead trap spam with low cooldowns. Decrease duration of shield of courage to 3 seconds…(making bulwark trait more relevant for increased shielding… give and take for balance) Increase cooldowns on traps and these will be in line. Oh yeah spear of justice shouldn’t be unblockable. Those the only 2 things making this specialization outrageous. ..

Druid: Thye aren’t fine. Just nerf the HoT pets and put in line with the other pets and then they will have to use other amulets to actually do damage. You do damage or your do major healing… you should NOT be able to do both. Oh nvm this gw2.

game needs serious build diversity another reason it has gone to what it is now with balance. Many useless stuff sitting in utilities in all game modes.

Agreed and this right here —->

Ross Biddle.2367:

Xca.9721:

I love how noone mentions Rev since its already dead.

That’s because we celebrate success, which this thread is not about.

Is the reason this game will never be even close to be decently balanced, with such gross and immature attitude.

Something all reasonable people can agree on is that my attitude has absolutely no impact on the balancing of this game whatsoever!

Makes you question what sort of an attitude lead you to suggest such a ridiculous thing!

:D

However I do bring a lot of entertainment an insight to the forums! :D:D

Gwaihir.1745:

Crinn.7864:

Dawdler.8521:

You can CC and block a warrior all you want – they’re still gonna regen 1000 hp/s.

Adrenal Health requires the F1 skill to successfully hit a target. So blinding/blocking/evading the F1s result in no adrenal health for the warrior.

With fast hands you can burst an insane amount of times. Its almost impossible to not land one of them considering theyre massive aoes and mace has a leap+interrupt.

Kite.

See, some people only need bring patience to the game and you can watch a warrior go byebye.

If you’re burly and quick to action then, gg.

Emdrix.6124:

U can be happy for now but its only a matter of time till your class becomes worthless aswell. It just takes enough QQ

The entirety of GW2 has had to endure an OP Rev for four seasons. As for class nerf fear mongering, my main is mes which was mostly rubbish per-HoT, and outside of the one condi-chrono meta build, mostly rubbish post HoT. I also play warrior which was trash for three seasons, only had a condi berserker build in the 4th, and is only being able to stretch it’s legs a bit now in the 5th thanks to, drum roll please, the fixing of rev. You can kitten all over these classes and the rest for all I care, it won’t matter to me. What’s important is the desolation of OP HoT features. Rev being prime amongst them.

All this said, had a staff rev on my team last night. Did an amazing job, and his team support really boosted the team potential. It was death and destruction for the enemy in the team fights. Good revs are still good I suppose.

XxsdgxX.8109:

Burn.5401:

Rev’s the only class in HoT that’s been fun for me to play due to the highly active/reactive gameplay. But yeah, let’s push passives more and replace him with the passive king (Warrior) for this season. I’m so glad this game’s forcing people to reroll with every patch, keeps the meta fresh right?

Yup, couldn’t have said it better. kittening gross how braindead Zerks and DHs are and I used to main all the Heavy armor classes along with Necro, Revenant was by far the most active/complex one with great reward for that. It’s kittening sad.

This is funny and will get funnier the moment someone posts that gif of the two rev’s spamming through the exact same skill rotation at eachother and never landing a single hit.

Rev complex, rofl, what a joke.

Killshot Mesmer

8 seconds of unblockables with some solid weapon rotations and bursts either side puts them on their kitten real quick.

Anything with clones, condi’s, phants, or GS burst is just going to be a headache.

Just burst out their endure pains, then burst past any regen.

Xca.9721:

I love how noone mentions Rev since its already dead.

That’s because we celebrate success, which this thread is not about.

ArthurDent.9538:

sophiewhite.3149:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Emdrix.6124:

I just want the dmg nerfs reverted.

someone kills a few golems with revenant “ZOMG ANET PLS NERF TOO OP”

Actually that was a warrior in the picture.

Hehehehehehe

Jokes aside, Rev is broken. Sure it’s damage has knocked it off the scene, but if not for that you’d still be facing it’s broken sustain mechanics. Fact is, if you give Rev back it’s damage, it’ll come back on the scene and kick other classes and their builds to the curb again. Again, as in, has already happened once. Suggesting we repeat the same mistakes again is just idiocy.

Rev doesn’t need a buff. It needs a redesign. Preferably not by the HoT guys who created that monster.

Digikid.7230:

kakumbien.8047:

Have you ever tried to fight against a warrior on point with ranger/thief / necro / revenant / ele ? Let me guess , you didn’t . Because staying on point with these classes is almost impossible in the melee range of warrior . You can’t kite enough in 1v1 because you ll lose the point . Warrior is direct counter to lots of builds and classes no matter what build warrior thanks to just defense traitline . It does too much for just 1 traitline.

To be fair, have you ever tried playing warrior without the defense traitline? To say it’s horrible would be somewhat of an understatement.

Without Defense line Warrior is Dead in the water, dead on arrival, dead on dead XD

Maniac Magee.2643:

I’ve been using this in ranked heavily for another 2 weeks and had to tweak the build.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAW7fnknBFphdqBmpBEgilXj6sICijDNAypjoeYP2lF-TJxHABz+EAMqMwO7PAwFBAA

I changed the Chaos traitline to Inspiration. While I really enjoy the quality of life you get out of the Chaos traits I had chosen (the finessed play you get from the Manipulation traited skills and the Stability on Shatter), the fact is that many many times there are far too many Conditions being thrown at you. I understand that no build on any class will have an even match-up with EVERY other build, but in the current meta-game you need to be able to handle Condis. I always go for a well-rounded custom set-up (something that is never present in the meta-game, but always valuable when used with skill) So, I switched to the Inspiration line and find myself much better able to sustain long enough.

Obviously without Master of Manipulation Mirror is simply not good enough. I have toyed with both Ether Feast and Well of Eternity. They both have their merits, but a large part of the well’s benefits are only reaped if your team stays in the well. Ether Feast remains a solid and reliable choice.

So in the end you’re just playing meta condi chrono but with the on point sustain weapon set swapped out for some more direct damage condi.

Yup, mesmers in a great spot! :D

Emdrix.6124:

I just want the dmg nerfs reverted.

Heavy direct damage will burn a meta warrior down (force both endure pain procs). That’s 8 or 10 seconds of endure pain depending on if stances are traited or not. After that you have one shield block to work around (3 seconds) which can be ignored with unblockables. If you do this with range you can neuter kite and never suffer his melee.

Most META warriors are running cleansing ire. So with solid direct damage build, and an unblockable, you can work through a warrior after 8 seconds of direct damage immunity.

And this is hard for you?

Maybe get off the healbot eles and bring a counter to get the job done. Then you’ll be laughing instead of crying.

This is the same as Blink for Mesmers.

It has been this way since launch.

For mechanical reasons, it will not change.

Don’t worry everyone, I’m hear to translate Pyro’s otherwise clear explanation.

• Anet’s marketing department created a concept we all know as “Play the way you want”.

• When people, departments, or whatever make a statement, they do so with specific meaning and/or intent. You may refer to this as a definition.

• The definition of Anet’s marketing for the statement “Play the way you want” was specifically meaning “not required to PvP or to do specific kinds of PvE etc etc…”

• Players have extrapolated this to incorporate their seemingly reasonable ideas regarding class build and balance. This would be the error being taken exception with!

• Clarity before agreement!

• I am amazing – This is clear – We can all agree!

apharma.3741:

SneakyTouchy.6043:

It’s just like how in real life when someone has a rope around your neck and they try to hang you with it, you just poof dodge away.

Nah I just pop stability and wait till the cops cut me down and walk off….

Personally I just invuln, slip right through the noose, land on my feet and waltz away.

But to be fair, I can count the number of times a heavy armor wearing dragon hunter has fired a chain bound spear from a bow at me during day to day life on a single hand. It barely comes up irl

-_-

Basically an animation related to a targeted skill effect bugged

sophiewhite.3149:

Vallun.2071:

https://clips.twitch.tv/thelordhelseth/AttractiveFalconSmoocherZ

am i the only one who thinks helseth is being a bit of a kitten here? i mean its one thing to tell someone they are trash when they refuse to improve. its another thing to call someone trash when you dont even know if they are trying to improve. elitest .

When the flaws of GW2 PvP get me down, I just go play a better PvP game on the PS4 with it’s in built chat features. That way I can at least co-ordinate my 5-man team/squad to some semblance of a victory!

The only problem I’m reading here is that you’re playing GW2 :)

You must be playing on NA servers. Just play on EU servers

Are you NA or EU?

If you’re EU, don’t worry, not only are you the best in virtue of your EU status, but you’re also an upstanding person.

If you’re NA, forget it. Give up. You’re scum, and you’ll never be good at this game.

If you don’t believe me, ask any EU player. They’ll tell you it straight. If you notice any NA players dissenting however, don’t listen to them, they can’t be trusted on account of being depraved.