Guild Wars 2

Ithilwen.1529:

That’s what I meant by stacked. The mm appears to be once again encouraging streaks by setting up one side to win.

That seems fine and dandy if you’re on the winning end. Kitten, if the matchmaker favored me I’d be sitting in platinum.

I’m guessing you must be playing only during low population hours. I would love it if you could get the ratings from the players in one of your matches so we could see what kind of matches you are being set up with. Also, I just haven’t seen any evidence that matchmaker would favor/hate someone so much to push them across entire divisions. With my data so far it is just unreasonable for me to believe that the system just worked against you so much to push you down to bronze, or that even if the system did favor you that you would make it to platinum.

Supreme.3164:

Shaogin.2679:

Ithilwen.1529:

I think the games are stacked to encourage streaks again, sadly. That was shown to be a less than optimal idea in s2 and s3.

Though the matchmaking has its issues, I am not seeing any evidence of the matchmaker intentionally trying to force win/loss streaks on players to keep them at a 50% win rate.

Why are there still people who believe that matchmaking gives a fair chance to both team every match?

It’s kind of painfully obvious that one team is heavily favoured to win from the first min of the fight

Actually during peak hours with a decent population in the queue, though one team is still stacked, the difference in rating between the two teams is pretty small. Even with one team being stacked, you can still overcome the odds and win.

So unless you are only playing during low population times, then you can’t really blame the system for all of your losses. If you insist that the matches are being stacked much higher against you than what I’ve been seeing, maybe get the ratings from the players in one of your matches and posting the results here so I can add it to my data and study it.

Sounds like as soon as the match goes into a Thief can just wipe the whole team.

I’ll try investigating this more, but from what I undestand your decayed rating doesn’t determine who you are matched against. So in theory, when you came back you were still playing against gold players. Your decayed rating only affects your leader board position and nothing else.

Been playing some ESO lately, so I’ll stay off GW2 PvP for a couple of weeks to let my rating decay, and then I’ll check the ratings of everyone in the match to see how it placed me and post my results.

Birman.1705:

I always felt S2 and S3 were best in terms of matchmaking as it gave me more stable and more even games. Right now it feels like S4 all over again.

Anyways, I got some first data to put it.

Blue Team 1642(112)/1478(336)/1473(222)/1464(602)/1445(151)
Red Team (me)1556(117)/1593(457)/1571(353)/1564(153)/1470(217)

I skipped all that math you did though.
We lost the match, because right after the first battle at mid people started enraging. In the middle of the match we got our teamwork working and held two points successfully and it was easy to stomp through blue team. However, people just had to start yelling again when there was trouble at home, people lost focus, rotation slowed down and lost it in the end. Lost 15 points, which is more than I usually loose, so I suppose matchmaking set up red team to win this.

Yeah, it looks like your team was favored to win there. Interesting numbers there, look forward to see more of what you get.

Ithilwen.1529:

I think the games are stacked to encourage streaks again, sadly. That was shown to be a less than optimal idea in s2 and s3.

Though the matchmaking has its issues, I am not seeing any evidence of the matchmaker intentionally trying to force win/loss streaks on players to keep them at a 50% win rate.

Rashy.4165:

People have so little trust …

ArenaNet has already stated how matches are formed. In a perfect world where we have 100s of players at every single rating point (100s at exactly 1600, 100s at 1601, etc) all queuing simultaneously, you will always have matches that are even.

Bolded for emphasis. That part is simply not true (look at the leaderboards and see if you can spot even 2 players of equal rating next to each other, and if somehow, you do find that, see how often that happens; this can then be extrapolated somewhat to all tiers; on top of that, all of those players have to be queuing at the same time for matchmaking to put them in a match together). Matchmaking cannot guarantee that people of equal skill rating are queuing at the same time. It has to do the best it can. When you queue, the system tries to find people as close to you as possible, and then forms the teams to try to even out the numbers. However, it will never, ever, period, be perfect when everyone’s rating in a given match is different. Even if the ratings are within about 5-10 points of each other, the odds that you’d be able to get a perfectly even match is very slim, and thats if by some miracle, players of close skill rating are actually queuing at the same time.

And on top of that, the longer you’re in the queue, the wider the search range becomes, and the greater the disparity. The system has to do the best it can with what it can get, and that particular split probably minimized the difference in average team rating.

I think you’re missing the point in this thread. The problem is, the matchmaking system isn’t making matches as balanced as possible. I understand that population problems will have an effect. The problem I have is I’m seeing these ratings in these matches and can see that it one side was stacked higher when there was a clearly better way to split the players into more even teams. This problem becomes much more of a problem when queue population is low. So I am trying to understand the logic behind setting up matches this way, when they could be much better balanced.

megilandil.7506:

@shaogin
the mm sistem it apears to be like:
1
pick 5 random players of aprox same mmr (create a team)
repeat repeat repeat
pick 2 random teams with aprox the same average mmr
release a match

Not
2
take 10 random players of same aprox mmr
split in two teams
release a match

this is the most logical explanation to stackings of highers mmr and classes cuz with method two they can split class and high mmr to balance a little teams

This would explain why the teams are stacked the way they are. However, if this is the case, I can’t see why they would choose such a method. I can’t see any benefit to do that over just finding 10 players and evenly splitting them. I mean, I can’t be faster to set up a match that way. This would be a completely illogical decision on Anet’s part.

It could very well be what is going on. I hope it isn’t, but knowing Anet, it wouldn’t surprise me. They do come up with some crazy stuff sometimes.

Birman.1705:

So I tried adding everyone into my friend’s list, but the names are not showing up on Friends and Guilds leaderboard? Not a single one, what am I doing wrong?

Hmmm, could be a few things. First of all, you can only do this about once per day or so for some reason, so you’ll probably only be able to do this for the first match of the day you’re in. Second, the leader board shows the player’s account name, so if you are looking for the character’s name on the leader board, you’re not going to find it. This is why I give each player I add a simple nickname (r1,r2,r3,…….b1,b2,b3, etc) so that I can quickly look at the leader board and find them. If you are doing all of this and still you don’t see anyone show up, then I’m not sure what is going on. You could leave them on your friend’s list for awhile as they should eventually show up, the only problem with this is by the time they show up, their ratings could be very different from when you saw them in the match.

If nothing else works, you could always try politely asking the players themselves what their rating is.

Rhiannon.1726:

I’m not denying your oberservations about the difference of the MMR in the opposing teams, but I don’t think that has a huge impact.

After my placement matches (6 won, 4 lost), I was rated with 1300. I’ve played 94 matches so far and my MMR varied between 1230 and 1360 (currently after some losses it stands at 1268).

I don’t think my own skill changed just because my MMR changed for ca. 130 points.

True. Like I’ve said though, even though one team is getting higher rated players, as long as the players are still pretty close in rating overall the match can still be overcome and won, despite being placed at a slight disadvantage. The problem arises when there is a lower population in the queue, because then at that point the matchmaker is pulling from a larger variety of player ratings, and when the higher of those ratings are on one team, it’s a devastating lopsided match that just isn’t fun for anyone. And though you could say, “Well that is just a population problem, they should queue during prime time”, keep in mind that not everyone can play during prime time, and there is no logical sense in punishing those players when clearly the teams could of been evenly split instead of stacked in one team’s favor.

Ithilwen.1529:

I got cast into bronze with a series of losing streaks. The last one was 10 straight slaughtered games.

The matchmaking was so nice early in the season, but I think the population is too low and match quality is being sacrificed to queue time.

It’s a real shame it feels like S2 all over again. The rich get richer and the poor get poorer.

Pretty sure you were misplaced at the start and have just been settling into the rating you belong in. Matchmaking has its issues in the way it divides teams, but overall the system is working pretty good and personally I’m not seeing a change in match quality from the start of the season.

Burn.5401:

Mr Suicidesheep.6137:

Throwing all players into one pot: absolutly terrible

This x10 times.
If I’m let’s say a 1500 rated player, I want to have 1500 rated players as teammates and enemies. I don’t want 1900 and 1000 rated people in my games. Having an equal average on both sides doesn’t make it balanced, games are simply put – kitten. I don’t mind waiting 5 or even 10 minutes for a queue pop if I’ll be able to play on my rating.

Funny thing is, the system doesn’t make two teams with equal average rating. It doesn’t even attempt to make them as equal as possible. One team gets started stacked with a higher average than the other team, and when queue population is lower, the difference between the two teams can be pretty crazy.

Lahmia.2193:

Anchoku.8142:

Signet passives should work in shroud and cool down for all 6 -0 and F-keys should be visible at all times.
SoU needs a drastic cast time reduction.
PS needs a mechanic tweak to prevent the user from being overwhelmed in PvE and WvW.

Wells need another active effect such as reflect and the protection when traited should be doubled in duration.
WoD is horribly weak and needs a large buff while Chilling Darkness should probably be reversed to blind in chill.

Your ideas for elite skills are interesting but there is low-hanging fruit I wish Arenanet would get to work on.

I guess mechanically it can’t atm because it is a form.

They didn’t seem to have that problem with the Druid’s Celestial Avatar. :-P

Birman.1705:

Arena Net might not appreciate you sniffing around in their system like that, because you are uncovering their conspiracy they have been denying. Expect to get dragged from your bed one night. You will be remembered.

P.S It’s actually quite clever though, I just might pitch in, because I’ve had a feeling that I’m getting matched against teams that just has much higher mmr than mine, since my team usually doesn’t even have bad players, we just can’t do anything against their better working synergy.

Lol, if they take me away someone must avenge me and continue my work!

And yeah, I’d love to have as many people pitch in as possible and post their results here. The more data the better.

Got another match to add. First match of the night tonight, just went ahead and added everyone to the good ole friend’s list to check ratings. Here was the initial team split courtesy of our matchmaker, this time with games played also added in parenthesis next to rating, bold one is me.

Red Team 1343(211)/1383(47)/1358(254)/1346(86)/na
Blue Team 1292(289)/1356(84)/1291(88)/na/1339(341)

So looking at the geometric average without including games played, we have Red team with 1357 rating, and blue team with 1319. Now one player on each team did not have a rating yet. So, as for factoring in matches played, I’ll try first starting by taking a geometric average per player, and then doing another team average. So:

Red Team 532/255/587/340/na
Blue Team 611/338/337/na/676

Then if we get the average ratings for these two teams from here we have Red Team with a rating of 406, and Blue Team with a rating of 466. So if we include matches played, it looks as though our team actually has the advantage here. Now let’s repeat this procedure, but this time only using games won instead of games played.

Red Team 372/178/412/246/na
Blue Team 431/236/230/na/491

This method gives Red Team an average rating of 286 and Blue Team an average rating of 327. Here we see Blue Team still being favored but by a smaller gap.

So as far as I can tell, factoring in games played/won doesn’t make any more sense of the system and it seems unlikely they would use this method in the matchmaking process. So looking again at just the ratings we have:

Red Team 1343/1383/1358/1346/na
Blue Team 1292/1356/1291/na/1339

I wish I could see the rating of the remaining two players, but I guess they must be in their placement matches still, or the Friend’s List just decided not to work with those two for some reason.

What I can see from the data I could pull though still follows in line with what I have been seeing every time I look in to the ratings of players in these matches. One team is getting stacked with a few better players, and the other team is getting stuck with a few worse players. Not sure how this is supposed to represent an even skill split between the two teams. It just baffles me really.

This match was lost pretty bad. There was a lot of disorganization. Pinging the mini-map or communicating through team chat or calling targets to be focused didn’t help. My team ignored the buffs on temple and fought off-point a lot. I usually win about 11 points or so per match, I lost 13 points for this match, so I’m assuming the matchmaker system considered this to be an even match-up.

I would love to see what kind of match-ups you guys are getting so I can compare notes and get a larger sample size, especially if you’re in different divisions.

Muy.3170:

I’ve noticed every time I get into combat and try to peel to rotate I move super slow and I don’t get out of combat in any timely manner.

Is SPVP in the state where this in combat speed matters because I keep getting out ran by the majority of professions that have swiftness as well as traits/runes movement bonus.

Chill and Cripple also seem to be over tuned with this in-combat speed because limping for 8 seconds or walking for 8+ seconds is really starting to waste my condition cleanses. It gets really bad when you’re trying to move while casting and interrupt your skills cause you’re playing in the quicksand.

All in all, I don’t think this mechanic is intended no more because of all the power creep I doubt anyone would care if you threw it out, not like 50% cripple or 66% chill wouldn’t do more than enough soft crowd control.

It wouldn’t change the problem you’re having though. Sure you’d run faster, but so would your opponents and then we’re back to your original problem.

vove.2768:

Ivakis Solo.4807:

Last night I got a game that the enemy team wiped the floor with us. At the start I went close with my thief and won 1v2 to cap it. All of my 4 teammates went far and died while the enemy team capped mid, which means they were 4v2. And that repeated through all of the mach. I was getting beaten pretty bad also, a Guardian was killing me in 2 sec. So after the match I whispered with some of the players in the opposing team and 1 if them was Platinum and 2 were Gold, and I’m in BRONZE 1!!! I mean WHAT?!?

I think I will start checking it as per this post: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/Matchmaking-Question-3/first#post6433448

I am just wondering why, in the name of God, the higher rated player allocation is so unfair? Why they are all stacked in one team, meanwhile other team is full bronze?

When is this getting fixed? Why the rating even exists if it matches you with higher tiers anyways?

Another thing I noticed: the further you get with your w/l ratio past 50% the bigger chance that you will be “chosen” to carry the game. As soon as I am starting to get my win ratio over 50% I notice I am paired with worse players each game against stronger teams. At the moment the following pattern developed for me: win streak > loss streak > repeat. Once I get back to around 50% w/l I am again paired with better players against worst teams, so we steamroll the enemy. As you can guess it is a lot of fun for both teams <rolls eyes>

This is a nightmare, I play more balanced games in unranked than in ranked. Ranked sucks badly at the moment in matters of pairing players.

Thanks, I could use all the help I can get. If you can, post the results you get on my thread there as well so I can gather more data together. Would love to see the results other people are getting.

Well of Death (Elite): Instantly kill anything that steps in the well. 5 second duration. Please make it happen.

On a more serious note, would it not be better if the Signet’s active just went ahead and put you in shroud as soon as you used it?

As for the well, I’ve got mixed feelings. Part of me would prefer it to just pulse both the fear and stability with each pulse, and reduce it to the standard 5 seconds, but part of me thinks maybe that would make it a bit OP. Just not sure.

Corrosive poison cloud definitely seems useful, but doesn’t it give you issues always have to use a condi cleanse right after or suffer from your self-inflicted weakness?

Also, after dropping Soul Reaping and staff do you ever have issues with Life Force generation. It is something I’ve been considering, but I’m worried about a drop in sustain.

Thanks, your post is much easier to read now. ^.^

Leafstorm.1349:

Shaogin.2679:

Gamble.4580:

Why it’s equal and fare if you skilled you move up.

It’s that moving up process that is chaos. Everything from elite pros to complete noobs all in a match together, and matchmaker having no idea which is which so it has no idea how to split the teams.

If they ever do that I’ll just play Unranked for the first month and wait for the chaos to settle. The one bright side, the forums will be very entertaining, more so than usual.

That already happens. Just start people off at 1550 and be done with it. Though part of the problem is that those players are then playing for the same amount of points as other, but at a different value considering their games are much harder.

That never happens currently. Legendary players are not being matched with bronze players, which is what would happen after a hard reset.

I don’t agree with the statement that matchmaking is trying to force a 50% win rate on people. However, it is very possible with the way matchmaking is currently functioning that players are getting put in badly lopsided matches. The mm system isn’t evenly dividing players into two teams with fairly close average ratings. Currently, one team will generally have 2-3 players with a higher rating than everyone on the other team, and that other team often has 2-3 players with a rating lower than those on the first team. This creates lopsided matches when you queue and there aren’t many players around your rating in the queue to pull from.

The mm system does still need work, but I don’t believe that it is intentionally trying to sabotage your win rate.

Marks and traps killing you with condi damage? Are you having trouble killing condi necro and trap ranger as a thief?

Ah, wasn’t sure what that little face was supposed to be.

Really not sure why Anet insists on putting so many skills in the game that provide defense while still letting you attack.

Personally I would love it since it would help me understand the matchmaking system a bit more. It’s also kind of a relief when you’ve just been completely destroyed in a match and trying to make sense of it to improve, and then notice the odds were stacked pretty heavily against you to start with.

Also gives us a more solid idea on how well matchmaker is or isn’t working, and provide better feedback rather than making blind assumptions. People can already look up another player’s rating yet personally I have not noticed people going around looking people’s ratings and trolling them about it.

I’m of the opinion that providing more information is better.

Azure The Heartless.3261:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Everyone knows it.

Time to act. All fair minded players need to support this initiative. For too long have these professions kept the others down with their op kitten.

Warrior = too much sustain for the mad burst.
Thief = way too much sustain and evasion for the mad dps. It warps the game and is way too good.
Mesmer = too much invuln whilst they pump out passive condis.

My proposals:
Reduce pulmonary impact damage by 25%. Passive dps should not be so good when thief has a spammable insta cast ranged interrupt. Like really…
The shield block on mesmer needs fixing to not slow the enemy, it does way too much
Mesmer distortion is too long in duration. Increase cooldowm to 1 minute.
warrior is annoying. Reduce the damage of greatsword whirl by 25% and also f1 mace should not apply blind and 3 stacks of bleed not 4

these are minor nerfs. But they will help for fairness.

All of this is fine if we can shave a second of scythe AA chill and slightly tone down deathly chill damage. Necros proc it by breathing.

(:y)

Not that I agree with OP at all, but not really sure what you are talking about. There is no chill on scythe auto attack chain, as far as I remember only two random auto procs apply chill (one in spite, one in reaper), and Deathly Chill applies a single stack of bleeding. Maybe I just missed the sarcasm?

I don’t think his build has enough boon generation to make any meaningful use of Blighter’s Boon, so he is probably better off with Deathly Chill.

Well I doubt I’ll see 1700 this season, so I would need someone at 1700 to post their numbers for me.

Lol, you’ll get in more trouble for calling him out on the forums than he will for afk’ing matches.

Cynz.9437:

Medex.1504:

Chilli.2976:

Show ranks at the end of the game.

Thats kinda pointles with the new ranking system, since its division based (bronze vs bronze, silver vs silver, …), and it does not help during a match.

The problem is at the start of the match and “pro” players raging during the match, so ranks at the end of the game …. well you get the picture.

They wouldn’t do it – it would show glaring issue with matchmaking. If you are not lazy, ask your teammates and enemies what rating they are (or check LBs if you are high enough) – you would be amazed of HOW actually broken matchmaking is.

Yeah, I’ve been looking in to this situation for awhile now. I wouldn’t say matchmaking is completely broken, but it definitely has some flaws that are causing issues during low population times. You can check out some of the results I’ve posted so far in the thread below.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/Matchmaking-Question-3/page/2#post6454077

Lol, a simple mention of Guardian and Legiion is in here foaming at the mouth in defense mode.

The post was worded fine, he listed a couple of professions that were included in the patch followed by “etc”, insinuating he didn’t want to list them all, and then listed three professions that received no attention at all and is apparently curious as to why this is.

Anything extra you pull from that simple post is all on you.

To answer your question though OP, Anet never really gave a reason. Apparently this was just some stuff they had the time to work on and wanted to go ahead and push out, which actually wouldn’t be a bad thing if we got little patches like this more frequently.

Jaxom.7310:

9 comments in… no white knights, wha is happeninginging!!!

Oh, sorry. Ahem, SKULL GRINDER IS PERFECTLY FINE, YOU NOOBS NEED TO LEARN HOW TO PLAY!!!! #GITGUD.

1) Can only happen if they disable class swapping before a match, but I’m all for that.

2) Completely agree, but it needs to be pure solo queue and pure 5v5 team queue. With proper rewards with an emphasis on Team Queue, population issues could decrease. Also, telling players they can’t queue as a team with their friends/guild and enjoy decent competition because their queue times will be too long isn’t really logical. There are many people that are willing to wait for better matches, and many more that would be willing to play Team Queue if it offered exclusive rewards (we’ve already seen this happen with pvp in general).

3) We’re pretty close to being there, Anet seems to be slowly working towards this.

6) The only issues I have with the reward system is that it shouldn’t reward anything if you lose. The only thing this accomplishes is give players a benefit to afk’ing.

I love skull grinder. I get hit with it and Warrior is all like “how does that feel?”

I transfer back like “I don’t know, you tell me.”

Then he like “pft, I have resistance.”

Then I’m like, “Resistance? Don’t you mean chill and bleeding?”

Then he’s like, “That’s ok, I have more resistance.”

Then I feel bad for him cause I don’t think he understands how this is about to go down. Lol.

In all seriousness though, yeah it is a bit over the top to be doing all that in just one hit. Was a poor way to give Warriors a condi build.

BigKev.1927:

Shaogin.2679:

BigKev.1927:

Shaogin.2679:

Geez, you’re just like Anet, leave the Necros out of your balance patch. ;-P

Necros:

Each mark also gives 10 stacks of confusion, and can hit through dodge rolls and invulns

That about sums it up

You’re such a classist. Us Necros are more that just fragile condi bombs. Give the power some love. ^.^

My appologies

necro:

make axe 2 hit in an aoe with 1200 range. also full life force on a successful hit. Also it automatically spawns a lich on all 3 points

Lmao. I love you.

Yeah, played Druid quite a bit and definitely always had a hard time with condi builds. You just wait for them to drop celestial avatar then condi bomb them.

On Scrapper, it is hard to fight against boon corrupt and heavy condi builds as well.

On Reaper, ranged power builds and heavy cc gives me the most problems.

Not experienced enough with the rest.

Gamble.4580:

Why it’s equal and fare if you skilled you move up.

It’s that moving up process that is chaos. Everything from elite pros to complete noobs all in a match together, and matchmaker having no idea which is which so it has no idea how to split the teams.

If they ever do that I’ll just play Unranked for the first month and wait for the chaos to settle. The one bright side, the forums will be very entertaining, more so than usual.

When I’m on my Necro, I love coming across a lone Engi. Really, I just love fighting any boon-heavy class. I’m all like, that’s some nice boons you have there, aaaaaaaaaaand now you have aids. ;-P

Gamble.4580:

Everyone should of started Bronze and grinder up and started in that division next season.

Sure, if you just love chaos.

BigKev.1927:

Shaogin.2679:

Geez, you’re just like Anet, leave the Necros out of your balance patch. ;-P

Necros:

Each mark also gives 10 stacks of confusion, and can hit through dodge rolls and invulns

That about sums it up

You’re such a classist. Us Necros are more that just fragile condi bombs. Give the power some love. ^.^

Medex.1504:

But that will not change their minds that it was “noob” players fault.

Nothing will ever change that for some people. Doesn’t mean we should not implement a useful tool.

Starbreaker.6507:

Shaogin.2679:

You’re the first person I’ve seen complain about the map all season. And it did actually go through a beta period and many changes ges were made due to player feedback. Where have you been man?

God the old one was so awful with multiple trap DH/Necros on the opposing team.

All in all I don’t mind how it is now, except somehow I once got feared off the laser pad and died from it

Lol, I used to troll hard with Engineer on the original Skyhammer map.

I also really enjoy the new map though.

Yeah, definitely agree with Blighter’s Boon. Make sure your opponents are chilled, then throw up RS 3 and spam auto attacks and enjoy watching your health climb back up.

If you are having issues with Life Force generation, consider taking Spectral Shroud for your stun break. It grants protection to reduce damage and generates alot of Life Force when you are being focused. Also works while in shroud.

Medex.1504:

Chilli.2976:

Show ranks at the end of the game.

Thats kinda pointles with the new ranking system, since its division based (bronze vs bronze, silver vs silver, …), and it does not help during a match.

The problem is at the start of the match and “pro” players raging during the match, so ranks at the end of the game …. well you get the picture.

Well actually showing mmr at the end of the match would be a great tool to understand how the match was set up. Could also show people that they were not match with complete noobs like they think they were.

Geez, you’re just like Anet, leave the Necros out of your balance patch. ;-P

You’re the first person I’ve seen complain about the map all season. And it did actually go through a beta period and many changes ges were made due to player feedback. Where have you been man?

Speaking of the power reaper build, you also have to consider that some of it’s survival comes from blighter’s boon. With strength runes and a strength sigil, I can go into Reaper Shroud, hit RS 5 on point for aoe chill, then RS 3 for pulsing stability, and then spam RS 1 for quite of bit of might generation (I stay at 25 stacks of might) and usually recover about half of my health from blighter’s boon before exiting Reaper Shroud.

Silly me, I can see number of games played, so I guess I can try to incorporate that to see if I get similar results to mm to see if it is a factor.

Sounds like you’re getting killed by a burn guard. Main thing you should do, stop hitting them while they are blocking (not sure why you would do that anyways). After that, dodge the blue fireball they throw, they light themselves on fire first and can get this ability from a proc as well but you should have plenty of dodges as Thief. Lastly, burn guard cover conditions come from melee weapon swaps most the time, so you shouldn’t have any issue successfully cleansing the burn with every cleanse used (it is one of burn guard’s major weaknesses).

I agree that some classes need condi application tuned down, but burn guard is not one of them.

Xca.9721:

Shaogin.2679:

Sounds like to me people want all these extra features implemented to simulate being part of a team.

• Class stacking
• Lack of communication
• Bad teammates

All issues that would not have to exist if we just had a 5v5 only Team Queue, which is insanely easier to implement than an in game voice chat, which opens up a whole new avenue of trolling. Why keep creating more and more problems in the game trying to make Solo Queue work, when Team Queue is the logical answer.

Most competitive games have a voice function and not everyone has a team to play with. + the q times would me much higher

The Queue times would be much higher is a horrible excuse. There has never, and I mean never, been a 5v5 only Team Queue. There has also never been any incentive from Anet (such as rewards) to even attempt to get people interested in Team Queue. Yes, Queue times would be higher than the current Solo Queue, but would provide better quality matches. Now how much higher queue times would be would depend on how anet implements Team Queue.

Also, this is gw2, not most other competitive games. Voice chat is made easily possible through 3rd party software, which you could easily organize on a team. Also, not everyone has a team to play with because not everyone has ever lifted a finger to even attempt to find a team to play with.