I will get much more Protection from Beyond the Veil and Speed of Shadows.
And no, I won’t take Chilling Darkness and worst well we currently have (aside from WoB) to get 2s of Chill I get from Dark Path and Chillbains anyway.
And Plague Sending is just best in tier.
I was talking in general not specifics to your build. There are people who will use those trait combinations.
Vampiric Rituals….Meh, I don’t use Wells. I don’t like them, aside from WoP in some situations. They’re too much about just damage.
Considering it allows you to give aoe protection its not bad. Also if you, for god know what reason, took chilling dark over plague sending you can use well of darkness to grant protection, blind+chill(+vulnerability if traited) and siphon health. Can be a game changer.
@Stilgar
You do realise shoutbow and d/d ele using cele amulet will be weaker than now because of the condi changes and no stats from traitlines right.
Yet they put Master of Corruption to compete the choice between Terror and path of corruption. Way to kill Condition Necro more. Now unless some new synergy comes out, Condition Necro would be stuck with a 30 CD heal (which is already the most easily interruptable heal in the current meta) and gg.
Or, you know, you can take blood magic for blood bond and gain like 3k hp 15s or so and if you traited it you corrupt boons and gain might.
The only real nerf is to consume conditions. Pretty much everything else is a huge improvement.
What about plague and lich? plague is practically unusable for condi buids.
I’m off the opinion the changes to those two aren’t that bad. Especially not bad enough to ignore the new things we now have and they even. They still have synergy with a wide variety of builds.
Anybody with a ranged weapon is going to hard counter reapers.
The new greatsword will be worthless, because you’ll never get close enough to generate life force. Also you’ll never get your chill off, because autoattack 3 disappears if you don’t quickly use it.
Same argument can be made for dagger. It’s also a melee weapon.
SoV currently has 1s ICD not per target, but in general. That’s why even if it’s somehow okay in 1v1, it totally drops the ball in anything else.
And since our Siphons are balanced for and meant to be played in fights bigger than 1v1, it makes little sense.
It’s per player. Used it on a world boss this is what happened:
“I see the buff come up, 8 charges left. Poof.”
“I see the buff come up, 6 charges left. Poof.”
I didn’t even get to see the charges shred down like I do in a group.
Also, SoV isn’t “per target”, it’s “per player.” If you’ve been trying to use Minions as players then that’s probably the source of your misinformation.
I think he means its passive heal on yourself. It will only trigger once per second no matter how many people are hitting you.
I have been testing vamp signet after the notes and i had some great success with it. It lets you do some crazy things. The builds i run will also only be getting much MUCH stronger due to the patch.
But there are some new combos for the new CC spell aren’t there? Especially with the new trait to get one more condition for the cd reduction. There is a new trait, with 3 or more conditions on you your next critical hit will send your conditions to the opponent.
So heal yourself, activate another corruption skill and attack for sending those conditions to the opponent.
And it cant miss because the trait needs a crit to activate the signet so will always transfer.
Most of the QQers are some combination of 1. Not even attempting to take the changes in context, 2. Totally ignoring the super strong traits we received, along with how Reaper will change this, and/or 3. Only focused on the negative things about our changes while citing positive things about other professions.
Pretty much this. We now have so many cool things to play with, far more sustain than before too.
since the changes i have been messing with signet, its not BAD just needs tweeks. It would benefit from cant happen more than x times in yseconds from chilling nova and the lack of condi clear would be covered by plague sending and lower cooldown of plague signet.
Edit: Necro now have a lot of non heal sustain via blood magic and blood bond heal every 15(12)s, spiteful renewal , vampiric and vampiric presence healing you like 60~90 per attack. Lots of healing around.
With the trait changes, a normal death shroud is looking the better option
This would entirely depend on the build you are aiming for.
Soul Reaping is actually a very good diverse line that you can use both for survivability and damage. But 300hp worth of life force a second is hardly a good enough reason on its own to invest in Soul Reaping in PvE, since life force generation is so over the top in this game mode that you barely should have any problem managing your life force pool without this trait.
I’m kinda sad that I have to choose between Fear of Death and Vital Persistence in PvP.
If my particular build is only in that trait line for one trait, there’s a problem.
So by this logic if i wanted to go into a line for just one trait that my build needed but i didnt want anything else thats a problem?
Just sounds like " I cant have all the cake and eat it" QQ not going to lie.
Don’t Lyssa Runes also convert conditions to boons?
That gives great access to boon conversion to anybody with a low cooldown elite.
Ouch. Every 45 seconds converting chill stacks into resistance. However I assure you a thief with a 30 second chill becoming a 30 second alacrity is far worse.
I think it just turns into the boon for the set duration not a copy of the duration. any length of chill turns into only 2s of resistance
Potential damage mods available:
Unholy Fervor 10%
Spiteful Talisman 5%
CtD 20% below 50% bp
Strength of Undeath 5%
Scholar Runes 10%
Vulnerability 25%
Force Rune 5%
Around 210% damage easily in pve.
Also easy 20 stacks of might on a target below 50%. Not a bad set of very easily attained damage mods for pve.
Idk what I’m missing but that’s 180% and only under ideal scenarios.
Either way. I honestly think the condition changes will allow us to some-what make working hybrids in pve. I won’t stop until I make it work… Except I might try flame legion instead if the math is there. I have never really done pve Dps calculations, only PvP. So that will be something to toy with.
Well they are all multiplicative so its:
100*1.1*1.05*1.2*1.05*1.1*1.25*1.05 =210
or if you replace scholar with strength runes its:
100*1.1*1.05*1.2*1.05*1.05*1.25*1.05 =200
With might and food you can easily reach around 3450~3700 power on your own in pve.
not by itself no, but i feel like i get more from spite (which would be the only one i would think of switching out). especially because it’s quite handy to use before scepter 3.
Its the only one with an aoe. With the trait its very powerful for removal and healing. The radius increase to 600 means its far more likely to hit % targets now aswell. Maybeon a condi build you would get more from spite but you wont bnefi from the power opposed to the increased move speed allowing you to get around faster, especially with your lack of horn. May be beneficial to try it out.
what do you mean with signet of the locust? the signet in general or is there a trait that i didn’t see that procs it? the reason i didn’t take locust in my utility choice is because i felt like the other signets were stronger in comparison.
It would have a 24s cooldown, trike a potential 5 targets, heal you for 1.4k hp for each struck and corrupt two boons on each struck target. Its not a weak signet by anymeans.
This is pretty much the exact same build i came up with. People were to angry to reply to my thread though. Lots of trait synergy, Lesser vamp signet is like 12~15s so very good on that and just the build should work wonders.
Edit:
Its protected vs condi spikes by plague sending as well.
You have these options:
Locust 30(24)s – ( AoE boon removal and up to 7k heal )
Lesser Vamp 15(12)s – leech proc and extra boon removal on low cooldown
Plague+Plague sending 30(24) – 5 condi transfer and 2 boon corrupt
No icd confirmed. Functionally identical in this case just means it’s the same but also a seperate skill from the dagger’s so it woudn’t interact with Quickening Thirst.
Wow, no icd on Enfeeble, that’s pretty awesome. I was leaving options open for another trait line but this kinda seals the deal for Curses for me. Which means every 7 seconds if traited, we get to go into DS and aoe weakness. Solid.
The trait can proc itself it it crits for 13s of weakness every 10s. 100% uptime ftom a single trait.
To be fair, we could just corrupt resistance back into chill. But I do agree, it seems a little insane to make chill convert to…that.
Are you sure we can convert resistance back to chill, I got the feeling it is like “invul” and cant be stripped? If it can be then I agree, not a big deal.
Yeah it’s a boon definitely corruptable, only immunity is against the conditions themselves.
This makes me wonder, will they change berserker stance to instead use resistance?
All siphons have been increased by base 20%. With this trait you will self siphon for around 70 a hit. It’s slightly lower than the 90 you can get nke but it doesn’t depend on critting for VP. It actually increases the amount you can siphon. Also we don’t know if they have been buffed or not and how well their effects now scale with power and healing power.
Siphon damage cannot be mitigates unless it’s by an ability than makes you invulnerable. You can still damage targets who use signet of stone of endure pain.
linnael i got ur point its understandable but pls say me why i should spend even a single thought about going into curses in a pve power build after the damage multiplier is gone, the on crit proc is gone. the warhorn trait is gone and our main dps increase are wells which u can get from blood magic. curses does not grant precision anymore so why?
Weakening shroud and Chilling Darkness are 2 of the best traits necro has. Path of Corruption is just as good on a power build, and the fury/crit chance per condition are better than precision by far.
I’m having a hard time seeing why you would not want to go curses.
I think he was on about a pve power build where those two skills currently wont do anything at all for a pve power build.
A quick comment because I’m just half way through the podcast:
Carrion will still be a lot better than rabid.
Rabid will get a bigger bonus on Target the Weak and the additional sources of healing traits will give you a better healing effectivness against direct damage, but the fact remains: life force scales with vitality and lf regen is percentage based. This and the fact that conditions in general might be more potent in PvP will still give Carrion a better overall defense.
As for damage: power>precision.
wtf??
I might be wrong but right now LF doesnt scale with vitality anymore.. and I dint read anything about this coming back. or did the mention that??
because right now I’m pretty sure LF doesnt scale with vitaliry at all nice we got about idk 10-13k LF in pvp? back in the times as it still scaled we had no problems getting 18-20k LF
I might be wrong though..
LF is 60% f you Hp pool as a base or 78% with full Soul Reaping line. Robert even mentioned how we get extra LF after the changes which we do. We get an extra 1.35% Max LF compared to now.
Go test it in pvp. Put on a settlers amulet and full blood magic, you will have around 30k hp and 24k LF.
Except now the more common condition-boon gives you resistance off of chill so not only do profession convert some conditions to boons, but they also can get additional immunity to conditions after that conversion.
I still think people are over reacting because the skills that turn conditions into boons are low in number. Only Classes can do it. Engi, Guard and Necro.
Elixir C + Toss Elixir C
Well of Power
Contemplation of Purity
Transmute
Purity of Voice
Fumigate
Only 2 of these guarantee its conversion. Purity of voice also has the downside of it mostly turns 1 condition into 3 boons ( coverts 1 and grants 2 ) giving you more targets for things to convert and decent counter play.
The only thing i took from it was about the new siphon aura " it does about as much as vampiric now" so that means that the other siphon traits got a boost?
I dont see this one in particular as an issue. Most of the other things are stuff thats on point.
That’s a really painful nerf to terrormancer because the boon removal was somewhat vital to the usefulness of terror, and combined with everything else we’re losing, this is too much.
Well, and it breaks a play style which is something they had originally said they wanted to avoid, which is why I added it to the list.
Still dont see it an an issue rather a choice between different play styles since specific boon hate can be an actual build. I never seen the boon removal as “vital” to the build. My opinion.
A build that is completely devoted to being anti boon is more or less a niche counterbuild that is not very amazing when it can be done alongside many other things on more generalized build, such as terrormancer, which currently has really good anti boon on top of being able to deal with things that are not boon heavy, like some warriors.
There are new builds opening up that are antiboon while doing many other things and are very generalized. Just going to agree to disagree and see what people say tuesday. I am going to bet tunes change.
Also on terror i expect its scaling to change else its going to be weaker in comparison after the changes.
Those endurance traits have never stacked with vigor, no reason why they should start stacking now. The nerf to vigor is good though, it’s just way to strong as it is now.
In comparison its far more accessible than alacrity and also on a wider range of classes where as alacrity is just on chronomancer. 6/9 Classes have access to quickness, some far more than others.
If other classes could generate alacrity or it came in higher durations i would agree but with the way it is i think its fine as an effect.
I dont see this one in particular as an issue. Most of the other things are stuff thats on point.
That’s a really painful nerf to terrormancer because the boon removal was somewhat vital to the usefulness of terror, and combined with everything else we’re losing, this is too much.
Well, and it breaks a play style which is something they had originally said they wanted to avoid, which is why I added it to the list.
Still dont see it an an issue rather a choice between different play styles since specific boon hate can be an actual build. I never seen the boon removal as “vital” to the build. My opinion.
I don’t understand why Alacrity, the exact opposite of chill, wasn’t made a boon with conversions being between alacrity and chill. It makes no sense.
If that was to be the case it would have to be as widely accessible as chill is. Its not, which is why its an effect.
There is 1 phantasm that grants 1s of it and one well which grants 3s as long as you stand in it. Shatter skills do grant alacrity but only to the chronomancer.
Its easy to see why its an effect not a boon.
The only skill that you really have to watch is CoP. Everything else its a around a 1 in 5 or 1in 7 chance it will be converted, They have to take that master trait locking them out of others and it wastes a cooldown, if you corrupt it again then it goes back to chill and we have several corruption abilities most of which are on shorter cooldowns than their shouts.
Its actually not that big of a deal as OP makes out and we have counter play to the counterplay so no issue.
if you have no precision at all and you spec into curses you still get 10% if the target has 5 condis on.. then I have never seen before any tank necro with on crit proc sigills whithout any precision equipped..
then if anyone would he would get his procs once every 15s with that fury what is very ineffective.
if ppl wanna spec for crits they simply go soulreaping and equip deathly perception bc it goves you more. I even think the should put the precision to soulreaping just bc of this trait
And what 10% should just be enough and that’s it? Whether you like it or not its the critical strikes line so fury fits fine. Going for 14 to 34% give you better chance to proc things and not everything had a low cooldown. Plague sending is on 30s got example and other on crit abilities have ICDs. It gives builds who want to build tanky and lack perc a chance to make use of abilities that would other be hard to use.
" simply spec SR ad take DP" how about if they don’t want that line or want a different GM from that line? Again whether you like it or not, if it fits your build or not, if it curses is the crit line and it should have options for people who want to crit. Fury fors that just fine. You dislike of fury in the line is, for lack of better words, narrow minded.
Your changes and dislike of the minor cator specifically to condi and specifically to your condi build. It completely disregards the current trait positioning for a wider amount of builds, for which there can now be many, that harmonise perfectly fine with the way it has been shown to us.
I think its fine as it is. Furious demise is also fine because it helps both builds as it is. The way it is now it has options and combinations for all condi builds instead of specifically terror builds and still has great options for power builds.
I dont understand your dislike for fury though.
fury doesnt help a condi build at all.. during that 5 seconds it gives you at max. 3 more crits (I can show you the math if needed).. good in a power spec but in a condi with almost no critdamage and power it procs 1-2 additional bleeds.. that is literally nothing. and since this line is focused on Condi (I didnt say dedicated..) that fury should either be moved to somewhere it serves builds better, for example with the DS recharge.
or you leave furious demise there but merge it with something but just alone the 5s of fury dont benefit a condimancer at all
I like fury a lot, but not in a condi spec, its simply missplaced there
Sigil of Torment
Plague Sending
Weakening Shroud
Sigil of Blood
Sigil of Rage
Sigil of Generosity
Sigil of Strenght
Sigil of Nullification
Sigil of Earth
etc etc
Fits perfectly fine. There are builds, both power and condi that will make good use of the fury and the extra crit chance. Also the line is condi and critical strikes, not just condi. Fury makes perfect sense.
About the Sigills,
anybody who equips those is gonna use some precision stat to trigger them, just triggering them all 15 seconds with that fury isnt effective at all.
additionally post update everybody who uses curse line is gonna equip some precision stuff since 13% is getting convertet to condi damage (Minor3)
fury helps mainly a power build so why not move it to a power-focused line and give the condimancers a useful minor?
So any build condi or other wise shouldn’t be able to take less precision and build tankier and get the crit chance they need to proc the traits from the line that specialises in critical strikes?
Not everybody taking the line will build precision nor will anybody looking to proc on crit abilities. What’s to say people who want extra critical strike chance from speccing into the line that specialises in it shouldn’t gain any? Just because it doesn’t fit for you and your builds doesn’t mean it doesn’t fit for other people and theirs. Carrion spite condi builds, settler blood magic condi builds are two off the top of my head.
Weakening shroud is anything but weak. 50%+ upimr in weakness is huge. Weakness has 50% to fumble and -50% endurance regen. If the vigor changes are true it completely counters it.
Didnt say it in the other threat but MoC isnt “really” usable by a power spec.
not really usable yes, but it helps a little bit just like Spinal Shivers or the in the would help a condi a little bit.
but spite is a power focused line and curses is focused on condi so it cannot and shouldn’t provide amazing support for power specs..
the main focus should be to improve Condi builds or am I wrong?
and @Lily yes you are right the Terrormancer needs to be adressed by Anet but its main problem is in the Soul Reaping Line.. the Idea of merging fear of death with terror sounds pretty amazing =)
Condi + critical strikes. You keep forgetting the other half of the line. Also on terrormancer, there are builds on other classes that have been changed in the exact same way what makes terror any different? You guys make it sound like the only condi spec that there will be.
I think its fine as it is. Furious demise is also fine because it helps both builds as it is. The way it is now it has options and combinations for all condi builds instead of specifically terror builds and still has great options for power builds.
I dont understand your dislike for fury though.
fury doesnt help a condi build at all.. during that 5 seconds it gives you at max. 3 more crits (I can show you the math if needed).. good in a power spec but in a condi with almost no critdamage and power it procs 1-2 additional bleeds.. that is literally nothing. and since this line is focused on Condi (I didnt say dedicated..) that fury should either be moved to somewhere it serves builds better, for example with the DS recharge.
or you leave furious demise there but merge it with something but just alone the 5s of fury dont benefit a condimancer at all
I like fury a lot, but not in a condi spec, its simply missplaced there
Sigil of Torment
Plague Sending
Weakening Shroud
Sigil of Blood
Sigil of Rage
Sigil of Generosity
Sigil of Strenght
Sigil of Nullification
Sigil of Earth
etc etc
Fits perfectly fine. There are builds, both power and condi that will make good use of the fury and the extra crit chance. Also the line is condi and critical strikes, not just condi. Fury makes perfect sense.
Its a massive nerf. Resistance now has no chance of being first to convert. As in it will sometimes convert and sometimes it wont. Basically all our corruption skills and traits will sometimes not work at all. This change effectively kills all boon conversion traits and skill for the next 3 years. As in it kills necro for the next 3 years. This is because the only good thing necro does is boon conversion. Now we have traits and utilities which will be totally unrealible because mostly they will not work at all. You will often use corrupt boon and not actually put any conditions on the target due to resistance. It is a complete and utter disaster for necro. Devs dont understand necro so they dont realise as usual.
Our only unique thing, boon conversion, has been deleted by this news. Resistance should always convert first. This will NEVER happen now. As in this change will not be made till another expansion. The result is trash tier for necro for at least 3 more years
You do realise we have more boon hate than ever before right?
I think its fine as it is. Furious demise is also fine because it helps both builds as it is. The way it is now it has options and combinations for all condi builds instead of specifically terror builds and still has great options for power builds. There are far more build options in there now than before.
Would people stop complaining if master of corruptions was like :
Master of Corruption: Reduces recharge of corruption skills by 33% but causes corruption skills to apply additional conditions to you when cast. (Condition applied varies per skill.) Corrupting a Boon converts a condition of yourself. ( Insert ICD here)
While still strong you are a little off on the spite minor. It has a 1sec icd not a 1sec icd per opponent so you would only get 2 might max per swing no matter how many guys you cleave.
The reaper auto still takes over 2s and will still have 3 attacks so one auto chain will give you a ax of 7 stacks of might. Having maximum might after a few auto chains is immense. Its also even faster if you make use of chilling force.
So that will be something to toy with.