Guild Wars 2

Tom Gore.4035:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Tom Gore.4035:

If you are losing money in WvW you are doing it wrong. Really wrong.

Meaning, you aren’t running in a Zergball.

If you buy upgrades, scout, small havoc, camp flips, make improved siege, you are losing gold anyway, and repair costs just add to it.

This attitude kills wvw, kills most individualism in game, kills addressing real issues.
One way or the highway does this game more harm than anything else, and it is really bad that it seems to be the semi official Anet policy as well.

If you think money is the reason people run in the zergball you need to take a reality check.

Loot bags. Reality Check Accomplished. Most reward for least effort. Follow the dorito.
It may not be the “reason” they run in the ball, but it is the only way to gain coin while playing wvw.

Sube Dai.8496:

Yeh we could really use a few more medium coats too.

Not enough medium coats to choose from atm.

Perhaps a few….. I dunno… Trenchcoats??

Seriously, how did making Ranger skirts and Tunics become a lost art?

Tom Gore.4035:

If you are losing money in WvW you are doing it wrong. Really wrong.

Meaning, you aren’t running in a Zergball.

If you buy upgrades, scout, small havoc, camp flips, make improved siege, you are losing gold anyway, and repair costs just add to it.

This attitude kills wvw, kills most individualism in game, kills addressing real issues.
One way or the highway does this game more harm than anything else, and it is really bad that it seems to be the semi official Anet policy as well.

Crazylegsmurphy.6430:

I realize that everyone has different ideas of what would be cool and such, but for me swimwear in GW2 is a waste of time.

The amount of effort to put swimwear in the game far exceeds it’s practical use. Sure, there are a few people who will buy the outfits and stand on the beach for a laugh, but in reality these “gimmicks” have a short life.

I am also personally against the idea of modern swimwear in the game. Whenever I go to Southsun Cove, and see tourists wearing modern style swim suits, it breaks immersion. It has been said a few times that IF swimwear was to be added, it should be old timey style.

Search for 1900’s – 1920’s swimwear in Google for an idea of what I mean. I think it would better fit the look and feel of GW2.

In the end though, I would like to see them put more effort into proper town clothing, and leave the modern swimsuit to Second Life

5 minutes in LA should be telling you that the “immersion” ship sailed long ago, and won’t be coming back.

Dawdler.8521:

HiSaZuL.2843:

they either super carebear shiny(all they are missing is rainbow vomit)

Come join the dark fabulous side.

Nice image of what has gone horribly wrong with the art direction in this game.

“just collecting achievements” in GW1.

Never played it, did you.

Stealth isn’t the problem. The ability to reset any wvw pvp encounter is.

No regen or heal in stealth would go a long ways towards fixing this. Or better yet, no in-combat stealth at all.

Otherwise, this thread is a rehash of years of stealth complaints from every game that allows them to reset, and rogues/whatever insisting it is all about “skillz”

There are so many games where rogue is “unload, reset, rinse and repeat till the crits kill” Same old stuff, different game.

Vayne.8563:

If Guild Wars 1 was half the game Guild Wars 2 is, more people might still be playing it.

Oh. Really. Last release for GW1 was EOTN, in 2007. For 4plus years, GW1 soldiered on with no added major content, making enough money to help fund the making of GW2. People bought GW1 knowing that there were no plans to expand it further, and still do. GW1 is still up and running, now 5 plus years with no expansion or campaign.

I think we all get that you hated GW1. Fine. But snotty statements like the one above are unjustified and petty. I cannot imagine very many MMOs, including this one, that could survive.. and still be running… 5 years after the last major content expansion and announcement that there would be no more.

You delight in bashing a game that was basically put on minimum life support to make this one, and then blame the game? If it was “half” the game this one is, it would have never survived, and yet, it did and does.

Quite honestly, I can imagine the number crunchers at ANET/NCsoft are praying that GW2 is half the game GW1 is in terms of customer loyalty and longevity.

Middzz.1490:

You wonder why FA or parts of give the server an unsavoury reputation ……ask the Dolak parade .Well announced in advance well attended SOS TC .Peacefull bit of fun ..
so 2 guild FA or part of attack the parade repeatedly .

Can do it yes …was neccesary no ..it simply displays again a rather poor attitude .

It is a pvp zone. If you want to safely RP, try Divinity’s Reach.

I started this game aware of my limitations and dislikes, and knowing some things were either not within my reach or my tastes. I have a severe motor skills handicap, serious Rhuematiod Arthritus in my hands and finger joints.

I’ve played many MMOs with this condition. I assumed I would be able to explore, and do most content save JPs. As time went on, I found that world completion..on my own..is impossible since they made some vista and skill points only possible by JP. I find myself increasingly locked out of more Living Story by JP inclusion. I have given up on both World Exploration and Living Story because of JPs, and also mandated 5man grouping. So.. a lot of stuff to do..gone. Because of the 5man mandate for Personal Story, that has also been abandoned. More gone for me.

In every game I have enjoyed the challenge of taking out harder content solo, and perhaps gaining a reward for doing so. For example.. in GW1 there was always the chance of that Unique from a boss, and a better chance the more you handicapped yourself by smaller group size. Well, here I found the challenge of taking on Champions is a “fun once” thing..no point after doing it one time, as I need no porous bone or blue junk, if it drops that much. More things to do lost.

I thought I would enjoy DEs. I did, but soon learned that again, what is the point. It is less a DE and more of a timed “kill ten rats” and any change you make is very temporary and meaningless. I find myself running past DEs out of sheer apathy, just another repeatable kill 10 rats for a poor reward.

I enjoy making Alts. I have 8 level 80s and a 53. If content is really enjoyable, I have run all my alts through it. Example.. I did Battle for LA, the whole WIK line, on 14 characters in GW1. Here, its by acct for most Living Story and achievements. Do it once, its done for the acct. Sure, I could redo some parts, but to what end. The reward is done, just going through the motions. More content lost for me.

I discovered WvW and pursued that, enjoyed it, till the hard reality of zoom hacks sunk in. Then the new matching system put the nail in the coffin for that. And now, even less to do.

I’ve even lost the desire to do dailies. I would trade Laurels for t6 mats, I have a lot of crafting to do with 8 80s. Now, with crafting going to 500, why bother. Also, the Achievement rewards left me cold. I thought it would be a token system, to allow choice in what I earned with MY achievements. No, I get a box of mostly junk, gear and buffs for sPvP which I have never done, useless consumables, skins with horrific art, etc. I’ve deleted most of it. I don’t care if I don’t earn any more of it

So here I am. I log in daily, I harvest Ori, I talk to my friend, I log out. And play GW1, because, I have things to do there even after 5 years of play.

I’ve commented before, the small thing I really noticed was how the little berries, grapes, etc disappear from the bush after harvesting. A pretty neat little detail.

You forgot a jumping puzzle or two, a trip to the SAB, and 5 uses of the Mystic Forge and crafting something. Ya know, grander, and something for everyone.

Group required for all, of course.

And I love love people who always know what the Developer intentions are, and can speak for them. It must take a big load off the real Developers.

Vayne.8563:

Slaunyeh.9852:

Khairos.3890:

It’s an MMO, you have to expect group content.

There’s a difference between “Our MMO has group content” and “all new content will be grouping-exclusive.”

I don’t think anyone’s shocked that GW2 has group content.

But all new content hasn’t been group exclusive. SAB isn’t. Everything in the three months of Flame and Frost is soloable, including the 2 new instances. Guilds need stuff to do, particularly larger ones, because there was so little large guild stuff in the game. What you basically had was WvW and that’s it. Dungeon parties are limited to 5.

So because there was a serious lack of big group content and Anet threw in some desperately needed guild stuff, the soloers are complaining.

Most of this game, almost the entire game is soloable. The open world is huge and soloable. But every single upgrade isn’t going to be for the soloers. SAB was. Everything in Flame and Frost so far is.

It’s one thing to want solo content. It’s another thing to object when other groups get content for them.

How on earth did you pull Guild content into this, and who, in this thread was complaining about guild content? I’m used to you pulling unrelated rabbits out of your Anet Defense Helmet, but sometimes it is just ludicrous.

Secondly, this is about the storyline dungeon. That did not have to be group only. It won’t add that much to group content, and afaik, won’t be permanent.

You keep pointing out Flame and Frost, so far, is soloable. Yes. Way to not get the point.

But Carry on. You will have 5 responses to this, and then derail the thread in some other argument over having to be always right.

lothefallen.7081:

In my opinion and based on experiences, i would state the problem as such:

-Proper Reward based on time investment.
-Depth of the engagement
-Depth of player interaction

World events (taking this as an example because i don’t think people roam the living world to just seek out events or hearts unless they are grinding completion or levels.) are basically the longevity that non- instanced pve content has to offer seeing as karma is near useless and events are a waste of time considering reward.

Now, take into account, most people playing this game are far from imbeciles (most). If you are playing a game for fun, what is more engaging as a player? (One of many examples that could be given to show content disparity)

(Choose an option)

1. Hitting Jormag from a safespot with 1 on auto-attack while you microwave a pizza and balance your checkbook for a free guaranteed rare?

or

2. Being fully engaged in a fight like Gigantus Lupicus where your team mates rely on you in a very active manner, second to second, to see victory?

The point is, there is more room to design instanced PvE content with depth and group engagement than the world bosses and otherwise shallow PvE content. You’re not going to get the same depth accent to the skill system or combat mechanics in a huge loot pinata zerg that requires no thought or planning as you would in a dungeon that is specifically designed to do the opposite.

[IMO] GW1 was able to pull off a very high level of engagement and challenge by making nearly everything in the game instanced. I for one, while i do like the open world, feel that the depth of that game mode is just peanuts in comparison to group content. I really see dungeons as the endgame content this game has to offer considering people only just stomp around the living world otherwise. I’d welcome more development to the open world, but honestly i just think the player base at large is just more engaged by instanced content considering it actually takes mental exertion.

You forgot an option. Option 3, I could uninstall and return to Everquest2, and duo 5 man content with my SK and my friends Inq. More dungeons, better dungeons, and dedicated healers. IF I wanted to do dungeons, that is exactly what I would do.

I started playing GW1 to escape forced pugs and forced groups. I bought this game with the same expectation. If they feel they need to force 5 man instancing then they have bought back into the the “everymmo” mindset, and frankly, I can go back to one that has done that longer, better, and with a lot more variety and depth to them. And, built in VOIP and a working LFG along with particle spam graphic settings.

Heck, Everquest even has Player designed Dungeons. But, I don’t want to do Dungeons.

The game needs to play to it’s strengths. DE is one of them.

And re Jormag, standing in that safe spot, which BTW, I’ve not seen, is your choice. I run around, clear pillars, pull the champs off the golums, rez people, and when I get time plink at the dragon. If you run it AFK, that was your choice. You cheapened the encounter, not Anet.

Krosslite.1950:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Krosslite.1950:

per Colin Johanson:

“Open world online games are always strongest when players are encouraged and rewarded to interact as a community, to support other each other, and when the flow of the game ushers players to go places where they run into other players across all levels and have shared experiences.”

that is why

Way to go fail, linking an out of context quote. Tell me, what “Open World” content requires grouping? There are “group” DEs.. but they don’t require grouping, just a mass of people, or not since some can be soloed. He was talking about Dynamic Events, not 5 man instanced dungeons. Huge difference.

Actually you took my post out of content. Huge fail.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/The-Tunnel-Vision-of-the-GW2-player-base/first#post1862888

Read this to understand where I am coming from

The Full Quote, concerning the DYNAMIC EVENT systems in the OPEN WORLD and the WvW maps. None of which has anything to do with 5 man instances. Where you are coming from is not understanding what you quoted or linked to. Grats.

“Allowing players to share experiences in an open world where other players are seen as helpful, rather than competition, is a huge component of what makes our game what it is. Open world online games are always strongest when players are encouraged and rewarded to interact as a community, to support other each other, and when the flow of the game ushers players to go places where they run into other players across all levels and have shared experiences. Our shared loot system, dynamic level adjustment system, shared resource nodes, multi-player skill combos, and the ability for every player to revive one another are all examples of key game features that help support this concept of a community-driven experience.
Guild Wars 2 is a game that’s about these shared experiences. Through the dynamic event system, every time you log in, you can experience and share something different in the world with other players. Maybe you’re in a map you’ve been to before and see an event for the first time, or you’re in the midst of an event and it dynamically scales with more players arriving, becoming more epic, or you’re fighting for control of Stonemist Castle in WvW, where each fight can play out differently.
Since launch, we’ve shown our capacity to really build and expand on this system of dynamic events with more unique events that are a living story. These special events and living stories like Wintersday, Halloween, and the Lost Shores invasion are all examples of this style of event we’ve run since the launch of GW2.

These key pillars — a sense of community and a dynamic, living world full of different experiences every time you log in — are what makes Guild Wars 2 what it is. But what does that mean looking forward to 2013?

Ruprect.7260:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Ruprect.7260:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Ruprect.7260:

Thothkepara.2539:

I’ll be brief. I have no problem with the dungeon/grouping concept by choice, but I’ve had it with new dungeons being the only answer to continued PvE development in the game.

Why does every major PvE concept, whether Personal Story, Living Story or special events have to end with forced group instancing? I’d like to complete my personal story, Flame & Frost and experience Super Adventure Box on my time without having to deal with the random and varied expectations of strangers, much less their schedules.

Grouping for anything should be a choice, not a requirement.

Give me slower progression, less reward per run. I don’t care. It gives me something to do when I play. As it stands, you only produce walls which actively discourage me from playing the game.

Hmmmm… MMO – Massively Multiplayer

This would tell me that I should be playing with others. There are games made for crabby people that don’t like to group up and they are called SPRPG’s.

By the way, the super adventure box can be done solo, it scales down lol.

Love the “M in MMO” crowd. Playing with others does not mean grouping. In ten years of supposed “M in MMO” games I’ve spent the bulk of my time ungrouped, crafting, exploring, traveling, leveling, etc, yet still interacting with other players.

Never fails to amuse me when brought up. Funnier still that most of the big MMOs have an “automatically reject group invites” checkbox as well. Now, if MMO means “group” why do they do that?

Please name one big MMO that does not require grouping to get end game gear. Besides GW2.

This is the least social game out there and the OP still has a problem with it. I don’t think MMO’s are for the OP.

So, you define all MMO gameplay down to getting “end game gear” Oki Doki.

You don’t play to progress? Why level/craft/or anything then?

Are you serious? By your definition then, only Raiders matter in games that have Raids. A common raider attitude, but false. I play for fun? And I don’t do “not fun”.
BTW, my crafter WS never grouped in SWG once, and there was no “Endgame” item she couldn’t buy, from Crafting money. Oops.

Ruprect.7260:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Ruprect.7260:

Thothkepara.2539:

I’ll be brief. I have no problem with the dungeon/grouping concept by choice, but I’ve had it with new dungeons being the only answer to continued PvE development in the game.

Why does every major PvE concept, whether Personal Story, Living Story or special events have to end with forced group instancing? I’d like to complete my personal story, Flame & Frost and experience Super Adventure Box on my time without having to deal with the random and varied expectations of strangers, much less their schedules.

Grouping for anything should be a choice, not a requirement.

Give me slower progression, less reward per run. I don’t care. It gives me something to do when I play. As it stands, you only produce walls which actively discourage me from playing the game.

Hmmmm… MMO – Massively Multiplayer

This would tell me that I should be playing with others. There are games made for crabby people that don’t like to group up and they are called SPRPG’s.

By the way, the super adventure box can be done solo, it scales down lol.

Love the “M in MMO” crowd. Playing with others does not mean grouping. In ten years of supposed “M in MMO” games I’ve spent the bulk of my time ungrouped, crafting, exploring, traveling, leveling, etc, yet still interacting with other players.

Never fails to amuse me when brought up. Funnier still that most of the big MMOs have an “automatically reject group invites” checkbox as well. Now, if MMO means “group” why do they do that?

Please name one big MMO that does not require grouping to get end game gear. Besides GW2.

This is the least social game out there and the OP still has a problem with it. I don’t think MMO’s are for the OP.

So, you define all MMO gameplay down to getting “end game gear” Oki Doki.

Ruprect.7260:

Thothkepara.2539:

I’ll be brief. I have no problem with the dungeon/grouping concept by choice, but I’ve had it with new dungeons being the only answer to continued PvE development in the game.

Why does every major PvE concept, whether Personal Story, Living Story or special events have to end with forced group instancing? I’d like to complete my personal story, Flame & Frost and experience Super Adventure Box on my time without having to deal with the random and varied expectations of strangers, much less their schedules.

Grouping for anything should be a choice, not a requirement.

Give me slower progression, less reward per run. I don’t care. It gives me something to do when I play. As it stands, you only produce walls which actively discourage me from playing the game.

Hmmmm… MMO – Massively Multiplayer

This would tell me that I should be playing with others. There are games made for crabby people that don’t like to group up and they are called SPRPG’s.

By the way, the super adventure box can be done solo, it scales down lol.

Love the “M in MMO” crowd. Playing with others does not mean grouping. In ten years of supposed “M in MMO” games I’ve spent the bulk of my time ungrouped, crafting, exploring, traveling, leveling, etc, yet still interacting with other players.

Never fails to amuse me when brought up. Funnier still that most of the big MMOs have an “automatically reject group invites” checkbox as well. Now, if MMO means “group” why do they do that?

Krosslite.1950:

per Colin Johanson:

“Open world online games are always strongest when players are encouraged and rewarded to interact as a community, to support other each other, and when the flow of the game ushers players to go places where they run into other players across all levels and have shared experiences.”

that is why

Way to go fail, linking an out of context quote. Tell me, what “Open World” content requires grouping? There are “group” DEs.. but they don’t require grouping, just a mass of people, or not since some can be soloed. He was talking about Dynamic Events, not 5 man instanced dungeons. Huge difference.

One yesterday in Frostgorge, lol a “rare” large skull. Easier to spot the little boxes on the snow.

FrizzFreston.5290:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

I do not want to run Fractals Solo, or any future “stand alone” dungeons. I don’t want to run the Destiny’s Edge storyline solo. There is 5 man content, and I am sure there will continue to be. Great. Leave it out of the Living Story and Personal Story.

I doubt that’s gonna happen, and I don’t think many people want that to happen either. The living story tells the story of the world, and the world of Tyria has many dungeons to explore. That’s not to say that everything Living story should end in a dungeon. But I would hate to see them close of the option because a select few can’t stand dungeons.

I guess you will miss out on a tiny part of it, because as far as I’m concerned Living story is just as optional as everything else.

Logging in is also optional. Going to Target and plunking down 25 US for a gem card is also optional. If I feel the “select few”, as you put it, are being ignored, I can explore other options. Prior to that, I will express my concerns here, on the venue provided.

I have 9 Characters who will not do the Personal Storyline after their Order choice, because I know that continuing is a waste since I will not buy into forced grouping. I’m fine with that, because I know. Had I known this Living Story would devolve into just another excuse to force 5 man pugging, I would not have bothered with it from the start. I object to them changing the structure mid stream.

And I think the “select few” are more than you realize.

darkace.8925:

MatthewMedina.5419:

a 5-man instance was really the thing that made the most sense for us to pursue, as it enabled us to best tell the conclusion to this story arc in the way that we wanted.

That sounds all well and good, but it kinda falls apart the first time someone joins a PUG with that guy who votes to kick someone because they actually want to watch the cutscenes.

If my experience in GW1 is any indication, the scene skip group will be the overwhelming majority of pugs. How they could not know this is beyond me. I feel at times the current dev crew needs a refresher course in GW1.

Narrowly defining playing with others as grouping only is pretty fail, particularly in this game.
I buy from other players, without grouping.

I was chatting in LA, without grouping.

Yesterday I saw two players taking on the Ice Troll champion in Frostgorge, and jumped down to help. Without Grouping. Helped some noobs blast a periscope and moltens, without grouping. Did a lot of DEs, without grouping. Got mad and murdered Ice worms at the Ori node, helping other players, without grouping.

Every day I interact with other players, without grouping. So do most of us. The days of having to form a group at log in just to level are long gone for the bulk of MMOs, and good riddance.

I do not want to run Fractals Solo, or any future “stand alone” dungeons. I don’t want to run the Destiny’s Edge storyline solo. There is 5 man content, and I am sure there will continue to be. Great. Leave it out of the Living Story and Personal Story.

Do not presume to tell me I shouldn’t play an MMO without grouping. I can, I will, and I have, for the majority of my playtime, for 10 years. That is a lot of sub money, game money, and store purchasing. Like it or not, my demographic is fairly large, and spends money too.

Shrug. That is your take. I don’t buy games, play games, or purchase game cards for a “community”. I do it for myself, for my own enjoyment.

To me, personally, “community” is the single most overblown aspect of the internet in general, and games in particular. Every game fanset claims to have the best “community” anyway. “Communities” don’t stop games from failing either, SWG? I can log into AoC or Vanguard today and hear raves about their “communities” as well, despite both being down to basically single server games.

Communities don’t make games. Gameplay does. Gameplay retains players, who form these “communities”.

FB is free and is just as much a “community”, sadly.

FrizzFreston.5290:

But, this also happened to GW1, when everything is solo-able, to an extend people will most likely solo it. People that want to group will have even more trouble finding a group (why ask, everything is solo-able, you’re bad if you cant solo). It will hurt the game if every single thing is solo-able.

Snipped your Quote to the part I wished to address.

Yes, most of GW1 could be done with Hero/hench, later Heroes. But, the option to group with players never left. Given the choice, people chose not to group, or chose to group with 1 or 2 friends. Forming pugs just became the least popular option, and that should have given ANET pause when designing story content that requires pugs. Contrary to assertions, pug grouping is not as popular as some would have us believe, and GW1 is proof of that.

Pugging died in GW1 because it wasn’t forced, people voluntarily took the other option. Players were given a choice, and made an overwhelming choice away from pugs.

Mandating a singular group only playstyle for content that should be for everyone is a bad move. Fractals, designated group zones are for that.. optional content. Forcing it into general storylines and personal stories, No. It is a step backwards.

digiowl.9620:

Meh, ANet could save themselves a whole lot of grief if they added the option for having the 4 additional slots filled by “competent” henchmen.

Hardly, since a recurring drama on the GW1 boards was demanding better rewards for groups composed of “real people” vs henchmen, with the same “M in MMO”, “don’t have friends”, “why are you playing a group game” arguments.

The same arguments that happen in every MMO that expands solo play, even while the bulk of them are doing so. Even Everquest 1 and 2 has Henchmen now, and the “M in MMO” crowd had apoplexy regarding that too.

It goes beyond mechanics, they don’t want people “soloing” with hench, it is not “THE WAY”. They want people forced to pug. If there is a parallel solo path, they want more reward. They see their way as the only way, and I don’t see it changing.

Its unfortunate that Anet feels the need to resort to a tired old pug mechanic that has been used to death for 15 or so years. It is not new, it is just another dungeon in a long long list of them.

There are also unique weapons for LionGuard and Ebon Vanguard, all tiers are the same for them.

Pirates too, but I’ve never seen that vendor.

Paul Belz.7351:

Hey guys,

I just want to mention that we have attempted to design this dungeon in a manner that, in a way, makes it very difficult to skip much of anything. We have done extensive internal testing and the general consensus is that trying to skip most of the content ends up being more trouble than it is worth, and the fastest way through is essentially to play through the content as intended.

I know that there will still be doubters, but hopefully the work we have put in towards this goal will contribute to providing the story experience you are hoping for.

Actually, I’ll skip the entire dungeon, thanks. Next time let us know up front that this stuff leads to group only play, and I’ll skip that too.

UnderdogSMO.9428:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Asterix.6182:

Why do you play MMO’s if you don’t want to play multiplayer….. The dungeon is a great idea! if you want to play solo then go play Runescape

Thank you for the great illustration of the “my way or gtfo” attitude that, over the years, has led me to reject group play, with few exceptions.

is that why you dont have any friends to play 5 man content with? Because you hate everything.

And thank you as well for illustrating the point. I don’t like grouping, therefore I have no friends and hate everything. Oki doki.
PS. You forgot to say “go play _______”

Asterix.6182:

Why do you play MMO’s if you don’t want to play multiplayer….. The dungeon is a great idea! if you want to play solo then go play Runescape

Thank you for the great illustration of the “my way or gtfo” attitude that, over the years, has led me to reject group play, with few exceptions.

Well, only a matter of time till the “M in MMO” crowd showed up. Multiplayer does not mean “forced to group”, that went out with Brad McQuaid. There are many viable reasons to play an online multiplayer game, and grouping is only one of them. For myself, I play MMOs because of persistant worlds and other social interactions, when I adventure I prefer to go alone.

People who don’t care for the “round up 4 strangers and have fun” content are not friendless social pariahs, believe it or not. It is a choice of playstyle, not an indication of personality.

GW1 was pretty flexible. You could do group content with 7 people, 4, 3, 2 or Solo, using Heros to fill. One of the best parts of that game, it allowed many choices.

This is “no choice”. I don’t feel this is appropriate for stories that are either supposed to be “personal”, or supposed to be inclusive of most players like a major story line.

The DE events for the Karka event didn’t work out well, but that does not mean the concept should be tossed. Bringing the population together to solve a “living” problem is a great concept. A 5 man dungeon.. meh.. nothing new, nothing special, and nothing interesting.

Thanks for the heads up, gives me a few days more to quit caring.

Deciding unilaterally that “everyone” needs to run a dungeon does not make them fun for everyone, does not make pugs fun for everyone, and will change few minds regarding them.

After 8 years of Everquest2 no loot on earth will get me back into a 5 man pug, or click a dungeon door.

I would have liked to have known this would ultimately be group only, so I could have bypassed all of it.

They are big, and full of details, and.. no reason to ever look at anything twice save the craft stations and banker/trader.

So much wasted opportunity. So many meaningless NPCs.

I get that Anet thinks they needed to totally abandon anything but the DE, but, these huge detail and NPC filled cities are crying for a few exploration, fetch, and information questlines, if only to encourage people to find all of the neat stuff created by the Art people.

To me, the point is it is easier to get a replica of a toddlers colorful plushie backpack than it is to get something remotely fitting to the game and a character.

I agree, for myself, the sheer number of cutesy items just keeps ripping me away from feeling part of a world. It is like this is a caricature of GW1, and not a sequel.

Plushy backpacks are cute. My boys had them at like.. 3-4 years old. And outgrew them shortly after. I am amazed that people take time and effort to make a heroic looking character, and then slap this toddler pack on them.

SAB stuff just wearies me. It does not fit in this world. Period. It is jarring, and an eyesore.

Personally, Im not part of the demographic that thinks apparel being on fire is awesome. To me, its like, rolling and screaming time. I’m also not part of the demographic that thought buster sized swords were anything but ridiculous.

I would not mind so much if there were alternatives. I would love to purchase a backpack that wasn’t some idiotic “theme” but instead something fitting. I would buy a quiver in a heartbeat. (and yes, I know there is an ascended quiver and ugly guild packs)

I guess as well, I’m a bit sick of the unrelenting particle spam and effects, and wish fervently there were some control over them (as in many other games). It is as if they are so proud of their ooooo shinyspam they don’t want anyone able to turn it off.

I always felt a part of the GW1 world. In GW2 I feel as if I am a reluctant spectator. The game, their shiny effects, their cute creations and retro funk is the main character, and I’m just here to supposedly gaze in awe at it.

The art is wonderful. So is the world, so are the characters. And because of that, some of the horrendous additions to this are akin to slapping a clown wig and shoes on Michelangelo’s “David”

Noviere.7309:

This whole invasion thing is terribly inconvenient, isn’t it? Hmph! :-)

ANet fixed the scopes. That tells me more than any snotty comments from forum fans.

Not quoting wall of text.

It isn’t a weapons system. It is a system of tying the UI skill bar to item equipped. Period. Weapon, rock, bucket of water, whatever. It is weapons-linked UI.

Weapons linked skills is a totally different thing, and changing the argument changes nothing about how wrong your initial statement was. Done with this.

Vayne.8563:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Vayne.8563:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Then focus on how they did things Vayne, instead of constantly claiming they invented everything. Leave that to Al Gore.

Most of this game has been done, before. Very little can be claimed as innovation.

Doesn’t make it a bad game. Or good. Or diminish anything they have done.

Again, the way things are combined is what makes it unique, and original. There are plenty of examples I can give of recombined things that are far better than any of the originals.

I’ve spent time writing and editing and there are simply very few new ideas. That doesn’t mean that certain books don’t take those ideas to a new level. That’s what Guild Wars 2 did.

It doesn’t matter that other games did various things. That’s not what makes the game unique. What makes it unique is the specific combination of things.

By your standards no book can ever be innovative, because everything in it has been done before. I’d categorically disagree with this assessment.

When you make an absolute statement like this I question your knowledge of the genre;
“Actually, Guild Wars 2 did break a lot of MMO ground. The skills linked to weapons, whether you like it or not, is ground-breaking for an MMO.”

Weapons linked skills are common, have been around for years, and in many games. Try using a common skill like “shield bash” in the many games that have it.. without a shield? As I said before, in 2003 my SWG chars had skillsets based on weapons choice.

What Anet did was functionality of weapons swapping, in that it flips your weapon and skill bar in one step. That is it.

When you flatly overstate an argument, I tend to suspect a lot of your other claims.

My knowledge of the genre is fine. Let’s look at some MMOs and see which one has skills linked specifically to weapons. This doesn’t mean that some weapons give you some skills. It means ALL your base skills are based on weapon and when you change your weapon the skill changes. I haven’t seen any other MMO that’s done this, and I’ve seen a bunch of them.

Deliberately misinterpreting something to support your agenda does nothing for your credibility.

The fact is, no MMO has a combat system like Guild War 2. Not one of them. Sure there was Guild Wars 1, where different weapons offered options for different skills, but that’s not what we have here.

The idea of swapping a single weapon and getting five new skills…on the fly? What MMO does that, pray tell?

You are talking UI function swap, not weapons tied to skills. All that this game does that others have not is the auto Hotkey swap tied to the weapon swap. Often something not needed with configurable hotbars, swappable hot bars, and other mechanics. In SWG, 9 years ago, a simple macro if you wished accomplished the same thing, or two UI clicks vs one here. 9 years ago. And 9 years ago, swapping a weapon gave me far more than 5 skills linked to it, and in fact required a hotbar change to use it. Many games give you different skills with a weapons change, and you use a separate toolbar. I will repeat, nothing new except for one button functionality.

I can log into EQ2, hit my ranged key, and “on the fly” have all of my Assassins bow skills instantly usable, as my bow is equipped. Hit tilde and use my daggers, instantly, with all of my dagger skills. The only difference is I have 20 hotkeys there, and no need to switch hotbars.

Argue UI function. Weapons linked skills.. no, you are wrong, period. Elementalist attunements.. yes, that is new, but you didn’t mention that.

Vayne.8563:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Then focus on how they did things Vayne, instead of constantly claiming they invented everything. Leave that to Al Gore.

Most of this game has been done, before. Very little can be claimed as innovation.

Doesn’t make it a bad game. Or good. Or diminish anything they have done.

Again, the way things are combined is what makes it unique, and original. There are plenty of examples I can give of recombined things that are far better than any of the originals.

I’ve spent time writing and editing and there are simply very few new ideas. That doesn’t mean that certain books don’t take those ideas to a new level. That’s what Guild Wars 2 did.

It doesn’t matter that other games did various things. That’s not what makes the game unique. What makes it unique is the specific combination of things.

By your standards no book can ever be innovative, because everything in it has been done before. I’d categorically disagree with this assessment.

When you make an absolute statement like this I question your knowledge of the genre;
“Actually, Guild Wars 2 did break a lot of MMO ground. The skills linked to weapons, whether you like it or not, is ground-breaking for an MMO.”

Weapons linked skills are common, have been around for years, and in many games. Try using a common skill like “shield bash” in the many games that have it.. without a shield? As I said before, in 2003 my SWG chars had skillsets based on weapons choice.

What Anet did was functionality of weapons swapping, in that it flips your weapon and skill bar in one step. That is it.

When you flatly overstate an argument, I tend to suspect a lot of your other claims.

Then focus on how they did things Vayne, instead of constantly claiming they invented everything. Leave that to Al Gore.

As I stated in my post that was eaten.. SWG had weapon-linked skills in 2003. Anet did not “break ground” on that.. or on a lot of other things fans will claim they did.

Most of this game has been done, before. Very little can be claimed as innovation.

Doesn’t make it a bad game. Or good. Or diminish anything they have done.

Thanks to Anet for addressing this and changing the blowout/kd for low level areas.

Someone mentioned Elonian Refugee. Here is mine.

My Norn sweater girl

T1 cultural with magician skirt.

I have a sinking feeling that Anet doesn’t have a handle on this issue, as more and more I see people from known guilds, apparently normal players popping in and out at nodes, including people I see talking every day in LA.

They must feel pretty safe using whatever hack it is.

RebelYell.7132:

This seems to be the inevitable conclusion when you design your Dynamic Event system around “Everyone who shows up wins a gold medal.”

Those mechanics work well for a certain, infamous kind of Olympics. Not so much an online RPG that encourages you to tweak your character and gear, and strategize intelligently around a wide variety of encounters.

Perhaps its time to rethink what “participation” truly entails.

It’s a bit more complicated than that, if you consider scaling. Maw, for instance, is level 12 content. As it is today, a level 12, with level 12 skills, stands a good chance of bronze at best, even trying to participate in the horde of camped 80s. If you put a participation threshold based upon damage, kills, whatever.. these players will be gated even more.

Contrast to Svanir’s dome, where appropriate level players actually have to work a bit to take down a much harder, mobile boss, for.. a pat on the head and a pittance event reward. Few high level players bother, no chest. Lots of participation for nothing.

Effort has little to do with rewards in GW2.

To address an issue, find the cause. Why are people camping Metas, using timers, guesting, doing precious little else in some cases?

Messing with the Events themselves is putting a bandaid on a symptom, not addressing the issue.

The world loot system in this game is, hands down, the worst I have ever seen. Not just rares, but even the junk people could use to sell rares, not to mention crafting mats. That, to me, is the actual issue.

From my perspective, the Living Story would not have been degraded, at all, if Periscopes had been placed not to aggressively intrude upon other quests and objectives. Their buff icon exceeds their range anyway, and would have alerted players to their presence. They did not have to be placed in unavoidable areas to new players. They did not have to be placed covering roads, vistas, unrelated quest goals, etc.

They are supposed to be listening devices. The “being listened to” icon and effect should have been enough to cause investigation of them, not some brute force KD effect to get attention. They did not have to be in ambush locations nor add considerable difficulty to new player DEs, Hearts, and other new player content.

It should have been the choice of a Low level to investigate and destroy these scopes, not something forced upon them to achieve unrelated content, content designed for low levels.

lordkrall.7241:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Oh yes, it would have been so less living and dynamic, so much less, had the added content not been placed to grief level 4s. Without that, the entire meaning of the story would be lost, and become nothing. Without this periscope, placed EXACTLY where it is, the story would have lost all meaning. Totally. Everything hinges on this particular scope rolling newbies around.

/facepalm

Good job completely missing the point.

The areas in question are invaded by enemy forces. Wouldn’t it be quite logical for said enemy forces to do as much as possible to disturb everyday life in said areas?

But then again I suppose we could have moved all those periscopes to Orr or something like that, since that wouldn’t “grief level 4” players.

Lets talk about missing the point. Above point in Personal Story, daily life is being disturbed by rampant berserk hordes of mad Minotaur. No mention of scopes, Molten Alliance, nothing. Eir is oblivious to it. No.. “and watch out for nasty scope things”. A level 4, on this mission, has one objective, to track minotaur and find out why they are wreaking havoc. Period. Now, how “living” is it to deal with another, separate, unmentioned story threat right in the middle of this, brutally injecting itself into the story line. This is not like grawl, svanir, or local wildlife. This is another story, a later story, hamfisting its way into an unrelated personal story.

But, I can see you are just fine with it. It would be interesting to find out how many Level 4 players in the upcoming free trial are also “fine” with it, share your view, and buy the game.

And noted your use of ’we could have moved". Are you a developer? Do you work for Anet? Or just take it for granted you speak for them?

lordkrall.7241:

So.. how living and meaningful would the Flame & Frost storyline be if it did not, in anyway or form, effect anything?

Oh yes, it would have been so less living and dynamic, so much less, had the added content not been placed to grief level 4s. Without that, the entire meaning of the story would be lost, and become nothing. Without this periscope, placed EXACTLY where it is, the story would have lost all meaning. Totally. Everything hinges on this particular scope rolling newbies around.

/facepalm

More Newby Fun. Note that trying to examine the tracks for the second Norn Personal Story mission puts you solidly in range of a thoughtfully placed periscope.

Yes, fans, I can see now that what this game needs is harder “track examining”. This was just too trivial before, and now, getting flounced like a ragdoll while doing it adds life, dimension, sheer brilliance and depth to “track examining”.

So what if its in a level 4 area, and interferes with Personal Story, right? This track examining is nothing compared to the dynamic living periscope spawnage, and also shows me how unimportant saving a Spirit of the Wild is compared to such riveting, drama filled content such as this. Duh, its a sonic periscope!!