Guild Wars 2

1) A balanced game
2) More than one game mode that didn’t revolve around breaking down doors
3)A game that puts it’s resources into #1 rather that peddling it away in tournaments
4)Fixing bugs on a regular basis, rather than leaving game breaking bugs in the game for years
5)A leaderboard that incorporates a team’s rating into it’s core mechanic, rather than by each players individual rating.
6) Frequent content updates, however if you can’t keep up with #1 and #4 then good luck with that.

You get the idea

Countless

Puck.1509:

Liewec.2896:

Puck.1509:

Do you HONESTLY believe they do not care about their own game and the people who spend money to play it?

you’ll find a thread here if you dig deep enough of over 2000 of us letting Anet know how much we HATE skyhammer and want it out of the rotation…
ITS STILL IN THE UNRANKED ROTATION.

yes, i honestly think they don’t listen and don’t care.

Incorrect. It is in UNRANKED rotation. It is not in RANKED rotation where it matters most, so yes if it was in ranked rotation then it has been changed otherwise that was a rather stupid request in the first place to basically remove it entirely from the game..

This would imply that you’re suggesting that the leaderboards in its current state, means something.

Countless

My two cents-

Leaderboards: Guild Wars 2 only has modes for team based game types, but yet the leaderboards are solely based on individual rating, why? This effects the following

- No incentive to stay on a team
- Constant team hopping
- A very toxic community
- Elitism

The solution:

Make the leaderboards actually work. And two make the leaderboards register as an actual team rather than something that looks like everyone is competing with each other despite being on the same team. Team rating should be first, and player rating should be secondary. Give players a reason to stick it out on a certain team, and if they leave a team that is really high rated, then that players team rating is back at zero for exmaple. There needs to be consequences for leaving team / incentive for staying.

Balance

Balance and Conquest are supposed to go hand and hand “from what arena net claims”. However that excuse is going to be long gone once Stronhold finally comes out and is forced into the rotation despite our opinion on if we actually want to play it. There are quite a few things that effect balance that need to be checked out regardless of game mode.

Healing Signet – Not even fire and forget, just simply forget, no need to even hotkey
Dodging while immob – completely changes fights which in turn changes the outcome of games
Signet of restoration – promotes passive spamming of skills
Withdraw – Low counterplay when it comes to interrupting the heal.
Signet of the Ether: Promotes max clones to get the most passive healing effect

TLDR: fix dodge while immob, take away passive healing effects from signet passives, replace them with more offensive capabilities that promotes exciting play, and give a more rewarding active heal for anything involving a signet. Withdraw needs to be something along the lines of a mesmers phase retreat while healing to promote counterplay. Interrupting someones heals are huge plays, but right now half the classes don’t even actively heal themselves, which promotes passive, stale, and boring play, regardless of gametype.

Game Modes

We need game modes that incorporate 2v2 and 3v3’s. Why? Less people on team team = more available teams with a small population. And more teams = more competitive play.

I could say more but I wanna go play battlefield 4. See ya

Countless

https://youtu.be/4CoOAsg_AaY

Enjoy

Countless

Quadox.7834:

Doesn’t work in this game. At least not anymore. Sure, you can dodge the usual pindown, pbs, burning speed, mirror blade, zerker, net shot and the like. But what about:

Air/fire sigils
Geo/doom swap
Steal, Backstab, Panic Strike
Overcharged shot, Incendiary powder
Guardian Scepter immob, Judge’s intervention, Smite condition, Passive Burn
Krait Rune #6 (currently even ignores evades iirc)

And many, many more. Point is, in a dodge based game, the ammount of instant damage that kills you is in my opinion over the top. The effect is that people can random dodge (especially tankier builds) and still survive just fine.

Arenanet! Please try to reduce or remove some of the instant undodgable damage in the game for HoT. We would see people who know how to dodge and Los survive longer while the rest can practice and become better. Some of these skills are fine as they are, such as backstab (meant to be stealthy), but most are simply impossible to react to and are still game-changingly strong. Some can’t even be random dodged, as they will simply propc again on the next attack (looking at you, panic strike). Say no to random dodges, please.

Air/fire sigils – I agree, purely rng based off crit.

Geo/doom swap – geo I agree with, although you could argue positioning based off class, lining yourself up for it. Doom I don’t agree with because there is a on screen proc.

etc etc etc.

Tldr: The sad truth is sometimes the only tell you have is based off an individuals play style, which doesn’t incorporate fun play, or balanced play in that regard. For example if you see a medi guard running away for no reason, you know he’s just going to teleport through walls and cheese you so be ready for it, etc.

Upon seeing the new mesmer changes, it was really interesting, however I feel that the old mesmer weapons have been ignored even before the new traits, weapons etc, and here are my suggestions to give them a jump start that will make them up to speed.

Scepter 2, illusionary counter – Clone – Block the next attack. Counter by applying torment on your next attack and creating a clone that casts Ether bolt. Upon the successful application of torment from illusionary counter, the cast time of confusing images is reduced by 33%.

The whole idea behind this change is to actually have the ability to direct your own damage. In a team fight the output of torment is sketchy at best because of this, you never know who you are going to block, let alone if it’s actually a player. So the solution is not only the suggested change, but to put a on screen proc for the torment similar to a weapon swap so there is counterplay for the opponent as well. Also with my proposed change to confusing images, I would of asked for more of a cast time reduction with Scepter 3. However with the introduction of alacrity, and haste returning to the scene I felt that would have been too powerful. However as it is now Scepter 3 is very underwhelming seeing as the actual confusion application doesn’t even start to apply until the channel is 50% underway. So instead of asking of asking for a direct buff, I felt that a indirect buff was fitting because of scepter 2 needing work as well, therefore giving them both synergy with each other.

Off Hand Sword 5 – Phantasmal Swordsman – This weapon stays the exact same as before, however your phantasm spawns directly on your opponent like the phantasmal beserker. And since the attack of the swordsman is more than obvious there is plenty of counter play. There really isn’t a logical reason why a melee phantasm should have to run a marathon to get to their opponent as where the warden and the beserker do not. This simply needs to be changed.

Let me know your thoughts

Countless

brannigan.9831:

Seyiwaji.4082:

I have more than 10k pvp match on my Mesmer.
I tried all kinds of build. Even if most of people don’t admit it, the most viable pvp build is really clone death. Hated for being easy. But, the concept built around the Mesmer was more based on Illusion death than shattering.
The position of some traits was just senseless. This is not a nerf, it is a clean play.
The biggest issue was Illusionary Persona, they understood that it’s needed to be a baseline.
From there, you don’t even need to skill deceptive evasion, which was in fact one of the worst trait. It allowed the enemy to follow the Mesmer.

But playing a Mesmer without I.P forced you to use D.E. Mesmer Damage was somehow Weak.
From the point of view that you could only burst light armored, berserk player. Meeting true team with people playing with some toughness and intelligence, you were not competitiv enough. With those change even shatter can now be used as defense and offense. This is not a nerf, they buffed the Mesmer in every way, and gave him now all viable build as possible.

You just need to know how and when to shatter.

You make some decent points but really those kind of clone death condition builds were always garbage except anything but potted plants. That’s why WvWvW is filled with this build. Sadly that’s what pvp is filled with it now too for the most part. It is easy though but still bad and ineffective against good players. It’s demise is cause for celebration. Anybody that thought it is a good build I’m here to tell you it wasn’t your were beating bads/fooling yourself. It is crap.

Alout of people played the build poorly from what I’ve experienced. However that doesn’t deem the build not viable, positioning of your clones is crucial which is why main hand sword is a must because your clones run towards the target rather than sit there like beacons which makes it harder for your damage to actually land. The only reason why it was viable to begin with was because it took advantage of the over abundance of cleave in the game currently, not to mention you being able to destroy them through dodging at max clones.

The build is capable of beating top players if played correctly, so I’m sorry but you are mistaken on that front “sorry not sorry”. The deletion of clone death doesn’t really bother me however, since it seems that condi shatter is getting quite the buff, so well just have to wait and see how it unfolds.

Countless

Caedmon.6798:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/Is-immobilize-bug-gonna-be-fixed
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/Midair-Immob-Bug-unable-to-use-abilities
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/bugs/Stuck-in-air-bug
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/List-Your-sPvP-Bugs-Here
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/bugs/Major-Game-Changing-PVP-BUG
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/bugs/not-able-to-use-any-ability
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/Need-more-people-to-beg-Anet-for-a-fix/first#post5019736

Etc..

Your comment alone trumps all others, nice job

Countless

Chaos Archangel.5071:

I really like the elite idea countless. Sounds great.

As for confusing combatants, I think it’s just poor wording. It’s likely “you and your illusions cause confusion on crit”

Condition Mesmer is looking really good ATM, tho I’m surprised you’re cool with the whole lack of clone death thing.

The PU buff is.. Odd, but I don’t see it being that big of a deal. Even with duration increases, fact is we still can’t stealth nearly as much as thief because of our cooldowns, so I don’t think we’ll actually be seeing that big of a difference between Mesmer stealth now and when updated. Seems more like an improved escape/disengage or to help stealth runs through dungeons.

Yeah I’m cool with the deletion with clone death as long as they make a viable option(s) for condition builds. And Yeah I agree I would really like to see the mimic idea implemented. It would spice things up again that’s for sure. Not to mention it would open up a ton of viable builds just from one change, the ability to essentially have double of the same utility would be huge, but without breaking the game.

Countless

Noss.4105:

I wouldn’t worry about PU, no way it’s gonna hit live as +100%. I myself would just keep it at +1s and add some utility to it, like 1s of distortion on entering stealth.

I absolutely love the Mimic idea.

Thanks man. And yeah the only thing I think they should really reconsider is giving you the option to choose 2 master traits, or even adept for that matter if you wanted to. It would open up more build diversity.

Countless

MailMail.6534:

Countless great thoughts in this video…! See what I did there? XD

• I’ll be right there with you looking for a way to keep Signets in play. Your suggestion is very solid theory craft though.
• I’m right there with you on the PU buff… I’m still a bit shocked.
• Your Mimic idea is pretty glorious, but Mimic would need it’s own CD regardless of which utility you mimic.

With the idea I suggested the whole point of mimic would be to double the cd of whatever utility it was to copy, like the example I showed in the video. If you were to give mimic a long cooldown, then you would not use it for skills that required a short cd. Therefore the idea was for whatever it copied, for the cooldown to be double of whatever skill it were to mimic. For example

Portal would be 180
Feedback would be 80
Illusion of life would be 240

And so on.

The point is to give you the choice of a extra utility instead of a elite skill “of a utility you already have equipped”, but for double the cooldown of the selected utility as a result. Therefore you have balance regardless of what you pick for that choice.

Countless

Let me know your thoughts, suggestions, etc. Thanks for watching

Countless

let me know your thoughts, opinions, etc. Thank you.

Countless

IEximius.9204:

Hardly mandatory, you must not main mesmer.

Based off this comment you should probably refrain from posting on the mesmer forums. Deceptive evasion has every reason to be baseline.

Countless

MailMail.6534:

Literally. They put the signet trait in a 100% power based tree. That makes no sense considering signet builds are more condi based.

I’ll have my thoughts soon!! The lack of Debilitating Dissipation is a HUGE hit combined with the fierce competition between traits within the minor and adept categories in the Dueling tree. It’s not looking good for Signets…

Actually It couldn’t look better for signets, that being because signets now hold the only available shatter reset currently.

Countless

1- Mesmer Dueling Minor – Confusing Combatants – You and your illusions inflict confusion when YOU critical hit. So for example if you have three clones out and you critical hit, do your illusions inflict confusion as well?

2- Mesmer illusions – Grandmaster – Could anyone elaborate in detail how they improve your shatters?

3- Mesmer illusions – Malicious Sorcery – If you were to pick up this trait but not wield a scepter, would you still receive a bonus to torment damage vs moving targets?

Thanks ahead of time

Countless

I don’t think I’ve ever come across a thread of someone who is oblivious to how spoon fed PvE has been since day one compared to PvP. 9/10, would read again for the lawls.

Countless

“The fastest way to nerf turret engies”

Is to nerf it fast? Kappa

Countless

Sebrent.3625:

@MailMail:
Thanks. As I stated in PMs, Mesmers used to be able to be tanky before our capability to do so got nerfed hard with the nerf to Chaos Armor not immediately giving protection and Illusionary Membrane having an ICD that is more than 4x the duration of the Protection it gives.

@Countless:
I’m very excited to see what you’ve cooked up. Even more excited by skcamow’s claims that you’re using clone-on-death traits … those were some of my favorites back in the day when I could run a tanky condition build so I’m excited to see what you do with them given that we can’t be quite as tanky as we used to.

Using clone on death traits? You’re late to the party friend :P I don’t want to toot my own horn and saying I discovered it, however I haven’t seen a video that dates back earlier than mine explaining the mechanics I found with clone death in general. However if you can find something earlier than the link I’m about to show you then I will take back my statement about me discovering it :P The following video was published on December 8th, 2012. Way before signet of the ether was even an option, haha. Ah the good ole days when there wasn’t a cooldown on the trait blinding befuddlement, and no internal cooldown on condition application when it came to chaos armor : /

Countless

jportell.2197:

I’ve seen plenty of people running this build. Honestly, I feel that it detracts from organized teams, and is less survivable in 1v1/1vx scenarios than standard shatter mes. I know countless runs a signet build but I honestly feel that guy could play while sitting on one hand and still be better than most of us.

• You have absolutely no peel capability. Yes there is massinvis, however it has a cast time longer than that of your distortion from your signets. This is even more shown by the fact that you don’t have blink. With the port changes blink can get you ALMOST ANYWHERE in most PvP maps. The lack of blink hurts your ability to sustain yourself more than you know. Which brings me to your lack of ability to drop target. Mesmers go down faster than any other class when targeted, and if they can’t drop that target they are even more screwed. So why no decoy? Or Desperate Decoy at least? Your phantasms have a high enough crit chance without the fury. Not to mention the iWarlock does power based damage, which scales horribly unless you are specced into power.

• Distortion, you make such a big deal about your distortion in this build, why not drop menders purity and go for masterful reflection instead? Not only do you now become invulnerable on signet activation, you can absolutely wreck any ranged class. Which brings me to menders purity.

• Okay I know it’s a signet build and all, but the maths have been done, Signet of Ether is hands down the worst healing skill for mesmers especially in a PvP environment. I know it’s got neat little tricks for other things such as maxing DPS in PVE, but as far as healing goes, even with max illusions out you do not heal for all that much, and the base healing on activation isn’t worth the cooldown compared to every single other healing skill mesmers have. In a PvP setting it is literally only slightly better than necro signet of vampirism, and you should go ask necros how they feel about that healing skill. And if you really want to keep menders purity go for something that you can get the most out of it. Use those signet invulns to use a mantra. That is 6 conditions removed every 10s if you used the mantra on CD (granted I’m sure you wouldn’t.)

• Lastly your offense. Yes the duelist does nice bleeds, and thats about it in this build. Your scepter clones torment doesn’t last very long, and you would put out more condi pressure if you just dropped the signets all together and went for iElasticity and kept up a bunch of staff clones. Even on shatter mes, iElasticity allows me to stack max bleeds, and about 10s of burning.

And for those that say “countless runs this build.” Last time I faced him he wasn’t using scepter and I am pretty sure he was power based, also the guy could prolly play blindfolded while sitting on one hand.

The only thing that I personally would question is the reliability of scepter in general in a teamfight. Scepter is unreliable at best to put it bluntly, you can’t even direct the torment with multiple enemies reliably, therefore it’s a incomplete weapon imo. Furthermore when it comes to trait allocation, you have multiple options of what to trait for when it comes to clone on death, and I believe is situational depending on what you’re facing. You have the following options.

2-6-4-2-0 – My standard build, decent condi application with good condi clear – Lyssa
4-6-6-0-0 – Chaotic interruption – For all you risk takers
4-6-4-0-0 – Condition heavy with crippling
2-6-4-0-2 – Reflect heavy from distortion on signet, good for power rangers, necros, etc

However in the past week or two I actually made a variant of my build that I dare say performs better than my standard build. I shall have to make a video for you guys sometime this week explaining it

Countless

Personally I don’t think a class daily should even exist in terms of solo and ranked que. It’s an open invitation for unbalanced comps and kittened off people. Keep a daily and or achievement like that in the cesspool that is hotjoin.

Countless

MailMail.6534:

UPDATES:
2/8/2015 -
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fhAQNAraWnsISFa2gG2qB3aIx1YM5JzcqiIVAluiNmG-TZBCwAAOBAeLDc5IAU5RAYb/BA

Hey guys. This is my first build post on the official forums, as it’s the first time I’ve actually done my own theory crafting and testing. That being said, it’s only been a few days since the patch so who knows how it’ll do over time… Before I go on, I’d like to credit Lyssa’s little brother, Countless, for inspiring me to make this build. If you don’t know this demi god of a Mesmer, please go check out his stream. You’re welcome biznatch!

~[Malignant Inscriptions]~
Weapon Set: Scepter/Pistol + Staff
Sigils: Corruption/Energy + Agony
Rune: Nightmare
Amulet: Rabid

Traits
DOMINATION (4)
Crippling Dissipation, Signet Mastery
DUELING (6)
Phantasmal Fury, Blurred Inscriptions, Deceptive Evasion
CHAOS (4)
Debilitating Dissipation, Cleansing Inscriptions

Utilities
Healing Signet
S. Domination
S. Midnight
S. Inspiration/Portal (Portal + Treb = Balthazar; every elite Mesmer should always run Portal, but I’m also having fun with the “pure” signet build)

Strategy

---

CLONE DEATHS
When fighting on point, they will die often, and they will spam 3 AOE conditions for long periods of time thanks to nightmare runes. And if they don’t die, they will cause bleeds from critical hits. Either way, you will keep lots of conditions on opponents. If they don’t attack your clones, you can still make them explode by dodging, causing the AOE explosion of toxicity yourself. The bleeds from Debilitating Dissipation will cause 6s bleed for ~2k. Your iDuelist will cause bleeds often, leading your opponent to once again come to a difficult decision: kill the duelist and hurt my team or take the single-target dmg?

It goes without saying, you shouldn’t be shattering except Distortion for stomps, rezzing and escaping a tough situation.

---

SIGNETS
Why are Mesmers not running these builds? Countless is the first high profile guy I’ve seen really sticking with this build style for the Mesmer, and until I tried it myself, I was still unconvinced of how effective it was. Well let me tell you: the distortions on these are insanely underrated. If you need to activate the heal, you most likely won’t be interrupted, especially if you chain it with another signet. The only downside is that you can’t capture points while distorting, but if you’re in a large mid-fight, your focus should be on wiping the opponent, and leaving your bunker to keep the point captured. Caught in a Warrior’s 1000 blades? Distort. Caught in a blurred Frenzy? Distort. Caught in a Fire Storm? Distort, and then get the kitten out of there. Basically, ruin your enemy’s rotations altogether with distortions.

Additionally, the passive signets synergize perfectly together with the entire build, boosting condition dmg, boosting boons. Activating them allows for nice combos as well like sharing boons from a Chaos storm or chain stunning with S. Domination + Pistol.

---

OVERALL
I can ramble on forever… You pretty much can be effective at several parts of a typical pvp team: self-sustain, condition, AOE, support and roaming.

IGN: Cho Kurai
Constructive criticism highly encouraged. Shoot me a whisper sometime. :-*

It goes to show how little I venture to the mesmer forums. I’m flattered that I inspired you to try something different.

Countless

Lordrosicky.5813:

Now mesmer has always had too high damage but it does have weaknesses to thief.

However, if they implement my thief nerfs then there is no reason to not nerf the mesmer.

My ideas:
1, Remove ability for mesmers to cancel cast their greatsword auto attack
2, Reduce the damage from a shatter by 5%
3, Make that stupid illusionary berkzerker thing do 10% less damage
4, Add kitten icd to deceptive evasion
5, Increase icd of critical infusion to 20 seconds

I am NOT saying they should do ALL these things. 3 or 4 out of the 5 would be FINE. I wouldn’t want to overnerf mesmer.

What do people think? Serious posted only please.

I had a good laugh at #4 and #5. I know quite a few people would agree with me by saying that deceptive evasion should be added into the mesmers class mechanic. Critical infusion is fine, no need to gut it a second time.

Countless

It seems the patch today brought more than just failed port changes it seems. Enjoy.

http://www.twitch.tv/bringyourfriends/c/6335141

Countless

Trevor Boyer.6524:

I’m noticing it with torment, poison and burn. Bleed seems to be working normally though.

Bleed damage is affected as well.

Countless

ronpierce.2760:

Up or down…? Are you shorted or OP?

Both

Just letting you guys know there is wild condition damage fluctuations regardless of me having might. Thanks

Countless

jportell.2197:

Trigr.6481:

jportell.2197:

So I’ve been told by a few people that have done ESLs/AG etc. That mesmer just “can’t work” anymore. I know people are gonna bring Supcutie/Misha/Helseth etc into this argument about how amazing they are at mesmer and they are great in their team. The point is…

When asking people about forming a team they flat out tell me “play something else.” Not because I’m a bad mesmer, I know I’m not the greatest mesmer but I know that I am not complete garbo. They say it because they and others feel mesmer just doesn’t have anything of value to teams anymore In their opinion just bring two eles with FGS they will match the mobility, and have better sustain. I know that in the past mesmers were great, it took the team building around them, however they were able to contribute a ton to the team if it happened that way.

Now even mentioning the class (along with others I know.), is met with heavy resistance, and if you some how have two on your team. It’s just called out GG before the match even starts.

I’m just wondering why PvP players feel that mesmer can’t work. What should change to make it in the meta? Do the top players not even want mesmers in their teams anymore? What would it take to actually have people say “you play a mesmer cool we need one.” Instead of “Do you play anything else?” as soon as you are on a team.

Kind of a rant, Kind of a question. I know this is a class question in the pvp thread but this is specific to mesmers in PvP.

TLDR: Do you think mesmers need something to be on teams again? Are there others just as frustrated that the class they have spent so many hours trying to become perfected on is just brushed off on the class alone.

Don’t believe everything you hear.

Countless

Countless doesn’t mean imma stop playing mesmer. Just means its frustrating that that is how people feel about it right now.

True, I can understand where it can be frustrating. However the majority of people in this game are very narrow minded when it comes to what’s viable and what isn’t. Not to mention that the community itself is very miniscule. Believe it or not mesmer can work. However I feel it requires more of a specific comp as compared to other classes.

Countless

jportell.2197:

So I’ve been told by a few people that have done ESLs/AG etc. That mesmer just “can’t work” anymore. I know people are gonna bring Supcutie/Misha/Helseth etc into this argument about how amazing they are at mesmer and they are great in their team. The point is…

When asking people about forming a team they flat out tell me “play something else.” Not because I’m a bad mesmer, I know I’m not the greatest mesmer but I know that I am not complete garbo. They say it because they and others feel mesmer just doesn’t have anything of value to teams anymore In their opinion just bring two eles with FGS they will match the mobility, and have better sustain. I know that in the past mesmers were great, it took the team building around them, however they were able to contribute a ton to the team if it happened that way.

Now even mentioning the class (along with others I know.), is met with heavy resistance, and if you some how have two on your team. It’s just called out GG before the match even starts.

I’m just wondering why PvP players feel that mesmer can’t work. What should change to make it in the meta? Do the top players not even want mesmers in their teams anymore? What would it take to actually have people say “you play a mesmer cool we need one.” Instead of “Do you play anything else?” as soon as you are on a team.

Kind of a rant, Kind of a question. I know this is a class question in the pvp thread but this is specific to mesmers in PvP.

TLDR: Do you think mesmers need something to be on teams again? Are there others just as frustrated that the class they have spent so many hours trying to become perfected on is just brushed off on the class alone.

Don’t believe everything you hear.

Countless

Words and stuff

Countless

I personally enjoy how you assume the worst case scenario and just log off when you saw skyhammer. 10/10 would watch again.

Countless

Liberis.9573:

I am much more interested in Conquest than Stronghold, and I don’t want to have to dodge queues in order to play it exclusively.

Thanks for your time.

Fixed

Countless

Edit- Just for clarification, I don’t really enjoy either game mode too much, my choice is literally based of the lesser of two evils.

xDudisx.5914:

Aomine.5012:

Johje Holan.4607:

witcher.3197:

Johje Holan.4607:

I think if they want to attract the max amount of players to Stronghold, they really need two different versions.

5v5 is too small for casual PvP’ers. But anything over 5v5 is too many for competitive PvP’ers.

Custom arenas are ok but it just splits the community too much. Two versions would be better.

A competitive bracket with 5v5. A non-competitive or casual bracket with 8-12v8-12.

The article highlighted that there will be some casual/PvE-friendly role(s) in this gamemode, there is no further reason to minimalize the need for individual skill by increasing the team sizes imo.

So play the competitive 5v5 bracket. I’m telling you casual players like larger teams. 5 is too small.

Casuals like bigger numbers because they want to slack off and still have a chance of competing, because the larger the group size, the less impact on each individual’s skills, so 1 of 8 people being bad is not as bad as 1 of 5 people being bad.

By that logic Soccer and Football wound’t be competitve because they have much more then 5 players on the team? You are using flawed logic.

Example

3v3 – 1 person being bad is 33.3% dead weight = harder to carry on a team

10v10 – 1 person being bad is 10% dead weight = easier to carry on a team

The point is the high the number of the team, the easier it is to carry 1 bad apple or more compared to a smaller group. Seriously, why do you think WvW is more popular?
Part of the answer to the majority regardless of whether or not they want to admit it, is that it’s more forgiving than conquest.

Countless

GrandmaFunk.3052:

Custom Arenas allow you to have all the 3v3 and 2v2 you want.

Hey Grandmafunk, I’m in someone else’s custom game but there is nobody here. Should I wait for some magic to happen? Or refer back to you when you’re available since you’re just overflowing with knowledge?

Countless

ronpierce.2760:

Yes, it’s absolutely necessary. It’s already a community favorite that is the subject for weekly turnies. Secondly, smaller scale simply means you won’t struggle to find 4 others to play with at any give time that also has strong synergy. It’s always fun to have that option to just play with a good friend because most players have that 1-2 “good” friends. It’d add variety to an otherwise stale game, and would revolve completely around the games wonderful combat wit house as much risk for exploitative behavior, especially with certain “checks” or rules that could be very loosely made. (Such as after so many minutes capping stealth durations, very simple checks).

Beyond those reasons, we already know it’s fun and has a vast amount of effective comps. Not everything works perfectly together but that doesn’t have to be a goal. Every class has seen a strong representation in 2v2 tournies in the past, some slightly more than others. But the other great part of this game is it’s instsnt max level pvp. Creating a fitting comp works much easier than traditional mmos which require releveling and regearing to even try.

This is the PERFECT game for the arena community and it’s widely an untapped area outside of wow which has “Rpg” limitations for accessibility. I feel ANet is passing up a great opportunity.

Finally, someone who speaks English.

Countless

I laughed when I read the following lines.

" Rather than fight players, NPCs are designed to help a team push forward through the map"

And

“We definitely see this being the future of PvP for Guild Wars 2.”

Countless

runeblade.7514:

Trigr.6481:

runeblade.7514:

2v2/3v3- Stealth away and hide in each corner.

Actually reading the thread might prove to be beneficial in your case.

Countless

I don’t like the answers. I don’t want the game to screw me over because of trolls. I don’t trust a complex system from other MMORPG because their stealth system is completely different.

Answer 3: No deathmatch. Instead, King of the Hill with no respawn, the entire map is the objective. If a thief stealth forever, he loses the match because he didn’t fight. If the thief stays in combat, the bar will decay into neutral over time, while not stealthed, even if the other player isn’t stealthed. Balanced so that legit thief can fight forever while troll thief will lose the match.

Basically, It is Deathmatch but with King of the Hill as an anti-troll measure.

Don’t like the answers? You must not like common sense either. If you’re so bent on standing in a circle then go play conquest. Not really a point of making a “new” gametype from a conquest variant and pretending it brings innovation. It will go stale faster than the leaderboards.

Countless

masskillerxploit.2165:

O man that strawpoll is ironic.

Unfortunately..

Countless

runeblade.7514:

2v2/3v3- Stealth away and hide in each corner.

Actually reading the thread might prove to be beneficial in your case.

Countless

Israel.7056:

I think 2v2 and 3v3 DM could be fun but I’d prefer them to not be default single elimination. I actually liked Wildstar’s system where each team got an allotment of respawns.

Having respawns promotes unnecessary snowballing and it prolongs the match. The idea behind no respawn dm is that it’s quick, it’s fast, and it promotes more thinking than “Lets zerg this guy and if we fail, lets try something else”. If you kill your opponents once you are rewarded with a win, and you move on with your life.

Countless

http://strawpoll.me/3535928

Stronghold – TLDR – It seems to me that there will be way too much pve oriented elements involved for it to be a “competitive” gametype, and personally that’s fine with me as a casual game mode.

Conquest – TLDR – 5v5 point capture, some pve elements involved depending on the map, the only “competitive” game mode in gw2 by default.

2v2 3v3 Arena – TLDR – A gametype specifically made for 1 round deathmatch, no respawn. Wins by default, why? I’ll explain below

First lets start this debate with numbers shall we? For the example lets say we have a playerbase of 1000 people.

Conquest = 5 people per team = 200 Teams – Low team count, stagnant competition
3v3 DM = 3 people per team = ~ 333 Teams – Med team count, decent competition
2v2 DM = 2 people per team = 500 Teams – High team count, most competition

I’m going to assume that stronghold is going to have 5 people or more, so it’s pointless putting it on the list at this point. The point is, the smaller the team size, the more teams you will have overall with the same amount of people.

So despite having a more competitive community with more teams, lets look at the possible questions I’ll probably get after I post this thread, such as.

Q – Won’t it fragment the playerbase and make conquest matchmaking even worse?

A – With the expansion of heart of thorns, there will more than likely be a huge increase of new players who want to try out the new content and new game modes, therefore leaving the existing community game types already in place unaffected. Not to mention when you want to be competitive the best choice in my eyes is always the most convenient one. Why try to gather 4 players when you can settle with 1 or 2 to be competitive? Not to mention the argument of the more players involved, the more roles that are needed in order to have a successful composition. Less people = less work and less hoops to go through to start playing.
———————————————————————————

Q – What happens if all bunkers want to que for 2v2 or 3v3?

Answer 1 – This is a simple answer of adding rules to arena that prohibits having multiple amulets in 2’s and 3’s. For example : You cannot have a team with 2 cele amulets, or any mix and match of amulets that arena net has deemed as a “bunker”.

Answer 2 – Another possible alternative would be to my first answer would be to incorporate a debuff that increases all damage taken by both teams if nobody in the match has died within a certain time limit. Therefore preventing arena from drawing out.

Q – What happens if players run builds that incorporate alout of stealth, preventing combat all together?

Answer 1 – In arena it could be set that if you are in stealth for a long period of time then you get a debuff and you are auto revealed for a duration, preventing you from going back in stealth until the debuff has expired. This will prevent people from running perma stealth builds purely for the sake of trolling, and or prolonging the match for no reason.

Answer 2 – You could incorporate buffs that you capture in the arena that give you increased stealth detection for a short time while the buff is active. Therefore giving side objectives, take the buff in order to give my team mate a solid opener, and or to get the opposing team out of stealth. Something along those lines.

Q – What happens if the “competitive scene” leaves say conquest for example and plays 2v2 arena instead with launch of the expansion?

Answer – Would you honestly complain if you had the existing community not to mention all of the new players consolidated into a smaller game type therefore making more teams and a better competitive scene that guild wars 2 has ever seen?

If I had to choose the lesser of two evils, it would be that the 5 player or more game types would become casual status, so the 3 man or under game types could flourish.

There is no point in gathering more people for a competitive scene just because the game type dictates it to play, let alone competitively

Hopefully this gets the point across, feel free to ask questions concerning anything. And don’t forget to vote.

Countless

The higher player cap, the less likely the chance that it will be competitive in my opinion. It might be fun sure, but high end competitive no. More players mean less teams, less teams mean less competition between the community. Frankly it should be the opposite, smaller scale, more teams, more competition overall. I honestly think that they don’t want to make something so generic like deathmatch regardless of how successful it may be.

I mean the 2v2 tournies that I have seen broadcasted have been the most fun to watch imo. Imagine 3v3 thrown into the mix as well with their own set of leaderboards for each game type? And said leaderboards would actually include a team of players instead of just a individual name. I would throw my money at A-net willingly if such a thing occurred.

Countless

If only Cruuk could be here to comment, this thread would turn into the best thing I would have read all week.

Countless

silvermember.8941:

Trigr.6481:

Stealing the glider idea from Archeage – Kappa

Let’s assume your comment wasn’t already stupid and that as others have pointed out Archeage stole the idea from aion. with your logic every game is a copy of another, which makes your comment just salty. Every game would have to be a new idea, while nice wouldn’t workout tell well in the long run.

You mistake salt with humor, never played Aion, first mmo I played with a glider was archeage, so naturally it was the first thing to come to mind. Easy tiger.

Icaruk.5401:

“Stealing the glider idea from Archeage – Kappa”

Aion says hi.
And probably some older game says hi too.

Regardless of where it came from, I just hope it’s not a copy and paste idea with no innovation.

ArrDee.2573:

Hang gliders! New profession specialization! Those seem really cool!
PvP changes seem bad! Even with the new specializations and the new class and the effect it will have on the meta, the game mode will still be boring, old, stale, un-esports conquest! Meanwhile the new game mode is even less PvP than conquest! It’s practically PvE! Where are the arenas! Where is true PvP!
Oh wellz! Back to the Killing Floor 2 hype! CSGO until it comes out!

Wahoo! Bye frands!

Agreed I’m actually excited about killing floor, and I’m not really a fan of zombie games for the most part.

New sub classes for each profession +1
New Profession +1
New Abilities for each class +1
New “Game Mode” GvG oriented – no comment
Stealing the glider idea from Archeage – Kappa

But why no game mode that’s small scale of 5 players and under? The majority of the pvp community have been just begging for another game mode for years that’s competitive, small scale, and not conquest, and not revolving around holding a point or standing within a small vicinity.

Let me know your thoughts.

Countless

+1 The change this game needs is just as important as the way the game is presented. However I feel that even if a individual or the community as a whole had the answers on how to make this game balanced and exciting to watch, that by the time it has been implemented the community might lose interest. It’s like a 56k dial up connection trying to download a huge file, It’s going to take a long time. I feel they simply don’t have the resources.

Countless

PhDusk.2590:

Please come back, we all miss the cancer!

Haha, maybe someday if they come out with say 2v2 or 3v3 deathmatch. Otherwise if I were to come back, it would be brief.

I only came back to play for one day to try out the new changes to the game. The only thing I really saw that was potentially game changing was the addition to courtyard being added to the ranked rotation. While it’s a good idea to add something new to the super stale conquest, the implementation is all wrong in my opinion. When you potentially put 5 uncoordinated people against each other in straight death match it’s a recipe for disaster.

At least in conquest you could get some type of bearing from the mini map alone of where you need to be based off the positioning of your team, but with death match there is no such thing. Esp when the match doesn’t stop when you either wipe the enemy team once, or get wiped yourself.

TLDR: Still keep team death match in the rotation, but only under the circumstance that you make it 3v3, and best of 3 matches or rounds “team dies, another round starts with say like 30 seconds in between to discuss your strategy”. That way you eliminate the zerg. And since It’s best of 3 regardless of if you wipe with your team you still have time to talk about your strategy of how you’re going to take down your opponent. Just my thoughts, thanks for reading.

Countless