Guild Wars 2

Knights gear is a good balanced choice.. the WvW Power + Toughness + vit is best imo, I think there is PvE gear with the same stats not sure I dont pve much.

Sebyos.4089:

No I really like how you can put up any build and have 4 good skills available at any time.

If you play a power build they are useful skills… not so much if you are conditions necro.

No need to insult him he is correct Guardian is much easier to play.

Yeah Im sure he can learn how to kill them with a Necro. You will see alot of this kind of talk from elementalist work alot harder for lesser/same results of other classes.

Shame you did not level the Necro up first then any class you played (other then ele) would be faceroll easy.

Its comical how easy/faster my thief is after playing a necro so much…. I keep thinking I should be doing more….nope I just DB like a boss spam one button on my thief everything dies.

Cempa.3645:

Advantages over full Carrion? As in why get Khil over Cari?

Condition damage + crit + toughness works alot better then the power + vit + condition damage gear. The crit procs bleeds with the right runes and toughness is a better stat for a necro because we can remove conditions so fast and our health is already high.

I really wanted to make carrion work because it easier/cheaper to get… all my testing says Rabid is better in all the condition or hybrid conditions builds I have tried.

In process of replacing my exotics knights gear and moving away from power builds in WvW. The more I play conditions in Spvp and Tpvp the more I like it.

Flissy.4093:

You must be new to MMOs. If everybody jumps on the flavour of the month, there will be an imminent nerf for them, so be prepared to say hai to Necro in a few months.

Really is a shame, I want to play a guardian as I like support, but they’ll be nerfed soon as they’re OP … guess I’ll go play post-nerf.

Anet is not really like that OP stuff stays OP forever with minor changes and underpowered classes will never be OP EVER. GW1 Paragon case and point.

Seragi.5910:

lol what a freakin joke… so you saying joe smo with no experiece or talent at all puts in 10-12 hours a day will have mroe qualifying points then someone with skill??

Yes thats exactly what im saying.

I like systems that I can play for a few hours a week with my vented up buddies against other players of our skill level and move up the ladder. We at one point were a well oiled machine few hours of game play we held tops spots while players of lesser skill would play 10-12 hours a day and be stuck at the rating they were at.

If being considered good in the game is QP farming, kitten this game I have a life and a full time job. Give us a rating system based on skill or watch the games pvp become a joke in the MMO pvp community.

Not that hard to do, game has alot going for it just implement a rated system because once people go it can take a long time if ever to get them back.

Poxxia.1547:

I don’t have an issue with surviving a thief 1vs1 with cd’s up if he is dumb enough to stick around. But many thieves do know how and when to get out and in again. If you don’t know how to do that .. I suggest you learn to play this “hard & unrewarding class”.

There you have it, thiefs just because some people are no longer dying in 3 seconds too you is not an indication thief is a hopeless weak class. Use one of many get out of jail free cards, the players defensive cooldowns are done you will kill them next burst combo. Thief is still OP and an instant 3 second win vs people without all the 40+ second cooldowns up.

I like that vid more. I do wonder if it was to display that rank does not equal skill…. true true, thats really the case if its a thief. Its the only class I think you could farm to rank 20+ with never learning even the basics of how to play.

That said the other thief was clearly decent there are good thiefs out there its just a class flooded with bad players dominating spvp scores anyway so they rank up by default. I see alot of higher rank mesmers that are terrible also same situation they really never need to learn how to play because they just kill kitten fast.

Anyway you did not win the 2 v 2, or even down any of the other two. Not that you played poorly thats just the nature of fighting people of the same level with balanced gear. (and you had to rez that terrible typical faceroll thief)

I liked your vids in the necro forums same vids. I thought it was just a fun vid of smashing noobs in WvW….. it was when you posted them here as if an indication of anything related to class balance that I had to comment.

Eventually you will move towards a condition build if you want get the most out of necro in spvp or tpvp. Or dont worry about it and have fun in WvW with wells and power its what I run in WvW and PvE sometimes in spvp.

kittenon.8572:

Please put a small “X” on the top right or left of that message so we can close it,like any developer in the known universe would do.

I clicked all over the thing with the hope of finding a hidden X to close it……

Sebyos.4089:

I want longer and epic fights no matter the builds. I want to be able to dodge more than twice in team fights not just play a chaotic mess where you can get bursted in seconds after using your CDs.

This

15 Chars

Seragi.5910:

sorry but there is no data collection what so ever, all that info is based on biased kids who only contribute what they see

Right, that’s your response the default call everyone that does not agree with you ‘kids’ comment.

You just got kitten slapped with the truth backed up by data, have a nice day.

Worth a bump because of all the effort Argo put into it.

Hope he comes back to the game if things get fixed down the road.

Just make a vid of you stomping with that build in tpvp with all the gold chests you are collecting and prove how right you are.

If WvW is the same as PvP it should be as easy as all those kills you got in WvW.

Schwahrheit.4203:

In high level play, Necros are broken as hell. And to anyone who thinks I’m wrong, actually try to fight competitive people in tPvP.

Well you are wrong buddy, data shows thieves in high level tpvp are doing better then necros and most classes

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/Statistics/first#post769717

Sure it was just a player that made the data but I’m leaning towards it being true based on the last patch…. Also I expect more thief and mesmer fixes in the future after the next batch of data is collected and im sure Anet is collecting it.

Dont waste your time making this a Necro are OP thread I doubt anyone will agree with you OP classes tend to get played alot by FoTM kids like yourself and the data does not back up your claims.

3 round system is not a rated systems its a farm based system.

No matter how much you played WoW arenas if you were not better then 1800 ratings you could play 24/7 and never pass that mark.

It might be too hardcore for the pretend pvpers because it all came down to winning against the people at your same rating… win a move up lose and go down only the best of the best made it to high ratings.

Right now faster or slower is pointless its a farm based system that = play more get higher qualifying points. No serious pvper that has played a rated pvp game is going to respect a system like that. GW1 not that I played it alot but I do know the GvG fights were rated so you knew who was the best guilds and it was not based on farming.

Whats qualifying points if there is not rated matching?

Its nothing but a farm fest. I’ll respect no system that is not matching the best vs the best in a systems that does not reward farming. Aka You drop to a lower tier if you lose no amount of farming or trying will get you to the higher tier only beating high tier teams should get you there.

There are more thieves then necros and eles…. Ill give you the guardian point there are alot of them.

Nice one, also posted I kill people on my level 17 thief in WvW. Guess what having exotics and being level 80 helps.

Understand that when they nerf thieves again ill still be playing mine probably more, just to prove to you and ever fotm thief that will be crying you cant kill anything were never good at the game.

Aye Harrier I sometimes roam with a full geared thief with a glass cannon spec on dragonbrand and we have killed 7 v 2 before his burst + my control and staying power with vuln stacking is commical. A geared exotic WvW glass cannon thief does not die in a few seconds.

There is plenty of data showing what people are playing and what is winning more then other classes.

The classes that are dominating are also strong 1 v 1 classes Mesmer Thief Guardian.

Ill say it again I probably play a thief better then you do anyway, and I played games at the highest rated pvp level top % of the pvp population with actual matched arenas I doubt you have. Some classes are extream EZ mode like the thief and mesmer where other classes need extream skill to just be ok like the Ele for example.

Seragi.5910:

If you can survive the initial burst and the thief has to fall back and blow defensive cd to stay alive thats a win. I’m not saying thief lose if there burst fails, trust me I play main thief . I know all the tricks to stay alive and how to reattack after initial burst if player isnt already dead. I’m simply trying to help the players who are having trouble with thiefs.

You call that a win? Just living against a class is a win…..

Man did I call that one or did I call it.

Thief players logic is outstanding…….
So a person uses a stun break on a 40+ second timer and lives.

Super skilled ninja thief /s “OMG my burst failed !!(#!#!#@ now I have to leave for a few seconds and comeback to kill him QQ”

Few seconds later “man Im a super skilled ninja that other guy was a noob he did not even break my stun LOL”

Oozo.7856:

Xom,

Please explain in detail how you can tell someone’s gear level by looking at what skills they are using.

Before you say that it’s because of their level please be aware that when a person is a true level 80 that they don’t have the little green up arrow next to their name and that it is highly likely that a true level 80 has his weapon skills, utilities, and elite unlocked.

I already explained how I could tell looking at the gear used. There are not a limitless numbers of exotic skins, and more then a few of those skins were not exotic skins.

The stat/power creep from blue to yellow to exotics is massive. WvW is an indications of nothing, the burden of proof is on you at any rate claiming that those were all level 80 exotic geared players lol.

Please most the players I seen in WvW are under level 80 and very few level 80s have full exotics. Heck I run around with my level 17 thief and still kill people in WvW but another in exotics is going to kill me instantly its not a statement of skill.

There is zero point arguing with me because I WvW with my full exotics geared armor rings weapons etc necro probably as much or more then you only I dont fool myself into thinking when I stomp people effortlessly that it was pure skill….. I cant fool myself into thinking that because I do spvp and tpvp time to time.

The video made a key point I think some missed. If players complain about a class and the complaining goes away in a few weeks that ‘perfect imbalance’ the meta developing etc…

However if a few weeks go by and the complaints dont change then the players where probably right. (thief mesmer guardian)

Of course complaints need to be put against actual data of what people are playing and how often they win in Tpvp or top scores in Spvp.

100% agree seeing people doing this more and more.

Oozo.7856:

Fiesbert.9816:

WvW is meaningless PvP since you can outgear your enemy.

So, in other words, a fight between two equally geared people in WvW is meaningless since some fights in WvW aren’t between equally geared people.

It’s a kitten shame that logic isn’t taught in lower level education.

You are not fighting equally geared people there I can tell just looking at the gear they have on and the use of skills. No I did not watch and look up all the gear set of ever fight to match it to pics but I seen plenty to know what it is. Stomping underlevel undergeared players.

It’s a kitten shame that logic isn’t taught in lower level education.

p.s. naw power necros can be tanky I tend towards at least 1800 toughness in WvW knights exotic gear gives great stats for a power necro.

I understood your post I just don’t believe you. Based on the comment that if burst fails its a 100% win. That smells like a comment made by a bad thief or someone that just does not pvp, because thiefs have a ton of get out of town options. Only a faceroll bad player dies evertime burst fails on a thief.

Seragi.5910:

this post needs to be closed, to many cry babies who dont play the class and dont understand how hard it actually is to play a thief the right way. Everyone is QQ cause they play a spec that doesnt have enough defense to take a hit. I main thief cause its fun… I also have 1 of every single class. I don’t have any issues what so ever with BS spec’ed thief in any class. I take the time to learn the class I have the most problems with and know how to counter it. I’m sorry if u guys are bad and don’t want to take the time to learn how to play the right way. All of thief burst is in the first 2-3s, you survive that you win the fight 100% the time end of discussion

I play a thief, if my burst combo does not drop them or get them in the health level i can finish them off…. I get away and come back in 5-10 seconds then end it.

I have seen champion shadows do these with perfection you cant kill them you can only survive them and wait to die.

Learn to play if you are dying 100% of the time when your burst fails.

Stealth, a broken mechanic give it to a class and the result is too strong or too weak, see clones the same way. I find it strange that GW1 was very smart and did not have stealth yet added it to GW2.

Anyway it comes down to fights lasting a few seconds in a MMO with no healers….. not only did anet remove healers they made fights super bursty where you need to have long cooldown stun breaks up or you die in a few seconds. If you live and win fight was still just a few seconds because you dropped the class cannon that attacked you… (or if he was not bad at the game he just left and will be back in 20 seconds to try again)

Just no middle ground if you are a chosen class you can spec burst, balance, or defensive. Most classes choices are stack defensive stats or be a free kill.

Right now there is no point no tittle outside the grind fest just for rank title…. Thats fine however I enjoyed WoW rated arenas could hop on a few nights a week win because you had a good team and be a top team.

It was based on matching the best with the best the winner gets points the loser gets downgraded. There is nothing more simple yet honest then a system like that it will show what needs balancing and what does not. I read somewhere that devs talk with top teams to help balance…. What???? who is a top team when there is no matching. I can’t even get my WoW arena teamates to play this game because there is nothing showing who is good and who is not.

Glass cannon burst builds work for some classes in tPvP.

Mesmer Thief are built to make it work with great defensive options not tied to stats.

Some warriors will glass cannon build to end long stalemates… simple tactic just run in go crazy forcing stun breaks/long cooldown use respawn then come back and end any stalemates.

Game needs work, right now the PvP is not MMO like with epic battles and tactics. It plays like a FPS that takes no skill like a FPS takes (people dont even need to aim as busrt). Sure you can say stun break and dodge but stun break is on much longer cooldowns then burst classes burst.

We need another game mode like deathmatch or massive balance changes to classes.

Yes needs a nerf cant see them coming they unload death in a few seconds. Takes zero skill to do it.

Schwahrheit sill mad over minor balance to thief.

When there are hundred of comments and threads talking about how OP necros rangers etc are I might give your opinion more thought.

If there is ever a ranking system in this game that rewards the top teams NOT related to farming, something like WoW arenas rating then you might see what class and builds works and what does not work. I have the deadly glads under my belt top .5% and held the number 1 spot for 2s and 3s a season on my battle group.

Without a real rated system like that going to be hard to shut up the pve/wvw heros and actually balance the game.

Oozo.7856:

Xom.9264:

p.s. opening your vid by ganking an afk player in WvW does not really help with the whole 1 v 1 in spvp and wvw is the same argument. LOL
Also they are not even glass cannons in the vids just undergeared underleveled people.

He was not AFK, he was scouting our position and waiting for help to arrive. He tried to heal but the heal got interrupted. AFK players don’t try to heal. Also, people can’t move when they are rooted. :P And if you hit them with a daze while they are in it, what do they do?

He did not move once, afk or typical skill level of WvW player whatever you want to call it just like the pve heros that stayed in your wells full duration the next fight without being dazed or rooted.

You cant know what a persons gear is in WvW and the people in the vids did not seem to have all the class skills and utilities unlocked and if they did there is no way to know because they never used them.

I have to strongly disagree with WvW being an indication of anything. When I say I 3 v 1 and 4 v 1 in WvW im not making it up.

Just Tpvp post a vid of you doing the things you did in these vids. Problem solved prove me wrong.

I have been running well builds since day one release, go own it up with wells in Tpvp then come back to me. Ill stick with wells in pve/wvw and some spvp noob stomping then go to the only viable spec in tpvp conditions.

You would probably do fine with a warrior they have issues but are a safe bet for the game being balanced around.

If you want to play the currently OP class Mesmer in spvp and tpvp or thief in spvp tpvp and wvw.

Oozo.7856:

I doubt the PvP class balance devs even read the WvW forum.

For good reason, if you feel you are a real daisy make a tpvp vid you will be facing people that are there to win and understand the class they play with and are even geared.

I have never had anyone stand in wells full duration in Tpvp. Wont get into it, just dont think a WvW vid belongs in spvp forum but like you said thats the Mods call.

There is a huge difference stop fooling yourself. Great you have fun in WvW I do also but I know when I 3 v1 and 4 v 1 people in WvW its not because have godlike skills.

Heck Necro in WvW is really fun because you can cheese the lifeforce mechanic by killing mobs. I never roam without 100% lifeforce and 25 stacks from weapons runes.

Funny I notice even your opening fight you have 100% lifeforce so I know you do the same thing I do in WvW, that does not work in Spvp and Tpvp the only pvp formats we have.

Spvp I dont think I ever 4 v 1 anyone, dont get me wrong like the vids but this is not the place for them.

p.s. opening your vid by ganking an afk player in WvW does not really help with the whole 1 v 1 in spvp and wvw is the same argument. LOL

Also they are not even glass cannons in the vids just undergeared underleveled people.

PvE and WvW will distort the numbers as the classes that have a hard time in spvp/tpvp are popular classes.

I see few rangers and thats a real comment on their power level because ranged pet classes are popular in all MMOs

I see few engineers I think that less of a comment on their power level its just a strange class that people are not used to seeing in MMOs.

Seems to be 95% WvW there is a forum for that

You can kill them with a necro just have to kite use skills well and know the class inside and out.

Guardian you just faceroll and win.

So yes bad game design.

Yes happened to me against a guardian with 3475394893 buffs.

Blocked now I know the patch notes were not true.

Spvp if you want to spend the time on necro you will do fine.

I highly recommend you dont spend the time and try mesmer instead you will do outstanding.

You could always go with a power/crit build and be supbar to other classes built power/crit but at least you will be doing something.

Yeah its a damage nerf for dagger builds, you want to just dip in and out for fury buff damage soak etc…

What I hate about the mechanic is we are the only class that must disable their build for the built in defense. Other classes are balanced around defensive skills that do not remove their bar (sure mist form but thats one situations and eles have other defensive tools).

Remove death shroud 4 attacks let people keep their own bars balance DS according to that as just a second lifebar that activates things like fury etc whatever you build for.

Well I will say it took longer finding a ranger and necro to kill.

I think the OP was kind of joking….

Honestly tho before i got my ranger kill I must of killed 30 thiefs and mesmers.

Exactly

Burst/Damage for some classes is so easy to play in this game its the classes that try to live past the burst the burden is on. You see it over and over learn to dodge, those same burst players tend to never dodge and just spam the attack rotation.

Zero need to aim alot of skills get your right on target with a single button press, you dont even need to move your char to be facing the target LOL.

I’m having a blast playing thief. Its still faceroll still OP eles and guardians are easier to kill now, seems like a thief buff overall to me.

It got boring really fast.

Deathmatch is the only format in PvP I have found I can play endlessly. Some disagree and find deathmatch boring…. and that proves the point that you need multiple game formats just having 1 is not acceptable this is a 2012 released MMO.

Why do people think if a player says thief needs a damage tone down they dont play one?

Thief is my second most played classes, its broken, its very easy to play has a ton of get out of jail free cards. Needs a damage nerf and when all you fotm thief players reroll to something else after the fixes I will still be killing you with my thief.

Schwahrheit.4203:

@OP

Go back to PvE then. I don’t know why a Necro is complaining about PvP when the class itself is legitimately more broken than Thieves at full potential.

I probably play your faceroll main better then you do.

With no healers game needs to be balanced based off 1v1s because that really all combat comes down to.

My post made perfect sense, you nitpicking someone complaining about thiefs OP nature because he does not know the class in and out perfectly is what did not make sense to me. Also this is the SPVP forums not the Thief forum your warrior boards example was condesending.

D/D instagib still happens, its still needs toning down with the nerfs to bunkers skills the changes to thiefs did nothing, the bunker nerfs is a net gain for the class in reality.

P/D conditions is a solid viable build the prema AoE snare has a role in Tpvp, its sure more useful then anything a warrior brings to the Tpvp table.

evilapprentice.6379:

Killthehealersffs.8940:

1) Wiki is my friend , logic is even my best friend

Quick Pockets when u change weapons u get 3 Inenactive (no stealth needed)
Quick Recovery:Gain 2 initiative every 10 seconds ( no stealth)
Hastened Replenishment: You receive 4 initiative when using a heal skill. (prefered with withdraw heal) ( no stealth needed)
Infitrator singet 1 every 10 sec (no stealth needed)

Initial Strike: Attacks with the first weapon-skill slot have a 7% chance to regain 1 initiative. (screw it > too low chance)

Dodge > 2 attacks with dagger > deathblosom > repeat
Try it in sPvP

2) So we have <<ur kind of ppl>> , telling us to L2p and we cant say anything to u ?
Becase i told the guy to L2P and get some defensive cds of toughness i am the bad guy here ?
Oh sorry i should spell slowly to the Theif population and explain them , what is defensive cds or Soldier amulet
Too bad there is not an Intelligence Stat in GW2 , cause Thiefs would have the lowest score …..

……….

I know that warrior class abilities are called burst abilities, and they’re based off of adrenaline, but I still know I’m not qualified to hop on the warrior forums and tell people who’ve been playing warriors for months how to play them better, so I don’t try to. Doing so would just make me look silly.

This is not the warrior forum also as a pro thief you seem to be claiming….you going to tell me caltrops conditions builds dont crush warriors?

Thiefs complaining they are weak is the most massive L2P issue I have seen in any MMO ever. Heck based on a 3 min skim of guru forums and looking at skills I made a caltrops condition build and dominated poor warriors. Thiefs have been dominating with a simple rotation and type of spec against everything for too long and never had a reason to try other specs there burst specs was/are THAT OP.

Show me a serious Ele, Eng, Necro, Ranger that has not tried eversingle spec combo gear runes possible just to try and be competative.

There is a thread in the Spvp forum showing hard data that necro is a bottom tier class in TPVP.

Regarding WvW and PvE. Necro and every class is fine, balance issues are not game breaking in those formats there is no need for walls of text talking about how great you do in WvW and PvE. Everysingle class can do great in WvW and PvE because the options of what you do are near endless.

Tpvp has a very specific format and goals. Necros are not needed and are better replaced by a top tier class in Tpvp. The complaints are from Necros that want to Tpvp and be competative without being carried. These are valid complaints backed up by data.