Guild Wars 2

Ragnarox.9601:

Warrior is the best class in pvp 1 on 1. If DH needs balancing than warrior(berserker) need serious nerfhammer.

They both do for the little skill they need to perform well.

Since when did Casual = Garbage playing skills? You can be good – great at a game without playing for thousands of hours if you play smart.

Being Casual to me is not been able to log in every day for multiple hours.

Lol the Jallis energy cost nerf (by increasing the energy cost) on Road because it might break PvP/WvW!

kdaddy.5431:

ThatNAESLGuard.6238:

Tbf if esl teams were to make a team with class stacking it would probably be 2 scrapper 1 ele 1 mes 1 thief. So not as bad as it use to be with 2 mes 3 rev lolz

I was gonna ask,

Because when you go back and watch EU ESL games before the D/D meta. EU teams usually had 1 of each class.

It was NA running double engy and ele.

Like when we go back and look at it, those GW2 core tournaments were pretty good.

Even back when i believe you were in WTS 1, wouldnt you say the balance was better then?

Yeah

TBH they should only balance around EU feedback, and this is coming from a NA player.

The only use UA has right now is to survive the AOE cancer everywhere, conditions, CC.. that is if you even have the spare energy for the stupid high costs.

Exedore.6320:

LouWolfskin.3492:

Stacking was a problem though.

Stacking was a problem because balance was (and still is) bad. That’s why ESL decided on their rule.

What OP is saying is that any future tournaments should allow class stacking. That makes the balance problems more apparent, and the thinking is that it will force ANet to address them faster.

---

You have to balance for both the top and everywhere else. That’s what many people forget. If something dominates at low and mid skill levels, it chases away a lot of the playerbase. However, you don’t have to balance as finely below the top the top. You just have to balance enough to stop a few low skill, high reward builds from dominating.

Right now, there are a few of those low skill, high reward builds: dragonhunter, berserker warrior, evade spam thief. They aren’t a problem for top players, but for the other 95% of the playerbase, they’re extremely frustrating to play against.

Yeah I agree with you on this, and they need to fix the ridiculous low risk/high reward builds, exactly the ones you mentioned:

Exedore.6320:

dragonhunter, berserker warrior, evade spam thief.

Also you are right here:

suffish.4150:

Regardless of what many people say, the thing is there is NOTHING wrong with balancing for ESL/top level.

So I should rephrase what I said.
You should not only balance around ESL. Thats why these really low skill floor builds with high reward plague PvP and stay untouched or even buffed after each patch, while builds that only top tier players could master (Revenant is one example) get nerfed into the oblivion even though they were never popular among the total population. (From Bronze to Legendary if you can’t get it)

You can’t keep balancing around ESL either or the game will be forever infamous because of the frustrations, DH is still unpopular in Tournaments but in solo/duo que it is kitten spammed class along with warrior.

Think I’m wrong? Ok yeah then have fun with your perpetual low population numbers in PvP.

Rune Darkmoor.3269:

To be fair, I don’t even consider issues it would cause condie Rev until they add a condie elite spec with a condie ranged weapon next expansion. Lol

It just needs so much work at this point I miss the Mallyx from Rev beta with displacement.

Valid points

You don’t ever see the whole spectrum guys, like… the only big problem right now is Berserker’s stupid high sustain while still being able to deal so much pressure, but in the other hand Condition Revenant is kittening garbage, so much that it would literally be nothing if Resistance was any weaker, an already high risk/low reward build getting even worse.

Ross Biddle.2367:

XxsdgxX.8109:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Exedore.6320:

Celtus.8456:

Gw2 PvP in 2017 is like: “Guys if everyone is broken that means the game is balanced right?!?!”

Pretty much.

OP’s list is funny. Builds which “play themselves” like DH and warrior are fine, but revenant, which requires actual thought and decision making, is underpowered.

FrostDraco.8306:

Because getting stab on dodge and a dps rotation consisting of auto attack and precision strike whenever its up is hard to master how?

Lol XD

Yes so loool, so now why dont you plz get to Legendary with a Rev and show me how many more Revs than warriors (and to any other class really) are in it.

What, like the last few seasons when everybody and their dog was playing them because of how broken and faceroll they are?

Interesting that, the moment they dont have their full bag of bullkitten to make them an easy spam one button do it all class with a super easy ride over every bodies grave they evaporate, hmm. Nothing’s changed about Rev’s design. It’s simply been neutered for the moment to take it from the scene.

This has actually been healthy for the game this season.

That is a blatant lie, Revenants were never overplayed among the total player population(kittening read, no one ever said they weren’t a popular choice among the top players [ESL] which is still less than 1% of the total population). And nice try on diverting attention from Warrior which is obviously overtuned, best example of a low risk/high reward class. And hypocrisy at its finest, saying Revenants were/are easy? Coming from a Warrior? Wow haha

They keep “balancing” around the random crying here but also what is played in tournaments (which is bad also since it implies people run full teams of friends all the time in pvp). Zero consistency.

Obtena.7952:

XxsdgxX.8109:

Yannir.4132:

Huskyboy.1053:

Rev hasn’t been good at 1v1s for a long time

You clearly haven’t seen the ESL 1v1 tournaments. There was 1 player that successfully beat every other class put against it with a rev, including very good mesmers, DH and warriors. This was about 2 weeks and 1 week ago, so after the nerfs as well. And others playing rev haven’t been doing badly either. Tbh, the bad rep rev has been getting lately isn’t entirely deserved.

>1 player
>Lul Rev is fine

>1 player
>Lul Rev is bad

Works both ways. Frankly, it’s nice there are some classes in this game with a high threshold for performance. Rev isn’t a bad class, you just need to be much better with it than many other classes. I don’t doubt that’s desirable though perhaps not intended by Anet. Variety isn’t something that should be avoided.

What?

You just don’t get it, there is no point in playing a harder class but to feel a special snowflake, cause me original anti-meta special boy!. You could be playing any other easier class and still even outperform Rev.

Ross Biddle.2367:

Exedore.6320:

Celtus.8456:

Gw2 PvP in 2017 is like: “Guys if everyone is broken that means the game is balanced right?!?!”

Pretty much.

OP’s list is funny. Builds which “play themselves” like DH and warrior are fine, but revenant, which requires actual thought and decision making, is underpowered.

FrostDraco.8306:

Because getting stab on dodge and a dps rotation consisting of auto attack and precision strike whenever its up is hard to master how?

Lol XD

Yes so loool, so now why dont you plz get to Legendary with a Rev and show me how many more Revs than warriors (and to any other class really) are in it.

Id instantly buy a makeover kit if they introduced sliders… but yeah they don’t care enough.

Yannir.4132:

Huskyboy.1053:

Rev hasn’t been good at 1v1s for a long time

You clearly haven’t seen the ESL 1v1 tournaments. There was 1 player that successfully beat every other class put against it with a rev, including very good mesmers, DH and warriors. This was about 2 weeks and 1 week ago, so after the nerfs as well. And others playing rev haven’t been doing badly either. Tbh, the bad rep rev has been getting lately isn’t entirely deserved.

>1 player
>Lul Rev is fine

Vitali.5039:

Exedore.6320:

Celtus.8456:

Gw2 PvP in 2017 is like: “Guys if everyone is broken that means the game is balanced right?!?!”

Pretty much.

OP’s list is funny. Builds which “play themselves” like DH and warrior are fine, but revenant, which requires actual thought and decision making, is underpowered.

Yeah I don’t know anymore with these devs.

Spartacus.3192:

sophiewhite.3149:

heralds/revenants. they arent bad. people just think they are bad. they take skill to use sure but in decent hands they still provide amazing cleave. people are jumping ship over nothing. the only nerf i would reverse on them is the sword 2. that one was just stupid.

You just said it. In decent hands. But when I see all the Rev mains (prev season legend ranked) that I follow on twitch switch to DH/War/Thief then you know something is wrong. Simple a legend skill level player will still perform MUCH MUCH better on DH or War in solo/duo queue than if he stay on Rev. So why would he/she bother to stay on Rev if he wants to crack top 20 leaderboards.

I really wish ANET will publish stats of the TOP 50 on leaderboards showing the classes they played the most in Season 5. I doubt Rev will be represented much in Top 50.

ReaverKane.7598:

That’s more because Rev is underpowered, it never was that great, i mean even in PvE Revenant is kind of a one trick pony. Like most things HoT it was a big Flop.
Although i’ll concede that Guard and Warrior are plenty effective even at low skill ratings, i’d like to point out, that’s how they were designed.
Anet said it themselves, there’s a gradient of required skill to play all classes, and Warrior and Guardian are on the low end, while Mesmer and Ele are at the high end.

I’d like to point out that in the hands of a Top player, a Mesmer, Elementalist or Thieves are WAY more powerful than a Warrior or a Guard. The only reason you see them stack less is because they’re HARDER to play.

The issue is less about those two classes being overpowered, which, honestly it’s not the case, DH, especially trap DH are easy to kill, just shove a Ele with obsidian skin on that fray and watch them fall. As for warrior, especially the meta mace/gs, any ranged character wins if you’re smart, just kite him around with autos, wait out the invulnerability, feint the block, and wail on him. Sure it’s not a one shot spot, like other more squishy classes, but Eles and Mesmers are just as tanky, if not more.

Couldn’t have said it better, same with the OP.

zomgbuffalo.5276:

Lonewolf Kai.3682:

Not to rain on your parade, and I’m not completely disagreeing with you because if you played well with the class he is strong, but then so can any class be that is well played. Heck, you could go naked and still win if well played. But, the problem is that the other classes have take half the effort to do said well played.

Don’t get me wrong, I love the revenant, but the other classes do have it much easier.

Ever since I started playing GW2 people were always raining upon certain classes as high risk – low reward and saying that other classes could do the same with less effort. Then I played those classes myself.
I realised how full of bullkitten people were. Once you learn what your skills do on rev it’s not even that hard… And for the high risk thing – the only 2 classes that are simple to play are warrior and guardian I could say, but guardian is the whole new story. Warrior is supposed to be simple, it is a class that should be as simple as it gets, since it is WARRIOR. You just go and bash things lol. Well, that’s just my opinion though.

Classes I personally know are way easier to play than Rev cause I played them alot before HoT are Guardian, Warrior and Necro. And it is a coincidence since those are the most popular ones and since I also experienced it I can confidently say that they aren’t hard to pick up and master.
And a class I think that is probably harder to master and I don’t even own is engineer and IDM accepting that fact.

Also numbers speak, Rev was only ever popular among Top world players. Their general numbers were always very low and now not even those top players pick it up.

So remember this, no one ever said that they weren’t really powerful, but their skill floor and ceiling was very high for the non-tournament level player, so 95% + of the total player population.

Lonewolf Kai.3682:

Not to rain on your parade, and I’m not completely disagreeing with you because if you played well with the class he is strong, but then so can any class be that is well played. Heck, you could go naked and still win if well played. But, the problem is that the other classes have take half the effort to do said well played.

Don’t get me wrong, I love the revenant, but the other classes do have it much easier.

Yep exactly, what bothers me alot is how other classes risk less and still perform as good or event better, having lower skill floors and ceilings over Revenant and still over-performing.

lucadiro.4519:

To be honest I’m seeing really few revs in my match but the ones I meet are really good… Seems like most of the brainless revs have left it to play dragon hunter now.

I would left rev As it is now, It’s well balanced and instead tone down other classes

But they NEED to have fixed tons of bugs

I agree, pretty reasonable so lets hope for the best.

Hyper Cutter.9376:

Locking people into a single weapon set was only acceptable for elementalists and engineers because they had ways to get around the limit of weapon skills (every elementalist weapon has skills for every attunement, and engineers have an entire suite of kits that give them a variety of weapon skills. Elementalists have conjures that do the same thing, as well, even if they’re mediocre). Revenants don’t (an extra bar of fixed utility skills doesn’t offer nearly the same flexibility, for starters), and that’s why people wanted weapon swap for them.

(revenant also desperately needs a ranged condition weapon, but one problem at a time I guess)

Yeah even after reverting every single nerf and locking into only having one weapon I don’t think it would perform good, unless all the five legends are available at any time and by buffing everything even more.

HoT’s difficulty is perfect, I hope they don’t go backwards with the next expansion.
I played since launch and now I find core Tyria really kitten boring, the AI and overall mechanics are laughable easy.

BTW I played solo all the HoT maps, made it a very good challenge.

Rain.9213:

I’ve only ever tried Power Mallyx with Shiro before so I’m not too familiar with the condi set. I’m sure the condi version is at least usable in Ranked. I’m just not a huge fan of Mace.

I do want to point out though that Power Shiro/Mallyx was actually decent in ranked. Made it to Gold with it but I decided to switch to Herald Shiro/Glint after seeing Abelisk’s build as it just performed way better than mine.

Mmm I see, yeah I don’t like mace at all but no there is no other option. I’d rather play power again but just looking at sword makes me mad because of the PS nerf, let alone
staff ones.

Rain.9213:

Abelisk.4527:

Here’s the build I’ve been running with Power Shiro

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vlAQNAW8sn3guNSuQ7JRboVlsP0rS4IaWJ4EdsklNFyegHchtB4ALgNMlZNA-TZBHwAFOIAlvAAMLDwZ/BAPBAA

Loses extra boonshare potential at the sake of better damage.

It’s potent. I’ve really made dents with this build.

I just came in here to point out how freaking good this build is. I’ve been running a Berserker Rev build for the longest time and while I did pretty well, I’d get destroyed by a well played Necro or Condi Mes.

NO MORE! Thanks to your build, I now have the vitality to withstand heavy condi pressure and the damage to hit back harder! Thanks so much for sharing your build, sir! You have singlehandedly saved Revenant for me PVP-wise. I was even able to win a 2v1 against a Druid and Condi Warrior last night with this build which is something I thought impossible just a week ago.

Too bad Revenant is no longer as desirable in Raids though sigh I built an entire set of Raid gear for him too then he got nerfed a week later.

Oh, so would you recommend this over Mallyx? I’m still trying to make it work but it’s really hard to tell when there is literally no one else playing it to compare myself with.

My current Mallyx build:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vlAQRApX5sn3geNSuQvJRboHlsP0kS4I6SJ4EtrklTlJNgEWQNjPKxe93nH-TphAABc8AAWa/BAOBA6XG4jDCwEHBAA

Went with Rune of the Undead since I believe it synergies well enough with Hardening Persistence and Wanderer Amulet. The thing I was never sure enough about was Invocation vs Retribution, since I did miss even just the stunbreak when I went with Retribution so I’m not sure if the damage reduction from it is worth the trade off and the stability is so stupid unreliable.

OriOri.8724:

Azukas.1426:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Azukas.1426:

Still waiting on valid argument that proves PI is OP

Sorry guys, Azukas has ignored or dismissed everything you’ve said, deeming them as invalid. Threads over. Judge has spoken.

https://youtu.be/itmNiTwHOsM?t=19

Trying to hard mate. Need to bring some facts to the table

So do you, since you’ve contributed nothing to this thread except quoting yourself and telling other people to “provide facts”, all while conveniently ignoring all of the posts that do in fact provide facts to back up the claims made

Don’t mind him/her much, I’ve hardly seen anyone else as stubborn.

Wow people, please show me how really powerful Rev is right now, seems like you guys know alot just by theorycrafting (most likely didn’t even play the class for more than a couple of hours) And it’s funny cause the numbers always talk, Rev has always been one of the least played classes and now it’s even worse. ANET even acknowledged that it is one of the hardest classes to master but still you keep bashing and flaming any person who even dared to main a Rev.

Now, is it in an actual good place right now? Yeah maybe, after they fix the plague of bugs it has and after they tune down every other single profession, if anything the only exception that would be fair is Ele.

Is it viable (against actual competent players)? Yeah if you are among the best world players I guess (another reason you shouldn’t bring tournament numbers here), so in other words the risk/reward ratio is stupid unfair. It’s High Risk/Medium(at best)Reward.

And to address staff being a “support” weapon even though it has terrible… everything except for what was number 5 and maybe number 3…
Yeah that’s why they nerfed once again the block and still haven’t done anything about the terrible heals, high energy costs and long cast time of number 4.

Fun fact: Did you guys know that Mallyx so amazing stun break has a casting time? Claps

BeepBoopBop.5403:

Nope because most of the playerbase is still salty as kitten. Too lazy to learn the new class and it hurts me really bad, nerf it now! See it all the time in my guild.

I said this long ago when HoT was still recent, lol it’s something that always plagues games with PvP (specially MMORPGs), people in any game are never happy to have to learn and adapt to new things so they just cry loud.

Abelisk.4527:

I run Glint/Mallyx condition revenant (Ardyn Izunía) and it’s pretty powerful.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vlAQRAsc5un3geNSuQvJRboHlsP0kS4I6SJ4EtrklTlRNjPKJNgEWwe93rH-TphGABA8AAG4gAYwJAgt9H0vMABHBAA

Great defense, lasts long with all the blocks, and can do pretty mean damage

Nice, thanks for the link. Cool name btw

EpicSuperFail.9518:

Were those nerfs only in Spvp or were they also in WvW? Last I played I felt really good roaming as rev.

What are the good roaming classes now?

Last nerfs stayed in PvP so Rev is still decent for WvW roaming.

FitzChevalerie.1035:

Zintrothen.1056:

When played poorly, like most Revs were allowed to do because they were so OP, they’ll be crushed, just like a poorly played profession should be.

Like a poorly played DH.

oh wait.

I know right? No one ever said Revs weren’t really powerful, but they never had a low skill floor and ceiling like the said example, DH.

Abelisk.4527:

Revs are fine, it’s other classes that need to be toned down

At least I could agree with this. Every single other profession needs to be toned down but then you have threads like the thief one where it is being defended mindlessly.

Ross Biddle.2367:

Apolo.5942:

they are essentially unplayeable

I’m not seeing the problem.

In fact we’re living in the post fixed Rev era right now.

This thread is backwards.

Classic member of a PvP community.

Thief, then thief and last but not least… thief.

Master Ketsu.4569:

Asur.9178:

It’s a game for casuals.

The balance team doesn’t care as much as you’d want them to care.

There’s your answer.

PvE catering to casuals is fine tbh.

But PvP? No.

Exactly, and them catering to casuals on PvP has done jackkitten for the actual active player population, the numbers have been ridiculously low.

For the low skill floor and ceiling it has, yes warrior is overtuned. Same can be said for DH.

Atticus.7194:

Gwaihir.1745:

Xca.9721:

serj.8214:

No stability on Rev? lolwhat? XD how about some Retro traits? Or mallyx resistance and legend swap condi transfer?) If you cant make 100% of ur Rev its ur problem not Revs) atm there are 2 types of Rev 1st who dies as fast as blink of the eye) and 2nd who kill ur team as paper shreder)

I was talking about the meta build, which means I already made “100% of my rev”. Retri trait is dead and Mallyx is really bad compared to other condi classes.

Mallyx is destructive if played right in a teamfight.

Honestly I’d love to see an example of that, I’ve tried it myself and sadly found it incredibly lackluster. So no trolling or anything if you have an example of someone effectively playing mal on par with other condi classes I would absolutely love to see it.

As it stands to the original point, just don’t play a rev in PvP. Sure if you’re given the exact optimum scenario you might be good for a little while but for the most part you’re going to struggle so much more to be effective than any other class. Just play a thief if you want to go for kills, guard for point holding or ele for team support and aoe damage

Same here, I still keep trying Mallyx Rev but it just gets shut down by any good player so I’d love to see an actual good example of it being used well and not just people supposing that Rev is in a good spot (which it isn’t for the high skill ceiling it has, high risk/low reward)

Crinn.7864:

Moonsinn.5382:

This thread has gone on too long. OP (or someone else) needs to post a video showing how broken this skill is, or it’s all theoretical bullkitten. Arguing about what a thief can potentially do is pointless. People who play thief know what it takes to win with thief, and it’s not as easy as the “nerf PI” crowd would have you believe.

Video or end thread.

Math is witchcraft. YouTube is science.

/s

Abelisk.4527:

Here’s the build I’ve been running with Power Shiro

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vlAQNAW8sn3guNSuQ7JRboVlsP0rS4IaWJ4EdsklNFyegHchtB4ALgNMlZNA-TZBHwAFOIAlvAAMLDwZ/BAPBAA

Loses extra boonshare potential at the sake of better damage.

It’s potent. I’ve really made dents with this build.

Thanks, Ive always enjoyed looking at people’s different builds.

BlaqueFyre.5678:

BeepBoopBop.5403:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

XxsdgxX.8109:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Xenesis.6389:

Meh happened to me months ago, no one cared and it won’t change. Was down before I could react, basically only an auto skill would have saved me. Wasn’t even full zerk either.
Good luck with the balance crusade, I don’t see anet giving two figs about it.

Thief was within 1200 range of you unstealthed blew 4 long CDs to land two Hits, no different then most big hits that happen in WvW, it sucks when it happens but WvW will never be balanced, you will never see those numbers in PvP just because less stats and less damage modifiers. Fun fact you can get hit from a well setup maul for 18k in PvP the Ranger was super glass and died when sneezed on though, that was the biggest hit I have seen in PvP to date.

So far the classes I know that can land over 20k hits in WvW are Revenant CoR doesn’t need any setup just hit CoR and can easily achieve over 15k damage, Warrior with Gun Flame, Warrior with Arc Divider hits for over 15k easily, Ranger with Maul can hit for 20k with setup, and Thief running full Signet with setup on D/D with Berserker gear. I haven’t seen other classes achieve anything higher than these ones.

Huge difference is that Rev and Warrior have huge tells, AKA Telegraph on Rev and “Cast” animation on Gun Flame. The range only means kitten on blob fights, thieves just deal the damage from literally nowhere (stealth spam cancer).

Edit: And for Rev at least to deal above 15k+ crit against a glass build you pretty much need to have the stars aligned.

I play Rev in WvW it deals 15k easily when running Marauders gear with Cav trinkets with furious Sharpening Stone running Invo/Retribution/Herald. No stars align…

And you don’t know how Thieves achieve The 15k plus Hits here’s a hint no stealth spam, no Evade spam it is literally a Pure Berserker DA/CS/Tri Signet Dagger Dagger build, it uses all 4 signets to get 20 stacks of might, so using every single heal and utility which leaves nothing for if they fail or are spotted before they land the burst, since it’s not a one shot build and the only Stealth they get is CnD which means they don’t engage from stealth. It’s not an instant you’re dead they have to get close enought to CnD which means if a player cant react to two hits before the Backstab, it’s not the build that’s the issue, the thief would be seen from 1200+ range away.

Sorry every one of those classes is always visible to achieve their burst.

The game is unbalanced but there is a balance, you want to do huge numbers, you have to sacrifice survivability. Except for warrior because passives for days.

Yea you’re straight up lying about Rev damage in WvW.

I’m Zerk except 2 Cavalier trinks and Marauder weapons. 240% crit damage easily over 3100 power with full might. You don’t get 15k hits unless you hit Cruel Reprecussions with full stacks, full might, have every boon in the game on you (Elder’s Force) target less than 50% (Swift Termination on Devastation, which you don’t even take apparently…) and probably some vulnerability on target. Which is the stars aligning.

“Sacrifice survivability” uhhhh the signet build can just run d/p as the offhand set and stealth on approach/running away. Other full zerk glass cannon builds on other classes (except maybe mesmer) just lay down and die.

Thief mains lol

Blah

Wow you have been using the exact same picture for a while already and still kept getting debunked by other people.

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Xenesis.6389:

Meh happened to me months ago, no one cared and it won’t change. Was down before I could react, basically only an auto skill would have saved me. Wasn’t even full zerk either.
Good luck with the balance crusade, I don’t see anet giving two figs about it.

Thief was within 1200 range of you unstealthed blew 4 long CDs to land two Hits, no different then most big hits that happen in WvW, it sucks when it happens but WvW will never be balanced, you will never see those numbers in PvP just because less stats and less damage modifiers. Fun fact you can get hit from a well setup maul for 18k in PvP the Ranger was super glass and died when sneezed on though, that was the biggest hit I have seen in PvP to date.

So far the classes I know that can land over 20k hits in WvW are Revenant CoR doesn’t need any setup just hit CoR and can easily achieve over 15k damage, Warrior with Gun Flame, Warrior with Arc Divider hits for over 15k easily, Ranger with Maul can hit for 20k with setup, and Thief running full Signet with setup on D/D with Berserker gear. I haven’t seen other classes achieve anything higher than these ones.

Huge difference is that Rev and Warrior have huge tells, AKA Telegraph on Rev and “Cast” animation on Gun Flame. The range only means kitten on blob fights, thieves just deal the damage from literally nowhere (stealth spam cancer).

Edit: And for Rev at least to deal above 15k+ crit against a glass build you pretty much need to have the stars aligned.

Rizigmar.2681:

sophiewhite.3149:

5 pages of people complaining because theyd rather nerf than get better at the game.

I find this comment ironic, because thief players will preach the same sort of nerfs to other classes when they can’t roll them over easy, and lose their marbles when you tell them to get better at the game, because their class takes the ultimate skillz to play.

Yep, double moral at its finest.

Buran.3796:

^ Has a lot of blocks and evades but the stunbreaks are a bit clunky, to say the least.

Take a look at the main (only) playable build: power Herald with Glint/Shiro and Devastation, Invocation and Herald traitlines. You have a good breakstun in Gaze of Darkness, with a 20s cd, but the breakstun from legend swap is situational and sometimes using it throws for 10 seconds the tools you want. And then is the third breakstun, Riposting Shadows, which costs 30 energy units in a skill bar in which everything costs 30+, so you can’t even use all your Shiro skills in a row even if your energy is at max (100 unitsa).

Rev is currently a high risk, low reward class.

Exactly and specially the last line, Rev might not be garbage tier but the risk/reward ratio is so gross when other classes like Warrior are literally the opposite, low risk/high reward.

Call me hipster but as soon as I realized that, I could not keep playing my Warrior much longer so I and went back to my Mallyx Rev, Zerk’s toolkit is so overtuned for the easy of use it has.

Boonbot apparently. If you want great pressure, sustain and be good at team fights play a Berserker instead, if you enjoy 1v1s play a thief or mesmer.

This BS also happens in PvP, and are arguably the best class for solo que.

BlaqueFyre.5678:

XxsdgxX.8109:

DrDivine.5378:

This profession has had an interesting history, from being almost unusable to becoming the staple on any serious team. People might disagree with me on this, but one issue I’ve always had with the revenant in pvp is that it doesn’t feel like it knows what it wants to be.

Power shiro, the most prominent build in it’s history, is really just a thief. Once they were able to take their role back as the sort of glassy but very mobile dps, they don’t have much to work with. The revenant is a heavy class, but it doesn’t really take hits (conditions for that matter) very well.

Thief and mesmer used to suffer from this problem for the longest time, the reason old fashioned shatter power mesmer didn’t work is because it was heaviy countered by thief but trying to fight for that role of “glassy mobile dps guy” and failed. Once mesmer started to lean towards it’s own role, the really annoying confusion, manipulation with portal it started to stand on it’s own. Thats what we need right now. Thief and mesmer are now doing their own things, revenant needs to do the same.

It was jack of all trades (and master of none), but the saltiness of people destroyed the class and now it does at best an average job at niche things, it’s pretty sad because arguably it’s one of the most interesting classes, both mechanically and thematically.

And you can see how people in general don’t give kitten about balance when they keep expressing how happy they are that the class they hate is almost unusable and hope it stays dead.

You mean it was shipped overpowered compared to all other Classes forcing Multiple classes out of their Roles for close to a Year.

Sorry the Rev finally got a dose of reality, maybe now they will start fixing its plethora of bugs instead of making it rely on overpowered skills.

First one, here we go. Good mature community proving my points.

DrDivine.5378:

This profession has had an interesting history, from being almost unusable to becoming the staple on any serious team. People might disagree with me on this, but one issue I’ve always had with the revenant in pvp is that it doesn’t feel like it knows what it wants to be.

Power shiro, the most prominent build in it’s history, is really just a thief. Once they were able to take their role back as the sort of glassy but very mobile dps, they don’t have much to work with. The revenant is a heavy class, but it doesn’t really take hits (conditions for that matter) very well.

Thief and mesmer used to suffer from this problem for the longest time, the reason old fashioned shatter power mesmer didn’t work is because it was heaviy countered by thief but trying to fight for that role of “glassy mobile dps guy” and failed. Once mesmer started to lean towards it’s own role, the really annoying confusion, manipulation with portal it started to stand on it’s own. Thats what we need right now. Thief and mesmer are now doing their own things, revenant needs to do the same.

It was jack of all trades (and master of none), but the saltiness of people destroyed the class and now it does at best an average job at niche things, it’s pretty sad because arguably it’s one of the most interesting classes, both mechanically and thematically.

And you can see how people in general don’t give kitten about balance when they keep expressing how happy they are that the class they hate is almost unusable and hope it stays dead.

The damage is so stupid high and constant that if I wanted to be unfair with thieves I’d just nerf it, but no the best and most fair solution would be to add an ICD.

Holy kitten, yes I hate mesmers too when played correctly but I’m also tired of the constant crying to “nerf everything I don’t like”. It’s getting pretty kittening annoying and it really starts to remind me of Destiny’s PvP which has always been kind of a kittenhole, kinda like here with devs overnerfing/overbuffing whatever garbage they see on the forums. Like people right now bringing up UA being OP, wtf? Wow rofl, guys you should reread what you write before posting it.

And almost everyone keeps forgetting that low risk/high reward is the no brainer clue to balance. Example right now is DH and Warrior, their easy of use is almost unreal, and even thief (inb4 ninjas triggered). It should always be low risk/low reward, high risk/high reward.

Cynz.9437:

Burn.5401:

Cynz.9437:

Burn.5401:

Cynz.9437:

Revs needed nerfs badly, they are roamers after all and roamers are not supposed to be so stupidly strong (Anet logic, not mine). Not to mention until all HoT specs (rev including) get nerfed, there should be no buffs.

thief main

So? Why should Anet treat revs differently than thieves? Welcome to the club.

Dunno, your post is ironic since thieves atm are the ones that are stupidly strong.

In what exact way?

Dude, thief is stupid powerful at the moment, and the excuse is that it doesn’t give boons to a party so it is way overtuned in every other aspect.

Lonewolf Kai.3682:

Chewablesleeptablet.3185:

WHY HAS THIS NOT BEEN FIXED? ITS BEEN THERE SINCE RELEASE!

Because nerfs take priority…..

Lel?

LinhZeri.6412:

Revenant needs to have its damage back on sword skill 2 or revamp the skill to something new.. I mean the description doesn’t even make sense for it precision strike yet hits like a wet noodle. Right now it tickles more then a firefly monster does. Just saying. Staff 5 is acceptable however missed. the staff 3 was un-needlessly increased in cooldown as well after those other 2 changes. Just the typical overnerf like so much balance is these days.

DH: lol so outrageous it has an on point random brain dead trap spam with low cooldowns. Decrease duration of shield of courage to 3 seconds…(making bulwark trait more relevant for increased shielding… give and take for balance) Increase cooldowns on traps and these will be in line. Oh yeah spear of justice shouldn’t be unblockable. Those the only 2 things making this specialization outrageous. ..

Druid: Thye aren’t fine. Just nerf the HoT pets and put in line with the other pets and then they will have to use other amulets to actually do damage. You do damage or your do major healing… you should NOT be able to do both. Oh nvm this gw2.

game needs serious build diversity another reason it has gone to what it is now with balance. Many useless stuff sitting in utilities in all game modes.

Agreed and this right here —→

Ross Biddle.2367:

Xca.9721:

I love how noone mentions Rev since its already dead.

That’s because we celebrate success, which this thread is not about.

Is the reason this game will never be even close to be decently balanced, with such gross and immature attitude.

Burn.5401:

Rev’s the only class in HoT that’s been fun for me to play due to the highly active/reactive gameplay. But yeah, let’s push passives more and replace him with the passive king (Warrior) for this season. I’m so glad this game’s forcing people to reroll with every patch, keeps the meta fresh right?

Yup, couldn’t have said it better. kittening gross how braindead Zerks and DHs are and I used to main all the Heavy armor classes along with Necro, Revenant was by far the most active/complex one with great reward for that. It’s kittening sad.