Guild Wars 2

Justin ODell.9517:

I love the game, but I have many of the same complaints as any of the other players on the forum. I was getting trolled pretty hard by Hugh the other day… hambow is pretty OP, has nothing to do with him being better than me.

The devs are fed up with warriors

This is at least my take on the upcoming changes to pvp ‘rewards’, my overall point is how people’s progress in pvp up to now is basically being reset and many pve players will in fact get a jump start. To help iterate it, lets follow the path of two players who joined at day 1 with a smile on their face…

Player A joins the game at release, experiences all aspects of the game whilst leveling up to 80 but ultimately decides that they don’t really enjoy the nature of pvp and sticks to playing pve, only rarely dipping their toes into pvp.

Player B joins the game at release, experiences all aspects of the game whilst leveling up to 80 but ultimately decides that they don’t really enjoy the nature of pve and sticks to playing pvp, only rarely dipping their toes into pve.

In the 1.5 years since release, Player A has gained 2 amazing looking legendary items by playing the world events he enjoys and gaining gold and materials through dungeons and wvw, was able to obtain any armour skin he wanted with the same ease as any other player aiming to obtain an armour skin that they wanted, and even his rare ventures into pvp hotjoins with people from his guild have paid off because the skins are very widely obtainable. So even if he has been eyeing up a very high ranked skin, they are now easy for everyone to obtain, regardless of whether your taste favours the high ranked pvp skins or not.

In the 1.5 years since release Player B has had no access to legendary items whatsoever, gained no gold or useful materials for the most part, has had to grind ranks in order to receive certain mediocre skins which were vastly more obtainable through pve means, and even his ventures into pve/wvw with his guild go largely unrewarded as their gear is sub-par and they have very few gold to fuel consumables to even the playing field.

Now lets look forward.

Lets say that at some point in the next few months, perhaps in more than one patch, the following proposed changes from the pvp rewards blogs happen;

#Gear is carried over into both pve and pvp
#Legendary skins become available for pvp use
#Glory is removed as a currency

Player A stands to gain ;

-His Legendary skins in pvp
-Extra sets of gear which is actually of use in pve for different gear setups
-Loses nothing

Player B stands to gain;

-No ‘extra’ sets of gear carrying over as pvp stats are changed through amulets, only one copy of your favourite skin = you are done, extra skins are of no use
-No legendary item carrying over into either pvp/pve for their playing up to this point
-Loses the currency which at one point was their equivalent of gold meaning that even if a pvp grind towards a legendary was introduced, they have to start at square 1

Player A has been reaping the best rewards in the game from playing pve and will then go straight in at the top in terms of pvp rewards after the patch, Player B has been getting shafted from playing pvp in terms of rewards and will be bottom of the barrel post patch.

I’m sorry, but how is it fair, how is it a good move?

I know the devs refer to ‘things they can’t discuss yet’ a lot with pvp, but with the information we have right now, this scenario is how things are going to pan out, a massive slap in the face to pvp players, a massive pat on the back to pve players.

I would love some word from the devs that this isn’t what is going to happen to the people who have stuck with pvp even through the bad times, even through the early months, even through skyhammer, even through hambow.

But being honest, my prediction is that this is exactly what will happen, and there will be no remorse.

All is not vain, just pvp is.

kokiman.2364:

Lord Hammer Hand.4815:

thats crazy better than any rank finisher

Is there actually anything thats exclusive to sPvP?

Crushed dreams and no rewards, those are pretty exclusive.

I have no idea how it is going to pan out, honestly, but tbh it had better be something good for pvp players with at least some kind of recognition system for the pvp you have already done. I’ve been playing since release and still don’t have the frozen pvp staff/scepter that I want. That might sound like a petty complaint, but in pvp we have nothing else to even aspire to other than skins, so beggars can’t really be choosers. That’s despite spending 500k+ Glory trying to get the rare craft and getting nothing but copies of the same skin.

By comparison if I had spent as much time in pve as I have in pvp since release I’d be sitting on at least two legendary items or probably more [I’m pretty sure I seen someone with 4 or more somewhere], whereas playing only pvp I have nothing to show for it, not even the skins that I wanted that aren’t as amazing looking as the legendary skins whichdon’t exist in pvp. So if pve players cry that pvp makes some of their armour ‘easier to get’ I have no sympathy, at all.

You must be new around here.

JETWING.2759:

azuzephyr.7280:

The build in question is FOUR signet-1 shout hambow with unknown traits.

Source; https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/members/JETWING-2759/showposts

I don’t like Berserk Stance… Then i slotted signet of fury

Not sure if srs or Troll but lets roll with it anyway.

Why are you complaining about conditions being OP when you ’don’t like’ 8 seconds of immunity to them?

Harper.4173:

I like how warriors are regarded kitten OP in PVE – but I’ve never seen a high-end PVE run fail because they didn’t bring warriors.
I’ve seen them fail for not bringing guardians.

If warriors are so OP in PVE why is it that any high-level fractal or harder PVE content almost requires that you have a guardian?

You need a guardian to give the four zerker warriors protection form spamming hammer. That is it.

The build in question is FOUR signet-1 shout hambow with unknown traits.

Source; https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/members/JETWING-2759/showposts

KratosAngel.7289:

Also, you can’t either in Lich Form.
All this share one common point : using a different “form”, which prevents you from any interaction (except looting)

Except, y’know, mist form

If you are losing to a condition class as a warrior in the space of 20 seconds, that is definitely you.

You can go Immune for 8 seconds for God’s sake, that’s before cleansing ire/Lyssa. If you had played with stability right you wouldn’t have taken the fear damage. That is more than enough breathing room to rip into a necro while they can do nothing back to you.

I’m honestly struggling to understand what you could have been doing for 20 seconds apart form standing there cheering them on in order to get a screenshot to help prove your point.

EDIT: nvm, on closer inspection you seem to have forgot to mention that it was a 2v1, cute

Burnfall.9573:

I Respect your opinion OP. I will leave you with this..

Thief class;

You are not a victim.
No matter what your Justification is,
No matter what your reason is,
No matter what your excuse is,
No matter what you say,
You have no reason to be Justified,
You have no reason to be reasoned,
You have no reason to be excused,
You have no reasoned to be heard,
You are not the one in suffering,
You are not the one in Pain,
You are not the one in Tears,
You are not the one in Brokenness,
You are not the one in Bondage,
By the hand of our abuser,
By the hand of

YOU

Beautiful.

This thread needs more thief tears

I think people are getting way ahead of themselves with this, even for builds which benefit quite a lot from healing power it’s still too weak a stat to have as your only defence. For meds I’d still rather go either zerker or soldier.

Healing power on a meds build with 0 toughness or vitality from gear is basically going to be as glassy as a zerker but with significantly less damage.

style.6173:

@OP: A thread like this is pointless. You need to specific what type of game mode. Anyone who answers without specifying is either new or only plays in one game mode (PvE, PvP, or WvW). Even within those, there are differences, but the 3 are good at a high level.

Why? Warrior is God tier in every mode in the game

He wasn’t actively reacting to the passives, duh

Mine is currently fearing twice, once when I’m downed and once again when I’m finished

One word: Warriors

Not even slightly, there’s a reason people don’t run the ‘unorthodox’ builds.

Cleansing ire/healing signet/lyssa runes/ doublestance & doublesignet utilities – attach weapon of choice and facetank whatever you’d like. There really isn’t a skill in the game that would punish this setup in a way that you couldn’t shake off

There are a lot of traits long overdue for review, in the endless list of broken/OP/useless traits and abilities critical infusion is so low on the radar that it barely even qualifies.

It double sucks because depending on how much of a cut this turns out to be it’s only going to push people more towards using PU troll junkspec if GS/sword builds are hit too hard.

They should have just made the guardian active heal our heal and kept the passive.

Considering how much of a crutch consume conditions is for necro as a class any other heal has to be very good before you could consider replacing consume as a heal.

Not only is Sov not competitively good, it’s utter trash even under best circumstances

Why do I get the feeling that a lot of this is due to PU.

Shatter/phantasm do not have too many defense options, it’s only PU which becomes untouchable between spamming stealth, aegis, blocks and evades ontop of that.

Why do they add in OP trash traits and then balance around that

Mid bunker, attributes: be a Guardian

Roamer, attributes; be a Thief

Condition pressure, attributes; be a Necro

Decap, attributes; be an Engi

Warrior, attributes; be a Warrior

Conditions do higher base damage because if they increased it’s reliance on condition duration then condition duration would have to be added to an amulet, and that would mean a reworking of every fear/immob/chill duration before they got out of hand. And if we’re being honest, that’s more work than has gone into pvp balance in the past 9 months.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Did you lose to a necro using Signet of Vampirism?

Nobody ever lost to someone using SoV

Body/gloves/legs/boots: Orrian [heavy]

Helm: Grenth hood

Weapon: Gargoyle scythe [staff]

Wow, we are waiting months for Healing signet to be mini-nerfed, but this absolutely had to be put in ASAP before it destroyed balance.

wat

Long story short it’s been a long time since I played Mesmer in tpvp and I’m struggling to get back into it.

I don’t really like the typical shatter builds and the thought of degrading myself by playing PU is just too sickening.

But, my phantasm build is just plain sucking atm. Is it totally dead or does anyone have anything up their sleeve? Preferably with a GS

Much love, zepf.

The meta still needs GC roamers, any attrition specs [not that there are any good ones in this game] would be relegated strictly to team fights because a 1v1 on far point as an attrition spec would run the risk of having someone else from their team come to help, securing the point. Being able to KO the far point defender in a matter of seconds OR realize it wont happen and blink back to the team fight is far more valuable.

Certain glass specs take a lot of skill to play; power necro/power ranger/ele those specs are very active in how they survive and one mistake on your part will mean a loss.

The only glass specs we actually see in the meta, however, revolve around spamming high damage attacks while at the same time using non-counterable defences; glass mesmer using invuln/stealth, glass thief spamming evade, blink & stealth, glass guardian spamming block & blind, glass warrior spamming damage & cc immunity. Those do not take skill, those are built for putting up a non-counterable wall to cover you while you burst down the enemy before they can touch you.

Harbinger.8637:

scerevisiae.1972:

Harbinger.8637:

However they are a small group with limited amount of resources. So it takes time to fix all the issues we are currently seeing at the moment.

But that’s the real question: why is there a lack of resources? why is class balancing such a low priority?

Lack of players = lack of resources. Majority of their money comes from PvE, after that it’s WvW.

But there isn’t even class balance for pve. In fact I’d say it’s even worse, anything other than a zerk warrior just doesn’t exist. I just get the impression that they either don’t get that people are hating the state of balance or they are under some delusion that balance is fine as it is. Maybe they have just cut their losses, who knows

For scope, this is a B2P game gaining revenue from gem sales which typically go on shiny new armour skins and we have waited months for them to make tiny adjustments to class balance. By comparison I play Marvel Heroes by Gazillion which is a very low budget F2p game which also works on gem sales. That company did a class-wide evaluation of damage and survivability in November, continually pushes out tweaks to balance on a weekly basis, chooses 2-3 classes each month to receive a complete overhaul of their traits + abilities which often includes adding new ones in addition to revamping old/unused ones while at the same time updating their gem store with fantastic skins [note: not recolours of existing ones] and pushing out a new class each month. All I can say is how refreshing it feels playing that game compared to how much of a dredge it can feel playing here at times, their pvp is far from perfect but at least people are having fun.

There is no real excuse for leaving balance adjustments this long, we need them now.

Stop griefing yourself and just reroll. The only way to enjoy pvp at the minute is to pick whichever powerful meta build you hate the least and go with it.

Forget whichever weaponset you like the most, forget the traits you find interesting or the playstyle you enjoy and just go with what is powerful because the bottom line is that those builds are the only builds that are getting attention for the foreseeable future.

Let me tell you – you can waste your breathe making suggestions that go under-valued, you can stress yourself over trying to compete using a sub-par build vs the behemoth meta builds, you can destroy your love of the game with pride over not going with fotm and you can live in unfulfilled hope that the meta will shift soon. Or, you can just drop the pretense and start enjoying the pvp side of the game for what it has become; cheese vs cheese.

Minion necro is definitely up there, but just do yourself a favour and go with it.

I’m very disheartened with the lack of love pvp is getting. I mean major updates like new modes, new traits etc I could deal with waiting for, but balance is disgusting atm. Hardcounter traits, zeroskill 1man tank setups, lyssalol troll builds. It’s the main thing putting me off the game atm.

Some of my favourite weaponsets are just totally pushed out of the meta because they are overlooked, totally rolled by the specs dominating the scene and just flat out dont compete for effectiveness. It’s very poo thinking that we are waiting months for a tiny shave to healing signet when there are traits and weapons which need drastic attention – but how many years will it be if an 8% shave to a steaming pile of dump skill took nearly a year from last summer.

I don’t QQ anymore I just don’t join pvp as much as I used to. People have been around since before there even were leaderboards and got nothing compared to people who played 1-2months during the skyhammer craze.

Elmo Benchwarmer.3025:

But yes, Automated Response is at the core of the problem. I play Engineer almost exclusively but I never touch that trait. I hate it with a passion. I’m close to reporting everyone who uses it. It is just griefing.

Grief traits are all the rage, I suggest you get used to it as I have because they are only growing in number

Setun.4368:

Tim.6450:

Maybe instead of leaps we should receive reverse-teleports ( teleport an enemy to the necromancer)? We would still be a low mobility class but we can keep our enemies in combat.

This 100%. I love spectral grasp so much on my necro. It would be awesome if there were more effects like this. First thought is if someone hits a spectral wall could there be a 2nd move with it that pulls any that hit the wall to the necro.

I will say that with 86% condition duration and access to 4 chill skills, I can keep someone perma-chilled with 20+ sec of chill for the duration of a fight most of the time (condition cleanses obviously chance that up, but still, that’s a ton of chill duration.)

Also if any of y’all are playing Norn Necro’s snow leopard form is a godsend for escaping while roaming / small man havocs.

To start spectral grasp would need fixing, I can’t count how many times it just flies in the wrong direction, produces ‘obstructed’ on targets less than 600 range away or just doesn’t pull the target any closer to you when it does hit.

Even with practice shroud stomping is unreliable at best.

On topic: Wod on it’s own barely warrants slotting, even fully traited it is still weak but at least could give a chill [even this only lasts as long as they stand in it]. As people have already said, a fully traited well build serves no purpose and even in hotjoins people aren’t that stupid to just stand in them til they die.

Wells are just an odd skill for necros. They’re an aoe burst on an ‘attrition’ class. The thief blind field works so well because in the space of 1-2 missed attacks they could have burst you down significantly, a necro can’t really suppourt the same playstyle atm. I’d prefer the suggestion that wells were larger, had longer durations and ticked less frequently so that people basically had to stand in them because they are up for so long, but slowly suffer being periodically blinded/damaged etc. That would be awesome.

Cynz.9437:

i don’t get it, why do people even queue up when they are not gonna play

People might have to go unexpectedly AFK, disconnect, alt-tab out to read the web when the que is taking forever. But why they don’t show up to the game in time isn’t really the point, the current system makes it a massive dump for everyone concerned. Your team is down 1 player, that player gets dishonoured and even the other team will probably enjoy the game a little less knowing that there was no real challenge beating a team with 20% fewer players.

A simple ready check system would make it a joy for everyone. I just have no idea why it isn’t happening.

I just laugh whenever the ‘necro is the one class you can’t run away from’ quote comes back. Necro is hands down the easiest class to run away from, even worse as power. All slows you have access to have a huge cooldown, single target casts, unecessarily long cast times that require you to be facing your target. Compare that to sceptre 2 which can actually be reliably used to snare and it’s bull.

The classes that you can’t run away from are the ones who have the best ability to run away themselves. Once there’s a thief/warrior on you they are impossible to shake, doubly so as power

When warriors aren’t running healing signet there is a drastic difference in how tough the fight is/how easily they hover at near full HP. They are actually susceptible to CC, will have to go on the defensive to pull off the heal and you can interrupt it.

Every time I play pvp I’m a little more disgusted by healing signet carrying terrible plays, 1v1 a warrior can walk into anything that they should have dodged and shrug it off. 1 missed dodge vs a hambow/condition and you are finished in seconds.

I love how the balance preview is shaving a tiny 8% from healing signet but wasn’t afraid to take an axe to the kneecap of other specs

If they actually made the vampiric traits worthwhile outside of zookeeper builds then no healing in deathshroud would be justifiable

If they had gone ahead and made sigil of vampirism actually siphon health to make a real siphon build I would have been a very happy puppy

Nothing, because that’s what we’ll get

Oh good, pvp is dying on the vine without a word from the devs and we’re in here playing reddit

Sari.9836:

It is not WvW killing or hurting sPvP per se, neither is it PvE.
The real issue lies in the decisions made by the developers.
They brought in so many changes many people over the whole game were not screaming for. Ascended Gear ? Seasons ?
I think these are really the flaws:

• Common balance:
• Homogenization of PvE, WvW, sPvP: * Lowering of skill ceiling: A good, competitive game has a high amount of complexity and a high amount of skill involved at high levels. There is still a difference but what they did with each consecutive big change to sPvP was lowering the ceiling.
• Lack of proper feedback:
• eSports:

Hit the nail on the head.

They are making changes/advancements that you might consider ‘late stage’.

Adding ongoing pve saga content, seasons/ladders for pvp, ranking, trying to push for esports is all stuff you might be doing to a game in it’s adolescent years. None of that is any good if the foundation work isn’t sound. And the state of pvp is far from good enough to start expanding into new territory like this.

Focus on balance and new game modes so people are at least having fun on a basic level then look for new ways to challenge them.

That being said, while it is probably too early to be looking at the kinds of changes they are making, it is also way too late to just start to look at some serious balancing. I think even if they unveiled huge sweeping class reworks tomorrow it’d be too late for most to turn things around.

I’d be all for tiny adjustments if they were happening on a frequent basis, but waiting months for tweaks which are making almost no difference is not okay. The balance in pvp is taking away too much of the fun to make it worthwhile. I find myself playing a F2p game more so than GW2 atm which is sad considering I thought GW was going to rock the gaming world before it released

I ran out of breath reading that in my head

Seriously, a handful of tiny shaves is called a Kneejerk change? pvp could use kneejerk changes, lots of them, just test them out on a public ptr beforehand.

I’m not hopefull for this ‘massive’ alteration in the ominous future tbh

It all sounds great, but they are really good at putting out great sounding podcasts/blog posts, actually implementing them, well…

Lets just say it took them months to shave Healing signet by 8%, so I’ll just sit back and wait to see how long it takes for anything to materialize from this

The guy at rank 11 has 14 games under his belt, I never realized how bad the leaderboards actually were

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

Romek.4201:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

Archaon.6245:

why not just get rid of adrenal health? That is the real problem imo when paired with hs (Always)

why not just learn to counter warriors properly and stop complaining? That is the real problem imo when paired with players who are doing puny damage.

you should stop your spam – rly – it is not even funny or so

how about you warrior haters stop complaining and learn to play the game?
whiners always win unfortunately.

anyway i learned something from this.

just keep complaining about something, and they will eventually nerf.
time to do the same to other professions that i do not like then.

remember, you warrior haters started it first.

You have been doing ranked matches for 5 minutes and haven’t played anything but warrior while doing so.

Maybe if you had a clue you’d see that 30phs reduction is nothing on this ability.

Go back under the bridge, quietly.

I was very let down with the lack of legendries with the update tbh. They have made it clear that glory is going the way of the dodo, which basically means that whenever they introduce legendary skins to pvp that it will require some kind of new grind and ignore everyone’s progress up to now.

That’s total bs, there are people playing casual pve since launch with more than one legendary and we’re still waiting to even begin one.

Step in the right direction yes, but big oversight and kick in the flapjack at the same time.

Arganthium.5638:

I’ve disproven your poll using facts about statistical observation; .

You literally have done the exact opposite, come in with 0 evidence and just bashed mine which is disproving you. But if you’re that deep into the well then just stay there.

A difference of over 50% caused by order bias in a totally optional poll? Get out of this thread and take that claim to be a theorycrafter out of your sig, this is embarrassing.