Guild Wars 2

MonMalthias.4763:

Now, Elite Supplies is a bad trait, and people should feel bad for taking it

The second you would say something like this, you lose most credibility with reasonable players. Any time you are going to insult part of the community for using the traits they want, you alienate yourself from them in any future discussion. The fact that you would add this to any post, simply to make a personal jab at another poster for having a differing opinion.

The trait is not a bad one at all. It literally buffs all 3 of the professional oriented elites.

Merlin Dyfed Avalon.5046:

I Like the chages too, but again they are totally negated by what some professions get to compliment their current builds and/or creat options for new builds (spvp).

Every class got a “press this button to kitten ton of damage without consequence” skill that can be dodged, while having acces to vigor and evade skills ON WEAPONS not to mention ways to cover heals,

Is that so? So break it down for use, and by profession, what “press one button” skill did each profession get that “doeas a kitten ton of damage”? Specifically warriors, engineers, elementalist, and thieves. List thier massive damage buffs your claiming and how much damage the buff is please.

Merlin Dyfed Avalon.5046:

expecting necro to save the dodge for that 8 second CD skill. Without vigor and being focused troughout the encounter.

Don’t be foolish. Every profession gets focused. Stop attempting to suggest only the necromancer get focused, its unreasonable.

Merlin Dyfed Avalon.5046:

i guess they saw necro getting rekt in their tests and decided to give that cd reduction on a skill that literally gets it’s boon stripped instantly

Who is stripping these boons? There are few boon stripping skills in the game and several of them are on our profession.

Merlin Dyfed Avalon.5046:

by proxy leaving a proc stunbreak in a stun immobilize heavy meta. stunned then evis oh look my stunbreak proc-ed after i took that huge burst accomplished by pressing 1 button.

Stun and immobilization are two entirely different things. The necromancer is the best profession to transfer condition, consume conditions, and remove conditions, that if you have a problem with immobilize, I have to feel it is truly your fault. Stuns, on the other hand are a different story. To be honest though, necros are no more susceptible to stuns then engineers are to to conditions.

It doesn’t seem productive to a low hit point threshold trait, to have an offensive boon trigger. To me, it would be much more logical to have a defensive boon trigger.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Am I the only necro that likes most of the changes?

The necro community made over 17 threads in 3 days to pitch a fit about the date they were even doing the ready up involving them. At that point was that not a sign of the unreasonable hate to come?

nearlight.3064:

You are misinformed. A well build wouldn’t take ritual of protection over staff mastery, and that’s only if they run 0/2/2/4/6 over 6/2/0/0/6. There’s also the outdated ascii build which is 0/5/4/4 I believe.

People that don’t seriously play necro in WvW or pvp shouldn’t be commenting on them like they actually know the class.

Ahem, I commanded on Jade Quarry for 6 hours last night (as well as regularly on other nights) on a build your suggesting does not exist. How is that possible?

TheDevice.2751:

coglin.1867:

TheDevice.2751:

What you stated is that necromancers have burst damage.

Quote the post I made this statement please.

You’re confusing yourself cog. What you said.. the point you where trying to make actually implies that we have burst damage and defense, not the other way around. What you said does not mean we have attrition, it means we have the opposite.

You didn’t literally say we have burst. Your arguments ended up saying that even though you meant them to say we have attrition.

Seems a little presumptuous to tell another what they meant.

Please do not read things into my argument, or tell me what my argument is, then use that as a basis for accusation. All I was doing was pointing out the defensive capability that allows them to last long enough to consider a battle, one of attrition.

Poplolita.2638:

The well build you’re talking about doesn’t go in death magic. Also, never said well is not viable.

Wait, you know specifically what builds the necromancer commanders on the tier one servers are using in front line commanding? can you post it for us?

TheDevice.2751:

What you stated is that necromancers have burst damage.

Quote the post I made this statement please.

Jayce.5632:

It won’t matter how durable you are when you’re constantly trying to figure out which way is up after being slapped all over the map.

It will matter more if you learn to dodge CC skills and use your blinds.

Don’t you have to be durable in order to survive well enough to define a a battle as one of attrition?

I just described a bursty Pure damage caster? How so? The only damage I mentioned what so ever was damage over time. Care to explain how you got “pure burst damage” out of all that I said?

Poplolita.2638:

Also, no viable build has “35% up time on protection”. Don’t mislead people with misinformations.

Are you disputing my facts? Seems your making accusations with no context.

A “well” build with Ritual of Protection is not viable?

TheDevice.2751:

Engineer, Elementalist, Mesmer, Warrior, Ranger

Try to come up with a reason why necro’s are… I’ll gladly accept the challenge.

Necromancer’s

They have twice the hit points of any of those professions.

35% up time on protection.

The ability to corrupt those professions boons into conditions.

The ability to remove, transfer, or consume condition at the highest rate of all the profession.

Highest condition damage out put.

Pets have been an integral part of MMOs for a very long time. Many players, including myself enjoy them greatly. They have been in the game and promoted since before release. It is not like they magically added them in out of no where after 2 years.

You are free to search out and move to a MMO that has no AI what so ever. Good luck.

No, we have stability. The problem with it, is that is is not on a skill that breaks stun, and it is a GTAoE

GreyWraith.8394:

DS associated mechanics need a re-design.

Why do they need a redesign? Every hour someone post somewhere on these forums that X mechanic or X skill needs a redesign, and almost none of them, just as you lacked here, offer even a slightly comprehensive reasoning to justify it.

Carighan.6758:

Meh, IMO I think all current +stat or duration effects (and minus ones, too) are quite too strong.

What I’d do:

• Reduce all stats on items and traits and runes and sigils by 60%. A traitline fully specced gives 120 points of a stat or 2% of a percentage.
• All base stats are increased by ~30%. A character basically gets half of what is lost in the specced part back, but for all stats.
• Rebalance skill durations for the lost duration to achieve the same 30% increased base.

In other words, reduce the extremes. Fully non-specced durations and stats are stronger, fully specced durations and stats are weaker.

I am completely against lowering the benefit for invested trait points. Personally I think it is a terrible idea for players investment benefits to be reduced for the trait points the earn.

Holl.3109:

We have a greatsword chainsaw skin, but still use axes to cut down trees…

Your troll post logic.

I can cut a tree down faster with a chainsaw, in a world with no 2 cycle engine fuel then in ax.

TheLastNobody.8319:

What if one of the gadget skills gave you stability if you had gadgeteer traited? Like…eh I don’t know slick shoes?

Also a good idea.

Just move it from toss elixir B to the actual utility elixir B and make it a stun breaker instead of elixir U

Box of Parana’s

The engineers underwater tool kit skill.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Box_of_Piranhas

Shaogin.2679:

his posts are constructive

Yes because using this line after you state your opinion is constructive
V

ArrDee.2573:

That’s a fact!

Intentionally declaring nonfactual statements as fact is not constructive. Neither is supporting those that do so. Newer players or newer engineers will not find this helpful either.

The best is when someone who uses repeated “stealth” and skills titled “backstab” and want to cry fowl. As well we have “mindstabs” and illusions, pets, , death itself, transformations, and thugs swinging massive hammers at us, and “traps” as well , but drop one crate on their head and the cry like little girls with a skinned knee.

Atherakhia.4086:

Any single attunement, kit, or weapon for those classes alone is better than what a Longbow or Greatsword is capable of. I’d probably argue in many cases they’re better than the combination of both weapons.

Prove it. Because I do not feel you would say that out right if you had any experience with either.

I will bring my warrior, and you bring your lone tool kit or lone flame thrower, in its current condition.

Lifestealer.4910:

there is literally no skill involved in these builds, its all passive, all you need to do is focus on staying alive which isn’t an issue since you can go the tankiest amulet with all defensive traits allowing you screw up a ton.

Perhaps at the skill level you play at. But many of us do not play at that low of a skill level. If “you” played them mindlessly, that was your decision, to play it so. That does not make it any less mindless then some of the lower level meta builds designed around the lowest effort requirement.

Aww, how cute. A random, self promoter assumes there opinion on the forums is a “fact”…….That’s a first.

As soon as they show me a receipt displaying that they payed for my copy of the game, I will start caring what they think about when I use my elite skill in a 1v1 against them. Until then, just tell them engineers have a trait that uses their tiers to lower the cool down on your next use of the skill.

ArrDee.2573:

Hello frands! Vee Wee here, #1 Engi NA and world first rank 80!

No thilly! Vee Wee has been creating Vee Wee’s own builds for 2 years now! Some of these builds are even quite popular Vee Wee has been told! Vee Wee was just giving an example! Turret builds are garbo! Someone who is really good at Engi, and even played a turret build in tournaments agrees! Even though Vee Wee has been saying turret builds are jokes since April 15, Vee Wee is not as efamous as a tournament winner! People are more inclined to listen to efamous people!

Also turret builds aren’t really that original!

Wahoo! Bye frands!

People are also inclined to develop deaf ears towards someone who tried to bash players with negativity for using a working build just because you do not like it. If you do not like turret builds, go make your own thread over it and stop being a “derail” troll and making this topic about it. You las few post offered nothing to the topic, but simply bashed a build simply because someone said they enjoyed it, yet the topic of your bashing has nothing to do with the topic of this thread.

Why would you suggest that they are not used in WvW? Protection when stunned+stabilized armor together is -53% damage when stunned. A great combo for the hammer train and small groups with a lot of CC, when you figure out stun breaks are 25s or longer cool downs.

Lightsbane.9012:

digitalruse.9085:

This ranks up there with hobosacks. Making a legendary for engis is discouraging cause we never get to see it.

some of us run builds centered around a weapon.

The problem is that these are the most limiting of all builds, and they are the most limiting and generally the weakest, by design. Either way, I am not sure why you mention that here, unless you are here to promote the “hobosack” and speak out against those who would like to be rid of them.

spoj.9672:

coglin.1867:

Although I agree, that necros do not have as much avoidance, they do have, protection, possibly the most powerful boon in the game, through converting invulnerability, ritual of protection, spectral armor, and spectral wall……………….I do feel they need a trait to offer at least some vigor though.

Protection is useless if you dont have the sustain to bring your hp back up. Which is pretty why necros are so bad at defence at the moment. We can take a lot of damage before going down but we have no way to bring it back up because we cant avoid, escape or heal enough when engaged. We either need far superior sustain (better than warriors) or more damage avoidance. Or both.

I suggested just that in the last line of my post that you quoted.

Roe.3679:

I can do those things on my necro, but they are all long cooldowns, and take up all my utility skills.

So if I do that, I can’t do the boon corruption or have any of our debatably effective escapes. Which are also on longer-ish than they deserve cooldowns.

I do not feel the wells are on a long cool down but spectral armor and spectral walk do seem like overly long cool downs though.

Muchacho.2390:

coglin.1867:

Muchacho.2390:

And all those builds were offensive builds.

What difference does that make. I have seen post after post of folks claiming they need this buff or that buff, because they were not predominant in the last tournament. The build is completely irrelevant. In this tourny, they were fairly prevalent.

No, it seems you misunderstand me. You asked you why necros needed defensive buffs in the first place and my answer was because the defensive side of necros is bad. That remark with the offensive builds was only to point that out.

You could say it is the same like spirit weapons of guardians, because they are bad Anet wants to buff them. Essentially making underperforming things better. And you wouldnt say because guardians have a good representation in ToL, Spirit weapons dont need a buff, would you?

That’s not a very logical train of thought. How do you compare buffing AI summon pets, for a lack of a better term, to buffing the over all defense of an entire profession? Boon stripping and as high an uptime as any profession on protection, combined with the ability to clear conditions better then any profession in the game, plus a second health pull sums up to be extremely defensive for me when I am a commander in WvW on my necromancer.

3s every 32s for well of blood, 3s every 28s for well of suffering, 3s every 32s for well of corruption, 3s every 40s for well of power.

That is a 40% up time if you use wells consecutively or in conjunction. If you space them out and ignore the idea of using them for protection, you will still have a 35%-37% up time on protection. I do not consider that low at all. As well it can be increased a fair bit with various rune sets.

Although I agree, that necros do not have as much avoidance, they do have, protection, possibly the most powerful boon in the game, through converting invulnerability, ritual of protection, spectral armor, and spectral wall……………….I do feel they need a trait to offer at least some vigor though.

It is happening to rampage. So it will be effecting eles, engineers, necros, and warriors all relatively equally. Not that warriors flock to rampage, but I know some engineers exploit rampage’s/tornado’s unreasonable power boost to exploit mine, mine field, BoB, acid elixir, and turret damage.

Muchacho.2390:

And all those builds were offensive builds.

What difference does that make. I have seen post after post of folks claiming they need this buff or that buff, because they were not predominant in the last tournament. The build is completely irrelevant. In this tourny, they were fairly prevalent.

nearlight.3064:

coglin.1867:

I dunno. I saw very many necros in the recent ToL. I saw no reason they needed any defensive buffs at all.

I’m glad many necros were seen. They did die pretty easily if they were focused in team fights though, which is why overall compositions and deciding where the necro goes was critical to their success. Its pretty anti-meta to use them since they counter much of the celestial boon spam of the current meta fairly well.

You do realize that every profession dies pretty easily when focused be the other team, so I have no idea where your trying to take that part.

Its Anti meta? over 40 of the top 64 teams in both NA and EU had them on their team. That IS what defines them as being part of the meta.

I dunno. I saw very many necros in the recent ToL. I saw no reason they needed any defensive buffs at all.

The claim that heal and support are your only options is a load. Eles have great damage. Particularly AoE. One of the best for destroying siege on a wall, as well as damaging and inhibiting those attacking your walls.

Report him in game rather then giving him undeserved advertisement here.

Sykper.6583:

The signet is not a problem

coglin.1867:

Seems a bit hypocritical based on how many post you made complaining about engineers passive automated response trait.

….What? I haven’t had anything to say poorly about Engineers in any recent posts…or even in months. You might have confused me for someone else.

Edit: Oh kitten, editting options OP.[/quote]

Because you jumped on the band wagon to get it nerfed long enough ago that it wasn’t recent times, it has been many many months. Fact is, you still jumped on those threads and demanded that any skill or trait that promoted passive play was “atrocious”, promoted a lack of skilled play, and other comments imying insults to anyone who used it…………..Here you defend it…………That is the purest definition of a hypocritical pattern to me. Maybe we use different dictionaries?

yolo swaggins.2570:

Mayama.1854:

yolo swaggins.2570:

Just pointing out a few things:

1.) There is no such thing as “perma” anything for the thief. If a thief was “perma-resetting” they would be immortal which is just exaggerating a falacy..

Thieves can reset at will as often as they want. To proof it you just need to watch a twitch or youtube video from any decent thief. I mean theirs even a good example on the thief forum right now, the video of that engi that duels P/D thieves. In every single video the thief constantly reseted the fight and only died because he overextended or did a stupid mistake. Its known throughout the community that a thief can reset as often as he wants if he knows what he does.

That still isn’t perma-resetting.

Secondly, resetting is a double-edged sword since both parties get reset; not to mention that if the thief keeps resetting, it means that the other player is superior. All said player has to do is manage their snares better and up their DPS and they will get their kill. So there shouldn’t be a problem here.

Yeah it kinda is “perma-resetting” in this context.

As far as the “double edge sword” aspect, thats is not the case. Which is in itself the problem. A thief not skilled enough to kill another play can keep “perma-resetting” and try again all they like. That is an option that no other profession has. No other profession can play badly AND get away with it by resetting to try again. When other professions play badly, they die.

Sagat.3285:

I do play condi kit engi and ele actually, my point those two set up can be rewarding but are not all it doesn’t have to be zerker stats. Complicated get’s easy over time that’s not high risk and I go arcana on my ele because I like having all skills as soon as possible. High risk and complicated are not the same lol.

If I’m lost please enlighten me sir share us your high reward/high risk specs that are not zerker related.

Apparently you missed it earlier. I cannot enlighten you on anything, because apparently we disagree. The problem appears to be that you think your opinion of high risk/high reward is cannon. Apparently the concept of subjective opinion is a foreign concept to you my friend.

Sykper.6583:

Engineers and Necromancers specifically can and will get their conditions across even on the current incarnation of warriors.

And? It has already been proven in practice, in a multitude of posted videos, and old fashion math, that power engineer or necro puts out as much damage in soldiers gear as they do in dire. CI simply lets you mitigate more damage of a condition damage user then a direct damage user.

Sykper.6583:

The reapplication and ‘layering’ is far higher than CI can influence, and the adrenaline nerf will force warriors running LB to save their full adrenaline only for LB and never their other set. The Adrenaline nerf is big enough to have competant Warriors change their playstyles while the mindless ones get weeded out.

Heaven forbid though, that warriors actually have to think in battle and use there adrenaline wisely, similar to how they other professions have to use there professions in battle. (Strange, I never would have guessed that warrior tears were more pink then a mesmers)

Sykper.6583:

The signet is not a problem

Seems a bit hypocritical based on how many post you made complaining about engineers passive automated response trait.

Trust me, if they had a “charm” skill, I would be all over what ever profession it was on. I have always LOVED charm spells in every MMO. The problem is, well, just look at the ranger pet problems.

Me Games Ma.8426:

coglin.1867:

I think what most peoples problem with it is, that this clone will immobilize you and limit your reaction option very much.

The clone will only cripple you. The immobilize is done by Swap.

Bah, I new that, and said that in another thread, or maybe even this one previously. Thanks for correcting my mistake.

The problem I meant, was that is they can swap instantly after they spawn the clone, you will be immobilized. Causing a problem with too easy of a burst to set up. Other professions have a travel time or what not. If there is any type of delay what so ever though, it won’t be a problem. So basically everyone is going bat shoot crazy over something they haven’t even experienced yet.

musu.9205:

And clearly op has little knowledge about what the high risk/high reward build
are.

I do agree with this completely. The problem is that everyone thinks there opinion of high risk/high reward is cannon. Apparently the concept of subjective opinion is a foreign concept to so many here. Some of those folks need to play a elementalist or multi kit engineer against actual skilled players, before suggesting they are not complicated or high risk to play.

NinjaEd.3946:

You have stealth too, tell me what is telegraphed about your stealth combos? Don’t look at similar skills so plainly, there is more to ileap-> swap and the Mesmer in general for it being telegraphed.

I do? What am I David Copperfield? Unlike yourself, I have leveled all 8 profession a very long time ago. I am speaking with my experience across the board. My comment was expressing how clearly bias from a thief perspective, that your comments were.

Black Box.9312:

You’ll see the mesmer point at you and a clone will appear nearby. I don’t see the problem with this change; you’ll just have to react a little more quickly.

I think what most peoples problem with it is, that this clone will immobilize you and limit your reaction option very much.

Sagat.3285:

Are you going to mention the high risk/no reward builds as well like zerker trap thief or zerker signet guard?

Why? Are you having trouble reading the thread tittle? Please do not derail the thread. If you wish to discuss builds that are problematic in that context, make a thread for it or use one of the multitude of them that already exist, to express your opinion. Thank you.

Solori.6025:

Warrior has to blow 2 cooldowns for damage immunity, rendering them pretty useless for the next 60 seconds vs a well played condi class, say an engineer.
Secondly, mesmer can also get get full damage immunity using weapon skills and a class mechanic.

And they still have access to literally 3 X the amount of immunity then other profession. As well other professions are locked out of their heal, utilities, elite, and ALL weapons skills. You can try to justify it any way you like, but you will not really convince people that it is congruent treatment for the same effects.

Solori.6025:

And lastly, how is the warrior going to deal with an engineer or necro that plays smart and reloads them with conditions and CC when their stances end.

How does an engineer deal with it? Oh, that is right, they don’t. Because they can never come close to a warriors condition removal thanks to cleansing ire.

Solori.6025:

Because again, its really not easy hitting ES vs a good opponent.
and are we considering the new fact that warriors WILL lose all adrenaline when they A) exit combat and
B) miss a burst skill

Which is a good change. Yet still, none of this addresses the passive heal of the signet. As much as you complained about an engineers “automated response” you cannot defend the signet.

Loki.2894:

Any other class that has immunity to damage cannot have capture point contribution, but warrior can do just that with endure pain+berserker stance. (ele mist form, engi elixir S, thief stealth, mesmer stealth) to name a few

You make a fair point here. Come to think of it, I have no access to ant weapons skills, elites, heals, or other utility, when using an immunity on those professions either. That does seem to be congruent among every profession except the warrior, which seems a bit unfairly unequal.

Stances are utility skills, so there function doesn’t bother me at all.

Healing signet does bother me though. Healing just by standing there and looking ugly.

tom.7468:

In wvw this highly favor the ones with more numbers, It should be so you can’t res when in combat, and ressing speed slightly nerfed it shouldn’t be possible to res faster than you can use 1 finisher. And when you’re dead you get ported back to automatically. Down state class balance is good. Except for ele mist form in towers.
There is some easy hotfixes to make the game less braindead.
Rally system can stay the way it is.

Seems extremely irrational to cry about how 5 people can rez a player faster then a single 1 can stomp them. It makes perfect sense to me.

All of the skills are reasonably thematic. The only problem I see, is in WvW that ele’s mist form should not allow them to enter a keep.

Kontrolle.3514:

no its not because the crowd of awesome ubercool engis since day 1 like me are playing rifle end of discussion.

Ahhh, but that is your choice. To say no we cannot is inaccurate, because we have the option to do so.

Personally I have had little difficulty with PU septer mesmers by sticking to them like glue and using bomb kit, elixir F, and acid bomb. The average PU mesmer in WvW is not very mobile.