Guild Wars 2

manveruppd.7601:

Dustin.2793:

Bros, no lie those games today were so fun, and exciting to play in. The lag was on EU was kittening me off a little but that’s to be expected : D. Hope we can do more soon, well played both teams.

I’m surprised it felt laggy for you – all of NCSoft’s servers are in Texas afaik, so it shouldn’t make a difference for you playing on EU servers.

Unless ANet have some sort of peering deal happening meaning your data has to get bounced across the Atlantic and back…

You really shouldn’t speak on matters that you know absolutely nothing about. EU servers are located in Germany, at least some of them, I can only assume they are all in one location.

14 175 ms 172 ms 170 ms ae-46-46.ebr1.Frankfurt1.Level3.net [4.69.143.137]
15 172 ms 168 ms 178 ms ae-81-81.csw3.Frankfurt1.Level3.net [4.69.140.10]
16 171 ms 171 ms 171 ms ae-3-80.edge6.Frankfurt1.Level3.net [4.69.154.138]

Israel.7056:

I dunno I think warrior is still totally viable.

I agree. Warrior is very viable. As well, the OP does not appear to know what “proof” means. What he offered was subjective supporting evidence. Soloq isn’t a very good way to base balance in the least anyway, in my opinion.

There are tons of skills that have similar problems. Flame thrower has a 10 hit AoE auto attack. Retal can be brutal.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

- turrets

I do not think you understand. We are discussing about passive here. This skills have to be placed, and over charged, to function. Healing signet requires absolutely nothing beyond being equipped.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

- minions

I do not think you understand. We are discussing about passive here. This skills have to be placed, and over charged, to function. Healing signet requires absolutely nothing beyond being equipped.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

- clones

I do not think you understand. We are discussing about passive here. This skills have to be placed. Healing signet requires absolutely nothing beyond being equipped.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

- stealth

Umm, this isn;t passive at all. it is a effect of a physically taken action. Healing signet requires absolutely nothing beyond being equipped.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

- 1500 sniper machine gun long bow

This isn’t passive in the least bit.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

i say, deal with it, it is a class mechanic for kitten’s sake.

I’d say you do not appear to understand what a professional mechanic is then. Nothing you said was a profession mechanic. Not to mention you have post, complaining about passive skills/traits on other professions. You never accepted “deal with it” as an acceptable argument if it was directed to you.

Your right. Warriors are not OP. Personally, I feel that the change to adrenaline, put them in a very solid place.

The problem is, that you have posters on this thread who slam other professions for having passive skills or traits. Some of the posters here, have an extensive history of post, in which they emphatically state that any passive are bad game design, and have even gone as far to suggest that players are bad for using them. Yet they defend passives such as healing signet, because now the discussion is about their main, or preferred profession.

You cannot attack reapers mark, Mirror of Anguish, Incendiary powder, renewing stamina, soothing wave, etc. etc. Yet be in favor of passive on another profession. The double standard is getting over the top.

This would then have to be done for spirit weapons, elemental pets, ranger pets, possibly aspects of mesmer clones, and turrets. The you open way to many other needs, such as the problem of turrets being immobile. I am not saying your wrong by any means. I am suggesting that the problem may be a much deeper rabbit hole then it initially appears.

This suggestion uneccisarily convolutes an otherwise simple system. In my opinion, you are simply trying to out think common sense in terms of the system. It would be uneccisarily complicated to new and old players alike. Not to mention the weight it would put on back end systems to track it all. I see almost no benefit from this what so ever.

Nerfing a skill because you personally find it annoying is a terrible idea. The rifle is fine.

Stop belly aching and deal with it. Every single last profession has passives, and no body complains when they have them on ht profession they are playing at the time. They all simply and very selfishly demand that they remove it from the other guy.

reapers protections procs on an ele with tempest defense, they can stun you right back with shocking aura.

reapers protection procs on a mesmer with mirrored anguish, you both get feared.

If this procs on a warrior with Last Stand, they get a free 8s stability.

With all of those passives, on other skills, some of those players are clearly irrationally bias to complain about a passive defense skill on the necro. Engineers IP anyone?

There are well over 40 skills in the game that proc “on crit”. Not to mention those that are a simple chance on hit. Multiple other defensive procs.

What makes this one so special to hypocritically single it out? It is literally hard countered wit stability as well.

Simon.3794:

you simply don’t understand the fact that one skill on focus of ele is more powerful then 3 stances combined together, nor like you understand how good are instant cast able blocks. nor like you understand how teleportation is better then any gap closer or disengage warrior has, nor like you understand how good is protection, nor like you understand evade is the closes thing to invulnerability, nor like you understand how much benefit you get from having 15+ more skills or skills without CD and a handful of soft CC available to you and etc. these are the things that balance with warrior’s extra health, less so the healing skills. The higher the % of your HP pool a healing skill heals, the more valuable it is. not the amount it heals, also the lower the CD the better cuz sustain, really just a ratio between CD and % heal, but i guess you understand non of these, because you probably only play thieves and have little multi class pvp experience. really, you can go play a mending or healing surge warrior against anything non-noob, you will notice how the healing skill which has the most burst heal(10k hp with 30 CD and 5.5k hp with 15 CD)are part of the worst heal in the game.

and you clearly did not read what OP posted in his thread, i like how you just assume i was talking to you without me quoting you. really funny of your part.

You need to explain yourself better. All your doing is blurting out how such and such skill is equivalent to such and such skills on the warrior. Unless you break down, in detail, how they compare, and function the same, you just blowing smoke.

Besides that, you completely failing to justify any of it. They do not have the passive healing of warrior heal signet, the same health pool, or the same base defense.

As an engineer main (I rarely use more then healing turret) and I can agree that regardless of what the target is, having crit or conditions being negated unreasonable in my opinion. Nothing about a build should be negated by default such as condi or crit.

sinject.4607:

incendiary powder has absolutely zero counterplay as it cannot be predicted

Are you talking about IP or healing signet, I can’t tell, because your statement literally describes them both. It is odd, because you previous stated that passive play is horrible. Yet your okay with it here. Does your opinion change to suit your argument?

sinject.4607:

or avoided thanks to the absence of any form of broadcast

Are you talking about IP or healing signet, I can’t tell, because your statement literally describes them both. It is odd, because you previous stated that passive play is horrible. Yet your okay with it here. Does your opinion change to suit your argument?

sinject.4607:

healing signet has already been nerfed,

So has IP, and some other passive skills you have attack in some of your post.

sinject.4607:

is an entirely defensive tool, is very susceptible to poison and condition pressure in general, and leaves warrior without a way to recover from burst damage like active heals do.

Actually, when combined with the immunity of stances, it recovers from burst rather easily. As well it allows for a warrior to continue doing damage, yet other professions have to stop damage output to heal, and can have thier heal 100% negated by interruption.

sinject.4607:

incendiary powder is broken. healing signet is not.

Broken doesn’t mean what you appear to believe it means.

sinject.4607:

i might not appreciate passive mechanics,

Actually I can link to you other post and quote you here if you like, but you have stated they are both “horrible” and “designed for bad players”. Would you like me to link those for you?

sinject.4607:

but i’m fine with them until they carrying builds

Right. Because a skill that carries every build, to the point that you literally never have to worry about healing yourself doesn’t just go beyond carrying a build, but it literally carries the profession.

My AoEs do not diminish in the least with more targets. In find it increases in damage output up to 5 and then is static from their. How are you suggesting skills lose value after 5? The damage output in the same either way.

How would you expect any of that would make me want diminished value on my immobilize? I do not want my skills devalued.

Shpongle.6025:

i wish there was a way to use a keyboard and a mouse on consoles… i can’t stand controllers they just feel wrong

What do you mean? you have always been able to use keyboard and mouse on consoles. They sell them specifically for it. How do you think people played the multiple MMOs they released on PS2 and Xbox back starting in 2002 ?

Still a horrible idea as I see it. Say I and one or even two other players are heading to a supply camp. We stumble across a player killing the guard. Then we are punished if more then one of us uses an immobilize within your concept of immunity. Why should the single player be given such a strong advantage? If they use a mobility skill that also breaks immobilize, as several due, now they have a gap on us, they broke immobilize, and they are now immune.

Nothing you have mention, would even remotely convince me that my skills deserve to be devalued, simply because someone else finds being immobilized to be “inconvenient”.

RyuDragnier.9476:

It’s just a reminder that they need to treat Immobilize as CC and almost put in diminishing returns for CC…that way you can’t just spam the stuff.

Diminishing returns is a bad idea no matter how you cut it, in my opinion. Why should your CC be given diminishing value, because I previously CCed the same target? If that target has a problem with multiple CC, then they should have showed the battle awareness to not get in a situation of fighting multiple opponents.

Valentin.2073:

Are all eles’ defensive statements like these?

Would you mind explaining to us how a profession can be a defensive statement?

Valentin.2073:

They have been top tier for a year now.

Top tier at what? Based on what metric? This is a bit representative of the problem in this thread as a whole, as I see it. The profession as a whole is not Nearly as strong as you falsely claim. Professions are not defined like that, builds are. No one is linsting any problematic builds, nor is anyone listing how they are problematikittenill you do, you just whistling in the wind.

Valentin.2073:

Just eles came here to defend the class.

What makes a poster an Ele? I leveled all 8 profession between WvW and PvP withing the first 6 months of the games release, and I consider my engineer my main, but I have played a few hundred hours on each profession.

I am not defending the profession, I am defending what I feel, are unjustified demands of the nature you are making. Again, it is blind to claim the profession as a whole is a problem. Unless and and all trait and gear combinations possible, are clearly over powered, it is absurd to claim the profession as a whole is a problem.

Valentin.2073:

Nobody really cares how anet would nerf the class, we are more concerned about the outcome.

Actually, everyone cares. You have yet to offer a comprehensive reason to even nerf it. But it seems irrational to make a statement of the nature you are making here. It suggest you want the profession nerfed out of anger, and not reason. Someone concerned about balance would care to discus the specific problem and solutions for the problems.

Valentin.2073:

We need a kittening change on the meta? How many times do i actually need to say that?

Why does the meta need to change? You ask how many times you need to say it, well the answer is until you offer a convincing argument that a change is even remotely needed.

Valentin.2073:

i am on a vacation right now with my family and i didn’t bring my laptop with me. Last time, i played gw2 i was commanding DR and capped the whole eb.

Sure you did.

Once, I killed a gofer with a stick.

Roe.3679:

Ok… Are you aware that the nice things that put the N in GWEN have little more than nothing to do with being useful in pvp?

No one is aware of it. Simply because it is not entirely true.

Roe.3679:

Reapers protection certainly doesn’t play any roll in any serious GWEN build.

No one suggested it did. I addressed multiple points previously. You are simply blending the comments together or over looked that I was addressing different points.

Roe.3679:

You’re implying that necro is cool in pvp because of GWEN. Not so.

No. I am not implying anything of the sort. Although it is true, some of what makes them valuable in the GWEN theory is what makes them cool in PvP, I was making separate statements. I was fairly specific in what I said, I am genuinely curious how you were so confused by it. What I did say was that GWEN shows that the necro is very valuable. I separately stated that the devs do not segregate PvP, WvW, and PvE in terms of balance changes.

As changes based on PvP have a clear history, and they refuse to segregation them, it is in fact very relavent. Particularly due to the fact that I see nothing in the original post or title that designates this as a PvP based discussion.

Actually the necro has many nice things. Otherwise the GWEN theory would not be so prevalent, and the N wouldn’t be there.

Why would any of that be off the table?

The fear itself, fits well in my opinion, but as was already mentioned, the fact that it can be traited to be offensive is problematic. Personally I am okay with it, due to the trait investment. Though I can see the argument that it becomes offensive. Given necros lack of escape options from a battle, the fact that it fits perfectly in a thematic sense, and the trait investment required, I think complaints are a bit petty. Especially due to the fact that one of the big arguments, is pushing to alleviate the build, based on the selfish notion that some “are tired of fighting against it”.

It is only your opinion that it is the best spec to run. As I disagree. To expect a change simply because one tires of fighting against a spec, is unreasonable in my eyes. Though, changing the defensive proc may be an idea, removing it may not be. I don’t thing simply making it so that terror wouldn’t effect it is a good idea either.

The only problem I see with sagats suggestion is that folks will complain about another offensive proc. The forum goers here like to label procs as “skilless”, and speak I’ll of them. Which is fine. The problem I often run into, is that I encounter them in game, and recognize their names from the forums, and they have procs traited, or proc items on, that they blast others for using.

I can see you point towards mirrored anguish, but what is wrong with shared anguish or transmute? Your justification you mentioned was that the necros trait theirs ti be offensive, so why change the defensive? I am okay with the defensive procs myself. I simply dislike the offensive of ones.

By the way, do you have a list of the names of this group of players you are claiming to represent? You keep saying people. So if you have permission to speak for them, who are they? I am genuinely curious. As to me, I prefer to speak for myself. Perhaps it would be in everyone’s best interest if you allow “the people” to do the same. Wouldn’t you agree?

You cannot reasonably take out the passive proc trait for the necromancer or single it out, and lobby against it. Every profession has an equally defensive and equally passive proc. You must lobby removal of them all, or none. To single one out over the others, in my opinion, is a sign of bias behavior that no one should condon. Why is it okay to target those whose effects you dislike dealing with, yet intentionally not mention those of your main, or preferred professions?

No it is not terrible design. It is simply CC. People hate it when it happens to them and that is it. If you truly thought it was a terrible mechanic or a bad design, you would never use it.

What do you want them to do about it? Before it didn’t stacked. So if you used a cleanse and another immobilize was applied, you were out of luck. Everyone spammed the forums with threads like this, demanding that they make it stack, so one cleanse can clear it all. So they changed it based on that feedback. Now your feedback here contradicts that previous demanding feedback. So what should they do?

They cannot allow it to stack, but have a cap on it. Because then many players would have skills not take effect and it is unfair to anyone who wasted a skill once the cap was met. So what is a solution? As I see it, the solution is to stop ccomplaining when you get into combat and a large amount of enemies, accept that you reacted to slowly to escape, and accept your death.

lorndarken.3702:

Lifestealer.4910:

I only mentioned 1v1 because alot of the players post about how others should go try necros 1v1 to prove that they underpowered and needs buffs.

and yet we get baseless claims like this ^ for why necros are so " Strong " . i just want people to get a good understanding of how weak necros are so that they can get a understanding of how much necros need help , if you were to take any class in the game that can and will cleanse conditions , use hard cc , regen , and burst , that right there alone can and will destroy any necro in the game period regardless of what build that necro is running . people who have been playing necro since day 1 will agree with me from page 1 on what i brought up . and yes , they might disagree with me on soloing just to see what better way a necro stacks up to other classes in 1 vs 1 . for me in group combat there is to many variables to list on what might work vs what might not work . and yeah some people can claim that this is the meta of how things are now because of patches , but i say it goes beyond that cause necros really have not got that one patch that made them into something to be feared like other classes because all in all they have been getting constantly nerfed . and i see this as a problem . necros need mobility they need stability , they need regen , and yet we don’t see any of this happening . if a necro could do hard cc like other classes and be consistent with it , could regen well , i would not complain anymore , but where it stands right now has nothing to do with how the meta has shaped up , but everything to do with how ignored and nerfed necros have been since day 1

How is the claim baseless? We have tons of video footage of skilled necros in 1v1 tourneys, or in a 1v1 situation in tourneys, who win against skilled players of other professions. Sure, I am of the camp that understands the game isn’t balanced around 1v1, but you brought it up. You really shouldn’t make claims, when there is a massive amount of video evidence thay disproves you claims. It might be in everyone’s interest if you stopped speaking in definitives, and assuming your results in game are those of everyone else’s, when it is not.

In my experience, this occurs when you have a connection problem or lag from your ISP. In the few occasions I have had this occur, I lost my service for a few seconds there and after, on a temporary basis, or I had to reset my router.

Is block an immunity, because you can trait to hit through blocks. It is generally a utility skill that grants the immunity, not a trait, so I do not why you want a trait.

By the way, can I have a trait that allows me to sends all of my conditions back to the necromancer? Or one that turns all boons into conditions?

sinject.4607:

pu builds were the only thing implicitly banned from many 2v2 and 1v1 tournaments, and they’re also banned by just about every 1v1 KoTH duel server i’ve ever seen.

You mention 1v1 a few times. Yet it is made very clear the game isn’t balanced around 1v1. Why do you repeatedly push this 1v1 argument when it is common knowledge it is not balanced for it? Do you enjoy beating this dead Centaur?

sinject.4607:

you’re right about turret engie though, good thing SPvP isn’t entirely composed of just conque- oh wait it is.

I can kill all of the turrets in literally 5s. Then the engineer has no weapon swap, and all utilities on CD. Play one for a few minutes, you will see what I mean.

sinject.4607:

it also doesn’t really help when you defend a build by saying it can get beat by things that are genuinely overpowered in 1v1s like engie and pu mesmer.

Again with this 1v1 obsession, when they do not balance for 1v1. Why?

Nerf kyubi for making the 5,287th thread, about mocking the threads that are about nerfing.

Orpheal.8263:

I should have known that this thread will get flooded quickly by forum trolls

It is unfortunate that you have this attitude. No one said anything that trolled you. If they did, you should report their post. The fact that you simply name call and fling this insult at everyone for simply disagreeing with you, shows your clear agenda.

Orpheal.8263:

Sure as a projectile attack it has its counters, but with a way too fast recharge time of, if traited freaking low 8 seconds, you can’t prevent being bursted down to death in seconds all the time when you need it the most.

Well actually you can. I do it repeatedly on a daily basis. I can agree that given the changes, a possible cool down adjustment might be reasonable. That was a bit hard to say on this particular thread, as you previously called me a troll simply for disagreeing with you that a redesign is required.

Orpheal.8263:

No class should be able to dish out like 12-14000+ damage within 2 seconds.

When you make statements of this matter, you harm your credibility further in my opinion. Because your not being completely honest. It is a fact that I can burst down another profession just as easily using your profession. It is a fact, that each profession has a spike damage build that when in full zerker gear against another profession in full zerker gear, can burst them down in literally a few seconds. I have plenty of videos in my library of myself and others doing so (I play all 8 professions myself)…………….But since your requesting a mod to close the thread, whats the point.

Orpheal.8263:

Anet clearly overbuffed the Ranger’s Burst Potential here with all those trait synergies, out of fear, the community might complain about it later after the FP, that they wouldn’t buff them good enough after all the long Ranger CDI and year long complaints about, how weak the class is

I do not think they did anything out of fear, they did it out of community feed back. The fact that you see things through this view does not aid in your goals here.

Either way, it by no means justifies an completely unnecessary “redesign”. That is simply a bad idea no matter how you cut it.

Orpheal.8263:

Especially when you fight against multiple rangers

No offense, but you make it clear you have difficulty with one opponent, so why are you justifying "redesigning " a profession over the fact that you lose a battle to multiple opponents?

Orpheal.8263:

When you overlook my changes for the longbow, someone who is truly interested in a constructive conversation

If you were interested in a constructive conversation, you would not name call, you would have participated in the CDI, you would not demand an entire redesign, and you would not have made your own thread for specific attention to your own personal thoughts, and would have participated on one of the ongoing threads already existing on the topic.

Anytime we have multiple threads on a subject, and someone makes a new thread, I always get the impression they feel their opinion is special, and thus deserves its own thread. It is probably a popular opinion.

I do not get the rational of pushing to make a weapon a “hybrid”. Why harm both sides, and never let one side specialize in it. You want to lessen its value as a condition weapon and hurt it effectiveness in condition builds for the sole agenda of your power builds. That seems greedy to me.

One thing I will say, is that personally I would rather use “stabilized armor” over “cloaking device”. That way when you are CCed it works wit the protection from “protection injection” and gives you -53% damage when CCed.

Aberrant.6749:

PvE = very easy as is, idk of any encounter where 1,500 range is needed.

So your suggesting nerfing grenade range based purely on the fact that you feel PvE is easy. I feel we would need an actual substantial reason to implement yet another grenade kit nerf.

WhiteRose.6934:

coglin.1867:

I always find it comical how posters try to throw the word “spam” around when they are trying to put down another profession in the “X profession is OP” threads. As if you are not constantly spamming weapons skills, heals, utilities, elites, and dodges, on every single profession in every fight.

Except in certain classes case (Engi, ele, thief) there is literally spam. Engineers always have something available to them, and for some reason this ability to consistently toss everything out and repeat makes them a “high skill” class.

Maybe players who have played engi extensively can actually weave these skills together efficiantly and get the most from the class, but when I pick up my engi and spam grenades on point and down 3 players it’s not because the class is high skill.

Yes, experienced engineer tend to not camp in kits. So are you suggesting you are not constantly spamming weapons skills, heals, utilities, elites, and dodges, on every single profession in every fight?

Mod? No, I simply happened to be a part of the discussion on many threads in which he said some fairly mean things that I saw get removed. Not to mention, asked in a thread one time why he has posted on 3 separate accounts. And he replied in the thread that his original account was banned via repeated infractions.

Saturn.6591:

coglin.1867:

Otherwise “he” is an appropriate pronoun for reference to anyone in the English language.

No, it’s not. It’s common to say “guys” if you are refering to a group with mixed genders or if you don’t know. It’s also common to use “he” if you do not know the gender of a person. But if you’ve read the other topic, or even just this one, you know that Vee Wee is female and thus, “he” would have to be “she”. Then again, it’s not that extremely important, hence I’ve just added it at the end of my post.

He. See also Gender neutrality in English: Pronouns.

The use of he was prescribed by manuals of style and school textbooks from the early 18th century until around the 1960s, an early example of which is Anne Fisher’s 1745 grammar book “A New Grammar”.¹¹ Older editions of Fowler also took this view.¹²

This may be compared to usage of the word man for humans in general (although that was the original sense of the word “man” in the Germanic languages, much as the Latin word for “human in general”, kitten , came to mean “male human”—which was vir, in Latin—in most of the Romance languages).

“All men are created equal.”
“That’s one small step for [a] man, one giant leap for mankind.”
“Man cannot live by bread alone.”

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender-specific_and_gender-neutral_pronouns

Saturn.6591:

dancingmonkey.4902:

Ahh, yes, I will miss the berating of players for their builds, calling anyone who tried anything new a bad player, the insults and profanity barked at players in map chat, and lets not forget the things he said in some of the post that were removed by the moderators, man those were doosies.

None the less, I still hope he comes back. It was entertaining if nothing else.

Wow… you’re at it again. -_-

I’ve yet to see any proof for those claims. Anyway. Doesn’t matter now.

Btw, he’s a she.

What does the fact that a person is he or she have to do with anything. Otherwise “he” is an appropriate pronoun for reference to anyone in the English language. It may matter to you what sex someone is, but I prefer not to judge by that.

So are you also going to argue that he didn’t post on multiple accounts? And that it started because he made multiple post that got the first account banned? Do accounts get banned for being polite?

Riccardo.7254:

1- Warrior
2- Guardian
3- Mesmer/Thief
4- Guardian/Warrior
5- Mesmer/Thief/Ele (depends most on the race)

Aww, poor engineer. They have 3 threads about the engineer being OP on the first page of the balance sub forums, but don’t make this list.

I find it interesting that you claimed to refuse to ever play an engineer, yet you will inaccurately claim to know what the engineer community thinks, and presume to speak for them.

Grenades at max range will absolutely hit player on keep walls, hit siege, hit players from keep walls, hit player fighting on a point, hit world bosses, hit players distracted by other fights, hit players who do not see you coming, all at max range. So you are being very deceptive and dishonest in your representation of claiming what they community wants. Particularly considering how you claim to avoid being part of that community. The only time they are so easily avoided at max range generally, is in 1v1 open field battles. So please stop using a hyperbole that misrepresents the facts.

You might as well give up on using the word “we” as well. Considering that you clearly stated you hate the profession and will never play it, in a previous thread. I am more then open to hear your opinion. Heck I even agree with you about IP being problematic. But if you want to be taken seriously, you have to speak at least with limited experience or on the basis of actual fact, and not hyperbole and hearsay.

I am curious as to why it is a problem all of the sudden? Personally I think it is fine. I feel hammer skills are reasonable easy to avoid when needed.

If you want to complain about weakness spam, you should look at the necromancer.

You are wrong actually. It is free on other professions. Take engineers elixir gun auto attack for example. It is not your bias that I refer to specifically. It is the fact that your justifying it with irrational and unfactual means.

You are completely incorrect. It would completely change the explosive options. I am curious, as I have noticed in two previous threads, you specifically mention you avoid playing the profession. Why do you feel you have the insight to know what those who do play will chose? Keep in mind, I ask that as a player of the profession, who is against IP being crit proc of long duration. How much damage do you seriously think IP does in a defensive style build, since you brought it up?

Admittedly though, I am somewhat curious about what you feel the IP discussion has to do with necromancers being innately solid against engineers due to the engineer being limited in terms of condition removal. The subjects are irrelevant to one another.

I always find it comical how posters try to throw the word “spam” around when they are trying to put down another profession in the “X profession is OP” threads. As if you are not constantly spamming weapons skills, heals, utilities, elites, and dodges, on every single profession in every fight.

Bombs? How are bombs hitting outside of their designated range?

Guyver.1426:

Totally agree with OP. Engis can take away 50% life in a second easily at first sight.

Players who counter this kind of engis are put in an unfair situation.

Are you suggesting damage over time conditions are doing that damage in that amount of time?

Shouldn’t those claiming other professions abuse it, prove it first? It seems reasonable due to the fact that they made the initial claims, doesn’kitten I mean, they are even refusing to list traits or builds, yet they appear to justify it on their preferred professions as useless builds. As everyone making accusations of OP at other professions, jumped to the defense of the thief profession, that seems somewhat telling of where the QQ is coming from, as far as I can tell.

It is just as reasonable of an accusation as any of those directed at the might stacking ranger build, engineers, elementalist, warriors, guardians(empower for example)………..Claims to point fingers at just 1 or 2 profession s are both unreasonable and unfactual. What makes it so active or reactive on one profession and not others?

I was simply stating what they devs officially posted as the engineers intentionally balanced in, weakness. Not the semantics of grenades value at max range. Personally I have no problem with ranged because of shield reflect, magnet, and rocket boots.

Seeing as how many dislike the traits level of passive effect, they should just find an alternative idea for that trait slot and integrate the damage into the MH pistol in some form as well as the rifle. In my opinion, it would open up a bit more build diversity. My biggest question here would be how to do that, as well as what to turn that trait into in return.

As far as the inaccurate claim to ranged, how would you claim engies are intended to be weak to ranged with 1500 ranges grenades? Or when the devs have specifically stated engineers weakness as a lack of condition removal?

As an engineer, I am on the side that is against the passive of IP if compensated to a congruent level. But you have to at least be reasonable and remotely factual with your arguments, if you want to have the debate

sinject.4607:

you guys dont need to be compensated elsewhere. the problem is that IP does damage that shouldnt exist in the first place.

Because more then one Anet post in the past has explained the trait was implemented and designed to compensate for weak auto attack and sustained damage on the weapons sets. It is well known and well documented.