Guild Wars 2

Kitt.2567:

hand-throwing grenade range is 1500 while warrior’s longbow or rifle range is only 1000~1200 and you say it is not op?

Poor guy. I feel bad for anyone who has such limitations as to use real world physics to justify a fantasy game. Would it make your death better if Anet gave them a graphic launcher for the grenades instead of them being hand thrown…………………..The method is arbitrary. When developing a game, you simply have it do what you want in the sense of your idea, the graphical way it occurs is irrelevant.

As well, I question your wisdom after the first 2 years of the game to use “warrior” as the metric for balance.

Raiyo.1584:

engis not op ? are u really serious ???? i just went in 4 matches in soloq and guess what in all the matches i had to face 3 engis, this is not even fun anymore , turret knockback grenade spam pull and what ever they have

I saw 3 mesmers then 3 thieves. in back to back matches yesterday. By your definition, they are both OP. Brilliant. You are mocking someone elses opinion, then definitively declaring that if randoms stack a particular profession in soloq, that it defines it as OP?

I don’t get all of the unoriginal buzz word regurgitation like “spam”.

As you suggesting your teams players spend time in a fight being idle? If so, that is probably a bad idea. If not, they are “spamming”, as you would put it, attacks as much as anyone else then.

Present myself? You mean by requesting that you stop suggesting you speak for the community by saying everything in definitives and using “we”, “everyone”, and “us”? Then sure. that is precisely how I present myself. As an individual who speaks for myself with my opinion, who dislike others presuming to speak for me or others. Sorry if it offends you, that I dislike posters who appear to have difficulty with builds that I do not, presuming to speak for me.

So what if I defend the existence of perplexity runes? I do not find the particularly strong or difficult to deal with.

Feel free to quote any post in which I state there is not imbalance in the game at all. Simply because I disagree with most of what you claim is imbalanced is not reason to try to claim I am saying anything other then what I am. It kind of makes me wonder if you couldn’t muster up evidence to support your opinion, so you resorted to back handed comments at me instead, but that is just my assumption.

The fact that I agreed with you in respect to incendiary powder, and suggested the fact that it was passive, indicated a balance issue, would have tipped you off that I feel balance is not perfect. It is interesting that You avoided mentioning that, and how I agreed with you specifically.

Why do you use all the regurgitated buzz words? How are condition attacks “spammed” any more then direct damage attacks are? Are you suggesting that direct damage builds spend time sitting idle? That doesn’t make any sense to try to demonize one form of damage when you have offered no evidence that it does more damage then the other.

Personally, I do not feel “fear” necromancers, as you put it, are OP at all. I often use it to give myself stability.

Of coarse I do not know what builds you are referring to. Nor do I know if anyone else does. You have made a solid effort to avoid mentioning them. You only mention gear. Possibly because you do not know what they are? If that is the case, it falls to reason that you are crying OP about builds you do not understand. I am simply speculating, but it seems rather likely. Particularly after I asked you how long you have played each of the builds, in two separate post, and you avoided the question.

So yes, please, if you are so confident specific builds are OP, please list the build and not just the gear. As well, please break down what about the builds are OP? Simply crying OP while not showing any damage or control comparisons of any kind, is just as accusation with no supportive evidence. Most of which, my personal experience disagrees with.

nicknamenick.2437:

Yeah its not about 1vs1 in this game..

Then why did you make a thread to specifically complain about 1v1 balance? If you know it isn’t about 1v1 and mention it, then make a thread on it, isn’t that pretty trollish?

nicknamenick.2437:

kinda sucks EVERYONE keeps QQing about warriors where they are just plain easy free kills vs them

Do me a favor please. Speak for yourself. If you are not skilled enough to defeat other professions/builds, that I dispatch just fine, then you do not have the right to speak for anyone but yourself.

Creld.8702:

Your best bet, if you’re really having trouble with engies, is probably s/s+longbow with doom sigils. The longbow’s large aoe f1 makes cleansing ire easy to land, and engineers have very limited condition clear (about 2 every 15 seconds on the normal builds, along with converting the first incoming condition into a boon every 15 seconds). Given you can apply bleed, burn, torment, and poison fairly regularly, you can kill them with well timed condition burst.

I agree. This is the best innate build path for engies as a whole. As you mention here, they have terrible condition cleanses. As well, odds are that they will have only one stun break with anywhere from 40s-60s cool down. That knowledge is easily exploitable.

I can agree with everything the OP said except the point on adrenaline decay. I understood that change. We have entirely too many skills/traits linked to adrenaline to allow it not to decay. Although some compensation could be applied to some skills that it effected.

Zefrost.3425:

I already explained why the current overpowered builds are the way they are, in the engineers case it’s: high burn uptime, blocks/invulns and doom/geomancy sigils. Poison is supposed to be something that you use skillfully, not just “another condition” that you try keep on the opponent 100% of the time; this is exactly what geomancy and doom sigils do. Engineers built this way are done so to try and maintain poison, bleed and burning on the opponent 100% of the time while overloading them with other conditions on the side.

What build? All your posting is gear. I have yet to see you list a single build yet. What trait set up are you referring to? How long have you played the build your complaining about?

How are you suggesting players are not using “poison skillfully”?

What is wrong with using gear to maintain as much uptime on bleed/burn/poison as possible? Isn’t that the point when running conditions? To me, your point here is about as rational as complaining a CC build stacks as much CC as possible or that a direct damage build is stacking gear to get as much direct damage as possible.

Zefrost.3425:

You don’t see people complaining about leeching or blood sigils. This is because they don’t define an entire build. Doom/geomancy give conditions to classes that aren’t supposed to have 100% uptime of these conditions.

I don’t? I could have sworn I have. I sure am glad you are here, to tall us what we have or havn’t seen and discussed ourselves. I do not know what I would do without you here to dictate to me and transparently others, what we think. Perhaps it is best for everyone if you stick to speaking for yourself?

Zefrost.3425:

What would I do to doom/geomancy?:
Sigil of Geomancy – Nerf the bleed stacks from 3 to 1 because it’s AOE.
Sigil of Doom – Remove it and perplexity runes from the game entirely.
Incediary Powder – Add skilled play to it like how dhuumfire is on lifeblast now.

Personally, I feel sigil of geomancy and doom is absolutely nothing. They both only work on weapon swap. One is single target, the other is small, close range, AoE, and I do not see in any way how you have demonstrated them to be OP.

As to incendiary powder, I doubt comparing it to dhuumfire is a wise route. I agree it needs some sort of function change so that it is not entirely passive.

insaneseagull.7063:

Is this what pvp players have become?

What does it suggest about you, when your first question is stereotyping a player base in your question?

One person is rude and you feel the path of wisdom here is to post an accusatory question about everyone else?

ghaleon.2861:

MailMail.6534:

I’m a mesmer player. No class is breaking pvp. We are currently in the most balanced state since launch. More improvements can be made, but the QQ is a bit much.

I disagree, the game is more broken now than back at launch.

I don’t think “broken” means what you think it means.

In my experience, posters who repeat the buzz words of the day, such as "broken"and appear to make a solid effort to avoid posting a comprehensive explanation as to how they feel something is a problem, it generally turns out to be a poor build or weak play style for those particular build. But that it just what my experience has taught me.

For example, you claim:

d/d ele and engis are dominating pvp

Prove it?

I am not seeing a lot of either. I see more mesmer and thieves then eles, engies, or rangers, all of which are they top OP claims at the moments.

Precisely what is OP specifically? List the builds for those professions that are problematic would you please?

Zefrost.3425:

If you don’t understand how builds like balthazaar rabid doom/geomancy incendiary powder nade/tool kit engineers are overpowered then it’s because you haven’t fought any.

Or, it could be that your not very good against them………….Your argument that because I, or anyone else, does not have difficulty defeating them, in the same manner that you do, that they haven’t encountered any, is very accusatory in its presumptions. All your doing is inviting the counter argument that if you do not understand how it is not over powered, then you need to learn to build and play to counter it.

Your argument is to make accusations, instead of making a comprehensive explanation, detailing what about it makes it over powered. That, to me, suggest you have no actually explanation, beyond the fact that the build is strong against you specifically, how you play, and the build you run.

OP. You claim those are over powered specs, yet you listed no specs. You listed gear and occasionally one trait.

It may also help of you explained why you think each is OP. I might also aid in conversation, if you state it as your opinion, instead of disingenuously declaring your opinion as it it were a statement of fact.

The only thing there though, is that they would need to do similar changes for similar traits on other professions. Icons create more information transferred, and more graphics, equalling in more possible lag.

Dayra.7405:

Offair.2563:

Dayra.7405:

Offair.2563:

Reduce PPT in my nights when its daytime for others. So they want to reduce PPT at their night, which is my daytime.

This Argument is as old as it is Bad.

The Point of the proposal is simply make it:
few players = few score
many players = many score
Then it doesn’t matter where the sun really is, but you will notice that in the middle of EU night there are the fewest players playing in EU matches, such that they should get the fewest score at that time.

And no they should not get lower score per player, they should just not get more score per player.

So basicly you are limiting their game fun when they have bought the same game as you. Interesting theory but anyway OP, if ya really care about PPT war – join Tier1 or so.

This is not a better argument! PPT is the fun, I thought playing is fun. Anyway, I do not limit their fun, even if PPT is their fun. They can fight for 1 point per player as primetime can play for 0.7 points per player, but I do not see a sense to let them fight for 10-20 points per player.

That is not how the game works. You get points per keep/camp not per player. Why do you feel you are important enough to redesign the game around your personal playtime?

What “mages” are you talking about? Why would you dump 2000+ condition damage into guardians for one condition?

Cuddy.6247:

Vayne.8563:

The OP mentioned gear. He didn’t mention skills.

So gear can’t have horizontal spread as well? kitten, I must’ve been playing World of Warcraft wrong all this time.

Gear most certainly can be different without being a treadmill. It’s why we have Soldier’s gear, Berserker’s gear or Valkyrie’s gear.

But these are introduced early and the range of effectiveness that some people want (especially people who play trinity MMOs) is kitten poor. It’s not that options aren’t available, it’s just that 90% of the options are pretty crummy and people don’t want to use them. Whereas in virtually every other MMO you could take a warrior, give them a particular weapon, and have about six different ways to build that warrior instead of one, or two depending if you want to drop the Fast Hands trait. Even further from that, all six of those different ways (with different gear specs) were effective.

Guild Wars 2 doesn’t provide that.

Check yourself before you wreck yourself.

Seems to me that you state your opinion as if it were fact. You have proof that percentage of options are “crummy”? Or are you pressuming to speak for the community? Personally I feel those options are pretty great, as well as diverse.

I think they are intelligently cautious about power creeps. Not being cautious hinders balance across the board.

Sandrox.9524:

PS->I dont even mention that rangers can RF from stealth..

Yes. And my channel skills can Track them during it. What is your point?

Gaile Gray.6029:

Hey all,

The dev team has been tracking the concern about the Engineer backpacks for quite a while. They understand our players’ point of view, and this is something that a few different team members have discussed for a possible remedy. They’ve batted around a few ideas about how to fix this problem, including some of those mentioned in this thread. (Thanks for all the suggestions – they’re very helpful!)

For example, one designer thought that with new art, we might be able to display the kits on the weapon holsters on the right or left hip, so players could tell what kits are in use while allowing the Engineer to display a sweet back-piece, too. Another suggested that perhaps Gem Store items could simply override the kits, so if you owned a Quaggan Backpack, your character displayed a Quaggan Backpack. (Please note: This doesn’t mean to say that either of these ideas will be the one that is settled upon. I just offered examples so you could see that thoughts and possible solutions definitely have been discussed.)

Ultimately, enabling any correction will involve members of several different teams (design, art, programming) and those teams members currently are engaged in other prioritized projects. But as you can see, the team wants to address this situation in the future and we’re grateful for your patience while the team selects the implements the right fix for the issue.

Then why can’t they simply remove the hobos sacs altogether, and allow them to see what kit we are using by what is in our hands? That is exactly how we have to see the weapon other professions are using. The wrench isn’t enough to say tool kit? The FT and EG weapons are distinct as well. All you need to do is make a weapon that looks like a grenade and one like a bomb, and viola. That would appear to me to be a ssolution with minimal man power requirements.

The misinformation is claiming a profession hard counters another. Build effect that more then the profession. Skill level effects it further.

I would disagree. Without income, the game goes under. It would seem to me that the logical thing to do is balance to the largest demographic of player skill level. Unless they have evidence that the higher skill level players bring in the most money. To my knowledge, that is not the case, but I can only speculate as to what level of player brings in the most money.

Then why would you claim no other skills function that way if you do not know? That approach is, in my opinion, one of the biggest problems on the forums. Posters make such definitive claims, without even knowing the facts of the matter.

Part of the problem here as I see it, is deciding whose opinion of traits count? I have seen some threads claiming traits as OP, that are useless to me and the builds I like to play. As well as threads declaring certain traits as useless the at I find to be of very high value.

Narkodx.1472:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

sinject.4607:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

sinject.4607:

that being said, perplexity is a rune set that has been in the game for a long time now, so the usual reason you see gear not available in sPvP just doesn’t apply. in fact, I believe the devs have even publicly rejected the idea of including perplexity runes in sPvP when it was suggested.

Wrong. The Devs did want to add Perplexity to PvP. They felt it was balanced for the game mode.

However, the announcement drew tons of hate from players, and they decided against it. Keep in mind that they were to be added in the same patch that all of the runes got revamped, so players made that decision without context or experience.

without context or experience? what about what they did to wvw? or are you one of those people who try to completely separate wvw and pvp as if they’re separate games entirely?

however perplexity’s rejection happened, it happened. the runes are not in spvp and you will not find a single spvp player wishing otherwise.

the dev’s are not infallible, and obviously they themselves recognize this.

They didn’t have context because the players had no idea what most of the runes were going to be at the time. Perplexity was one of only 2 or 3 runes that had been spoiled at that point. The rest, we learned about on patch day.

Likewise, no players had experience with how the new Perplexity Runes would actually work out. How could they, when they hadn’t played with them?

The original time that Perplexity was going to be introduced to PvP was the same exact patch that completely overhauled runes and sigils as well as balance changes to the professions. If they were going to be introduced to PvP, say, two months later, then yes, there would be experience via WvW and context via knowing other runes that could have been used for better decisions. But we didn’t have that.

The decision to keep Perplexity out of PvP was made by the player’s kneejerk reactions. Whether this was a good or bad decision, we can debate all you like, but the reason why is a documented fact.

And you will find sPvP players wishing for Perplexity. They may be the minority, but they exist.

This is all 100% correct

My condi necro and his 900 fears which now interrupt would like perplexity runes

Indeed I wouldn’t mind it in sPvP.

Got to love when folks think they are so special, that they can presume to speak for me, you, and the rest of the community. Particularly when they speak so incorrectly.

Black Box.9312:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

sinject.4607:

that being said, perplexity is a rune set that has been in the game for a long time now, so the usual reason you see gear not available in sPvP just doesn’t apply. in fact, I believe the devs have even publicly rejected the idea of including perplexity runes in sPvP when it was suggested.

Wrong. The Devs did want to add Perplexity to PvP. They felt it was balanced for the game mode.

However, the announcement drew tons of hate from players, and they decided against it. Keep in mind that they were to be added in the same patch that all of the runes got revamped, so players made that decision without context or experience.

Yes, because it’s quite clear that the devs know so much more about balance in this game than the people who have experience playing through it.

They do. They play it to.

Which people are we talking about? the same people who have made a thread for nearly every weapon skill, heal, utility, and elite, in which at some point or another, have deemed, and demanded, everything in this game “ridiculously OP” at some point or another?

No thanks. I will take the current team over the community for balance any day of the week.

Shock value attempt, yes I agree. Title is terribly worded.

Majority of the replies agree with you? List the names of those that agree with you please.?

The fact is, your not very specific. Your ideas bring potentially, very negative power creep effects.

Why do you assume to claim someone elses opinion as “biased” as bad? Do you know what the word even means? By definition, your “biased” in favor of your own opinion.

Like it or not, you cannot stop nerfs and promote buffs. If you buff weak traits, you have to nerf strong ones in one form or another to compensate. Either by moving them in the trait lines or what not. To prevent to many strong traits being available in one build.

Fact is, your both right.

Wow, this thread is extremely misinformation and chalk full of mistakes. Generally in the case of folks making broad claims such as “X” professions hard counters “Y” profession. When that is not correct. Some professions builds may trump the so called “meta” builds of other professions. To claim a profession as a whole, trumps another profession as a whole, is embarrassingly misinformed.

WhiteRose.6934:

Yeah, loading into a game and seeing 2-3 engineers on the other team practically every game makes me want to kill myself.

Engi has taken it’s place next to warrior as easiest pvp class.

Only in this case, easy don’t equal good. I love turret engies in PvP. They are so easy to deal with.

killahmayne.9518:

Carighan.6758:

killahmayne.9518:

I don’t think people get how ridiculous 5 stacks of confusion every 15 seconds is.

Quoting from http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Rune_of_Perplexity :

(6): +20% Confusion duration; every 15 seconds, cause 5 stacks of Confusion for 8 seconds to your current target.

Oh wait, no, that’s not actually what the rune says. I know, I got confused, too.
Here’s what it actually says:

(6): +20% Confusion duration; when you interrupt a foe, cause 5 stacks of confusion for 8 seconds. (Cooldown: 15s)

Now, maybe you are on a class which can reliably interrupt a target, independent of what they are doing, every 16-17 seconds (if you can do it every 15 seconds, please talk to your programmer, you should not be interfacing with this forum I imagine).
But in that case, is that really the rune’s fault? That your class can freely interrupt enemy players on demand with virtually no limitation upon it?

I am well aware that it is on interrupt. The reason why I didn’t mention that is by default many classes (Necro, Warrior, Engi, Thief, Mesmer) can easily have interrupts available every 15 seconds so it is a relative non-issue. Technically Guardians, Rangers and Eles can but I will leave them out because Perplexity is typically never ran on these classes.

I don’t have a problem with classes having that many interrupts at all. It is the rune’s fault because clearly the 15 second cooldown did not account for the fact that many classes have many interrupts that are readily available. So not only are you interrupted, you have a juicy purple aura that ticks for 900-1000 for each skill used unless you can cleanse it every 15 seconds or are content with doing nothing for the duration that the confusion lasts (which, I had demonstrated in my previous post, can reach 100% uptime).

I could be mistaken, but please show me a rune that inflicts 5 stacks of bleed or torment every 15 seconds? Bleeds are a much weaker condition, I don’t think there are any runes like that. Heck, even the complained about Runes of Balthazar aren’t nearly as bad.

At 1500 condition damage the burn is around 700 a tick. The difference is that it is the lasts 3 seconds. The cooldown is 10 seconds but how many heals are a 10 second CD? So realistically the effect is procced every 20 seconds. The base burn amount is 3 seconds. With food, +30% condition duration and runes/sigils the burn can maybe get up to 8 seconds, which is still about half as much as you can get on the Perplexity Interrupt, and arguably a longer practical cooldown and requires you to be in melee range.

If you compare Perplexity with any other rune that procs conditions under certain situations, I don’t think the comparison is even close. The 5 stacks of confusion every 15 seconds is already over the top. The 3 stacks of confusion on hit makes it even more over the top.

Given that, I don’t know how people insist on defending this rune. Oh, well conditions are useless in WvW so that’s my justification for a rune that procs 5 stacks of confusion for 8 seconds base and 3 stacks of confusion for 5 seconds base not being overpowered. If that was a case why not have a rune that procs 20 stacks of confusion every 5 seconds when you are hit? The above statement about conditions in WvW is only half true at most. Then people go on to say, well, ANet doesn’t balance around 1v1 or small-group play because it isn’t a game mode.

Guess what, zerg play isn’t any more of a game mode than 1v1 or small-group skirmishes. Even if ANet comes on this thread and exclaims explicitly that we do not balance around 1v1 or small-group, that still isn’t an excuse for a rune to be imbalanced in somewhat inevitable and commonly occurring situations. Now, it is inevitable that some classes are better than others in small-group/1v1, just like other classes are better in zerg warfare, etc.

However, if you look at the rune objectively, compare it to other runes, and in a practical sense, it is out of place and is in need of a balance. And the fact that it doesn’t require any special sort of skill (then again what runes really do, however to proc confusion is as simple as getting hit and landing any interrupt, which is easier than many runes) to trigger.

Then why did you misrepresent them and disingenuously word your post outside of the true function of the runes?

Jelzouki.4128:

insanemaniac.2456:

“stop balancing, start power creeping” -jelzouki.4128 2014

Please take your negativity that’s not backed by reason elsewhere.

What negativity? He is being factually. It is the logically reason not to buff certain aspects. If your going to brand everyone who disagrees with you, based on realities of the situation, you shouldn’t have opened the discussion.

Wilco.1458:

BlackBeard.2873:

Wilco.1458:

Everyone saying “oh but there’s counters” and “you can do x/y/z to beat turret engies” that’s completely besides the point. The fact the build exists is the problem in itself.

Its actually REALLY good for a game to have really simple builds, as they let new players hop in and be effective, without needing a ton of skill, yet not being an optimal strategy at all. Perhaps it could be a little bit less effective so that vets aren’t as drawn to it, but I don’t think it needs to be nerfed into oblivion.

The best news: if you don’t to learn to 1v1 a turret engie, that is fine. The best way to beat them is rotations! Either leave them and win 4v5 on the other 2 points, or bring the teamfight to them where they are 100% useless. In a teamfight, a turret engie is like a guardian that has no stability and can’t stand up to as much focus-fire.

A video for reference – Extra Credits talking about balancing for skill:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EitZRLt2G3w

I understand how to balance videogames. The problem with this build, imo, is that it’s just completely awful to play against. I don’t want to play against fidgety AI, that’s called PvE. The fact it’s balanced or not has nothing to do with this build, it’s just lazy and poorly designed.

Apparently you do not. You assume your personal opinion as fact. You assume your personal experience defines the whole of the community. You assume to tell everyone what is goof for them in the community. Nothing about any of that says “good video game developer, for the balance team” to me in the least.

Xillllix.3485:

coglin.1867:

Seriously? Questioning communication after a WvW CDI? To me, this seems like digging pretty deep for the OP to find something to complain about. They communicated extensively on WvW. All the devs jumped in it together. Now they are taking time to mull over ideas. I find limited validity at best to the “communication” complaint.

We don’t need communication, we need something to actually be done.

You presume to speak for the community? Who is this we? I am simply speaking for myself, based on what the OP stated. He specifically and disingenuously claims that WvW gets no attention. You would probably do everyone a great service if you stuck to speaking for just yourself.

There have been literally hundreds of threads complaining about playing the same servers every week.

Seriously? Questioning communication after a WvW CDI? To me, this seems like digging pretty deep for the OP to find something to complain about. They communicated extensively on WvW. All the devs jumped in it together. Now they are taking time to mull over ideas. I find limited validity at best to the “communication” complaint.

grifflyman.8102:

This week did it for me. Forcing servers to compete with servers that vastly outnumber them is a sure way to alienate your player base.

I’m tired of playing servers that outnumber mine on every map, I just want an even fight.

It’s no longer fun, it’s repetitive and punishing. The maps are not large enough to split a massive server properly and removing swords from objectives will just punish the smaller servers even more.

Seriously, a rank 7 servers should NEVER play a rank 13.

A rank 9 should NEVER play a rank 15.

It’s an absolute joke.

I love this game, and I play to WvW but when the game I love so much does nothing but burn me week in and week out it’s a pretty good indicator that things won’t change.

Yet you complain when you compete against the same servers that have similar populations. What should be done about it, when folk complain regardless of the situation?

Simply claiming folks who disagree, as “condition lovers who hijack a thread” seems a bit over the top to me. It seems down right irrational to me when given the context that the discussion is about a condition based rune. In my opinion, it detracts from ones own argument to label and attack a disagreeing party in thay way. To me it is a sign that you feel facts alone, do not satisfy your perspective.

hybrid.5027:

sorrychief.2563:

rofl, there are meta builds for pve? don’t let these DNT guys play for you.

Why wouldn’t there be? When a specific job can be done in multiple ways there is always going to be an optimal way and a suboptimal.

Meta and optimal, are not the same thing.

So, your pressumin to claim to speak for every players mentality and perspective? You have no clue what kind of or how much satisfaction a player gets from winning a fight. You really should stop claiming you can speak for anyone else, much less everyone else. Particularly when your using it as a tool to portray the runes as an advantage over all others. Every rune has an advantage of one kind or another. I do not feel the same runes are a particularly strong advantage at all. Much less strong enough to create a thread to complain about them specifically.

sinject.4607:

so why are they still around if all they do is create problems for wvw balance?

Because they don’t. As far as I am concerned, they were not even a problem prenerf.

How do they imbalance WvW? Conditions have a very limited value due to group/AoE cleansing. So at worst, they may effect very specific roaming encounters. How does that imbalance WvW?

Although I see where your coming from, why do you assume you get to state so matter of factly, that it is inherently broken, and thus assume it requires a fix? Sure it could be adjusted so that it is complained about on the form less. That does not difinitivly define it as fixed. Particularly given that players, such as myself, do not feel it is broken.

It all boils down to personal opinion on the matter. For me, it becomes more difficult to respect someone’s opinion though, when they state it as if thief view or opinions, is fact.

caveman.5840:

coglin.1867:

caveman.5840:

rapid fire is the one channeled skill that u need to use both dodges just to dodge part of the skill ….

it stands out from all channeled skills because most of the skills can be dodged in one move .

I can not agree that they should change all channeled skills .
because no other channeled skill has as many multiple hits as rapid fire
with that kind of range and damage

it makes blind and ageis useless

but ranger should be buffed in return for any changes to rapid fire

I think changing the stealth tracking rapid fire would be a good change ….
but what is buffed in return is yet to be decided

There are a great deal of factually false statements here. Such as stating that you need two dodges to avoid the entire skill. That is false. As well, there are multiple skulls that offer 10 hits and have the exact same duration or more. I can only guess you are making statements about other professions, without having experience playing them.

name one channeled skill with the number of hits as rapid fire
the range/damage
and cool down

and can u dodge rapid fire in one dodge ?
like most channeled skills ‘_’ ???

Ahh. Now you are adding a new qualifier of range. Change it all you like. As a player that deals with a ranger, likely as often, if not more then you, I have no problems with them. Unless something in the game changes, you will not convince me, because I can deal with them as well as I can any profession. In fact, through the various “such and such” is OP, for every profession that has arose, there is also a player such as yourself, that will not be convinced that it can be dealt with, in the context of the profession as a while.

If you dodge toward the ranger, you can dodge every arrow in one dodge.

Sreoom.3690:

Poor zergs get mad when their trains get derailed by siege disabliers….I’m not feeling y’all’s pain.

It doesn’t have to be a zerg. It is the same if it is a single scout against a 5 man group or 2 groups of 5 each. Why should the be forced to have to assault a door with their characters when a smaller number of defenders already have counter seige?

I think being able to disable them on a limited bases, in order to slow them down until help arrives, makes sense. The problem is that walls cannot be damage by player characters, yet the siege that can damage walls, can be permanently disabled by rotating out a minimal amount of defenders, to redisable, and allow no siege uptime.

caveman.5840:

rapid fire is the one channeled skill that u need to use both dodges just to dodge part of the skill ….

it stands out from all channeled skills because most of the skills can be dodged in one move .

I can not agree that they should change all channeled skills .
because no other channeled skill has as many multiple hits as rapid fire
with that kind of range and damage

it makes blind and ageis useless

but ranger should be buffed in return for any changes to rapid fire

I think changing the stealth tracking rapid fire would be a good change ….
but what is buffed in return is yet to be decided

There are a great deal of factually false statements here. Such as stating that you need two dodges to avoid the entire skill. That is false. As well, there are multiple skulls that offer 10 hits and have the exact same duration or more. I can only guess you are making statements about other professions, without having experience playing them.

Bryzy.2719:

OP, you wanted logical arguments so let’s dismantle your thread with some.

Lets be honest here, he doesn’t want “logical” arguments. He want posters to agree with him, and help him validate his opinion, an opinion that was disagreed with whole hardheartedly in 97 post out of 100 made thus far in this thread.

Black Box.9312:

Don’t make a stupid title, and you won’t get stupid responses.

Definitely this.

The other problem is that even when posters make solid arguments, disagreeing with him, he uses this same accusation. Kind of a lose/lose situations.

sinject.4607:

but it’s true. if it wasn’t, you would be able to quote someone’s post in this thread proving me wrong.

In my opinion, anyone could prove you wrong by quoating almost any post in this thread that you did not make.

sinject.4607:

this is an embarrassing argument. there is no such thing to getting “outplayed” by a build that can effectively burst you down within the use of two skills all while being out of range. this is simply overrewarding someone for being able to press #2 at a distance while supported by AI.

If it is so strong, are you agreeable to hoping on your ranger and dueling my or others? We can record it and post the video.

sinject.4607:

stealth is as good as a reactionary mechanic as it is a precautionary one. the only thing that completely voids this are ranged channeled attacks, which has absolutely no reason for doing so. particularly on ranger, this tracing mechanic alone drastically undermines the existence of sic em’ entirely as mentioned earlier in this thread.

I am reasonably certain that “because the folks who created the game made it as thier design choice” is the perfect reason for doing so.

sinject.4607:

there’s a difference between counterplay and an unfair advantage. it’s unfair that melee weapons require to put yourself in much greater risk to actually do damage yet cannot trace through stealth like ranged (channeled) attacks can.

Yes, counter play is what everyone else does to you, that you claim is an unfair advantage. Unfair advantage is what you are demanding, by lobbying to remove all of the counter play.

sinject.4607:

the point is that ranged channel attacks have a lot of inherent advantages over melee ones, but tracing through stealth shouldn’t be one of them.

You do understand the “cause I say so” argument gets you know where right? Until you become a tyrannical leader of your own country, when the majority of the speakers on a subject disagree with you, the majority wins out.

The point is, you keep claiming your personal opinion as indisputable fact. I have to admit that I like that you do it. It is a solid guarantee that devs will over look your post when you state it so.

Bella Kim.4061:

I hope we come up with something productive that will improve this game

No. You can up with some suggestions that you feel are productive. You really shouldn’t approach this as if your opinion were fact, and that your personal perspective is that of everyone else.

Bella Kim.4061:

I hope Guild Wars 2 will improve after 3 months

I like improvements. In any game. I simply have faith that they will not implement any of the suggestions you listed. I feel they will clearly degrade the game, and certainly won’t improve it.

Bella Kim.4061:

I wonder what developers think about this issue
maybe they just want to ignore this because more fix = more work

Why do you wonder what they think? One would like to believe you would have read their previous post on the subject before making your post. You do yourself a great disservice by not knowing such things before you speak on them.

What profession do you play?

How long have you played it?

Do feel stealth is a problem on multiple professions or just one?

What professions do you feel it is a problem on?

Have you played those professions? If so, how long?

Aylpse.6280:

I already have bleed stacks by then and sneak attack/dodges adds more.
You’ve likely never played a Mesmer without condi cleanse have you?

Why would anyone play any profession with out a condition cleanse. As far as I am concerned, you have no right to complain about how much damage you take or how you take it, from conditions, when you refuse to run a condition remover.

Aylpse.6280:

I cant give up utility for a unreliable cleanse that’s bugged 50% of the time.

If you claim mesmers do not have a reliable condition removal, then I do not feel you know your profession very well. In my opinion, you need more knowledge of the profession, before you can base complaints around your experience.

Necrotize.2974:

Aside from having no idea what build they’re all playing or if they’re organized or not, one thing stands out. If you were trying to point out how all the rangers have much higher points than the other classes, why does your team’s ranger only have 40 points? Obviously he’s doing something different than the other rangers.

That was my immediate thought before I read your post.

I don’t understand the problem. I literally destroy all of the turrets in the area in 3s, while damaging the engineer. I don’t understand why players have difficulty out smarting AI.

insanemaniac.2456:

protection injection + stabilized armor = hard countered

they will literally auto lose by holding a hammer. but most builds wont run that, specially if youre talkin about pvp and not wvw, it tends to be a waste of points in pvp.

Personally I really love that trait combo. I also use smoke bomb to keep a few blinds up. Otherwise they have big tells for what to dodge.

LunarNacht.8913:

If anyone would use a skill with such an drawback, I can’t say.

Like engineer skills? Such as rifle #4 with a self knock down. Rocket boots worked the same way for a year. Elixirs still have RnG effects as well.