Guild Wars 2

daydream.2938:

It’s funny to see what the devs get accused of. When I left spirit ranger was basically useless. Now people say its OP. And to accuse Dev’s of being behind this because they want pet rangers. have no idea what they are doing. LOL.

Making one of the kittentiest most passive specs to play, instead of fixing it to be a more strategic, active team buffing, spec… they outright buffed it to top tier quality…
That is a disaster waiting to happen… and for devs… devs that so obviously care so much about this game… to repeatedly do things like that… it just means, they are utterly incapable of helping GW2…

People get kitten y when that happens, when a game they really want to succeed flops so hard because of kitten like that.

milo.6942:

for kitten sake, stop asking for buffs
ask for nerfs to obscene specs

At some point specs have to become generally enjoyable to play.
Balance doesn’t give that.

If you say ‘but they are’.
Just know, no one really plays GW2 anymore.

Vena.8436:

They were terrible times! Mein gott!

If only the world were so kind as to spare me from any more MJ products…

PS: The fact that the devs care in spades, is, if anything, what gives some people hope that this game has a future.

I enjoyed WAR.
But it was also the first MMO I got into, so had that kicker on its side.
It had legions of issues, but the PvP was still popular.

I even thought Rift PvP was good up to lvl 40.

GW2…

Anyways.
They do have allot of work cut out for them, and I could forgive slow production time (to a point)… if what they did put out was very helpful to the game.

That hasn’t been the case and their timing couldn’t be slower… I mean it took them 6 months to up projectile speed on shortbow… it took them 3~ months to realize warriors might need compensation from the frenzy nerf… the leaderboards are trash, SPvP is the worst hotjoin I’ve seen and they split solo and ‘any group’ que…
Anet might have talent, brilliance and passion, but its worthless if it isn’t put to the task.

Vena.8436:

It leaves them but good teams will shift around that.

The point is that a lack of depth and versatility in classes, to the point where certain ones typically outright hardcounter others…
It kills casual AND high-level play.

In a team based game, having AN enemy who’s spec hardcounters yours can be played around through teamwork and positioning… but in a 1v1 or 2v2 skirmish… there is very little room to play around with…
Pugs hate feeling useless.
Pros need tons of depth in gameplay.
Hard counters in conquest supply neither.

showatt.9413:

Vena.8436:

garethh.3518:

like WAR

I agree, we should have only one class in the whole game called Bright Wizard. That was probably the most brilliant design decision WAR made, one class to rule them all, along with its many other brilliant decisions that led to its astronomical and ongoing critical success.

See what I mean? If you can’t even convince some random on the forum, how are you going to convince the people who have vastly more superior industry knowledge than you that the changes you’re asking for is good?

Good stuff btw Vena. I loled a bit.

You act like the talk here, if sensible and convincing, will in some way matter to the future of the game.
You must be new here?

It’s possible that the pressure towards success and intricacies of working in a larger team are slowing them down.
It’s also possible that the devs really don’t know how to make an enjoyable game. People have always said GW1’s gameplay went downhill with time… meaning Anet actually was making the game less enjoyable to play with their changes… which means they aren’t actually sure what an enjoyable game plays like… which REALLY fits the changes coming out in GW2, disregarding the ludicrous amounts of time it took to make them.

Vena.8436:

garethh.3518:

like WAR

I agree, we should have only one class in the whole game called Bright Wizard. That was probably the most brilliant design decision WAR made, one class to rule them all, along with its many other brilliant decisions that led to its astronomical and ongoing critical success.

Hah.
Good times.

Anyways…
There’s a lil bit of a difference.
The WAR devs just didn’t care.
GW2’s have caring in spades… they just are incapable from one means or another… shoring up that issue with simplicity would only seem to help.

dDuff.3860:

Get used to it.

Slow down.
People don’t play a game because it has a counter-able meta.
People don’t play a game because its cheese specs can be killed through some spec based means.

A game has to be enjoyable first and formost.
GW2 isn’t.

No amount of balance or shifts in which classes are ‘the cheese’ will change that.
GW2 has driven away nearly every person who has picked it up to PvP.
That is bound to cause allot of complaints.
The forums are one of the outlets for that.

When GW2 stops hemorrhaging players one way or another, you’ll see them calm down.

Vena.8436:

I’d prefer it more if the build were tuned to be in line with how warrior currently operates against necros and spirit rangers -> punishes their utility greed. The hammer warrior simply demolishes spirits and leaves a spirit ranger with nothing on the back four of his ability slots, especially now and he’ll be dead in 25s. Likewise a necro slotted with greedy, offensive utilities find themselves getting stunlocked. Stunlock warrior, though, quickly falls apart against more balanced builds and professions that can managed his skull cracks, for example. (Healing signet is a bit too oppressive though.)

Not in this game, not in skirmishy conquest.
If the game was more team based, sure, having specific specs hard counter others, that could be a somewhat common thing… but not in this game.
It in GW2, in a small skirmishy game… it just leaves an unavoidable situation where you will get kitten on, best player NA or not…

No one wants that.
GW2 did so many things wrong, their terribly created class/utilities, ones that might have had a shot at working in a team based game… it could have made a decently popular game if it was just 5v5 team v team.

But not in this conquest.
A game without depth through teamwork and map awareness (most notably comparable to MOBAs) needs to make up for it, in combat… specs NEED to be a few dozen times more dynamic than they are atm (as dynamic if not more so than most moba specs) to bring in a working skill base, to avoid the extremely hard spec-countering-spec and ‘most specs are just kitten’ situation GW2 currently is drowning in…

They really should have just done classes like WAR or WoW.
Sure having traits and weapons you can mix and match is cool… but only if the dev team is EXTREMELY competent…
Anet isn’t, even in the most passionate delusion.

The devs aren’t competent enough to enact timely changes in a complicated system (like traits), and they for rucks sake even aren’t able to take a simple/controlled setup (like weapons/utils) and tweak them to be more enjoyable to play!!

It leaves the devs in a terrible pickle that makes me wonder again and again how GW1 came to be…

Tricare.2946:

How about you leave all the changes you see these silly little spvp players complaining about, in spvp.

How about you check out the WvW world, and help out there more.

Perplexity Runes would be fixed already if they were in S/Tpvp, but you wouldn’t know what’s wrong with them would you.

S/Tpvp will never be an E-Sport.

SPvP is like the spoiled 4 year old….
The one inflated like a balloon because the parents keep cramming kitten down its throat…

Be happy WvW doesn’t have any of that attention.
WvW is playable right now.
WvW has people playing it (last I checked).
S/TPvP is for all intensive purposes smothered and dead.

jsu.4370:

I spoke to all of the pvp developers after the event and although the community seems to think they don’t know what they’re doing. They actually do. They know the meta is crap right now and they know about all the small bugs and systematic errors and the direction they mentioned they were wanting to take it in the future sounded very promising. The developers are very smart and very analytical, I give them all mad respect.

What the community doesn’t realize is all this negativity you’re conjuring and developing on the forums doesn’t help you get more responses from devs. It’s actually hurting you, a lot. The developers don’t have time to sit there and carefully word their paragraphs in a way that doesn’t outrage the community every time. We have one of the most offensive communities I’ve seen. Oh well I guess hate is always going to be louder than love.

Well done Anet, to a successful event. The internet may think otherwise; but I know the teams personally had an amazing time and the viewers at the event did also.

sorry, but respect isn’t a one way road…
When the game stops hemorrhaging all its population… I’m sure the forums will clean up.

Devs.
Sorry for all the backlash you guys get, it will eat you up inside if you pay attention to it.
The internet, especially the forums of a game that massively flopped, just aren’t bearable places for people who care.
Tragic, but the biggest truths tend to be.

Anyways Allie, I wish you all the luck in the world in what you do, and that you can kind of shift your job over to ‘starting-up/guiding topics/threads based on what the devs are currently focusing on’* instead of just trying to trudge through the kitten that infests these forums.

It’d let you become more of a guiding hand for the forums, giving a sense of direction to people who genuinely want to help as they are shown topics that the devs are currently interested in…
I can only see that as a plus, any way I look at it.

natsos.3692:

It is exactly what SPvP needs right now, we need a guy that can be the gate between the Devs and the Community.
While you guys are working on delivering a better game we won’t feel forgotten and alone because there will be someone there to respond back and you will have more time to work on your stuff.

It is a Win-Win.

What the community needs is a good game.
Communication is a nice perc and a courtesy, but IT WILL NOT MAKE A GAME.

Having more communication about what the devs goal is before they, for example, take months to make a badly enacted change, won’t help anything.

I know it sounds pessimistic… but it has been a year… and Anet has wrote out many, many goals that brought out hope to many people… and they have driven away the vast majority of their player base…
(especially after pax, so many big names left after that)

You devs care about GW2, and want it to succeed, you have a great amount of passion, and well, that’s GREAT!!
I love that about you.
Passion is one of the most important things a dev team could have, without it a game can be left to whither as the devs are playing WoW. Caring about the game is essential, well, next to the ability to actually be an effective dev team… BUT the one great thing a large amount of care and care alone can give, the one gift you guys seem to be holding back from GW2… is in yourselves. Let it go.

You think you’re doing everything to help the game, but it’s still going downhill, you know of GW2’s potential, you know it can be great if tweaked right… but it hasn’t gotten any better… there comes a point in time where, to truly help something, if you truly care for it… you let it go, give it away, sell it off to someone else… It sucks to say it, but the game might just need a new dev team to have a shot at making it…

dreztina.4820:

Nice posts, but I’ll wait until I see results before changing my opinions. Words are the easy part.

And have been… since way back before release.
They made a hell of allot of promises, like, the game wasn’t going to be burst based, like it was going to be latancy friendly, like it was going to be the first MMO esport…
Everyone loved hearing those things BUT the game ended up being the furthest thing in the world from their very core intentions…

That, along with ever tweak since, speaks louder than any post or interview the devs have done, it screams out how much they actually know about what they are doing and where GW2 is going…

There have been dozens of threads calling out specific devs over what they did wrong.
They tend to never respond.

But best of luck!
:)

No.
And for the little it means, the 8 other people I started playing the game with didn’t care much about GW2 after the first month, which is far short of enough caring to to log in and answer now…

djaddi.2780:

ArenaNet knows about these problems already. What ArenaNet actually needs are not lists of existing problems, they need solutions – or, in Jon’s words, details. The game needs solutions or at least suggestions, not “I quit”-posts that don’t have any productive content. Therefore, I fully understand the removal of Xeph’s thread.
Have fun,

Addi

He’s right that knowing ‘a problem’ verse ‘its solution’ is vastly different.
He’s right that people saying ‘heres a bunch of issues, solve them’ isnt always possible.
But to an extent, it should be.
Especially when that is your job and your job alone.

Every game needs solutions to its problems, It is what devs exist for. If a group of people aren’t fit for that job…. that’s not the forums place to take over, that’s the manager’s as he searches for a new dev team that actually can do the job, the only job, a dev team exists to do…

That’s kind of the conundrum it seems the forums are running into. The forumers expect pointing out an issue along with occasional well thought out solutions to the devs to be ample work on their side to fix the game, as it should be. The GW2 devs seem to need their hand held from problem to solution in every instance, completely cutting out any work on their side, short of through coding…

Lopez.7369:

Luiz Swordbreaker.6547:

How many viewers were there?

Less than 5,000.

Quickfoot Katana.8642:

Jumper left, Acandis left, Zoose left, Xeph left, Helseth is leaving after next Mist League. Everyone is abandoning ship

oh… my… god.
I honestly didn’t think the game was in THAT bad of a state…
Holy Shi’ite…
Anet… wow devs… you guys…
I get it, you devs care about GW2 and want it to succeed, your passionate and that’s GREAT!! I love that about you. Passion is one of the most important things a dev team could have, without it a game can be left to whither as the devs are playing WoW. Caring about the game is essential, well, next to the ability to actually be an effective dev team… BUT the one great thing a large amount of care and care alone can give, the one gift you guys have been holding back from GW2… is in yourselves. Let the game go.

You think you’re doing everything to help the game… but its still going downhill, you know of GW2’s potential, you know it can be great if tweaked right… which leaves the problem at only one doorstep… there comes a point in time where, to truly help something, if you truly care for it… you let it go, give it away, sell it off to someone else… get a new dev team…

GW2 has a massive amount of potential and has since beta.
Give it a chance to live up to that…
Go away.

cymerdown.4103:

I should have screenshotted my team arena game where it matched my #ESPAHTS team versus rabbits and deer Not enough people team qing these days, sad times.

Can’t really say nobody expected that.
The TPvP population is depressingly small… the reason Anet wants to split solo and group que is because they can’t create good enough match making for the small population…
Both of those things, bad matchmaking and a small population, are the very reasons a split que can’t work… team que will turn into a ghost town and few people are willing to play a game entirely solo…

I’ve been calling it, the game is going to be pretty much deserted, when it comes to PvP, by the end of the year.
Anet seems keen to drive away anyone who wants to like this game.

@yasha
Maybe I’m biased.
I mained a healer in allot of MMOs.

Anyways, we all have different opinions.
I found most token MMOs much more engaging to play than GW2. GW2 had many innovations and good core ideas, just the execution… all in all… I got bored of it leaps and bounds faster than any MMO I have ever played… even Rift and I started getting bored of Rift after hitting level cap (it was a really fun game before that though).

@Diage.6451

Conquest won’t make an esports or top notch quality game mode, by any means.
But I’d happily widdle away my time playing the game with conquest as a map, if the combat was very well made around it.

It won’t make a GW1, but it could be a pale version of its predecessor, that’s the least anyone has asked for and the bare minimum I wanted from the game.
Conquest can work for that.

Back point bunker is a gay position.
The actual strats tend to be depressingly simplistic.
Large issues, but things I personally could cope with.

And yeah, I find the reward system hilariously bad.
Like the worst I have EVER seen, they could have kittening just givin 1/100th~ of the netted glory from chests after salvaging and 0-2 pieces of gear; then made all gear cost glory, the higher up ones took much more to buy, and they had a money->glory exchange…
Bam.
They would have actually made money off of PvP instead of throwing away hundreds of thousands if not millions of dollars because PvP players couldn’t give money to the guys even if they wanted to…

Conan.8046:

You sound very ungrateful for the work they put in for us and the feedback we get is vastly more than 90% of games. You want to bring money into this? when was you last subscription payment?

You do have to understand.
This game was hyped as the biggest esports game.
Anet completely and totally whiffed when it came to that.

People get kitten ed when you deceive them (intentionally or not), especially to the extent of ‘the quality of your entire game’…
It causes allot of people to be kitten ed at the guys so bag on the guys at every opportunity.

Are the devs putting their best foot forward to help the problem… probably.
Should they be MMO devs if these are the results… definitely not.

Giving feedback and putting in effort is one thing, its like getting brownie points from your players.
Brownie points won’t make or break a population… the quality of your game will… that’s what people stick around for, a game worth playing, and tragically (it truly is) that’s what the Anet devs aren’t delivering.

Knote.2904:

The lack of communication is literally going to be what causes the death of pvp in this game.

To put it bluntly… no one seriously gives a kitten about communication.
If a game is worth playing no one goes on the forums expecting devs to talk out each and every aspect of their patch notes and hopes for the future…
It doesn’t matter at all.

GW2 is a terribly made game.
The devs telling the population their patch notes and what they are playtesting won’t change the fact that they are terrible at making a game engaging to play.
Tossing the devs for new ones seems more like what you are looking for, ones that actually scout out future changes from the forums, talk out their changes over the forums and enact the patches in a timely and quality manner… something the current devs are utterly incapable of doing.

Anyways, people who enjoy a game don’t give a kitten about the forums… the forums are NEVER a make or break deal for a game… at best they are a moral cushion that can keep people hanging on to a game for a lil bit longer…

From day one, they should have just added a larcenist strike (in mechanic) to every thief weapon abilities.
Of course they would be different attacks, and be more situational and whatnot… but anyways…. the primary abilities cost little to no initiative, and the second abilities cost 3->5. Then after screwing up the ini regen traits so you have to majorly invest in them to actually be able to shoot off skill after skill.. vuala, a very deep and strategic class in a game (conquest) that desperately needs that.

It’d create a ‘sort of CD’ setup where you use a primary skill, a secondary comes up for 7->15s and if you want to use it, you can pay the ini and open up the primary one again.
Spam, but with consequence, or play well, deal with the ‘sort of CDs’ and not have to spec so heavily into initiative.

But no.
Anet has no kittening idea how to make a game.
The kittening made spam fest initiative.
It’s just luck, and luck alone that made GW1 into something worth playing.

Dirame.8521:

I guess all we need from the Devs is that they tell us; “New modes are coming” and then we’d all be like “AAARARRGGG!!!! BRAINGASM”

GW2 will still be the same game…

People say ‘we need new game modes, having 1 in a game sucks!!’
But… most every MMO has revolved around 1~ style of combat with different side objectives and layouts of the map… all in all the game usually always ends with the same style of combat.

In GW2 though, I mean, yeah this conquest isn’t a good mode, and its odd enough to cause the game’s balance to be awkward enough to make just dropping in new game-modes to be a lil tough . Anyways, on point, the issue though that even if you found the best map for the game, it would still not be great… a game could easily get away with this conquest as its core map style if the combat was well made and so engaging to the players… don’t get me wrong conquest does GW2 no favors but it isn’t unworkable… like the current combat setup.
There’s a reason every esports team left within a few months and for the most part the 3mil people who bought the game too… synced through all NA que times still typically go over 10 mins short of during prime time… that’s CRAZY.

Anyways allot of the map complaints just seem like, no offense, but people unhappy with the game and blaming the first thing that comes to mind… and thats ‘one map style’…

Anyways, I could be wrong, but I can only see a new modes, at best giving most people a few weeks of ‘this is nifty!!’ before it wears out and people start complaining just like before… because the combat itself just isn’t engaging.

AndrewSX.3794:

About this – and the whole “Why Gw1 PvP was better – Why we don’t have deathmatch or GvG” argument i’m thinking, lately, that it’s something very related to the removal of Monks or, in general, of the healer.

I’m deeply against trinity, both for pvp and for pve. I was kinda hyped by the no trinity approach of Gw2. But after 1 year, it looks like the solution is worse than the problem – see DG meta being 5 DPS and rest is trash, see PvP where Devs can’t go further than Conquest mode and Damage is simply out of whack.

It’s so easy to make a 5v5 game where dedicated healers and tanks don’t exist yet there isn’t 5 spike dps.

If the game had well made conditions and countergank abilities along with some sort of healing for the sake of sustain…
The core of it is actually jokingly easy to make, in my mind.
You don’t have dedicated healers, instead you have something like current heal skills except they tend to aoe out a portion of their healing to allies, like rangers healing spring would burst out a heal on cast, and one 3-4s later, necros heal will be like troll ungent except aoe out healing while in death shroud.
It’d keep the sustain needed for a fight to keep going on, short of a spike dps based rampage.

That is something easily stopped.
Having blind not go away when attacking (also never last more than 2s and have a duration cap of around 4~) be a 30-50% dmg debuff, weakness being something like ‘1/2 dmg on crit’ and combo fields be a large part of doing good spike dmg… well then there are easily enough counters and situational factors to running a spike that there’s a game capable of good gameplay.

The GW2 devs just suck balls.

Yasha.5963:

I have searched high and low for another game with good pvp for several months

That’s the only reason GW2 has a PvP population… there is no other decent PvP MMO out there atm short of kitten like WoW.

Phasing out healers… its probably a bit of a plus, IF they do more than just dump healers.
GW2 didn’t so its definitely a negative, their ‘no healer setup’ neglects teamwork… they didn’t put in anything to compensate for tossing healers and tanks… healers were a staple of the genre for a reason, they were a super simple concept that got people working together and playing entirely as a team…
Allot of people love that.

I’m not saying healers are ideal… I’m more a fan of getting rid of dedicated healers , but still, healers fill a role MMO PvP benefits from. Tossing the role, not the means to it won’t help a game in the slightest.

If GW2 did something like… make combo fields into a legitimate thing, I don’t mean combo fields as they are right now, but combo fields as an extra ‘utility slot’ type skill every player had. With one button you could place a type of combo field through some maneuver and the field gives strong buffs/debuffs for combo’ing abilities through it. Then combo’ing skills were a lil more consistently on weapon sets… that could be a working replacement.

MaXi.3642:

they dont do anything because of —-… so i REALLY hope they will introduce some BIG balance patch after —-… and many others hope as well…

I’m pretty sure you can just copy and past that stuff short of the dashes and find a dozen posts saying the same thing since beta.

Everyone always has always been hoping.
Anet has yet to deliver.

And the guy asking about forum responses…
Haven’t you noticed Anet only picks up talk on the forums right around patch time?
It’s probly not too far off so you should have some forum responses in a few weeks.

Arheundel.6451:

Let me understand you propose to add normal CD on skill for the first part of the sequence and initiative to the second part of the sequence, wouldn’t this double tax a thief for using his skills?..or maybe I have understandood wrong

The secondary ability is the ‘CD’, just like on flanking->larcenist strike.
Just imagine specs typically regening much less initiative and having most every attack have a secondary one that costs 3-4 ini.
Initiative regen would be lessened, most notably on a few traits, to ensure that people can’t easily get such high ini regen that they can still lol-spam certain abilities/combos without largely hurting other parts of their spec or situational requirements (gain more ini when not attacking/moving exc.).

Arheundel.6451:

3) S/d Thief
-Shadow return = 4 inititiative ( if you want to mele, you need to take risks, not simply hit and run 24/7, the return should be a tactical choice and not something that can be spammed with impunity)
-Larcenous strike = 3 initiative ( pick carefully the boons you want from the enemy)
Possibly the 4 intitiative shadow return would make a 3 initiative larcenous strike an overnerf so this is up to debate really

Bad ideas.
The issue with the s/d thief isn’t the initiative costs on abilities.
Initiative has already taken a place in the class that screams ‘be a one trick pony spike dps or stack initiative like a motherkittener so you can actually kill someone before running out’

That is bad.
Initiative should be more pushed to a secondary mechanic… abilities should be like flanking->larcenist strike and shadow return, not in the OP nature they are atm, but that they have secondary abilities attached to them. The secondary ability should be the only thing costing initiative. That’d make a class where, if you use an ability it, goes ‘on CD’ for 7-15s as the secondary ability takes its spot. It’d give dozens more strategic options if the secondary abilities are made well, it’d make ini regen a perc, not a necessity for most thief specs but most importantly… it’d make a situation where if you wanted to spam an attack, you could, at a large price.

A simple fix to make initiative into a working and strategic mechanic.

It’s a good idea, in its core concept.
But the devs suck.

Anyways, the idea of precision dealing less dmg than power but giving added status anailments and whatnot… it’s a very good idea.

But like everything… Anet enacted te idea terribly… they kittening made sigils for the ‘on crit’ effects so it wasn’t a class/weapon based deal… so it couldn’t be strong or else some classes multihit attack (spammable unload) would make it OP.
That makes precision as a standalone stat bad… especially since the ‘on procs’ are pretty much all condi dmg based.
That along with precision/critdmg scaling so well with power so power is useless alone…
kittening devs.

Oolune.4357:

Rangers suddenly have a build that isn’t mediocre = everyone whines. This is amusing.

Just forget how next to no one plays a spirit ranger because its a fun spec… then sure…
Your spot on.

I quit playing when I realized Anet didn’t give a kitten whether a spec was actually engaging to play, just whether or not it was balanced.

Julius.1094:

The whole notion of “SPVP doesn’t bring income” is such bullkitten.

MMO PvP is notoriously bad at being a main source of income.

MOBAs have a solid formula for success, if you make a tri-lane map with a few core concepts and create abilities in a general way… you will have good PvP.
MMO PvP isn’t quite that easy to make, at least atm… with most dev teams being trash and PvE players being so easy to entertain… well it ends with MMO PvP typically being a second rate feature…

Pyroatheist.9031:

The reason why many pros will leave autoattack on is because if you manually press the autoattack button, you are unable to interrupt the attacks to do another action

It is kittened that the devs designed it like this.
And yeah, that was why on my ranger I was swapping to a style where I kept auto-attack on so I could daze out heal skills consistently… well… before this game lost any and every competitive interest.

Anet made cleansing terribly.
It’s their fault they tossed the easy way to make conditions dynamic out the door…. adding another large complication to the game… ehh… don’t see it helping at all.

Making conditions innately situational… that would have been great, like confusion was a short duration ‘attack denial’ sort of condition, chill really impacted something like dodging, bleed/burn weren’t raw dmg but involved actual conditions to pull notable numbers… you may say ‘but the game is already like that’… conditions have to be your only dmg source for any dmg one to be notable… that utterly kills situational conditions.
Anyways great potential, wasted by Anet…
kittening devs.

There have been dozens better written, more in depth constructive posts floated around these forums. Not a criticism on your posts so much as a show of how many people have taken fixing GW2 to heart.
Anyways, Anet has ignored them all.

So far the devs have shown that they don’t know what a better game is, or just don’t have the resources to fix this one… whats relevant from that is that the forums seemingly have been marked by the devs as a place to ‘appease the masses’. Nothing said here has been taken seriously unless it was addressing something the devs are already considering and are in the process of doing….

Anyways, I could be wrong, hope is great to have, I don’t wanna jump up and down on it if it’s your thing.

Diage.6451:

Don’t forget Anet, designed it to have minimal choice. So that their job could be easier.

I find it hilarious that the only thing the current trait/weapon system did, by putting all the balance in the dev’s hands, just made everyone realize exactly how little the devs know about ‘enjoyable gameplay’…
It made people realize how kittening lucky the devs were to actually make GW1.
It must have been like kittenting out gold for them.

BurrTheKing.8571:

Honestly, the game balance isn’t that bad if you ask me. The problem is players have fallen into the mindset that conditions are the most unbeatable builds ever…

You’re right, balance in this game is good, it’s actually better than most MMOs.

Everything after that though…
The problem with GW2 isn’t the thoughts about condi’s being OP… it isn’t about learning to counter spec the meta. It isn’t about people not knowing the game isn’t balanced around 1v1…

Sure, because of that, the game ended up decently balanced, but so is flipping a coin.
No one kittening plays a game for balance.
It’s all about engaging gameplay, and GW2 is lacking that sorely.
That is the issue.

I don’t mind aspects that touch on a MOBA in an MMO, I actually think a half-MOBA MMO would be amazing.
But Anet took the worst aspect of MOBAs (the rock-paper-scissors speccing) and left out every good feature of a MOBA map… I mean they left out literally every strength in the MOBA genre… its things like that that make me hate the devs.

GW2 is basically a bunch of nifty ideas with obviously no thought behind when enacting, its why so few people play GW2 and every legit esports team left after a month or two…

The issue isn’t so much “conditions can’t be a main dmg source” so much as that “GW2 wasn’t setup around conditions being a strong dmg source”…
The devs didn’t think it through in the slightest when making the game, they didn’t make cleansing or amulets or weapons like conditions were supposed to be a high solo dmg source…
Condi removal traits, there is typically 1~ notable one in only most classes, and its an extremely strong counter-condi trait. Devs do things like that when it is supposed to be situational to actually need any sort of counter to it at all.
Most condi-weapons have utterly useless physical dmg attacks…
Amulets provided extreme physical dmg scaling, while condi ones seem intent on bunkering… meaning it would just be a slow sustained sort of dmg.
Even in utilities there is only a few scattered ones that remove conditions…

It’s like after tossing together the stuff they wanted in the game, they just balanced kitten out until it wasn’t OP, then kittening called it a day and went back to praising themselves or twiddling their thumbs.
kittening devs.

The game is a mess from the ground up, I like the idea of conditions as a main dmg source, I hate… utterly hate… how they implemented it.

Juan Ignacio.8903:

Sotg were useless, the players that were invited asked questions and anet talk about other stuff, saying we cant talk about it/soon/meeting/working on it, and it ended up in every1 nodding with each other and laughing.
I mean the most important change that they did wich was the quickness nerf, they never talked about it instead they said “we going to make banners stronger”.

Seriously, I read OP and was thinking ‘This is the GW2 SoTG he is talking about, right???’
Are people in a state of nostalgia already or am I missing something?
Do people really feel that the devs reading out patch notes, most guests acting completely self-serving and focusing only on their own class and spec and the future patch notes, while any good questions, a question not focused on the goals of the patch notes, a question actually addressing the state and future of the game, being forbidden, something Anet cant talk about.
Did that really help people?

I’m kind of lost, I always thought people were hating on the SoTG for being utterly useless, I mean about as useless as a king having a public audience to tell people that the hurricane’s not gonna hurt them…

Its still the same game…
The same bad matchmaking, the same gameplay, same map style for every insance…

Just go to a different game if you didn’t like GW2 before, the devs seem happy with where GW2 is, and was at a year ago, short of balancing tweaks.

GankSinatra.2653:

these triple A pvp devs didnt even have the foresight to percieve any problems with tiny Asura models during years of development

They are terrible.
Just played a lil of a ‘moba that shall not be named’, and god the difference…
Well made combat in every way I can think of, polished UI and relevant PvP rewards, an entire meta that doesn’t flop around with patch notes…
kitten.

You were supposed to be amazing GW2… what the kitten went wrong?!!??

Leuca.5732:

Is there a window of opportunity to throw ideas to the playerbase and receive feedback?

The game is far beyond that.
If, in the first few months Anet more went to that notion and it ended bringing quick, actually a helpful patches…. GW2 could have had a shot at bringing enough progress to work out the kinks and be popular….

But the devs…
A year later and GW2 is still in the same shambles as at launch.
I mean, openness can only do some much, more openness now… Anet is far too set in their way of ‘one step at a time and see how it plays out for a few month’ balancing… that alone kittens up any chance of the game coming back. To boot they don’t seem like the kind of guys who will actually take forums criticism seriously, unless the critique is something they already thought of beforehand.

Alissah.9281:

I also think the total stats from items should be 75% in tournaments. It would make the difference between bunker and glass cannon much smaller. Maybe even 50% :o. But keep it as it is now for hotjoin.

Just a subtle nerf to physical dmg, and so bump to condis and retal with mild bump to might stacking.

Since you don’t seem to have thought it through.
Physical dmg, if you lose half your stats in physical dmg, you don’t lose half your dmg, you lose much more.
Physical dmg in GW2 isn’t linear. Power, crit, crit dmg, %bonus dmg, they all scale off of each other, so as you gain more of each of them, each point of power/crit/critdmg/%dmg becomes more effective.

That’s the issue withe the system, not the amount of stats, but the scaling between them.
If critting was a viable standalone dmg source, like critdmg just gave something like a flat bonus dmg on crit and there were a few more non-scaling bonuses on crit like life-leach, the game would have soooo much more diversity…. going power/crit/critdmg would give you good dmg, but not obscenely more since critdmg doesn’t scale off power…

Anyways, the games just a complete catastrophe of ineptitude.
Anet didn’t seem to think a single thing out when they made it.
Conquest heavily promotes the already promoted ‘burst dps’ since the best roamer is the best burster… it’s just a terrible, terrible siutation that won’t be fixed short of kittening up the core of conquest or the entire physical stat system.

Your ‘suggestions’…
Your ‘suggestions’ are ‘ehh’ where they aren’t vague/intuitive to the point of uselessness.
Yes Anet knows battlefield clutter is bad.
Yes Anet know better telegraphing is better.
Yes Anet knows there are many, many bad specs out there.

If they didn’t, well, you better pray that isn’t the case.
There wouldn’t be cause for an ounce of hope if the devs didn’t realize those things…. I mean it’d be like they aren’t playing their own game, if they don’t play their own game, they would laugh at the idea of taking the forums seriously.

ronpierce.2760:

garethh.3518:

ronpierce.2760:

People are really starting to baffle me with this ranger letting “AI spirits” do all the work for them… Are you people stupid? I don’t even play spirit ranger and I know all they are- are stronger, but killable signets that have to be casted… They don’t do anything.. they stand there and supply buffs that ARENT 100% uptime (10 second ICD) so essentially they’re just signets with an HP bar. How in the kitten is that AI winning the game? If a spirit ranger has 4 pets out and stands afk, guess how much damage an attacker would take? Maybe a little from his actual pet, spirits would have done just about nothing…

You should realize, if you have ever actually talked to a person before, that phrases aren’t always meant literally…

For kittens sake, saying something is “like a signet but with a lifebar” doesn’t mean it involves much skill to use. Yes spirits don’t attack for you, but auto-attack does.
Rangers don’t have a complicated or dynamic ability scheme.
Shortbow is quite literally spam 1 unless you feel like crippling the target for a few seconds or interrupting/poisoning a heal skill.
At best its using your 4~ on demand dodge rolls somewhat decently, that is a depressingly lower skillcap than a viable, top tier, spec in any other popular game.
That is what people hate.

Yes there is ‘cheese’ like spirit rangers in other games.
No, cheese doesn’t tend to sit around in top tier esports meta.

Um, it is literally what they mean, or they wouldn’t call it AI. They’d say Ranger passive buffs are too strong. That’s not what they kitten about, its thakittens AI… Also, at least they’re signets you can dispel (by killing them). Helpful hint: do it…

All MMO pvp is about EVER is who makes the best/most EFFICIENT (see how ease of play can be part of that?) builds that work against the most scenarios, and there’s nothing wrong with that. There is absolutely NOTHING wrong with an easy-to-play build being top-tier, HOWEVER, Anet has a different issue, where maxing dps too often comes from auto attack and there is no real combos/rotations like in WoW, Necro dagger, Shortbow Ranger, etc get too much out of just spamming 1, THAT is the issue, not the summonable passive buffs… kitten , traits are basically ALL passive buffs, many with proc chances, its nothing new… If you look at what the game really entails nothing is that kitten hard… But yes, there are many weaponsets that get no dps benefit (in fact several lose dps) by using other skills, and that’s pretty crappy.

???
I don’t think anyone ever said “spirits are AIs that kill enemies for the ranger”
Is that your point of contention?
That you think people are complaining about how spirits actually attack and completely kill enemies while the ranger does literally nothing?

Take a step back, no one is saying that spirits aren’t passive signet-like buffs… no one is saying you can’t kill spirits… they are saying that those things aren’t making good gameplay or a remotely good ‘skill put in’->return situation.

And if you think its good for a game to have low skill cap specs be not just viable, but TOP TIER viable…. if you think in GW2 most of dmg comes from auto attacks and there aren’t “real” (whatever that means) combo’s and rotations in GW2…
We’re in two completely separate worlds.

ronpierce.2760:

People are really starting to baffle me with this ranger letting “AI spirits” do all the work for them… Are you people stupid? I don’t even play spirit ranger and I know all they are- are stronger, but killable signets that have to be casted… They don’t do anything.. they stand there and supply buffs that ARENT 100% uptime (10 second ICD) so essentially they’re just signets with an HP bar. How in the kitten is that AI winning the game? If a spirit ranger has 4 pets out and stands afk, guess how much damage an attacker would take? Maybe a little from his actual pet, spirits would have done just about nothing…

You should realize, if you have ever actually talked to a person before, that phrases aren’t always meant literally…

For kittens sake, saying something is “like a signet but with a lifebar” doesn’t mean it involves much skill to use. Yes spirits don’t attack for you, but auto-attack does.
Rangers don’t have a complicated or dynamic ability scheme.
Shortbow is quite literally spam 1 unless you feel like crippling the target for a few seconds or interrupting/poisoning a heal skill.
At best its using your 4~ on demand dodge rolls somewhat decently, that is a depressingly lower skillcap than a viable, top tier, spec in any other popular game.
That is what people hate.

Yes there is ‘cheese’ like spirit rangers in other games.
No, cheese doesn’t tend to sit around in top tier esports meta.

selan.8354:

ok the thing is those meta builds screw up a ton of other builds if they get nerfed. if u nerf all phantasms, yes the phantasm builds will get weaker and maybe are still sorta viable, but it would affect every single mesmer that doesent use those spvp builds. as a condi/reflection mesmer i have very little dps, but the phantasm is the only one that allows me to deal a little more dmg than just a 435 autoattack hit.

Phantasm should be tweaked, having to go out of your way to knock out 3~k dmg, for allot of specs, just isn’t a viable option. Sure for some aoe spams and condi specs, yeah they can slaughter phantasms like they are nothing, but that is kittened gameplay… where winning/losing is largely decided by spec…

Other games can get away with having ro-sham-bo style specs because they didn’t choose ‘skirmish-conquest’ as their game type… other MMOs actually focus mainly on teamwork or at very least positioning in a team, while GW2 tossed that out the window… doing that threw all the focus in GW2 on your spec and its strengths and weaknesses. It makes kittened gameplay.

Anyways, one step back, the issue with ‘needing phantasms for some viable phys dmg’ is not so much an issue with phantasms. It’s an issue with ‘viable physical dmg’.
Power/crit/critdmg and +%dmgs, they scale very, very well together…
It’s to the point where you either deal good base dmg, and then get high crits allot… or don’t bother with physical dmg (short of retal cheese).

Nothing will really fix that issue short of…

and/or

Romek.4201:

we had all this before we had condimeta and everything was fine

Ohhh, that perfectly explains why the population playing GW2 has been patheticly low for the past 6~ months…
This game had an outrageous amount of box sales at launch… millions… and no sub fee… and no MMO PvP competition… yet lost the vast, vast, majority of its population… because everything was going fine?

Just because you feel so, doesn’t make it universal.

I find it funny that Anet only goes to the forums around patch time.

Vena.8436:

garethh.3518:

a good game.

I think its a pretty good game actually.

Opinions are whatever you want them to be and I’m glad some people are finding enjoyment out of this game…

But the steep and unrecovered loss of population says you aren’t in the majority, tragically.
If GW2 was a generally thought to be, halfway decent game, it would have had an extremely high population. There is little->no real MMO PvP competition, only waning titans (WoW, exc.) and there were so many kittening fanboys at launch, so many people were dying to love/throw-money-at this game (including me)…. it had the perfect publicity at launch, no game could realisticly ask for more…

Yet it had the population of a game 6~ years down the road, after 6~ months.

Red.3572:

Millions of copies sold to people who don’t want to PvP?

The game was sold on a progressive, next gen PvE experience, not on PvP

This is just a ‘I say, you say’ sort of argument, there isn’t a single fact that could be brought up to support either side.
Just personal experience.

From my experience you are terribly, terribly wrong.
Just to clarify, from what I’ve seen GW2 probably sold a large portion of its copies on PvP, but it only retains a playerbase atm because of PvE.