Guild Wars 2

Vayne,

To answer your question on your original post, I do play like you. I am heavily involved in two different guilds. One is very dungeon/fractals focused and they other is much more PvE and guild focused. I enjoy both very much and love the social aspect of both guilds who have a lot of wonderful people in them. I agreed to be an officer in one of them because I like to help people out with anything. It makes playing for me fun.

As for this…

Vayne.8563:

pricer.5091:

Torpian.9142:

My mother always said ‘only stupid people get bored, they don’t know how to entertain themselves’.

Your mother was entirely wrong. The higher the intelligence the more the need for external stimulation. This is why there is frequently a link between high natural intelligence and poor behaviour in children at schools. It is also the reason why big cats, elephants, primates etc frequently display pacing behaviour, aggression and self-harm in captivity.

It is also the reason why highly intelligent people are usually not found working in highly repetitive jobs such as assembly line work.

You’ve said some untrue things but this is absolute at the bottom of the barrel. Intelligence doesn’t necessarily need to be spoon fed entertainment. SOME intelligent people can make their own entertainment.

What you’re confusing is something else with intelligence…and that’s drive. Some people are driven but many MANY intelligent people are not. A lot depends on their upbringing, their life experiences, their genes.

My intelligence tests quite high. I’m almost never bored. (and when I say quite high I mean just around the beginning’s of genius level). But I grew up in circumstances where I LEARNED to entertain myself, because when I grew up entertainment wasn’t spoon fed the way it is today. You had to think. Had to use your imagination. Had to figure out how to entertain yourself.

And once you get into that habit, external stimulation,. while nice, isn’t necessary.

And this…

Dafomen.7892:

Our playstyles seem to be very similar as I am a roamer too and I enjoy helping others out of tricky situations.

But where I realized we differ is when reading:

Vayne.8563:

…
My intelligence tests quite high. I’m almost never bored. (and when I say quite high I mean just around the beginning’s of genius level).
…

I could see some form of Irony but from the context it looks like you really mean this.
From that line on who can take you for serious? Looks like a classic case of narcissism here.

I agree with you Vayne and have this to add.

First: I don’t think Vayne was saying he had high intelligence to brag, but to point out that those with high intelligence can entertain themselves. Period. No narcissism at all.

Second: There are many people with ceiling shattering IQ’s who are very stupid. The ability to retain knowledge and test well says nothing about your ability to manage life and social interaction. Conversely, there are just as many that do not have close to genius IQ’s who are more successful and wise than those blowing the IQ tests out of the park. These people are often looked at as vastly intelligent when in actuality they are merely driven, focused, shrewd and savvy. All of which have nothing to do with IQ.

So yes, you can still have a high IQ and be an idiot. I will agree that there are lot of very intelligent people who get bored easily, but as Vayne said, they have never been taught or forced to entertain themselves. Again, IQ does not equal the ability to govern life in a constructive and acceptable way.

Rosen Myst.7641:

At this point in time I highly doubt we’ll ever see the Crystal Desert. GW2 is being developed in a completely different direction. They have no reason to revisit old areas including Cantha and Elona. If they did open up the Crystal Desert, I’m sure it wouldn’t look anything like what we remember. So it’d just be a disappointment.

I laughed at your post Rooks Zaer. That’s exactly what they would do!!

I think it is highly likely we will see the Crystal Desert. And they have every reason to revisit old places. Not only do you pull in the people that are nostalgic for those places (which are a lot), but they already have a base of creatures, places, story line, and lore that they do not have to completely create from scratch. I’m sure we will see new places as well, but old haunts would be cash cows for ANet and I doubt very much they are gone. It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to know that Cantha and Elona are places that players are clamoring for. They pop up in the threads constantly.

And it is pretty obvious they would not look like what we have seen before. Palawa Joko has changed Elona for the bad, the jade sea is supposedly re-liquefying by some accounts, those same accounts say that the petrified forest is coming back to life as well. Whether or not this is true, who knows? Cantha is also xenophobic. So it is almost certain that those places are not going to be the same. And why would they? Tyria is nothing like it used to be either.

Ronah.2869:

There are no lotteries in GW1 cash-shop and they never were. GW2 is run by different people than GW1. They just kept two names: A-net and Guild Wars to lure in the playes from GW1. Everything else is pure Nexon style.

I never said there were lotteries. I never even suggested “they” were. I said the company did something right. And as far as new companies go, that doesn’t matter either. The current company is doing well and probably have, as I have said before, plenty of people who are industry savvy who know how to sustain a game of this type. The longevity of GW1 and the desire for a company to acquire the rights to GW1 speaks to the profitability of the franchise. It doesn’t matter who owns it. Also many of the developers of the game are still attached to GW2. It isn’t just a whole new lot of people creating GW no matter what the business model is.

AlietteFaye.7316:

Well arguments are only heated discussions. The reason people argue is because they feel so strongly about something, and because it is something that is important to them.

I agree, but can you read some of the posts above and in other RNG threads and tell me they are just heated discussions? Some of those things are just hateful and rude. They are in no way just heated, the are attacking and mean.

As for ArenaNet taking advantage of people, I don’t believe I said that anywhere. I think that they are doing what is best for them in terms of income. Which is what any company will do. But I don’t think that what is best for their income right now is what is best for the income and playerbase longterm. [/quote]
You are right and I owe you a big apology. You did not say that, and I am sorry. There have been many above that I am sure you have read that have in fact said that. Again, proof of people just being hateful.

As far as what is best for them long term, I am in finance and what they are doing is just fine in both long and short term. Certain portions of their fan base will fall off because of many factors. Many of them will come back over and over again. Just like fame, they are going to take advantage of their good fortune and make their money while they can. And when those people who left return after new expansions or large content infusions, they will make more.

I am certain a company the size of Anet has accountants and financial planning people that know their industry inside and out. They would not have been as successful as they are without them. ANet is not just a set of programmers and fan boys sitting around putting out a really cool game. If their people who determine their ways of making profit and generating fund thought that this was not the way to go, then they wouldn’t be selling this stuff in the Gem Store. ANet has a huge track record of success stories behind them. They didn’t do it by not knowing how to make money.

GW1 lasted seven years before they introduced their next phase. I would say they were doing something right. I think they know for themselves what is best for their company for short term and long term better than either one of us.

Thalador.4218:

Konig’s only “flaw” is that the 7+ years of incredibly active and beneficial contribution to the lore society may (rather: must) have eroded his patience to nonsense, BS, debunked but necro’d theories, wrong information or understanding, etc. His aggressive-looking way of handling such can be offending at times, but I of all people know it best that his intention is not to be a rude kitten… it’s become his semi-signature way of handling things over those 7+ long years of being involuntarily – and to his own protest – declared a lore god by some.

Hey Thalador. I appreciate you defending Konig on one hand because he does indeed have a lot to contribute and has vast lore knowledge as many of you do. I am always impressed by some of the knowledge you guys bring. Wow! It is amazing.

On the other hand, there is a reason that Konig gets bashed and it doesn’t matter why he may be impatient or tired of the BS, you cannot talk to people like he does. He has repeatedly said that he does not mean to come across that way but he does. People who don’t know his approach are justifiably offended.

I’ve learned when not to get offended at his responses to me and when to call him on something he shouldn’t have said. I appreciate his knowledge and he has given me some awesome answers to questions I have. That doesn’t change the fact that his posts can be very harsh. It also doesn’t change the fact that if he isn’t able to self evaluate his posts for rudeness, then he has to live with the negative feedback. He already stated that he has a hard time seeing where he is being rude and I believe him.

No amount of disgruntlement or weariness justifies poor behavior. I don’t think Konig does intentionally. But it is there.

@Konig. I really do appreciate your knowledge. I am often facinated by some of your posts. I see them and say to myself “How does he pull that stuff out of his hat?” I know we had our little spat once, but I really do appreciate what you bring to the community. I also will never stop saying something to you if I think it was harsh or hateful. I am not just going to let myself be talked to that way. And if you don’t understand why you are coming across harsh, then take the feedback and try to understand why people got offended. Maybe it will give you some insight to where people are coming from.

I know you aren’t intentionally being mean or arrogant. I get that now. If it was intentional, it would make you the worst person in the world. LOL. I don’t think you are. That title belongs to my second girlfriend. I’ll continue to be impressed with your knowledge and appreciate the help and answers you give to me.

I hope you know that this post was in no way another slap to you Konig. It was more compliment than anything. I wish you the best and look forward to seeing you in the forums.

AlietteFaye.7316:

Criticizing aspects of the game is what helps it grow and change. If we as players don’t make ourselves clear on what we want from ArenaNet, then of course it won’t change. Players coming to the forums and making themselves heard is what is making this game evolve. You should be thanking these people, not telling them to go away.

As I said in a previous post, I think everyone should voice their concerns and opinions. I think everyone has the right to disagree with something they don’t like. I don’t want any of them to go away, nor did I say that. I also said that giving your opinions are good. Even the ones I don’t agree with. That being said, however, there is a way to voice your opinions and concerns. Most of the people doing that on the forums are just nasty.

When I see comments like “ANet doesn’t know what they are doing”, “the game is terrible”, “RNG is horrible”, “ANet is milking people for their money”, “gambling is a disease and ANet is preying on those people” and yes even huge entitlement statements that are basically saying “I deserve this because he or she has it” are just wrong.

I appreciate the dialog with you. You are level headed and don’t just insult. I don’t think you are one of those entitled people, however in the post above you have said you think ANet is taking advantage of people.

I am glad people are posting their concerns. I do thank them for expressing themselves as is their right. But I am not going to praise people who are doing it in a counter-productive way. No one being mean or unrealistic deserves thanks. Being hateful to a company that has provided a wonderful gaming experience is terrible. Most of those expressing their dislike for RNG are never doing it in a way that people, including ANet, would respond positively to.

I don’t want anyone to go away, but if people are not going to be constructive, civil, realistic or congenial, then yes I think they should go away.

AlietteFaye.7316:

Nobody is saying that you should have everything that anyone else has. People are upset that they have to spend REAL money on skins without an actual guarantee of getting them. Gambling is a terrible way to have your playerbase get new skins, especially if it is the only way you can get them. There is zero skill in these RNG boxes, and a lot of players obviously don’t like it.

Some people are upset. Not the majority. Some people don’t like it, not the majority. Most just don’t care or or have any complaint about it. Random does not equal guarantee. If you are buying something that has a random factor then you take the risk and reward. No one should be upset if they take the risk.

Maybe there are a lot of players who don’t like it. So what? If you don’t like it, find something else to play that makes you more happy. Constantly complaining about RNG boxes isn’t going to change anything and shouldn’t.

And as far as this current round of boxes go, ANet has introduced coffers that are free to get and also contain the tickets. So go out and get some of those and hope for the best. You don’t have buy a thing this time to get a ticket.

Vayne.8563:

SundayTrash.9562:

since its event, u expected some exp and karma already, so by reward you generally expect ppl to know chests. I don’t say it was impossible or not, and even if its soloable, it just takes too long thakittens not worth it.

Some people pay for the challenge. Some for rewards. It’s not worth it TO YOU.

Amen. +1 Why can’t some people get this? Just because something is important to you doesn’t mean it is important to everyone.

AlietteFaye.7316:

It’s why skins are obtained from every aspect of the game. Because there are no stat increases, the only thing to work toward after you finish leveling is skins. That is the endgame. Or it was supposed to be until they decided to RNG box everything.

I don’t agree with you. Skins are not the end game. They may be a part, but they are far from the end game content. Unless you have every single achievement and all places explored, then you cannot make such a statement. Even if you have both these things finished, it does not make you entitled to have everything anyone else does.

athuria.2751:

Completely beside the point given if there’s ever an exotic skin you like that’s a loot drop you don’t have to wait for it to drop for you—you can go buy it off the TP.

It completely is the point and with this statement you are proving what I was saying. It is an entitlement issue with people. He has one so I deserve to have one. Why should you get to buy things other people either worked hard to get or were lucky enough to get? You will get something someday that I will want and I don’t get. That doesn’t make me deserve the thing you get just because I want one.

athuria.2751:

Oh, I put plenty of blame on people who can’t control themselves and continue to enable this, or who actually seem to like the RNG box chase, but ultimately they’re not the ones holding Anet up to this practice—Anet, or some higher up, is making the decision to milk these specific people at the cost of everyone else.

This is funny. It is their company. They can do what they want. They’re running their business in a way that best benefits them. They are not milking anyone. They are also not costing anyone by milking others. Bottom line is that it doesn’t hurt you in any way because you think you are entitled to have a skin someone else does. Do not blame ANet for your jealousy.

athuria.2751:

I am not mad at Anet or boycotting supporting them I just want to see them hit a better medium between player accessibility for these things and their own revenue.

ANet is not a charity and it is not in business to hand everything to everyone. There doesn’t NEED to be a better medium because things are working for them just fine. They are making money and the game continues on. You can’t please everyone and the majority of players are not on here complaining about any of the revenue models ANet employs. So they are going to let anyone complain if they want because they know that most players don’t care or like things the way they are. Most don’t believe they are entitled to everything.

Rooks Zaer.5846:

Wethospu.6437:

Imagine if they had a system where you could support them and get something in return.

Don’t worry, they’re getting plenty of financial support from the gambling-addicts that are spending 8k gems trying to get a ticket. You certainly don’t have to feel like you should give them money…they’re getting plenty of it. If they weren’t, they would change their strategy.

Absolutely. Well put.

athuria.2751:

Rarity is exclusivity. Making something rare to obtain makes it limiting, it’s literally the same sort of thing. That a handful of people get better luck than the chance doesn’t change that. If we were taking more like a 1 in 5 chance, yeah, that’s not very rare of exclusive, but we’re talking much lower than that.

I understand what you are saying, but I still have to disagree. If we go by that way of thinking, then there should be no levels of rarity at all in any part of the game. All drops should be white and that is just that. I have been playing since the head start and I have only gotten four exotics to speak of. But I don’t think my friends who have gotten dozens have exclusivity over me. Just my bad luck. I won’t complain about something is random.

athuria.2751:

[snip] You don’t care about working to make your characters look good for the sake of looking good, but a lot of people do because cosmetic progression is part of what the horizontal progression people come here for is, just like achievement points or skillful play.

Again I agree, but there is no way they are going to make everyone happy with everything. Some of the things I like most about the game have not happened or are messed up in my opinion. I want to do many things that I want, but can still many I love. Same with cosmetics, there are many, many ways to make your character cool, so the ones you may wish for you just have to accept and work around them.

athuria.2751:

And I’m well aware nobody’s forcing me to buy RNG boxes for skins, nor do I do so. But that doesn’t mean I’m not allowed to be annoyed with overusing it as a business practice when their alternatives past the base game have been lacking (especially when you see on the forums that a lot of people unfortunately lack that self-control and continue to buy into it).

I absolutely believe you should voice your opinion. I’m not saying you shouldn’t be annoyed with anything, I just want people to be realistic. None of us, without exception, are going to get everything we want to make the game perfect for ourselves. And as much as the “RNG” topic keeps popping up, I am sure ANet is well aware of what some people on the forums think about it. I don’t like the way many businesses practices are handled by many companies, but I don’t blame them for the lack of self-control their customers have in spending their money. If it was the company’s fault, Vegas would be a ghost town.

AlietteFaye.7316:

2 of their design principles were based on aesthetics. It’s pretty clear it was one of the larger parts of their game that they wanted to emphasize.

I agree with you. I just don’t think it was one of their biggest end game factors. Even the article you posted didn’t suggest that it was great content for end game as you stated before. But I do agree that aesthetics are very important, but they can be gained through more ways than just RNG boxes.

pricer.5091:

I would say they have absolutely no idea that a game requires a constant excitement factor. Even Solitaire is more rewarding.

Maybe you are right, but excitement and reward are often in the eye of the beholder. Not the same for everyone.

Ruruuiye.8912:

You guys are missing the point. What jheryn is actually saying is that none of you represent the majority opinion but that he does.

Actually what I am saying is that no amount of rude complaining, “He’s got one, so I should get one… …No, I DEMAND one.” mentality, or snarky comments are going to sway anyone, least of all ANet.

And in some things I am in the majority just as you are in others. The bottom line is that ANet will do what is best for their company and its profits. Obviously that is selling RNG boxes.

So as far as this topic goes, you are right. I am in the majority of people who either like or don’t care about RNG boxes and truly understand what ‘random’ means.

Capes are not my thing, but if you could toggle them on and of like in GW2 I would be all for having capes. They are kind of fun during guild events.

@AlietteFaye

I don’t see anywhere that says that the end game is about acquiring skins. I have seen several articles, by ANet themselves that give suggestions on many things to do end game that have nothing to do with acquiring skins. And just as Hjorje said, we need access to more armors that are not RNG armors. As far as all armors we have gotten being hideous… …that is in the eye of the beholder. I do agree we need more non-RNG skins, but I can’t ever be convinced that there should NOT be RNG skins.

@athuria

RNG skins are hardly exclusive. I see many people having them. I got a Jade Weapon skin ticket yesterday in one of the boxes I got fighting holograms. It wasn’t a rich box. It was certainly dumb luck that I got it, but it wasn’t because I was spending lots of money on RNG boxes. Just because something is very rare does not make it exclusive.

Also this game is not entirely about cosmetics. I don’t grind away to get gold and items because I want all my characters to look awesome. I do it because I like the game play. I also like finishing achievements. I like running dungeons. This game is much more than about cosmetics.

Also, I don’t have a lot of money to throw at Anet, but what I do throw at it, I do so because I want to do so. No one is forcing you to buy anything. That carrot analogy works great for donkeys, but human beings are supposed to be above that. We are supposed to have self-control. If you buy RNG things, then you take that risk. Don’t blame anyone but yourself when the risk doesn’t fall in your favor. Random does not equal guaranteed.

Hjorje.9453:

Also from another post here someone said that they need to keep threads like this on the front page so ANET see there discontent, well I can say people like me will continue to post here showing are liking of this and I know many more in game that like this setup also, as it has been stated the majority on the forums are a minority of the amount of players in game.

Awesome! +1

Rooks Zaer.5846:

But wouldn’t your complaint be better directed towards getting more weapons/armor skins that you can earned rather than gambled for? Right now it takes a mere minutes to buy a bunch of boxes and click through them all. Are you saying that these moments that you can gamble away some money are what is keeping the game from being boring for you? And that you’d prefer this method over having more skins that you can spend some time earning in game?

No I am saying, again, if every skin was available to everybody, it would NEVER be as exciting to get one. If anyone can earn a skin, I wouldn’t care as much when one dropped. Also, when I get a drop, I am glad that not everyone else gets one. It makes me a little more unique. I also don’t care if someone else has something I don’t. That is life. I am happy for them when they have something good. Good for them! I’m not going to sit around feeling sorry for myself because I don’t have one.

I don’t think everyone should have access to all skins. There absolutely should be some very rare things.

And no I am not saying that if I could not buy RNG boxes it would ruin the game for me. I like all aspects of the game. Are you saying that if you can’t have all the skins that are available then the game is ruined for you? Because if so, that is just sad.

Rooks Zaer.5846:

jheryn.8390:

They know that if they caved to those complaining, that would just bring about a whole new set up people complaining about their changes.

You think if they got rid of their gambling boxes….people would complain? ….seriously?

Yep. I do. There are a lot of people who like them who are not upset when they don’t get what they hope for. They are realistic and know they are taking a risk. I’m one of them. I know many others. We are realistic in knowing that we may not get anything no matter how much we buy. We just don’t complain about it when things do not go our way. So they would be upset if they had everything effectively handed to them. It would make the game boring.

Hjorje.9453:

IMO, if we get another dragon before an expansion I see it being Jormag. This reason for this is if we go after Krak there is a lot more at play there with Palawa Joko. Plus is opens up Elona for us.

I think you are right Hjorje. I really feel like the Crystal Desert will be an expansion. We are going to have to deal with Palawa there as well. I think that is big content and will be an expansion.

I think Jormag could be an expansion as well. They could open up all the EOTN lands we can no longer get to with him.

I think other smaller map content will be map areas we currently have closed off around us. Like some of the areas north and west of Maguuma, south of Metrica Province, possibly more Arah, and some of the area east of Dredgehaunt down to Mount Maelstrom. Just my guess if they open up more map areas that are not in an expansion.

@Nebast I get what you are trying to say but if everything was available to everybody, I wouldn’t be very excited when anything special dropped for me. If exotics and skins dropped all the time, I wouldn’t care when I got one of them. The excitement factor would be gone.

Astralporing.1957:

That works only if the drop chance is high enough that you can actually expect something to drop. If you open 1k boxes and still get nothing (like some people here have already done), then not only the excitement is long gone, but a lot of (well justified) anger starts to build up. Guild wars 2 is not big enough of a game to be able to safely ignore player’s discontent.

Well there are two things you said above that I don’t agree with. One is that if you are buying anything with a random factor you cant “expect” anything. All you can do is hope for it. This isn’t gambling but people go to Vegas all the time and play slots and loose everything they put in. Sometimes in the thousands of dollars. They may be disappointed and frustrated that they didn’t win, but that is the risk they take. They should only be angry with themselves if they decide to risk their money. Same with RNG boxes. People are taking the risk. No one made them do it.

The second thing is that GW is a big enough game to ignore discontent on these forums. The people here, both of us included, only represent the tiniest fraction of the people that play the game. Anyone in business, as I am, can tell you that you cannot make everyone happy and it is futile to try. It just isn’t going to happen. So ANet can indeed afford to ignore those here complaining. They know that if they caved to those complaining, that would just bring about a whole new set up people complaining about their changes.

Astralporing.1957:

Most of those disinterested people that this forum do not represent also do not care enough to buy those boxes. In fact, it’s mostly the buyers that Anet tries to persuade to look for a better game. Which is a …curious marketing strategy for a game that is no longer in a steady growth phase.

I googled everything I could find and found not even the slightest indication that Anet has ever tried to persuade anyone to look for a better game. If you are talking about their drop rate doing the persuading, as I said above, there are always going to be people who are unhappy. If they are in the majority you have a problem. If not (as in this case) they are acceptable collateral damage.

As to the disinterested people that this forum does not represent, that is untrue. Many of my friends and myself shell out a bunch of money on boxes. If I don’t get anything, fine. If I do great. We are all this way. We understand we are taking a risk. The thing is, they either don’t do forums, or they don’t complain about it. Either way, a lot of boxes are being sold. Anet is doing just fine. And for those not happy with the RNG boxes and their drop rates, Anet is still making a lot of money whether or not those unhappy buy them or not.

Wethospu.6437:

I would say core issue is paying more than the whole game and getting nothing in return.

I’m not trying to be rude, but if you don’t want to take the risk, don’t buy it. If you do take the risk, then you really shouldn’t complain. No one is forcing anyone to buy anything.

spoj.9672:

Im pretty sure primordus will be last due to him supposedly being the strongest? Im torn between it being Jormag or Kralk next though. I have a feeling Jormag is more likely as they have it setup with the tooth in Hoelbrak and all the lore surrounding him. But then sometimes it seems like they are hinting in the way of Kralk next and I really want to go to the crystal desert and see Palawa Joko.

I think you are spot on. It could be either. It all depends on if developers are more interested in taking us North (old EOTN territories) or South (original Prophecies territories). Because both dragons are said to be in those respective areas.

If I had to pick one, I would think that Jormag would be first. Going Crystal Desert first gets us closer to Elona and you do that and you will have a storm of people clamoring to get back there. Even more than we have now.

pricer.5091:

Mentalhead.5721:

So, why is everybody complaining about RNG? I honestly don’t care about skins, and if I get one by chance from Boxes that’s fine.

Only thing that bothers me a bit is the extremely low drop rate of keys for Black Lion Chests, since I would really like to get some Transmutation stones.

YOU don’t care about skins. The people who are complaining DO care about skins.

Why is this concept so hard to grasp?

You are right Pricer. You care about skins and that is great. We all have in game things we enjoy. You need to voice your opinions. It is the only way ANet will hear you if you do.

But I would just suggest that you consider this too. There are many, many more out there who do not care about the same things you or I do. They have their own likes, etc. as shown by Mentalhead’s response. Just realize that ANet must keep them happy as well. Many like the RNG models.

So as a person who deals with employees and customers alike, they best way to get what you want is by stating your desires and complaints in a civil way without threats, insults, hate, and sarcasm. I’m not saying you do this, but many, many posters in the forums take this approach and it is never productive. In fact, handling things in those ways usually garners the opposite desired results.

Bottom line is, I get what you are saying Pricer and I appreciate it. Keep voicing your opinions. Just realize that it is OK for those with opposite views to voice their opinions as well.

I get that everyone has their dislikes and likes but there are a lot of factors that I don’t believe many here are taking into consideration. I’m in finance have a large number of employees so this comes from my knowledge and experience with large groups of people.

1. Posters in the forum represent only a small vocal minority of the GW2 population. As an officer in a very large guild I can tell you that most of the people in my guild have no problem with the GW2 business model as it is. The majority could care less about RNG drops etc and how ANet structures their selling and in game purchases.

2. Many people like the RNG model the way it is. Truth is that most people are eager to complain when they don’t like things (like those here talking about RNG) but when they are content or happy, they generally don’t say anything. So it may appear that a lot of people hate RNG here on the forums, but that is just because they are wanting to voice their opinions about something they hate. It’s good to voice your opinion and you should, but it doesn’t mean the majority agrees with you.

3. Guild Wars is big business and they are going to do what makes them lots money while keeping the majority happy. That is obviously happening because they continue to offer new items in the Gem Store and people are continuing to buy them.

4. ANet is a responsible company that listens to these complaints and tries to alleviate as much as they can without damaging their bottom line. They will take care of their business and profits first and disgruntled players second.

5. No matter what anyone says here, ANet has plenty of finance people who know what works and what doesn’t. When things no longer are profitable they will change up their offerings. Until then RNG boxes will continue to thrive. Probably even well afterward.

6. Knowing business models, an expansion will not happen because of lack of sales in the Gem Shop. So campaigning to stop Gem Shop purchases, I believe, will not get you an expansion sooner. When one is ready to be released, they will release it ASAP. If RNG boxes and the like are still selling strong, a new expansion will give them even more opportunities to sell them. So I am certain they will release any expansion as soon as it is ready. Releasing one, is not a save measure, it is a means to make even more money.

I get that many here are passionate about things they would like changed, but realistic business practices will always trump the desires and passions a minority of it’s patrons. And yes, you may know several people that share your disgruntlements, but there are most likely many more who don’t or don’t care about them. I just don’t want anyone popping a vein because they are angry about these issues. I used to be that kind of person and it doesn’t help in any way and it doesn’t change things. At least not quickly. Hope this helps a little. I am glad everyone are voicing their opinions. That is a good thing. I just hope people can understand the business components and can discuss these things in a civil manner.

I agree with the OP. Great job ANet. I am enjoying the Dragon Bash.

Astral Projections.7320:

Nice idea. Imo the problem with it though is ANet wants you to buy the gem store RNG box to get the goodies. The drop ones are just thrown in to appease the people who otherwise would complain loudly if the gem store was the only way to get them. They don’t want good odds or guaranteed tickets with a certain number of drops as it cuts into their profit too much.

Exactly. And there are two other factors I believe.

1. ANet knows that to keep people interested in the game there has to be a constant excitement factor. That factor comes from what drops from creatures and chests and RNG boxes. You allow everyone access to all skins and the excitement factor drop dramatically. If you are not excited about what you might get in drops, then you get bored and stop playing.

2. Also the all the complaints about RNG represent a very small part of the GW2 community. Most GW2 gamers do not participate on the forums. I am an officer in a large guild and we have had discussions about RNG and for the large majority, they don’t care about RNG one way or another. The vast majority of players have fun playing the game and are excited when they get something cool. They don’t care for the most part about RNG percentages of drops because it isn’t an issue. The main people complaining about RNG are those on these forums. In real life, the people who are upset about something are the ones vocal about it. The people who don’t care or are happy with the way things are don’t say much. ANet knows this and knows that most people are not bothered by RNG in any fashion.

I honestly don’t think that an expansion is dependent on slow RNG box sales. Expansions take time to come to fruition. When it is done, they will release it. They will make a lot of money doing so. They will bring out new RNG boxes to go along with the expansion. Lather, rinse, repeat.

Stinson.5972:

I agree with OP, but would go one further. I think they should do away with gold to gems. Don’t grab the pitchforks.

No pitchforks, I promise. The problem with doing this is that gold to gems is one of the safeguards against considering gems as actual real currency. If a player can only acquire gems through purchasing with real world currency, then it may be considered a form of virtual currency and then gambling laws come into place. Since you can obtain gems solely through game play, via converting gold into gems, conceivably you should never have to pay a dime to get gems. Therefore, gems are not considered online virtual currency but just a game play device.

Calae.1738:

Hire a team of people that is tasked to bring in revenue by creating convenience and cosmetic features.
-Weapons and special effects
-Armors and special effects
-Mounts and transportion systems
-Player owned real-estate, public instance with mini games
-Animations (dance, jump, dodge, attack)

This is a good idea and they obviously have some of that going on. All the minis and town clothes they put out are evidence of this. I am sure that most of those things will probably be released when they feel they need to add some different purchase elements to the game. So good thinking on your part. This is touches on what Hjorje said above. Maybe if they created great looking skins for sale making more skins available in game, they could keep sets like the molten and jade still as RNG’s and keeping the “Wow I got one!” element still in the game. If all skins were available to everyone, as Hjorje said, it would take away the excitement of getting something cool.

Vol’s idea was cool too. Still keeps rare things rare.

Arcanis.2437:

This post isn’t about you or your me complex.

This is about opinions and solution from people that want options other than RNG.

I want to read what people think about my opinion and if they think that should be options other than RNG.

I would also love to read what ArenaNet think about my idea, and about the option to have skins from ways other than RNG.

LOL. “Me complex.” I am not the one who called someone out incorrectly and then will not admit it. Instead you try to turn it back on me? That is funny.

You said you want to know what people think about your opinion and other options than RNG? If you cannot get that from my first post which you obviously just got defensive about and did not read, here are my thoughts to your questions.

You opinion about the red gems is bad. All it does is negate the need for RNG which many people have no problem with. Anet would not make money this way, they would lose it. All RNG purchases would drop to nothing. My real life job is in finance and projecting profits and purchasing trends. Your model is bad for Anet profits and I am certain they would tell you the same.

As to the second part, I don’t think there should be options other than RNG. And since other options are not going to happen anytime soon, the point is moot.

This post is awesome! +1 absolutely. My whole guild has an unwritten policy. We don’t run by people in PvE that are downed or are in trouble with a fight. We help them. We also make sure that if someone is calling out for help or to answer a question, we do so if we are able to. In game goodwill is a huge thing. Not for our guild recruitment, it just makes the game better for everyone.

I think the same can be applied to the forums. There are a lot of people in the forums that are just plain nasty. I was always one of those people that protected others from being bullied. I’ll do the same here when I see it.

I think random acts are a good thing here too!

Arcanis.2437:

I hate RNG, but unlike people like you, I give suggestions and try to fix the problem.
I don’t want to take RNG out of the game, I just want to give people other “options”.

First of all, where in my post did I say that I hated RNG? I don’t hate it at all. I was defending it. I think it is perfectly fine. Maybe you need to read my post again.

I also don’t remember saying there was a problem other than the complaints people make about RNG. I think RNG is great. I don’t want everyone to have everything I do. I also don’t want to have everything everyone else does. It makes the game interesting to me. “People like me” don’t have a problem with RNG. You do. There is no problem to be fixed in my opinion. “People like you” are the ones thinking that there is a problem.

You said above you hate RNG and then go on to say you don’t want it out of the game. What’s up with that?

Next time you want to call me out on a post, maybe you should read it better and understand what I was saying.

Another “I hate RNG post?” Really? I do not understand why there is so much complaint about RNG. One of the initials is for the word “random.” Random never means guaranteed.

Also people complain about those that can constantly grind and get stuff or those with money able to buy gems where others cannot. This also doesn’t mean they will get anything either. I know two guys that this applies to.

One is a friend who is retired and plays all day grinding out gold, mats, and drops. He wanted one of molten tickets so bad he could taste it, and with all the drops and gold converted to gems to buy keys, he still didn’t get one ticket.

Another friend of mine has money to burn and bought a huge amount of the rich coffers. Over $250 RL money to get them and didn’t get one Jade Weapon ticket.

Having money and time also does not guaranty that you will get some of those rare things. Only dumb luck will get you these drops. And again, random is the key word. Not one person playing the game is guaranteed anything. That is the nature of the game.

Also it is Anet’s game and they can place rarity at whatever levels they want. It is up to all of us to decide how hard (or not) or how much money (if any) we want to fork over for better chances at these RNG items. Personally, if I get them “Great!” if not, “So what?” Either way I know there are other skins down the road that will come up and eventually I’ll get one.

@Dustfinger. Great answer! But how do we know the mantle of godhood is permanent?

I guess to clarify my question a bit (and I know we don’t know the answer) did they give the mantle to themselves or did humans (or others) give it to them? They certainly didn’t shy away from the title no matter how they came about it.

I just thought of this. One indication that they are in fact deities is that Kormir’s avatar obviously adopted the mantle of godhood. And since she is the goddess of truth, I doubt she would lie about being a god.

Before anyone rakes me for this, I did search for a topic on my upcoming question and didn’t find anything I thought was close. What claim do these 6 “gods” have to that title? Of course humans currently and in GW1 worshiped them gods, but even these beings call themselves gods. (i.e. cut scene after the Shiro/Lich mission in Nightfall)

Do we have any lore that tells us why they are gods? I read the Wiki and did a Google search but nothing I found gives me a clue to their “deity” other than humans worshiping them as such.

@Konig – I agree with you. 100% There is nothing wrong with wanting people to look things up. You are not understanding what I am saying. Here is as nutshell as I can make it.
1. Point out when people should use the search but do not be mean about it.
2. Realize that not everyone thinks to use the search when they are new to the forums. Again point it out but don’t be rude.
3. If you see a thread that has been posted before, it doesn’t give anyone the right to hit the thread and start being a jerk. If you can’t say something nice…etc., etc., etc.
4. No one is forcing anyone to comment on a thread. If you see a topic that has been done before repeatedly. Ignore the new one. It isn’t hurting you. Move on.
5. I find it pretty funny that people would get annoyed by a repeated topic. Who cares?

Hjorje.9453:

@jheryn,

I have to agree with Konig on this one. When I started reading and posting on the forums, I would always search the forum before hand. It didn’t really feel the need to bring something up if it has been talked about before. I only really do this on the lore forums, as the other ones are kinda different.

As for starting a forum etiquette class that might be a good idea. As for me doing it probably not. LOL.

As for this topic, it really gets on my nerves when it comes up, it is quite annoying to discuss the same thing all the time with just a different group. It comes up like every two weeks.

I see what you are saying, Hjorje. But the thing is you think people should do what you do and think like you think. Not everyone does processes and thinks like you. Their first instinct isn’t to search the forums or think that they even need to do so. Pointing it out like Konig said is good, but being rude or snarky about it is not.

The second thing is something I mentioned earlier, if it annoys you, don’t comment. Stay away from the thread. Unless you have thread OCD and feel you must comment, why not just ignore it? It isn’t hurting anyone by being there.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

jheryn, did I say anything about rudeness?

No you didn’t and I owe you an apology for that. It just hit me wrong. My bad.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

And being told to use the search function isn’t “snarky and rude” in of itself – as BuddhaKeks said, if people don’t know they made a mistake, how can the learn from it? Being pointed out mistakes in of itself is being helpful. If it comes out as rude, then it comes out as rude. Not everyone in this thread was.

You are also right about this, but others, like BuddhaKeks initial replies were in no way simply pointing out mistakes. Read Buddha’s original post and tell me if you think that was a decent way to point something out.

And this is a recurring theme from many threads. It seems many people on these threads cannot discuss something in a civil manner if someone brings up something they disagree with or have posted before. Some people don’t have the time to go back and read every post ever written in order to maybe avoid discussing something that has been discussed before.

No one deserves to be treated badly. There is a vast difference between telling someone they made a mistake in a kind way and “calling someone out” as if they had committed a mortal sin.

Your response to the OP was just rude BuddhaKeks. And to use your own words it “contribute[d] nothing new to the lore community.”

If it bothers you so much that someone else has posted something before and you can’t be decent, don’t post anything in reply. And what does it hurt any of you if something is posted again? Ignore it in that case. The duplicate thread isn’t impairing your life in any way.

I don’t understand the mentality that anyone has that makes them believe it is alright for them to be mean to other people over something as trivial as a game thread.

Well Konig, maybe you and Hjorje should start a forum etiquette class that everyone should take before they are allowed to post here. Yes, that was snarky and deserved. Nothing you or anyone else says will make me believe that it is OK to be overtly rude.

Hjorje.9453:

That main reason for being snarky is that is has been discussed to death and it is just as easy to search the forums as it is to start a new thread.

So what you are saying is that a person that is new to the forums is supposed to look up anything before he or she posts? And also that it is ok to be snarky and rude to people when a simple link to a previous post would do? I don’t think so. Good way to scare off people new to the forums and make a jerk out of yourself in the process.

Ok, so there are several other threads about this same thing. Obviously the OP didn’t know that. I don’t understand why some of you have to be so rude in letting the OP know and instead simply directing him to one of those threads. In my opinion those of you being so snarky and hateful are much worse than someone failing to know that other threads on this topic exists.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Personally, I think trying to make negotiations between Trahearne and Faolain would be most intriguing. She’s still living, and we’ve been told in an interview that the Nightmare Court are still anti-Elder Dragon (even though there are theories that the NC are, at the very least, indirectly influenced by the Jungle Dragon). One would think it to be possible for Faolain to “put aside differences” temporarily… unless she really is too far gone. But I can definitely see an attempt at such being made.

I agree. I think this would be an amazing plot device. I doubt that Faolain is too far gone to work with the pact. She obviously has some self-preservation going on. That would probably extend to fighting the elder dragons by whatever means necessary if she thought they were a threat to her life and limb. Even if this meant a temporary truce or alliance.

It would be awesome to see how this might force Caithe and Faolain to work together.

Actually I wouldn’t hate Trahearne so much if they didn’t write his dialog so long winded, and full of such Syfy channel d-movie, rah-rah speeches. If they gave him decent lines and interactions maybe I could tolerate him continuing to lead the pact. If not, as mercury ranique said, there is always a nudge over the side of an airship away from any waypoints…

The Pact did come together to defeat Zhiatan. I believe that the pact will continue on fighting the other dragons.

I know that will mean the unfortunate return of Trahearne (well unfortunate in my eyes), and it will make for great continuity.

Thoughts on The Pact’s future?

And let’s not forget that although Kryta may not have much of a navy, it appears that the pact is building one of sorts. Air ships. So I guess I’ll amend and say they are building an Air Force. Of course, I would speculate that the pact will also have a water fleet due to some of the personal story line arcs.

A group of us were speculating that it may be these airships that take us to other parts of the world since sea and land has us blocked at the moment.

soboard.6974:

To those complaining about displacement or stuff being under water.

A couple of points to consider.

1 – First and foremost its a fantasy game.
2 – Even the drastic changes that have been made involved processes analogous to real life geologic forces. Uplift and subduction occurs all the time. Yes, compared to our million year timescale 250 years is somewhat short, see point 1.
3 – Things just change. It by and large still has a lot of interesting GW1 accents to make us feel at home in Tyria.

EDIT: To add, sea level rise does not reflect the same way in different parts of the world. It is not a constant. Elevation plays a big role as well. As well as continental shelf angle.

While it is quite true that this is a fantasy game, it is a fantasy game built on the foundation of another beloved fantasy game and its lore and locations. Many of us loved the places and were attached to some of them. So it is more than natural that people are disappointed that they are no longer there. It is also natural for people to question why they are gone when no real explanation is given.

And yes, things do indeed change. I never for a second believed it would all be the same. In fact, I couldn’t wait to see what was different. But as far as there being enough “GW 1 accents” to make us feel at home. That is a matter of opinion and perspective. I wanted to see much more, so for me, there isn’t enough. It isn’t a complaint, it just isn’t what I was hoping for.

All of you points are valid. But how valid to each person is like beauty: it is in the eye of the beholder. See your #1. I don’t believe you will find two people who would happily agree on everything done to Tyria in the 250 years between games. It is natural for all of us to need to vent and grieve a little for the things we are sad we are not seeing.

I am grateful for a lot of the explanations, but it still perplexes me that all of these places, in effect, have disappeared or destroyed or abandoned to ruin. I would have been just as easy to let some of these places still exist as to create new ones.

Beetletun looks nothing like Beetletun in GW1, but it is still there. The wide spread demolishing of places from GW1 is just sloppy and even unwise on Anet’s part IMHO. For those of us nostalgic for the first game looking for some familiarity, it would have been a great way to draw us in and make us feel like “There’s the game we loved so much.” For those that are new to the Guild Wars franchise it may have even been a way for them to be curious about GW lore and locations. It would also cause them to question what they are seeing and get more involved with the community and ask questions. I think Anet missed a huge opportunity in not incorporating thriving places found in GW1 instead of destroying them or neglecting them.

I’ll admit, I miss many of these places, small and large, and am sorely disappointed that they are just footnotes in many ways.

A couple of quick points:

@mercury – I was just making a point about Vlox’s Falls. My point that it is underwater. I just called it a swamp for brevity’s sake. Still it is just gone with no real explanation or clue.

@Konig (and the rest who pointed it out). Thanks for telling me about Droknar’s Forge. I had never looked there really. I’m glad they just didn’t dismiss it. Like Konig explained, however, it was on a freaking snow covered cliff. How does it go from that to mostly intact and under water? Is there any wonder I missed it? Even if the cliff side would have fallen, there is no way the city would have remained standing.