I think you did not get me.
I totally understand you completely dislike it if that happens to you. I know the feeling of being upset when you die because of something like that.
I get furious at this game often when I die because mobs that I already killed multiple times keep respawning before I killed the complete group. Thats similar in that it’s out of your control and should not happen.
So I get that feeling, and I get it why you dislike it if people can do it.
The only part I do not get is that this can already happen now without mounts and then why it would be more upsetting with mounts. It’s just upsetting with or without mounts but why is it more upsetting to you with mounts? That part I really don’t get. Has nothing to do with not wanting to know I really don’t get that.
It is more upsetting with mounts because the constant speed buff would allow griefers to just run up..agro a few Mobs.. then run with them to you… then outrun them after they agroed on you.
Maybe they MIGHT be able to do this with the skills they have now…but… maybe the 10 second quickness is Not enough… maybe they need to use a few dodges, and maybe they don’t get vigor, or stamina back, before they themselves gert trounced by their train.
A constant speed boost mount, makes it easier to train, …. makes it easier to grief others. As long as you have a constant speed buff that allows you to outrun mobs that then get agroed on other players just minding their own Businss…you need to understand this griefing is … One of the consequences of a speed boost mount.
And simply saying " But you shouldn’t care, because…..if you do that is silly of you to care, and it’s Nothing to do with me or My desire for speed boost mounts…. sucks to be you."
Ummm…That is Not Likely to win you any converts. Fact is, while I was of half a Mind to go with the " speed boost mounts" idea before. I now see what i was saying was correct.
“Slippery Slope” when it comes to speed boost mounts is NOT a fallacy here.
Suddenly people want combat mounts as well… and No slow down ehen agrowed… and if they agro something that they outrun and it attacks someone fighting something else.." sucks to be them..and they should not care that i was Mounted, and if they do, I Just don’t understand why they care, because ..I don’t.’??
hmmm…. Not sure that is the type of attitude this game needs.
Justify slippery slope with more slippery slope.
Solution: How about we just keep mounts out of PvE, sPvP, and WvW…but allow them in all other game modes?
I don’t support this.
Hehe I haven’t seen a valid argument from either side. The pros just cry “I want it!”, “other MMOS have it”, “If you don’t like it gtfo!!” and the anti group is “NO!! It’ll hurt immersion and cause griefers!” “It’s dumb!!”,“If you don’t like it gtfo!”
Sadly, this thread is turning into a hater fest. Most of what I’ve seen is not discussion, but both parties bashing and abusing each other.
Pro-duelers want it to have uninterruptable duels.
How is that not a valid argument?
“Because” is not a valid argument. Period. At least on the Anti side, they can point to RL examples of griefing/trolling/harassment. The Pro side just points out they can block/report or ingore it. Using dueling as training for PvP is a weak argument, as the two systems are completly different. One might learn the basics of dodging and when to use skills, etc. but those can be picked up from any mob or boss fight. Gear/traits/stats play a major role in PvP, as well as PvE. If you want to learn to PvP, there is PvP dummies, private “rooms” etc to do that with. Which would be a much better medium for doing that anyway. I learned PvP through a couple of my guildies in a private PvP match.
What is not a valid argument? Why is it not a valid argument. No where in my post has “because.”
“Pro-duelers want it to have uninterruptable duels.” is not an argument. It’s a statement. An argument would have reasons X, Y and Z to include dueling and have A,B, and C positive impact on the game. And not, “I like duels, and think they should be included, and not interrupted”
Pro-duelers want duels to have uninterruptable duels.
Done.
The PvE world is not duel free right now.
There are multiple skillpoints where you duel a npc.
That is just an idiotic statement.
By your logic you ARE dueling every time you fight a human foe, so your problem is solved! Thanks for stopping by!
Dueling requires consent from both sides. The NPC challenges the player and the player click the accept to fight.
A human foe wants to kill you, but you just want to get to a skillpoint. So the human foe kills you. That is not a duel, that is ganking.
That is the difference between my example and your example.
(edited by runeblade.7514)
Hehe I haven’t seen a valid argument from either side. The pros just cry “I want it!”, “other MMOS have it”, “If you don’t like it gtfo!!” and the anti group is “NO!! It’ll hurt immersion and cause griefers!” “It’s dumb!!”,“If you don’t like it gtfo!”
Sadly, this thread is turning into a hater fest. Most of what I’ve seen is not discussion, but both parties bashing and abusing each other.
Pro-duelers want it to have uninterruptable duels.
How is that not a valid argument?
“Because” is not a valid argument. Period. At least on the Anti side, they can point to RL examples of griefing/trolling/harassment. The Pro side just points out they can block/report or ingore it. Using dueling as training for PvP is a weak argument, as the two systems are completly different. One might learn the basics of dodging and when to use skills, etc. but those can be picked up from any mob or boss fight. Gear/traits/stats play a major role in PvP, as well as PvE. If you want to learn to PvP, there is PvP dummies, private “rooms” etc to do that with. Which would be a much better medium for doing that anyway. I learned PvP through a couple of my guildies in a private PvP match.
What is not a valid argument? Why is it not a valid argument. No where in my post has “because.”
Speed boost mounts won’t work. Guardians, for instance, have no perma speed buff other than speed/traveler runes. To give them a perma speed mount would then shift game play ‘balance.’ I really don’t want Anet to waste time rebalancing the game for mounts with speed.
Also, I don’t want mounts in game.
How would that shift any balance when mounts are non-combat mounts?
Since I would assume that it will be PvE content only, it will make all guardian weapon set viable so that they don’t have to use only a specific weapon set to travel around.
I am always stuck on the GS/Staff because it is the only way to get around fast.
That’s how. According to devs (though i can’t locate those posts at the moment. I think they were somewhere on the WvW subforum), the fact that some weapons offer better mobility than others was an important point in balancing them. The same for things like traveller runes, or the mobility +25% signets of some classes. Or the fact that some classes posess far better mobility than others (that one is big, since it affects whole class balance). All those things would have to be completely rebalanced. And you know how long it takes – we could reasonably expect the process to last years.
I don’t care about WvW.
Talk about PvE instead.
It was in WvW subforum, but was about general gear and class balance.
People think that PvE and PvP are separate and they are not. One affects the other, so the balance is very delicate to handle.
Toys and some/most/all karma consumables do not work in WvW. There are traits and skills that are different in WvW, sPvP and PvE. So you are wrong, PvE and PvP is separate.
Speed boost mounts won’t work. Guardians, for instance, have no perma speed buff other than speed/traveler runes. To give them a perma speed mount would then shift game play ‘balance.’ I really don’t want Anet to waste time rebalancing the game for mounts with speed.
Also, I don’t want mounts in game.
How would that shift any balance when mounts are non-combat mounts?
Since I would assume that it will be PvE content only, it will make all guardian weapon set viable so that they don’t have to use only a specific weapon set to travel around.
I am always stuck on the GS/Staff because it is the only way to get around fast.
That’s how. According to devs (though i can’t locate those posts at the moment. I think they were somewhere on the WvW subforum), the fact that some weapons offer better mobility than others was an important point in balancing them. The same for things like traveller runes, or the mobility +25% signets of some classes. Or the fact that some classes posess far better mobility than others (that one is big, since it affects whole class balance). All those things would have to be completely rebalanced. And you know how long it takes – we could reasonably expect the process to last years.
I don’t care about WvW.
Talk about PvE instead.
Simple, keep all the speed boost mounts out of WvW, or PvP, only for PvE.
I can support this.
Hehe I haven’t seen a valid argument from either side. The pros just cry “I want it!”, “other MMOS have it”, “If you don’t like it gtfo!!” and the anti group is “NO!! It’ll hurt immersion and cause griefers!” “It’s dumb!!”,“If you don’t like it gtfo!”
Sadly, this thread is turning into a hater fest. Most of what I’ve seen is not discussion, but both parties bashing and abusing each other.
Pro-duelers want it to have uninterruptable duels.
How is that not a valid argument?
The Barber NPC is a vendor that lets you preview your new hair/body. It uses the same interface as the self-style kit. However, If you want to get the new look, you will have to pay with the Self-style kit.
Why? Because I want to know what I want to look before I change my style.
Why should ANet add this? Because ANet can expect more money off of self-styling kits.
The PvE world is not duel free right now.
There are multiple skillpoints where you duel a npc.
“You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.”
-Inigo MontoyaWithin the context of these threads its always pointed towards other players.
Saying stuff like skillpoints or NPCs is an example of dueling is like saying costume brawl is a fine example of PvP in the Open World.It isn’t because it is an activity which doesn’t take your stats into consideration.
Back to the original point, dueling with a skillpoint or NPC is simply beating down a scripted AI.
It doesn’t get better, it doesn’t complain that it had lag, it doesn’t jump up and down whispering derogatory comments if it loses or wins, and it doesn’t refit itself for a rematch.Therefore these PvE duels you use as an example aren’t even examples to help your case.
1. PvE duels show that dueling can work in towns and not out of place. There are talks about PvE is cooperation when we have always been fighting each other in a friendly match in Tyria all this time. It is lore-friendly.
2. Your comment on player duel vs. npc duel is funny. Destiny’s Edge doesn’t get better, they don’t complain that they had lag, it doesn’t jump up and down whispering derogatory comments if they fail a run, and doesn’t refit themselves for another run. But players do that. That means dungeon in GW2 should be removed because of toxic environment. I got tons of hate comments for running ranger in dungeons.
Speed boost mounts won’t work. Guardians, for instance, have no perma speed buff other than speed/traveler runes. To give them a perma speed mount would then shift game play ‘balance.’ I really don’t want Anet to waste time rebalancing the game for mounts with speed.
Also, I don’t want mounts in game.
How would that shift any balance when mounts are non-combat mounts?
Since I would assume that it will be PvE content only, it will make all guardian weapon set viable so that they don’t have to use only a specific weapon set to travel around.
I am always stuck on the GS/Staff because it is the only way to get around fast.
That’s how. According to devs (though i can’t locate those posts at the moment. I think they were somewhere on the WvW subforum), the fact that some weapons offer better mobility than others was an important point in balancing them. The same for things like traveller runes, or the mobility +25% signets of some classes. Or the fact that some classes posess far better mobility than others (that one is big, since it affects whole class balance). All those things would have to be completely rebalanced. And you know how long it takes – we could reasonably expect the process to last years.
I don’t care about WvW.
Talk about PvE instead.
to all guys saying P2P suck. first all those games like rift, swtor. eso… it is not the sub fee which brought them down, it was low quality of content and support that made people to say the game does not worth a sub. AND none of them is actually free i played them all.
there are successful sub based games like FINAL FANTASY XIV with over 2 million subscribers, why i am not there because i do not like the graphics and on top of all unholy trinity. but the game is pretty good over all for many people.
IT IS ALL ABOUT YOU. ask for better game and have will to pay for good game.So you admit that quality content has no correlation to subscription fee?
why some of you reply to a post you did not read or did not understand. I SAID IT in my very first post that quality of content and support need a lot of improvement and if it takes sub fee for much better quality content i am willing to pay for better not for same game.
But then you listed games that have a subscription fee and admit that those are low quality. So why do you think that if ANet add subscription, quality becomes better?
Speed boost mounts won’t work. Guardians, for instance, have no perma speed buff other than speed/traveler runes. To give them a perma speed mount would then shift game play ‘balance.’ I really don’t want Anet to waste time rebalancing the game for mounts with speed.
Also, I don’t want mounts in game.
Since I would assume that it will be PvE content only, it will make all guardian weapon set viable so that they don’t have to use only a specific weapon set to travel around.
I am always stuck on the GS/Staff because it is the only way to get around fast.
The PvE world is not duel free right now.
There are multiple skillpoints where you duel a npc.
Thread is still going.
“pro-mount” side still hasn’t given a real reason why the game should be ruined with mounts.
19 pages… with nothing but “I want it, and a speed boost”.
Sigh.
You refuse to listen.
Talk to the guy above me, he wants gw2 taking from Skyrim because “Skyrim is Game of the year… material.” Didn’t gw2 already win Game of the year?
if Skyrim or TESO is simply average, why should we take from them? If Gw2 won game of the year… why should it give up on what is clearly working? Waypoints and zero mounts.?
1. You think that Skyrim is the same as TESO? Please, just stop talking. It hurts me that I have to explain this.
TESO stands for The Elder scrolls Online. It does not stand for The Elder scroll O’skyrim, nor the Elder scrolls o’series. Both games are two different things. Made by two different companies.
What game did I say was average, what game did I say was game of the year?
Answer: TESO is average. Skyrim is game of the year.
2. ANet gives up what?
ZeniMax owns Bethesda which owns the IP surrounding ES. As a matter of fact ZeniMax also owns ID Software. So, they ARE the same company.
Skyrim was a Single player RPG, TESO is not (although it really feels like it is and grouping is nigh impossible). You cannot compare the 2.
Back OT, mounts are generally situational in GW2 as in GW1. Example the siege scorpions in EotM. Notice, you become the Scorpion (there is no heal skill or any utilities – just 3 skills only). This is due to the fact that they are weapons, not mounts. One cannot make a weapon into a utilitarian mount.
The TP system is fine as it is. Mounts would just make rendering this game even more difficult. Remember the Southsun Cove introduction? It was slow, haltingly slow but think of how it would be you if doubled the amount of people because they are all on mounts. It would make the game unplayable on older computers, which you can do now. Hence there would need to be a super optimization of the rendering engine just to put mounts in the game to keep it playable on those same older systems.
There were mobs that did ride mounts in GW1 but they were not considered separate. In fact when you killed them they just fell into one big pile and the rider did not fight off of the mount, when the mount went down. They were considered a single entity in GW1 and were rendered as such. So using those as an example of mounts in the GW universe doesn’t hold water.
1. You forget that Skyrim and TESO is not the same. So no matter how much you say that TESO is average, it doesn’t do a thing to Skyrim. Like you said, You cannot compare the two.
2. You forget that everyone and their mother having mounts will be unrealistic. Why? 1. I would assume that they will be gemshop only. 2. They would be cosmetic only. They are not needed to explore the world. 3. I would assume that it would be clunky as selecting minis or toys from the inventory. I don’t see every Tom, Jerry, and Joe having their Queen Jennah mini out while running around.
[…]
3. It has been discussed to death that Horse exists.
Charr ate them all. All horses left are undead, or ghosts bound to a ghostly rider.
Edge of Destiny: Logan and Caithe saw horses behind the Destroyer portal before saving Rytlock.
No, they are not dead.
What the kitten, I have been Pm’ed from Anti-duelist saying that I should go kill myself.
Very disgusting, guys.
Here, you all want dueling so bad, I’ve got your solution.
Gem Store Item – 800 gems – Dueling Flag: Use issues a challenge to selected other player in possession of a dueling flag. If used on a player without a dueling flag, there is no effect and your dueling flag goes on a 15 sec cooldown. May not be used in instances, sPvP, or WvW.
Make it unlimited and make it if it’s in the bank it’s not considered in possession. One inventory slot isn’t going to hinder too many and will let players who may not want to always want to have to worry about being asked for a duel a means to “auto-decline”.
And while a dueling boon is active, nearby foes (including other duelers, if that’s possible) can’t harm you. Meaning griefers not in the duel can’t run that mob into your duel to ruin it.
You also can’t hurt other foes and you aren’t counted as in the event as to not effect scaling of nearby events.
Yes, as I imagined the item it would be unlimited use, inventory counts as possession bank does not, and if you want to auto-decline you leave said item in the bank.
As for invulnerability to the environment; no. This is where you need to be selective about where you use the item.
How about this? No.
I’ll accept that if they sold Elder Dragon boss battle behind a gem shop purchase. Not an expansion, not a dungeon, just a single elder dragon boss. No one is allowed to fight it except people that bought the privilege to fight it.
Then clearly dueling isn’t that important a feature to you if you’re unwilling to pay for it (either through gold earned in game or real money).
Dueling should be a free feature. This is disgusting practice to sell features that should have been there in the first place.
You conveniently ignore that Custom Arena do not work.
Then the simplest solution to the whole problem (one that has been proposed since the very beginning of the thread, and for some reason consequently ignored) is to make them work.
It is much easier for Anet to improve on already existing system, than to make a new one from scratch. Additionally, it would make duels available without putting them in the face of people that do not want any PvP in their PvE.Only way to do that is to give free custom servers for everyone. But that won’t make any profit and that will create tons of needless servers. It will turn into a loss more than a profit.
They already do that. Every non-private hotjoin server is a custom arena hosted by anet. What they need to do is to create a number of 1v1 arenas (and if someone wants to use their own custom arenas for this, it’s even better, since they will pay).
Or the alternative, just create dueling.
That’s one of the points – it’s not “just create”. They’d have to basically make a completely new subsystem. And then keep removing bugs and quirks from it for the next year. On the other hand allowing 1v1 duels in the mists is a relatively minor work.
Then all 1v1 dueling room will be filled up. I will have to wait till a dueling room is open. 5v5 rooms do fill up quickly, I can’t imagine how much money Anet will have to waste to maintain tons of dueling servers.
Or the alternative, just create dueling.
to all guys saying P2P suck. first all those games like rift, swtor. eso… it is not the sub fee which brought them down, it was low quality of content and support that made people to say the game does not worth a sub. AND none of them is actually free i played them all.
there are successful sub based games like FINAL FANTASY XIV with over 2 million subscribers, why i am not there because i do not like the graphics and on top of all unholy trinity. but the game is pretty good over all for many people.
IT IS ALL ABOUT YOU. ask for better game and have will to pay for good game.
So you admit that quality content has no correlation to subscription fee?
That would be cool if there were Guild Houses. Or Guild Territories.
And the reason i think there isnt any mounts is because there are WP for fast travel.Skyrim had both mounts and fast travel. Skyrim is a Game of the Year material.
Fast travel is no excuse for lack of mounts.
Mounts would be fine if everyone ONLY wanted Cosmetics Only Mounts with zero speed boost, that also allowed players to select " hide Mounts" at Log in.
Is this the types of Mounts you guys desire? if so… sign me up.
Problem is Incrementalism. Once you accept this,. the pro-mount people will want more, and more, next thing you know we are discussing " speed boost" then 150 % ….then 180 %..then flying mounts….
Nope. Just…no..for all the reasons already stated.
Skyrim may be game of the year, but that is because it works for Skyrim. Just because “Game XDFG” is Game of the year, doesn’t mean we need to absorb any feature from it. One of these days Look at all the awards Gw2 has recieved. Should TESO take on features from Gw2 to be good?
or should they just be a unique game, as gw2 seeks to also be a unique game?
1. My opinion changed, It wouldn’t matter if mounts had a 25% speedboost. I can’t see anything wrong with that in the PvE world. A player can easily get that from a signet; however in turn, it will improve gameplay as a player is no longer stuck with a specific weaponset/signet/rune/trait forever. I see the anti-mount’s vision of clustery mess is unrealistic. Example, I don’t see every tom, jerry and joe showing off their Queen Jennah mini.
2. You confuse Incrementalism with slippery slope, a logical fallacy.
3. You asked the wrong question. Because I say yes, TESO should take some/most/all features from GW2 to be good because TESO isn’t good. It is average.
Talk to the guy above me, he wants gw2 taking from Skyrim because “Skyrim is Game of the year… material.” Didn’t gw2 already win Game of the year?
if Skyrim or TESO is simply average, why should we take from them? If Gw2 won game of the year… why should it give up on what is clearly working? Waypoints and zero mounts.?
1. You think that Skyrim is the same as TESO? Please, just stop talking. It hurts me that I have to explain this.
TESO stands for The Elder scrolls Online. It does not stand for The Elder scroll O’skyrim, nor the Elder scrolls o’series. Both games are two different things. Made by two different companies.
What game did I say was average, what game did I say was game of the year?
Answer: TESO is average. Skyrim is game of the year.
2. ANet gives up what?
You conveniently ignore that Custom Arena do not work.
Then the simplest solution to the whole problem (one that has been proposed since the very beginning of the thread, and for some reason consequently ignored) is to make them work.
It is much easier for Anet to improve on already existing system, than to make a new one from scratch. Additionally, it would make duels available without putting them in the face of people that do not want any PvP in their PvE.
Only way to do that is to give free custom servers for everyone. But that won’t make any profit and that will create tons of needless servers. It will turn into a loss more than a profit.
Or the alternative, just create dueling.
That would be cool if there were Guild Houses. Or Guild Territories.
And the reason i think there isnt any mounts is because there are WP for fast travel.Skyrim had both mounts and fast travel. Skyrim is a Game of the Year material.
Fast travel is no excuse for lack of mounts.
Mounts would be fine if everyone ONLY wanted Cosmetics Only Mounts with zero speed boost, that also allowed players to select " hide Mounts" at Log in.
Is this the types of Mounts you guys desire? if so… sign me up.
Problem is Incrementalism. Once you accept this,. the pro-mount people will want more, and more, next thing you know we are discussing " speed boost" then 150 % ….then 180 %..then flying mounts….
Nope. Just…no..for all the reasons already stated.
Skyrim may be game of the year, but that is because it works for Skyrim. Just because “Game XDFG” is Game of the year, doesn’t mean we need to absorb any feature from it. One of these days Look at all the awards Gw2 has recieved. Should TESO take on features from Gw2 to be good?
or should they just be a unique game, as gw2 seeks to also be a unique game?
1. My opinion changed, It wouldn’t matter if mounts had a 25% speedboost. I can’t see anything wrong with that in the PvE world. A player can easily get that from a signet; however in turn, it will improve gameplay as a player is no longer stuck with a specific weaponset/signet/rune/trait forever. I see the anti-mount’s vision of clustery mess is unrealistic. Example, I don’t see every tom, jerry and joe showing off their Queen Jennah mini.
2. You confuse Incrementalism with slippery slope, a logical fallacy.
3. You asked the wrong question. Because I say yes, TESO should take some/most/all features from GW2 to be good because TESO isn’t good. It is average.
(edited by runeblade.7514)
That would be cool if there were Guild Houses. Or Guild Territories.
And the reason i think there isnt any mounts is because there are WP for fast travel.
Skyrim had both mounts and fast travel. Skyrim is a Game of the Year material.
Fast travel is no excuse for lack of mounts.
Here, you all want dueling so bad, I’ve got your solution.
Gem Store Item – 800 gems – Dueling Flag: Use issues a challenge to selected other player in possession of a dueling flag. If used on a player without a dueling flag, there is no effect and your dueling flag goes on a 15 sec cooldown. May not be used in instances, sPvP, or WvW.
How about this? No.
I’ll accept that if they sold Elder Dragon boss battle behind a gem shop purchase. Not an expansion, not a dungeon, just a single elder dragon boss. No one is allowed to fight it except people that bought the privilege to fight it.
If two consenting people want to duel in sPvP custom match, I will be there and interrupt their duel.
It is exactly like: If a dungeon party want to complete a dungeon, a griefer would come in and killing the final boss thus barring you from completing the dungeon and stopping you from getting the rewards.
So no, custom arena do not work, not now not ever.
So you admit to wanting to ruin the fun of two players that go out of their way to duel in an environment best suited to it. Yet you wonder why we think those that want open world PvE duels are 12 year olds.
Go figure…
Who is doing the griefing? Was it the duelist that tried to grief their own consenting duel or the griefer that exploited the fact that custom arena duels DO NOT WORK!
I don’t see why you need to have a duel option in PvE except for those people that get upset about what is said in map chat and want to be like “come at me bro!”.
If two consenting people want to duel they can do so in sPvP custom match. We don’t need people randomly fighting each-other or picking fights in what is supposed to be a cooperative environment when we have a specific place for that already.
As for the above argument, both can already happen in game one just requires you to move to an area where the playing field is level. I don’t see whats so hard about this concept.
PvE is for cooperation.
sPvP is for player vrs player.We don’t need to combine the two.
If two consenting people want to duel in sPvP custom match, I will be there and interrupt their duel.
It is exactly like: If a dungeon party want to complete a dungeon, a griefer would come in and killing the final boss thus barring you from completing the dungeon and stopping you from getting the rewards.
So no, custom arena do not work, not now not ever.
Yes just conveniently ignore the fact that some are password protected.
Also conveniently ignore the fact that a duel can be interrupted by simply pulling mobs to you in PvE.
Conveniently ignoring facts or griefing people doesn’t make your argument a good one.
1. I ignore the fact that they are password protected because if I can’t get in, they can’t get in.
Okay, fine, Lets not ignore that. You have to pay a subscription fee to duel in a password protected room. Why can’t PvE players pay a subscription fee to do dungeons to be free from griefers running in and stealing their dungeon rewards? That would be equally fair.
2. A griefer can do that, but then the players are at fault for dueling at such a place. They can duel in non-monster zones and there are plenty of zones that don’t have mobs. Mobs have a short leash so a griefer cannot pull a mob half the map away to grief a duel.
You conveniently ignore that Custom Arena do not work.
No mounts, please. Thanks.
However, I would like to see roads offer a speed bonus. Maybe even a slight defensive bonus. Basically… let there be any reason at all for roads to exist, ‘cause they sure don’t have one now.
They are there for show. Just like Mounts would be.
I don’t see why you need to have a duel option in PvE except for those people that get upset about what is said in map chat and want to be like “come at me bro!”.
If two consenting people want to duel they can do so in sPvP custom match. We don’t need people randomly fighting each-other or picking fights in what is supposed to be a cooperative environment when we have a specific place for that already.
As for the above argument, both can already happen in game one just requires you to move to an area where the playing field is level. I don’t see whats so hard about this concept.
PvE is for cooperation.
sPvP is for player vrs player.We don’t need to combine the two.
If two consenting people want to duel in sPvP custom match, I will be there and interrupt their duel.
It is exactly like: If a dungeon party want to complete a dungeon, a griefer would come in and killing the final boss thus barring you from completing the dungeon and stopping you from getting the rewards.
So no, custom arena do not work, not now not ever.
(edited by runeblade.7514)
I want to know why people don’t think it is a viable weaponset.
What is their vision exactly?
After the inclusion of Ascended gear to the game, I’m pretty much against the idea of dueling in anything except sPvP land. in sPvP, I know at least that we are on the same playing field when it comes to stats, and that a stat advantage had nothing to do with it. With ascended gear in PvE, I wouldn’t accept a single duel since I’d never known whether I’m about to fight a guy decked out in full purples just another exotic bum like myself.
To understand your post, you want to bar players from dueling because you are afraid that you might lose in a duel. Am I right?
Here is how beggars ask for gold:
A. Beggar ask for gold → Guy says no. → Beggar moves along.
B. Beggar ask for gold → Guy says no. → Beggar harasses guy.
Here is how requesting a duel works:
A. Duelist request a duel → Guy says no. → Duelists moves along.
B. Duelist request a duel → Guy says no. → Duelist harasses guy.
Would it make more sense to remove gold because it is toxic or just accept the fact that harassment can be caused anywhere, dueling isn’t toxic and that only people are toxic.
I feel that this shout should be a bear F2 skill instead of a shout.
1. Aesthetics. It will clutter up the screen for people that do nto wish to see them, and will be used by griefers.
Answer: Make it so ONLY people that wish to see Mounts can see Mounts , and those that cannot, do not.
Problem: No Visual Bling. Reason #1 for Cosmetics only mounts.
2. Balance. They have gone out of their way to provide us with a fast travel system that is also a gold sink. So they do not have to put mounts in the game. Speed boost mounts would make many existing skills unnecessary. Means they need to do a major job re-balancing, and recreating skills because why would an elementalist use the " speed buff on air attnemtn" trait for example if she can ride a perma speed boost mount? or use the air attunemtn staff speed boost skill?
3. Lore. This has been covered to death.
There needs to either be a NEED for Mounts…. (there isn’t)..or a desire for mounts that doesn’t require a revamping of the entire game.
Anet is Not gonna go through all that effort to introduce something they have no need to introduce… to introduce something on the gem store…for some cha-ching…..
There are free2play games out there, that would do exactly that.
How do we Know Anet won’;t do it for that reason? because since release there have only been 2 Mounts in the store…purely cosmetic. Ok, there you see that they know how to make them, and Know how to sell them…so…why haven’t Mounts deluged the gem shop? If their ONLY Motive is " Money!" ?
1a. God, I wish there was an option to remove these.
1b. If it was a gemstore item, and requires to be selected from the inventory every time the player switches maps. I assure you that there wouldn’t be mount festivals as in other MMO. Why? 1. It would be a gemshop item. 2. It would be cosmetic and no one needs it. 3. Because it would be annoying to select. Do you see every tom, jerry, and joe having a mini-pets out?
1c. Griefers has almost zero effect in blocking anything. There is a button, f key, that lets you talk to npc without clicking anything. Gasp, I bet you didn’t know.
2a. I will be okay with 0% speed or 25% speed, I don’t really care about speed. But, ANet put a waypoint cost to encourage players to travel the world instead of teleporting everywhere. Mounts will be a great goldsink + encourage players to actually play the game! Gasp!
2b. Not all players want to be forced into these equipment sets just because for speed. It will improve gameplay because instead of being forced into Greatsword or sword/warhorn. I could play a Axe/shield or hammer warrior without feeling too sluggish.
3. It has been discussed to death that Horse exists.
(edited by runeblade.7514)
This thread (and the others like it) are exactly why there shouldn’t be open-world dueling.
If you are not in favor of dueling, here are some of the things you’ve been called by its supporters in this thread:
Lazy
Scared/cowardly
Delusional
Over-sensitive
Bitter
Ignorant
Stubborn Control-freaks
Whiners
Fear-mongerers
Angry
Foolish
Crazy
Have Trivial/Invalid concerns
Snippy
Magnet for trolls (love this one)
Liars
Anti-fun
Stupid
Selfish
Absurd
Having completely unbelievable opinions
Entitled
Unreasonable
Trolls/Bullies/Griefers (yes, seriously, and after all of the above was said about those against open-world dueling)
Asking to be harassed (Asking for it)
Petty
Silly
Haters
Over-emotionalAnd that’s only when they don’t just dismiss your opinions completely as not worthy considering.
These are the people that are telling us that there won’t be harassment and yet are being rude, insulting, and dismissive to those who simply don’t agree with them. If we can’t expect open world dueling’s biggest proponents to act maturely when discussing it, how can we expect any better from the trolls and griefers waiting for dueling to get their rocks off by harassing people who just want to play the game they bought as advertised? Since Guild Wars 1, Guild Wars has been about team play in pvp. Dueling is possible but has never been the focus of the game. It would be a major deviation, if this changed.
I saw earlier in this thread that custom arena is not a good option for dueling because it is costly. Yet, I never see dueling supporters making threads suggesting ways to improve the custom arenas or offering alternative suggestions to open-world dueling that are less intrusive to other players (opt-in is clearly not the magic fix here, or so many wouldn’t be against it). GW1 didn’t have open-world dueling and was better for it. However, it did offer dueling opportunities in guild halls. Why not request guild halls and a similar dueling feature there?
Here is what I have been called when I was running dungeons on my Ranger.
Stupid.
Poster child for autism.
kitten
kitten
idiot
terribad
noob
baddie
loser
Griefer
Stupid kitten
kitten
You should have been an abortion.
You should go suicide
Dead things have more common sense.
Yeah, Anet should remove Dungeons. They are toxic.
(edited by runeblade.7514)
So i have noticed a huge amount of longbow users in PvP and WvW who either don’t read their skill tooltips or haven’t got a clue on how to weapon swap. It’s pretty comical, fighting a bunch of warriors who are determined to use their longbow in melee whilst im smashing their face in with my Rangers sword. It’s as if they have gone, “i am playing a warrior and therefore i shall use my longbow in every situation”
Dear warriors who do this, even though you’re a warrior, you do have access to melee weapons, i know this might be a surprise to you but it’s better than trying to auto attack people with your longbow in melee range.
Warrior Longbow is a mid-close range combat weapon. The projectile is too slow for long range. The AoE is great for melee range.
That would make it broken as ranged or casters could just be lazy and sit back with their finger on a channel skill, press as soon as they see the HP bar appear at the top of their screen (without needing to face the target) and win all the time.
Not to mention the mesmer clone issue. You’d always know which is a clone because it wouldn’t be targeted when the real one goes into stealth.
Stealth is a equivalent to a immunity button against ranged and casters. So I don’t think it is a problem.
ok now seriously…
you have exatly 2 options as a longbow ranger in tpvp.
and trust me i play it long enough now.
- option 1: you have more survive, but no damage (also not aoe)
so you can jump around like a clown and be completely useless
- option 2: you have more damage (not much), but no survive.
and every other player will love to put a target on you.
if you go high ground like this, nobody in your team will rez you after thief, ele or even condi professions killed you in 10 seconds.
if a s/p thief decide to troll you, he can even farm you on spawn with a build like this.at least you will never come to try this two options, because every serious tpvp team dont take you into a team with a build like this.
so please just stop complaining longbow ranger is viable.
i have no idea how you can think that…everything can do much better
high range is worth nothing in gw2
there is enough mobility, ports, jumps to get fast into a close combat
Option 2: You increase your survivability by using the terrain. No player can target you unless they want to waste 20 seconds trying to reach your location only to be knockback onto the ground and then another 20 seconds to find out that you repositioned yourself in another place. If two or more players tries to reach you, then that is the equilivent of 2 players leaving the objective while your team kills the rest.
Not sure about Team tournament, but it is viable in soloqueue.
there is enough mobility, ports, jumps to get fast into a close combat
This is the problem with your argument. You think that longbow is a close combat weapon.
(edited by runeblade.7514)
If Longbow is so bad, then I must be a pro esport player.
I sniped and killed so many players using the 6/0/2/6/0 build.
Pewpewing noobs or newbs from afar proves nothing. A thief, mesmer, warrior, guardian, engineer or elementalist should be able to close the gap in no time. Anyone who lets the ranger utilizing his range does something wrong.
Against a LB ranger, you have to play aggressive. If you do so, the ranger is forced to switch the weapon or die painfully.If any of those classes can close the gap and gank the ranger before he could see it coming, then that ranger is terrible. That ranger isn’t abusing the 1500 range and the terrain; he deserves to die.
You are so wrong on so many levels, in other mmos (more successful ones) the ranger/hunter/archer profession has many reliable kiting mechanisms unlike here in gw2. rangers have huge cooldowns & unreliable spells that very often even go on cd without doing anything.
If you play the build correctly. You should be finding terrain advantages. If there is no enemies around. Your terrain advantages is your fortress, your 20-40 second damage immunity. Other classes and ranger’s weapon set can’t abuse the terrain advantage as much because their range is much much less. With this advantage, I felt that my emergency escape skills are always there when I needed it most.
Also if u r with a ranged – longbow build & some one like warrior or thief gets to you (which is very very very easy especially for thieves) you cannot escape they have superior mobility .
If you have a good terrain advantage, you can just knock them back or waste their time by escaping.
if you switch weapons .. well good luck with your ranged build holding a gs or sw/smth against a thief / warrior in close combat
Those weapon sets are for escaping. Longbow Rangers should always position themselves for escaping.
its a loss-loss situation
If you escape successfully, you can get back to your terrain advantage with relatively no loss at all.
Oh and almost forgot, even with the range you have you still dont have a huge burst like thives or warriors do (no matter even if you are “THE SNIPER CLASS”)
On the other hand, Longbow has a decent pressure: sustain damage. If the enemy tries to escape, they still have to suffer arrows on their backside. Think of it like trying to escape huge amount of bleed stacks without any cleansing available.
so as a conclusion – no burst, no kiting ability,no escapeability*, no good melee option if you have a ranged build – if you are the poor kitten to try play a bow ranger basically you a the free loot bad end of story & if you wanna tell me that this is a balanced game well i don’t think so a balance —->
In conclusion, you are free kill because you don’t know how to play the build. I was definitely not a free kill when I sniped hundreds of players in sPvP.
Just turn it to Arcing Smash.
Arcing Smash- The warrior smashes his blade onto the ground which grants fury to himself and nearby players while damaging nearby enemies.
This is intended to give a free cleansing Ire. Greatsword should be a utility weapon like the bow. The GreatHamsword will be mobile but it lacks range capabilities. While the Hambow lacks mobility.
(edited by runeblade.7514)
So, define “garbage” ?
What makes the skills garbage?
If you wanted anything fixed, you sure are going about it an a manner counter productive to do so. Unless you explain anything in applicable means, all your doing is broad complaining with no reasonable input on the matter.
Are you going to ever use Alpine wolf for the aoe chill? I will assume no because it is garbage.
Krytan Drakehound aoe immobilize is far superior than that garbage. It has less cooldown and better snare.
Yea, this garbage gameplay needs to go. I rather that ANet destroy stacking and nerf enemy hp to compensate than have this trash.
I am very happy for the increased response time. So now that it is fixed, Ranger should now get to the issue: Pet F2. It is very important since they are our Mechanic.
The problem with the Pet is that it is very imbalanced. Very few pet F2 skills are decent, everything else is trash and garbage. The best of the Pets is the wolf.
You might say, “nerf wolf and be done with it.” However, it is not fixing the problem. The problem is that there is no utility, no burst, no support, no control, and no synergy among the pets. I feel that almost every single pet needs to be brought up to the wolf’s level. I feel that this is worth power creeping.
I believe the best way is to reform the pet F2 skill. No need to buff damage or armor. I feel that it is fine for now. It promotes synergy and active combat.
I will make a list of ideas later, but I wanted ANet to know that pet F2 skills needs a big change. Chill pets are the biggest offenders.
1. THIS GAME IS NOT MADE FOR 1v1 PVP.
2. You already have the capability to duel in Spvp with the custom areas. Yes, they do work, and yes you can use them in that fashion. You are just to lazy to use the functions given to you.
1. So what?
2. Those custom arenas exist for me to grief in. I love trolling the duelists trying to get a fair duel in there. I love jumping in and quickly kill one of them and see them qq. After they quiet down and go back to dueling, I will interrupt their duel again. If they try to switch to another room; no problem, I just need to find rooms that are 2 filled out of 20 slots. Usually those have duelists in them for me to grief.
Waypoint exist, so mounts cannot. That is stupid.
Skyrim has both Fast travel and mounts. I say it works fine.
I watched this enough in other MMOs that allowed dueling in PvE:
Situation 1
Troll tries to duel X
X declines (insert any reason here)
Troll verbally attacks X in chat
More Trolls join in.Situation 2
Troll tries to duel X
X has auto-decline active
Troll verbally attacks X in chat
More Trolls join in.Both situations usually escalates to the point that the trolls try to duel everyone on the map and verbally attack anyone that doesn’t duel them.
No Dueling in PvE, go to the Mists and find a 1v1 or start a dueling only server.
I watched this enough in other MMO that allowed gold:
Situation 1
Beggar tries to beg X
X declines (insert any reason here)
Beggar verbally attacks X in chat
More trolls join in.
Situation 2
Beggar tries to beg X
X has trade-notification off.
Beggar verbally attacks X in chat.
More trolls join in.
Both situation usually escalate to the point that the trolls ust begs everyone and verbally attack anyone that won’t give them gold.
No Gold ever. Go farm some Karma.
Mounts do not work in this game because of waypoints.
Brooms/Dredge tunneling device do not work?
I wouldn’t consider those as mounts. They are purely cosmetic and do not provide any boost like mounts normally do. You could call them animation overrides or something.
So, if ANet put in mounts, then they can’t make it work the same way as those?
Well, no, not really. They’d have to at the very least change collision boxes (or you’d get only very tiny, tiny mounts). The both current “mounts” do not affect character movement in any way.
Also, as it has already been acknowledged, most of the people that want mounts are not interested in merely visual ones. They want them to bestow advantages.
I don’t see why collision box should be a problem. There is no collision. It can just stay the same while the mounts stay bigger. Asura’s collision box is bigger than their size.
Wrong. The people that want mounts are people that just want mounts.
The anti-mount people are the one crying about advantages.
Every time, however, someone says they want mounts, people who rage against the idea post their same old tired reasons why it is a terrible idea that would destroy the game and anyone who asks for mounts should be ashamed at their stupidity, which calls for those of us who would like them and don’t agree with the arguments against to defend the person who pulled it back to page one.
So disagreement based on personal feelings is only from the anti-mount group??
Sorry but the pro-mount side is just as empty of real reasons as to why they want it other than they can jump over peoples’ heads in town. I.e. “it’s kewl!”
The issue is that mounts add nothing, NOTHING, to the game. Every character class has a speed skill/spell/buff that is +25% to +33% of move rate. Those that really want to move through maps quickly DO NOT NEED MOUNTS.
Since we have now dispensed with the movement argument that leaves the aesthetic side. I will grant you that mounts can be done very nicely but they are fluff. I think all would agree that I want Anet working on ANYTHING other than fluff. Content is (or should be) #1 priority, then bug fixes, honing the megaserver (give up on it going away), and the next living story line are the rest in that order (personally).
So with all the above I think it’s time to move on.
If people would just let the occasional person say, “Mounts would be great in GW2!” and a few people chime in with “Yeah!” then the thread would sink back down once again.
Let one side say all and the rest just let it go … you do know what a discussion forum is for right?
Peace.
I am fine with Mounts adding NOTHING to the game. I just want a horse to ride around in.
Players do not need ANYTHING from the gemshop. Should ANet just remove everything from the gemshop and sell +200 permanent power boost, Ascended/Legendary weapons, a level 200 cap increase because of that logic?
(edited by runeblade.7514)
Those that want Mounts should just play another game. OMG who necroed this thread? I thought it was dead Long ago.
Should we all wander over to your sub/multi class thread and tell you that if you want multi-classing you should just play a game that already has it?
In a way, it was the forum moderators who necroed this thread, because they consolidated a new mount thread into here to keep things tidy.
And there will continue to be people wanting mounts because they are intrinsic to human history and fantasy literature. ArenaNet has not definitively said there will be no mounts, and there are occasional mounts sprinkled throughout Tyria in both GW1 and GW2.
Imagine a fantasy game that had no swords. Every other type of weapon, but no swords. Except there are a few NPCs in game that have dialogue that talks about swords. And some monsters that have swords instead of hands. And undead NPCs who wield swords. But no swords for PCs. And all the developers have said on the subject is “we don’t have plans to add swords at this time”.
Do you think the “Can we have swords” threads would ever end?
We don’t need swords. We have other weapons. Other weapons make swords useless.
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